Trust Me: Cults, Extreme Belief, and Manipulation

Episode: David Farrier – Conspiracies, Cults, and Investigating Arise Church
Release Date: January 14, 2026
Hosts: Lola Blanc & Megan Elizabeth | Guest: David Farrier

Episode Overview

This episode features a candid and darkly humorous conversation with journalist and filmmaker David Farrier (Tickled, Dark Tourist), who is known for exploring subcultures, conspiracies, and abuses of power—especially within religious groups. The hosts and David dive into conspiracy culture post-COVID, discuss the manipulation at New Zealand’s Arise Church (New Zealand's largest megachurch), and reflect on how groupthink, social pressures, and the search for belonging can nurture both cults and conspiracy movements. Along the way, the discussion branches out into the mechanics of religious manipulation, personal recovery after high-control environments, and even the disturbing evangelism techniques of evangelical “Hell Houses.”

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. David Farrier’s Path to Investigating the Dark and Unusual

• Background: David explains how his career in New Zealand media (starting 2005) let him pursue odd, dark topics (09:00).

  • Inspired by British documentarian Louis Theroux; admires participatory, non-threatening style (09:32).
  • Emphasizes the disarming power of accents/cultural unfamiliarity when interviewing hostile or secretive subjects (10:22).

• Notable Projects:

  • Tickled: Explored the world of competitive tickling, revealing abuse and homophobia (12:03).
  • Dark Tourist: Netflix show on tourism to morbid or dangerous places. Analysis of those drawn to dark tourism and those monetizing it (13:49).
  • Webworm Newsletter: Focus today on cults, high-control religious groups, and conspiracy movements, especially post-COVID.

“I was just gravitated to do sort of like, do you know Louis Theroux?... My whole brain is like, why don’t I do a similar thing to Louis, but in New Zealand?”
— David Farrier (09:32)

2. Conspiracies and Their Allure

• Pandemic Surge: David notes how New Zealand, previously seen as rational and reserved, was not immune to QAnon, anti-vax, or anti-5G conspiracies (15:41).
• Similarities to Cults: Conspiratorial thinking draws on people’s need for clear, reassuring answers to a chaotic world—akin to the lure of cultic religion.
  • Social aspects (message boards), puzzle solving, and a sense of community intensify commitment (20:02).
• Leaving Conspiracies: The exit often comes when one’s logic "goes a step too far" and breaks down.
  • Discusses “steel manning” (helping someone verbalize their beliefs to reach internal contradictions) as a respectful strategy for dialog (21:39).

“It’s much easier to go, oh, there’s this giant thing behind the scenes pulling all the strings... then it’s really embarrassing to come out of [conspiracies].”
— David Farrier (18:29)

3. Arise Church: Investigating a New Zealand Megachurch

What Is Arise? (22:43)

• Once NZ’s biggest megachurch, modeled after Hillsong, targeting youth through modern music, social activities, and college outreach.
• Outwardly apolitical, predominantly white, and seen as benign—escaped critical media scrutiny unlike minority-focused churches.

Patterns of Manipulation and Abuse

• Exploitative Internships: Interns (as young as 17) pressured into unpaid labor, working extreme hours, and tithing despite financial struggle (26:08, 28:51).
• Celebrity-Pastor Culture: Leadership (John Cameron and wife) venerated as near-divine; strict rules—e.g., forbidden to make eye contact with leaders.
• Spiritual Guilt and Control: Members told their self-worth and eternal salvation depended on obedience and service.
• Coverups and Systemic Harms: Reports of financial exploitation and sexual assault cases being buried.
• Aftermath: Farrier’s reporting spurs hundreds of former members to come forward (32:14); external investigation condemns leadership, leading to resignations (56:51). However, the leaders simply restart similar churches in Australia (57:43).

“You had to follow their leader, John Cameron. Like everything he said was... godlike almost. At conferences he’d have his own green room and you weren’t allowed to look him in the eye.”
— David Farrier (28:51)

The Human Cost

• Isolation and Shunning: Those who left were fully ostracized, losing their community, friends, and often any support network (51:28).
• Recovery: Survivors leaving in adulthood struggle to build new identities and basic worldviews from scratch (53:43). Some, desperate for belonging, end up in new controlling groups.

“You lose all your community support. Imagine if you’re like a single mom in there... Suddenly that’s instantly cut off.”
— David Farrier (51:28)

4. Hell Houses and Evangelical Scare Tactics (34:05)

• Evoking “the fear of Hell” is a timeless and effective tool.
• Farrier describes attending a modern evangelical "Hell House" in California:
  • High production value rooms simulating sins—club scenes, drunk-driving deaths, graphic suicide and drug overdose—and a literal "Hell" finale.
  • Participants shown real violent YouTube clips, then urged by pastors to convert—dozens do.
  • Minimum age is 12; trauma as recruitment strategy.

“There’s demons, there’s people screaming in cages... and the idea being that all those people you saw die in these hideous ways—they went to Hell.”
— David Farrier (36:05)

5. Broader Reflections on Religion, Recovery, and Capitalism

• Manipulation Checklists: The hosts discuss a church-renunciation checklist, noting its impractical demand for exclusive devotion and constant guilt (42:29).
• Life After High-Control Groups: Building a new worldview, finding non-culty communities, and the risk of “cult-hopping” (54:59).
• Ethics and Selling Out: Lively meta-conversation about the ethics of advertising, capitalism, and compromise for those making a living by exposing exploitation (60:11, 62:44).

“I think the people that get involved in the leadership of these churches are out to make a lot of money and I’ve never seen an instance of it [voluntarily reforming].”
— David Farrier (59:49)

6. Memorable Moments & Quotes

• On Deprogramming:

  • “It just goes a step too far... as they try and explain in this conspiratorial way, their own explanation is a step too far for them and they start to get stumped.”
    — David Farrier (21:39)

• On Isolation and Shunning:

  • “Your friends in there will stop talking to you because you’re now evil. And so you’re suddenly completely adrift in the world.”
    — David Farrier (51:28)

• On Leadership’s Motivation:

  • “I could never figure out whether he [John Cameron] really believed this stuff or whether it was just a convenient thing... that made him very wealthy and popular.”
    — David Farrier (47:42)

• On the Recovery Journey:

  • “How to construct an identity from scratch as an adult is... just start again now.”
    — David Farrier (53:50)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• David’s Background and Style: 09:00–13:45
• Tickled & Conspiracy Journalism: 12:03–15:41
• Pandemic Conspiracies in New Zealand: 15:41–18:29
• How People Get Out of Conspiracies: 18:28–22:22
• Entry to Arise Church, the Megachurch Model: 22:43–26:59
• Intern Abuse and Manipulation: 28:51–33:10
• Community Response & Leadership Fallout: 32:14–34:00, 56:51–58:35
• Hell House Explored: 34:05–40:14
• The Cost of Shunning: 51:28–54:03
• Recovery from High-Control Groups: 53:43–56:46
• Future Investigations/First Amendment Auditors: 64:22–67:05

Tone & Style

The hosts and guest maintain a balance of dark humor, compassion for survivors, and analytical curiosity. The mood is supportive and at times playful, even as the content turns heavy. Insights are delivered with an open, confessional tone.

Where to Find David Farrier

• Newsletter: Webworm.co
• Podcast: Flightless Bird
• Documentaries: Tickled, Dark Tourist, Mr. Organ (all available on various streaming platforms)

Conclusion:
David Farrier’s account illuminates the hidden but systemic harms of seemingly mainstream religious organizations and the subtle psychological levers that cults and conspiratorial groupings exploit. The episode closes with a discussion of next investigative topics (First Amendment auditors), the murkiness of ethical purity in a capitalist world, and the ongoing need for survivor-centered storytelling.

(Summary compiled for listeners seeking an in-depth yet accessible understanding of the episode, major insights, and notable moments, with references to precise timestamps.)