TJG: RHOC S20 E2!

Summary

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Two Judgey Girls – TJG: RHOC S20 E2!

Original Airdate: July 17, 2026
Hosts: Courtney (LA) & Mary (Bay Area)
Episode Summary:
Courtney and Mary dissect episode 2 of The Real Housewives of Orange County Season 20, covering new housewife dynamics, iconic cast nostalgia, behind-the-scenes podcast drama, and the cast’s evolving friendships. The episode also explores pop culture updates and Bravo-adjacent reality rumors, peppered with the duo’s trademark humor and sharp observations.

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Main Theme / Purpose

This episode delves into the early drama and evolving relationships on RHOC Season 20, focusing on the impact of the new housewife (Carmela Garcia), the cast’s personal stories, and meta-discussions about Bravo-related podcasts. Courtney and Mary highlight the lighter, campy direction of the season, recap memorable taglines, and question the authenticity of certain conflicts. Interwoven are Bravo universe side stories and personal anecdotes that inject their signature "judgey" flair.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Personal Updates & Patreon Teaser

• Mary’s Childhood Room: Mary records from her mint green childhood bedroom in Novato, California, prompting nostalgia and a preview for their Patreon mini room tour.
  "It was a throwback. We spent about 10 minutes on the Patreon about it. I loved it." (Mary, 02:46)

2. The Bravo After Show & Reality TV Gossip

• Valley After Show Highlights:

  • Dani Booko’s confession about not watching porn for six years and only watching private videos from his wife, Nia.
    "He has videos of Nia that he watches, but he has to go offline... and that's his porn." (Mary, 03:14)
    • Courtney questions whether his over-announcing signals a past issue.
      "If you have to announce your 6 years free, was there an addiction?" (Courtney, 03:34)
  • Echoes of Vanderpump Rules friendship dynamics: Janet distancing herself from Kristen due to repetitive venting and drama cycles.
    "She'd vent and vent... and then a couple days later, she'd post man crush Monday and it would be her boyfriend." (Courtney, 04:13)
  • Anecdote about Kristen staying at Janet’s house during a breakup, resulting in a messy aftermath.
    "Apparently the dog shit everywhere. She said there was vomit. I'm like, who was vomit? The dog or Kristen? She drank her wine, all this shit..." (Mary, 05:07)

• Speculation on Jasmine and Zach’s Move & Family Dynamics:

  • Discussion of wedding invites, unfollowing drama, and the likelihood of Jasmine and Melissa moving to New Jersey.
    "As soon as they got pregnant... they would be moving to New Jersey." (Mary, 07:26)
    • Courtney muses on the possibility of Zach being a donor while not wanting ongoing involvement (07:37).

3. Golden Life Casting & Sex and the City Crossover

• Candace Bushnell Joining “Golden Life”:
  • Excitement about new casting, including Sex and the City creator Candace Bushnell and RHONJ’s Margaret (“the Marge”).
    "Do we need the Marge? What do you think?" (Mary, 07:59)
  • Dorinda Medley’s connections and rumors about her inspiring SATC characters.
    "Supposedly one of the characters from Sex and the City is based off Dorinda." (Courtney, 08:48)

4. Teresa Giudice & Melania TikTok Deep Dive

• Rumors of Trouble in the Giudice Household:
  • Speculation over Teresa’s missing wedding ring and whether Louie has moved out, based on Melania’s frequent TikToks.
    "Teresa is not wearing her wedding ring. Did Louie move out?... In the TikTok... she said, Louie made the chicken cutlet... so maybe he's still living there." (Mary, 08:57)

5. “The Valley” Scandal & Reality TV Camera Pickups

• Bravo’s Over-Use of Camera Pick-Ups:
  • Skepticism toward Bravo’s push to "pick up cameras" for every real-life scandal, questioning if Jax’s cheating with publicist Lori merits on-camera coverage. "Not everything is a scandal, and not everything needs cameras to be picked up." (Courtney, 10:40)
    • Both agree this story isn’t newsworthy and don’t want to see Jax back on TV.
      "We want Britney to be free of him!" (Courtney, 11:19) "If Britney's upset because of the betrayal, that's totally fine. But it's not newsworthy to me to be a storyline..." (Courtney, 11:23)

6. Special Forces Reality Show Casting & Celebrity Trauma

• Discussion of “Special Forces: World’s Toughest Test” Cast:
  • Mo and Alexia Umansky added, prompting jokes about Mauricio’s desperation for fame post-cancellation of his shows and marriage troubles.
    "It's feeling desperate for Mauricio... It's giving Desperado completely." (Courtney, 14:10)
  • Brandi Glanville's expected "trauma" storyline involving parasite rumors and Real Housewives fallout.
    "Her trauma gonna be the parasite?" (Courtney, 18:15)
    • Speculation about whether Candace Cameron Bure will lean on “child star” trauma.
      "What's Candace Cameron Bure's trauma gonna be? Just a childhood star?" (Mary, 15:41)

7. RHOC S20 E2 Recap

a. Tagline Deep Dive & First Impressions (25:41–31:18)

• Taglines Read-Aloud, Reactions, & Nostalgia:
  • The hosts recite and critique each tagline with color commentary, notably loving Shannon’s:
    "How do I hold it all together? Resilience and shapewear." (Shannon’s tagline, 26:21)
  • Apologize to Carmela Garcia for underestimating her:
    "I really came around to her this episode. I think her story is interesting. I think she's rich, and I like to see wealth on these shows." (Mary, 29:40)

b. Cast Dynamic Shifts & Personal Stories (31:18–36:14)

• Desire for Deeper, Personal Focus:
  • Both want more personal stories and less “manufactured conflict.”
    "I want them to focus more on the personal stories and less on the conflict." (Mary, 31:18)
• Vicki & Tamra’s Nostalgic Meet-Up:
  • Reflections on Vicki’s relationship history and regrets over her divorce from Don.
    "I think she acknowledges now. And she says, I took him for granted. And I think Don was a great guy." (Mary, 32:12)
  • Courtney notes the importance of real friendships among long-time cast members.

c. Behind-the-Scenes: Podcast Drama (39:16–45:25)

• Tamra, Teddy & Emily’s Podcast Beef Explained:
  • Tamra’s Two T’s In a Pod network once included Emily’s “Legally Brunette” podcast. Emily left for her own feed, then seemingly returned – causing friction over gratitude, numbers, and money.
    "Tamara's basically telling Emily, you actually need me... And you're coming at me as if you're not grateful for the leg I’ve given you." (Courtney, 41:17)
    • Mary argues Tamra still profits off Emily and should be supportive.
    • Both debate how much Tamra should care, ultimately finding the feud petty.

d. Aging, Parties, and Costume Gimmicks (45:29–61:08)

• Hamburger Mary’s 50th Birthday Party:
  • Critique of themed costumes (old lady/Depends), preferring genuine interactions over gimmicky parties. "If this is my birthday party and... all of you guys have a good joke together... and then I come in looking hot. I'm like, what the..." (Courtney, 46:03)
• Concerns Over Manufactured Drama:
  • Jen’s attempts to stir conflict with Heather seem too obvious and forced. "Jen is really trying to stir some stuff up, and I'm like, can you just, like, not." (Courtney, 35:01)
    • Mary and Courtney want less staged drama, more kitchens-and-wine candid moments.

e. Carmela Garcia’s Story & Co-Parenting with Jeff Garcia (52:00–57:55)

• Background:
  • Carmela’s life from playmate to NFL wife to complicated, successful, unconventional co-parent.
    "They have birthdays together. They're co parenting, and, like, it's definitely working out for them." (Mary, 54:48)
  • Vicki comes off judgmental of their situation, leading to pointed criticism from the hosts.

f. Body Shaming & Housewives Self-Discovery (61:08–63:38)

• Emily’s Struggles With Body Image and Food:

  • Jen and others make repeated remarks about Emily’s weight loss and eating, which the hosts point out as problematic. "Why does it always come back to shaming Emily? It is so weird." (Mary, 63:24)

• Empowering Message for Women:

  • Hosts highlight how the franchise has allowed women to reinvent themselves post-divorce or at midlife, gaining confidence and independence. "At the heart of what Real Housewives is, is it's about these women having their second lives... live their lives so authentically." (Courtney, 61:08)
    • Tamra proclaims her 50s have been her best era (61:47).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On nostalgia and growth:

  • "I really came around to [Carmela] this episode... I think she's rich, and I like to see wealth on these shows." (Mary, 29:40)

• On recurring Bravo meta-drama:

  • "Not everything is a scandal, and not everything needs cameras to be picked up." (Courtney, 10:40)

• On the central Housewives theme:

  • "At the heart of what Real Housewives is, is it's about these women having their second lives." (Courtney, 61:08)

• On internal Real Housewives conflicts:

  • "Jen is really trying to stir some stuff up, and I'm like, can you just, like, not." (Courtney, 35:01)
  • "Vicki can be so traditional in so many ways, and it's like, guess what? This is working for that family... So shut the up, Vic." (Mary, 54:47)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:17] – Episode intro, Mary records from childhood room
• [03:14–05:48] – Valley after-show, Dani Booko’s “porn” confession, insights on friendship dynamics
• [07:54–08:57] – Casting news for “Golden Life,” Sex and the City connections
• [08:57–09:55] – Deep dive into Teresa Giudice/Melania TikTok rumor mill
• [10:40–12:50] – Bravo’s over-usage of “picking up cameras” for scandals
• [14:10–18:15] – Special Forces cast discussion, criticizing Mauricio and Brandi
• [25:41–31:18] – RHOC taglines segment, reactions to new and returning cast taglines
• [31:18–36:14] – Reflections on cast friendships, Vicki/Don nostalgia
• [39:16–45:25] – In-depth breakdown of podcast drama between Tamra and Emily
• [45:29–46:22] – Mocking themed parties, authenticity in housewives events
• [52:00–57:55] – Carmela Garcia’s backstory and co-parenting with Jeff Garcia
• [61:08–63:38] – Body shaming of Emily, focus on Housewives’ empowerment and evolution

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Episode Tone & Style

Courtney and Mary’s rapport is witty, irreverent, and peppered with pop culture references. They balance critical takes on housewives’ behavior, Bravo’s production choices, and the evolving landscape of reality TV with personal anecdotes, sharp one-liners, and loving nostalgia for what makes Housewives fans obsessed.

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Final Thoughts

This episode captures the essence of Two Judgey Girls: a blend of Bravo deep-dives, meta-commentary on reality TV culture, candid critique of show production, and celebratory acknowledgments of housewives' personal growth. Courtney and Mary’s banter, laughs, and honest reactions make this recap both insightful and fun—even for those who haven’t watched the RHOC episode or follow Bravo religiously.

Transcript

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[Mary]

Welcome back to two judgy girls. This is Mary from the Bay and

[Courtney]

it's Courtney from la. Mary, you do have to tell people where you are actually recording from today.

[Mary]

Guys, I'm in my childhood bedroom in Nevada, California. Started from Nevada, now I'm here

[Courtney]

and if you want to see more of it, you can listen to our Patreon that comes out today because we get a mini room tour and discussion about growing up in this mint green room.

[Mary]

It was a throwback. We spent about 10 minutes on the Patreon about it. I loved it.

[Courtney]

Me, too. I felt like it really gave me an inside look. More of who you are.

[Mary]

Thank you. Thank you.

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[Courtney]

Okay. We put out our Valley episode before we had watched the after show. I was like, mary, you have to watch the after show this week. I felt that this week gave a lot of intel to who some of these people are.

[Mary]

I mean, a highlight for me was Danny Booko claiming he hasn't watched porn in six years because he is a man of God. However, he has videos of Nia that he watches, but he has to go offline to watch them. And that's his porn.

[Courtney]

And he said that. No prompting, no nothing. He shared that with us so that we knew, which to me means if you have to announce your 6 years free, was there an addiction?

[Mary]

Okay. When I took all those pre Cana classes for the Catholic Church, there was a lot about watching porn in that. I don't know why. It must be a thing.

[Courtney]

Why are you telling us these things? And then Kristin's like, oh, my God, Nia. That's so cute. Because she wants to wear Nia's skin like last season's Versace. It's actually crazy to me and you guys, the IG comments are scary to

[Mary]

me because people are siding with Kristin

[Courtney]

and Dani and Nia. Not even that I'm choosing Janet in this. I'm just not with them. Okay. So on the after show, too, I thought Janet talking about why she actually ended up distancing herself from Kristen was very reminiscent of the reasoning of why Stassi and Katie had to distance themselves from Kristen in the Vanderpump Rules days. Because Kristen would vent and vent and vent and use her friends as this therapist, and she's in this bad relationship and she's got to get out, and they're trying to give her advice and push her towards whatever's going to make her happiest. And then a couple days later, she'd pose like man crush Monday, and it would be her boyfriend at the time. And so Janet finally had to put, like, an arm's length, which was very Kristen and Stassi with Carter. And then I thought, too, actually, she did that with Sandoval, too. Remember when they went to Mexico and she wasn't going to be with them? And then they found her in the room, and then she'd be like, me and Sandoval are such crackheads. She'd post that on Twitter.

[Mary]

They Said when Janet and Jason went on their honeymoon, Kristen ended up staying at their house. And that was because Kristen was going through her own breakup. So they were like, stay at our house while we're away. And apparently the dog shit everywhere. She said there was vomit. I'm like, who was vomit? The dog or Kristen? She drank her wine, all this shit, and she was like, at that point, when I came back from the honeymoon, I was like, I'm gonna distance myself. I'm like, yeah, I can't even imagine doing a favor for someone and then they take advantage of you. Like, hell no.

[Courtney]

The wine thing was weird too, because I believe that Janet used to work somehow in some capacity with Cameron Diaz and that company, Aveline.

[Mary]

Oh.

[Courtney]

Which is actually very good wine, you guys. I really enjoy that wine. Oh, have you had it before?

[Mary]

No. It's like a natural wine, and it's

[Courtney]

a screw top, so you need to bring it places. It's very easy.

[Mary]

Yeah. A porch pounder.

[Courtney]

Yeah.

[Mary]

What's that? A porch pounding wine. Like, you sit on your porch and compound it. It's like, easy, drinkable.

[Courtney]

Wait, that's hilarious. I've never heard of that.

[Mary]

A porch pounder. Oh, my God. I'm gonna have a couple porch pounders today when I go to Annabeth. No, but it's like, a porch pounder is just, like, a very easy drinkable wine.

[Courtney]

Wait, I love this. I'm gonna use this now. A porch.

[Mary]

Found it on your porch.

[Courtney]

Oh, I guess I'd have to have a porch. Put it on my list.

[Mary]

You kind of do a little bit.

[Courtney]

You have that little. Just like, sitting there, staring at the street. Get off my lawn.

[Mary]

I wish they would play the episode. Then they played the after show. Then we did watch what happens live.

[Courtney]

I agree. The after show is very RuPaul's Untucked. If you're not watching the after show, you're not getting the full story. Like, Michelle also is talking about how Jasmine and Zach unfollowed her. She didn't go to their wedding. So I'm like, is there a correlation? Apparently she was invited but turned it down. And I was like, was Dr. Dre not given a plus one? When did they unfollow her?

[Mary]

Could you imagine if she brought Dr. Dre as the plus one to Jasmine Melissa's wedding? That'd be so, so good. I also felt like from this after show, as soon as they got pregnant, Jasmine and Melissa, that they would be moving to New Jersey.

[Courtney]

Oh, you think so? Be closer to family. They've moved to the Valley we know she's left Zach, and weho.

[Mary]

I also feel like she's going to be pregnant really, really soon.

[Courtney]

I hope so. Exciting. I hope so. I love what she said. Like, yeah, Zach would be a great donor, but then, like, I don't ever want him trying to get right. So.

[Mary]

No.

[Courtney]

Let's talk about this golden life update, because this is very interesting to me about new casting.

[Mary]

Yes. Okay. So it's Candace Bushnell. She's the Sex and the City creator.

[Courtney]

Yep.

[Mary]

And she is good friends with Dorinda, I believe. And I think she likes to party with Dorinda. I think she is fond of the drinks, so I think she will be an excellent ad. But then we also are getting the marge, which do we need her? And then I was starting to think about. I was like, okay, well, she'd be like, the only sober person. She's the only married person, I think, too. I'm not sure if Candace is married, but I. I'm curious about the march. I love the march, but do we need the march? What do you think?

[Courtney]

I'm just wondering what her relationship is with everybody on this show. I feel like she's friends with Dorinda, but, you know Durinda, after three teeny, she's going to turn on anyone. Also, by the way, speaking of turning the line of how you doing? Not well, bitch. Is her telling that to Candace Bushnell in an episode?

[Mary]

Yes. Yes.

[Courtney]

And supposedly one of the characters from Sex and the City is based off of Dorinda. I believe that's been debunked, but I'm gonna believe it still.

[Mary]

We can let that live here, because I've been starting rumors because I'm pretty invested in this Melania situation because the LR thing really threw me off. So then Melania posted pictures of her and her mom in bathing suits in their backyard. And then I was, like, texting Courtney. I was like, teresa is not wearing her wedding ring. Did Louie move out? I'm just like, what's going on? Then I went on her TikTok, and she posts a freaking ton. But in the TikTok, she was eating chicken cutlet. And she said, louie made the chicken cutlet, which made me think. I think he might be still living there.

[Courtney]

They were in bathing suits by the pool. So I thought maybe she just took her ring off because they're going to go in the pool.

[Mary]

Right. And, like, the tanning lotion and all that.

[Courtney]

I do love a rumor, though.

[Mary]

I know I'm getting obsessed with this Melania situation. I need to know what really happened.

[Courtney]

I think you have a deep dive for the weekend, Courtney.

[Mary]

I already did it. I'm all over her TikTok and she posts like 10 videos a day, and it's of nothing. She has a boyfriend too. And her hair is, like, red right now. Right? Like an aerial moment. She even. She even has these videos of her being a mermaid. She got mermaid tales and I need to go. Okay. Oh, God. Okay, so apparently the Valley is picking up cameras because they want to capture, I guess, Britney's reaction to knowing about Jax being with the publicist. Lori, who was also Britney's publicist. Do you care? Do you think this is necessary? Thoughts? Concerns?

[Courtney]

Not everything is a scandal, and not everything needs cameras to be picked up. Britney posted a story too, and was like, I haven't made a single statement about it. I'll do it in due time. Meaning it'll be taken on the cameras and probably after the reunion. What do you think?

[Mary]

I don't even think this is that big of a deal, to be honest. I guess this woman betrayed her for sure. I guess it's just, like, not that shocking. If. If I was Britney, I would be like, I feel bad for you, Lori. You know, he's a master manipulator. You saw what he has done to me. Like, for you to go for him. Good luck.

[Courtney]

I totally agree. I feel like they're picking up cameras because it's going to be like this was going on. When those rumors first happened, when Jax and Britney were still technically together, this was happening. And that's what I think. Like, this cheating scandal. But it's like, we don't care. We want Britney to be free of him. And I started thinking because you said would you would potentially boycott the Valley if Jacks came back? And I'm like, is this them trying to gauge interest? If people are interested in Jax returning? The answer is no. This isn't a scandal. If Britney's upset because of the betrayal, that's totally fine. But it's not newsworthy to me to be a storyline on this show to have to pick up cameras again. You could save it for season four. We'll wait.

[Mary]

Yeah, I definitely don't think it needs to be a pickup scene, Especially because the Valley does film in the summer. In the fall, they're going to be picking up cameras in no time. That would just be, like, part the story. It doesn't need a pickup scene to me at all. Who do you think she'll film it with? Oh, probably.

[Courtney]

Maybe Janet. Jason. I just also don't care. That's the thing is, like, I want Britney to move on from Jax. And I think bringing him back into this is like, I know in theory he's a good reality star because he's a disaster. He's always saying he's causing drama, but he's also a fucking monster. And I don't care to see him like, him not being on this season. Yes. Was a detriment in a way, because all it did was expose how bad the other men all are. But I don't need him back on our screens. He's gone. This isn't a scandal. Not everything needs to be picking cameras back up. We're getting into this routine now that every season there's some scandal. Pick the cameras back up. Summer House. That made sense for me. Scandal. When Ariana called, that was, like, groundbreaking. But not everything needs cameras to pick back up to give us this update.

[Mary]

Right. And do you think Jax will be on the cameras? No. Right.

[Courtney]

That's. What. I don't know. I would think it's for Britney's reaction to the betrayal, but she's not with him. And even if he did cheat. I'm sorry, wasn't he cheating the whole time?

[Mary]

I. I just. This isn't news to me. I. I guess.

[Courtney]

Yeah, it's literally as. Good luck, Lori K. Hope it's worth it.

[Mary]

Other news. Are we gonna watch Special Forces? Remember, we watched Special Forces before. But, you guys, this lineup is. And I noticed the other day that Alexia Umansky had commented on Colin Gosling because he just released a book. And I was like, what is their connection? She had said, like, oh, I'm so proud of my friend. I'm like, how are they friends? That feels so random. Didn't they live in Pennsylvania? You know, you're in Beverly Hills, and it's because they're on Special Forces together. So it's Mo and Alexia now. I think Alexia will go out kind of quick. Will Mo leave with her or will he stay?

[Courtney]

It's feeling desperate for Mauricio. Doesn't it feel so desperate, Mauricio? You did Dancing with the Stars because Kyle turned it down. You had buying Beverly Hills canceled. Like, I thought Mo was someone who just wanted to be, like, hot and on the side. And now it's giving Desperado completely.

[Mary]

I think it's embarrassing.

[Courtney]

I agree. When it was Teresa and Gia, I liked that. And especially spoiler alert, if you didn't watch last season, but Gia wins. And I was so proud of Gia. So proud of her. And Then because. Also cast as Brandy, are we going to talk about the cheating rumors?

[Mary]

Okay, the Brandy thing will be super interesting, but. But wait, Going back to Mo, do you think he would leave with Alexia or. He'll stay.

[Courtney]

He'll stay. Of course he's going to stay. He wants his 15 minutes.

[Mary]

Okay, but then what is going to be his thing when he has to go in and talk to the guys?

[Courtney]

Oh, they bring up their trauma. That's not funny. We're not laughing. But it's like, oh, like, what is

[Mary]

this gonna be like now I'm single. But they're. They're gonna be like, well, you're kind of a womanizer. Or, you know, they like come at you. What is his gonna be? I don't know.

[Courtney]

They're gonna be soft on him. You think? Yeah, I think his is gonna be like, did I work too hard and neglect my family? Did I make mistakes? It's gonna be something stupid like that. Because when they bring up the trauma of somebody on this show, they're trying to give them like a redemption arc. Right. Like you're on Special Forces because therapy was too expensive.

[Mary]

Right? Right. Wait, what's Candace Cameron Burrs? What is her trauma gonna be? Just a childhood star.

[Courtney]

Our friend has one sided beef with ccb. I'm like, you're gonna get yourself banned from Instagram because you cannot leave and you shouldn't. Do not leave personal comments on her Instagram. Like, one sided beef. And I can't believe she's never been blocked at this point by her. And you told her.

[Mary]

Yeah, I was like. I was like, she is on Special Forces. She was like, God damn it, I'm pissed about that.

[Courtney]

As if she's ever watched a single episode of.

[Mary]

But what's going to be her trauma? Like, I'm a child actress. I always thought everything had to be perfect.

[Courtney]

Hers is going to be something like her daughter married some Disney star or something and is pregnant right now. And hers is going to be like, my life is changing. I have a grandchild on the way. It's going to be something very as she is Hallmark. Okay, let me break down who is on this cast for you besides the ones we've already named. So we have Matt Barnes, who's an NBA champion and podcaster. Hey, colleague. Alicia Baumgartner, who is a world champion boxer. Ccb. It's funny that they say former the View co host and actress. Bitch. You're dj.

[Mary]

Yeah, you're DJ Tanner.

[Courtney]

David Charvet, who's an actor. I believe he's on Baywatch. Brandi Glanville, Colin Gosselin. Oliver Hudson. I'm shocked by Oliver Hudson. Kate Hudson's brother's doing this. He's, like, getting legit acting work.

[Mary]

Well, he's got to face drama.

[Courtney]

Oh, okay. LaShawn McCoy, NFL Super bowl champ. Maxon Namov, an Olympic figure skater. Ruby Rose, who is an actress. You remember her? She was on. I feel like you liked that show Orange is the New Black.

[Mary]

I did.

[Courtney]

She's like a really gorgeous Australian girl. Do you know, with the shorter hair. You know who I'm talking about?

[Mary]

Yes. Okay.

[Courtney]

Okay. George Santos. Hannah Stocking, a comedian. Bri Tiesi from selling Sunset.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Courtney]

She and Nick Cannon.

[Mary]

Oh, they have a baby.

[Courtney]

Well, he's got 12. I think she's. I also think she's currently pregnant again.

[Mary]

I think he had at least 14 the last time I heard.

[Courtney]

All right, okay. Then you got Alexia and Mauricio.

[Mary]

I might have to just, like, watch the Mauricio episode to see his trauma. I'd like to see Brandy's trauma and Candace Cameron's.

[Courtney]

Brandy's trauma gonna be the parasite?

[Mary]

It has to be.

[Courtney]

Or is it gonna be something like, I was just so misunderstood on Housewives. Leann Rimes had an affair and is married to Eddie. I feel like she's still going to talk about the trauma of that.

[Mary]

I feel like the face stuff has been such a battle for her and really taken over her life. Has Terry Dubrow ever seen her?

[Courtney]

Yes, and he said there's no parasite.

[Mary]

Oh.

[Courtney]

But also, if you guys watch Calabasas Confidential, it's a terrible reality show on Netflix. I need a season two immediately. Her son is featured as like, a friend of one of these. And then Brandy's in there and she's talking about her life. And it's very strange. But the thing that's wild to me is that she's hirable here because we literally have a scrapped season of Ultimate Girls trip because of her and Caroline Manzo.

[Mary]

Yeah.

[Courtney]

So Fox, NBC Universal, obviously, two different areas, but just I thought that's interesting that she is on this next season. West Wilson.

[Mary]

I. I agree with you.

[Courtney]

Should we take a break and come back?

[Mary]

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[Courtney]

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[Courtney]

Could AI help you do more of what you love? Workday is the AI platform for HR and finance that actually knows your business. We help you handle the hack and to dos so you can focus on the. Can't wait to dos. It's a new work day. Okay, thank God they updated the intro because last week when we were getting those inner stitchels from seasons past and

[Mary]

we said, poor Emily, she looks fantastic in this new stuff. I was so excited when these taglines came out. I texted Courtney. I go, I cannot wait to say them with you tomorrow.

[Courtney]

Why don't you start with Heather?

[Mary]

Okay. My motives are like my taste, best left unquestioned.

[Courtney]

I don't get that one.

[Mary]

No, like, don't question my motives. I always have the best taste. Don't question me.

[Courtney]

Okay. Okay. Now this is my favorite of the bunch. Shannon Storm's bedor. How do I hold it all together? Resilience and shapewear.

[Mary]

I mean, that is. Laugh out loud.

[Courtney]

This dress, though, terrible.

[Mary]

Jeff Lewis's friend did this dress and actually, it doesn't look great from this photo. It does look better. I didn't see it in person. It looks better on her Instagram. But Patrick and Pole, they're on Jeff Lewis. They're chumps and they've created the stress for her. It looks like really pretty, like, very intricate. It might not show that great on the camera.

[Courtney]

It doesn't. Okay. Do Jen.

[Mary]

Oh, no. The truth speaks volumes. And I'm about to turn it up.

[Courtney]

Oh, God. A season of her trying to be the bone collector, but she's just so d u m b. Okay, Gina, just because I'm spoken for doesn't mean I won't speak up. I don't like this one.

[Mary]

Well, I. I think it's very strange. They're all about, like. Not like she's like a kept woman now, but it's like it. Nothing's really changed. She's still. She's lived with Travis for how many years? Like, they're not actually married.

[Courtney]

Is he even divorced? Mary?

[Mary]

Yes. He only, like, put a fake diamond on her hand, you know.

[Courtney]

He is officially divorced. Yeah. Are you sure?

[Mary]

I would say 98%.

[Courtney]

Okay. Okay. I'm gonna go with that then. I. I feel like last season he was not. My favorite engagement is to someone who can't get married.

[Mary]

Okay, Emily. My body may be new, but my mouth is the same as always. I don't like that she has to talk about her body so much. Honestly, this episode when Shane says body

[Courtney]

shaming, but, like, her dress compared to everyone else's feels really off.

[Mary]

But don't you think they pick the dresses?

[Courtney]

I just don't think it matches as much. Like, it's also, like, in Atlanta. I believe it's K. Michelle compared to the rest of the women. She's wearing this, like, velvet number, and it's a darker red. And to me, it throws off because it's not like, the same color. And then this is not necessarily, like, a sparkly silver, which I feel like they're all going for, but it's also, like, short. And she looks hot, but, like, it doesn't fit the vibe with me where it's almost like they're trying to be diamonds.

[Mary]

Oh, I. That was not what I was getting.

[Courtney]

Okay, well, in my mind, you thought

[Mary]

they were trying to be Beverly Hills.

[Courtney]

Yeah. Like, sparkly, shimmery. And then she has, again, a hot dress. She looks fabulous. It just doesn't mesh with the group.

[Mary]

For me personally, should they have all been wearing orange?

[Courtney]

I would have. You know what? I would have loved that. I would have loved that. Okay, I'll do Carmela's. I'm the center of attention and the centerfold. And I do have to take something back. I said she's gonna be a one season wonder. I really enjoyed her this week, you guys. I really enjoyed her.

[Mary]

I really, really liked her. And I will say on the red carpet, I didn't know if I would either.

[Courtney]

That was our vibe. We didn't know because she was a little standoffish on the carpet. I don't know if it was standoffish as much. It might have just been overwhelming. And we didn't give her the benefit of the doubt because we're terrible humans.

[Mary]

I know. And I really came around to her this episode. I think her story is interesting. I think she's rich, and I like to see wealth on these shows. It's important to me.

[Courtney]

So this is our formal apology to Carmela Garcia. We are sorry for doubting you. Now if you do a bad job next week, we may take back that apology. So there is pressure.

[Mary]

Yeah. Things change real quickly around here. We are flip floppers.

[Courtney]

Okay, Do Tamra.

[Mary]

I'm still the Hottest housewife. And that's my opinion.

[Courtney]

I love this for the nostalgia factor, because her first season was that she was the hottest housewife. That was her tagline. And then incorporating. That's my opinion. I like that. I do wish she put more emphasis on that's my opinion.

[Mary]

Sure.

[Courtney]

But she was doing it. And if you watched our Tamra video

[Mary]

in, like, a supportive manner, I'm still the hottest housewife. And that's my opinion.

[Courtney]

Exactly. I feel like you should end with Vicki. I want to give Vicki to you.

[Mary]

Okay. Wives come and go, but legends, we whoop it up forever.

[Courtney]

Also a good one because of the nostalgia.

[Mary]

I liked them acknowledging, like, a legend and throwing in the whoop it up

[Courtney]

leader of the group. Am I right?

[Mary]

When I read them yesterday online, I was, like, giggling. You know, they made me laugh. I think they're funny.

[Courtney]

This season, to me, has felt. And we're only two episodes in, so obviously it'll change. But camp in a way, in a way that, like, SLC is camp this season because it's feeling a bit lighter. Feels campy to me. And these taglines are like, they're in on the joke.

[Mary]

I want them to focus more on the personal stories and less on the conflict.

[Courtney]

I was thinking when Vicki and Tamara had their meetup, I was like, this is what Mary has wanted, because she wanted an update on dawn. And you got it. You're not gonna see him in the present, but you're gonna hear about him. And I was like, this is what Mary was hoping for, you guys.

[Mary]

When we heard about dawn and her confessing that she cheated on dawn with Brooks, and yes, she's like, oh, I won't cheat again. I did that once, and it was horrible. And then her talking about running into him at nest. He lives in the desert now, and, you know, she's there with her boyfriend Mike, and she sees dawn and just, like, runs up to him, kisses him, hugs him. I'm so sorry I divorced you. That was probably such a big moment for him.

[Courtney]

Finally.

[Mary]

She really thought the grass was greener, and I think she acknowledges that now. And she says, I took him for granted. And I think Don was a great guy. Yeah, I think they bickered and would fight, and they probably had, like, a. A. A very normal marriage. Her love tank was not full, but I think she's been from Brooks then. Who was after Brooks? She had.

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[Mary]

Steve Lodge. Yes. You know, she's had a lot of people in her life that I think have taken advantage of her, and I think she's like, maybe I should have stayed and stuck that out. I know he sees Brianna a lot, too, so. I mean, I'm sure Vicki gets updates from Brianna, but I wonder, when's the last time she actually saw Donna in person?

[Courtney]

Vicki or Brianna? Yeah, Vicki at the nest.

[Mary]

Right. No, but, like, before. I would be curious. How many years?

[Courtney]

Yeah, I don't think. I don't think that they have run ins. It's just so funny because I think when I was talking last week about her relationship with Michael and you were saying, do you think she wants to be married? She wants the ring. And I was like, I think she's in such a different place now. I think with dawn, with the show, she started getting more attention. She started thinking, I want better for myself. Not, as you said, realizing that the grass isn't always greener. And seeing dawn, she was like, God, my life could have been so different because Don never wanted to do the show. Remember, he was like, we're not interesting. She said that at the panel.

[Mary]

I. I think he also was like, what are we gonna do this? We're boring.

[Courtney]

Yeah. Like, it wasn't like he didn't want to do it. He just was like, we. We don't have interesting enough lives. Yeah. And he's like, little did he know

[Mary]

a docu series about our lives? Like, yeah, but I. I also like the whole, like, nostalgia about talking about, like, Havasu and this season.

[Courtney]

Is that part of it or no?

[Mary]

I. I felt like. Yeah, I felt like that was gonna come.

[Courtney]

Setting it up.

[Mary]

I also. I just. I liked the. I liked them just filming in Tamara's house and ordering doordash. I felt like that was very natural. Like, that's what you do. You go over to your friend's house, you have a glass of wine, you order food. We don't have to have everything so set up. I think that's what I'm missing, too. And real friendships. Because you can tell a lot of these people haven't seen each other since filming last ended. I do think Vicki and Tamara have a different relationship. Like, on the phone. They're in a better place now. Like, they will get drinks off camera. I think that's what we need.

[Courtney]

The reason that some casts will work really well is because they are friends. Miami. It works because a lot of them are close, like the bros. We've got this longevity between so much of this cast. I think maybe that's also partially why I was, like, not gelling with Carmela at first, too, is. I'm like, we have such history. We have, like, eight years and on with this cast past. They've either known each other for eight years or in Vicky and Tamara's case, what, 18?

[Mary]

Yeah.

[Courtney]

Yeah. So it's like, there's so much history with them that when it can be light like this and they're talking about these things, like, even, like, the fact of, like, Heather and Tamara, because Tamara's telling Vicki about this, like, Heather puts me in a box. There's something about knowing that it's never going to be that serious in a way that feels good. Where I feel like Jen is really trying to stir some stuff up, and I'm like, can you just, like, not. But can you just not when Vicky's

[Mary]

like, I mean, are you really that good to friends with Heather? It's the surface level friendship thing. You're just friends for the show. You don't really like Heather. Why do you even care? Like, stay out of this shit. I loved it.

[Courtney]

I also love, too, that she's threatened by Heather because Heather now thinks she's the leader of the group. And Vicki's like, I'm the leader of this group.

[Mary]

Okay. Did you think that Heather really texted her that? That. No. Right.

[Courtney]

He was added into the group chat for the cast.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Courtney]

Heather either added her or created the group chat and said, welcome back, Vicki. Like, here's the chat so that we talk with each other throughout. Like, I don't think that she was in the season 19 cast chat. I think that's what happened. And so Vicki then, of course, is like, this is my show. I don't think Heather thought anything else from that.

[Mary]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Courtney]

And then we've got the new blogger this year. It's not bloggers. It's.

[Mary]

We're talking podcasts.

[Courtney]

Okay. I'm like, man, we were so close both times. Could have been us. But Vicki being like, who even has time to listen to all these podcasts? Do you work like babe? That's where they are listening to the podcast at work. Also. You have a podcast, Vicki.

[Mary]

Vicki has a podcast once a week with Christian Grace. No. You've gotten in trouble because of your podcast. Like, you should not be putting down podcasts. You literally have one.

[Courtney]

You got into a fight with Tamara where we had to see that lasered face because you said it on the podcast.

[Mary]

Yes.

[Courtney]

Okay, Victoria.

[Mary]

Victoria. Okay, let's take a break and break down this podcast drama.

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[Courtney]

So let me try to break down what I think is happening with the logistics of the podcasts and then maybe what the arguments are. And then feel free to jump in at any point because you know, I'll keep talking. But to go back to last season's reunion, if I'm remembering correctly, Tamara brought up the podcast drama because two T's has their network on iHeart. So let's just picture two T's to be this umbrella. And Emily was one of the podcasts on this under this umbrella. So Legally Brunette when their new episodes came out, they would come on the feed of two T's. So if you subscribe to two T's when Emily Had a new podcast out, you'd also get Legally Brunette. And because you'd get Legally Brunette, she's getting the built in listenership from Tamara and Teddy. And then people would decide if they wanted to listen to it or not. So she's getting like a big leg up there to have a built in fandom already.

[Mary]

Right? Because people would essentially start listening, thinking it's new two T's in a pod, but it's actually Legally Brunette.

[Courtney]

Or also like it would say Legally Brunette, but she would get that listener to say, hey, do you want to? So it made it way easier to discover Emily's podcast as opposed to having to go search for it. Emily's got this podcast, right? So then Emily was getting listenership from this. And so she decided to leave that network. So leave 2T's feed and then have her own feed.

[Mary]

Now, do you think when she left the feed, do you think Tamara at that point is not making money off of her?

[Courtney]

I feel like she's probably still getting some sort of kickback. I just don't think it's maybe as much. But when Emily left to her own feed, the numbers weren't there. She didn't get that following from. From two T's, So it looks like it drastically plummeted over there. And so the money's not coming in the listenership. And so it sounds like then Emily decided to go back under, whether it was because I heart said or not. And that's where they were arguing last year at the reunion.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Courtney]

Tamara's basically telling Emily, you actually need me. Two T's has over a hundred million downloads and we're giving you a built in fandom and you're coming at me as if you're not grateful for the leg I've given you. Now it sounds like though, legally Burnett has left that umbrella again, left her feed, because now maybe she's got more built in listenership. They might have just left too early. And so now Emily has that. And then what it also sounds like is Legally Brunette discusses cases all abroad of subject matter.

[Mary]

They did that maternal instinct case that. Oh yeah, Netflix doc that we talked about on Patreon.

[Courtney]

Huh. And so they also were talking about a lot of murder cases, or as Emily wants to say, unaliving. And so it sounds like from the murder cases they wanted to have another feed, which is what they're doing this photo shoot for so that they could focus over there. Is that the move? I don't know, because I noticed that it's actually now under their legally Brunette feed Legally Brunette presents Death Do Us Part. So I'm wondering if they tried their own feed, didn't get the listeners, and then pulled it back under Legally Brunette to have, like, every Friday, a Death Do Us Part podcast.

[Mary]

Yeah, I. I guess my whole thing was with, this is like, Tamara, at the end of the day, you're making money off Emily, and you're doing pretty much nothing to do that. So why wouldn't you just want to, like, promote it and just make it seem like it's a great podcast and everybody should listen, in my opinion. I think she's trying to make Emily look bad here, even though maybe she feels like Emily isn't grateful, but I think it's making Tamara look bad, and then it's making people maybe not want to listen because it feels like Tamara is saying the podcast is bad even though Tamara's making money off of it. You know what I mean?

[Courtney]

She does say at the old lady. I can't believe, like, I've turned so much and I'm now defending Tamara. But it. I think what it is is, like, Tamara's like, Emily, you're gonna come after me last season. You're gonna come after me when I've given you this opportunity to have your podcast on my feed for you to make money. And yes, obviously I make money. You're gonna come after me. You honestly need me, Then you're gonna leave, and you're not even gonna be grateful when Shane told Emily, just give her a thank you card. So you shut her up. I'm like, you should just do that. Be like, here you go. Are you happy now? Obviously, I'm grateful. I heart told me to make a post saying we have our own feed to find us here. I'm sorry I didn't give you a thank you, but I am so appreciative. And I know she says that at this Hamburger Mary's luncheon, but I'm also like, emily should be grateful. Do I think that Tamara is jealous of her ugly leather pants, AKA podcast? No, I don't.

[Mary]

I. That was a stretch for me. Like, obviously, Tamara's making more money on her own podcast and more successful. I mean, mean, I'm sorry, 100 million downloads is a ton of downloads.

[Courtney]

Whether you like them or not, they're doing the thing. And I also think that they have a niche, that they are recapping all of these shows with the behind the scenes of what really happens. They have Dolores who pops in. I'm assuming Dolores is doing Orange county. Maybe instead of Tamara because she can't comment.

[Mary]

Dolores does a ton, and I think that has to do with also, like, Teddy maybe not always up to podcasting every day.

[Courtney]

I didn't know she was picking Tamara spot because Tamara, like, there's probably some loophole that she's not allowed to actually talk about her own show.

[Mary]

Yeah, she's definitely not allowed to do Orange county, but Dolores does multiple podcasts with them a week.

[Courtney]

Cynthia pops in any every so often, or is she just doing humble brag now?

[Mary]

I think Cynthia just is doing her own primarily, but Dolores seems like their. Their number one co host.

[Courtney]

Got it.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Courtney]

If I'm Tamara, I'm like, you're gonna come after me. I gave you this platform, and then you're gonna just act as if I've done nothing for you. I see what you're saying, too. Should be grateful. She should be promoting it. But I think she's also like, yeah, I make money from you, but honestly, you make money from me.

[Mary]

I. I see what you're saying. I don't know. I just.

[Courtney]

Upside down, Mary. It's the upside down. Okay.

[Mary]

Honestly, I was so thrown because Tamara wearing those depends. I felt violated. I could. It was too much. This was the dorkiest party. I thought it was so lame. If I was Heather and Shannon, I would have done the exact same thing.

[Courtney]

They looked amazing.

[Mary]

Yeah, I'm a glamorous glam. And she's like, I'm married to a plastic surgeon. Of course my face is going to stay like this. And I loved Shannon's look. It was just like Vicki and Tamara leaned in a little too hard.

[Courtney]

This was awesome. I'll be honest, too. If this is my birthday party and you're throwing me a surprise birthday party and I don't get to come in theme, and all of you guys have a good joke together, and you can take old, old photos and ha ha ha. And then I come in looking hot. I'm like, what the. Like, I'm not in on the joke. Now that's funny.

[Mary]

I. I would have felt left out.

[Courtney]

Yeah, exactly. But the best part about this, though, is because if we want to backtrack to the bungee jumping workout class, which I'm like, shannon needs ankle strength. I am worried about these weak ankles of her.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Courtney]

There she is just being flung around this room. I. I worry. Gina goes, yeah, I give Emily a lot of for getting older. And turning is this look Shannon gives to the camera like, you gotta be effing kidding. I'm in my 60s because it's half second. It's just a quick glance of like, you guys hearing this shit? Yeah.

[Mary]

I will say I loved when we saw the ring camera footage of Shannon actually falling and not performing. Falling, like her bungee jumping. She, she, she thinks she's in an acting class.

[Courtney]

Heather Debro could give her some tips at the ground. She's a physical comedy. She's like, it's me, Chris Farley. Isn't that what you said?

[Mary]

Yep. It's just, it's. It's tough to watch. And then so the whole thing there was like. Jen's like, so I kind of like stirred the pot with Heather on camera. But, you know, Heather keeps telling me to like, speak up for her. She wants me to be her buddy this season, so I thought I was doing that, but I guess I did something wrong. And. Okay, honestly, I'm kind of on Heather's side here. So then when Heather and Tamara go to the restaurant, they're talking, oh my God, I haven't been sleeping. Tamara hasn't slept in two nights. Heather didn't go to bed till 2am you know, and that's because I didn't like how you walked off from my party.

[Courtney]

I think it was from the espresso martinis. I think she was up late because she had two or three espresso martinis and was like, why can't I go to sleep? And it's like, cuz you're full of caffeine

[Mary]

but not dairy.

[Courtney]

What does that mean? Just no Bailey's. Right?

[Mary]

Non dairy. Yeah.

[Courtney]

I don't like the ones with Bailey's. I mean, I do. It goes down real fast, but I prefer one without.

[Mary]

I, I agree with you. Except the original Joe's one. They. It's like creamy. It's delicious. It's like a milkshake.

[Courtney]

Yeah, that's like the dessert though. Like, I'm not having more than one of those. I'm having two teenies. And then I'm having. I'm doing, I'm doing what Dorinda tells me not to, but I'm having a third of an espresso martini.

[Mary]

That feels appropriate for an OJ's night. So. So Tamara tells Heather. Well, Jen told me that you're talking behind my back. And, and Heather's. Oh my God, stop that. Stop that. And it's like, yeah. Heather's like, of course I talk about behind your back. We. We all do. And I can compartmentalize my friendships and that's what I'm doing with you. So relax. Tamara, you do the same Exact thing.

[Courtney]

Everyone does this.

[Mary]

Doesn't everyone do this?

[Courtney]

We're using this from the reunion. After the reunion, they all talked shit at dinner. And that's like what Jenna's referencing. But then we also get this flashback scene to Jen being at Heather's house, asking her 20 questions and trying to see if she can pull up to use again, even though she's supposed to be Heather's buddy. And you know, Heather asked Jen to be her buddy and then was like, oh, my God, she really is as dumb as everyone said. I'm sorry.

[Mary]

Like, we.

[Courtney]

I just have to side mention to the fact that Jen's son started this Ladera Ranch fire and she put a story out about it and then is like, the discipline is going to be a fire class. Like, yeah. And community service. And also your family should have to pay for the bills of the firefighters that everyone's gonna have to pay for. But that's just an aside. I could go on forever, but I won't because I think we all know what that stuff.

[Mary]

That was very bad.

[Courtney]

And it's the youngest kid. Scary. What the hell is he doing? Anyways, back to Heather and Tamra. I think Heather and Tamra are historical friends.

[Mary]

Yes.

[Courtney]

I don't think that they really hang out. I think that's what you were alluding to with the Vicky Tamara combo.

[Mary]

Well, they're just show friends and they want to put on a good show and they know how to. To play this up. And it feels like to me, Tamara has decided I'm going to get that dub this season. This is kind of gonna be my story. And she starts in her confessionals. I think Heather changes her personality based on who she hangs out with. And then meanwhile, we, like, see Heather calling her out for all her. Like, I didn't like how you acted at the Quiet Woman. That was embarrassing. And yeah, you kind of do compartmentalize friends. Like, I go to certain friends about certain things and I think that's what Heather does.

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[Courtney]

And yes, Tamara, you can be in a box with a bow of and diamonds. Okay. No worries. You have those friends that you're like, okay, I know I can't do X, Y and Z with this friend, but I can do A, B and C with them. Okay. I know that's right. Like, that's what it is. And also, by the way, guys, Heather thinks she's better than every single person on this cast.

[Mary]

She sure does.

[Courtney]

That is part of the Heather debrow charm, if you will, is that she thinks she is better than every Single person on this cast. So you all are in boxes for what she needs to use you for. For.

[Mary]

She also doesn't even live in Orange County.

[Courtney]

Okay, to be fair, though, where is Carmela living? Because technically, she's in Corona del Mar, but she's in Rancho Santa Fe, which is part of San Diego County.

[Mary]

That was confusing. But also, like, Carmela's house is huge. That has to be one of the biggest houses we've ever seen on tv besides Heather Deros.

[Courtney]

Don't ever talk about that porticochet that Heather had that we never even got to see when that house was built until she came back.

[Mary]

Back.

[Courtney]

We had seasons of that porticochet. And then you guys fire her. We had to wait for it to come back. That was tough.

[Mary]

Okay, this whole Carmela. So she has four kids. So those four kids are all with the quarterback of.

[Courtney]

Did you ask?

[Mary]

No, because I stayed in my parents.

[Courtney]

Oh, my God. I texted Mary. I said, we. We have an in to get Michael because Jeff Garcia used to play for the Browns. The Ohio connection is there. This is how we get him. Him.

[Mary]

Like when he texted me, she's like, ask Michael about Jeff Garcia. I'm like, what is she talking about? And I'm thinking she's talking about Jerry Garcia from the Grateful Dead.

[Courtney]

She's like. She's like, jerry or Jeff? Jeff. I thought you'd already watched the episode at that point. So I was like, the connection wasn't there. But I'm like, no, this is how we get Michael to care about our shows.

[Mary]

Right? Right. But I thought they did a great job talking about Carmela's life support. So she grew up in Cleveland, came from, like, a really strict background. And then she's like. So then I kind of the other way. And she talks about her playmate time she was playmate of the year 2004. Then she gets married at 21. He is like 13 or 14 years older than her. She was like, I would be drunk on the Jumbotron. He'd be like, please stop drinking at the games. And they have these four kids. She ends up finding out that he's cheating on her from an iPad dad

[Courtney]

with a burner phone number.

[Mary]

They end up going their separate ways, but they aren't actually divorced. And they have an interesting custody situations. Like, nothing is on paperwork.

[Courtney]

There is no situation. It's just. He tells Vicki later, I didn't want to have to get divorced and then lose my kids 50 of the time. I didn't want to have to have a schedule. So this is how it worked out, and I honestly think that that's great. It's also funny because she's talking to Shannon about her life. Her first meetup is with Shannon, who is, like, so prim and proper, even though we know that the twins were conceived after a Def Leppard concert. But Shannon is so the opposite of Carmela.

[Mary]

Yes, you're right.

[Courtney]

When she's like, she goes, carmela is racy. Like, as if, like, her being a Playboy playmate all those years ago is, like, really throwing Shannon off.

[Mary]

They were an interesting dynamic, but I think they really get along in real time. And the only person that I think that isn't getting along with Carmela is Vicki. And this is gonna bite Vicki in the ass. The comments that she has been making, like, oh, my God, your kids are, like, having such a dysfunctional situation. What. What about the children? How is this affecting them? They sound like they're doing an awesome job.

[Courtney]

They are literally, like.

[Mary]

Like, he's not a track practice. You need to call him and get his ass to track practice. They seem like they are talking to each other constantly. They have birthdays together. They're co parenting, and, like, it's definitely working out for them. I did not like Vicky's opinion on this. She can be so traditional in so many ways, and it's like, guess what? This is working for that family, and those kids seem like they're thriving. So shut the up, Vic. You double.

[Courtney]

I also, like, if we want to go there, I was like, dawn's your third divorce, Vicki, second divorce. Like, I'm just saying, you're coming at them. Yes. They're not divorced, but they figured out how to co parent because as Tamara said, you love your kids more than you hate him.

[Mary]

Yeah.

[Courtney]

And they've figured out what works for them. Now I'm upset, though, because she left Jeff Garcia because he cheated only to get with this guy Danny, who also has infidelity. But she hasn't left him. And they've been on and off for about 10 years, it sounds. They live together, and for some reason, I feel like he lives with her. Her?

[Mary]

Oh.

[Courtney]

Not like she lives with him. I'd love to see his bank account. I don't know what Danny does, but I'm judging him and I'm allowed to. It's in the title of the show.

[Mary]

Oh. I mean, she's a developer. I would be very curious. So then it also seems like they go between the two houses, her ex and her. Like, they kind of switch off other houses. I was kind of A little bit confused.

[Courtney]

It sounds like she has a place in Rancho Santa Fe. So does he. And then she also has a place in Corona del Mar. So then I was wondering maybe Danny's places in Corona del Mar. And that's where she goes to stay when she wants to be in Orange County. The kids go back and forth, Rancho Santa Fe, depending on where they want to be. That's what I grasped from it. I don't know. But then I also started thinking too, like, okay, they're not divorced. I know Jeff probably also finances a lot of her life because there's no alimony, but I bet there's something going on there. She has like, money from him. And not that she doesn't have her own because she was playmate of the year. She was in wwe. She's a real estate developer. As Jen Pedrante said, there's so many layers to Carmela.

[Mary]

I bet they are developers together. I wouldn't be surprised that they're in business together. I. I am making that up. But that wouldn't be the pipeline from

[Courtney]

NFL to real estate.

[Mary]

Of course. A natural progression.

[Courtney]

Of course.

[Mary]

And then they're also trying to develop this story of like, Carmel and Gina being against each other. And Gina's like, no, no. So she's not actually in real estate. She's not a real estate agent. She's a developer. They're trying to create that clash and the Vicki Carmela clash.

[Courtney]

We do need to mention about the gated group website that we talked about last week. Because, listen, real estate is not our jam. We don't know. So when we saw 4,000 listings, we thought they were the gated group listings. We now know that they are just pulled from the mls and these are homes for sale. If people are interested, someone from the gated group could. Could show them, as I'm assuming, the buyer.

[Mary]

That feels confusing. You know, I thought those were everyone in the gated group's listings. And I thought they had a lot of people under their belt.

[Courtney]

Now there is still hope that she could replace Mauricio. He's busy on special forces. Anyways, we need somebody to take over the real estate brand. So all the million dollar listing shows have been canceled. So it's Gina or bust.

[Mary]

Oh, oh, wait. I would maybe be pretty interested in Gina and Travis having a real estate show.

[Courtney]

Okay.

[Mary]

I love these real estate shows. I really enjoy them.

[Courtney]

You do?

[Mary]

You.

[Courtney]

You have layers like Carmela. Okay, so let's talk hamburger Mary. So we have to go to Long beach because we're doing a 50th surprise party. And I will say, though, I mean, I think Vicky and Tamara looked ridiculous, but I also appreciate that all of them went all out because all Jen did was put, like six parts of her hair in curlers and still do makeup and then put a baggy sweater on. She's like, I'm so old. And that's her greatest fear.

[Mary]

That is very, very true. I don't like this gimmick. I think this was so lame. We already saw it in Summer House. That was actually funny. This was just so dorky and played up for me. I know a lot of people had a problem. Vicki and Shannon falling at last episode. I think they really need to focus on the sitting in each other's kitchen scenes and just kind of going back to the basics because they're trying to, like, drum up situations, which makes it inauthentic.

[Courtney]

Also, though, haven't they already gone to the Hamburger Marys and weho when they all came dressed as rock stars and Lydia came as Charlie Chapman Chaplin,

[Mary]

Like,

[Courtney]

Shannon came as, like, Brett Michaels. You know what I'm talking about.

[Mary]

You know I have a thing for Brett Michaels. And yes, I know exactly what you're talking about.

[Courtney]

We have to literally repeat places now because we need to be part of the gimmick. And Jen just tries again. It's like, jen, just shut up. You're not good at this.

[Mary]

This. I did not care about this Jen Heather fight.

[Courtney]

Well, she's like, I've got to say I'm sorry. And it's like, no, you're not. You just. It didn't succeed. You just realize that it wasn't going to work. And even when she tried to turn it on Shannon earlier in the episode, I was like, jen, you're going to get a lot of from everyone because they're all going to realize what you're doing because you're not smart enough to be more secretive about what you're doing. Like, you're trying to tell Shannon, you're making me do your dirty work. It's like, of course Shannon is, but she'll never admit that out loud. Code, right? Some of them will admit it out loud. You're just dumb enough to fall for it.

[Mary]

I also kind of got a dorit vibe from Heather in this situation. Cutting really long winded and making sure her point was getting across. And she kept on going and going and going. I was like, does anyone care about this fight? I don't want to watch that. I. I don't want to watch you guys in Stupid costumes and depends. I don't. I don't want to see the acting. I want them to have, like, genuine fun together, and it needs to be a little bit more authentic.

[Courtney]

Okay, well, I will say one of the things I really, really liked at this luncheon, Drag Bingo, was that all the women were giving Emily advice. At the heart of what Real Housewives is, is it's about these women having their second lives. And this really lets them. And hopefully has made for a lot of them, especially on this cast, too, is like, have more independence in their own life, have more confidence in who they are, being able to be better versions of themselves, not having to rely on a man, being able to live their lives so authentically. And this show has helped them. And I feel like the advice that all these women gave Emily were directly because of this show completely.

[Mary]

Tamara's like, my 50s were my best era ever. And look at. I mean, she's built this massive following on Two T's in a pod. I like what Heather said, you know, be. Be careful of your own brain.

[Courtney]

Jen doesn't have to worry about that. Sorry. It's just, like, I'm having a really tough time watching Jen because especially of what happened last week. I'm sorry. It's just, like, really tough for me. She's lost me, so I will be being mean, unfortunately for her.

[Mary]

Okay. And then Shannon's like, I. I feel younger than ever, in my 60s. And Vicki's like, well, we're all gonna die someday.

[Courtney]

Tell her I died. Sad. This show has changed their lives. How many of these women came on married and they're divorced now? How many of them have made money and been able to be financially successful because of this? Whether they've done that once they've left the show. You know, Kelly on Atlanta, sure, that's a tough one. But for the majority, these women, this show has changed their lives for the better. And so their advice of this to Emily just felt like. That felt nostalgic in a way of just, like, how far so many of them have come. And I think across all franchises, I agree with that.

[Mary]

That's what makes me love this show. I love these women finding themselves in an unlikely place. Reality tv.

[Courtney]

And of course, it's like, oh, you think just because Emily's skinny, she doesn't eat anymore, she's not going to be feral? We got a bowl of chicken week, and we got birthday cake this week.

[Mary]

Emily saying, I love birthday cake, as she's eating with her mouth open, and Jen just goes, shocker. I was like, why does it always come back to shaming Emily? It is so weird.

[Courtney]

Jen's like, don't eat that. You're skinny now. Like, I feel like that's like what she's whispering to her. Then Emily's cheers is cheers to being 50 and not fat. I and it's just like, oh, that sounds like you have some food issues that are for another day.

[Mary]

I think we're ready for the weekend.

[Courtney]

Everybody's working for the weekend.

[Mary]

You guys have a great weekend. We will be back Monday with Atlanta. Bye.

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