TJG: Summer House Season 10 Finale & In The City S1 Premiere (Part 1)!

Summary

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Two Judgey Girls – Summer House Season 10 Finale & In The City S1 Premiere (Part 1)

Podcast: Two Judgey Girls
Hosts: Courtney (LA) and Mary (Bay Area)
Episode Date: May 20, 2026

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Episode Overview

This special two-part event covers the emotional Season 10 finale of Summer House and the much-anticipated premiere of In The City. Courtney and Mary break down the major happenings, from dramatic relationship developments and the end of an era in the Hamptons, to the transition into a new chapter for the cast. The episode is equal parts honest reflection, sharp pop culture commentary, and inside jokes for Bravo superfans.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The End of an Era: Summer House Finale

[02:53 - 06:20]

• A Bittersweet Farewell:

  • The finale is described as “sadness. 100%. Such a tough episode.”
  • Mary wishes producers had acknowledged the finality with a true send-off for the OGs (Kyle, Amanda, Carl, Lindsay), including a Goodbye Montage.
  • Both hosts emphasize the significance of a decade spent at the Summer House—even if only four years were in the current location.

• Notable Quote:

  • “Am I getting chills talking about it as if these are my real friends? I don't. They're not my friends. But it really is the finality of the end of an era of Summer House.” (Courtney, 04:08)

• Passing the Torch:

  • Sierra is recognized between old and new eras: not an OG but closer than newer cast.
  • The cast as a whole seems uncertain—no one is sure if this is truly “goodbye.”

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Amanda & Kyle: The Relationship at the Center

[06:21 - 10:20]

• Amanda’s Evolution:

  • Amanda is “spiraling” after a heavy summer—the pressure of her marriage, new job, and expectations for having a baby are mounting.
  • Mary interprets Amanda’s “I love you” at the party as genuine but laden with anxiety about the future.

• Production Influence & Realities:

  • Insightful speculation on how production schedules key relationship conversations.
  • Amusing sidetrack on Amanda’s long-expired driver’s license and logistic mysteries.

• Notable Quotes:

  • “In any relationship, it is really hard to be the person to start that conversation because it makes it real.” (Courtney, 09:48)
  • “She finally got the balls to stand up to him and say, guess what? I can't continue doing what we're doing.” (Mary, 09:52)

• Kyle’s Spirals & Internet Reaction:

  • Fans observed Amanda and Kyle posing together at the In The City premiere, leading to rampant speculation and online toxicity.
  • Both hosts empathize with Amanda’s situation—caught in contractual, professional, and personal crosshairs.

• Notable Quote:

  • “She probably is contractually obligated to show up to this premiere... She's in a no win situation either way.” (Courtney, 11:39)

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Lindsay, Carl & OG Dynamics

[13:06 - 16:38]

• Carpet Commentary:

  • Lindsay seen as “coaching” on the red carpet, and she and Yvonne’s friendship sparks curiosity.
  • Speculation on cast chemistry—Amanda appears only for obligatory photos.

• Lindsay & Carl’s Closure:

  • Described as a “forced” but necessary conversation for closure; hosts debate the authenticity of Carl’s sentiments.
  • The emotional stakes for Lindsay, post-breakup, are discussed, with a nod to her feeling blindsided.

• Notable Quotes:

  • “In their relationship... she makes them faint. Remember when he fainted the day before he proposed? Which was like, that should have been the sign.” (Courtney, 39:32)
  • “There was something cathartic about these OGs finishing and wrapping up their storylines in a way. And I was weirdly smiling during the whole thing, even though it was a tough conversation to have.” (Courtney, 31:36)

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Party Recap: The Final Summer Blowout

[23:30 - 24:29]

• Abruptly Unraveled Fun:
  • Over-the-top details: igloos, saunas, holographic ice walls, nighttime party—“Production must have given them a large budget for this because it’s the end.”
  • The party is compared to a Stefan SNL sketch: “This party has it all.” (Courtney, 24:10)

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Relationship Post-Mortems: Advice, Intimacy, & On-Camera Fallout

[24:29 - 29:24]

• Sierra’s Intervention:

  • Sierra gives forthright advice to Kyle, voicing support but also drawing lines about boundaries and group impact.
  • She pushes Amanda to make a decision—possibly overstepping, but also empowering her.

• The Cost of Reality TV Relationships:

  • The hosts discuss whether televised relationships—engagements, weddings, fights—are real or driven by storyline needs.
  • Calls back to other Bravo situations (e.g. Jax & Brittany, Ariana & Tom from Vanderpump).

• Notable Quote:

  • “You start thinking too, and I'm sure production on their end is like, what's in the future for you guys? Are you planning this? And, like, we would love—the fans would love to capture this moment.” (Courtney, 29:04)

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Sierra, West, and the Kiss That (Maybe) Didn’t Matter

[17:09 - 18:06]

• Romantic Whiplash:
  • Sierra and West’s “moment” feels minimized amid the chaos, but remains central to viewers invested in their dynamic.
  • Hosts break down whether the West & Sierra saga had any real impact, calling it “minuscule” among the episode’s many climaxes.
  • Chracter interactions described as “touchy feely, touchy feely. Cast is too touchy feely” (Courtney, 18:15)

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Behind the Scenes & Party Logistics

[46:05 - 46:44]

• Inside Production:
  • Only housemates + a select few extras allowed inside during the party.
  • Hosts muse about whether the pool house has a bathroom, how production manages logistics for such massive parties, and the necessity for porta potties.

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Cast Transition and Looking Forward

[16:38 - 18:06, 28:13 - 29:24]

• Who Stays, Who Goes:
  • Much curiosity (and some impatience) about the next cast for In The City—with Mary fixated on who gets the next invitation.
  • Acknowledgement that Bravo casts are reshaped by both audience reception and the personal crossroads of cast members.
  • Big cliffhanger for next week: “Who is going to go to the Summer House? That’s like my—I cannot wait to know who the cast will be.” (Mary, 16:38)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “I wish they would have broke the fourth wall and kind of been like, this is probably the last summer in the house with these OGs.” (Mary, 02:53)
• "Am I getting chills talking about it as if these are my real friends? ... it really is the finality of the end of an era of summer house." (Courtney, 04:08)
• “She finally got the balls to stand up to him and say, guess what? I can't continue doing what we're doing.” (Mary, 09:52)
• "You cannot keep doing this merry go round... now you're actually fighting with other people because of this. ... I do think Sierra overstepped with recommending the separation. ... But maybe it was good to ignite that conversation." (Courtney, 25:29)
• "The lines of blur of reality and reality tv. And you think, will anybody like me if we break up? Do I have a point on this show, Are we together? Because we're just... It's... There's a lot of pressure right now." (Courtney, 28:36)
• “There was something cathartic about these OGs finishing and wrapping up their storylines in a way.” (Courtney, 31:36)
• “In their relationship and their friendship, [Lindsay] makes [Carl] faint. ... That should have been the sign.” (Courtney, 39:32)
• "Touchy feely, touchy feely. Cast is too touchy feely. That should be wild." (Courtney, 18:15)
• "The exhale line [from Sierra] is actually what put Kyle over the edge of being like, oh, it's bad." (Courtney, 26:45)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:42 – Opening thoughts: Bittersweet feelings, lack of closure montage
• 04:08 – The finality/“passing the torch”
• 06:39 – Amanda’s emotional state at the finale party
• 09:52 – Amanda stands up to Kyle
• 10:20 – 12:22 – In The City premiere fallout, red carpet awkwardness, Internet uproar
• 13:30 – 14:43 – Lindsay, Yvonne, and cast carpet dynamics
• 17:09 – 18:06 – West & Sierra relationship drama
• 24:29 – 25:27 – Sierra’s heartfelt sit-down with Kyle
• 29:04 – The cost of on-camera relationships for Bravo celebs
• 31:36 – 34:04 – Lindsay and Carl’s “closure” conversation
• 39:32 – 40:21 – (Re: Lindsay & Carl) "She makes them faint"—the warning signs in failing reality TV relationships
• 46:05 – 46:44 – Production logistics for the finale party

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Tone & Style

The conversation is breezy, sharp, and irreverently honest—balancing inside jokes and Bravo deep cuts with surprisingly tender reflections on the nature of friendship, change, and “growing up on TV.” Courtney and Mary speak with both empathy for the cast and a wink to podcast listeners who are equally invested in these reality TV storylines.

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For Listeners: Why This Episode Matters

Even if you missed the Summer House finale or In The City premiere, this episode brings out the big questions about the price of public relationships, the emotional stakes of an era ending, and the messy, real-world dynamics that play out on and off camera. The analysis is both expert and heartfelt, with practical empathy for even the most “judgey” of Bravo stars.

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Stay tuned for Part 2, which promises even deeper dives and pop culture crossovers!

Transcript

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[Mary]

week on Lead Human with Jack Myers and Tim Spengler.

[Jack Myers]

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[Mary]

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[Jack Myers]

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[Mary]

Welcome back to two Jaezy Girls. This is Mary from the Bay and

[Courtney]

it's Courtney from la and we are here for our two part event tonight.

[Mary]

I mean when I watched this the first time my overall emotion was just like sadness. 100%. Such a tough episode. And the weird part about it is and I think everyone needs to like watch the episode is like they are mourning the loss of never coming back to the summer house at this point. I wish they would have broke the fourth wall and kind of been like, this is probably the last summer in the house with these OGs like Lindsay, Kyle, Amanda, Carl. And I wish I had a little bit more of, like, a goodbye montage of all the great times. Like, I could have watched five minutes of a montage with, like, some 90s music of the great times in the house. And I will say I'm also very proud of Amanda once again. Guys, I am watching this. Like, the scandal didn't happen.

[Jack Myers]

Been.

[Mary]

Yeah. So I'm thinking I'm very proud of Amanda. And it was just like, this was such a big moment. They did 10 years in this home, and I loved it.

[Courtney]

Only, like. Only like four in this specific home, but 10 years in the summer house. I agree. Like, watching it, you could see the finality of it. Even looking at the details of this ski party and how all out they went there. Am I getting chills talking about it as if these are my real friends? I don't. They're not my friends. But it really is the finality of the end of an era of summer house. Kyle, who started this show, even though they're moving on to the next version now, who knows? Because half of them could come back next summer. All of them could come back to next summer. It's so up in the air.

[Mary]

That's the wildest part. Like, they thought, this is my final summer. I mean, I think Lindsay did. I think Kyle and Amanda did, and Carl for sure. Yeah. And I wish they would have acknowledged that a little bit.

[Courtney]

I wish you would have been pretty blessed out there. Like, this is goodbye.

[Mary]

Yes.

[Courtney]

Yes, I agree. I agree. Watching the group together, I thought about it too. It was like Sierra's on the most in this in between. She came in at season five, so she's not an OG like them, but she sits more of an OG in this group. But I think for her, she also realized too, was like, this is it. I'm probably staying. I'm not on in the city.

[Mary]

Mm.

[Courtney]

I'm probably saying my future is with, like, Jesse and West over here. She's dealing with whatever. We'll get into that part of it. But it's kind of the passing of the torch in a way. We are now the summer house. There's so many as we'll say layers to this. And you're so right, though, is that we're not really acknowledging the end of this era. Because we're acknowledging the end of this relationship, which though just as compelling for me, I was on the edge of my seat watching this, I cried a couple of times and then I was talking to you about it because it's obviously a two part event that we're going from Summer House to In the City. And once we got in the city, I was fully enveloped into in the City. I wasn't thinking about Summer House anymore. I was like, okay, now we're in the new part. Obviously we have the reunion in three weeks of watching that. But it, they did a really great job of transitioning, ending Summer House, ending it with the Kyle and Amanda conversation, and then pushing into this new show.

[Mary]

I loved it. And I was honestly, I was trying to figure out, wait, where did Summer House actually end? Like, if I was to watch the last episode by itself, where did it end? Because it just like, you know, quickly spiraled into it. And speaking of spirals,

[Courtney]

great segue.

[Mary]

I, I, I honestly thought so. You know, they're having a great time at the Aubrey Ski party and Amanda grabs Jesse's face and, and kisses him and says, I love you. And she's like, there's like nothing better than being at this summer house. And you know, they're kind of having this like goodbye moment and like talking about the great times. And then I just thought, is Amanda completely spiraling right now? Because she's thinking, oh shit, now I have this new job that I'm supposed to have a baby. I really think she's like, okay, Summer House is closed. I don't even want to be with Kyle. The next chapter for us is supposed to be like, we have this new job and I'm like, supposed to have a baby. And she's thinking, what have I gotten myself into? And I think she had like a great summer. She had so much fun. She partied the most because Paige wasn't there. So I, I honestly, I was like, is she just like fucking spiraling too?

[Courtney]

Okay, so funny, because I thought you were talking about Kyle spiral from the in the City premiere last night and you're talking about Amanda's which, let's talk about that after. But you bring up some great, great questions. Because I also was thinking about this too. I was thinking on the production end of things, they have to have this conversation. Kyle's trying to find her throughout this party to talk and she's like, no, no, no. Is it on the call sheet for tomorrow? Hey, Kyle and Amanda, you guys are going to have a conversation about the state of Your relationship, whatever ensues from that. Fine. But obviously they had to have a production car ready to take Amanda back to the city. Kyle's driving back by himself. I then question, does Amanda even have a driver's license? Because someone drove her back to the city. We've never seen her drive.

[Mary]

And Courtney, I have to think she let it expire.

[Courtney]

Yeah, it probably expired in Covid.

[Mary]

You know, like she never got that figured out.

[Courtney]

She maybe has like a real ID or a passport that she's had for 10 years. And then she's like, oh, Kyle, by the way, it's expiring. Can you renew it for me? And he's like, not anymore. Is that the real reason she didn't go to Andrea's wedding? The passport expired too. Just kidding. But you're so right. I think this was. I also thought too. I felt like people were rolling at that party. Like, I love you. The touchy feeling.

[Mary]

This.

[Courtney]

I was like, oh, this is. This is an all out party. They're. They're going crazy. But I think you're right. Like, this probably was a party to start thinking about the next step. Some people just get to go home from the summer. Some people are starting the new part of their job, which is going to be an entirely different experience. Focused more on the relationships when they were in Summer House. Yes. Obviously we're talking about their relationship. We're talking about for three days.

[Mary]

Right, Right.

[Courtney]

Right now, this is the main focus of the storyline. I agree with you because we were saying, like, Amanda's gonna have to be the one to have a conversation. She's waiting for Kyle to do this conversation. And she actually took the initiative on the last day when they were leaving to have that conversation and say what she wants. I was proud of her in that moment. I think in any relationship, it is really hard to be the person to start that conversation because it makes it real.

[Mary]

No. And she finally got the balls to stand up to him and say, guess what? I can't continue doing what we're doing. And I could easily go back to our apartment and we can pretend like nothing happened, but, like, I have to draw a line in the sand and stand up for myself. I had my two hype women, Mia and Sierra, and I finally have the

[Courtney]

courage to do it.

[Mary]

So that's what I'm gonna do. So we have to be proud of her. Imagine if this scandal didn't happen. We have to acknowledge that.

[Courtney]

Oh, my God, everyone be giving her a standing. Oh, congratulations, Amanda. She's having her Ariana moment. Little did we know it'd be Ciara having the Ariana moment. But can we go back to the spiral of Kyle? Because the in the City premiere happened last night. Obviously. We've got the whole cast that's there, including Amanda. And Entertainment Tonight had posted from there and they posted on the carpet. It was Kyle. Amanda walks up, they're taking photos together. And this caused the Internet to go in an uproar.

[Mary]

And you sent it to me. And my reaction was they felt awkward. They were gracious and took the photo together. I also felt like Amanda picked a really great outfit. I feel like it was very, like, also, like, demure and mindful. Like, she wasn't trying to have, like a big moment. It was, like, subdued and she showed up for the event. She looked nice and she probably did what her contract says she had to do. And I mean, that must have been tough. Like, why am I feeling bad for these people?

[Courtney]

This is what I was thinking too. I was like, the Internet has become so crazy. Like, the fandom has gone, I mean, somewhat toxic. Obviously there's us normal people, you and I and everyone listening. We're all normal.

[Mary]

Of course. The normies, yes.

[Courtney]

But it's, you know, those other people that are just going crazy. It's like, what is she supposed to do? She hasn't done any press for this, which is why we think maybe Carl was doing press, was to step in for Amanda or something very strange, because he's not on the show. But also, she hasn't done any press. She probably is contractually obligated to show up to this premiere. I mean, Kyle goes on a drunken rant later that night, being like, having to defend Amanda, being like she's at a work event. Like, grow the fuck up. What is she supposed to do? She's in a no win situation either way. And because the Internet's going so crazy, I'm like, oh, my God, are they going to turn? And then people are going to be rooting for Amanda now because the Internet's gone so nuts.

[Mary]

Could you imagine having to show up to that? That would be so tough. My anxiety would be through the roof. I'd want to get wasted.

[Courtney]

But she said Kyle did.

[Mary]

When does he not? I saw this other. It was from Gibson. He posted like a three minute speech. And it's like Kyle and Lindsay with a pepper shaker because they don't have a microphone. He's basically says this long speech that says absolutely nothing. And eventually Lindsay, like, jumps him because she's like, has to save him. It was awful.

[Courtney]

She's like, kyle, this is my show. He's like, usually I have a speech prepared at these premieres, but I didn't plan this one. It's like, Kyle, watch. You have no control. Now.

[Mary]

This is Lindsay's show.

[Courtney]

This is her deal. I will say Lindsay was kind of annoying me on the carpet because it's like, Kyle, Amanda and Lindsay are obviously like the veterans, right? And Andrea to a point too. And so they've done this before. They just did it for summer. Like, they are pros when it comes to that. And I feel like Lindsay was coaching everyone of, like, how to be on the carpet. But she kept doing the look and laugh.

[Mary]

I noticed her and Yvonne were holding hands, which I'm very invested in that relationship because it feels like Yvonne and

[Courtney]

Nick or Yvonne and Lindsay.

[Mary]

Yvonne and Lindsay.

[Courtney]

Okay.

[Mary]

I'm interested in Nick too, because he feels like he doesn't want to be there. But with Yvonne and Lindsay, because best friends for 13 years, the preview shows Yvonne, like, going after Lindsay, it looks like at the final dinner, which I'm like, I just don't want this to be like a Shamia and Portia, you know?

[Courtney]

And then I was like, I think it might be more like a Janet and Kristen.

[Mary]

Sure, sure.

[Courtney]

But they seem fine. The whole cast seems fine with each other. I mean, Amanda was there too. I don't know. It's like when I see it, I'm like, okay, Amanda came in for the obligation. It didn't look like she even stayed at the premiere party. So it feels like she came in for the press, did the ph photos, went and left. Maybe she went to a dive bar and played Fingers. We don't know what she did after, but I just kept thinking they're in an impossible situation at the end of the day. And I would say with the pickup scene too, that we saw, it's like there wasn't cheating from her end. It seems like Kyle and Amanda were separated. If we're going off the timeline that we think it is, which is January, whatever that happened with West, Kyle and Amanda seem to be on good terms regardless if he's like, defending her or not. They've had a 10 year relationship, which we've seen. There's a mutual respect for each other. I do think he worries about her. I think that he is also watching his behavior back too. I think he can also see, like, maybe I pushed her towards this separation. And I think he takes some blame about the demise of their relationship. And so I think in his mind, he's like, I want to be amicable with her. I want to have a chill relationship. We're also co workers. The line is so blurred with everything. Like, it's not me defending her, it's me having respect for her.

[Mary]

Right. And at the end of the day, it's like, they were married and that's over. But they can still be friends and they can still respect one another and they can still support one another. And it sounds like their relationship wasn't really. A.

[Courtney]

A relationship, exactly.

[Mary]

It sounds like they were living as roommates and friends for seven years. They didn't have the intimacy anymore. I think they were support system for one another.

[Courtney]

So sometimes you're better apart than you are together. And I don't think that he had a lot of respect for her in their relationship. And so now he's making up for it in a way. And the crazy part is too. And I think people are gonna think I'm defending her, and I'm not. But it's like when we see what happened with Scandival and we see the toll that that took on everybody there, it's like, what is Rachel doing? She's literally offering sound baths on Cameo. It's like, those people destroyed their lives. And maybe they're trying to say, hey, let's not do that to each other in this situation. I don't know. It feels a little different from how the cast is handling it. The reunion will probably be a totally different ball game, I think, completely.

[Mary]

And I think a lot will show. Who is going to go to the Summer House. I. That's like my. I cannot wait to know who the cast will be. And, you guys, I have to say, I think Wes Wilson had a good episode. I'm like, it's kind of what we've been saying. She wanted Best friend's relationship, and she's excited about them again. And he's like, I need to let her know.

[Courtney]

Well, maybe he shouldn't have kissed her, though.

[Mary]

Agreed.

[Courtney]

He did have that combo and then kissed her. But what's also crazy about that, too, is okay, because it's two hours, I have the attention span of a gnat of a goldfish. Whatever you want to give it, it's small and short. Okay. So when I'm watching In the City or I'm watching the end of Summer House, I'm like, I've already forgotten about the Sierra and West stuff because there's so many things happening that it felt like it was such a minuscule part of this episode, even though it's obviously a large part, but because there was so much content of watching, I was focused on Amanda and Kyle when we went to in the city. I've said I am so invested in the end of this relationship. You were worried about that when this whole scandal happened. Like will I still care?

[Mary]

I care. I thought it. I thought I wouldn't. I was like, yes. So yesterday's news. Yeah, I'm completely invested and I think we weren't as shocked about the West Sierra moment because we knew it was coming and we saw it in the you and we saw it multiple times.

[Courtney]

Thank God we were prepared.

[Mary]

To be honest. The Jesse Amanda kiss I thought was quite strange and that really threw me for a loop. I was like, what is going on here?

[Courtney]

Touchy feely, touchy feely. Cass is too touchy feely. That should be wild. And at the same time we're like, that was a moment, just a little

[Mary]

blip in the party.

[Courtney]

Should we take a break and then come talk the episode?

[Mary]

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[Jack Myers]

Acast.com hey, sweetie. Your mother showed me this Carvana thing for selling the car. I'm gonna give it a try. Wish me luck. Me again. I put in the license plate. It gave me an offer. Unbelievable. Okay, I accepted the offer. They're picking it up Tuesday from the driveway. I haven't even left my chair. It's done. The car is gone. I'm holding a check. Anyway. Carvana, give it a whirl. Love ya.

[Mary]

So good you'll want to Leave a voicemail about it. Sell your car today on Carvana.

[Courtney]

Pick up fees may apply

[Jack Myers]

during Memorial day at Lowe's. Shop household must haves for less. Save $80 on the Char Broil Performance Series 4 Burner Grill to Chef up something special, plus get up to 45% off. Select major appliances to keep things fresh. Our best lineup is here at Lowe's. Lowe's. We help you save valid through 527 while supplies last. Selection varies by location. See lowe's.com for details.

[Courtney]

Visit your nearby Lowe's.

[Mary]

This party was a fucking blast. Also, do you notice how many f words I say now?

[Courtney]

Oh, my God. You are unfiltered. Unbridled, as Dorit would say, unburdened by being a teacher anymore. She is cursing up a storm.

[Mary]

I love it. I love it. But I think Sierra didn't. Excellent job with this party. The. The ice luges, that funny mountain.

[Courtney]

There's not even an igloo. There was a full, like, sauna there too, at one point. Maybe it's just the front of it, but I thought production must have given them a large budget for this because it's the end.

[Mary]

Oh, and then it was a night party. We never even had a night party. I don't think I know was the

[Courtney]

different rules because this was on a Sunday versus a Saturday or it was labor day weekend. And so we got a little bit more that even that ice wall that they had made in the house with the, like, cellophane holographic paper that they end up knocking down. I was like, this part. This party truly had it all. It was like a Stefan's snl. Like, this party has it all.

[Mary]

Yeah, it looks like a blast. Okay, let's talk about Kyle and Sierra sitting down. I think Sierra gave him great advice. You know, she's like, listen, Kyle, I hear you. I hear the things you're upset about. You don't know how to express yourself, okay? You're lashing out at everyone. Your best friend, Carl, you know, you can't say words like fuck you. Your words have weight. And you're getting everyone caught in the crossfire, and it makes it hard to be your friend. And I'm not saying it from judgment, but it's from concern. And we all want to support you guys. We want you to be happy. We want Amanda to be happy. And we don't know if that's together or apart. And everyone is rooting for you. We're not rooting for a divorce, the separation, but, like, we want you guys to Have. Have a productive relationship and exhale outside of each other.

[Courtney]

Him grabbing her hand.

[Mary]

I know, like, after this, because I

[Courtney]

think this actually was such a nice way of putting it with being completely honest with him. And it was advice. Like, you guys can't keep doing this merry go round. You cannot keep doing this. You're going around in circles. You are now affecting way more people as opposed to, like, bringing us into your fights. Like, now you're actually fighting with other people because of this. Right. Like, we're watching you have this full spiral. She's also talking to Amanda, too. Like, I do think Sierra overstepped with recommending the separation. I do think that that was too much because that's not her place to. But at the same time, I don't know if that actually pushed Amanda to have the conversation later. So maybe it was good to ignite that conversation. But I thought here it was like, this is what I think she should have started with. With Kyle.

[Mary]

Sierra has everyone's best interests in mind,

[Courtney]

and her intentions are 100% pure.

[Mary]

Did she overstep by suggesting the separation? Yes. But I think it did give Amanda the ammo she needed to actually follow

[Courtney]

through with something, even though she denied it that she ever said any of this in that conversation. But we'll get there.

[Mary]

Yeah, that was very strange at the end. I didn't think this was gonna happen. Yeah.

[Courtney]

But whatever. The exhale line, I think, is actually what put Kyle over the edge of being like, oh, it's bad. Like, in the sense of when she's like, we just, like, want you to be able to exhale. Because I think for Kyle, he's like, I haven't had a chance to breathe all summer. The one good weekend I had was when Amanda was gone.

[Mary]

I also think he's like, this is literally my last weekend in this house ever, ever, ever. Like, I have dedicated my life to this show. I have gotten married on this show. Like, this is such an end of a chapter for me. And, like, this is how I'm going to go out with that fudge. You and that Carl fight. Like, that's my last weekend in the house ever. He has so much anxiety. He's worried about lover boy. He's worried about his relationship. He's mourning leaving summer.

[Courtney]

You know, I mean, truly, it is the end of an era. I can't imagine his monologue at the end was making me cry because it really is like, you have had every summer. And Amanda says this, too, in their conversation. Like, we have been here for 10 summers like, it is crazy that this is your routine in life is like, okay, 4th of July, we are going to the Hamptons. We end at Labor Day. Then we do press, then we do this, and we have our brand deals, and I'm running lover boy. And it's like the cyclical routine that they've been in, and now everything's changing. And not only that, too. Now you're going to another show which you hope the fan base follows you to.

[Mary]

Exactly. They don't really know where their job stands. They're hoping the city's gonna work out. And then I think they're also like, you know, sometimes I think I. I don't think people get married for storylines or anything like that, but I do think being on these shows creates storylines that maybe they push an engagement faster than it would happen. Maybe they follow through a wedding.

[Courtney]

You think about Jackson, Britney, right? It's like he basically told her, like, we. Everyone was like, britney, leave. Leave him. Like, leave him. And he was like, you won't be on this show without me. The lines of blur of reality and reality tv. And you think, will anybody like me if we break up? Do I have a point on this show, Are we together? Because we're just. It's. There's a lot of pressure right now, but in the off season, it's great. The. You're right. I mean, literally, they got engaged and a week before, Kyle was being exposed for cheating.

[Mary]

Right.

[Courtney]

You know, but. And so it becomes also like this sunken cost fallacy, too, of like, do we just stay together? I think on Vanderpump, Ariana and Tom would have broken up a long time ago if the show wasn't there. You would not be hanging out with your exes in a regular life situation because you got divorced and you have different friends.

[Mary]

Lindsay and Carl wouldn't have gotten engaged as quickly as they did.

[Courtney]

I agree. It's also like, you start thinking, too. And I'm sure production on their end is like, what's in the future for you guys? Are you planning this? And, like, we would love. The fans would love to capture this moment. And Lindsay, I think, brings it up with Carl later is like, I thought as a friend off camera, you would have talked to me about this, like, regardless of our relationship, our past, our history. And so you. You surprising me on camera, regardless of what our relationship was, I thought you had more respect for me. And that was a little bit of a breaking of the fourth wall. You really are thinking about all these different dynamics. And I. I'm with you on that is the fact that this is the last night in this house. And Kyle's also trying to turn it around. And Sierra says, go find Amanda. Because I think with what you're saying is you have the chance to make it right for the night.

[Mary]

Right? Right.

[Courtney]

You can enjoy the rest of your night. And Amanda's like, no, you won't.

[Mary]

She will not have a conversation with him. And that's fair. She's just like, you know what? You're not gonna ruin my last night here. I wanna jump in the pool with everyone. I wanna have last. And, like, I'm not gonna let Kyle take away my last night because he already ruined last night the night before.

[Courtney]

The combo that he's gonna have with Amanda is basically Amanda having to accept an apology. And she's not ready to accept the apology. Right. The conversation would be for Kyle to say sorry and her to say, okay. So it's basically the burden is put on Amanda to change the dynamic of their relationship right now so that Kyle can feel good for the rest of the night.

[Mary]

Like, her confessional was like, oh, yeah. That was basically what she said in that confessional.

[Courtney]

Let me. I think I had the thought. Okay, let me think. My own original thought.

[Mary]

She's like, oh, yeah, so Kyle can say, oh, I'm sorry, and then do the same thing again. Cool.

[Courtney]

Like, the only thing that's changed is my reaction to him.

[Mary]

Exactly.

[Courtney]

I did think that I was being analytical, but I guess I was just paraphrasing her own confession. Dang it.

[Mary]

Okay, let's talk about this igloo moment.

[Courtney]

Okay. When. When the. When she pulls him, I was like, oh. I just. There was something. There's something cathartic about these OGs finishing and wrapping up their storylines in a way. And I was weirdly smiling during the whole thing, even though it was a tough conversation to have.

[Mary]

So, Courtney, I wasn't buying this. I thought it was very fake. I think.

[Courtney]

From who?

[Mary]

Okay. So I think she pulled him, and he. He didn't know what direction this conversation was gonna go. So at first, he thinks it's gonna be about her kind of, like, calming him down for last night and him having to, like, thank her for calming him down. But then she brings up Sharon, and he is very receptive. He's like, I know. That was very confusing. She didn't clock it. And Lindsay's like, well, that's the problem. She wasn't clocking it. And. And like, you said, like, you literally, like, broke up with me on national tv. Then your mom was like, dancing on the grave with Sheena Shay. That was so humiliating.

[Courtney]

It always comes back to Sheena.

[Mary]

Right? And I can't believe that you did this all on live TV and you didn't say before, like, I'm a little nervous to go down the aisle with you. You didn't give me any heads up as she thought she was blindsided to

[Courtney]

ask your your opinion on that part because you've always said she was not blindsided. Anybody could see that this was the end of a relationship. But did this change it for you in that moment?

[Mary]

Maybe, maybe a little bit. I do think she's basically telling us, like, I cannot believe you did this all on camera, that you didn't give me a little bit of a heads up. And I think they're both happier for not going through with it.

[Courtney]

Totally.

[Mary]

So, yes, I think that's exactly what she said. So. Okay, I'll give her a little bit of that.

[Courtney]

Well, because I've always said too, is like she felt blindsided.

[Mary]

Sure, sure.

[Courtney]

It's the same thing with, like, Craig Conover is like, whether or not they couldn't see how their relationships were deteriorating and how toxic it had become. I do think that she never thought that conversation would happen and they would basically break up on camera. Now, whatever Carl's intentions were of where he was like, I thought we just postponed, we'd figure it out. Whereas Lindsay was like, you're doing this on camera. I really do feel like she thought she was blindsided in that moment.

[Mary]

I, I, I will maybe give you that.

[Courtney]

I'm not even trying to, like, to jump up and down.

[Mary]

I'm, I'm moving forward. I'm showing grace.

[Courtney]

Okay, wait, let's take a break, though, because I do want to celebrate that offline foreign. Howdy ho, and welcome to Fantasy Fan, Fellas. I'm Hayden, producer of the Fantasy Fangirls podcast and your resident lover of all things Sanderson.

[Jack Myers]

And I'm Stephen, your bookish Internet goofball, but you can call me the Smash Daddy.

[Courtney]

And we are currently deep diving Brandon

[Jack Myers]

Sanderson's fantasy epic Mistborn.

[Courtney]

But here's the catch. Stephen here has not read Mistborn before.

[Jack Myers]

That's right.

[Courtney]

Hey.

[Jack Myers]

Hey. So each week, you'll get my unfiltered raw reactions to every, every single chapter.

[Courtney]

And along the way, we'll do character deep dives, magic explainers, and Steven will even try to guess what's next.

[Mary]

Spoiler alert.

[Courtney]

He'll be wrong.

[Jack Myers]

News flash, I'm never wrong. Episodes come out every Wednesday and You can find fantasy fanfellas wherever you get your podcasts.

[Courtney]

Mom, can you tell me a story?

[Mary]

Sure.

[Courtney]

Once upon a time, a mom needed a new car.

[Mary]

Was she brave? She was tired mostly.

[Courtney]

But she went to Carvana.com and found

[Mary]

a great car at a great price. No secret treasure map required.

[Courtney]

Did you have to fight a dragon?

[Mary]

Nope.

[Courtney]

She bought it 100% online from her bed, actually. Was it scary?

[Mary]

Honey, it was as unscary as car buying could be.

[Courtney]

Did the car have a sunroof?

[Mary]

It did, actually.

[Courtney]

Okay, good story.

[Mary]

Car buying you'll want to tell stories about. Buy your car today on Carvana. Delivery fees may apply

[Jack Myers]

during Memorial Day at Lowe's. Shop household must haves for less. Save $80 on a Char Broil Performance Series 4 Burner Grill to Chef up something special. Plus get up to 45 off select major appliances to keep things fresh. Our best lineup is here at Lowe's. Lowe's. We help you Save. Valid through 527, while supplies last selection varies by location. See lowe's.com for details.

[Courtney]

Visit your nearby Lowe's.

[Jack Myers]

Do you keep hearing podcast ads like this one, for example, but always wonder how you actually get involved with them for your own brand or organization. Well, it's easier than you think. We're acast, and we give you the platform to do it all yourself. Browse thousands of popular podcasts, choose the shows that match your perfect audience, set your budget, and launch. And if you want a hand, our podcast specialists are there to help you launch with confidence. This is podcast advertising without barriers. Get [e-mail] advertise.

[Courtney]

Okay, I've got it out of my system. Let's keep going.

[Mary]

But then I guess this was sweet. I guess I wasn't kind of like buying Carl's tears. I was buying what he was saying. He's like, we have so many good memories together. I didn't handle that situation well at all. And there's been so much time. It's been two years. And he really says, like, you guys, me, you made me a better person. I'm very grateful. And, you know, when you crack the whip, it's really good. They didn't even hug at the end of this conversation. She was in bunny ears. I don't know it for.

[Courtney]

For.

[Mary]

For some reason, it just felt a little fake. I. I felt like he was like, I want to give her what she wants in this moment to move forward, but I just don't know how genuine it is.

[Courtney]

You think he was just serving her word?

[Mary]

I don't know, that was like my. As I was, like, reading their body language and stuff. And I love that they're friends again right now. Like, I think it's great. I. I would love to see Carl on the city. Obviously, I'm happy for them moving forward. I just.

[Courtney]

Yeah.

[Mary]

I don't know. I guess this felt forced to me.

[Courtney]

Okay, well. And I think it was a forced convo to, like, by production. I think they were like, you guys need to have a conversation. And Carl's obviously not going to be the one to have the conversation. Lindsay's going to have to start it. But I also think, too. I don't know if he ever would have had this conversation with her. You had mentioned before. I think it was maybe last week or the week before. Is like, is Carl angling to get on the show somehow? Is there an ulterior motive? So did you feel like maybe this was him just saying whatever Lindsay wants to see potentially a future on that? Or do you feel like he was just. Was more like, you know what? I deserve this. At some point, however she wants to say she feels I'm gonna let her have that because I did do things that she doesn't think were right. And if that's her vibe and that's her feeling and she's been holding onto this for two years and that's going to move us forward, then let me say what she wants to hear, because I can't prove my point any more so than I already have.

[Mary]

Yeah. And maybe. Maybe I'm looking into this way too much and everyone else is buying it, and I'm the person that's wrong. At the end of the day, I'm happy that they've moved forward, but I just. I don't know. For some reason, I just thought it was a little fake.

[Courtney]

I. I see what you're saying. Because you feel like, what? They would never be talking if it wasn't the last night of the summer and, like, the end of an era. But I do like that they.

[Mary]

Well, I think he literally went into the conversation, was like, I don't know where you're going. What's the road? We're talking the road we're taking. Linds, you're in the driver's seat.

[Courtney]

I will.

[Mary]

I will get in the passenger seat. I'll follow along.

[Courtney]

I think he's always in the passenger seat with Lindsay.

[Mary]

Yes.

[Courtney]

Very, very. In their relationship and their friendship, she makes them faint when she's like. Remember when he fainted the day before he proposed? Which was like, that should have been the sign. The signs were there.

[Mary]

We just didn't see them.

[Courtney]

I choose to believe that this was a productive conversation. Lindsay got what she wanted out of it, and all she was waiting for was an I. I also was like, will she give an I'm sorry back too? But she was like, so I won't be. This is all about me being wronged. And I want you to admit that you were wrong and that your mom was doing too much. And I can move on from that if you just say you were wrong.

[Mary]

And where was the hug at the end? I wanted an awkward hug.

[Courtney]

Well, it was at the last breakfast. The group hug. Lindsay's like, carl really loves those hugs.

[Mary]

When Carl and Lindsay say goodbye to each other and like fist pump.

[Courtney]

But you know, that's progress and wildly. This scandal really has brought people closer together.

[Mary]

Ain't that the truth? Ain't that the truth? Okay, now let's talk about. We have Ben in west on the mountain and Sabrina and Sierra chatting. And Sabrina's like, ben said, I love you. I'm like, you guys have been love bombing each other all summer long. Stop it. He says, I love you, and then she says, let's make a baby. I mean, they've been saying I love you for a long time. They just decided to do it on camera.

[Courtney]

Last week I made a comment about this and she says, I love you. And he just rubs her shoulders like, thank you. But then it feels like he had something to make him have a little bit more courage. And he said it on camera. And it was two hours earlier in Sabrina's Sabrina Bale. She was like, Sierra, you were the first person I thought of. It did take me two hours to find you and tell you about it. But he did say I love you. No, I thought that was a real moment.

[Mary]

Okay.

[Courtney]

The cameras were like the were like above when they were talking. It wasn't like a close up of Sierra. And since Sabrina Bale, they were sitting by the pool.

[Mary]

No Sabrina. Sorry, I'm Sabrina. And the Sierra moment for sure. Real. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay.

[Courtney]

Cynical this morning.

[Mary]

Sorry. I'm sorry.

[Courtney]

I appreciate it, though. I think we need all angles.

[Mary]

I don't, I don't like to be lied to. You dated since March. Okay. Like, you haven't been back for two weeks saying I love you. It just bothers me. But I will say I also like that, like, Sierra has been influenced by Sabrina in the best way. Like, it's better to have loved than to have lost. You know, I think Sierra needed That because it's like she's held onto this grudge with Wes for two years. So I'm happy she's let that down.

[Courtney]

I wish she kept the grudge.

[Mary]

Meanwhile, on that mountain, west is freaking out. He's like, you need to tell Sabrina to stop pushing me and Sierra. Can you get that message to her? Because I'm feeling very uncomfortable. Clearly we have a chemistry. It's so easy. I mean, I love flirting with her. There's sexual tension, but I can't do this. Like, I want to jump her bones, but I'm not going to be her boyfriend. Okay, I will sleep with her, but I'm not going to be the boyfriend. And that's the problem.

[Courtney]

I want the benefits of a hookup and not a relationship. But you know what? At least he said it out loud. And I think I even said too at one point. Wes needs to tell Ben, who can tell Sabrina to not do like the double date. Like there needs to be some sort of conversation. I will say too when Lindsay at the breakfast is like new relationships and she's like, west and Sierra. I wish that he might have said like, yeah, we're friends. So great, we're friends again. Although they leaned out the night before so it's obviously awkward. Why'd you do that? Wrong. Head West. Think with the top one.

[Mary]

You blew it on the mountain though. He says, the last thing I want is her to be heartbroken.

[Courtney]

But I will continue to that.

[Mary]

They do end up kissing that night. The real question is when they left the house, what really happened? Because Jesse is very clear with west in the bed if you do anything more. If you text her in the fall, you have to be very clear, serious, like. And Wes is like, I know. So that is what I'm very curious about, what happened when they left the summer house.

[Courtney]

But by the way too, Jesse knows about Montana girl. He thinks they have an agreement. So I think that's also part of it is he's like, west, what are you doing? Because you have this off camera relationship. I don't know what the status is if it's open. If you guys are exclusively dating. Like you say she's kind of a girlfriend, but I don't know what that means because you obviously have an agreement and now you're having this on camera kiss. The cameras are in the corner of our room capturing this embrace with you guys. And like, while I like that, you better know what the fuck you're doing because I don't know if you remember what happened two summers ago.

[Mary]

Right.

[Courtney]

You dumb, dumb. You've now made this public again. You think we're not going to be seeing this on an episode, so you better have your ducks in a row or else you're going to do the exact same thing. And he's like, well, what if I did that but made it worse by hooking up with someone else on the show? Do you think that would take some of the heat off of me? With Ciara, it's like this. But this conversation, if we go back to it with Ben, I was like, here we go. This is what he needs to be having this convo with Ciara. And I feel like in this moment, if it had just stayed at this point we would have been like, you know what? Okay, great. Like at least he said it out loud. And he even says that too. Like I couldn't say this two years ago, right? He's feeling like, okay, I do understand the ramifications of my like decision making previously, so I'm not going to do that again. But then he's like, but I do think I will do that again in a couple of hours because after this party we're gonna go out, we're gonna party, we're gonna come back, I'm gonna be thinking with the wrong head and I'm going to up for everyone. For everyone. It's, I mean, truly crazy at 5

[Mary]

o' clock in the morning. I wonder how many times they stay up till 5 o' clock in the morning and we just don't see that.

[Courtney]

Oh, I think it happens at least once a weekend for multiple people. Like it definitely happens. Okay then too at this party, a pizza gets delivered. We see Sierra carrying like six pizzas. And in my head I thought, I don't think that's enough.

[Mary]

It's just for the people that are allowed to come in the home.

[Courtney]

Yeah, I think that's actually absolutely what it is. Even though there was an ice luge in the kitchen. So I'm like, who gets to come in? Like do you have to be an invited guest? Do they get like a plus three? Are there wristbands?

[Mary]

Oh, I think the only people allowed to come in the house are like the people that live there in like an extra couple.

[Courtney]

You have to like walk them in and walk them out.

[Mary]

There's a bathroom outside, like those porta potty nice bathrooms. I mean think about like the permanent to do all this stuff.

[Courtney]

I would love a behind the scenes. Do you think the pool house has a bathroom?

[Mary]

I guarantee you they bring bathrooms on site for these parties.

[Courtney]

Wow. I've literally never thought about. But the boys are always pissing in the bushes. Because the line's too long, I was gonna say.

[Mary]

And then the boys are in the bushes.

[Courtney]

Well, because. Okay, so Yvonne is staying over, and Yvonne and Carl are in that little nook by the stairs. And it's funny because obviously Yvonne is Lindsay's friend, but has been there for the relationship with Carl. Has been friends. I also thought Yvonne was the one that lived in D.C. she obviously lives in New York. But doesn't Lindsay have, like, a D.C. friend? She definitely does.

[Mary]

Remember, they went to the White House.

[Courtney]

Yes. And I thought that was with Yvonne. So maybe she's moved for the show.

[Mary]

It was interesting, them trying to trickle in the city, people like, Andrea. Why was Andrea wearing robe? How's that opera ski?

[Courtney]

Because he's, like, going in the Jacuzzi, maybe with a glass of wine or something. I know, but he met Gavin there. There's this little moment. I don't know if you can. If you picked up on it, but Yvonne says to Andrea about Gavin, like, oh, he's on the cast.

[Mary]

Oh, I didn't hear that. But I saw. Remember, like, when Lindsay was being picked up. And that's Wes's whiteboard friend.

[Courtney]

Oh, Soho. Brody.

[Mary]

I don't actually know the name, but I'm sure you got the right guy.

[Courtney]

But it was funny. They were, like, introduced. Like, Andrea and Lexi are obviously there. Katie and the husband. Is his name Matt? Maybe they're back for the weekend. Gavin's there, Yvonne's there. I didn't see Nick there. He's busy doing.

[Mary]

What is the deal with Nick? When she is talking about how she went to San Diego and he's like, didn't notice she was gone. I'm like, who watched the dogs? It just seems weird.

[Courtney]

I thought she's done this before. She's, like, threatened it. And I feel like he has her location and he saw that she was at jfk. He was like, okay, she's on some trip. He saw she landed in San Diego. He's like, okay, so she went home, like. Like, this is why Mary doesn't, like, find my location. Because if you're trying to prove a moment, it's not going to happen. They can just follow you cross country and see where you're going.

[Mary]

He's also probably thinking, God, did she tell me about this trip? And I wasn't listening.

[Courtney]

She does complain that I'm not a good listener. He likes, like, no, you definitely told me you were going. She's like, I just bought the ticket an hour ago. He's no. You mentioned San Diego. Are you sure? Like, you definitely told me. She was like, so here's a 2020 date line that I want you to sit and watch. And he's like, honestly, you're trying to gone girl. And I probably will be the Ben Affleck. I don't know. But I do worry about that relationship. Except that, like, Nick did make me laugh in his confessional when they were talking about it was Andrea and Lexi and Nick and Yvonne at the bar, and they were like, congrats, we've made it to a year of marriage. And Yvonne's like, yeah, we're in similar places in our life. And Nick's like, yep, four supermodels. And she didn't like that joke, but I thought it was pretty funny. And I was like, oh, no, another toxic guy I'm gonna love.

[Mary]

I'm very curious about their relationship because their whole fight is basically, she's like, I thought we were getting married and, like, trying right away. And he is not on the same page. Which is interesting.

[Courtney]

There is interest. Yes. I also think Yvonne and Casey Wilson are more twins than Jo Ellen and Casey.

[Mary]

I agree with you. Yeah.

[Courtney]

I feel like they have similar vibes. And I'm like, oh, Jo Ellen was on the scene first. Are we going to get another TikTok? I don't. I'm pulling myself out of the conversation. By the way. I don't think I look like any of them. It's flattering. I think Yvonne and Casey look more alike than Casey and Jo Ellen.

[Mary]

Agreed.

[Courtney]

Agreed.

[Mary]

Yeah.

[Courtney]

Okay. Should we take a break, come back and talk the rest of the episode and go into in the City?

[Mary]

I cannot wait to talk about this. Amanda, Mia, Sierra, let's go.

[Courtney]

Howdy, howdy ho, and welcome to Fantasy fanfellas. I'm Hayden, producer of the Fantasy Fangirls podcast and your resident lover of all time things Sanderson.

[Jack Myers]

And I'm Stephen, your bookish Internet goofball, but you can call me the smash Daddy.

[Courtney]

And we are currently deep diving Brandon

[Jack Myers]

Sanderson's fantasy epic Mistborn.

[Courtney]

But here's the catch. Steven here has not read Mistborn before.

[Jack Myers]

That's right.

[Courtney]

Hey.

[Jack Myers]

Hey. So each week, you'll get my unfiltered raw reactions to every single chapter.

[Courtney]

And along the way, we'll do character

[Jack Myers]

deep dives, magic explainers, and Steven will

[Courtney]

even try to guess what's next.

[Mary]

Spoiler alert.

[Courtney]

He'll be wrong.

[Jack Myers]

News flash, I'm never wrong. Episodes come out every Wednesday. And you can find fantasy fanfellas wherever

[Courtney]

you get your podcasts.

[Mary]

Global phenomenon Cat's Eye is coming the

[Courtney]

Wild World Tour live across North America.

[Mary]

Get tickets Thursday, May 21 at 3pm@live

[Courtney]

nation.com

[Jack Myers]

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[Courtney]

Visit your nearby Lowe's.

[Jack Myers]

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