By Order of the Faithfuls: The Duchess of Deception (S2 E7 & 8)

Summary

Two Ts In A Pod — By Order of the Faithfuls: The Duchess of Deception (S2 E7 & 8)

Podcast: Two Ts In A Pod with Teddi Mellencamp and Tamra Judge (iHeartPodcasts)
Episode Date: October 24, 2025
Summary by: [Your Assistant]

---

Episode Overview

This recap episode dives into Episodes 7 and 8 of Season 2 of The Traitors US, with Wells Adams and Dolores Catania (subbing for Tamra) breaking down twists, alliances, betrayals, and game strategies as the Faithfuls and Traitors close in on endgame. The discussion revolves around Peter’s moral dilemma over joining the Traitors, internal Traitor drama, key missions, explosive roundtable confrontations, and shifting social dynamics—plus candid behind-the-scenes insights from two reality TV veterans.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Peter’s Traitor Dilemma and Fallout

• Turret Temptation: Peter is offered a spot as a Traitor but declines, citing his inability to betray close allies—yet paradoxically makes side deals and draws critique for hypocrisy.

  • Dolores: “I'm surprised he turned it down because even the best of people don't.” (03:33)
  • Wells: “He is kind of holier than thou ... but then, making deals with Parvati...you can be kind of shady, I guess.” (03:43)

• Keeping Secrets In-House: Peter tells only his ‘Peter Pals’ about the attempted recruitment, excluding others and inadvertently painting a bigger target on himself.

  • Dolores: “He kept it in house, which is probably the best thing to do.” (05:01)
  • Wells: “He’s starting to draw lines in the sand and make enemies with people who aren’t technically his enemy.” (05:08)

• The Social Media Meme Moment: Reference to MJ’s infamous retreat—likened to Homer Simpson backing into the bushes.

  • Dolores: “There was a meme of MJ walking backwards very slowly... like the Homer into the bushes.” (05:28)

2. Traitor and Faithful Strategy (and Stumbles)

• Recruitment Backfire: Both hosts agree trying to recruit Peter was a strategic misstep for the Traitors—a lose-lose scenario that only fueled suspicion and isolated him.
  • Wells: “It’s a little bit of a kiss of death ... once that happened, I was thinking, he's not long for this world.” (08:02)
  • Dolores: “The way he was playing, he wasn’t going to win anyway.” (08:35)
• Traitor Infighting: Traitor unity crumbles as Dan exposes Phaedra to save himself—making her an obvious target.
  • Wells: “The big Achilles heel ... is that [the Traitors] don’t stay unified...the second you do that, it gets really—made it very, very obvious that Phaedra is a traitor.” (09:30)

3. Game Missions & Comic Relief

• Forest and Mud Challenge: Episode 7’s mission brings comic falls, muddy setbacks, and questions about stunt doubles.

  • Wells: “Looks like it sucks...running into open water covered with leaves...Peter gets the first question wrong, sent into a pool of mud.” (10:55)

• Bug Drop Challenge: Contestants face their fears in the infamous “bug drop”—with Dolores and Chrishell orchestrating a swift intentional retreat.

  • Dolores: “Chrishell, the first thing she said when we got there was, I don't do bugs...She pulled her hand away and once you do that, it's over.” (27:08)
  • Wells: “The only one to kind of get through is CT. He finds the last piece of gold...He pulled the gold out of his pants and said, ‘I had an anaconda in there. Also a piece of gold.’ I appreciated that comment.” (28:01)

4. Explosive Round Table & Banishments

• Peter’s Surprise and Social Isolation:

  • Wells: “Are you surprised that he was surprised he was on the chopping block?”
  • Dolores: “Yes, I am surprised...what did you expect?” (14:25)

• Strategy of Survival: Some contestants (like CT and Sandra) focus on lasting to the end, revealing different long-game approaches.

  • Dolores: “That's how I won, by the way.” (16:07)

• Trishell’s Emotional Fallout:

  • Trishell feels betrayed when CT shields John over her, highlighting how alliances and feelings spill into gameplay.
  • Dolores: “She was like, guys, please. And as a friend, it's the same reason Cherie picked Phaedra...She was really, really sincerely hurt.” (20:12)

• Bergie’s Elimination:

  • The Faithfuls lose a likable underdog—Bergie.
  • Dolores: “He was so...He made it further than I thought he would, to be honest.” (22:57)

5. Phaedra vs. Parvati — The Duchess of Deception

• Round Table Charges:

  • Trishell and others zero in on Phaedra and Parvati; John bestows Parvati with the moniker “Duchess of Deception.”
  • Wells on John: “He goes ... full William Shakespeare and calls Parvati the Duchess of Deception.” (30:15)

• Tell-Tale Signs:

  • Trishell points to Phaedra’s ‘eye twitch’ as a tell, while Phaedra tries to shift suspicion.
  • Dolores: “No one ever could say Phaedra’s anybody’s fool. She is so smart.” (16:55)

• Parvati Banishment and Fallout:

  • Parvati’s exit as a Traitor isn’t a shock, but creates new waves of suspicion and alliances.
  • Wells: “...and it kind of comes down to CT and Parvati's banished and reveals that, of course she is a...no one was surprised she was a traitor.” (35:23)

6. Changing the Game — Recruitment and Endgame

• Recruitment Mechanics Tighten:

  • With only one Traitor left, Phaedra is forced to recruit or face elimination—production tweaks rules to up the stakes.
  • Wells: “Obviously, she has to recruit someone, or they're just going to run out of numbers because it's obvious everyone's on her..." (37:05)

• Production Integrity & Behind the Scenes:

  • Dolores and Wells discuss the reality of the hands-off producing on The Traitors due to money being at stake, and the pain of producers watching good TV slip away due to player decisions.
  • Wells: “It's a testament to them that they're making a show that is just living in reality. Things are happening the way they're happening.” (19:50)

7. Big Picture: Is It Great Faithfuls, or Weak Traitors?

• Wells: Wonders if this season’s intelligent, united Faithfuls or the Traitors' missteps are to credit for the outcome.
  • Dolores: “I don't think the Traitors were bad at all. I think they were very strategic ... I think this is a very good group of Faithfuls.” (38:12)
  • Wells: “Dan is the linchpin for, like, taking down this entire thing, much to the delight of the Faithfuls.” (39:47)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Game Ethics:
  • Dolores: “You can never make a deal with a Traitor, even in real life. They're gonna stab you in the back, even if it kills them—that’s their nature.” (09:19)
• On Traitor Disunity:
  • Wells: “The big Achilles heel ... is that [the Traitors] don’t stay unified together. They start throwing each other under the bus.” (09:30)
• On Game Strategy:
  • Dolores: “The biggest mistake is walking in with a strategy ... you can’t control the events that happen every day.” (10:14)
• Comic Relief:
  • Wells: “A good dick joke goes a long way with me, you know?” (28:01)
• On the Power of Reality TV:
  • Dolores: “For me, I'm looking forward to the end, because it's like therapy for me. I have PTSD from it ... this was the kickoff season where people got really hooked.” (43:10)

---

Timestamps for Critical Segments

• Peter’s Traitor Temptation & Fallout: 02:49 – 08:56
• Mission Recap (Mud/Bug Challenges): 10:55 – 11:26, 27:01 – 28:35
• Trishell’s Shield Snub: 19:57 – 21:53
• Bergie’s Elimination: 22:26 – 23:39
• Round Table Explosions: 28:35 – 35:24
• Production Reality/Rule Tweaks: 17:13 – 19:58, 37:05 – 38:12
• Faithfuls vs. Traitors — Meta Discussion: 38:00 – 40:57

---

Final Thoughts & The Road Ahead

• Both hosts agree: these episodes are pivotal, clever, and full of memorable moments that underscore why this season solidified The Traitors US as a reality TV powerhouse.
• Expect more twists and intense confrontations as the end approaches—Dolores even admits, “I cried a little...it punched me in my gut!” (42:34)

---

Connect:
Fans are encouraged to follow "By Order of the Faithfuls" on Instagram and subscribe to keep up with discussions, clips, and behind-the-scenes content.

---

This summary covers all notable moments, player moves, and analysis, and is designed to let those who missed the episode experience its highlights and deeper context fully.

Transcript

[Commercial Announcer]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop, voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All rights reserved.

You've got the New Year's motivation, but the crowded gym? Not so much. Keep your drive with iFit, we bring the world's best trainers right to your living room. Whether you want to crush a studio cycle class, build strength or zen out with yoga, IFIT adapts to your pace and your schedule. No waiting, no judgment, just results. Make 2026 the year it sticks. Start [e-mail] support for the show comes.

From Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures the.

World'S best ski and snowboard athletes are chasing medals. Now you can follow their every move. Join Insider, the official US Ski and Snowboard Fan loyalty program, and get premium viewing at World cup ski events, exclusive athlete meetups, discounts from brands you love and a custom welcome gift mailed direct to your doorstep this winter. Show your support as they race for the podium. Head to insider.usskiandsnowboard.org and join today.

[Wells]

All right, welcome into another episode of By Order of the Faithfuls I'm Wells alongside Dolores. Where's Tamra?

[Dolores]

Oh, she has some house stuff to tend to today, so we're gonna miss her.

[Wells]

I'm excited about today's episode because these two episodes, seven and eight, are very, very fun. In season two of U. S. Traders, we're back in the turret. Parvati and Phaedra are waiting for Peter to join them. Do you. Did you ever think that Peter, the. The Lord of the Faithfuls was ever going to join the traitors?

[Dolores]

You never know. I knew when I was there not to talk about me, but I said I made it very clear at every time I could to say, do not try to recruit me. I will not come.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

So I am surprised he turned it down because even the best of people don't. So it's an interesting.

[Wells]

It's interesting to watch how he's moving through the house, right. Because he is kind of holier than thou and won't accept this whole offer from the traders. But then, you know, a couple minutes later, he's, like, making deals with poverty that seem like backdoor deals. And then it's like, okay, well, you can be kind of shady, I guess. So I'm just confused as to. As to Peter's motivation.

[Dolores]

So I feel that he wanted to play, but he could not look the people. I think his main thing was not being able to look the people in the face that he became close with and lie to them. A backdoor deal, it's not so. I feel like it's not so visceral. Like, it's kind of. I'm making moves for everybody here, you know?

[Wells]

Are you surprised that he didn't say anything at breakfast the next day when, you know, it was obvious that no one was murdered, so someone was probably recruited?

[Dolores]

No, that was the smart move. What he did was this was the smarter thing to do. He took his. What do they call him? The Peter gang or whatever?

[Wells]

The Peter Pals.

[Dolores]

The Peter Pals, yeah. And he. And he kept it in house, which is. Which is probably the best thing to do.

[Wells]

Yeah. The Peter Palace. They get together for a quick meeting when he tells them about the invitation. During the meeting, Phaedra and MJ Both try to walk in the room, but Peter asked them to leave. I feel like this was a big mistake for him. He's starting to make. Draw lines in the sand and kind of make enemies with other people who aren't technically his enemy.

[Dolores]

Right. Which is. Which puts him on the chopping block. Right. So it was funny because I don't Know if you saw it at the time, Wells, I don't know if you're an Instagram junkie like the rest of us. Social media, scrolling all day. But there was a meme of MJ walking backwards very slowly. Do you remember that?

[Wells]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like the homer into the, into the bushes.

[Dolores]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it was kind of funny. She's so cute. But, you know, I think that when it gets to this, this point in the game, you have no choice but to do things a certain way that you would have done differently in the beginning when there was so many people. Yeah, you're kind of, like, forced to make the decisions of keeping it in a close, and it's already obvious you have nothing to lose by doing it. Yeah.

[Wells]

You know, in this season, when I went on the show, I didn't make it very far, but one of my thoughts was, is I'm gonna try to figure out who Trader is, and then I'm gonna try to be friends with them so I can be shielded by them for a while.

[Dolores]

Smart.

[Wells]

Before I, you know, before I try to get rid of them. Where? It doesn't seem like that's the case with this one. Like, it seems like everyone's kind of got everyone's number, right? Like, everyone's, like everyone's on Phaedra and everyone is on Parvity except for Sandra, who is convinced Peter's a traitor. And I can understand Peter being annoying. Like, it does seem like everyone's annoyed by him and, like, him being the ringleader, but, but he never screams to me, traitor.

[Dolores]

No, he doesn't. And did you happen to notice, going back to when he was letting the Peter pals know that he turned down the invitation? John had a lot of doubt in his mind. Like, John was like, oh, you did? Yeah. Like, yeah, right. You turned it down.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

What do you think?

[Wells]

I mean, well, it almost put a.

[Dolores]

Target on him with the pals. Now they're, they're questioning him.

[Wells]

Yeah. But it didn't matter because didn't John. Wasn't John the one who lit his flame later on in the episode so he was able to, to flip him?

[Dolores]

I don't know.

[Wells]

I, I, I think that you, the, I think the Traders did something smart and something stupid. I don't think they should have ever tried to recruit Peter, because you need numbers in that situation. Like, they are now at a disadvantage if you, if you, if you don't say yes to that. Right.

[Dolores]

It was a major, major mistake.

[Wells]

Major mistake. But then also, it's Smart. Because it. It makes someone have to make a decision that is, no matter what, going to look shady. Right. Like, if he doesn't say anything that's shady. If he does say something that's shady. Right. Like, there's, like, really kind of no way to win. It's. It's a little bit of a kiss of death, I was thinking, and I don't know, I felt bad they painted him into a corner, and once that happened, I was thinking, he's not long for this world, right?

[Dolores]

No, he's not. But the way he was playing, he wasn't going to win anyway.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

You can't go after the traitors the way he did and exclude other people, because now you're making enemies. You're not making friends. And I feel like it's. It's not a playing for the long game.

[Wells]

Yeah, it's. It's really not like he is it. He's now gotten to a point where he's just trying to make it day by day, you know, instead of have, like. He really probably should have been like, parvati, I know you're a traitor, but I am, you know, I want to make a alliance with you to get. To get further. But regardless, he played the way he wanted to play.

[Dolores]

You can never make a deal with a Trader, no matter what, even in real life. That's it. Yeah, they're gonna. They're gonna stab you in the back, even if it kills them, because that's their nature.

[Wells]

They stab each other in the back, too.

[Dolores]

They stab each other.

[Wells]

That's the other thing. Like, I do feel like these first two seasons and then our season, the big Achilles heel on the Traders, is that they don't stay unified together. They start throwing each other under the bus. And the second you do that, it gets really. I mean, the fact that Dan called Phaedra, I mean, this is getting a little put in the cart before the horse, but, like, him doing that made it. Made it very, very obvious that Phaedra is a traitor because he wanted to banish someone that would absolve him of his sins. Right, Right. So it was almost just like you. You should have never done that. Like, if you guys are a united front, you have numbers with three people already, you know, and then the people.

[Dolores]

That you get to trust you, Right? Yeah. So the game kind of like, I feel like it plays itself out because that you can't control the events that happen every day that kind of can put you under a glass. So things start to fall in place. You can't plan for it. I think the biggest mistake is walking in with a strategy. Yeah, like I didn't. You walk in with a strategy and then when something there's too many moving parts. It's like a mental chess game. And then when something doesn't go the way you expected it to go, you stand there like, now I just screwed myself totally. So, yeah, it's a risk. Every day is a risk.

[Wells]

The mission that they do in Episode seven looks like it sucks. I mean, it's like running through the forest, running into like open water that's like covered with leaves. The bat, Peter and Trishell. They think that they're going to be the ones that get all get all the money. But they get the first question wrong. Setting Peter into a pool of mud. Bergi meets the same fate, which is very funny. More than half the players get to the next two get the next two questions wrong, which sends them flying into the air in a giant net which.

[Dolores]

Like a big cocoon.

[Wells]

Do you think that that really happened, or do you think that those are stunt doubles?

[Commercial Announcer]

Did you know? Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop, voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice. Used with permission. All rights reserved.

Want to buy your way? Of course you do. That's why CarMax offers an experience designed just for you. Want to start online, then visit the lot, then go back online?

Sure.

Want to talk to a real person or chat online? Either works. Want to take your time and compare all the makes and models? No problem. Then make up some time by filling out the paperwork at home and schedule express pickup or home delivery.

[Wells]

Done.

[Commercial Announcer]

When it comes to how you buy, CarMax puts you in the driver's seat. Want to drive? CarMax delivery restrictions apply. See CarMax.com for details.

You've got the New Year's motivation, but the crowded gym? Not so much. Keep your drive. With iFit, we bring the world's best trainers right to your living room. Whether you want to crush a studio, cycle class, build strength, or Zen out with yoga, IFIT adapts to your pace and your schedule. No waiting, no judgment, just results. Make 2026 the year it sticks. Start [e-mail] support for the show comes.

From Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally typ any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra, S I P C Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures.

[Wells]

Back in the castle, Peter finds out he's in the chopping block. Are you surprised that he was surprised that he was on the chopping block?

[Dolores]

Yes, that I am surprised about. I'm like, bro, what did you expect?

[Wells]

Yeah, you're also just dividing people when you don't allow people to come. Like, and, and then you know what they do, what Sandra does. Being like, we gotta look at the numbers is so smart. Right? Like if you are on the outside looking in, you're thinking, well, if I'm not part of the Peter palace and I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be murdered or I'm banished at some point. Right. So we need to figure out how to get numbers. And him sending people away when they come try to join when, when they're not poverty and when they're not Phaedra. Like he's signing his own death warrant, I feel like. And so surprised. Surprised me, right?

[Dolores]

Well, I think, you know, like I said, there wasn't a lot of different things he could have done in that time because he was really just trying to survive. And the less people he trusted, the better off he was to tell them something. And even in that you don't know who to trust at this point.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

So, you know, it was expected that he was going to go anyway. It was like coming close. But you know, Sandra was in the military, I believe she was in the army. Yeah, I. And I don't think she played like she. She hung in there, but she didn't get a lot of things right.

[Wells]

No. I was thinking that this entire episode, these two episodes of like, you're so wrong on like every account, I think. But I also wonder if sometimes you can just be like, I'm trying to get to the end and then I'll figure it all out. Like.

[Dolores]

Like myself.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

That's how I won, by the way. That's exactly how I won.

[Wells]

Well, and same with ct. CT is. Well, I think he's smarter than he's letting on, but he's just like, I'm just trying to get to the end and then I will figure everything out. Which I think Sandra's kind of doing a little bit. You know, this is like we are in like the Peter Pal's world in these two episodes. Peter pulling Parvity and Phaedra aside, I will say that I do think that Phaedra does have a tell with the eye twitch or whatnot. But I do think her instincts are very, very smart. And right when. When Peter asks them kind of both to work together with him, Phaedra immediately is like, I'm getting out of here. And she can use that later, which she does.

[Dolores]

Yeah.

[Wells]

Really smart.

[Dolores]

That is. No one ever could say Phaedras anybody's fool. Yeah, she is so smart.

[Wells]

I know.

[Dolores]

That was. That was. She didn't even have to think about it. She made a good decision on the fly. She's quick.

[Wells]

She's. She's very good. I wonder if this was a production faux pas and like a tipping of the hand. Then Alan tells the players he has a surprise for them in the woods. They're driven in the forest where they meet Alan. He tells him that no one will be banished tonight. Instead, they'll have the power to save someone from being murdered by the traitors. Okay, so the reason why I bring this up is it's. If you're not banishing someone, right, you're just saving people for murder. That means the numbers aren't right for the traders and that is. Okay, then whoever they tried to recruit didn't say yes, because if they had said yes, I have a feeling that they would have had a banishment that night.

[Dolores]

I agree. Yeah, I definitely agree. But you think by now. Well, yeah, because the Peter Pals didn't repeat it to anybody else. Right. They kept it amongst themselves. They kept it in house. They were good.

[Wells]

Yeah. I do wonder if Peter had told everybody and they were like, okay, that's us. But then when they went and did this with Alan, he would have been like, see, the reason why we're doing this is because I didn't accept their thing. And then that kind of absolves them. I'm not really sure. Sometimes I think I overanalyze and I get to, like, produce when I watched the show. But that was like, the one thing that I saw.

[Dolores]

This is not a produced show, as, you know, at all. They, the producers never get involved, and that's not an easy show to produce. Like, you see even, like, you being a producer, like, you want to. You may have said something or did something to change. They do not. It must be hard. I mean, you're a producer. Tell me, do you think it's hard for the producers that are there not to get involved while they're watching?

[Wells]

Yeah, I just think legally they're not allowed to because money's online. But, yeah, I think it's. It's really, really hard. Especially if you can see a storyline that's, like, so very obviously going to make good TV and it diverse away from it. I imagine for them that must be so painful. Like, the big example that I always give. And I remember when I was having my conversations with the producers, I was like, the fact that you got rid of Johnny Bananas in the first episode is bonkers, because I know he makes good TV and he's annoying to be around, but he is amazing television maker. And they were like, you don't understand. We are ripping our hair out. We did. Oh, no. But it's a testament to them that they're making a show that is just living in reality. Things are happening the way they're happening.

[Dolores]

And it's working because the show is so beloved.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

And it gets more. People get more into it every year.

[Wells]

Totally. Are you surprised that CT didn't save Trishell and save John instead? And are you surprised that Trishell was so upset by it?

[Dolores]

I think Trishell's an emotional person anyway. And I am surprised that he didn't pick Trishell same. And he picked John. And I understand that she was upset. She should have been. Because she was begging for that shield, like, literally begging for it. She was like, guys, please. And as a friend, it's the same reason Cherie picked Phaedra. Because when it comes down to that, it comes down to who you have a relationship with. Why would you save somebody you don't really have a relationship with? So was weird. I. I don't Even know why CT picked John. And he even said in his interview it wasn't personal, but she was, like, crying her heart out to him. She's like, but why? Because he's smarter. Like, she was. She was really, really sincerely hurt.

[Wells]

Yeah. But also, she's very good at this stuff. There. There is a part of me that wonders. I think. I think that two things can be true at the same time. I think that she probably was hurt. They are friends. They've been trying to, like, re. You know, mend the fences of their relationships. You know, she would have done it for him, so she thought he would do it for her. But then I also think that there is value in being upset with ct. Right. Like, there's. There's equity in sympathy. Right. And so go. I think if that happens, you do need to make that play to him to be like, you really broke my heart. And down the line, can't do that again. Well, which is not to. Not to put the cart before the horse, but that's kind of what ends up happening at the end.

[Dolores]

I know, but Wells, okay, you're a nice guy, and that doesn't work with every guy.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

I just want to let you know, like, you are a human man. There are some subhuman men that. That would not work on. Okay. I happen to know a few from where I come from.

[Wells]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fair enough.

[Dolores]

Just saying.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

You're really giving your. Your. Your people a lot of credit there. I'm so cynical.

[Wells]

We're just simple men. All right, so only four players were up for murder last night. Birgie, Kate, mj, And Trishell. Bergie is the one that goes down. Parvati wanted to kill Peter, but obviously she can't because Peter's been saved. Bergie is the next option. I feel bad for Bergie, like, we had on the show last week. He's so nice. Like, he is playing such a good game.

[Dolores]

He's so sweet. He was so. He made it further than I thought he would, to be honest with you.

[Wells]

He did the same thing on Love Island. I remember when. When we were there, when Sarah was there filming it, we were like, I'm amazed this guy's still on this show. So he's. He always. I think, you know, he's underestimated.

[Dolores]

Right? But. But he. He. He goes on because he's quiet and he flies under the radar. He's a little underestimated. He's no dummy. He's really nice. You can't, like, dislike the guy and for any way at all. He's just. He even smiles when he's talking. He's just sweet.

[Wells]

He's a sweet guy. I was sad to see him go, but I guess, you know, such as someone must.

[Dolores]

As in the words of Phaedra, someone must die.

[Wells]

Someone's gotta die. Trishell is bloodhound in on Phaedra after Dan throwing another trader under the bus.

[Dolores]

She's right, though.

[Wells]

She's so right.

[Dolores]

There's no easier way to figure out a traitor by the. By the clues another traitor will give you about the other person.

[Wells]

She convinces Peter to also go along this and take Phaedra out. And I think if things had worked out the way that they originally wanted, I think the show would have had to have ended an episode early because I think it would have been over.

[Dolores]

Really.

[Wells]

I do. Like, I think so the way that the numbers work, right. Like, if you take Phaedra out, then you can probably. Even though there are some people that aren't in the Peter palace, you can still get poverty out next. And then there are no more traders. And then it's just going to be the traders taking out other traders before the end of it. But I, I don't know if it would have been possible. I don't even know if there would have been enough time for them to recruit someone else with it all falling apart.

[Dolores]

Right. That hasn't happened yet.

[Wells]

No, because. Because them getting rid of Parvity instead of Phaedra. Phaedra still has the. Everyone thought that Parvati was a traitor. Right. Like it. So if they could have gotten Phaedra out. Because now Phaedra is a number to go against somebody else. I. That's just. Was my thought is that like they were so close to being so perfect, and then it kind of fell apart there because a lot of people didn't want to jump on the Phaedra bandwagon.

[Dolores]

Right. Because she was well liked. And that goes to her telling poverty, you are a nice queen. You need to work people. You need to be nicer to people. But guess what? It's too late.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

Because now then they always look to see for patterns. Like, why did you change? Stay in Ice Queen. If you're a bitch, stay a bitch. I understand that. Like, because if, you know, she's under the glass and I don't think changing her attitude in this stage of the game is going to help her at all. I think Phaedra was trying to tell her, you get more views with honey. Like, the nicer you are, less people will vote for You. Somebody's going to vote for you eventually.

[Wells]

I mean, it is like it's her face, and it's hard to change someone's face, but, like that kind of like squinting glare with, like, the duck lips thing. Yeah, great. But I think more so than that is her. She kind of has a condescending tone and a vitriol and hatred for Peter that comes across as traitor hating a faithful that she can't seem to get out.

[Dolores]

You know, she wants him out of her castle.

[Wells]

Yeah. Yeah. It's very, very true. The mission that they do is the one that I would never do. I would say, guys, I'm so sorry, but $20,000 isn't enough for me. I'm not having bugs drop down into my shirt and stuff. I know you guys did this, not me. You didn't do it. You don't have to do it.

[Dolores]

No, Because Chrishell, the first thing she said when we got there was, I don't do bugs.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

And I said, I don't do closed spaces. So I. She chose. We chose each other to be partners. And we go. And it didn't last two seconds. She pulled. Before they even walked up to us, she pulled her hand away. And once you do that, it's over.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

So we'll talk more about that when that comes. So people were like, oh, you picked the worst partner. No, I picked the best partner.

[Wells]

Absolutely. Yeah. You guys had a plan.

[Dolores]

She didn't tell me she was going to do it. And it's funny because when it airs, she called me and she's like, I'm so sorry. I'm like, and I was up for murder because I was the last housewife standing. And I was like, honestly, Chrishell, you were the best partner ever. Oh, and the smell of the bugs so bad. It smelled like a dirty diaper. Oh.

[Wells]

Now, see, not doing that. The only one to kind of get through is CT. He finds the last piece of gold. They found $15,000 worth of gold, but lost 4,000, dude. To the quitters. Very funny that he pulled the gold out of his pants and said, I had an anaconda in there. Also a piece of gold. I. I appreciated that comment. A good dick joke goes a long way with me, you know?

[Dolores]

You think that's fine? I mean, I guess. I guess we've heard too many of them, so. Yeah.

[Wells]

All right, so this is kind of the. The climax of the. The climax of the two episodes. It's time for the Round table Poverty starts off by telling the group that she's been A brick wall because she's constantly under a attack. She blames her friendship with Dan for how she's being perceived. And it's like, yeah, of course you.

[Dolores]

Good call, though.

[Wells]

Yeah, I, I, she's in a tough spot. Like, I don't even know how you can argue this at this point.

[Dolores]

No, you can't. And she came up with a good one. I'm impressed.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

She's sharp. She's no slouch.

[Wells]

Yeah. Trishell's like, yeah, I don't care. I want to talk about Phaedra. And she, you know, it's, it's. I can see the edit. When I was watching it, she was like, I'm gonna start with, like, the least salacious stuff, and then kind of, like, give you my, like, big reasons at the end. And they really only gave two. I have a feeling she had three or four or five that she had, like, in the chamber against Phaedra, but they only showed two. The eye twitch is something that I have noticed. I'm not sure if you noticed it when you've been watching.

[Dolores]

Oh. With Phaedra. I did not.

[Wells]

Her big thing is that when anytime they're talking about traders or, like, who they think traders are, that, that Phaedra kind of, kind of does, like, one eye twitch like that.

[Dolores]

Oh, wow, that's interesting. I can't get past the lashes.

[Wells]

Well, and that's like, I think the argument is like, I'm surprised she wasn't like, child, I've got giant lashes. You know, like, that's what's happening. But she just got kind of got defensive of it. John says, Parvi could be this is, this is when. When John really shines. All right.

[Dolores]

Oh, yeah, I remember this. Yeah.

[Wells]

He starts using alliteration and, you know, sing songy. He goes like, full William Shakespeare and calls poverty the Duchess of Deception. And then it's of murder when she.

[Dolores]

She thought she was playing him right from the beginning, crying to him. He never fell for her.

[Wells]

No.

[Dolores]

Ah, you know, John, something tells me you've fallen for a few in your day and now you know one when you see one. Yeah, he, I'm sure he's too schooled on that. It is not his first time.

[Wells]

Yeah, yeah. He, he's known a few ice queens in his day.

[Dolores]

He's known a few ice queens, and he has. Yeah, he, he's seen that person a couple times in his life. So he, he recognized it right away.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

If you'll go back to the beginning when she's crying, I'm a single mother and and he's like, oh, poor thing. And then he walks away and he's like, yeah, right. Yeah, the last time I fell for that cost my pension.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Commercial Announcer]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10 upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop, voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All rights reserved.

Want to sell your car your way?

[Dolores]

Who wouldn't?

[Commercial Announcer]

That's why CarMax offers a car selling experience designed just for you with online and in store options. Want to know what your car is worth quickly? Get an online offer in under two minutes. Want to think it over? Use offer Watch to keep tabs on your car's value over time. Plus, CarMax offers flexible selling options with Express drop off in store or pick up at home. Selling your car is in your control with CarMax. Want to drive CarMax pickup not available everywhere. Restrictions and fee may apply. See carmax.com for details.

10 athletes will face the toughest job.

[Dolores]

Interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points.

[Wells]

Points.

[Dolores]

You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract for $250,000.

[Commercial Announcer]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Dolores]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Commercial Announcer]

Pressure is coming down.

Trainer Games On Prime Video January 8th.

Watch the trailer on trainer games.com Support.

For the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc. SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosure is available at public.com disclosures.

[Wells]

Phaedra reveals that Peter asked her in poverty to work with him. I thought this was good on Phaedra's part. Try to get some of the stank off her. Peter says he was being cocky and joking around, which I thought was a weird way to explain that.

[Dolores]

Right. I agree. There was a better way to do that.

[Wells]

Yeah. And then I, you know, I love Kate. One, I love how she makes tv, and it's just, like, so entertaining. But she's been right about a lot of stuff, especially in the first season. But her questioning Peter's sudden switch, I was like, oh, okay. Like, I, I don't know why you're going after him. And I could be wrong, but I think it has more to do with Kate is annoyed by Peter.

[Dolores]

So Kate gets annoyed by a lot of people.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

And then, then they get on her nerves and she just wants whether it's whether they're a traitor or not. She just wants to not see them anymore because she don't even want to be there.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

So, yeah.

[Wells]

All right, so finally everyone votes. This one's actually a pretty good vote. There are seven for poverty. There are four votes for Phaedra, but it kind of comes down to CT and poverty's banished and reveals that, of course she is a. Like, no one was surprised that she was a traitor.

[Dolores]

Nobody.

[Wells]

Yeah. And then we go to, you know, like, the post round table. They all get drinks, which I wish we got conversation where Peter, where Kevin starts saying that he doesn't feel good about Peter changing his mind about poverty last minute.

[Dolores]

I agree with that.

[Wells]

Yeah. I, I, I can totally see that being weird and annoying.

[Dolores]

Because he was so hung up on it.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

You know, and that's sketchy. That's really sketch. And that's on the heels of him telling them he got recruited and turned it down.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

That's a big red flag. I'm sorry. That would make me not trust him either.

[Wells]

You're right. You're right.

[Dolores]

Big mistake.

[Wells]

Peter pulls Kate, which seems like a fool's errand. Like, I'm not sure if you're going to convince Kate of anything really, but that.

[Dolores]

No, no one ever has. Not on tv, off tv. She's dangerous. She's one of my dearest friends. I love her. But Kate marches to the beat of her own drum.

[Wells]

Yeah. You know, Peter tells her that, you know, he was going to vote out Parvey the next round table, but, you know, Kate's just not buying it. So we're down to one trader. Phaedra walks in the turret alone tonight. Obviously, she has to recruit someone or they're just going to run out of numbers because it's obvious that everyone's on. On her. If they don't accept their offer, they will be murdered. So this is the way the show says, I, we're not doing this. Like, you get to choose anymore. It's either you accept or you go home.

[Dolores]

Right. I guess they changed that.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

I don't. I think, like, Peter made case law. Pilot Pete over there, he made case law. He said they were like, whoa, we didn't expect this. He threw a curveball to them. So they had to come up with. With.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

Something to make that not be able to happen.

[Wells]

I was thinking about this, you know, for our season, my thought was that the Traders played a really bad game, and that was, like, kind of why I got kicked out was me saying, like, I. I thought that one of their murders was stupid. I. I'm wondering what. What you think this season is. Do you think this is a season of really good faithfuls or a season of really bad Traders? Because seems like we've got a couple episodes left, and it seems like the Faithfuls, they know who the bad guys are right off the bat.

[Dolores]

I don't think that the Traders were bad at all. I think they were very strategic. I think they're inherently smart. Phaedra was. Is. Is brilliant.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

I mean, look at. Look at who the traitors are. They're two brilliant, witty. I mean, poverty's got someone to drink out of a rusty cup and killed someone. Not everybody could have done that. Right. So I think the Traders were spot on. Amazing. Dan not so much, but rightfully so, got taken out. So I think this is a very good group of. Of trader. I mean, faithfuls. I think had. I think the show would have went a lot differently if there were less smart faithful.

[Wells]

I want to say I'm impressed with this season's faithful. They. They all seem, like, very cerebral and. And very organized almost. And I do think that things would have been so much different if Dan had gone about things differently. I think that he was one of the reasons why everything's kind of tumbling around. The Traders, especially with Phaedra, a lot.

[Dolores]

Of the residuals of what he did, the mistakes he made in the game. Are the demise of the Traders down the road.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

So I just want to say that he was not a good trader, I don't think. No offense, Dan, but the other two were. And listen, when you're not working alone, things like that happen, right?

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

Paul always says to me, partners are made for dancing. So sometimes it doesn't work out.

[Wells]

I mean, if you think about it, the reason why people were really on poverty is because he was. She was so close with Dan. And the reason why people are on Phaedra is because.

[Dolores]

It's because Dan called her out.

[Wells]

Called her out. And so, like, Dan is the linchpin for, like, taking down this entire thing, much to the delight of the faithfuls. Phaedra has to. Has to recruit somebody. I don't know if I think there's a better recruitment option than Kate.

[Dolores]

And this juncture, I'm thinking no.

[Wells]

Who in their right mind would think that Kate's a traitor? You know, like, I. I would never be able to pin that.

[Dolores]

No one. Yeah, no one. Especially someone so not interested in the, like.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

Anyway, I think. I think all choices this season were really good, I have to say.

[Wells]

I just. Honestly, I think one of the big missteps that the Traders made in the first recruitment is that they should have gone to Kate instead of going to Peter.

[Dolores]

True, but then. But, no, but see, this is either you join us or you die. And that. And. And Kate only says yes because she had no choice.

[Wells]

I know. I'm saying that they should have used. They should have asked Kate instead of Peter. I think things would have been different for the. For the Traders if they had done that.

[Dolores]

What? How so?

[Wells]

It would have given them numbers. I. I understand both sides. So, you know, if you can get Peter, then it gets you to have someone that can manipul. Be Peter.

[Dolores]

Majority. Yeah.

[Wells]

Right. But if you get Kate, then I, I do think that because everyone was so kind of grossed out by Peter shooing people away that they would have been able to get Sandra. They would have been able to get.

[Commercial Announcer]

Oh, sure.

[Dolores]

Yeah.

[Wells]

And I think that they would have been able to have the numbers and with. With the. The thing of no one ever expecting Kate to be a traitor. I don't know. I, I was just thinking about it was. I think that poverty was so dead set on something with Peter that she missed the big picture. Which was. The thing is, is that we need numbers in the turret. We don't need to, like, pull away the one guy who's trying to kill you the. Every. Every day. Right. We need numbers. And I think that that was the. The big miscalculation in this episode. But who knows? I mean, hindsight's 20 20.

[Dolores]

It's easier. It's easy to say what someone should do from watching.

[Wells]

Yeah.

[Dolores]

Don't we know that by now? Right? It's so hard.

[Wells]

Only a couple episodes left with this season.

[Dolores]

Do you remember how this season ends?

[Wells]

Yes.

[Dolores]

Well, it's insane. I'm gonna tell you the truth. I cried a little.

[Wells]

Really?

[Dolores]

Probably last time I cried. Yeah, I was, like. Felt a little emotional. No, I felt like emotion. It was bad. I was like. It punched me in my gut.

[Wells]

Yeah. Well, we won't spoil it for you guys out there who might be watching it for the first time or don't remember it from when it aired. But, yeah, we'll be back again next week to talk more traders and faithfuls. Anything else you want to talk about this season before we go? Flores?

[Dolores]

For me, I'm looking forward to the end because I want to know. Like, I just need to talk about it. I. It's like therapy for me. I'm. I have PTSD from it. It's, like, crazy. So, yeah, no, I'm. I think this is a. This was the kickoff season where people got really hooked.

[Wells]

Yeah. I was thinking about it, like, I like the first season, but this season is so fun to watch.

[Dolores]

This solidified like. Like we're on to something here.

[Wells]

Yeah. I. I do believe that the reason why the show became such a big success in the US was because of this one. For sure.

[Dolores]

I'd have to say yes.

[Wells]

And.

[Dolores]

And then next, even.

[Wells]

And then, of course, then you don our television screens and.

[Dolores]

And you, too.

[Wells]

And. And the ratings just skyrocketed.

[Dolores]

Yeah.

[Wells]

All right, all you faithfuls and traders out there, if you don't follow us on social media, please do. We are at by order of. Of the faithfuls on Instagram. We got clips there. You can DM us there. Your questions. Make sure you tell all your friends and all your family and all the people who love reality TV to subscribe to our show, whether it's on podcasts, on Apple Music or on Spotify or the iHeartRadio app. Wherever you listen to us, please subscribe and tell your friends. And we'll be back again next week, breaking down everything from season two of the Traders.

[Dolores]

Bye, Wells. Thank you.

[Commercial Announcer]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop? Voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025 Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All rights reserved.

At CVS it matters that we're not just in your community, but that we're part of it. It matters that we're here for you when you need us, day or night, and we want everyone to feel welcomed and rewarded. It matters that CVS is here to fill your prescriptions and here to fill your craving for a tasty and, yeah, healthy snack. At cvs, we're proud to serve your community because we believe where you get your medicine matters. So Visit [e-mail] or just come by our store. We can't wait to meet you. Store hours vary by location.

With M O Stash a taco in one hand and ordering a ride in the other means you're stacking cash back Nice. Get up to 5% cash back with Venmo Stash on your favorite brands when you pay with your Venmo debit card. From takeout to ride shares, entertainment, and more, pick a bundle with your go tos and start earning cash back at those brands. Earn more cash when you do more with Stash. Venmo Stash terms and exclusions apply. Max $100 cash back per month. See terms@venmo me stashterms this time of.

Year, most of us are checking off our holiday gift lists, but identity thieves have lists too, and your personal information might be on them them. Protect your identity with LifeLock LifeLock monitors millions of data points every second and alerts you to threats you could miss if your identity is stolen, LifeLock will fix it, guaranteed, or your money back. Make this season about joy, not identity theft. With Lifelock, save up to 40% your first [e-mail] iheart terms apply.