Two Ts In A Pod with Teddi Mellencamp and Tamra Judge

"Legally Brunette: Kouri Richins" (Air date: December 2, 2025)

Special with Emily & Shane Simpson

Episode Overview

This episode features a true crime deep dive led by Emily Simpson and Shane Simpson, focusing primarily on the unfolding Kouri Richins (mistakenly pronounced as "Corey Richards" throughout) case—an explosive Utah legal drama involving alleged spousal murder by poisoning. Before tackling that headline case, the hosts offer an in-depth update on the Karen Read saga, exploring her post-acquittal civil litigation and attendant controversies about evidence and police conduct.

With an engaging, sometimes darkly humorous tone, Emily and Shane break down court documents, legal nuances, and evidence, all while layering in their perspectives and legal expertise. Key discussion points include the details of the Richins investigation and prosecution, the complexities of the law, and the sometimes baffling conduct of suspects and witnesses.

Segment 1: Quick Case Update – Karen Read

Timestamps: 03:05 – 13:45

• Karen Read's Civil Lawsuit:

  • Karen Read has filed a federal civil suit targeting witnesses from her criminal trial and members of the Massachusetts State Police (03:44). Her main claims are civil rights violations, malicious prosecution, and conspiratorial cover-up efforts (05:42).
  • Shane points out she is not suing the judge or prosecutors (05:36).
  • Background recap: Read was previously accused of murdering her fiancé, John O’Keefe, by running him over. After two trials—a mistrial followed by acquittal except on a lesser DUI count—she is now "on the offense" with civil actions (07:48).
  • Discussion of motive for ongoing litigation: Emily wonders if it’s time for Karen to move on; Shane counters, “If people accused you of a murder and you had nothing to do with it, and you had to go through two trials, …I’d be doing just as she is” (07:53).

• Trial/Jury Insights:

  • Jury foreman Charlie Deloach believed in a conspiracy since “the very first witness,” notably troubled that police never searched the Albert home where John was found (09:10–09:49).
  • Shane: “If they found a crack pipe on our lawn, they’d be searching our house… There’s a dead body.” (09:49–09:54)
  • Key evidence concern: The taillight allegedly linked to Karen “looked…like it was tampered with” (10:33–10:49).

• Lingering Evidence Fights:

  • Discussion of legal battles over phones and digital evidence possibly involving “Turtle Boy” (a case-focused blogger), and impact on other related cases (11:31–12:46).
  • Shane explains in civil cases, the standard of proof drops (“just tip the scale… so it’s 51, 49,” 13:00–13:33).

Segment 2: Deep Dive – The Kouri Richins Case

Timestamps: 16:19 – 53:32

Case Background (17:01 – 22:36)

• The Crime: Kouri Richins (frequently misspoken as “Corey Richards”), a Utah mother, is accused of killing her husband, Eric Richins, in March 2022 with a fentanyl-laced Moscow Mule.
• Aftermath: Published a children’s book about grief soon after, painting herself as a mourning widow while allegedly covering up her crime (17:16–17:40).
• Key Allegations: Multiple secret life insurance policies; financial fraud; draining joint assets; and staging her husband’s death as accidental overdose—motivated by money woes.

Marital & Financial Context (19:00 – 24:22)

• Marriage & Prenup:

  • Eric, worth ~$5M, signed a prenuptial agreement written by Kouri’s own mother on the wedding day (“If you ever speak to my son…”), which lacked proper language about death during divorce proceedings (19:31–20:35).
  • Lesson: Don’t have your mother write your contracts (“If you really feel as if you need [a prenup], go to an attorney,” 20:40).

• Financial Deception:

  • Kouri took out at least $2M in life insurance without Eric’s knowledge (20:46).
  • Forged documents, withdrew $130k from business accounts, and set up fraudulent credit lines. Her home-flipping business looked successful on the outside but was likely failing and supported with stolen assets (22:06–23:16).

Timeline of the Alleged Murder (24:44 – 28:23)

• Eric’s Growing Suspicions:

  • Upon discovering fraud, Eric changed his will—removing Kouri and naming his sister as trustee (24:44–25:25).
  • Foreshadowing & Affair: Eric considered divorce, met with lawyers, and suspected Kouri was trying to poison him, particularly after a suspicious Valentine’s Day incident where a laced sandwich left him needing an EpiPen (25:25).
  • Shane jokes: “First problem is a sandwich for Valentine’s Day. Seriously?” (25:29).

• The Fatal Incident:

  • March 2022: Kouri allegedly made Eric a celebratory Moscow Mule—laced with a fatal dose of fentanyl (26:04–26:31).
  • Eric was found dead the following morning; autopsy revealed five times the lethal dose (27:04).

• Aftermath Behavior:

  • Two days post-death, Kouri hurried to unlock Eric’s safe to access over $100k in cash (27:50).
  • Physical altercation with sister-in-law over the estate resulted in an assault charge (28:22).
  • Self-published children’s book (“Are You With Me?”) about grief, interpreted by prosecutors as a cover-up (29:38).

Key Evidence and Legal Developments (30:46 – 52:14)

The Orange Notebook (30:46 – 35:17)

• Discovered during police search (not on the warrant); contains “damaging enough” possible confessions, conversations with a therapist, and plans regarding Eric’s death (31:33–34:53).
• Legal controversy: Seized outside the scope of the warrant, raising “fruit of the poisonous tree” (33:17).

Witnesses and Prosecution Evidence (35:49 – 37:04)

• Housekeeper Testimony: Carmen Lauber claims she twice sold fentanyl to Kouri; her statements corroborated via forensic evidence, but the defense highlights her lack of credibility as an immunized witness with priors.
  • “So that's her testimony. Allegedly, Carmen was the one who sold Kouri the fentanyl…” (35:50–36:16).

The Victim’s Awareness (37:11 – 38:44)

• Eric told family he suspected Kouri planned to kill him, especially after the food poisoning attempt.
• Emily: “The first second I thought you were trying to kill me, I’m going to move out. I’m just letting you know” (38:44).

Dark Humor & Commentary

• Shane riffs: “She should have just put it in his EpiPen.” (27:04), and later, “quit writing this stuff down and leaving it everywhere. Well, you leave notebooks in your house, you leave them in the cell...” (45:52).

Walk the Dog Letter (41:59 – 46:40)

• Incriminating Prison Letter:
  • Kouri writes directives to her mom and brother (“Ronnie”) about what he should testify, building the narrative that Eric had a secret opioid habit (42:23–44:55).
  • “So have him testify to all those things.” (44:31)
  • Defense later claims it’s just ‘fictional writing,’ not witness tampering.
  • Shane deadpans: “Who does she think she’s fooling?” (45:47)

The Drug Chain – Conflicting Dealer Testimony (47:19 – 50:12)

• The housekeeper bought drugs from Robert Crozier, whose original confession was that he sold fentanyl—but he later recanted, claiming it was only oxycodone, not fentanyl.
• This potentially undermines the proof that Kouri acquired the murder weapon.
  • Emily: “Isn’t it possible that it’s oxy, but it could also have—”
  • Shane: “—be laced with Fentanyl.” (49:39–49:41)

Legal Motions & Trial Outlook (51:00 – 53:32)

• Witness Immunity: Witnesses testifying about drug purchases are requesting independent counsel due to self-incrimination risks (51:00–51:42).
• Upcoming Trial: Judge ruled ample evidence for trial on aggravated murder, attempted murder (re: earlier sandwich poisoning), drug distribution, insurance fraud, and forgery (52:14).
• The trial is set for February 2026 barring further delays.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Karen Read’s Lawsuit:

  • Shane: “Now she’s on the offense.” (08:56)
  • Emily: “Maybe I would just feel a sense of relief to just… move on.” (08:32)

• On the Orange Notebook:

  • Shane: “The orange notebook is of more value to me.” (49:45)

• On Suspect Behavior:

  • Emily: “This is what I don’t understand about people that… commit crimes, and then they do something stupid like write down their exact plan within a notebook.” (35:06)

• On “Walk the Dog” Letter:

  • “It’s as incriminating as you can get.” – Emily (46:36)

• On Victim’s Choices:

  • Emily: “He clearly knew… she was trying to kill him… why stay in the house?” (38:02)
  • Shane: “It’s like, hey, I’m going to go out, have some drinks with my wife. By the way, I think she’s trying to kill me.” (38:27)

Timeline of Key Evidence

• 2015–2017: Multiple insurance policies taken out without Eric’s knowledge (~$2M).
• 2020: Eric discovers financial forgeries; meets with divorce/estate attorneys.
• Feb. 2022: Suspected sandwich poisoning; life insurance policy goes into effect.
• Mar. 2022: Eric’s death (fentanyl-laced Moscow Mule); rush to open safe.
• Apr. 2023: Kouri’s grief children’s book published.
• May. 2023: Arrest, home search, orange notebook seized.
• Pre-trial: Defense fights evidence admissibility (notebook, letters); witness immunity questions.

Closing Notes

Emily and Shane close by promising continued updates as the Kouri Richins trial approaches (53:32). They encourage feedback and case suggestions from their listeners, previewing more true crime legal breakdowns to come.

The tone throughout is conversational but informed, often darkly humorous, and focused on legal process and the baffling realities of human conduct in high-stakes cases.