Bones in the Backcountry

Summary

Uinta Triangle – “Bones in the Backcountry”

Podcast: Uinta Triangle
Host: Dave Cawley, Lemonada Media
Episode Date: May 20, 2026
Episode Theme:
An in-depth exploration of what happens when human remains are discovered in the wilderness, focusing on the investigation process and the dedication it takes to bring closure to victim’s families. This bonus episode centers around the aftermath of finding trekker Eric Robinson’s remains, what steps are taken from discovery to identification, and the broader implications for public health and personal closure.

---

Main Theme and Purpose

The episode delves into the emotional and procedural realities following the discovery of human remains in remote locations, using the case of missing hiker Eric Robinson as context. Host Dave Cawley interviews Utah’s Chief Medical Examiner, Dr. Deirdre Amaro, and Chief Investigator, Dr. Corey Russo, to illuminate the steps and challenges in identifying remains, determining cause and manner of death, and the broader impact of such work.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Discovering Remains in the Wilderness

[00:30]

• Personal Perspective: Kelvin Judd recounts the surreal experience of locating Eric Robinson’s partial remains by Allsop Lake.
  • “My brother found a hiking boot. … sticking out of the hiking boot was a tibia and a fibula broken off below the knee with a hiking sock half torn over it.” (Kelvin Judd, 00:54)
• Contextual Note: Such discoveries, while rare, are not unprecedented in backcountry settings.

2. Human vs. Animal, Ancient vs. Modern

[01:45-03:07]

• Jurisdiction over remains falls to the Utah Medical Examiner only if bones are human and “modern”—defined as less than 100 years old.

  • “The rule that is written currently is 100 years. But with that being now 1925, I think that might need to be adjusted.” (Dr. Corey Russo, 02:55)

• Identification Process:

  • Initial evidence at the scene (wallets, clothing, etc.) can be crucial. (Dr. Amaro, 03:27)
  • Forensic anthropologists may be needed if it’s unclear whether remains are human.

3. Cause vs. Manner of Death

[03:42-04:52]

• Definitions:
  • “Cause of death is the injury or disease process that made somebody dead. Manner of death is multiple choice: natural, homicide, suicide, accident, or undetermined.” (Dr. Deirdre Amaro, 03:49)
• Investigators need beyond intuition: “We need to be able to bolster our conclusions… and here I’m showing you these things versus ‘oh, yeah, this is my feeling’. That doesn't really work.” (Dr. Amaro, 04:52)

4. The Investigation: Family and Forensics

[05:13-06:13]

• Teamwork with law enforcement, families, and medical histories is vital.
  • “Definitely talk to family, witnesses, look at medical records, talk to law enforcement…” (Dr. Corey Russo, 05:46)
• DNA Is Not a Magic Bullet:
  • “DNA is not a magic trick … it’s not 100% slam dunk, black and white. Here is the answer.” (Dr. Deirdre Amaro, 06:14)
  • No national DNA registry—matching relies on available comparisons.

5. The Limits of What Can Be Known

[07:03-08:10]

• At times, only identification is possible; cause and manner may remain “undetermined.”

• Medical devices with serial numbers or prior X-rays can be critical in making a match.

  • “Each medical device has a very unique serial number and so we can definitively identify that device and match it to that person.” (Dr. Amaro, 08:00)

6. Coping with the Difficult Nature of the Work

[08:18-09:34]

• Amaro sees value in talking openly about death:

  • “I think the world would be a much better place if we weren’t so afraid about talking about death.” (Dr. Deirdre Amaro, 08:37)
  • The goal is to “mitigate that additional trauma of losing a loved one… that just decreases the overall suffering in the world and feels good.” (Dr. Amaro, 08:50-09:34)

• Positive identification brings closure:

  • “It is not good news when someone is positively identified and the family's hoping it's not them, but it is peace that they have and closure and that's very important…” (Dr. Corey Russo, 10:16)

7. Training Paths and Professional Pride

[11:03-11:46]

• Dr. Amaro outlines the long medical and forensic training path to her profession.

  • “You have to graduate high school… four years of college… four years of medical school… at least three years of pathology residency… then one year of intensive fellowship…” (Dr. Amaro, 11:03)

• Both professionals express passion for their puzzle-solving work:

  • “It is pretty cool.” (Dr. Deirdre Amaro, 13:59)
  • “I love it.” (Dr. Corey Russo, 14:01)

8. Wilderness Protocol: What to Do if You Find Bones

[15:04-16:16]

• Clear Guidance: “Do not move them, photograph them, document them, and contact law enforcement.” (Dr. Corey Russo, 15:32)

  • Leave it to experts—mistakes can easily happen distinguishing human from animal remains.

• Real-life anecdotes illustrate common confusion:

  • “Somebody sent me a photo one time … of a bear paw … this person thought it was a human hand.” (Interviewer, 16:29)
  • Amaro adds, “Depends on your level of experience, how much of a meat eater you are…” (17:07)

9. Public Misconceptions and the Impact of Medico-Legal Death Investigation

[18:03-18:44]

• Popular media and crime shows create unrealistic expectations:
  • “Forensic television is great for entertainment, but it hasn’t done us justice because then people are under the impression that we can do everything on one case in an hour.” (Dr. Corey Russo, 18:59)
• The office’s work actually serves public health:
  • “Every time a death certificate is filled out, that data becomes mortality data. … That’s what guides public health interventions.” (Dr. Amaro, 18:27)
  • The more precisely deaths are understood, the more future lives may be saved.

10. Privacy, Patience, and the Need for Understanding

[19:34-22:50]

• Legal privacy: Utah is a “closed record” state; only immediate family may receive completed reports.
  • “We wouldn't want the investigation to be interrupted… By law we're not able to just give anyone that calls in for case information…” (Dr. Corey Russo, 20:01)
• Delays in information are because thoroughness takes time, not due to inactivity.
  • “It's just, I haven't found a way to accurately convey what all is going on behind the scenes. Why it does take this long. But it does. And it's not that we're sitting around twiddling our thumbs.” (Dr. Deirdre Amaro, 22:15)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Who. Who are you? Who were you?”
  — Dr. Deirdre Amaro, reflecting on the humanity behind the remains (01:37)
• “DNA is not a magic trick…there’s still a human being who has to interpret it.”
  — Dr. Deirdre Amaro on the limits and process of DNA analysis (06:14)
• “We are very much a public health entity. ... Everything we do actually helps the living.”
  — Dr. Corey Russo, reframing the role of the medical examiner (18:05)
• “Do not move them, photograph them, document them, and contact law enforcement.”
  — Dr. Corey Russo’s advice to anyone finding bones in the wild (15:32)
• “[Identifying someone] is not good news…but it is peace…and closure.”
  — Dr. Corey Russo on the bittersweet role of identification (10:16)
• “Forensic television is great for entertainment…that's not how it works.”
  — Dr. Corey Russo on misconceptions from media (18:59)

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:54 – The discovery of Eric Robinson’s remains by hikers (Kelvin Judd’s story)
• 02:55 – Definition of “modern” remains and jurisdiction over cases
• 03:42–04:52 – Explaining cause and manner of death and investigative standards
• 06:14 – Debunking DNA as a “magic trick” and describing the process
• 08:37–09:34 – Dr. Amaro’s philosophy on talking about death and the emotional mission of the work
• 10:16 – The impact of providing closure to families
• 11:03 – The rigorous path to becoming a forensic pathologist
• 15:32 – Exact steps to take if you find bones in the backcountry
• 18:03–18:59 – Impact of forensic work on public health & TV misconceptions
• 19:34–22:50 – Privacy laws in Utah and the reality of slow, careful investigations

---

Summary Wrap-Up

“Bones in the Backcountry” is a thoughtful exploration of what happens after hikers stumble on remains, what it takes to answer the crucial questions of identity and cause, and why patience and respect for process matter. It pulls back the curtain on the meticulous, often misunderstood work of forensic investigators, the emotional weight of delivering closure, and the public health benefits of understanding death as deeply as possible.

Listeners come away with a greater appreciation for the science, ethics, and humanity behind those tasked with answering the hardest questions about life’s end, especially when mysteries emerge deep in the wilderness.

Transcript

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Mom, can you tell me a story? Sure.

[Carvana Narrator]

Once upon a time, a mom needed a new car.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Was she brave?

[Carvana Narrator]

She was tired, mostly. But she went to Carvana.com and found a great car at a great price. No secret treasure map required.

[Interviewer]

Did you have to fight a dragon?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Nope.

[Carvana Narrator]

She bought it 100% online from her bed, actually.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Was it scary?

[Carvana Narrator]

Honey, it was as unscary as car buying could be.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Did the car have a sunroof?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

It did, actually. Okay, good story.

[Carvana Narrator]

Car buying. You'll want to tell stories about. Buy your car today on Carvana. Delivery fees may apply.

[Dave Cawley]

What would you do if you found bones in the backcountry? I'm Dave Cawley, and this is a bonus episode of Uinta Triangle. In episode seven, you heard Kelvin Judd describe the experience of locating Eric Robinson's partial remains in the rocks above Allsop Lake.

[Kelvin Judd]

My brother found a hiking boot. There was a hiking boot. You can just see the bottom of it from where we were standing. You see the Vibram sole? And I can still see that in my head. And he picked up that hiking boot. And sticking out of the hiking boot was a tibia and a fibula broken off below the knee with a hiking sock half torn over it.

[Dave Cawley]

This was such a surreal, unexpected experience, but not unprecedented. Hikers and hunters do find bones on occasion. Sometimes they're obviously not human, but when they are, the next question is, who was this person?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

That's just the basic piece of humanity we're also trying to provide to these remains. Who. Who are you? Who were you?

[Dave Cawley]

I wanted to get a better idea

[Interviewer]

of what someone should do if they

[Dave Cawley]

stumble into a situation like Kelvin's. So I invited Utah's chief medical examiner to come talk to me.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

So, first name? Deirdre. D E I R D R E. Because I'm such a dear. Last name? Amaro.

[Dave Cawley]

A M A R O. Dr. Amaro didn't come alone. With her was the chief Investigator for the ME's office, Dr. Corey Russo.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

R U S S O Chief Medical Examiner. Investigator.

[Dave Cawley]

You should know there were ground rules for the conversation you're about to hear. Utah state law prohibits the medical examiner's office speaking publicly about individual cases. So Deirdre and Corey couldn't address the specifics of Eric Robinson's case or any other. We're speaking in general terms. Also, the system Utah uses isn't universal. Other states and countries might handle death investigations differently. So keep that in mind wherever you're listening. Under Utah's system, the state medical examiner holds jurisdiction in cases of unidentified Remains, but only if the remains are both human and modern.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

So the rule that is written currently is 100 years. But with that being now 1925, I think that might need to be adjusted.

[Dave Cawley]

That determination of human versus animal, ancient versus modern, begins at the scene. If it's not obvious the remains are human, like when there is no skull present, it might take a forensic anthropologist to figure out what investigators are looking at. But bones aren't the only clues.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

With the scene, we'll look for circumstantial evidence. You know, is there a wallet? Is there clothing? Is there anything around that may or may not be related to the remains found? But maybe those could be important clues to help us figure out who this might have been.

[Dave Cawley]

From identification. The job then becomes figuring out cause and manner of death.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Cause of death is the injury or disease process that made somebody dead. Manner of death is multiple choice. So manner of death is natural. Homicide, suicide, accident, or undetermined.

[Interviewer]

Hmm. Okay. So hypothetically, you could have, say, a situation where you can definitively say this was an accidental death, but we don't necessarily know exactly what caused the death. Am I understanding that correctly?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Other way.

[Interviewer]

Other way. Okay.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

But that is also possible. For example, if one were to find skeletal remains somewhere, and there's a gunshot wound to the head that we can still see in the bone, we have a good idea of what the probable cause of death would be. Gunshot wound of head. But then the manner of death is going to rely heavily on additional investigative information. Was there a firearm located nearby, which would suggest maybe more in line with suicide, or is there nothing? So could that be homicide or undetermined?

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

As you're probably aware, not uncommonly, we have to interface with the criminal justice system and the legal system. And so we need to be able to bolster our conclusions and be able to say we came to this determination because of X, y and z. And here I'm showing you these things versus oh, yeah, this is my feeling. And, you know, it seems right, that doesn't really work.

[Interviewer]

Well, I mean, circumstantially, say you have a situation where somebody is found, identified, and now all of a sudden, a family who has not known what happened to their loved one is confronted with, okay, here they are, they're deceased, maybe in a place we didn't expect, but they might have interacted with that person shortly before they died. Right. So, as an investigator, I imagine that becomes a big part of the picture of understanding the. Of what brought this person to the end of their life.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Definitely talk to family Witnesses look at medical records, talk to law enforcement, see if they had any interaction with them before they died. There's a lot of avenues that are explored.

[Interviewer]

The DNA component, I think, is something that a lot of people in the public know exists, but they don't understand what it means. And it's maybe treated a bit like magic. Oh, they find a person and it

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

DNA and there's your answer.

[Interviewer]

What does DNA look like?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Well, let me preface this a little bit. So DNA is not a magic trick. Okay. So doing a DNA analysis is like every laboratory test. There's room for error in the pre analytic phase, meaning when we're collecting the stuff that's going to be tested, there's room for error in the analytic phase, meaning when the stuff is being put through the machine that tests it. And there's room for error in the post analytic phase, meaning after the machine spits out an answer, there's still a human being who has to interpret it. So it's not 100% slam dunk, black and white. Here is the answer. Also, there is no nationwide database of people's DNA, fortunately. So you can't just stick DNA into a machine and it says, oh, this is Joe Smith from, I don't know,

[Interviewer]

Tallahassee, Florida from this time period, right?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Yes. One of the primary objectives of our office is to identify the person. And sometimes that is the only thing we can do. Not uncommonly when we have skeletal remains. We're not going to come up with a cause of death, we're not going to come up with a manner of death. It's going to be undetermined. Undetermined. But if at least we can identify them, that is something.

[Interviewer]

As you were talking, I was sitting here thinking about, okay, say something happened to me. What are the things that an investigator might look at? I had surgery when I was in my 20s and I had sternal wires and it was like, oh, yeah, there's a stainless steel mesh around my rib cage. That would be a pretty clear indicator it might be him. Right. Like that's a pretty fascinating idea that the medical devices, if you had pins or something put in, like, that could be evidence in helping identify you.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

We can get antemortem imaging, X rays, and we take postmortem imaging and that can be compared.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

And then also each medical device has a very unique serial number and so we can definitively identify that device and match it to that person.

[Interviewer]

That's fascinating.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

So, yes, I would like to encourage everyone to get some sort of medical implants with serial numbers. So we can identify you no matter what. Exactly.

[Interviewer]

I mean, all the things that we don't think about in our day to day lives, we all are going to die. We all deal with death in our lives. And for you in this career, how big of a mission is it to break down some of that barrier?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

I think the world would be a much better place if we weren't so afraid about talking about death. So that very much feeds into my why of why I do this.

[Interviewer]

Elaborate please.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

So we see horrible things every single day. And I think, no, I know if I weren't able to see the bigger picture of the good that the work we do does, I would just get bogged down by man. Human beings are terrible animals. All of us deserve to die. This is horrible, the things we do to each other. But instead, if I'm able to look at this like, yes, we've done horrible things, but everybody dies. So can we at least do our part to mitigate that additional trauma of losing a loved one? Because we're all going to lose a loved one. That just decreases the overall suffering in the world and feels good.

[Interviewer]

The flip side to that coin is of course, when you are doing this work and you identify someone or you're able to provide answers. I've firsthand seeing the effects that it can have when somebody has waited 10, 20, 50 years and suddenly here it is. And if you weren't doing what you all do, that would probably not happen. Right. There are many, many people out there who are waiting for that call of hey, we found your lost, missing loved one. That's got to. And maybe you guys don't do that notification yourself. Maybe that's law enforcement, but I imagine there's some pride in knowing that you've done the work.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

It's both. Yeah. Especially when it, when it comes to identification and our office has been heavily involved, we make those notifications quite a bit. And it is not good news when someone is positively identified and the family's hoping it's not them, but it is peace that they have and closure and that's very important to them and to us.

[Interviewer]

I'm thinking about the amount of training that you both must have gone through to get to this point in your career. Just walk me through what is the. Say you are high school or college age and you think, I'm really interested in this. What does it look like to go from there to where you are?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

So the path to becoming a forensic pathologist is pretty well laid out. So we'll start there to become a Forensic pathologist. You have to graduate high school. You have to do your four years of college. You have to do your four years of medical school, either an MD or a do. School doesn't matter. And then you have to do at least three years of general pathology residency training, which is where you learn all about the pathology of human diseases and how to diagnose them. And then you have to do one year of intensive fellowship training in forensic pathology and pass various board exams along the way. So that's the minimum number of years, and I wasn't keeping count. I hope you were.

[Interviewer]

I don't do math very well, but I can tell you it sounds like a lot.

[Jenny Ahmet]

If the world were like a Sleep number mattress, everything would adapt for your comfort. Because as your life changes and your body changes, sleep mattresses adapt and shift to give you personalized comfort night after night. And now everything's on sale during our Memorial Day event. Save up to $1,200 on mattresses for a limited time to experience a whole new world of comfort, visit a Sleep Number store or go to sleepnumber.com sleep number to a good life Sleep.

[Grainger Narrator]

When you manage procurement for multiple facilities, every order matters. But when it's for a hospital system, they matter even more. Grainger gets it and knows there's no time for managing multiple suppliers and no room for shipping delays. That's why Grainger offers millions of products in fast, dependable delivery. So you can keep your facility stocked, safe, and running smoothly. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click grainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.

[Carvana Customer]

Hey, sweetie. Your mother showed me this Carvana thing for selling the car. I'm gonna give it a try. Wish me luck. Me again. I put in the license plate. It gave me an offer. Unbelievable. Okay, I accepted the offer. They're picking it up Tuesday from the driveway. I haven't even left my chair. It's done. The car is gone. I'm holding a check anyway. Carvana, give it a whirl. Love ya.

[Carvana Narrator]

So good you'll want to leave a voicemail about it. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pickup fees may apply.

[Interviewer]

Maybe I'm wired weird. But getting out in the field looking into cold cases, which I've been doing for a number of years now. I am not medically trained. Whatever investigative experience I have is just because I fell into it. And I really respect the approach that you all take to it. And I have firsthand seen what it means to victim families when they get that notification at the Same time. Maybe this is the wrong way to say it, but you get to solve mysteries for a living, which is pretty cool.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

It is pretty cool.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

I love it.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

We like putting puzzles together.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Yeah. And I don't think it's insensitive to say that, like, it might be the worst experience for a victim family, but to be able to know, hey, we took this situation, we went to this scene, we had maybe some scattered bones. We didn't know what we were dealing with, and we were able to find out. This is incredible.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

And what's really cool is sometimes we're working backwards from a death certificate. Only in Utah, our office is tasked with clearing, reviewing all cremations and anyone that's removed out of the state to be buried or cremated in another area. And so we're reviewing death certificates on a daily basis to make sure we're not missing anything. And sometimes we find death certificates that make those cases our jurisdiction. And then we work backwards. They come in for an exam. And so even that is interesting. And like solving a puzzle, really.

[Interviewer]

Okay, I'm going to throw a curveball at you here. Utah is an amazing place because we have so many outdoor recreation locations, a lot of wilderness. But at the same time, that presents some challenges, because if something bad happen, a person may lose their life in a far flung place. If I am out in one of those places and I see bones, what do I do?

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Do not move them, photograph them, document them, and contact law enforcement.

[Interviewer]

Are there any, like, very clear, because I'm sure from my own personal experience, a deer tibia. I go, oh, that could be human. Some cow, Pretty obviously not human. But for a layperson, are there any obvious things or is it just, hey, if you have any question at all, leave it, photograph it.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Law enforcement, I would go with that route because sometimes it can be tricky, especially trying to identify through a photograph or. Or something. We want to just make sure the proper channels are followed.

[Interviewer]

I've certainly been in the position of, like, is that human? Is it not human? I don't know. I don't know what I'm supposed to do here.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Look a lot like hands.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Okay, I will tell you a story. I had somebody send me a photo one time not too long ago of a bear paw that was found in West Valley City, not too far from the Maverick Center. And this person thought it was a human hand. And, hey, what should I do with this? I don't know. That looks a lot like a hand to me. Turned out not to be. So dwr, thankfully, was able to come in and say, no, no, no, that's bare. But I can picture in my mind what that looks like. Pretty wild. Are there any other easily mistaken?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Well, that depends on your level of experience, how much of a meat eater you are. I think also plays a role in this. I mean, my very biased opinion is that everyone could benefit from learning more about human anatomy and health and disease, and especially anyone even considering going into a health professions where they're caring for live patients in some way, shape or form. So seeing an actual autopsy is gonna be a game changer.

[Interviewer]

Why do you say that?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Because you get to bask in the full glory of human anatomy. It's a beautiful thing.

[Interviewer]

See it in a way that, like most medical professionals are dealing with live patients. Right. They don't have that experience to see that. I mean, I've never seen an autopsy. I wouldn't know what to do with myself in that situation. But I can imagine that it's very educational. Yes. What is something that you think the public gets wrong about what you do for a living?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Oh, so many things.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

One is they tend to think that all we do is death, but everything we do actually helps the living. We are very much a public health entity, so I don't think they understand in detail where our data ends up and how that impacts treatments, targeted prevention efforts.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Yeah. So our office is dealing every day with the terminal results of public health problems. So every time a death certificate is filled out, that death certificate data becomes mortality data. And that mortality data is what guides public health interventions, resource allocations and research.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Right.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

All with the goal of trying to prevent future deaths. So the better we can understand death, better we do our job in investigating and coming up with the accurate cause and manner of death, the better we can improve life and postpone death for those still alive.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

And another thing I would say is forensic television is great for entertainment, but it hasn't done us justice because then people are under the impression that we can do everything on one case in an hour. And that's not how it works. You know, when we have to send specimens to outside labs, that process, it's a process. And it can take, you know, months, sometimes years to really get to what we need to in certain cases. That doesn't mean that we're not actively working on it. It's just some things are out of

[Interviewer]

our hands in that time frame. When you're working on a case and there is, let's say, interest from a. A prospective victim, family or somebody who wants to know about the case and they call your office. You have limitations on what you can talk about. What prevents you from just telling anybody who calls details about a case?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

It could so many things.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Yeah, I was gonna say there's a lot of components to that, but we wouldn't want the investigation to be interrupted, either ours or law enforcement's. So that's one big reason. Secondly, Utah is a closed record state. So by law we're not able to just give anyone that calls in for case information information that's limited to immediate family for our office once our report is complete and we have information to

[Interviewer]

provide them when an investigation is done, a next of kin is able to get access to that, but just not anybody calling from the public to get access to records, correct?

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Correct. In Utah.

[Interviewer]

Not everywhere.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Not everywhere. Which boggles my mind because this is ultimately the most personal, private health information possible. The information we gather in a medical, legal, death investigation. And it really should not be public fodder.

[Interviewer]

Is there ever frustration where you are working an investigation? So I'm going to ask this question as a member of the news media, right? Maybe there is a deceased person who's found. It's in a very public place. News people are there because it's newsworthy. Your office is there doing what you do. And there is this gap in time where you're doing your investigation. And those of us in the news media, we're not privy to all the inside of that and we have to try to communicate to the public what's happening. And so in this vacuum of information, I've seen it personally happen, where people will speculate, they will start posting comments on the story they want to, da, da, da. And I think there's a risk of misinformation happening, especially when less responsible, let's say reporters, organizations or just individuals start speaking publicly, saying, I think this happened before an investigation is done. Is there, I guess a message from your office to the public about when something like this happens, even if it's difficult, the patience that's required on the part of the public to wait for the answers.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

I do remember being on the public side when I lost my father before I was in forensic pathology, he died in a coroner system. And I was so upset and I was so angry and I didn't understand why it would take so long because I knew an autopsy is just a couple hours. Why am I not getting the answer right now? And I should know better, even though this was before I was a forensic pathologist. And so it's just I haven't found a way to accurately convey what all is going on behind the scenes. Why it does take this long. But it but it does. And it's not that we're sitting around twiddling our thumbs.

[Dr. Corey Russo]

Definitely not. We are pretty busy.

[Jenny Ahmet]

This bonus episode was produced by me, Jenny Ahmet. Our executive producers are Jessica Cordova Kramer and Stephanie Whittles. Wax for Limonada Media and Cheryl Worsley for KSL Podcasts. For more on the story of Uinta Triangle, Visit our website uintatriangle.com that's uinta u I n t a triangle.com thanks for listening.

[Grainger Narrator]

When you manage procurement for multiple facilities, every order matters. But when it's for a hospital system, they matter even more. Grainger gets it and knows there's no time for managing multiple suppliers and no room for shipping delays. That's why Grainger offers millions of products in fast, dependable delivery so you can keep your facility stocked, safe, and running smooth, smoothly. Call 1-800-granger. Click granger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.

[Carvana Customer]

Hey sweetie, your mother showed me this Carvana thing for selling the car. I'm gonna give it a try. Wish me luck. Me again. I put in the license plate. It gave me an offer. Unbelievable. Okay, I accepted the offer. They're picking it up Tuesday from the driveway. I haven't even left my chair. It's done. The car is gone. I'm holding a check anyway. Carvana, give it a whirl. Love ya.

[Carvana Narrator]

So good you'll want to leave a voicemail about it. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pickup fees may apply

[Lowe's Narrator]

during Memorial Day at Lowe's. Shop household must haves for less save $80 on a Char Broil Performance Series 4 Burner Grill to chef up something special. Plus get up to 45% off select major appliances to keep things fresh. Our best lineup is here at Lowe's. Lowe's we help you Save valid through 527 while supplies last selection varies by location. See Lowes.com for details.

[Dr. Deirdre Amaro]

Visit your nearby Lowes.

[Grainger Narrator]

This is the story of the one As a procurement manager for a hospital system, she keeps every facility in her network stocked and ready. That's why she counts on Grainger to be her single source for thousands of products, from disinfectants to lighting, air filters and more. And with fast, dependable delivery, Granger helps her keep every facility stocked, safe and running smoothly. Call 1-800-granger clickranger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.