Podcast Summary: Uncensored CMO – "How not to get fired (from the world’s leading expert)"

Podcast: Uncensored CMO
Host: Jon Evans
Guest: Cory Marchisotto
Date: March 30, 2026
Episode Theme: This episode revolves around the art of job survival—specifically, how not to get fired. Jon Evans and Cory Marchisotto share candid stories, hard-won lessons, and practical strategies for thriving (and surviving) in high-pressure marketing environments.

Episode Overview

Jon and Cory candidly explore the realities of getting fired in marketing, why it happens, and—most crucially—how you can avoid it. The episode dives deeply into office politics, company culture, personal responsibility, and the dynamics of high-growth organizations. Personal stories, memorable metaphors, and actionable advice create a lively, insightful discussion for marketers and professionals navigating today's workplaces.

Key Discussion Points

1. Getting Fired: The Great Teacher

• Jon opens by admitting, with humor, that his experience with being fired is the main reason he started podcasting.

  "The only thing I can outdo you a number of times—been fired. It's like top trumps." (01:00, Jon)

• Both agree that being fired can be an invaluable learning experience, but prevention is preferable.
• Lesson: Early-career idealism about bosses rarely matches reality. Proactively managing up and understanding success metrics is crucial.

2. Understanding the Rules & Politics

• Jon: Success isn't just about what you do, but how you do it.

  “There’s a manual on what to do. I read that. There’s another manual on how to do it. I didn’t read that one. Or I read that one too late.” (01:49, Jon)

• Navigating company politics and understanding organizational power dynamics are essential survival skills.
• Cory:

  “You need to know what game you’re actually playing... Before you break the rules, let's understand what the rules are first.” (03:24, Cory)

3. Adapting to Difficult Bosses & Cultures: Cory’s Story

• Cory recounts a formative career story: unable to connect with a boss despite loving every other aspect of her job, she resisted pressure to quit.
• After seeking advice and only hearing "just leave," she turned to books for help. A librarian directed her to Cultural Misunderstandings: The French-American Experience, which illuminated key cultural differences affecting her relationship with her French boss.

  “I needed to come from a different temperature, a different angle. Something about me had to change.” (06:45, Cory)

• Result: Cory stayed with the company for 18 years and even married a Frenchman.
• Major Insight: Don’t expect the environment or others to change for you; focus on how you can adapt.

4. Value of Open Dialogue and Understanding Differences

• Jon tells a story about early struggles with a manager, only resolved after they both underwent a psychometric test and realized their working styles were polar opposites.

  “People that think in opposite ways to you are so valuable. Once you unlock it, it becomes... an amazing unlock where actually you get the most out of each other.” (09:17, Jon)

• Both hosts stress the importance of seeking to understand before trying to solve issues—have candid conversations early.

5. Alignment With Company Goals

• To avoid being expendable, ensure your work aligns with what the organization actually needs.

  “Making sure you're aligned to the company goal and mission is so key as well.” (11:48, Jon)

• Cory notes that thriving in a high-growth company requires a particular mindset and skill set, which not everyone possesses or wants.

  “What does that actually mean? What are the set of behaviors? What needs to be true in order for that high growth to happen?” (12:19, Cory)

6. The Reality of High Growth Environments: Jon’s Brewdog Story

• Jon describes the intensity at Brewdog, an explosive-growth UK brand, where timelines and resources constantly fell frustratingly short of expectations.

  “I loved the mission, I love the creativity, I love the ambition... But the execution, oh my word, was that hard. With a small team in limited resources, that is a very, very, very hard job.” (15:27, Jon)

• Cory adds a powerful sports metaphor:

  “When you think about high growth, there’s zero room for mediocrity. Every position is visible and you can’t just shoot a two point shot... you got to shoot a three point shot... and then a four point shot...” (16:13, Cory)

• Both warn that despite its allure, high-growth culture is unsustainable for many and demands superhuman endurance.

7. Prevention Starts with Hiring (Not Firing)

• Both agree: the secret to not getting fired is often set before you even accept the role.

  “One thing is actually starting at the hiring stage... The other thing is... really understanding what success looks like for them and how things get done and asking the innocent question.” (17:51, Jon)

• Jon references Jess Myers (CMO, Veri), who, upon starting, meticulously interviewed 50 colleagues to glean what success required.
• Cory emphasizes that interviewing should be designed to assess not just skills, but characteristics and cultural fit:

  “The question is not whether or not they're great, it’s whether or not they're great here.” (20:19, Cory)

• Avoid surface-level interview questions; dig for true fit.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jon:
  “You learn so much and it really focuses the mind, but possibly it's better not to get fired.” (01:09)
• Jon (on politics):
  “My boss took me out for coffee and said, ‘Jon, you're the best marketer I've ever worked with… you just couldn't navigate the organizational politics well enough.’” (02:18)
• Cory (on adapting):
  “You can’t expect my boss to change. I needed to change... What had to change about me was understanding this actually had nothing to do with me and her. It had everything to do with... different cultural perspectives.” (06:45)
• Cory (on high growth):
  “Somebody could run a marathon at sprint speed, but you have to run a series of marathons at sprint speed. This is about endurance.” (16:55)
• Jon (on hiring):
  “You have to ask open ended questions and you have to ask a question that is actually gonna lead you to the characteristics about the individual... The question is not whether or not they're great, it's whether or not they're great here.” (20:19, Jon quoting Cory)

Important Segment Timestamps

• [01:00-03:24] – Jon and Cory discuss lessons from getting fired; importance of managing up and organizational politics.
• [03:24-07:23] – Cory’s story: struggling with a boss, seeking advice, epiphany via a book on cultural misunderstandings.
• [08:21-10:02] – Value of open dialogue, psychometric testing, and realizing the strengths of opposites in teams.
• [11:51-13:12] – Aligning with company goals and the reality of what high-growth organizations demand.
• [13:12-16:13] – Jon’s Brewdog story: excitement vs. harsh reality of high-pressure environments.
• [16:13-17:51] – The challenge of endurance and the relentless expectations in fast-moving companies.
• [17:51-20:26] – Importance of fit, thorough onboarding interviews, and hiring for both skills and characteristics.

Key Takeaways

• Manage up: Take charge of your own career by managing expectations and communicating with your boss.
• Decode the culture: Success is determined as much by how you do things as what you do.
• Adapt, don’t expect others to: Personal growth comes from changing your approach, especially across cultural divides.
• Have the hard conversations early: Early, honest discussions can defuse challenging relationships.
• Align with the company’s needs: Ensure your goals and style match what the business wants and requires, not just what you want to do.
• Assess fit before you join: Investigate whether the environment suits you; don’t just be seduced by a brand’s success.
• Great hiring prevents firing: Both interviewer and candidate must do deep, open-ended discovery to ensure mutual fit—not just competency.

For a marketer—or any professional—navigating modern workplaces, this episode is a candid, wisdom-packed guide to job longevity, role satisfaction, and true organizational impact.