A new species in New York

Summary

Unexplainable — "A New Species in New York"

Podcast: Unexplainable (Vox)
Date: June 10, 2026
Host: Meredith Hoddinott
Guest: Benji Jones, Senior Correspondent at Vox
Episode Theme: Exploring the search for undiscovered insect species in one of the world’s most densely populated cities—Prospect Park, Brooklyn—and what that reveals about scientific discovery, biodiversity, and the unknown in our own backyards.

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Episode Overview

In this episode, host Meredith Hoddinott joins Vox reporter Benji Jones on a field reporting trip within Prospect Park, Brooklyn. Together, they discuss the quest to discover a new species of insect—right in the middle of New York City—and what this adventure tells us about the hidden richness of urban biodiversity, the ongoing opportunities (and challenges) of scientific discovery, and the staggering amount of life on Earth that remains unknown.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Setting the Scene in Prospect Park

• [02:17] Benji describes Prospect Park: “It feels like more, a little more rustic than Central Park…there's like scruffy forests and ponds and turtles…dogs running everywhere. So it's a little bit chaotic, but just like very New York in every way.”
• Birding excitement: A group is “freaking out because they had just seen a Mississippi kite”—an unusual bird for the area.

Why Search for New Species in NYC?

• [03:28] Benji: Most people avoid bugs in the park—“I just set up a giant bug trap to try to find a new species of insect. I'm hoping that we will find a species that is new to science that no one has discovered before. Right in the middle of New York City.”
• Importance: Insects are foundational—pollinators, decomposers, and more. “They clean up our poo. They do all these sort of hidden tasks all around us.”
• “If you can find something new to science in the middle of the largest city in the country…you can find a new species anywhere.” ([05:04])

What Are They Looking For?

• Focus is on parasitoid wasps (which lay eggs in other insects) and scuttle flies (family Foridae), both notorious for having enormous numbers of undescribed species.
• Explanation of the trap setup ([06:52]): “If you can imagine just like, a sheet of black mesh that is supported by tent poles…Insects fly upwards, they get funneled into a bottle attached to the trap and full of ethanol…We already have a wasp. Yeah, I think that's a parasitoid wasp. Amazing.”
• Carefully designed not to capture larger insects like butterflies or bumblebees.

The Backstory — Discovering Hidden Diversity

• Benji's inspiration comes from fly researcher Emily Hartop in Berlin: “Within about 10 minutes in her office, she convinced me that flies are incredible.” ([08:02])
• Introduction to the concept of “dark taxa”: “Animal groups in which the majority of their species are still undescribed, still unknown to science. About 90% of life is still undescribed, which is just like…blows my mind.” ([09:19])
• “She has done trapping…in Los Angeles, and she discovered over 40 new species of flies…So I was like, if people can do this in LA, why not…in New York?”

The Significance of New Species Discovery

• Personal motivation: “I want to know what animals I share my home with.”
• Global implication: Finding the unknown here “will just really highlight the fact that our world is still so unknown…and that, to me, is both exciting, but also just inspiring.” ([05:04])
• Even “if we find something new…it will help tell the world…about how much there is still to discover…and how important discovery is when we think about trying to reverse some of these pretty horrible trends…biodiversity loss.” ([11:08])

What is a “New Species”? (Taxonomic Nuance)

• Meredith asks: “What exactly is a new species…what do you mean by that?” ([13:41])
• Benji explains:
  • Discovery vs. Description:
    • Discovery: “We find something…that we don't think anyone has found before.”
    • Description: The formal process of publishing a record with evidence it’s unique, comparing to museum collections and past literature.
    • “It’s this whole sort of due diligence process to prove that this is actually new. And at that point, it is, like, officially a new species.” ([16:01])
  • DNA Barcoding: Specimens will be sequenced, barcodes checked against a global DNA database—“kind of like collecting fingerprints at a crime scene and then running it through an FBI database.” ([16:15])
  • Even so, it requires expert confirmation using physical and historical records.

The Limits (and Possibilities) of Cataloguing Life

• Will we ever know all species?
  • Benji: “Even the term species is squishy…For insects, it's possible. When we get into smaller stuff like nematodes, bacteria, fungi…so hard to discover, so hard to find…” ([19:20])
• “I think for bacteria and fungi, like, it just seems hard.” ([20:22])

Why Bother with Flies? The Case for Micro-Discovery

• Even uncharismatic, small species contribute uniquely to their ecosystems. “Each fly is maybe like one of those tiny little bolts that plays some role in keeping that machine alive.” ([21:36])
• “There is real value in just getting a little bit of a clearer picture of just how this machine is working, especially when it's ecosystems that are what give us drinking water…clean the air…food is pollinated by all sorts of insects…” ([22:04])

Bringing the Wonder Home

• Meredith: “I guess I'm struck by just the wonder in these teeny creatures.” ([22:19])
• Benji on perspective change: “As soon as you start to shift your gaze towards the smaller stuff…each one has its own life, its own purpose…makes the world feel much fuller and more exciting and the community is bigger.” ([22:45])

On Naming a New Species

• Will Benji name a new fly after himself?
  • “Apparently very much not cool to name something after yourself. It's like loser behavior, a faux pas.” ([23:37])
  • Benji’s public approach: “This is such a public facing project…I sort of want input from folks. So if you have an idea of what we should name a new fly or a new wasp or anything else that we discover that's new, let us know.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "Insects run the world. They're so important for pollination. They clean up our poo. They do all these sort of hidden tasks all around us."
  — Benji Jones, [04:01]

• “About 90% of life is still undescribed, which is just like…blows my mind. And…we’re not talking about lions and tigers…we're talking about stuff that you really need to carefully look for.”
  — Benji Jones, [09:19]

• “Discovery is one of the most exciting aspects of science, of biology…there is real value in just getting a little bit of a clearer picture of just how this machine is working…”
  — Benji Jones, [21:36]

• “As soon as you start to shift your gaze towards the smaller stuff…each one has its own life, its own purpose…and the community is bigger.”
  — Benji Jones, [22:45]

• (On naming a species) “Apparently very much not cool to name something after yourself. It's like loser behavior, a faux pas.”
  — Benji Jones, [23:37]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 02:17 — Benji paints a picture of Prospect Park
• 03:28–04:51 — Introduction to the project and why discover insects in NYC
• 06:52 — Trap setup and what they're after
• 08:02–09:19 — The concept of dark taxa and the inspirations
• 13:41–16:01 — What constitutes a new species; discovery vs. description
• 16:15–18:41 — DNA barcoding and the modern golden age of discovery
• 19:20–20:26 — The limits of how much of life we can ever catalogue
• 21:36–22:45 — Why tiny species matter; the big picture of ecological roles
• 23:37 — The etiquette and creative process of naming new species

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Conclusion

This episode is a testament to the profound mystery, excitement, and value of scientific exploration—even in the heart of a bustling metropolis. Through Benji’s lighthearted but deeply curious fieldwork, listeners are invited to expand their sense of wonder and appreciation for the hidden world teeming with unknown life practically underfoot. The hunt for new species in New York isn’t just science—it's a reminder that discovery can be both local and limitless.

Transcript

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Excuse me.

[Benji Jones]

Hey, Meredith.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Hey, Benji. How's it going?

[Benji Jones]

It's going well. How's it going?

[Meredith Hottenot]

Excellent, Excellent. Yeah. Is now a good time to talk? I know you're pretty busy.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah, this is perfect. We just wrapped up.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Yeah, yeah. So, Benji Jones, senior correspondent here at vox, covering the biodiversity, the environment. I mean, usually I feel like I'm catching you between reporting trips to, you know, bat hospitals in Australia or chasing cougars in Mexico. So I'm glad that I caught you on this, on this field reporting trip. Where are you now?

[Benji Jones]

I am right here in New York City. I'm in the middle of Prospect Park. Exotic in Brooklyn.

[Meredith Hottenot]

The exotic reaches of Brooklyn.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah, exactly. On a beautiful sunny day, I should add.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Oh, yeah. Describe what you see and hear around you.

[Benji Jones]

Yes. So I'm like 20 minutes from my house in the middle of Prospect Park. It's one of my favorite places in New York. It feels like more, a little more rustic than Central park, for example, because there's like scruffy forests and ponds and turtles. We saw like a bunch of turtles and swans today. Oh, nice. And I'm listening to the sound of children in the distance. When we got here, there were dogs running everywhere. So it's a little bit chaotic, but just like very New York in every way. And we actually just ran into a large birding group and they were like freaking out because they had just seen a Mississippi kite. A Mississippi kite in the sky that was, like, hovering around us while we were here. So there's just like, all walks of life in the park. And that's why I love Prospect park and New York, obviously.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So what are you up to in the wilds of Prospect Park?

[Benji Jones]

So while most people probably try to avoid bugs in the park, I just set up a giant bug trap to try to find a new species of insect. I'm hoping that we will find a species that is new to science that no one has discovered before. Right in the middle of New York City.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Amanda. I guess if I think about a new species in Prospect park, what comes to mind is like, a Great Dane and a pug mix at the dog field or something wild. So why is it important to find a new species of bug?

[Benji Jones]

Yeah. So what's so incredible about insects in general is that there are so many unknown species still. So we're looking specifically for a new species of what's called a parasitoid wasp, which is a wasp that lays its eggs and other insects, and also flies in the family Foridae, which are known as the scuttle flies. And the reason we're focusing on those two insect groups is that they're famous for having so many unknown species, tens of thousands that have yet to be described. And when we're talking about the value of maintaining something like parasitoid wasps or flies, it may not seem that important. But insects run the world. They're so important for pollination. They clean up our poo. They do all these sort of hidden tasks all around us. And so there's a really strong argument, even if you're just thinking about seeing. Selfishly thinking about humans, to protect them. But first, you need to know what actually exists.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Right. So I guess why have this quest in the middle of New York City? Like, why not look for a new species in some remote jungle? Well.

[Benji Jones]

Cause it's easy. Look, I love it.

[Meredith Hottenot]

It's right next door.

[Benji Jones]

It's right. It's literally my neighborhood. It's my community. I want to know what animals I share my home with. But I also just think that doing this project in the middle of New York helps show just how unknown the world is. If you can find something new to science in the middle of the largest city in the country and the most densely populated metropolis, you can find a new species anywhere. And so I think if we do find something new, and the scientists that I've talked to say that it's very likely that we will. I think it will just really highlight the fact that our world is still so unknown. And that, to me, is, like, both exciting, but also just inspiring in the face of the larger story that I often tell and hear about about the decline of insects, the decline of biodiversity. So this is, like, look, there's still this incredible opportunity for discovery.

[Meredith Hottenot]

So are you right by your trap right now?

[Benji Jones]

Mm, yeah, we're, like, a few feet away.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Could you kind of walk around it and describe what it looks like?

[Benji Jones]

Okay. We're not that close, actually.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Not that close. Okay.

[Benji Jones]

The trap is behind a fence right now because we had to go in with this guy Howard. Oh, hey. Yeah. Hey, Howard.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Hi.

[Benji Jones]

Hi.

[Howard (Prospect Park Ecologist)]

Very nice to meet you.

[Benji Jones]

Howard is a forest ecologist with the Prospect park alliance, the nonprofit that manages the park.

[Howard (Prospect Park Ecologist)]

That's a leafhopper. Oh, that's an interesting one. Yeah.

[Benji Jones]

Wow. That's so cool. To your knowledge, has anyone discovered a new species in Prospect Park?

[Howard (Prospect Park Ecologist)]

To my knowledge, no. But again, most of the wildlife studies that have been done in Prospect park are the usual suspects. You know, the dragonflies and damselflies, butterflies and moths, bees.

[Benji Jones]

No one's gone out looking for flies here yet.

[Howard (Prospect Park Ecologist)]

I don't want to say nobody, but we don't have a fly list. We have a list of some other insects. We don't have a fly list yet.

[Benji Jones]

We are in eyesight of the trap, and I can describe it if that's helpful.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Perfect. Yeah. I'm really curious.

[Benji Jones]

Okay. So part of the reason why signage was very important to say what we're doing is that it does just look like a tent from the distance. But if you can imagine, just like, a sheet of black mesh that is supported by tent poles and some white mesh that drapes over it in an arc. And the trap is designed in such a way that as insects fly upwards, they get funneled into a bottle that is attached to the trap and full of ethanol. Oh, look, we already have a wasp. Yeah, I think that's a parasitoid wasp. Amazing. So basically, we're going to have bottles and bottles of dead bugs with DNA intact that we can then send to a lab for analysis. So we're really looking for tiny little wasps and tiny little flies. Those are where a lot of the unknown species are. And we're trying not to capture big butterflies, dragonflies, bumblebees, things like that. And so the opening for the bottle of ethanol where they're getting trapped is very small and too small to capture something like a monarch.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Got it. So how did you come up with this project?

[Benji Jones]

God. A few years ago, I ended up connecting with a fly researcher named Emily Hartop, who was at a natural history museum in Berlin. And within about 10 minutes in her office, she convinced me that flies are incredible.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Okay.

[Benji Jones]

And she just ran through all these different species of foreign flies, the scuttle flies, one of the types of flies that we're trying to collect here. Some of them, like, decapitate ants, Some of them, mimic ant larva. Like, they have all these crazy behaviors. And I was like, okay, there is this whole unknown world of flies. And when I was with her, she mentioned this term called dark taxa in describing the scuttleflies. And as she explained to me at the time, dark taxa are animal groups in which the majority of their species are still undescribed, still unknown to science. And so that really just sparked curiosity for me to be like, okay, there is so much that we don't know. I realized just so much of our insect diversity and really of most invertebrates. So, like, crustaceans, a lot of stuff in the ocean, totally unknown. Like, about 90% of life, big plus or minus there, because no one really knows. But about 90% of life is still undescribed, which is just like 90%. Yeah. The majority of life on our Earth,

[Meredith Hottenot]

that's like, a majority. Like, more than just super majority.

[Benji Jones]

The super majority of life on Earth is still totally unknown. And that just, like, blows my mind. And, like, yes, we're not talking about lions and tigers and all the other big things out there that are super charismatic that, like, Darwin or whatever found. We're talking about stuff that you really need to carefully look for. One of the things that I learned from, from this fly researcher, Emily, is that she has done trapping using similar traps that we're putting up in New York in Los Angeles, and she discovered over 4, 40 new species of flies in the family for a day, those scuttle flies. And so I was like, all right, if people can do this in la, like, why not? Why don't we try doing this in New York? And so east coast, west coast thing. Exactly. By coastal flies. So I was just like, dude, let's try to do this in New York, especially because I'm sorry, but New York is better and bigger. And I think it's even more exciting to find something new in the middle of New York. And also, like, it's just not very hard. Like, literally. I mean, well, as the people with me today can attest, it was not that easy to set up this trap. But mostly because I don't like camping at all. And it was basically like setting up a tent. And I sort of hated the whole process. And it's still a little janky. There is another stake and I'm not sure why everyone was like, you have to be an idiot not to know how to set it up. So I'm sure I'll, like, set it up somehow.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Fail.

[Benji Jones]

There's no poison ivy in here, right?

[Meredith Hottenot]

I'm sure the flies won't fault you for it.

[Benji Jones]

Exactly. The bar is low for them. Maybe not. Maybe they're judgy.

[Meredith Hottenot]

So what is your biggest hope for what you'll discover with this project?

[Benji Jones]

A fly just landed on me. Also, that Mississippi kite is in a tree right above us, which is very cool.

[Meredith Hottenot]

That's very cool.

[Benji Jones]

I mean, yeah. So, like, I don't think we're going to make a dent, any kind of meaningful dent in the, like, pursuit of unknown life. We're not going to describe dozens of new species. We're not going to help close these giant gaps in the tree of life. But each insect has its own role in the ecosystem. That's how it evolved. And so my hope is that we find something new, a new animal species that has not been described before. It's unknown to science. And we can also, and with that information, help tell the world, educate folks just about how much there is still to discover and how important discovery is. When we think about trying to reverse some of these pretty horrible trends in terms of what's happening to biodiversity. So good, so good. So good.

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[Benji Jones]

A fly got into the transmitter pod with me that first time when I was alone.

[Meredith Hottenot]

So this. This might be kind of a basic question, but what exactly is a new species? Like, what do you. What do you mean by that? What level of animal are we talking about here?

[Benji Jones]

Surprisingly, not at all a basic question. Very complicated, because taxonomy is quite complicated. The system that we use to catalog life on Earth. So I guess the first thing I'll say is that there's an important distinction between discovery and description. So discovery is like, okay, we find something. We being, like, usually scientists, taxonomists find something that we don't think anyone has found before. There was recently, for example, a big announcement of expeditions across the oceans to try to discover new species. And they found, like, 1100 newly discovered species. So things that taxonomists thought have not been found before.

[Meredith Hottenot]

But when that comes to fruit flies.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah.

[Meredith Hottenot]

So when it comes to flies, probably a little different.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah. So, like, you and me walking around pretty much anywhere, we're encountering flies all the time. Also, we have a bunch of kids here. Hold on. Okay, hold on. Hold on one second. Oh, kids seem to have fallen so long.

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What are you doing?

[Benji Jones]

We're sampling insects.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Oh, right.

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Okay.

[Benji Jones]

Very sweet. Maybe it's. Okay. So your question about, like, how do we know if something is new, what it means to discover a new species? So description is the formal process for actually determining that something is a new species. That's when you name it. And that basically means you have to publish a record of the specimen that you found with evidence that they're unique among all the other flies or wasps that are out there. And then you also have to comb through different museum collections, all these old academic articles to make sure that no one has described the species before. So it's this whole sort of due diligence process to prove that this is actually new. And at that point, it is, like, officially a new species.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Got it.

[Benji Jones]

But it's, like, surprisingly complicated.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Yeah, yeah. So you have, like, there's the, like, oh, I think we've seen something new.

[Benji Jones]

Exactly.

[Meredith Hottenot]

But that's a very different. Or just like, the start of a very long process.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah, it's a ton of work.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Finding a fly in a haystack, literally.

[Benji Jones]

And, like, just for, like, if it's helpful for this project. So we are going to the first step after we collect all these insects through our trap is to barcode them. And that basically means we will sequence a portion. And by we, I mean I'm not doing this. A lab in Canada is doing it called the center for Biodiversity Genomics. But we'll sequence a portion of the genome for each specimen. And that portion of the genome is called a barcode. And they basically have databases of genetic barcodes of all these species that scientists have collected. And so when we start sequencing our specimens, they can compare the barcode of our specimens to databases of barcodes to see if there's a match. And it's kind of like collecting fingerprints at a crime scene and then running it through, like, an FBI database of. Of people's fingerprints. And then if there's a match, you're like, oh, this might be a suspect. It's very similar, except for the fingerprint in this case is a section of the DNA of the species.

[Meredith Hottenot]

And that's only the first step because it only matches what's in the database. But exactly that doesn't mean that it couldn't be a match to something else that's been described in some back corner of a natural history museum.

[Benji Jones]

That's exactly right. So it's those kinds of experts who will make the final determination. That looks. We think that this is actually totally new, undescribed, and then that's when we would get to name something new, which is obviously the best part of this whole process. In some ways, it's actually easier to discover something new now because of advances in genetic sequencing. Like, we can sequence enormous quantities of specimens pretty quickly and cheaply now. And so you can do what we did, which is set up a trap. It passively is collecting stuff and then run it through sequencing and databases. Like, that's fairly, fairly easy. In the past, it was all kind of these big expeditions. Often they were. Usually they were white scientists who would go to foreign countries, collect a bunch of stuff, and just take it from that country. And so it was very much like a Western science extractive practice of describing new species. But it was. It was. I mean, back in the 14, 1500s, whatever, so much had been undescribed. I mean, there was a point in history where, like, Western scientists were like, look, a giraffe, let's name that.

[Meredith Hottenot]

I'm thinking giraffe has a good buzz to it.

[Benji Jones]

Exactly. So it was easier to visibly see new stuff hundreds of years ago, obviously. But in some ways, I think we're actually in sort of like a golden age of discovery now. Because of these new sampling techniques and because of the simple fact, as I mentioned, that just still so much of these smaller animal groups are totally unknown.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Yeah. Do you think there'll ever be a point when we'll know all the species on Earth?

[Windows 11 / Blinds.com Announcer]

I.

[Benji Jones]

I don't know, because, I mean, part of it is that even the term species is, Is squishy. Like, no, because I think there's a point where we will know all vertebrates. So stuff with backbones, birds, fish, mammals. I think for insects it's possible when we get into smaller stuff like nematodes, bacteria, fungi, like, that stuff is just so hard to discover, so hard to find. And at that point we're, like, talking about such enormous quantities of species that it's like, does it make sense to find every species of nematode? Maybe. But I think as you get into smaller and smaller organisms, it is much harder. And so I think we could discover at least most animal species if we see investments in discovery taxonomy less likely when we go into even smaller animal groups.

[Meredith Hottenot]

So it's sort of like, where is that line for it to be worth trying?

[Benji Jones]

Yeah, yeah. I think for bacteria and fungi, like, it just seems hard.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Right. What does it mean to sign up for just like, this kind of impossible project then, in terms of, like, the quest of finding, cataloging, understanding a whole family of flies that could have millions of potential unknown dark species?

[Benji Jones]

Yeah, I mean, I think that if you are like, to me, discovery is one of the most exciting aspects of science, of biology. So, yes, like, the excitement around discovering a fly is probably less than something big and charismatic. But because even individual fly species have some function in their ecosystem, whether they're pollinators, they're food for other insects, which are food for birds, which are food for mammals or whatever, it is getting to, I think, like, revealing some of the hidden diversity, revealing the hidden roles they're playing. Like, there's so much excitement in that, and I think also just like, helps us better understand, like, the ecosystems around us as. And, like, I guess I think about them sort of like machines, like, really complicated machines that have, like, big gears, but also, like tiny little nuts and bolts. And each fly is maybe like one of those tiny little bolts that plays some role in keeping that machine alive. And so I think there is real value in just getting a little bit of a clearer picture of just how this machine is working, especially when it's ecosystems that are what give us drinking water, they're what clean the air, they're what provide food. Our food is pollinated by all sorts of insects. Like, it's just there is so much value in just like each individual animal in the ecosystem.

[Meredith Hottenot]

I guess I'm struck by just the wonder in these teeny creatures.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah.

[Meredith Hottenot]

For listeners at home that might find themselves wandering through Prospect park or Central park or somewhere in LA or anywhere in between, like, what do you want people to see when they think about this tiny, mysterious world of flies that we know so little about?

[Benji Jones]

I mean, I guess for me, and I hope for other people, learning about this hidden diversity in our backyards has like, really opened my world up. And as soon as you start to shift your gaze towards like the smaller stuff and you just like pause for a moment on a walk and you just see little tiny creatures like buzzing all around you. Like each one has its own life, its own purpose. And as you start to pay attention to those smaller things, I think it just makes the world feel like much fuller and more exciting and the community is bigger.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Yeah. So if you do find something that is totally new, what are you thinking about naming it? You got like the Benjafly or something in your Benjifies?

[Benji Jones]

Well, it's like apparently very much not cool to name something after yourself. It's like loser behavior, a faux pas.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Got it.

[Benji Jones]

But I think, I don't know, I also kind of want like this is such a public facing project. Anyone walking through the park gets to see this happening. So I sort of want input from folks. So if you have an idea of what we should name a new fly or a new wasp or anything else that we discover that's new, let us know.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Excellent. Awesome. Well, I'll let you guys. I know you have more, more traps to set up.

[Benji Jones]

Yeah.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Throughout the day. So thank you so much for your time and oh my God, thank you so much. Yeah, absolutely.

[Benji Jones]

And I'll keep you posted. Hopefully we'll. It will have news to share soon.

[Meredith Hottenot]

Yes.

[Benji Jones]

I'll talk to you later. Alrighty. Cheers by.

[Krishna Yalla (Producer)]

This episode was produced by Meredith Hottenot and me Krishna Yalla. We had editing from Lissa SOP and fact checking from Melissa Hirsch. I did the mixing and sound design with music from Noam Hassenfeld. Sally Helm has her own fly dilemma. Joanna Solotarov is on TV and Bird Pinkerton got yanked through the opening in the wall before it slammed shut. She looked at the talon holding her arm and then she looked at the rest of the birds standing in front of her. Are you? She said. The bird nodded. It was Flapton. Thanks as always to Brian Resnik for co creating the show. With Bird and Noam, and if you have thoughts about the show, we'd love to hear from you. Please email us at unexplainableox.com/if you'd like to support the show and the journalism that Vox does, you should become a member. It's really easy to do. Just go to vox.com members and for those of you who have emailed us to let us know you signed up because of Unexplainable, thank you. It really means a lot. Thanks also to those of you who left us a nice review on your podcast platform or just told somebody in your life about the show, you're the best. Unexplainable is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network, and we'll be back very soon with another episode about everything that we do not yet know.

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