← Unfiltered Soccer with Landon Donovan and Tim Howard
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- [00:00]
Landon Donovan
I am going to move on to the elephant in the room.
- [00:03]
Tim Howard
And, you know, Landon likes to play the good cop, so I'll assume the natural role of bad cop.
- [00:07]
Landon Donovan
We made a promise to be unfiltered. We speak our mind from our experiences.
- [00:13]
Tim Howard
We're not mentors to these kids. What we're trying to do is hold them accountable. This is going to be the biggest World cup in the history of soccer.
- [00:19]
Landon Donovan
Take it seriously. Unfiltered Soccer with Landon and Tim, presented by Volkswagen. Volkswagen has long been a supporter of soccer in America and has proudly been a partner of US Soccer for the past five years.
- [00:33]
Tim Howard
Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the stage Premier League legend, New Jersey's hall of Famer, and the man who holds the record for the most saves in a World cup game, Tim Howard. And six time MLS cup champion, the MLS MVP trophy's namesake and the man responsible for the greatest U.S. men's National Team goal of all time, Landon Donovan. LD Timmy, how are you, buddy? Listen, you know when he talks about the greatest goal of all time, US Men's national team, say more. Do you ever think about how that started? You never. Like, you don't oftentimes give me credit.
- [01:25]
Landon Donovan
What do you mean, how the goal started?
- [01:26]
Tim Howard
How the goal started. I mean, it was a great goal and I had a great view of.
- [01:29]
Landon Donovan
It, but I didn't know you were going to go there. Okay, well, I do have a picture that someone sent me. It's one I'd never seen before of you throwing the ball, action shot out to me. You know who sent me that picture?
- [01:45]
Tim Howard
Who?
- [01:45]
Landon Donovan
You did.
- [01:48]
Tim Howard
That was this week. But this is awesome. You always tell me how. How great LA is. It's awesome to be here. Thank you all. Thank you, Sinclair and AMP Media. This has been beyond our wildest dreams. Volkswagen, our presenting partner, the support that we have. Thank you all again for being here and every and all of our listeners. The support we have is just absolutely blown us away, year one. So super excited to be here with you all.
- [02:14]
Landon Donovan
Yeah, thank you guys. Thanks for everyone coming out. I know obviously a lot going on in LA and traffic and all these things, so thanks for taking the time. As always. You guys hear me on the show say this, you probably get sick of it, but follow us on social media. Unfiltered soccer. I know all of you do, but for those listening later, make sure to subscribe to the show on YouTube. Follow us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. As always, you can email Jordan, who is here feedbackunfiltered soccer.com yeah.
- [02:41]
Tim Howard
And focus your eyes on this amazing national team jersey, special one that Volkswagen has. It's one nation, one team. In Spanish and in English, there's a bunch of stars that kind of blend together this little ode to the street style that is so much of U.S. soccer. So if you get an opportunity during or after the show, come have a look at it. It's pretty cool.
- [03:03]
Landon Donovan
Yeah, it's beautiful. And thanks, Jess. Where are you, Jess? Thanks for being here. And thanks for Jess. She runs everything at Volkswagen, so we adore. We adore Jess. All right. Anything exciting happen in the last few days in US Soccer?
- [03:19]
Tim Howard
A few things, sadly, at the moment. A few things, yeah.
- [03:23]
Landon Donovan
All right, so let's dig in. First to the friendlies over the last few days. The game against Turkey. Turkey.
- [03:30]
Tim Howard
It's correct. Good pronunciation.
- [03:31]
Landon Donovan
Feels like three weeks ago, it was only last week. Not a whole lot there. It was, you know, great goal by Jack McLean. Not a terrible performance. Not a great performance, but I think the one that's on everyone's mind is last night. So I know you were in Florida with your family, and I was watching with my kids. And 36 minutes in, we're down 4 0. And I was thinking to myself, and this got backed up later, has there ever been a national team game at home where we're down 40 or anywhere in the first half? And I don't know, I'm sure it's backed up by seven, but I could not believe what I was watching. Couldn't believe it.
- [04:08]
Tim Howard
Well, it's a little bit of the trend recently with the US Men's national team. And I think for our listeners, I think what you have to understand is there's tactics and there's coaching ideas, but there's a nuance to the game. Right? We've both been in it. You hear us say that all the time, that our experiences tell us. If your manager goes out and says, this is how I want you to play, Pochettino has a way of playing fantastic. If you're down to nothing, there are moments. And by the way, we have players on the field that play at big moments and big clubs around Europe. You take the game by the scruff of the neck, you kick somebody. I know people say, oh, this is a beautiful game. No, you have to earn the right to Play. So at 2 nil, things aren't going your way. What are you doing to influence the game, to change the game? And instead of trying to do that, it goes to 3 nil into 4 nil. And I, if I Hear one more person say, but the second half was better. I just thought Switzerland was up 4 nil. They were on the beach.
- [05:07]
Landon Donovan
It can't get worse, right?
- [05:08]
Tim Howard
At a bare minimum, your job as a US national team player is to run and tackle and fight and earn the right to play. Like, at what point did all of a sudden we think we can go on the field and just start knocking it around. You have to earn that right. And it's not there at the moment.
- [05:22]
Landon Donovan
Tim, I never told you this story. When I first got to Everton, I was in the. It was the first week I was there. I arrived on a Saturday and I was there. It was like Wednesday or Thursday. And one of the old play, I don't know if it was Stubsy or someone, he stopped me in the hallway and he said, landon, welcome to the club. I want to tell you one thing. I said, okay. He said, you can miss every pass, you can never score, never have an assist, do everything wrong. If you run and fight and represent Evertonian as well, they will love you. And I was thinking about this this week because when I hear from fans or when you scroll social media, you talk to people, that's what they want. Of course, that is what they don't care about. You know, a lot of fans, by the way, are new fans. And they don't really understand soccer at the highest, highest level yet. They're still learning, but they want an American team that fights like will just compete and fight. And I haven't seen that in so long. I mean, so long.
- [06:19]
Tim Howard
Well, you know what the interesting part is? One of the greatest rivalries in world football is USA Mexico. No one can tell me different. We've had. You and I have been a part of it. It's absolutely brilliant. For so long, the US Team, we didn't possess a skill, right? So when you watch the Mexican team, it's flair. It's beautiful football. That's what it is. And because we were always so far behind, right, as a US Team, all we were were fighters. We desperately wanted that beautiful football. We needed Claudia arena and yourself and all these different players to bring Clint Dempsey to bring a flair. But what people forget is Mexico are the nastiest, toughest players you're ever gonna play against. So it's masked with all that beautiful flair. That's the toughest team I've ever played against.
- [07:01]
Landon Donovan
Yeah, that's right.
- [07:02]
Tim Howard
And so in American soccer or US Soccer, it's like we kind of forget that we want all the flair, we want all the beauty Expansive football. But that's the baseline for a US Men's national team. And that is not what I'm seeing.
- [07:14]
Landon Donovan
No, it's not. And, you know, conversely. And we're going to dig way deeper into all this, but conversely on the women's side. And it was interesting this week because Emma Hayes came out and said she's giving all her players this summer off. European players this summer off. But she has made it very clear from day one that if you don't do that dirty work and the running and the competing, you're not going to play for her. And so I give her a lot of credit for that. I think it's been interesting now to see that group develop under her. And they seem to be going back in the right direction. And unfortunately, we seem to be going in the wrong direction. And it's sad, but it's the reality.
- [07:56]
Tim Howard
You know what's interesting about that, Landon, is when we look at the broader picture. Right. And again, we'll touch on this. And players missing this summer due to fatigue. Right. And other things. Jerry Colangelo with USA Basketball and the Dream Team. We had the dream team in 1992, and everyone thought that was the standard. Right. And they fell below the standard. USA Basketball. Jerry Colangelo took over and basically said, I need a two year commitment from UMBA players. Right. And so I love what Emma Hayes is doing because U.S. soccer should have seen this summer coming.
- [08:25]
Landon Donovan
Yeah.
- [08:25]
Tim Howard
Fatigue. This was the most outside of next summer. This is the most important summer. So what they should have done is look at the overall map and said, hey, if you guys need any break, if you're feeling the fatigue, take it a year prior to this, because we are going full tilt for the next 24 months. There is no breaks. And so I think you can mandate that in a certain way. It can't be contractual, but there has to be a collective understanding that we're missing.
- [08:48]
Landon Donovan
Yes. Collective buy in. Well, shout out to Emma Hayes and lots more to come with the women's team. And I think it's going to. It'll be fun to follow as we go forward.
- [08:58]
Tim Howard
Yeah. Speaking of the U.S. women's National Team, it's time for the unfiltered refresh sponsored by Coors Light. Choose Chill. Get Coors Light delivered. Go to coorslight.com USLNT yes, sir.
- [09:10]
Landon Donovan
So every week we choose someone who is choosing chill. And I thought it was really interesting, given what's going on. On the men's side, we saw Trinity Rodman in her backyard at Audi Field on Sunday, cheering on her teammate. She was alongside Michelle Kang, who we absolutely adore has invested, I believe now, 50, $55 million into women's soccer on the women's national team side. Hoping we can get that at some point, too, on the men's side, because it's incredible. But Trent Rodman, with everything going on, she's been injured, her back injured there, supporting her teammates and being there even though she's not fit and healthy. And I just. I love to see that because we saw her commitment to that team.
- [09:51]
Tim Howard
Yeah, she's committed. She's committed to a rehab. She was over in at the French Open. I think she was pictured there and back supporting her teammates. So she's got it all going on and big credit to her.
- [09:59]
Landon Donovan
Yeah, yeah. She's choosing Chill right now. To me. Let's crack open a can. Cheers to Trin. To the US Women, Michelle Kang.
- [10:06]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [10:06]
Landon Donovan
Cheers.
- [10:07]
Tim Howard
Cheers.
- [10:08]
Landon Donovan
Cheers, everyone. We actually get to drink this time. All right, I am going to move on to the elephant in the room.
- [10:18]
Tim Howard
Why everyone came tonight, by the way.
- [10:19]
Landon Donovan
Stop. All right, so there's a lot of chatter in our, what we think is an important soccer universe. My wife reminds me that it's not that important over some comments I made Sunday on the UEFA Nations League final broadcast between Portugal and Spain. For those who don't know, Portugal beat Spain in penalty kicks after the game, there were incredible artistic shots of Portugal celebrating with their fans. Cristiano Ronaldo at 40, crying, Bruno Fernandez crying, players balling. And I was sitting there processing it all. This was a tournament that didn't exist. I don't know, seven, ten years ago, nations. I don't know how long it's been around, but playing for their country meant so much to them. And you can see it in their face. They're crying. These are grown men crying who have accomplished everything. And I said, I can't help but think about some of our players this summer who are on vacation while the national team is struggling. And players want to represent their national team, and some of our guys chose not to. There's a great phrase, never let the facts get in the way of a good story. So the comment I keep hearing and seeing and reading is that, Good message, Landon. But you're the wrong messenger because you also took a sabbatical at one time, a break at one point in your career. I just want to start by saying when I. And you know this, Tim. When I. When I speak about someone or speak about something, I do my research, okay? It means I've either reached out to the player, reached out to their representatives, reached out to people around them, reached out to the team. I talk to people just like you all week to get as much information so that I can make an informed opinion versus, you know, just putting out a tweet or responding emotionally to something. I make mistakes, too, but I try to get as much information as possible and be informed. Unfortunately, most people don't do that, and we live in a society where it's okay to just say something and whatever. Okay, so let me get into, first of all, why I'm the right messenger. I also took a break like some of the players this summer. I know the consequences of that, and we're going to get into that in a minute, big way. So I am. I am the. I am the person probably more than anybody to speak about this. Okay? When I took my break from soccer, and I'm using that word intentionally, I didn't take a break from the national team. I didn't take a break from the Galaxy. I didn't choose club over country or country over club. I took a break from soccer, and at the time, I didn't know if I was ever going to play again. Okay. I was 31, about to be 32. I'd played over 500 professional games, including over 140 for the national team, five Gold Cups, three World Cups. I'd had 15 straight seasons of no longer than four weeks of a break. Okay. I think I deserved to make that decision. That time I was not in my early 20s or my mid-20s deciding not to play for my country. Okay, so that's one next. I. I suffered the consequences of that. Okay? So in the case of some of these players, they're still getting paid by their clubs. In some cases, they played with their club even though they needed a break at the end of the. And chose not to come in for the national team. My. I did the math this morning because I didn't remember me not playing for the Galaxy in those first four months. Cost me a million dollars. This was not a. This was not a decision I wanted to make. This was a decision I had to make. Okay? So I wasn't still getting paid and just decided not. This was a serious decision in a lot of ways. The reason I took the break and I said this on our podcast a few weeks ago, and this is why I urge people, do your homework. Get the facts. Don't just spew out bs. Okay? The reason I took the break was I was. I've been very open in my Life about depression and how it's impacted me. I was on the verge of being broken. Okay. And I don't talk about this publicly. This is not a shameless plug for my book that's coming out next year. But I'm going to talk about this deeply in my book about that time of my life, okay? I was on the verge of being broken. I said on our podcast, if any of these guys have something serious going on with them or their families or whatever, I will apologize. I'll take it back. No problem. The problem is, Tim, none of them. None of them speak, right? We don't. We haven't heard from any of them.
- [14:51]
Tim Howard
Right.
- [14:51]
Landon Donovan
So we don't know what's going on. We don't know the reality.
- [14:54]
Tim Howard
We're just.
- [14:55]
Landon Donovan
We're just assuming. And, you know, we've done the information or we've done our checking behind the scenes, and we know that from what we know there's nothing serious going on. So we just assumed they just didn't want to play for the national team. And, you know, look, I'll get off my soapbox, but I thought it was important to say that the context matters. It's not apples to apples, completely different. And I am the right person to speak about this.
- [15:17]
Tim Howard
You are. And mental health is important. So big credit to you, Rambo Paul, for you, for being so open and so honest. I obviously know that as your friend and oftentimes on unfiltered soccer, there's a good cop and a bad cop. And, you know, Landon likes to play the good cop, so I'll assume the natural role of bad cop. And look, we continually talk about consequences and culture. And when you make decisions, good or bad, for whatever the reason you make those decisions, there are consequences to it. Your words sparked criticism. Players on the U.S. men's national team came to the defense of Christian Pulisic and others, which is what you should do, by the way. If you're a teammate, that's what you should do. Weston McKinney, and I'm quoting, obviously, none of us take for granted playing for the national team. None of us want to lose games. We all want to compete. For me, it's a little bit. I won't say sad, which I think he is saying sad. But as a former national team player, I think a national team player in the pool, previously or present, should be trying to build and say something directly to the person. Now, let me stop there. I am not a mentor to any of these players, and I'm not any of their friends. I Got paid handsomely to play soccer when I was playing. I now get paid handsomely to talk about the game. That's my job. I have no desire to go into the tunnel and shake hands with them and be rah rah. We have a job to do, and U.S. soccer needs to be held accountable for this. And when he goes on to say, I obviously don't feel like my body is always in the right condition, if I'm able to do it at 100%, I'll do it. If you feel like you're risking injury, it's better to let somebody else go in. That's completely 100%, that's false. And end quote, that's false.
- [16:58]
Landon Donovan
Well, you're always risking injury.
- [17:00]
Tim Howard
You're always risking injury. But if you leave the door open and this is where culture comes in, if you leave the door open for somebody else, you risk losing your opportunity. This current team knows they can take the door off the hinges. No one's going to walk through and take their opportunity.
- [17:20]
Landon Donovan
It was shown last night.
- [17:21]
Tim Howard
It was shown last night. The culture has been set. You know, and I give the example, and we can talk, we can argue whether this is stupid or not, but I give the example. I took a year off, right? There was consequences to that. I played in the game. I snapped my groin. I never should have played. But Jurgen Klinsmann said a month before I regained my number one spot. So was I going to just not play and let someone take my position? The issue becomes the decisions that they make are garnered by the culture that's created. Eddie Johnson, again, given these quotes, Eddie Johnson, who is a teammate of ours for a long time, teammate of ours, praised you, but then said, again, you're not the messenger. Because one of the things he said is MLS can't compare with a European soccer career in terms of workload and travel. That's easy. MLS is no good. Europe's amazing, right? That's what everyone pretends to say. It's a lie. Let me give you an example. You played at LA Galaxy. I played at Everton for a time, right? In a given period, okay, you could have two away games. That means you could go LA to Chicago, Louisiana to New York. Any away game that I played in, I was only traveling two hours, okay? So when it was time at the end of the month to go bus or a train. On a bus or a train, yeah. When it was time to go into the national team, you flew from LA to Miami. I flew from Manchester to Miami. Ain't a whole lot of difference There, folks, when you start to calculate those miles, in fact, you log more miles playing in the MLS consistently than I did. So the workload argument is a silly one. It's a silly one. There are consequences. You talked about taking time out because you needed time out. There were consequences to that. You ended up.
- [18:53]
Landon Donovan
I missed. I missed a World Cup.
- [18:54]
Tim Howard
You missed a World Cup. The manager. There was no better players on the team than you. Certainly not in the starting 11, certainly not in the squad. And he didn't pick you because he didn't think you were committed. That was a consequence of your decision. I decided after the World cup in 2014 to take a break. I was a number one by a country mile. I lost my spot the following summer in Copa America. That was a decision that I made. You know, when Weston McKinney, who, by the way, Weston, has a really good agent. Dear friend of ours, Corey Gibbs, shout out to Wasserman. I know he's advising him. Well, the problem is someone else somewhere along the way has been ill advising him because his comments allow him to have that door wide open. And it's a. And for me, it's a big issue because what ends up happening is. He talked about our failure in 2017. You weren't there. I was part of the team. 2017. He talked about. He talked about. These guys are talking about taking a break. They failed. They failed. I own that. I implore Weston McKinney to go scour the Internet and look for one clapback that I made on social media. 1. I'm sorry to the fans, one interview where I gave any excuse. I wore it. Those were the consequences. There was no climb back. And by the way, on record, the people talking about me failing couldn't hold a candle to my career. They couldn't. So. So in those moments, he's. He's saying. He's saying to us, yeah, yeah, yeah, but you failed. Sure. I owned it. You owned it. There was consequences. And this is the issue for me. It's, it's. It's the. It's the consequences of your decisions. Now we have to. You talked about the elephant room. We have to address Christian Pulisic's father, Mark Pulisic. We now know after this week that he is a spokesman for the Pulisic squad. Okay. And my issue. And we talk about good cop and bad cop, right? You're an easy target. Because he mentioned, and let me not misquote him, this guy, because he tagged you talking about commitment. Look in the mirror. Something. Something else, which I won't say and call names out, or are you afraid the next time you want an interview, you'll get rejected? Here's what's happened. So it's important that we put the story straight. Kristen Pulisic and Weston McKinney have all been asked to come on our show. They. They refuse. I mentioned something about Christian Pulisic in the media. He responded to me on direct message on Instagram. He sent me a note. He said, I thought you were out of order. I didn't like what you said. I responded, you may or may not have a point. Give me a call. Here's my number. Let's discuss it. If we disagree, we disagree. Here's my number. So for his dad to come out and attack you and basically say, you're not getting an interview. We're not getting an interview from Kristen Pulisic, not because of you, but because of me. And so, again, I'm happy to have these conversations. I'm comfortable having uncomfortable conversations. If Mark Pulisic wants to text me, it's a New York number. His son has it in his direct messages. He can text me. There's no issue. We don't have an issue. Again, as I mentioned, we're not mentors to these kids. We're not best friends. We're not trying to be. What we're trying to do is hold them accountable. We know what the standard looks like, both on the success side and the failure. Okay, Again, Tyler Adams comes out today, a player who I love and respect. And by the way, I respect Weston, I respect Christian Pulisic.
- [22:15]
Landon Donovan
We respect all of that.
- [22:16]
Tim Howard
I think they're really good. I think they're really good players. Tyler Adams comes out today and says, as I quote, we don't talk about that internally as a group. The noise on the outside is a noise on the outside. I think we need to focus on what we need to do as a group to continue to build. Now, it's important. And we talked about this before the show, just for everybody here and at home. The noise on the outside is so freaking loud on the inside that in any team. And it's so loud. And you know how we know it's loud? Because it just got announced today that Christian Pulisic is going on a talk show tomorrow to address this. Well, who knows what he's going to address, right? But the timing of it sounds really interesting. So my rebuttal to Tyler would be, I think the noise on the outside is really loud on the inside. And we know that because we've been a Part of it. Right. We like to come out in the media and try and keep our head above water and say we don't hear it. We always hear it.
- [23:10]
Landon Donovan
Yeah. Well, look, thanks for all that. And this is what should have happened weeks ago. Yes. Right.
- [23:16]
Tim Howard
Yes.
- [23:17]
Landon Donovan
Christian Yunus, Anthony Robinson, come out and tell us, you guys all want to know why do you not want to come play for your country?
- [23:25]
Tim Howard
And.
- [23:26]
Landon Donovan
And again, I'm going to say this a million times. If there is something serious going on, I apologize. Okay. I don't have that information. So I have to assume you just didn't want to come in. And for whatever reason, maybe we'll find out tomorrow from Christian, but we have to assume that that's the case. This should have happened weeks ago. None of this would have been an issue.
- [23:46]
Tim Howard
But the interest. The interesting thing is we can probably talk about, like, snippets of time, but workload is one that sticks in my mind because that's what's being talked about. Right. There's fatigue, there's workload. I draw your attention back to 2007. Right. So from 2007 to 2011, let me give you a quick overview. 2007, we won the Gold cup in Chicago. 2008, I don't remember. I think was probably World cup qualifying. Summer. Right. 2009, went to the Confederations cup final, leading at halftime against Brazil. That's another final. We lost. 2010 World cup, finished first in the group with England. 2011 Gold cup final, we got smacked around by Mexico. It was horrific. My point is, over the course of five years, there was four major tournaments plus World cup qualifying. We get fatigue. We. And by the way, probably didn't miss but one or two games for our club. We get it. That's. It's part of the process. Right. But right now for U.S. soccer, we wouldn't be having this conversation, by the way, if this was one or two players. There's a lot of players missing this summer.
- [24:47]
Landon Donovan
The pattern.
- [24:48]
Tim Howard
It's a pattern. And that comes. That comes from the leadership group. We talked about it the other week. Within our group, if he was pulling out of a camp, one of us would be texting, like, am I not seeing you? Like, there was a peer pressure there. Right. We could talk about whether that's good or bad, but it's good for the success of a team in terms of building culture. So this is a bigger problem because it's a lot of players. It's not one singular instance.
- [25:10]
Landon Donovan
Okay. A lot there. Let's take a quick break. When we come back. We've got three thoughts on some of the bigger picture stuff going on with U.S. soccer and, and the questions pertaining to, certainly the men's team right here on Unfiltered Soccer Live with Landon and Tim, presented by our friends at Volkswagen. Be right. All right, Timmy, we're back. Us LNT on USMNT continued here. Let's talk about some of the guys, other guys who are not here. One that raised a lot of eyebrows right away because he came into camp and then left abruptly was Serginio des. So U.S. soccer put out a statement said the technical, medical and high performance staff had done a series of evaluations this week on all the players in camp. In the case of Sergino, we determined the best decision is for the player to have an individualized training program for the summer so he can focus on being fully recovered. It's a bit of a weird one because he was six or seven games into his recovery and then he came into camp and they decided that it was best for him. Now, in fairness, when you come back from acl, which I never had to, they do say getting that sharpness and that last few pieces back is hard. And I think from U.S. soccer standpoint, they felt like with all the other players in camp, that needed to be the focus because they're trying to win the Gold Cup.
- [26:43]
Tim Howard
Sure.
- [26:43]
Landon Donovan
And he wasn't going to get enough time and he needed individual time to continue recovering.
- [26:48]
Tim Howard
Right. Because the medical staff is hands on with the, with the players that are playing. Yeah, he needs. Yeah. Look, if he's played six or seven games for his club, I haven't had an ACL myself, thankfully. Naturally, when you come back and every, every injury, every ACL is slightly different. Right. So when you come back from an acl, usually you get yourself on the grass. You have to do block tackles. You certainly don't get put into a club game if you're not fit and healthy and strong recovered. But if the medical staff is saying that he needs more time, we essentially at this point in time have to go with that and trust that. So obviously he's a, he's a big player for, for, for the US Men. So hopefully he can take the summer, get fit, then get straight back into preseason training with his club, big, big year, and then the rest takes care of itself.
- [27:33]
Landon Donovan
Yeah. If we want, if we're going to be successful next year, he's got to.
- [27:35]
Tim Howard
Be a part of it 100%.
- [27:36]
Landon Donovan
Let's dig into the goalkeepers. Not me, you. So Zach, Stefan also, unfortunately, Got injured. It's that knee, right, that knee again.
- [27:44]
Tim Howard
Well, it's his other knee. Yeah.
- [27:46]
Landon Donovan
Okay, so believe is meniscus. Yeah. So like you won't say it, but I can say it because goalkeepers never criticize goalkeepers. I didn't think Matt Turner was great, to be honest. Now in fairness, he got battered. Yeah, yeah, right. So like there was only so much he could do, but one or two of them probably could do better. Where are you in right now in the goalkeeping situation is this, I mean, I think his move to Leon looks like it's going to be good.
- [28:13]
Tim Howard
Yeah, you tell people lies all the time. I, I, I might, I might have been a card carrying member of the goalkeepers innovation, but I burned it because anytime I wasn't playing, I wanted the goalkeeper in front of me to get absolutely pumped so I can get my position back. So I never really.
- [28:25]
Landon Donovan
I'm saying other goalkeepers.
- [28:26]
Tim Howard
No, no, listen, I be straight up with you. I mean, Zach, Stefan, it's difficult, man. I'm bummed for him because he's got to get the surgeon. Meniscus, you're thinking, you know, from people I spoke to four to six weeks, look, that still gives him ample amount of time to recover and then on the backside of that getting to the back end of the summer and playoffs.
- [28:44]
Landon Donovan
And so, but this felt like it was kind of his chance.
- [28:48]
Tim Howard
It felt like it was his chance because Matt had him in plan. And I've always said we, we've got, we've got one and a half start starting goalkeepers. If both Matt and Zach are playing, there's a good battle. If one's not playing then, then for me it's an obvious choice. The other, the other should be the number one. So Matt's coming off a year at Crystal palace where he doesn't really play at all. Right. So Zach's starting to find form with Colorado doing really, really well, having a good season and last year had a good season too. So I felt like this was his opportunity. Played well in January, left Pochettino with a good taste in his mouth. So for me, I just thought this was, this was his chance. Okay. He gets injured. Patrick Schulte also injured. For me, that's if you're saying who are the best three goalkeepers for me, nailed on. It's Zach, Matt and Patrick Schulte. As your number three, Matt comes in. Look, I can't be overly critical because as a goalkeeper in that game, Jesus. I mean there's just some of these chances you can, you can say you could do better on one or two, but when you're getting pumped for four in the first half, that's a problem with, with, with the team. So I think it's a good opportunity for Matt. He's got it looks like the move to Leon is going to happen. That's going to be incredible. I believe they're moving their other goalkeeper on, so I believe he's going to start straight away. If he can put together a season where he's playing in 30, 35 games, he puts himself in a really, really good position to play at the World cup again. How does Zach recover? How does he finish the season and start next season? It's an interesting one.
- [30:13]
Landon Donovan
So given just moving on from that. So given what we saw, not the first game of these friendlies, but the second game, if you're a Tanner Testman. Yeah, Sergeant, you guys who have been in camp but now didn't get called in, Joe Scally, are you now thinking, like, maybe he just doesn't like me or maybe he wants to see other players? I guess. But when you watch last night, I'm like, these guys are way off it.
- [30:40]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [30:41]
Landon Donovan
I mean, way off it.
- [30:42]
Tim Howard
Look, I think, I think one of the, I think one of the things that I try and do, and I've said this on the podcast, like, jokingly, but it's serious. I like to take what people say and then filter it and then give it back to you. When a manager says, I, I need to see other players, I've never heard, like, if a manager would have said, if I was playing really well and the manager would have said to me, yeah, but I want to see other players, I instantly would have gone, okay, this guy doesn't like me. Right. I mean, you look at Josh Sargent, whether he's your cup of tea or not, we don't produce brilliant goal scorers in this country. You scored 15 goals in 28 starts, 32 appearances. I mean, that's nearly a goal every two.
- [31:19]
Landon Donovan
Like, wow, that's a good return.
- [31:21]
Tim Howard
That's a great return. Yeah, we don't have, we don't have a lot of goal scorers. So that would tell me I'm not really in his plans. And again, you start to, you start to look at this team. It's a, it's a stripped down squad. We just talked about how many absentees there are. If you're Testman, if you're Sergeant, if you're a couple of these other guys, you're like, I can't even get in that Squad. That's a. That's a problem for me.
- [31:42]
Landon Donovan
Yeah.
- [31:42]
Tim Howard
Yeah. So I think. I think it. For me, this more is Pochettino saying, you're kind of on the outside looking in here.
- [31:49]
Landon Donovan
So, big picture, Gold Cup. I've been thinking a lot about this. Why is it. And I honestly, a lot of times, I have an answer for this right now. I don't. Why is it that the Gold cup has diminished in value to the players? Because I don't think U.S. soccer thinks it's any less important. Mauricio Pochettino, in fairness to him, like, he might not have even known what the Gold cup was until six months ago. But why is it diminished for the player? Like, why do they not take it? Some of our best memories, Tim, are going out in Chicago after the final, taking the trophy out and drinking all night and partying with the guys because we had just done something together. And why did these guys not value it the same way? I can't figure it out.
- [32:33]
Tim Howard
I think. I think I haven't figured out. So this is going to sound really odd given that we can't win the Nations League recently in some of our results. The best competition for U.S. soccer, the U.S. men, is not in CONCACAF, by the way. It's outside of that, Right?
- [32:50]
Landon Donovan
Sure.
- [32:51]
Tim Howard
So when you have Nations League, you start to fill up all these windows. Over the course of a year, you have 10 fixture lists of fixture windows, right? And so you have to play your Nations League. There was a time, right, we had a coaching transition, and Bob said, pack your bags. We're going to Europe. Every single fixture date, we're going to Poland, we're going to Italy. You're about to be really uncomfortable, Right? So we might have lost those games, but he put us in environments that were tough, man. They were rugged, and we had to survive. We weren't playing some of the lesser teams in concacaf, right, where it's a breeze, we don't have to play. You were going into Europe and you were playing some tough games. It doesn't. U.S. soccer couldn't schedule a friendly in Spain on a Thursday or Friday. They couldn't do it. They have a Nations League game. So that's. I think. I also think when the entrance to the Confederations cup, which we all know is a huge deal, right, because it's the. Yeah, it's the dry run of the World Cup. When entrance to the Confederations cup was winning a particular Gold cup, well, US Soccer said no.
- [33:49]
Landon Donovan
Every. Every country in concacaf, we got to win this.
- [33:51]
Tim Howard
Mexico, Canada, we got to go to Confederations Cup. It's money, it's glory. It's an opportunity. You know, we, we used it. And just so you all, internally, we made a couple Confederations cup and each coach was like, we, this is going to be a dry run for next summer. We're going to give you the same cadence of days off. We're going to place the same amount of matches. We, we're going to do our substitutions patterns the same. So it was an opportunity to really kind of. Which is what this Gold cup is. It's an opportunity as a dry run.
- [34:16]
Landon Donovan
Should have been, should have been, should have been. Correct. Right, okay, fair enough. Okay. So I think a lot of you guys saw. We did, we went to Chicago. Yeah, that feels like three months ago, two weeks ago.
- [34:28]
Tim Howard
Oh, my God.
- [34:28]
Landon Donovan
We interviewed Mauricio Pochettino. It was really interesting. We had, we, we spent some time with him off camera. We spoke to him on camera. I'm looking at this all Tim now with a different lens after these last few weeks. I really am. And he said, I think the most interesting thing he said to us was, he said, when I got here, some of the players said, I really hope Pochettino changes the culture. And he said, well, in his broken English, what it means to change the culture, what it means. And I think he was surprised that he got here and people expected him to dictate the culture and change the culture. And he said, that's not my job. My job is to come here and coach the team. And I just feel like one, why, why does he feel that way? Two, why do the players feel that way? And culture, for people who don't understand culture comes from inside a locker room. The coach has an impact on that, absolutely. But the culture comes from inside the locker room. Let me use this example. When I went to Everton for the first time, we went away to Arsenal my first week. We play the game, we're up 2, 0, Arsenal, tie draw the game at the end. 2, 2.
- [35:47]
Tim Howard
This is a story about me.
- [35:48]
Landon Donovan
It's going to be. So we come back into the locker room and I'm like, wow, it's 2, 2 at Arsenal. This is amazing, right? And before Moyes even got into the locker room, you, Cahill Neville, were absolutely ripping the team a new A hole. Because that was not acceptable. We're up to nothing at Arsenal. We need to win the game. I was like, whoa. Moyes came in, he didn't even say a word. He didn't have to. You guys held us accountable and that's what. That's what great teams do. They hold each other accountable inside. That's not Pochetti. I agree with him. That's not his job.
- [36:21]
Tim Howard
Yeah, yeah, no. Well said. And you. And just so you all know, we did the interview with Mauricio Pochettino, and prior to. We actually had a really nice lunch with him and one of his assistants. One of the great. One of the great things about someone where English is their second language. And so when I played in Everton, my best friend was French, right? And the great thing about the Premier League is there's so many foreign players, right? So you get all these different languages. When English is your second language, you try ultra hard to get your point across, right. And it become. Your point actually becomes way more clear.
- [36:54]
Landon Donovan
Agreed.
- [36:54]
Tim Howard
Than if some Scousers talking to you, you know, and he's trying to explain it. So my best friend was French. And everything he said to me was like crystal clear. Right? And Pochettino was the same way. And he talked about culture and he keeps talking, banging on about culture. Like, what is culture? Like, I'm not. I'm not here to change that. And what he's trying to say is he has to evaluate. He doesn't have time, by the way. He wasn't hired at a moment in time where he can put culture in.
- [37:22]
Landon Donovan
And they're not together every day. You can't change culture if you're not there every day. I mean, you got.
- [37:26]
Tim Howard
And so the point was the culture at U.S. soccer has been set way before he got there. I would. I would even say. And by the way, before anyone says this is sour grapes, I can. I can assure you it's not what US Soccer tried to do in the aftermath of us not you. I won't put you in that category of myself and my teammates at the time not qualifying for 2018 is. It was such a. And this happens with nations, they don't qualify. It was such a black stain on U.S. soccer. They went, poof. Get out. Get out. Michael Bradley, Clint Dempsey, Josie Outdoor, Tim Howard, get out. New generation, right? They branded it differently and it was great, right? Because it gave you something. It was shiny new toy over here. Don't look at that disaster. Which it was. But what ended up happening was these players then got thrust into the spotlight to be leaders. By the way, not everyone's a leader, right? You're not a born leader. You have to learn how that. You have to have older players in the dressing room and you have to learn how it works. They were like, no get those guys out and get this new generation in. And they've had to learn on the fly and create a culture, but they've had to create, like, characteristics of what the team is supposed to look like, but they're doing it on their own. And so Pochettino comes in in 2024, 2025, and he's. And he's basically saying, this has been in place for six years. I can't change. I've got to evaluate talent. I've got to pick, you know, who the best players are. I got to figure out what my tactics look like. You can't change culture. That culture's already been set. So that comes from US Soccer allowing some of these things to happen.
- [39:01]
Landon Donovan
Yeah, Agreed. All right. One year out, Tim. Today, right? Today.
- [39:06]
Tim Howard
Is that right?
- [39:06]
Landon Donovan
You're out from the World Cup. Wow. Wow. Obviously, a lot can change in a year. Okay. I think we're all hopeful. A lot changes in a year. I think about this big picture. I don't enjoy, just to be crystal clear, I don't enjoy having national team players pissed off at me. You probably like it, but it's not enjoyable. Right. Like, it's not like, I go home and I'm like, great, I pissed him off. But we do feel a responsibility to make this whole thing better.
- [39:39]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [39:40]
Landon Donovan
Like, we really do, and we always have, and people before us did the same and before us. And so when you don't see that same level of commitment, it's bothersome. So I guess my question is, can this change? Is. Is this ship sailed or can this change? And, you know, like, for example, Christian's now going to speak publicly tomorrow. Right. That was not an accident. He would not. He didn't have this planned for three weeks. And, you know, it's a response to all of this. Right. And that's good.
- [40:14]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [40:14]
Landon Donovan
Right. Should have done it weeks ago, but that's good. Right. Like, let's start helping Christian and the team get better.
- [40:21]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [40:21]
Landon Donovan
Can this. I guess, can this change or no?
- [40:24]
Tim Howard
I can't believe asked me that publicly. Yeah. Yeah. I think I'd like to. You know, these glasses aren't rose tinted, but I. I wish they were for a minute. Yeah, I hope so. I hope so. To do well in a World cup, you've got to. You've got to win. You got to put some wins together. One of those. Two of those have to be a really significant win. This team doesn't have a signature win to speak of. The current form doesn't fill me with a ton of hope. What I need to see me. What we all need to see. We're fans of this team. What we need to see is a collection of our best players. Yes, injuries are going to happen and different things. A collection of our best players post Gold cup together as often as possible. You know, to see what they're like when. When the going gets tough, when they're down 1 nil, when they have a lead laid on our players digging in. We need to see what that looks like as a collective group. I don't know if we have seen that. In fact, if I cast my mind back to 2022, when I would do interviews or speak about what was to come in that World Cup, I said I. My worry is that the Burhalters best team hadn't been on the field together enough. And here we are four years later.
- [41:44]
Landon Donovan
You're right. So that was the sentiment.
- [41:46]
Tim Howard
So look, I think naturally, because we want to give the team its kudos and we want to be forward thinking and excited. Sure. But the fact of the matter is, let's be blunt. This team has a lot to prove. This team has a lot to prove to a lot of people. So the jury's out for me. I hope so. Would love to talk. I've been. Where's Pasadena? Which way? Any locals know? That's amazing. So I was behind the goal when Marcelo Balboa did the bicycle kick in the Rose bowl and just missed. And I saw the US players celebrating that day. We ended up winning on an own goal. Right. I was, I don't know, 94. I was 15 years old. U.S. soccer, I was. I was with one of the youth national teams. I was there. I was in France because we were at a tournament in Europe and US Soccer brought us to one or two of the games. Like this can change a generation. This can change for. And, and, and quite frankly, what I hope is. And when we start to look at World Cups over the last 20 years, the home nation gets a massive lift. Gets a massive lift from playing at home. I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's something underwater, but the home nation, and they don't always win it. That's not what I'm saying. But man, they have a good run based on the momentum. So I'm hoping. Fingers crossed.
- [42:55]
Landon Donovan
This is why, Tim, this summer is so important, because you don't just show up and get the lift. It's impossible. You have to build it. There's been a new coach, bunch of new players. We still. You say this. And you're right at the end of the Gold cup, and it is more true now than it's ever been. Mauricio Pochettino will have no clue what his best 11 is. Zero.
- [43:17]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [43:17]
Landon Donovan
Zero. And in fact, it's probably more cloudy now. Right. Honestly. And, you know, that's. That's a challenge, and that's a problem. I. Look in 94, Tim, I was 12. I went to one game at the Rose Bowl. Argentina against Romania. Until that point, all I did was play soccer. I knew nothing about soccer writ large.
- [43:38]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [43:38]
Landon Donovan
I didn't. Couldn't watch it on tv. No Internet. No. Like, I knew nothing.
- [43:41]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [43:42]
Landon Donovan
And I was like, whoa, this is. This is real. 100,000 people cheering. I was like, jesus.
- [43:49]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [43:49]
Landon Donovan
You think about next summer, either through a long run into the tournament. Long run through the tournament, or some iconic special moments, you can change the course of U.S. soccer forever.
- [44:01]
Tim Howard
Sure.
- [44:01]
Landon Donovan
And that is why we get so passionate about this when we see guys who don't recognize that and realize it. And by the way, you can be a megastar.
- [44:13]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [44:13]
Landon Donovan
If the Algeria goal had happened in America.
- [44:16]
Tim Howard
Oh, my God.
- [44:17]
Landon Donovan
Well, I wouldn't be talking to you right now, but you know what I mean?
- [44:21]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [44:21]
Landon Donovan
Like, you can change the course of your life forever. Many people's lives, tens of millions of Americans inspiring new fans. Take it seriously.
- [44:30]
Tim Howard
Yeah.
- [44:31]
Landon Donovan
Take it seriously.
- [44:31]
Tim Howard
Yeah. This is going to be the biggest World cup in the history of soccer. Numbers wise, in terms of eyeballs. Not even close. By a million miles. Like, the opportunity that we have as a country, but also the players have is enormous.
- [44:46]
Landon Donovan
It's priceless. All right, one more break. When we come back, we're going to take your questions, start thinking about them, don't be shy. And yes, Tim will sign everything you want right here at BMO Stadium. Thanks for being great hosts, even though you're not my preferred team in la. Right here on Unfiltered Soccer Live with Landon and Tim, presented by Volkswagen. Stay right there.
- [45:24]
Tim Howard
Okay, it's time for the Fan connection, presented by AT&T. Every week, we invite you, the listener, to engage with us. Submit your questions, good and bad. We've shown that we enjoy a good debate. The best way to grow the game of soccer in America is keep asking questions, keep talking about the sport we love. At, AT and T. Connecting changes everything. And on us. Lnt our connections with you help us grow the game. Now, normally, Jordan pops up on the screen at this point. We got a little Bruce Almighty, Morgan Freeman style today. She's disappointed. She's not getting the airtime that she.
- [45:54]
Landon Donovan
So rightfully deserves, but she's been angling for it for weeks.
- [45:57]
C
They're lying to you.
- [45:58]
Tim Howard
Do not listen to this. Welcome in Jordan. How are you?
- [46:00]
C
I'm great, guys. How are you? This is amazing.
- [46:03]
Landon Donovan
How's your anxiety level right now?
- [46:06]
C
High.
- [46:06]
Landon Donovan
High.
- [46:08]
Tim Howard
Well, good. It looked like we had, we had some. We had a lot of questions.
- [46:11]
Landon Donovan
A lot of questions.
- [46:12]
Tim Howard
I mean, this is the most important part anyway.
- [46:13]
C
We have a lot of questions. Okay, so there were two people who asked kind of similar questions. So we're going to sort of group them together. So where is Scott? Scott, give the guys a wave. And then Nicholas, can you also give the guys a wave, please? Okay, so Scott asked you guys, in any other country, when a four nil loss happens, oh boy, the fans call for the head of the manager. Basically, how many more chances will Potch get before we have to move on? And Nicholas asked, if the US Crashes out of the Gold cup, should Potch be fired?
- [46:53]
Landon Donovan
Go ahead, Tim.
- [46:57]
Tim Howard
No, and look, I don't, I don't think it's a great question. I think everyone's.
- [47:01]
Landon Donovan
A great question.
- [47:02]
Tim Howard
I think everyone's either asking it on the surface or kind of subliminally. There's not enough time. There's not enough time to fire a coach and rehire one. To fire Pochettino now would be an admission of a mistake by US Soccer. And quite frankly, we've said today, Pochettino's a really good manager. He hasn't had players at his disposal for a long time. Look, I get there's been four losses in a row and sure, we can talk about whether that's down to the manager. We saw it a bunch at Manchester United this year. Ruben Amram, who I think is a really good manager, couldn't win a game. He was trying to implement his style and he was force feeding that. And people said, well, should he go? No, I think Pochettino is going nowhere. Also, there's, there's 6 million reasons why he's also not going anywhere because you have to pay him. There's logistics. You have to pay him. You have to go get another manager who you think can do a better job. And yet it's. He's going nowhere. So this is this. Nor do I think he should at the moment.
- [48:03]
Landon Donovan
So, yeah, here's the problem. The problem is time. The problem is he thought he had a group of players that he could count on and depend on. And over the course of six months, eight months, they've Thrown a wrench in that with their performances.
- [48:23]
Tim Howard
Sure.
- [48:24]
Landon Donovan
And so now he has no idea who's going to show up, who's committed, who is proud to put on their. He has no idea. And for him, coming from Argentina, sure. I watched Argentina, Colombia, the other day. That's not a soccer game. That is not a soccer game. These are some of the best players in the world. And it is just. I'm not using this intentionally, but, like, it's war, right? And so for him, he must be scratching his head going, this is not what I signed up for. Now, to answer your question, if he were to walk away, he's walking away from a lot of money, and it's a stain on him. U.S. soccer fires him. Ton of money. And now you got to hire a new coach, and now you have, whatever, eight months, nine months, ten months to prepare. I mean, it would be. It would just be an unmitigated disaster. Now, if they go crashing out of the Gold cup in the group stage, I think there's a conversation to be had.
- [49:27]
Tim Howard
Well, let me say this. Let me say this. If the worst happens, and that's what we're talking about, the worst happening, he's a good manager with a really great reputation. Right. And if in the summer, there's a European club who says, we have a lot of money, we want a top manager who can understand how to manage top players in Europe. And. And also, as an aside, things went horrific for the US There is a possibility there, sure. But I think it's a very, very small one.
- [49:55]
C
All right, where is Nicole? All right, Nicole said the U.S. women's National Team was disconnected, disjointed, the culture was really poor. And then they brought in Emma Hayes, and everything seems to have turned around. What's the difference between Emma Hayes and Pochettino? Why are her ideas working so well and his aren't?
- [50:21]
Landon Donovan
It's a great question. It really is. I. I'm. I'm gonna think about this as I'm talking. It's possible. Okay? And this is. This is just my opinion, and this is me deciphering a lot of things and a lot of information I've taken in both what I've seen and what I've heard behind the scenes. It's possible that Pochettino is an amazing coach and manager, but not for this group of players. That is a possibility. Conversely, Emma Hayes seems like the perfect coach manager for that group of players. And I can't put my finger on exactly why or what, but I'll tell you something. About Emma Hayes. I talked to her when I was coaching the Wave. I talked to her a few times. She is clear. She has clear direction that she wants to go. She takes no prisoners. Nobody's dictating to her what's going on. She's made it clear that you either do this and you perform this way or you're not coming in and she doesn't care who you are. And so that has been clear from day one with her, and that has really resonated with. With that group.
- [51:35]
Tim Howard
Yeah. And you have. You have that insight. Look, for me, it's very simple. The US Women have the best players in the world, okay? Which, by the way, makes the stakes higher, right? So when Emma comes in and takes a team over, it's not like you have to get better. You have to go to the Olympics and win. You have to go to the World cup and win, right? So the stakes are higher, but she's able to take the best players in the world and stamp her authority on it. And the women know that. The women are very, very clever. They know they're the best, and so it hurts them. It's a gut punch to the women when they're not the best, when they drop below number one in the world or they don't want to go medal or World Cup. So that's the simple answer. But she's done an incredible job because I think you do have to go in there, particularly with the success they've had, and go. I still want to have success in a very similar vein, but I've got to do it my way.
- [52:22]
Landon Donovan
So, yeah, great question.
- [52:24]
C
Where is Misa with the.
- [52:26]
Tim Howard
Tim Howard, Give me a round of applause.
- [52:28]
Landon Donovan
No, no, no, no, no.
- [52:31]
C
I would just like to mention that I'm going to ask an Everton question and I'm not going to break out into hives while I'm doing it. It's fine.
- [52:37]
Tim Howard
She's a Liverpool fan. Just in case she's a red.
- [52:40]
C
Misa would like to know what is your opinion on the new Everton Stadium name, which, for those of you in the audience who don't know, is Hill Dickinson Stadium.
- [52:47]
Tim Howard
Rolls right off the tongue. Listen, it's. I think it's important.
- [52:53]
Landon Donovan
Is that a sponsor?
- [52:54]
Tim Howard
Yeah. Yeah. Look, money makes the world go around. In the world of football and, you know, as. As Everton fans or any. Any Premier League or club fan, the more money you have, the more assets you can buy. And so you need to bring sponsored dollars in to get that done. That wasn't a question. You asked. How do I Feel about the name. It'll do for. It'll do for now, I suppose.
- [53:15]
Landon Donovan
No, you're right, though.
- [53:16]
Tim Howard
It.
- [53:16]
Landon Donovan
It cares. It's like if it makes your club better and you can buy better players, then who cares? The best is the lower leagues in England when they've got, like, around the edge of the States, like Tom's Fish and Chips Shop and like Dick's Lumber Yard. And like, it's so great.
- [53:31]
C
Where is Kelvin? In the room.
- [53:33]
Tim Howard
Oh, yes.
- [53:34]
Landon Donovan
Love it. Beautiful shirt, Donovan. On the back. No. Come on, man.
- [53:39]
C
Okay, Kelvin's got one question for each of you. So for Landon, he'd like to know about your favorite goal against Mexico. And for Tim, what did the first. Your first ever win at Azteca mean to you?
- [53:55]
Landon Donovan
Love that. The one in the World cup. So in 2002, I scored a header against Mexico. Yes. Thank you. The reason is, is it is entirely possible. I don't think it's likely, but for the next hundred years it's possible we don't play Mexico again in a World cup. And we can always, always, always hold that over their head. So.
- [54:17]
Tim Howard
Incredible. Yeah, that's an interesting game. I think it was 2012, went to Azteca and won. And Azteca is one of the greatest, I mean, scariest places, but one of the greatest places I've ever played. And there's like plaques on the wall as you walk down this concrete tunnel, and it shows the record against all the teams. We never won there. And it's, it's, it's. It's quite fitting that there's this episode that we're talking about this, because I remember it wasn't our strongest team going in and I was in. I was in Europe somewhere. I can't remember where we were. We were like off season training and flew to Mexico. And I remember, like, it was never in my mind to be like, our best team isn't there. So therefore I don't want to be there. The opportunity, now, the opportunity to fail was great too, but the opportunity to get the first ever win at Azteca was like, let's have at it. If we lose, four or five nil, sure. But the opportunity to be the first, it was huge. It was an amazing game.
- [55:09]
Landon Donovan
Well said.
- [55:12]
C
Okay, I think we have time for one more. This is a really great question. I cannot wait to hear your answer to this. So we're see in the room there in the back.
- [55:23]
Landon Donovan
Oh, that's helpful.
- [55:24]
Tim Howard
It's going.
- [55:25]
C
So C would like to know if we, the American soccer fans, prioritize our attention and our money on the US Men's national team, mls, the USL soccer here in this country. Instead of pouring our money into Premier League teams and La Liga teams and Syria teams, can we influence the growth, the rate of growth compared to the growth that we. That some of the European leagues and teams?
- [55:52]
Landon Donovan
You mean you as a, as an individual, what you spend your money on or you're saying total the ecosystem? I think the short answer is yes. Right. Like as Tim says, money dictates everything. You, as a consumer, you make choices every day. Right? Now, part of. Part of being on this side of it that we were on and part of being U.S. soccer and the players is that's a responsibility. So this happened late in my career. I became acutely aware that fans were spending hundreds and hundreds of dollars to come watch me play. Not me, but the team and me. And it kind of hit me one day because I was like, I have an obligation to them to play well, to play hard, to entertain. This is an obligation. This is not. And I wish it had happened earlier. I wish I had realized it earlier. But it doesn't mean I just get to like, ho hum around the field like you're paying hard earned money. And I see. And I'm a fan now of sports too. And when I go, I'm like, Jesus, my kid wants to go to a Padre game and it's like $600 out the door. Right. And if someone's just kind of run into first base slowly, I'm like, hold on a minute, man. You know what I mean? So I think there's an immense obligation and I think that's magnified and exacerbated when it's for your national team. I really do. Because there's so much more at stake. So, yes, to answer your question. But it needs to be reciprocated and you need to enjoy what you see. And if not, you have every reason to be pissed off. Off. We are as fam. Pissed off right now. And that's okay.
- [57:28]
Tim Howard
Yeah. I mean, I think when I look at the other side of that coin from not a personal standpoint, but the overall ecosystem in U.S. soccer or in American soccer, I should say, nobody plays ball together. Everyone's separate. MLS is separate from USL and usl, women and nwsl. And everyone's different. They like to say that it falls under the same pyramid. It doesn't. No one. No one's playing together. No, no. You know, usl, USL is going to promotion, relegation. Right?
- [57:59]
Landon Donovan
Yeah.
- [57:59]
Tim Howard
Whether you agree with that or not, if they have success. Right. And it leads to real dollars. I would imagine there's going to be a whole bunch of folks getting on board. Right. And so we need to do a better job in America in terms of getting this collective. And you can still have your own businesses, you can still be usl, but they. We need to figure out a way to get on this pyramid scheme like they do in England, in Spain and other countries. Right? You see, you have the top league that's governed by the Football association, and then everything trickles down. And until we do that, until we're separate, that's going to be a problem.
- [58:33]
Landon Donovan
That's the nail on the head, honestly. That's the nail on the head. And until we do that, I hate to say it, I don't want to be the grim reaper. It's going to be really hard. So certainly for our men's national team to be successful. Really hard. So on that happy note, we made a promise to be unfiltered. It's in our name, and we don't intentionally go after people. We don't try to make things up. We speak our mind from our experiences, we give our opinion from our experiences, and we try to be honest and open about everything. We appreciate the support we've had. This has surpassed our wildest dreams as to how successful this has been. And I just said to Tim during the break on a random Wednesday night, all of you came into downtown LA to be a part of this, and we're really grateful for that. So thank you very much. Tim usually does this part, but I want to thank all, all of our partners, VW Coors AT&T. Thanks for being a part of such a. What we think is an incredible show and hopefully it continues for many, many years. Thanks to BMO, the second best stadium in LA. As always, subscribe on subscribe on YouTube, Apple, podcasts, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast, it helps guys, people find the show. And when people find the show, they tend to like it. Not everyone, but they tend to like it. So please continue to do so.
- [60:07]
Tim Howard
And well said. And from me, when I say, when I say thank you. This is Landon and I can talk about soccer all the time. If we don't have engagement, if we don't have loyalty and love from our fans, this show is nothing. And we've seen over the course of the first six months, this show is incredible and amazing and it isn't because of us. It's because of the engagement we have with all of you. And it's not lost on us that you're here tonight, participating in the first live show. Hopefully the first of many. And thank you to our presenting sponsor, vw. The support has been incredible. Our Coors Light sponsor, they've been awesome. Just incredible. We love the fact that we can feel every single week that we're supported. And tonight was amazing. But we'll be back next Tuesday with a new episode. So thank you. Enjoy the night and let's enjoy sa.