UnJustified: “Jack Smith Testifies” (Jan 4, 2026)
Host: Allison Gill (MSW Media)
Guest: Jack Smith (Special Counsel)
Special Contributor Absent: Andrew McCabe
Episode Overview
This landmark episode breaks down the recently released transcript and video of Special Counsel Jack Smith’s closed-door testimony before the House Judiciary Committee, focusing on the integrity of the Department of Justice’s investigations into Donald Trump’s efforts to overturn the 2020 election and mishandling of classified documents. Host Allison Gill, armed with deep familiarity with the case, curates pivotal excerpts accompanied by commentary, highlighting Smith’s detailed, calm refutation of right-wing conspiracy theories and political attacks, his unwavering defense of his team, and the broader implications for rule of law in America.
1. Introduction: Why Jack Smith's Testimony Matters
[00:54–03:39]
- Gill sets the stage: Emphasizes the uniqueness of Smith’s measured, unflappable congressional appearance, comparing his command of detail favorably to Robert Mueller’s 2019 testimony.
- Purpose of episode: To curate and analyze significant moments from Smith’s testimony, focusing on facts, debunking misinformation, and exploring ramifications for justice and democracy.
2. Jack Smith’s Opening Statement: Clear, Unapologetic, Evidence-Based
[03:39–07:48]
- Smith’s approach: Asserts his obligation to “follow the facts in the law and to do so without fear or favor.”
- Core allegations restated: Trump “engaged in a criminal scheme to overturn the results of the 2020 election...and willfully retained highly classified documents,” with repeated obstruction.
- Republican narratives rebutted: Refutes claims about “rogue prosecution” or illegal acts in collecting call logs (“toll records”).
- Smith’s integrity: “If asked whether to prosecute a former president based on the same facts today, I would do so regardless of whether that President was a Republican or a Democrat.” (06:30)
- Memorable Moment – Direct accountability: “The decision to bring charges against President Trump was mine, but the basis for those charges rests entirely with President Trump and his actions...” (03:59)
3. Systematic Debunking of GOP Conspiracy Theories
A. Relationship with DOJ Leadership
[09:15–11:08]
- Smith rebukes “rogue prosecutor” narrative, clarifying his procedural meetings with AG Garland:
Smith: “Never in those meetings did he [Garland] tell me I couldn’t or shouldn’t go forward...” (10:40) - Smith chose, not Garland, to consult the Solicitor General regarding anticipated First Amendment claims.
B. No Collusion with State Prosecutors/Other Investigations
[11:48–13:51]
- Smith categorically denies coordination with state AGs (Arizona, Georgia), clarifying that information exchanges were minimal and not substantively investigative.
C. Handling and Disclosures of January 6 Committee Evidence
[14:51–19:21]
- Smith details efforts to acquire evidence from the January 6 Committee, refuting GOP claims of Democratic coverup or destroyed evidence:
- “We disclosed to the defense everything we got.” (16:50)
- Defensive access to hard drives from the Committee, including all handed-over files and transcripts.
D. Allegations of Election Interference
[20:10–25:59]
- Smith rejects claims he rushed cases for political effect or violated DOJ policy:
Smith: “We were trying to move these cases expeditiously... the public’s right [to a speedy trial] as well.” (21:17)
- Affirms that requests to file evidence under seal to avoid ‘interference’ were not opposed by his team; the court denied them (23:04–25:59).
4. Mar-a-Lago Search, Document Handling, & Judicial Procedures
Decision for the Search
[28:18–30:34]
- Smith underscores that the Mar-a-Lago search was a standard, court-approved law enforcement action, dismissing “banana republic” accusations: Smith: "The search... was conducted pursuant to a warrant... as the DOJ and FBI does every day." (29:45)
Accusations Re: Library Intent or Security
[31:23–34:28]
- GOP suggesstion that Trump retained items for “his presidential library”: Smith: “If his defense were that he was intentionally taking classified documents to start a presidential library... that’s a crime.” (31:36)
- Mari-a-Lago’s Secret Service presence did not constitute document security; the agents were unaware of the documents (33:20).
Judge Cannon and Judicial Recusal
[34:28–35:12]
- Smith firmly avoids discussing potential moves to disqualify Judge Cannon, citing confidentiality and adherence to public filings only.
5. Weaponization Claims & Charging Decisions
[37:07–39:19]
- Smith explains he considered charging additional co-conspirators but had not concluded on that before the office was shut down post-election.
- Rep. Jasmine Crockett (via Jamie Raskin) helps Smith emphasize fundamental prosecutorial ethics: Smith: "...you're not supposed to go after people who you believe are not guilty." (39:02)
- On needing to re-indict repeatedly: “Never.” (39:17)
Detailed Refutations of Election-Fraud Myths
[39:37–42:05]
- In response to revived Pennsylvania fraud claims: Smith: “...a lot of these issues were raised in the courts. I think Donald Trump lost those litigations.” (41:48)
6. Right-Wing Conspiracies: FBI Informants, “Threats”, and Misconduct
[42:42–45:02]
- Smith confirms some FBI confidential informants were present on Jan 6, but no undercover officers and “the idea that this was a ‘Fed inside job’” is baseless.
- Alleged intimidation of witnesses’ lawyers by DOJ—Smith thoroughly explains the actual events and investigative transparency, highlighting the insubstantial nature of the accusations.
7. Republicans’ Primary Grievance: Subpoenaed Congressional Toll Records
[53:50–62:31]
- Extended GOP outrage focused on Smith’s lawful acquisition of phone toll records (not content), used to document event chronology and communications relevant to the investigation.
- Smith stresses these actions were necessary, legal, and demanded by facts: Smith: “Who should be accountable for this? Donald Trump. These records... Donald Trump directed his co-conspirators to call these people.” (57:45)
- Examples given: validating communications between Trump, Mark Meadows, Jim Jordan, Kevin McCarthy, and others on Jan 6th.
8. Smith’s Prosecutorial Strategy: Law, Not Politics
Charging Trump under 18 USC 241 (Conspiracy Against Rights)
[63:07–65:14]
- Chose the statute because of Trump’s targeting of the voting rights of millions, supported by key evidence (asking Georgia’s Secretary of State to “find 11,000 votes”; focus on urban/Black districts). Smith: “We had strong evidence that the defendants... sought to interfere with... that right [to vote].” (63:56)
Proof That Trump and Allies Didn’t Believe the Big Lie
[65:59–69:34]
- Direct evidence from interviews: Giuliani and Trump admitting (in private) disbelief in the fraud claims they promoted.
On Not Immunizing Bannon/Stone
[69:50–70:55]
- Refused to immunize uncooperative witnesses (Stone, Bannon, Navarro): “The information... wasn’t worth immunizing them for their own possible conduct.” (70:18)
9. Evidence of Trump’s Knowing Fraud
[71:16–77:42]
- Smith recites key knowingly false claims (e.g., the ‘Red Mirage’ in PA, fraud in MI/GA), showing Trump was pre-briefed these phenomena would happen – yet lied about them being fraudulent. Smith: “He only brought fraud claims that involved states that he lost. He only approached people... who had party allegiance to him.” (73:07)
- Trump explicitly acknowledged (privately) losing: “Can you believe I lost to this effing guy?” (75:43)
- Would have built the case at trial around powerful GOP witnesses, plus Trump’s own admissions.
10. Supreme Court Immunity Ruling Debunked as Exoneration
[78:03–79:26]
- Ruling expanded presidential immunity, but Smith disagrees with outcome, emphasizes “the evidence that we had after that decision remained powerful.” Smith: “I do not see that [ruling] as an exoneration.” (78:20)
11. Pardons, Rule of Law, and Threats to Democracy
On Trump’s Pardons of January 6th Offenders
[79:38–83:09]
- Smith sharply criticizes Trump’s mass pardons for Jan 6th convicts.
Smith: “I just don’t understand why you would pardon people who assaulted law enforcement... I think it sends lots of messages... I think pardoning people who assaulted them is wrong.” (82:00) - Predicts further crimes by released offenders.
Professional Retaliation and Harm to DOJ
[98:55–100:19; 100:27–105:05]
-
Emotional recounting of career DOJ/FBI staff being fired for doing their jobs. Smith: “He got fired for doing his job two weeks after his wife died... No reason a person like that should have to go through that... I just think that's wrong.” (99:00)
-
Documents White House Executive Order suspending security clearances/contracts for Smith’s attorneys and firm solely because of their work for Smith. Smith: “[The EO's purpose is] to seek retribution against me... to chill people from having an association with me.” (104:41)
-
Memorable moment on intimidation:
Jamie Raskin: “Have you yourself been intimidated as a result of the actions that you in this case?”
Jack Smith: “I’m not going to be intimidated. I will not be intimidated.” (106:32–106:35)
12. The Legal Reality of First Amendment Limits
[94:18–96:44]
- Smith concisely lays out why Trump’s conduct went far beyond protected speech: Smith: “He was free to say that he thought he won... But what he was not free to do was violate federal law and use knowingly false statements about election fraud to target a lawful government function.” (95:25)
- “There is a very clear carve-out for fraud in our case law... when you’re committing a fraud... that’s not protected by the First Amendment. ... This case was an affinity fraud.” (96:44)
13. On Testifying Publicly, Transparency, and Defending DOJ
[88:51–92:50]
- Smith is adamant about defending his team and agrees to public testimony: Smith: “I wanted to speak for [my team]... I feel that they have been vilified in a way that I think is awful.” (91:01–92:27)
14. Constraints on Testimony—Pending Sealed/Confidential Materials
[83:55–88:50]
- Judge Cannon’s order precludes Smith from discussing volume two of his report (details re: classified case, Kash Patel, etc.), with Smith adamant about not risking even the appearance of violating confidentiality.
15. Allison Gill’s Reflections
[106:18–end]
- Gill concludes that Smith’s testimony—fact-driven, apolitical, and steely—demonstrates the qualities needed in future top DOJ posts.
Gill: “I think his testimony demonstrates his apolitical nature, his command of facts and details are astounding... his willingness to follow the facts and the law without fear or favor, I think make him an excellent candidate for the job [of Attorney General].”
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)
-
On the Basis for Charges:
“The decision to bring charges against President Trump was mine, but the basis for those charges rests entirely with President Trump and his actions...” — Jack Smith [03:59] -
On DOJ Leadership’s Role:
“Never in those meetings did [Garland] tell me I couldn’t or shouldn’t go forward. It was more talking through... the legal issues present in the cases...” — Jack Smith [10:40] -
On Mar-a-Lago Search:
“The search... was conducted pursuant to a warrant... as the DOJ and FBI does every day. It was approved by United States Magistrate.” — Jack Smith [29:45] -
On the Toll Records:
“Who should be accountable for this? Donald Trump. These records... Donald Trump directed his co-conspirators to call these people.” — Jack Smith [57:45] -
On Indicting Only Trump:
“I had not made final determinations [about charging others]... but Trump was the central reason for this whole thing.” — Jack Smith [37:14–37:41, paraphrased] -
On Knowing Fraud:
“He only brought fraud claims that involved states he lost... When he was told that a fraud claim wasn’t true, he didn’t stop making it.” — Jack Smith [73:07] -
On First Amendment and Fraud:
“There is a very clear carve-out for fraud in our case law, Supreme Court... This case was an affinity fraud.” — Jack Smith [96:44] -
On Retaliation and Staff Dismissal:
“He got fired for doing his job two weeks after his wife died... No reason a person like that should have to go through that.” — Jack Smith [99:00] -
Smith's Unbreakable Resolve:
“I’m not going to be intimidated. I will not be intimidated.” — Jack Smith [106:35]
Essential Segment Timestamps
- [03:39] – Smith’s opening statement (core themes, laying out facts)
- [11:08] – Rebutting “coordination” and state-level conspiracy narratives
- [16:46] – January 6 Committee evidence and transparency
- [21:17] – Pace of prosecution/Election interference claims addressed
- [29:45] – Mar-a-Lago search lawfulness
- [31:36] – “Presidential library” as legal defense rebuked
- [57:45] – On right-wing outrage over toll record subpoenas
- [63:56] – Why charge Section 241 (conspiracy against voting rights)
- [73:07] – Proof of Trump’s knowing deception
- [78:20] – Supreme Court immunity ruling not exoneration
- [82:00] – On pardoning Jan 6 attackers
- [95:25] – Free speech does not protect criminal conduct
- [99:00] – On staff retribution and Department culture
- [104:41] – On White House Executive Order targeting his attorneys
- [106:35] – Smith’s closing declaration of resolve
Final Thoughts
Jack Smith’s testimony, dissected by Allison Gill, provides a rigorous fact check against a torrent of right-wing accusations, spotlighting the professionalism and impartiality of the Special Counsel’s work. The episode not only rebuts misinformation but also offers an inside look at the integrity, legal rigor, and principle required to protect the rule of law amid political turbulence. Smith’s repeated defense of career DOJ and FBI staffers and his refusal to be cowed by threats or intimidation stand as a quietly powerful rebuke to those seeking to undermine American democratic institutions.
Recommended for:
Anyone seeking a thorough, engaging breakdown of the facts, strategies, and high-stakes political drama driving the Trump investigations—and what they reveal about justice in modern America.