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- [00:03]
A
Class is in session. Hey, everybody, and welcome to Unlearn 16. Class is in session, guys. Today I went over the pond. I love that expression. I should use that more in my daily life. And we went all the way to Kate Menopause. Now, Kate, did you purposefully change your last name when you got on TikTok? Because you're going to talk about all these, like, is it a legal thing?
- [00:26]
B
No, not yet, but I think I might do actually, now you come to mention it, why not? I'll put some giggles.
- [00:31]
A
Once you what? Once you put your stamp on that it is, you're good to go. Now we're talking a little bit before we jump into it. I don't know if anybody can guess what Kate's going to talk about, but, you know, put the comments in once we get into it. As we were talking just a little bit in the pre taping here, we found out that, Kate, you're from Yorkshire. And my whole family's like 25 minutes down the street, which is Boston.
- [00:56]
B
I know. Such a coincidence, right?
- [01:01]
A
It's hilarious. What's the weather like there right now?
- [01:04]
B
It's actually gorgeous. No, I'm not even joking. I know it shouldn't be because it's Yorkshire and it should be raining, but we've had a beautiful few days. Absolutely balmy. Gorgeous. Because you can't please English people. Because if it's 26, we're like, oh, man, it's too hot. I can't cope with this. And if it's raining, then we complain about the rain. But no, beautiful few days.
- [01:24]
A
You know what? But that's what makes us funny. That's why I'm funny. I know some of the best sarcasm and humor on the planet is coming out of there. And it all starts with a general malaise and. And annoyance with what's going on in the day.
- [01:40]
B
Go for it.
- [01:42]
A
Absolutely. But you have really good pork rinds. Okay.
- [01:48]
B
Yeah, done.
- [01:50]
A
You got. You gotta. You gotta sneak them in. Like the. You know the pork scratch you get from the pub? Yeah, yeah, yeah. The ones you pull off the thing. The ones that could break it, too, and pretty much have your weekly fat and salt intake. That's what I'm after.
- [02:05]
B
I don't know if it's weekly or it should be like bi weekly because that stuff's lethal.
- [02:08]
A
It's a lot. It's the world's tiny.
- [02:12]
B
Like three.
- [02:15]
A
But you only can do three, because every once in a while you could take out a tooth.
- [02:19]
B
Yeah.
- [02:19]
A
Thank you so much for coming on. I really Appreciate it. I am super excited to talk. Well, that's super excited because to be honest, I prefer not to have anything to do with it. But perimenopause and menopause.
- [02:32]
B
Yeah.
- [02:34]
A
I'm 49.
- [02:35]
B
Bless you.
- [02:36]
A
I did not, I did not sign up for anything. And the, the funny part about it is there is so much information and so much, yes, misinformation. But people are like, well, I just eat cantaloupe and I'm fine. And I go for a bike ride and that's cleared it up for me. And I, you know, all these different things, yay. And I'm like, what? I don't understand what I'm supposed to do. Am I supposed to go to a natural path? Am I supposed to ignore it? Am I supposed to let nature take its course? Like, I don't like any of it. I'll tell you, I'll tell you what I want to feel like I felt at 35. And I'm not ashamed to say I'll figure out. And hopefully we can talk about different things. I'll figure out whatever I have to do to get to that feeling. And I swear to God, if men went through menopause, we already would have had a pill we could have taken at the beginning year and called it a day.
- [03:28]
B
Yeah, for sure. So I need. So what, what's up?
- [03:33]
A
Right, so, yeah, let's break it in.
- [03:36]
B
Let's break it in. So first and foremost, Joanna, I need you. I need you to do me a favor. Go.
- [03:41]
A
I like it.
- [03:42]
B
I need you to let go of the 35 year old self.
- [03:45]
A
Oh, come on.
- [03:46]
B
No, no, I'm gonna start off like that, sweetheart. I needed you to start off like that because that version of you is gone now. That doesn't mean the next version of you is not going to be like insanely better because she's gonna be. Yeah, she's gonna be wiser. All that period nonsense is going to be done. All that kind of like up and down, all that kind of like dictated to by your monthly cycles. That shit's all done, right? So the newer version of you, the version of you that's going into her 50s, she could be like, kick ass, sorted, brilliant. But the 35 year old version of you has gone.
- [04:23]
A
All right, fine.
- [04:24]
B
You need to make peace with it, sweetheart, because if you carry on trying to grab, keep hold of her, that's when the misery starts.
- [04:32]
A
Right, Interesting. So it totally makes sense. In all fairness, I can't really remember what 35 felt like because I'm that Old, but, like, I like my shoulder. Do you remember? I don't remember 35. I. That's 15 years ago. I don't really have any.
- [04:52]
B
I vaguely do because I measure life in. In children, because my. My youngest was three, so I kind of remember. How old. Vaguely.
- [05:02]
A
They imprint that upon you.
- [05:04]
B
Yeah, they do. It's like, you know. But the good news is that there's so much that you can do to help yourself, and it's just a question of where do you want to go with it? I think so. I'm a life coach.
- [05:20]
A
Hold on. Before we go anywhere with it, can we just explain for everybody who's listening? Women and like. Everybody.
- [05:28]
B
Yeah, true.
- [05:29]
A
What is it? What is it? What does it do to your body? What does it do to your hormones? And what are. Forget the, you know, the night sweats. We'll talk about all those symptoms. But physiologically, what is it doing? Your body. Yeah.
- [05:44]
B
And mind. So this is the thing. So my background. Psychology. I used to teach psychology. I was a teacher back in the day. And people. People forget that it's the mindset and the mental health side of things that is equally as affected as the body. Okay. And.
- [06:01]
A
Right.
- [06:02]
B
It's really, really important to state that straight off the bat, like body and mind. Body, mind and soul. We need to put that into the dialogue right from the beginning. It doesn't just affect your. Your body, it affects your mind as well. You have estrogen receptor cells all over your body, so everything is affected. So perimenopause on average.
- [06:22]
A
Hold on. Pause for a second. How did you say estrogen?
- [06:26]
B
I said estrogen.
- [06:27]
A
Estrogen.
- [06:29]
B
Yeah. It's a. It's a. You say potatoes. I say potatoes, darling.
- [06:33]
A
Estrogen. All right. Okay. Sorry, just translating for my.
- [06:38]
B
It's a pod. Yes.
- [06:40]
A
How do you say migraine?
- [06:42]
B
Migraine.
- [06:44]
A
Oh, all right. I thought you were going to say migraine. I have a South African friend that says migraine. I'm like, what are you saying? Continue. All right, so you have.
- [06:53]
B
We have all over our body. Okay. Now what happens in perimenopause as we mature? I shall say we lose estrogen and progesterone and testosterone.
- [07:11]
A
Right.
- [07:12]
B
Okay. Estrogen. Well, progesterone leaves our body in a straight line. So it starts off high like this, and it leaves our body like that, nice and gentle in a straight line. Awesome. Estrogen is the dancing queen. She leaves our body. So in an average cycle, your estrogen does this anyway. Estrogen. Estrogen. I'll mix them up. Just.
- [07:36]
A
I like it. Listen, I Can adjust. I've already made the adjustment.
- [07:40]
B
I've already forgotten what I say now I, I appreciate the restroom or estrogen. So eastern does this, it goes like that as it leaves. So you one day feel great and the next day you feel like I'm gonna cry at a dog getting adopted on tick tock. Right. And feel like that. Yeah, I am watching that like before 7am so the problem being that there should be a nice gap between progesterone and estrogen to feel balanced. And one day the gap can be like this and one day the gap is the other way around. Estrogen dominance. And one day the gap is balanced. And this is why we're all over the place. But essentially you lose both of those hormones as you go through perimenopause. And this is why you suddenly feel that your skin is drier. You feel that you have less oomph because you get tired. And different, the three different hormones. So progesterone, estrogen and testosterone are responsible for different functions in our body. Estrogen is responsible for a lot of them. So heart health, what we think of as our, as our reproductive hormones. Progesterone is more responsible for us feeling calm. So when we don't have enough progesterone, that's when the perimenopause rage kicks in. You know that I'm going to stab you if you breathe. Don't look.
- [09:12]
A
Could it also feel like anxiety or is it more rage?
- [09:16]
B
Well, there's lots of different things that are associated. So the rage like don't, don't look at me in that tone of voice like I'm gonna stab you. But also that sudden onset anxiety that women get in perimenopause. Like I used to be okay driving my car at night and suddenly I don't want to go out at nighttime or I can't go out and meet strangers because I suddenly can't cope with it. We can lay that at progesterone store pretty much. And then testosterone is the one that's more linked to libido. So if suddenly you've lost interest in sex completely, like you're like, just stay away from me, like don't come near me. And also energy levels are quite often linked to testosterone as well. But estrogen is the biggest player because heart health is estrogen, eye health, skin, hair, nails, all these kind of things. That is eastern based. So that's what's going on and it's, it affects everything you that is in your body on average, the average woman. And I hate the Word average and I hate people do air quotes as well. But the average. Yeah, the average woman goes through menopause about the age of 51 and women of color around 49. Perimenopause can last 10 to 15 years. It usually lasts eight years.
- [10:46]
A
Wow. Okay, so, so it's so about 45, 45 to 53.
- [10:54]
B
Yeah. So it could be 45. It could be if you're, if you're asking for the nash for. So I, I did some research on Canada because I'm nice like that and they say, yeah, okay, it's cool. But they reckon in Canada it's around 47.5 and the average. Yeah, but maybe not. You know, the problem with average statistics is every woman is completely different. If you started your periods younger, you're going to go through perimenopause statistically younger. If you have other things going on with your reproductive health, it's going to make a difference. So that's. But you could realistically start experiencing symptoms anywhere from your mid-30s. There have been very rare cases where women in their teenagers have started with perimenopause.
- [11:47]
A
I've had friends and acquaintances that have gone through different health issues, like maybe they've had gone through cancer and got chemo or maybe they've gone through different things and it, boom, kicks them into menopause.
- [12:00]
B
And this is the thing. So some women, for example, have, have a forced hysterectomy and they're in their menopause overnight, all their reproductive organs removed. Menopause, like that's when the body goes into massive shock because you lose all your sexual hormones in one go and suddenly you don't have this gradual wind down. As traumatic as, as, like as perimenopause can be. And it can be traumatic for some women. And a lot of women feel so many emotions and so many mindset shifts. Like this feeling there is one of the biggest ones. Yeah. And, but it's really traumatic. If you have a hysterectomy, you have your womb and both your ovaries taken out. You have, you're producing then no estrogen whatsoever, and all overnight, you're in menopause. And it's a, it's a lot, It's a lot, a lot to deal with. So that journey is 8, 10, up to 15 years. Yeah, it's a lot.
- [13:03]
A
So question you're, you're talking about. I don't want to jump too much all over the place, but that's kind of how my brain works. You were talking about heart health and its relation to estrogen. My question is because obviously men and women both have estrogen and testosterone in their bodies in different degrees. Right? So we all have all of those hormones. My question is men have always had lower estrogen, obviously very, very low. And it, why wouldn't their heart be affected in a negative capacity throughout their whole life? Or is it? And then, or is it just what your body gets used to and you take this away and all of a sudden it has a bigger play on your heart?
- [13:47]
B
So men's health is very, very different from women's health. They don't go through this menopause, they don't go through this withdrawal forms like they do go through a withdrawal of test testosterone. Yes, but I don't know about Canada, but in, in the uk, if a man is lacking in testosterone, he can go to his doctor and get prescribed testosterone.
- [14:07]
A
Well, this is what, this is my, when I say I want to feel like I'm 37, it's a little bit of, a little bit of a play because it's like women should be able to take and there should be research and there should be stuff done about how to make our, our heart, our bodies, our minds healthier longer and what does that take and what do we need? Meanwhile, everybody and their brother knows that if you're a guy and your testosterone's low, you're in the doctor taking it. So no question.
- [14:37]
B
So one of the biggest problems for women's health was a study that was done in the late 1990s that was, that basically drew a correlation between HRT and breast cancer.
- [14:49]
A
Yes, yes, I remember that this was.
- [14:51]
B
A really detrimental study to women's health. So basically what they did was they tested a group of women and they, they came to the conclusion, I'm there with the air quotes again. They came to the conclusion that there was, there was a relationship between breast cancer and hrt. Now this, since then, the study was debunked completely, right? It was debunked completely.
- [15:14]
A
Yeah.
- [15:14]
B
Many reasons. First of all, the average age of the participants was 63 years old.
- [15:21]
A
Oh, wow.
- [15:22]
B
What's that got to do with the average 47, 48, 50 year old that's going to do HRT. Second of all, there was a large number of women that were obese. Third of all, they didn't test the women before they started the study to see if there were any cancers or precursors to cancers existing. Fourth, they didn't, they were testing a really old fashioned type of hrt. So I don't know if you Know this, but if you don't just hold the sides of your chair because I'm going to blow your hat off that you're not wearing. But they used to make HRT from pregnant mare's urine. I'm just going to let that one sit for a sec. Just rumble it around.
- [16:11]
A
When somebody discover something like that, what.
- [16:15]
B
Do you do with it?
- [16:15]
A
How do they do that? Oh, I know. I'm gonna take some urine from a mare and I'm gonna. You.
- [16:23]
B
I don't understand. I don't, I, I.
- [16:25]
A
Okay, so they took it from a horse.
- [16:29]
B
Yeah. And they did wibbly wobbly in the lab and then they gave it to women.
- [16:36]
A
Is that a technical scientific.
- [16:38]
B
Yeah, because that's about as much wobbly, mate. It's a technical term.
- [16:41]
A
All right, all right. Oh, I got you, I got you.
- [16:45]
B
So that's what they used to do. They used to give women HRT made from pregnant mares urine. Now the problem with that is. So if you think estrogen is a grower.
- [16:54]
A
So it can't just be one problem.
- [16:57]
B
No, listen. So estrogen basically is like a grower. Easy gym gives you, like, it helps to release the eggs. It's like a fertilizer, if you like, in your body. So estrogen fertilizes things and progesterone mows them down. So easter and progesterone need to be imbalanced because if you just let estrogen in your body, things would just grow and grow and grow and it, like the, the, the lining. Right. So the uterine lining would just get thicker and thicker and thicker probably. Right. Because that's when things like uterine cancer come along and it, it would get out of hand. So this is why the pregnancy point.
- [17:39]
A
Was that they were. Yeah, so they were just pumping us through or pumping women with estrogen rather than a combination of hormones that they're supposed to keep at a relatively regulatory amount in your body. So, yeah, they did give them.
- [17:57]
B
I'm just trying to think if they gave them progesterone, but it wasn't the type of, it wasn't balanced like it is now. So the, the whole thing, control. And it wasn't like the. We now we use bioidentical hrt, which is synthetic hrt. We, we always give women, if they have a uterus, we give them progesterone and estrogen. You're never allowed to just take estrogen on its own. So you have the fertilizer and working together. So it's, it's like everything's in balance. So this whole study was just a joke. It wasn't based on current hrt. It wasn't based on a reasonable sample of the population. It wasn't based on anything that is relevant to modern day technology and medicine. So, for example, in the States, you saw hrt used to. 40% of the women in the US used to take HRT after the study. The current figures are 4%.
- [19:03]
A
4. 40 to 4.
- [19:07]
B
40 to 4.
- [19:09]
A
Because of that one study.
- [19:11]
B
Because of that one study.
- [19:13]
A
And let's be perfectly honest, the study was messed up. But in all fairness, it was the media. The use of that particular. Yeah, just estrogen and jacking it up was dangerous for women in that moment because of that technology. Yeah.
- [19:30]
B
And when they first brought out hrt, it was like much earlier than that. And it was seen as the cure because suddenly women didn't feel like their knees were breaking and their hips were falling apart. And so it was seen as this miracle cure for all the problems that menopause had. And there were problems with the old form of hrt, but the media sensationalized this headline, you know, HRT causes cancer. But when. When the study was debunked, there wasn't like, oh, we guys, we made a mistake.
- [20:02]
A
Oh, yeah, right.
- [20:04]
B
It just fizzled.
- [20:05]
A
Right.
- [20:06]
B
So in. In, I think in Canada, I. I think it's like something like 13, 14, 13.1% or 14% of women that have access to HRT take it. Similar. Similar. In the UK it's about 14%. So slightly more. You guys are going up by about 20% every three years, four years, as more information comes out there. So there's more uptake in Canada at the moment, which is good. I mean, and not everyone wants to take hrt. So if anybody doesn't know, HRT is hormone replacement therapy. So we're looking at estrogen and progesterone, not testosterone, because they won't give it to women. That's a whole other rant, by the way.
- [20:53]
A
Why won't they give testosterone to women?
- [20:56]
B
Oh, I'm so glad you asked. Drives me mental. So in the.
- [21:03]
A
Why is it, in my heart, I'm gonna feel like, why do women need to sex drive? They can't have kids anymore anyway. They don't have any more eggs, so screw that.
- [21:11]
B
Yeah, pretty much.
- [21:13]
A
Is that the answer?
- [21:15]
B
So if, if you were diabetic, they would give you insulin? Okay. If you had a thyroid problem, they. They'd help you with that hormone. If you were a man and you were struggling with erections and you were struggling with stuff they'd give you testosterone if you're a woman. It's a whole heap of tough. They. So in the UK there we have nhs, so the National Health Service. So we have free health care in the uk. Right. There is no female testosterone licensed in the uk There is male testosterone licensed and in very rare cases they will prescribe male testosterone for women. Very, very rare cases. And you have to microdose, which is very dangerous. So you would have to use like less than a pea size and if you get it wrong, you can end up with male pattern baldness. You could end up with massive facial hair problems. You could end up with so many problems. Now there is a female testosterone available privately in the UK that you can buy. That would cost you, I don't know, like 60 sterling a month. I know what that is. Canadian. It's about US$80 or bucks, maybe 120. Yeah, yeah, you could buy that. But again that's prohibitive. You'd have to get a. Do you have to go to a private clinic? You would have to then get a prescription. You would then have to be able to afford the private clinic which is going to cost you, I don't know, £120 to start with, then get a prescription, then have enough money to buy the prescription, then get the follow ups, then get them. So it's available to a few people and most women wouldn't know that it's a thing and know what it's for, etc. And also almond in. So if you're allergic to nuts, it's a no go.
- [23:15]
A
Oh, outside of sex drive, what else does the. The level of testosterone that let's say I have in my body in right now, what else, what other good things does it do in my body that.
- [23:29]
B
I would lose, think energy and, and confidence. So if you've lost that vava voom, you've lost that bravado, you don't feel like that male energy, that hustle kind of woomp, that's testosterone that does that for you. So if you lose that, that kind of like. I don't know if we're allowed to say this but hey, you know that ballsy behavior that men have?
- [23:53]
A
Yeah, yeah, that sure. We should probably take some away from certain people in the community if we could siphon some out.
- [24:02]
B
Yeah. I mean there's no one in the States I'd like to do it to. At all?
- [24:06]
A
No, not at all.
- [24:07]
B
No, no.
- [24:08]
A
Little hard about keeping it up. I'm sure he gets multiple injections. So are we Thinking the reason why. It makes perfect sense to me in a. Not perfect sense, in a rational way, but it makes. It makes sense when you say you have a national, you know, health service, a national health care system that we're paying for, that's expensive. We're paying for chemo, we're paying for all these things. We can't be paying for everything. And your va, va va voom is just not on my taxation form. You're gonna have. Okay, so. So they write that one off, but they haven't written off hrt. Now, here's why I find that interest. Right. Have they written it all?
- [24:52]
B
Okay. Meh. So some very sad news came out of the UK this week. So let me start by saying I am petitioning at the moment to get the law changed in our Parliament. Menopause training in the UK is not mandatory for doctors.
- [25:15]
A
Like, I don't even know what.
- [25:19]
B
So this is really sad and I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna cry when I say this, but it's really, really sad. But I'm a big. I'm a big wuss. So if I do, like, get upset, just bear with me. There was a woman in 2022, and we had the court hearing this week and the final ruling was. Was given this week that. And the judge was a woman. Finally, we've got a female judge on this case and her death. And I have the. The regulation of reports to prevent future deaths that has. Is going to the National Health Service. She was a teacher. She was a brilliant woman. She was really loved. She had a brilliant husband who was so caring and fantastic. And the ruling is that her death could have been prevented if she'd have had menopause intervention and help earlier than she did. She unalived herself. Even though she was in a psychiatric ward. She was. She started showing symptoms in 2008 and she unalived herself after a day release in 2022, and the ruling was by the judge and she sent this to the National Health Service that had she had had access more earlier intervention for menopause, she wouldn't have unalived herself. And that's the official. That's the official report that's gone through.
- [26:49]
A
So. So we're. Well, this is going to shift into. I know there's all these other symptoms, but. But let's be honest, like, like sweating and vision and all of those. All of those things.
- [27:01]
B
Yep.
- [27:02]
A
You know, it's annoying. Well, what, what you're pointing to and, and obviously what this court case thought to was the idea that it has or it can have such a substantial impact on mental health and mental regulatory capacities that it puts women in the positions, like you're saying, to choose to leave this world because they just can't handle it anymore.
- [27:30]
B
And that's somebody with a support system. That's somebody with a loving, caring husband. That's somebody with a good job as a teacher. That's somebody that, like, had ostensibly everything to live for. Now, that's a very extreme case, but what I'm saying on that one is the doctors don't have to have mandatory menopause education.
- [27:52]
A
They don't even have the education.
- [27:54]
B
No, they don't.
- [27:54]
A
They don't need it.
- [27:55]
B
They don't need it. This is the National Health Service in the uk So I don't know what's going in Canada. So you guys, again, did some research. You guys, every state is for them. Every province in Canada can do their own stuff. You have no regulation. Yeah, yeah, that's right, you guys, every.
- [28:12]
A
Province decide every province and every doctor. Like, I, I know that there's doctors out there and I'll be everybody's pain in the butt, so I'll do what I'm going to do. But there's lots of doctors who say it's natural.
- [28:26]
B
Yeah.
- [28:26]
A
And. And it's. It's. That's how you're supposed to feel when you're 49, Joe. So deal with it and move on. Again, eat the cantaloupe or whatever. Dumb, ridiculous. I keep saying cantaloupe. I have had no, nothing about cantaloupe. I just chose thin air. In fact, I'm allergic, so I shouldn't probably be eating that. But a lot of doctors will say it's. It's natural. Now I'm going to play devil's advocate. It is. So women do go through menopause. That is a natural state of being. And I know everybody's going to say so do men, but we fix, you know, we deal with their testosterone. Let me put it across the board. The natural progression of your body and your hormone levels and its different functionality.
- [29:15]
B
Yeah.
- [29:16]
A
When are we supposed to leave it?
- [29:20]
B
Well, if. If you, if you were lacking in a. In insulin, if you were lacking in any other hormone, you would want to have that fixed. You would want to do something about it. I am not saying that every woman needs hrt. What I'm saying every woman needs to know how to make themselves feel better. Not everyone's going to choose HRT for sure. So I have a perimenopause Checklist that I give out to people. It has 129 symptoms on it.
- [29:51]
A
Go.
- [29:55]
B
You'd be so shocked if I did a Rain man on you now. But this is 129 symptoms that I've. So I have. I deal with perineal all day, every day. And I've done all my research and I have a free group and I just collect all these symptoms. 129 different symptoms, from burning tongue to inability to swallow, to sore boobs, to itchy ears to formication, which is the, like, sensation of ants crawling on your skin, to hair loss to itchy eyes, to, like. There's so many different symptoms. Burning mouth to.
- [30:31]
A
This goes on and there. And those are all symptoms of a million other things.
- [30:36]
B
But every single woman that. When you. So my story, by the way, I started going through paramedics. I had my first weird perimenopause experience the first week of lockdown. In. In. In. I mean, like, classic timing, right?
- [30:50]
A
Oh, interesting.
- [30:52]
B
I mean, like, why not? You know, why do it? Why do it when it's cozy, perfect time? I mean, who went up? So everyone's in lockdown and I'm cleaning my car because, like, what else have you got to do? And I have this weird, weird attack, right? So I'm suddenly, like. I go hot. And my. I thought I was having a stroke, I'm not gonna lie. So my. I get this rash down one side of my face, and my. I get tingly down my limbs and I'm like, I'm having a stroke, right? I'm having a stroke.
- [31:20]
A
Yeah, that definitely sounds like a stroke. Shingles, something, like something going wrong.
- [31:24]
B
So we call, like, the emergency services, and they're like, keep an eye on it. And then I feel better. Then I feel like an idiot. And then this starts, like, these investigations. And I. I'm not going to say I was gaslit by these male doctors, but they tested me for Ramsay Hunt syndrome, slap face syndrome, immune disorders. So many different tests, and not one of them ever mentioned hormones. So I started saying to him, I was 45, 46. I started saying to him, listen, could it just be more hormones? No, no, no, no. You're too young for all of that. And this is a sentence that every woman will hear. You're too young for all of that. Because in their head, unless you are 50.
- [32:03]
A
Doesn'T affect you. Yeah, right.
- [32:06]
B
So they tested me for everything. Eventually, when I was like 48, I went to see a female, 47, something like that. I went to see a female nurse and she went. And I said, do you think this could be perimenopause? And she was like, yeah, wrote a prescription. But up until then, I'd been. I'd had seven lots of antibiotics for my ears.
- [32:32]
A
Oh, my God.
- [32:33]
B
Yeah. Yeah. Because my ears were constant. I was constantly like, what's like. I was like, you know those dogs that lie on the bed and they go like this with their ear?
- [32:41]
A
I have one of those dogs. Yeah. That's insane. So she gave you a prescription for hrt?
- [32:52]
B
Yep.
- [32:52]
A
And how quickly did you feel better?
- [32:55]
B
I felt worse. Oh, this is the thing. This is the thing, darling. Not every single hrt. And this is what women need to understand as well. So you could start on HRT and it doesn't suit you, but that doesn't mean the end of the journey. Because I started taking oral estrogen and I didn't have a good experience on it. It didn't suit me. So I went back to her and I said, listen, this is making me feel nauseous. It doesn't suit me. She changed me to the patch. It's just like a. Like a transdermal patch is a little square that I put on. I started taking that and I felt absolutely great. And I've been on the patches ever since, so.
- [33:35]
A
And that's just estrogen. Is that just estrogen then?
- [33:40]
B
Well, I have the Mirena coil. So the Mirena coil provides my progesterone.
- [33:45]
A
Okay.
- [33:46]
B
So I have the marina. What is that?
- [33:49]
A
What's the Marina coil?
- [33:51]
B
So. So it sounds like a great name.
- [33:53]
A
For a band, by the way. Just. You should. Sounds like a great name for a band. They're Marina coil. Anyway.
- [34:00]
B
Yeah. So, you know. Yeah. That releases progesterone to stop you getting pregnant.
- [34:08]
A
Right.
- [34:09]
B
Because that provides a steady, small dose of progesterone. You can use that as the progesterone side of the hrt and then you just need estrogen.
- [34:24]
A
I never knew that an iud. People are going to come at me in my comments. Released progesterone.
- [34:30]
B
Some of them.
- [34:30]
A
I just learned that right now. Oh, okay. So not every. Not everything, not everyone.
- [34:35]
B
So.
- [34:36]
A
So you get this. This in order to balance it out. Now, here's my question, and I'm going to come back to the. When is it natural? When should we be messing with it? All of those kind of questions you're saying, I think is that it's. It's your mental and physical health. If they are debilitated, debilitating, if they are overwhelming, if they are all encompassing, you need to get Something to live the rest of your life. Now, would you then argue if your symptoms are minimal, then that's not something that you look toward?
- [35:11]
B
No, I'm. Why should you suffer? Yeah, it's like women that go and have a, A, a, a, a natural birth or women that go and have gas and air, or women that go and have an epidural when they have child. It's your choice.
- [35:27]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [35:27]
B
No one, there's no, there's no badge that's handed out that says you have to suffer. Some women are gonna rough. Are just gonna say, I'm. I'm not going to take any hrt. I'm. I don't want to put anything artificial in my body. I don't want it. Great. Your choice. There's so many options.
- [35:46]
A
But I'll take an Advil. My question is the, the comparison to insulin. And I just, again, I just, I like the back and forth. I like to be able to, like, really, you know, sort of dive into all of the possibilities because the comparison to estrogen and then the comparison to this, the natural functionality of the body would have insulin and would have it for the duration, for the most part of your life. It's only if your body's not working the way it's supposed to that you wouldn't have insulin and it wouldn't regulate. Now here's my question. If our natural status of our body is supposed to be around 50, this stops, and then we go into another sort of physiological phase of life, do you think it's a good idea regardless about, like, good idea is a strong word? I'm not trying to be judgmental here. I'm just trying to make the same argument for testosterone in men. I don't know why you got to be 65 getting shot so you can, you know, Elon Musk, get up over here. I don't, I don't quite understand that. But do you think that if it's a natural cycle of the body, should we step out of its way?
- [37:08]
B
So let me ask.
- [37:09]
A
Are we smart enough now to.
- [37:11]
B
So let me ask you a question. What was the average lifespan of women back in the day?
- [37:17]
A
Oh, I love it. I love it when people are smarter than me. Yeah. 45, 50.
- [37:22]
B
What was it back in the day? You were dropping dead at 50. You didn't need estroges. That's number one. Like, you were dead. So that's number one.
- [37:32]
A
Interesting, right?
- [37:34]
B
HRT, there's a misconception that you have to stop HRT so women will say to me, yeah, but I can only take it for a few years, and then they're going to take it off me anyway. So why have a good thing and then it takes away from me? Bs, right? There is no. You are entitled to take hrt. And I'm not, by the way. I'm not promoting hrt. I also, I have clients that will come to me and they'll say, I want to go down a natural route, and we use black kahosh and we use diet.
- [38:01]
A
I want to talk about all those things.
- [38:03]
B
We'll come.
- [38:03]
A
I want to talk about the natural things.
- [38:05]
B
There's other things you can do as well. So I'm not here just to promote hrt, but you don't have to stop it taking hrt. The rule on HRT is as long as it's benefiting you, as long as the pros outweigh the cons, you can take it to the day you drop dead. No one's. No one has to take it off you. Okay. But it does prevent. It does help to prevent heart disease. It does help to prevent hip problems because a lot of women in the. In. In the world will die from hip problems.
- [38:36]
A
My right hip's been killing me.
- [38:38]
B
Okay. That's one thing. You also need bovine collagen, darling. That's. That will help massively with a high hit problem.
- [38:44]
A
We're back to the cows. We just got off the horses.
- [38:46]
B
No, we're back to. Oh, did we? Oh, yeah, we. But, yeah, this is a different animal. Also very large, also on a farm, different species.
- [38:56]
A
What is bovine? Okay, wait. Okay, we'll come back to bovine.
- [38:59]
B
Yes. Collagen. Fabulous. All right, I'll send you some. Okay.
- [39:04]
A
Okay. With the pork rinds in, I'll have.
- [39:09]
B
To smuggle the pork rinds. But the bovine collagen we have.
- [39:11]
A
You can send the bovine collagen. But the pork rinds we're gonna have to hide. We're not allowed to have that guy.
- [39:18]
B
But. But it helps with hip problems as well, because a lot of women will die, will actually go into hospital because they've broken the hip and Complication. Complication. It will prematurely end their existence.
- [39:33]
A
Life. Yeah. So you're saying HRT can be forever? It can be. You're talking about synthetic. Are there more natural compounds of hormone replacement that people can do?
- [39:47]
B
Well, there's different. So the most common form of HRT is bioidentical. You can then go down the route of body identical, which is where you go to a lab and you get tested and they Produce a type of HRT that's identical to your body.
- [40:05]
A
Wow. Is that really expensive?
- [40:07]
B
It's really expensive. And the jewelry's out. They haven't done enough testing on it yet to say if it's, you know, the results are.
- [40:17]
A
But it gets very.
- [40:18]
B
It's. It's. It's. It's expensive. And some people swear by it. I haven't tested it myself, so. Anything I don't test myself. I don't know. Don't know. Right, right, right.
- [40:27]
A
So you can have bioidentical, which is synthetic.
- [40:31]
B
Yeah.
- [40:32]
A
And then you can have body identical.
- [40:34]
B
Yeah. Pregnant mares anymore created for you.
- [40:39]
A
No. Horses used in the filming of this podcast.
- [40:41]
B
No, we don't do that one.
- [40:42]
A
All right, okay. And then.
- [40:45]
B
And then you can do natural.
- [40:48]
A
Okay.
- [40:48]
B
Methods. So this, for example, there's things like wild yam cream. And while. Yeah, Wild yam cream. There's a very famous one. I don't know if It's Canadian, actually. Dr. Anna's like your gorgeous wife, isn't. It's true. Yeah.
- [41:03]
A
Maybe she did it. She didn't tell me anything.
- [41:05]
B
I mean, she. Well, I think that's a whole lot on the side. Are you creating.
- [41:15]
A
Be really nice to know.
- [41:17]
B
I mean, darling. Some secrets.
- [41:20]
A
I'll ask her when we get off. Yeah, she's so sweet. So, okay, so what is this? You literally. Is it cream? Like body cream?
- [41:27]
B
It's. It's a cream. It's just. It's in like a little. It's like a tincture, ointment type of cream. Doctor is a very famous one. I. I have a lifestyle brand that we use, so. Because I'm always recommending things. So I just started a brand, and we use one called Napiers Scottish. And it comes in a little tube or a little jar, and you just put like a little circle on your inner thigh or on your inner arm. And it literally helps your body to help you to produce your natural estrogen. Because when you stop producing estrogen in your ovaries, your body produces a secondary source, which is cells around your tummy. So women get very upset that they start to get that little bit more fat around their bellies, and they start kind of hating their bodies and getting angry with their bodies, but their body's actually doing that to help produce a secondary source of estrogen. So that's. We get very angry, but help them.
- [42:22]
A
Right, right, right. So it's trying to balance out.
- [42:25]
B
So.
- [42:25]
A
So technically, then, this is kind of interesting. Technically, a natural. A natural physiological response to us not dying and we lose our estrogen is our body starts doing it in a different way. We just don't like it because some people, it makes our body.
- [42:42]
B
Yeah, it's actually trying to help you so it gets this little body. Yeah, yeah, your body's amazing. And it's trying to help you by. By producing this little cushion, what we call our muffin tops. And it's trying to help you by providing that cushion because in there, it's not as good a source of estrogen as the one that's produced from your ovaries, but it's a secondary source and it's. It's trying to help you just give you that last kind of hurrah of.
- [43:09]
A
Estrogen, that push right now. Question. I've heard a lot of people say that if you're going to do hrt, if you're going to. If you're going to try to balance out these hormones synthetically or bioidentically, body identically, whatever you're going to do, you should do it in perimenopause before it's in menopause completely.
- [43:29]
B
Well, I mean, start at whatever age you like. But the earlier, the better you get better results if the earlier you start. So if you're thinking about it just the. You get better results the early you start for sure.
- [43:43]
A
Right. So. So what would be the process? So, like, for example, me, I don't think that I have, outside of maybe more of an erotic kind of period. And it really, some days does think it might kill me. Yep. That might be how I go. Maybe a little bit of sweating at night, maybe some brain fog, maybe a little bit of lack of some energy. So I walk into my doctor's office, I say, I'm not having it, by the way. I think my doctor might be the kind of person that be, say, Joe, you. This is what you're. This is just who you are now. So get over it. So what do we push for? We push for, I want to test my hormone levels or do I want to go to a gun? Do I want to go to a naturopath or a menopause expert? What do I do?
- [44:30]
B
I knew you were going to say that. So the test for perimenopause is incredibly unreliable.
- [44:36]
A
Amazing.
- [44:37]
B
I know. Chef's kiss on that one. So the testing for two hormones, LSH and FSH and LH said luteinizing hormones and follicle stimulating hormones. And remember that I said that Eastern does this.
- [44:52]
A
Yeah.
- [44:53]
B
Throughout your cycle. So you could go in there and tested one day and they Go, Joe, Joe, do you know what? Fantastic. You're fine, darling, absolutely no worries. And you can go in the week later. And he goes, yeah, week later. And he goes, my God, you're on your knees, darling. Hormone, hormone potluck. So this is the problem with the test. So I have. And I can give you the link for it. I have. I'm just thinking, if I've got one handily next to me, I don't think I have. I have a symptom checklist that I mentioned earlier. If you fill it out and there's a tracker on it, because doctors are very good at saying, I don't, I can't see the evidence. I don't know what you're talking about.
- [45:34]
A
Yeah.
- [45:35]
B
So if you have any kind of tracker, a symptom tracker, and you give them a print out of it and go, these are these, this is the evidence, this is the symptoms, this is the evidence. Statistically, I've had hot night sweats for this percentage. Then I've had women in their 30s that have gone on, given the tracker and the checklist and the doctor's gone, oh, that makes sense. Because they can see the evidence in front of them. But if you just verbally say, I'm having night sweats, they'll go, you'll be fine. Yeah. So as much as you can, evidence. Now, if you are over the. So in the uk, we have something called nice guidelines. And not like, oh, isn't that lovely? Nice as in N I C E. Right, okay. And those guidelines say if you're 45 years or older and you're presenting with vasomotor symptoms. Now, vasomotor symptoms are night sweats, hot flashes, anything cold, chills, anything to do with the veins expanding, whatever.
- [46:32]
A
Okay.
- [46:33]
B
Then you can have HRT regardless of. No test needed.
- [46:39]
A
Okay, pause is HRT is the level of HRT and the dosage. Yeah, the same for everybody. If they can't really. If you're saying they can't really identify it, how do they come up with a dosage?
- [46:52]
B
So it depend on the severity of your symptoms and your age, they would start you on a lower dose or an average dose and how severe your symptoms are. So again, that's where a tracker or a checklist would come in. So for example, the patches that I was talking about, they come in strengths of 25, 50, 75 and 100. So if you were just going in, first of all, they'd start you on a lower dose because they prefer you to on a lower dose to start with. So they might start you in a 25. They would then do you a three month review, a six month review and so on to make sure that you were on the lowest dose that to start with. And then if your symptoms were still reoccurring, they would then go up. And there's other things like, for example, topical estrogen, which I can talk about as well, which is vaginal estrogen if you need some extra help. Long story, but vaginal atrophy is fun. So you would go. And you. Yeah, that's a whole other. That's such a fun compliment. That's so fun.
- [48:01]
A
Listen. Yeah, okay. Fun. Yeah, it was fun.
- [48:05]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [48:06]
A
So you started a low dose and then they kind of progress a higher.
- [48:10]
B
Dose if your symptoms aren't lessening. So if you went to your doctor and you said to the doctor, I'm presenting with these symptoms, I'm having night flashes, I'm 49 years old, I'm having hot flashes, I'm having night sweatshirts. I'd like to explore that conversation. I want to have. You have to go in there with this kind of attitude of, I'm this age, I'm having vasomotor systems, this is what I want. And then they go, oh, okay. But if you go there and kind of like, right, okay. They'll be like, no, you don't need it right now.
- [48:45]
A
You don't need it.
- [48:46]
B
Yeah, you're fine.
- [48:46]
A
Right, but that's what I'm saying now here. I know, I know that there. Okay, so it's, it, it's very hard because you, you want a test, right? Like you want a blood test that says, oh, this is where you're at. Here's the medication in order to balance it. Because I'm assuming when a guy goes in and measures his testosterone, is it a little bit clearer of a picture?
- [49:11]
B
Very. And if you want to measure your testosterone, it'd be like that. It's a level.
- [49:16]
A
Annoying.
- [49:17]
B
Yeah, Always.
- [49:18]
A
It's just a level.
- [49:19]
B
It's just a level. This is your testosterone. Bing. But as it would be your insulin, as it would be your thyroid, it's the estrogen, it's this.
- [49:28]
A
Women are just more confident.
- [49:29]
B
I know. Well, that's why I catch women, because.
- [49:31]
A
They'Re more fun physiologically, emotionally.
- [49:35]
B
Yes.
- [49:36]
A
Across the board. Now, there are, and I've looked up some places where there are menopause focused clinics or health centers, natural paths connected to them. I've spoken to people from the states who have endocrinologists that they can go to. They pay out of pocket. And the endocrinologist measures it, I guess, over, you know, a specific range of time to really get a gauge on how high you go, how low you go and where we're supposed to be at. I've gone through ivf, so when you're talking about FSH and all of those indicators, you're like, I've gone through cycles and IUI cycles where they measure over, you know, a eight to 10 day period. And so they really get an idea. And that FSH number, that is a number. That is a very specific number. Right.
- [50:25]
B
On a day. On a day, but it's not the same. Okay, so the next day or the next day or the next day.
- [50:35]
A
Well, that's why they do it over a certain amount of time. Right.
- [50:39]
B
They wouldn't do that if they were checking you for perimenopause. Right.
- [50:42]
A
What. But they should. Shouldn't that be the test?
- [50:45]
B
Yeah, that'd be lovely.
- [50:48]
A
We're gonna do blood tests and over a cycle, over your, your whatever cycle. And we are going to do a blood test every day to see what the range is. Doesn't that make sense?
- [50:59]
B
Yeah, that would be beautiful.
- [51:01]
A
And they just don't do it because they don't want to spend the money because they don't want to include it in our health care.
- [51:05]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [51:07]
A
For it. That's what the endocrinologists in the states are doing. I'm. I'm guessing the endocrinologists in the states because you're going to pay for it out of. Or it's private insurance. They're going to do well here we're going to charge you X amount for every day we get a blood test and you're going to get this as your end result and then we can medicate and we can, we can address it properly.
- [51:27]
B
I have no idea how the states works in terms of healthcare. I mean you guys have the, I think you have like the Menopause foundation of Canada. So you can go to. Yeah, you do.
- [51:36]
A
Okay, I like it.
- [51:39]
B
Yeah, it's called the MFC about menopause.
- [51:43]
A
Okay.
- [51:43]
B
Canada. So they have guidelines that are like a general guidelines that your different regions can follow. But I don't know what they say, right. The kind of testing. But as far as I know that I don't know anyone that would actually test. That's why it's just so impossible. Unless they were willing to test you every single day over a whole cycle for a second.
- [52:05]
A
But it's not impossible. It doesn't sound impossible at all.
- [52:09]
B
Theoretically, but you know yourself with your periods, the first sign that women will always say with perimenopause is my periods are just wappy, like they're closer together, they're further apart, they're spotting, they're heavy, they're shorter.
- [52:23]
A
Well, even if you were to do it like, because they always start day one on a certain day. Right. So even if you do it from that day one, even if it's for a 10 days part or a 14 day cycle, regardless of what happens thereafter, that would seem to be a good.
- [52:39]
B
Start, will be lovely, wouldn't it?
- [52:43]
A
So, so this is just money, what we're saying right now, this is finance. This isn't about not having research, this isn't about not understanding. This is simply about. We are not going to put money into adequately testing the duration of a cycle for women to figure out exactly where they are in this particular stage of life and what HRT levels would help mitigate that. That's what you're telling me?
- [53:11]
B
Pretty much. I mean this is where the. Yeah, I mean, what can I say? Okay, so this is where it's like.
- [53:21]
A
But that's interesting because, because that, what I find interest, that that's not about research, that's not about. Is this the case or isn't this the case? That's not about anything other than flat out money. So what it does seemingly is it sets up a really clear, identifiable goal and demand that women of different countries can stipulate, can, can protest for, can, can, you know, create communities in order to access something that already exists, something that is clear, something that is relatively easy by the way, to do, you know, within that particular cycle in order to mitigate all of those, all of those impacts. And at the end of the day, I think it's not just because, and this, I'm going to say something and people are going to be like, oh, Joanna, it's not just because it's women. And let's be perfectly honest, women's healthcare is a distant second to our counterparts. It's because it's about women who are no longer seemingly biologically useful.
- [54:30]
B
Yes. And then you have a conversation about women in the workplace and the lack of consideration and anything that's allowed for them when they go to work and any accommodations are made for them in menopause.
- [54:45]
A
Right? None.
- [54:46]
B
Zero.
- [54:47]
A
None. What, what possible none. Yeah, they're not even willing to test and see where we're at, what accommodation. If there's no proof over here, how can they give an accommodation over here?
- [54:57]
B
So there's a massive amount of women that leave the workplace between the ages of 49 and 54.
- [55:06]
A
Because their mental acuity and capacity and physical health is just too damaged at that moment.
- [55:15]
B
And in some cases the women at board level get picked on and ridiculed by their male counterparts for using fans or having a hot flash or just bursting into tears.
- [55:28]
A
Because therefore, first of all, the whole tier, what we're losing then is we're losing all of the wisdom, all of the. And I, and I would also probably argue this because I just heard this. I, I saw a tick tock the other day where they were talking about women getting divorced age and this woman's like, that's because they're done with your crap. They're no longer interested. They no longer have hormonal, hormonal capacity to put up with your crap at home. And I'm assuming that translates to the workforce.
- [56:01]
B
Yeah.
- [56:01]
A
So where we used to be a pain in the ass before, we're now twice because we're not even interested in your feelings into mitigating it, into softening the blow on your fragile ego.
- [56:12]
B
So when we look at, Sorry to go back to unaliving rates, but if we look at unaliving rates, it goes from 4.3% and this is the UK, it goes from 4.3. And then if we go up to the bracket that's like, I'll give you the exact rate. So, so I'm not fibbing. We up until 49 years, it's 4.3. And then from 50 years old up until 6, like 60 something years old, it goes up to 9.2 per 1, 100,000. So literally at 50. Exactly. It goes from 4.3 to 9.2.
- [56:48]
A
Yeah, that's insane.
- [56:51]
B
And that's just, that's insane. I mean statistics don't lie, right? Yeah, exactly. Menopause, like precisely and all of those.
- [57:00]
A
And it's funny because you wonder and I, I think this is. Most women would, would never understand that it's this. They would think it's them.
- [57:13]
B
Yeah, that's, that's you. Yeah, yeah.
- [57:17]
A
That's why you even.
- [57:21]
B
Because so many women will come, you wouldn't. They'll say, I thought it was just me. I thought this was just me. I feel so, I felt so alone. Like I, I thought that I was the only one that felt like that I thought I was going, yeah, one of, one of the most like viral tiktoks I ever did was the one that I did. And I said I thought I was going mad.
- [57:44]
A
Yeah.
- [57:45]
B
And that's the truth. I thought I was losing the plot because I was gaslit. I was gaslit by, by male doctors. I thought I was losing the plot.
- [57:52]
A
I thought you around you, whether they're physicians, whether they're other women who haven't gone through it, whether they're, you know, men in your world, none of them can. How can we even possibly expect those people to understand it or contend with it or accept it or even acknowledge it when the medical community isn't.
- [58:13]
B
No. And this was six years ago when the conversation wasn't being had. This conversation is a new conversation. This is important.
- [58:21]
A
It really is. Yeah. Yeah.
- [58:23]
B
Because six years ago, talking about it.
- [58:27]
A
I find it very. Not similar, but, but obviously somewhat connected because it's all about, you know, women's bodies and hormone levels and reproductive capacity. Because I think it's also connected to the conversations that never really happened about IUI and ivf, about all of this stuff. I went through it not because obviously I, you know, I didn't have the, the other half of the equation when I wanted to have a kid. And so I went through all of these different things and I, I remember these, like, incredibly sterile. Because all the fertility clinics are private. Right. It's not a publicly funded thing. Well, in Canada it's a little bit funded. The government will chip in. But you sit in these places and everybody's dead silent, everybody going through hell, who's going in here every day getting, you know, ultrasound, internal ultrasounds done, full bladder ultrasounds. They're, they're getting their blood taken. They're doing all of this stuff every day. And then you'll have an insemination day and then you'll have a egg retrieval day and all of this very, very overwhelming, sometimes hormonal, because if you're on IVF medication, you're off, like, you could be off the chart and nobody, nobody in this room talks. We all sit quietly. There could be 40 people ready just to do. Go through, to sit dead silent. And I often, because I, I respond very differently now. Now, again, I have to acknowledge the reason why I was there wasn't because of necessarily an infertility problem. Like, I, I hadn't been trying for five or 10 years and it wasn't really playing plaguing on me and I didn't feel like a failure. And all of those things that women go through and men in those relationships, I was there out of just sort of, you know, objective necessity because that's how it was going to have to happen. But you sit There. And you think nobody. Nobody's talking about it. Nobody's making a funny. Like, how did nobody make a. A full bladder ultrasound joke? That. That's just funny. Nobody's talking about it. And then you flip it to what we're talking about right now.
- [60:39]
B
Yeah.
- [60:39]
A
Now I think more women are starting to talk about both. But again, it's. It's this internalized blame, right. I can't have a baby. It's my fault.
- [60:51]
B
Yeah. It's a shame.
- [60:52]
A
Yeah.
- [60:53]
B
And shame. See? Do you remember Gremlins?
- [60:57]
A
Do I remember Gremlins?
- [60:58]
B
Yeah. Right.
- [60:59]
A
I have no idea how you connect gremlins to this conversation.
- [61:02]
B
Well, I will explain. So gremlins are like shame. So Gremlins. Gremlins are like shame. So shame. If we. If you keep shame in the dark, it grows, right? Whatever you. Whenever you put. Whenever you wrap words around something, whenever you bring shape, whenever you bring whatever you're ashamed of, if you keep it in the dark, it grows, it multiplies. When you bring anything out into the light, you wrap words around it. You put it in the sunshine, Right? You just put it out into the sunshine, you wrap words around it, it shrinks. Again, shame is like gremlins.
- [61:39]
A
Menopause. Shame is like gremlins.
- [61:42]
B
Dude, this.
- [61:43]
A
You should put that on a shirt with a little Gremlin.
- [61:47]
B
Yeah.
- [61:48]
A
You know the part where he gets put in the blender, it should be like, just like that.
- [61:52]
B
I'm not sure. That's like terribly paranormal. Like the whole blood thing.
- [61:58]
A
But that's funny. If we can't laugh about it, that's another thing too, right?
- [62:07]
B
I know.
- [62:07]
A
We have to be able to talk about it. We have to be able to cry about it. And we sure as hell.
- [62:12]
B
Yeah.
- [62:12]
A
Laugh about it.
- [62:13]
B
I'm just not sure. Yeah, I'm just not sure. In terms of merchandise, it's quite, you.
- [62:19]
A
Know, just don't press the button yet. He can just be sitting it.
- [62:23]
B
Yeah. Just like a little cutie Gremlin in the blender, ready to go. Okay. Okay.
- [62:29]
A
Like prepper.
- [62:30]
B
Yeah. Okay. Pre percolation. Like pre blending.
- [62:34]
A
Okay. This has been the best conversation. Can you tell people, A, where they can find you, B, where they can find information, all of those things. And then I'll put it all in the comment section as well.
- [62:46]
B
So if you want me anywhere, Kate Grosvenor, don't go perimenopause, because that's not a thing, actually. So, Kate Grosvenor, just remember to put the S in it. Yeah. It's so funny. Kate Grosvenor life coach, Facebook, Instagram, I don't know, YouTube, everywhere. If you want to get your own symptom tracker, it's completely free. Just go to www.myparamenopausesymptoms.com. please download it because you can take that, you can track your own symptoms, you can take it to your doctor. It will really, really help you. And if you are in the uk, go to the NICE guidelines. If you're in Canada, you know, I already mentioned where you can go. Please just be an advocate for yourself. That's it.
- [63:31]
A
That's amazing. And Kate and I will be joining forces to come up with the Gremlin. Gremlins are like menopause T shirt coming to a store near you very soon. Thank you so much, Kate. I appreciate you. It was a fantastic conversation. I would love to have you back at any time. And I do think, I really do think that that this simple, you know, blood test that can go every. This is a very specific thing we can demand, we can talk about that has rational, clear objectives. It's not this pie in the sky thing. No, it is a very specific test that already exists, that is not expensive, that is not any of those things. But women have to start demanding it for themselves.
- [64:16]
B
We have to start demanding a lot of things for ourselves. We need to more women need to advocate for perimenopause care perimenopause health in whatever country you live in. For sure.
- [64:26]
A
Amazing. Thank you guys so much and thank you guys for listening. Until next Tuesday, same bat time, same bat channel dismissed.