← Unlocked with Savannah Chrisley
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- [00:00]
Savannah
You can want healthy, loving relationships more than anything and still find yourself repeating the same painful patterns. Maybe you overthink. Maybe you people please, maybe you shut down, push love away, or feel afraid to fully trust. And even when you know something needs to change, it can be hard to know how to actually change it. At the Personal Development School, they help people heal those patterns at the root. Through powerful courses, live classes, practical tools, and a deeply supportive community. They help people understand their attachment patterns, really rewire subconscious beliefs, and create real transformation from the inside out. They're the number one online platform for helping people build the best relationships of their life. Because it's not just about learning why you struggle. It's about healing the parts of you that learned to survive in ways that may no longer serve your relationships. Today the Personal Development school has a 99.7% NPS score in helping people achieve the results they want in their relationships and and dating life. The Personal Development School helps people grow, heal and build the best relationships of their life, starting with the relationship to yourself.
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Progressive Insurance Announcer
This podcast is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever think about switching insurance
- [01:11]
Shira Bowler
companies to see if you could save some cash?
- [01:13]
Progressive Insurance Announcer
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- [01:14]
Shira Bowler
Just drop in some details about yourself and see if you're eligible to save money.
- [01:18]
Savannah
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- [01:24]
Progressive Insurance Announcer
Visit progressive.com after this episode to see
- [01:27]
Savannah
if you could save Progressive Casualty Insurance company and affiliates.
- [01:30]
Shira Bowler
Potential savings will vary.
- [01:31]
Savannah
Not available in all states. Welcome back to this week's episode of Unlocked. We have been talking about all things health and wellness. And today I have Shira Bowler on welcome.
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Shira Bowler
Thank you. I'm excited to be here.
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Savannah
Okay, so before we jump in, I want to talk about how I actually asked her to come on this podcast. I was on a Southwest flight. I was heading to. I don't even know where I was.
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Shira Bowler
Austin.
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Savannah
Austin.
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Shira Bowler
Yes.
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Savannah
Yes, for America 250. And so I was headed to Austin and a friend of yours was on the flight and I were sitting next to each other and I go to put my bag up top and it was a nice handbag. And she. A guy comes by and shoves his bag on top of mine and she goes, oh, no, not the Birkin. And the moment she said that, I was like, I love you. I'm Savannah. Nice to meet you.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah.
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Savannah
And then we started talking and just about my business. Female focused health and wellness. And that's when you came up in your story. And I was just, I mean, I Was shocked. You are the author of one scan saved my life. And. And we're gonna go more into that because at 43 years old, you were diagnosed with lung cancer. You were a runner and, like, healthiest, as you can tell, very healthy, very fit. And you don't really fit the mold for lung cancer.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah, you're right. It was last October, so just seven months ago. And I had done more of a preventative scan. I'd never smoked in my life. I run often. My. My dad's actually a lung doctor, which is even crazier because I've never been around secondhand smoke. I've never been in an occupational situation that would be a problem for my lungs. And so.
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Savannah
Well, you're in a family full of doctors. Your dad's a pulmonologist, your brothers are orthopedic surgeons.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah, my mom's a pediatrician.
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Savannah
Yes.
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Shira Bowler
So I've always done, like, what you're supposed to do, you know, tried to eat out of the fridge, not the pantry. Work out all the time.
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Savannah
I love that saying. I've never heard that.
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Shira Bowler
Oh, yeah, that's what I was.
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Savannah
You have the fridge, not the pantry.
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Shira Bowler
Well, you don't have four little kids yet. So when you do and they come home from school and they go straight to the snack pantry, I'm like, no, out of the fridge, not the pantry. I try to lay out fruit and vegetables, everything cut up and ready for them so that they eat something healthy. I think that we need snacks in the pantry because when they leave for school at 8:00am and they need a 2:00 clock snack, it's harder to give them cheese or fruit that's gonna just melt and get disgusting. So there are times when you can eat out of the pantry, but if you're home, you should eat out of the fridge.
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Savannah
I love that. I love that. So you were always focused on health and wellness. You come from a family of doctors and you got a scan and this was. I think what's important to point out too, is the scan that you got was the scan you were going to cancel or, you know, reschedule.
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Shira Bowler
You're right. So if you back up. Actually, what happened is my husband and I have a healthcare investment firm. We've always been interested in all the new technology and information you can get about your health. And so not just eat out of the fridge. Fridge, not the pantry. But we would do 23andMe to get our, you know, interesting information about our genetics. We did a full genome sequency. There's like blood Tests that you can do that'll try to catch diseases early. We do all those things. And so over the summer, we did this full body mri. And a lot of it was, it'll be interesting to see what we look like on the inside. But also, what does the app look like? How is the, you know, the service, how it all runs?
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Savannah
You literally do it just so you can make sure it's running properly.
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Shira Bowler
Right. So it's interesting. Yeah, I did want to cancel it, and I did cancel it a number of times. You're right. I am really claustrophobic. I don't want to be in a machine. And we were in New York City, we had all these work meetings, and if I had an hour break, I did not want to go into a medical machine. I wanted to, like, run around with my girlfriends.
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Savannah
Exactly. Like, go get a drink.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah, obviously. So I kept canceling it. He ultimately won, and I did it. And then the results came back and the app was really cool. And we thought it was an interesting experience. And it really only flagged one thing, and it was considered a minor finding. So the radiologist said, minor finding. 3.8 centimeter mass in your right lung correlate with symptoms. And I'd run six miles that day because that's my morning exercise routine.
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Savannah
Six miles? No, the only time I'm running is if I'm running from something. Only time I'm running, running for me
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Shira Bowler
is my peace of mind. I know it seems ridiculous. My husband makes fun of it too. If I'm in a bad mood, he'll be like, should you go for a run? And I'm like, oh, you have something to say about my physique? You know, it's not that.
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Savannah
That's amazing.
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Shira Bowler
And so I did it. It came back and it kind of said, minor finding. Don't worry about it. And a couple months later, I was at my normal doctor's appointment and I showed him the app because I thought it was interesting. And I went through everything that it found and I showed him this minor finding and he was like, well, you know, MRIs are not how we look at lungs. You really need a low dose ct. So I followed up and had one with him. And my dad had said that to me and my doctor before had said that. So I did it again. I'd never had a low dose chest ct. I thought it was interesting. Let's see. And that radiologist also came back and said, 4.1 centimeter mass in your right lung. But if a never smoker and no symptoms don't worry about it.
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Savannah
That's insane. So here is this mass. But don't worry about it.
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Shira Bowler
Right? But don't worry. And I was still running. I had no symptoms. When I say no symptoms, I mean none. I was running and running, running. And so I actually got the cd, like, old school style. I tried to load it into my computer. I had to buy, like, a DVD thing to put in. And then I sent it to my girlfriend in Nashville, who's actually a lung cancer radiology specialist. And I also sent it to my dad. And it was that Saturday night she looked at it. I actually had to give it to her husband, to be honest, because she works all the time and he does carpool. So I met him in the carpool, and I was like, can you give this to Kim? And she looked at it. The next day, I was at Pilgrimage, the festival down in Franklin, listening to Kings of Leon. I had my son with me, and my husband was in Kabul, Afghanistan, actually picking up a hostage. So he wasn't there. I took my son. It was like a fun night. And my girlfriend called me and she said, where's Adam? And of course I was like, in Afghanistan, which is also like, who knows where he is?
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Savannah
Exactly.
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Shira Bowler
Right? They take their phones, they put them away. I knew he was picking someone up, but when and where, you know, it's all gray.
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Savannah
Yeah.
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Shira Bowler
And she was like, I want you to redo the scan on Monday. And I was kind of annoyed because I had a six mile run planned and other things to do. And I said, fine. So I woke up Monday morning, went six mile run, went and had the scan. My husband flew back, met me. We walked into the pulmonologist appointment, and he was like, you have lung cancer. And I was like, ugh, no, wrong person. I was like, my hair's sweaty. Like, I just ran six miles. And he was like, you're right. You don't look like somebody that would think they have lung cancer, but you have lung cancer. And my husband and I were just like, no malpractice, wrong scan. EMRs messed something up.
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Savannah
Yeah.
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Shira Bowler
And just kind of back and forth. But ultimately, that was a Monday morning. And I had a bronchoscopy on Tuesday where you go on a ventilator and they go down your throat and they take a piece of it to test. And I woke up from that on Tuesday afternoon, and I said, wrong person. And he said, no, you still have lung cancer. And on Wednesday, that pathology report came back, and I had an adenocarcinoma, like, highly Invasive, bad cell type lung cancer.
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Savannah
Wow.
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Shira Bowler
So when. Thursday, I'm at the surgeon, and I did that pulmonary function test where they test my lungs. He came in and he said, I've never seen such strong lungs. And that's when I started realizing, like, what's going on? I have lung cancer, but I'm running six miles. My lungs look good. Like, what's happening? And on Friday, I had a PET scan where they put nuclear medicine in your veins, and they look to see if they think it's spread. And the nuclear medicine doctor came in and said, I don't think it's spread, but you got to get it out. It's fast growing.
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Savannah
Holy cow. And if it wasn't for you getting this scan.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah.
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Savannah
You would have never known because you had no side effects.
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Shira Bowler
Right. I think what's interesting is, like, with breast cancer, you can feel a lump sometimes, or colon cancer, maybe blood in your stool, but with lung cancer, your lungs kind of compensate. They don't grow or change in shape or size, but what they do is they take in more air where they're healthy and less air where they're not. And so you don't feel anything until often it's stage four. And so by stage three or four, it spreads usually to your brain and bones first. And so what happens is maybe you're on a run and your hip hurts, and that's when they realize that you have lung cancer spread to your bones. Since you can't feel your lungs, you don't know until stage four. And if you catch this in stage one like I did, because I did this random scan and was the luckiest girl in the world, then you have a 90% chance of survival. And if it's stage four, it's less than 10. You can still survive. They're trying to make medicine and figure it out, but it's not a good situation to be in in stage four.
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Savannah
Yeah. And holy cow. That's just. It's just mind blowing to me.
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Shira Bowler
You know, when I was in recovery and in the week following, what I realized laying there. Cause you start doing research. Cause you're like, how did this happen? Why me? And my dad's like, I don't know. Cause I'm the lung doctor. Like, bad luck. I don't know. And you feel bad about yourself. You're like, what did I do wrong? Why did I have this bad luck? And what I realized in those weeks following when I was recovering was, I'm actually the luckiest girl in the world. Because my diagnosis was not Unique. It was not special. It's not a rare disease. Lung cancer is killing more young, healthy women than breast cancer and ovarian cancer and colon cancer combined.
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Savannah
That is insane. Because all we hear about right is like breast cancer awareness month. I mean, my mom had breast cancer at 39, no family history, anything. So you're hearing, all right, go get screened for breast cancer, all these things. But I've never one time heard someone say, go get screened for lung cancer.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah.
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Savannah
And it's, and it's affecting women under the age of 50 right now. It's on the rise.
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Shira Bowler
Young, healthy, non smoking women, it's on the rise. And you know, they're diagnosing breast cancer more than lung cancer. But we're dying from lung cancer at a faster rate than all these other cancers combined. And I think there's a few reasons. One is the guidelines say you have to be over 50 and smoke a pack a day for 20 years to get a scan. And like, I've never puffed a cigarette. It's not just if you have lungs, you can get lung cancer. Right. It's not just for a smoker. That increases your risk.
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Savannah
Yeah. I also think too, look at what's going on in our world. Look at the air that we're breathing, look at the products that we're using that, you know, whether it's a hairspray or whatever, you're ingesting those things. So there's no way that it doesn't have an effect.
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Shira Bowler
You're right. And lung cancer research is like a decade or two behind. Probably because we thought it was a deserved disease. It was for a smoker. Even though, though if you smoke, you don't deserve lung cancer. So it's behind. So the new changes in our environment or what we're ingesting, we don't know what the problem is, but we do know it's on the rise. And I think they're not looking for it. And look, I had two doctors say not to worry. It was the third, my girlfriend, who ultimately was like, you have lung cancer. And I think part of that sometimes I talk about with a heart attack, a decade or two ago, they would say, elephant on your chest, numbness down your arm. If you present with that, go to the emergency room, you're having a heart attack. And emergency room doctors were triaging those people. And then they started realizing that if a woman presents with a heart attack, they're like kind of lightheaded off a little bit. Something's not right. Maybe they want to lay on a cold floor. It's kind of like the man flu game where like the man is like, oh my God, my heart. And the woman is like, something's not right. And they were like, well, that's an asymptomatic, you know, not common symptom. Yeah, well, no, it actually is common. It's 51% of the time. It's how women present versus men. And you know, maybe eight, 10 years ago they realized that and so they've changed that. So now if you go to the emergency room and you're a woman and you say these things, you're off. You want to lay on a cold floor, something's not right. They know you're having a heart attack. It's not the elephant on the chest for a woman. So maybe what we're realizing and that I found is that what my lung cancer doesn't look like a smoker. Black lung, you know, like the Marlboro man, right? I don't look like the Marlboro Man. My lungs don't look like the Marlboro Man. And so if you're in your 40s and have lung cancer, they're missing it. Maybe because it doesn't look like lung cancer. In the over 50 smoke a pack a day for 20 years.
- [14:24]
Savannah
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- [16:56]
Progressive Insurance Announcer
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- [17:41]
Shira Bowler
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Savannah
Liberty with your story too. I think it points out another issue. Right is to where I've always said I feel like doctors. And granted I have the utmost respect for doctors, but I feel like there's a sense of complacency sometimes of just like they're so used to X, Y and Z that whenever you come along and yours is different. They're just like, oh, no, you're fine. Because it doesn't look like what you just described. And it's so important to advocate for yourself.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah, you're right. That's a huge part of what I talk about in my book and in Life now is you have to stand up and advocate. Because I had two doctors tell me I'm fine. And it wasn't until the third was like actually of lung cancer. If I hadn't done that six months, if it was now, and I hadn't had half my lung removed in October, it would probably be stage three or four. I would probably start having symptoms, and then another six months to a year, they would figure it out because they would be like, take antibiotics, Maybe it's pneumonia, maybe it's this or that. Because it's not what you would imagine look like a lung cancer patient, but it is a lung cancer patient today. And we need to change the guidelines. We need to change all that. In addition, in what I talk about, in the book, as you talk about your mom, My mom also had breast cancer at 49. So I've been checking mammograms and MRIs and getting my boobs checked every six months for decade. And what I found in all this is I don't have any of the genetic markers for breast cancer or any cancers. I've done all these tests 100 times, so has my mom. But they found that breast cancer survivors have a two fold increase of getting lung cancer within five years of diagnosis.
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Savannah
What?
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Shira Bowler
And they're not talking about it. No one's discussing it. No one's checking breast cancer survivor lungs. And the reality is we should be. That's not fair.
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Savannah
We should be. We should. Also, like I've said, the biggest issue that we're facing today is also insurance carriers. Even my mother, you know, 39 years old, no history of breast cancer in her family. Insurance is like, no, we're not covering a mammogram until you're 40. And my dad's like, I don't care, just go get it, we'll pay for it. She got it done and it came back as breast cancer. And the doctor said, if you would have waited until you were 40, there's nothing we could have done for you.
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Shira Bowler
Right.
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Savannah
It would have been maintenance of life.
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Shira Bowler
So, I mean, that is like exactly what I've been focused on. So all the profits from my book and I'm trying to raise more money to my foundation. It's called Cancer doesn't Care. And. And the Reason I did that is for exactly that issue. Insurance, Medicare, Medicaid. None of them are paying for screening for lungs right now. Unless you're over 50 and smoke a pack a day for 20 years.
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Savannah
That's insane.
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Shira Bowler
And the scan is 200 bucks most places. So, like, you can afford it. I can afford it, but most of this country can't. And cancer doesn't care if you're rich or poor. So why should the screening care? And so all the money from my book I'm trying to raise for this Cancer Doesn't Care foundation to pay for people's screening, to increase access, because it's not fair. I think you are 100% right. I've been getting mammograms and MRIs every six months for a decade before I was 40, because of my mom's history. Because we care and we pay attention to all these things. And now that I realize a lot of people can't do that, it doesn't make sense. It's not fair.
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Savannah
It's not. Because, like you said, $200 may not sound like a lot to you. Me.
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Shira Bowler
Right.
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Savannah
Someone sitting in this room. But that is a lot for the single mother that's struggling to put food on the table to pay her bills to all of those things.
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Shira Bowler
Yeah. And it's actually interesting. So I've spent time with Secretary Kennedy and Dr. Oz. I've spent time trying to figure out how to change these guidelines. So the United States Preventative Services Task Force gives guidelines, and then Medicare follows, and Medicaid follows Medicare, and insurance follows Medicare and Medicaid. That's kind of the process that happens. And the USPSTF has not looked at lung cancer screening since 2013.
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Savannah
Wow.
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Shira Bowler
We need to change that. They also haven't met in over a year. Secretary Kennedy's currently reconstituting it, finding the right people, going to redo it. I'm hopeful that lung cancer is at the top of their list because it is the number one cancer killer. I think we're working to change that. I think that in an ideal world, if you're over 40, like a mammogram, you get a lung CT, and then there's all this new technology that's amazing that with AI tools and blood tests and things like that, that may be like a colonoscopy, they can say you're low risk, come back in five years, you're high risk, come back in a year or two years and be able to do that. At the bare minimum, if you're a breast cancer survivor, if you have lung cancer in your family, if you have an occupational hazard or you're. You were around burn pits, as a veteran, you should be screened at a bare minimum. They don't even cover that right now. So if your mom or sister or somebody had it, you should get an opportunity to receive the scan.
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Savannah
Yes.
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Shira Bowler
And so I joke sometimes that I hope my foundation goes out of business because we just start paying for people to be scanned.
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Savannah
Yes, exactly. I mean, hey, if you go out of business, it means you're doing something right. You know, what have your meetings been like with Dr. Oz and Secretary Kennedy?
- [23:29]
Shira Bowler
I think that they're excited to hear about it and learn more. I think a lot of times people fear that people go down a rabbit hole if they have these scans. So, for example, your lungs have nodules, just like your skin has freckles. And so I feel if you get a baseline, don't be scared if there's a few nodules on there. Follow up in 6 to 12 months like we do with skin marks. Right. Is that freckle been there? Yes. Okay. Let's just watch it for a year. If it doesn't change, come back in another year. Yeah, Right. So I think there's ways around that. There's also all the technology that'll help us, you know, know what rabbit hole to go down and not other ones. The other thing that's going on right now is if you need a mammogram or a colonoscopy, it's not a shared decision model. You can just sign up and get one. And with lung CTs, you have to have a doctor order it. So it's an extra step. You have to meet with the doctor. You have to give them the reasons you want it and have this extra step. So I'd love to kind of change that, too, so that we can take care of ourselves, advocate for ourselves and get it done. And then.
- [24:26]
Savannah
Well, yeah, because if you have to go to a doctor to have them refer you, I mean, it's just one more step that makes it complicated. It's just. It's frustrating.
- [24:36]
Shira Bowler
And so I think. I believe that they're on board with me, and they want to, you know, figure it out and make the right changes. Also, the guidelines are antiquated today. My peers, they don't smoke cigarettes. They might vape. Well, that's not included in that. And you're reading about vape causing problems with people.
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Savannah
Yes.
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Shira Bowler
And it's antiquated. It's old. We need to fix it.
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Savannah
Yeah. And, you know, going back to you speaking about doing this scan, you know, your husband Adam was a huge advocate of like, get the scan done, get the scan done. Would you say, how would you say, did this whole process affect your marriage in any way? Like, you know, whether you were frustrated as all get out when he's like, go get it. And then after you found the results, like, what would you say?
- [25:27]
Shira Bowler
Well, it's funny, I was mad because I didn't want to do it. So he ended up doing it the day before me and I didn't show up because I was like, no, I'm not going. I have things to do.
- [25:35]
Savannah
I have things to do. I'm fine, I'm healthy.
- [25:39]
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- [26:09]
Shira Bowler
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Savannah
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Shira Bowler
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Savannah
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Shira Bowler
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Savannah
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Shira Bowler
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- [27:04]
Shira Bowler
by Grainger for the ones who get it done. And then when I did it and it didn't really bring anything up to the surface that were issues. I was of course like see perfect inside, just like outside done, you know, and kind of dismissed it again. And then when I ultimately followed up with the low dose CT and then followed up again and he had to come home, it did affect a lot. So I said before, he was in Afghanistan picking up hostages the week that I was.
- [27:33]
Savannah
And for people that don't know, that's just like a very casual. My husband was in Afghanistan picking up hostages. I know, like, very. People are gonna be like, what? Your husband, what is his role?
- [27:43]
Shira Bowler
Yeah. So he works for President Trump. He's the special presidential envoy for Hostage Response. So he is in charge of all hostage negotiating across the whole world. So, for example, the week I was in the hospital with surgery was actually the week that the final Hamas hostages were finally released, thank God. And he had been working on that so so much, actually. Little side story.
- [28:08]
Savannah
Yeah.
- [28:08]
Shira Bowler
I write in a book every single day called One Line a Day. I've been doing it for six and a half years. So every day I write one sentence about what happened that day. So on May 11 is today, I wrote. I'll write a sentence tonight about my day. So I'll talk about being here, things like that. And what happens is I read up what I did one year ago, on May 11, two years ago, on May 11, three years ago, just one sentence. So it's not a lot of pressure. I highly recommend it.
- [28:36]
Savannah
I love that.
- [28:37]
Shira Bowler
And so today I actually read what I did on May 11th last year. So May 11th last year was Mother's Day. Four kids woke up. We had a crazy day. So a hostage that was in Iraq's sister actually flew to Nashville to sit down and talk to us about helping her get her sister out. And she did. She came out in September. She's, you know, recovering and dealing with some health issues, but doing great. Super, super, wonderful family. While we were in that conversation with her, we got a call saying that they were going to release a hostage from Hamas, a Don Alexander, who is the remaining American from New Jersey that was being held. And my husband and I had to get up, leave this one woman sister who was talking to us, pack a bag, flew to New York, flew to Israel with Adon's mom to. To greet him as he came home and make sure they were set up. So that was a year ago, which is funny because I read about it this morning. So fast forward in October of last year when I was diagnosed with lung cancer. The week that I was in surgery and in the hospital following was the week that the final Hamas hostages were released. We were not there. We were at Vanderbilt having surgery. And as I was getting text messages from a lot of friends, why don't I see you in the videos? Why aren't you there? Are you there? Congratulations to Adam. How's it going? I'm so happy that the October 7th hostages are finally being released. And I was responding. I have lung cancer and I'm in the hospital. And so at this, like, height and like happiest moment to finally get these last individuals out from Hamas captivity, we weren't there to celebrate. We weren't there with the families. We were in the hospital. And so I think that those couple weeks of dealing with that, the highs and lows and like, just. It was really hard on our family because you sometimes have to celebrate the wins when things are so hard to be with these families.
- [30:34]
Savannah
Well, it goes to show too. It's like cancer takes over. Cancer takes over. And it takes over more than just your body, you know, it takes over your family and your marriage and your friendships. And there's a sense of anger too, right? Of like, my husband has worked so hard. We have, as a family, have sacrificed so much for what he does, and now we're not even there to celebrate it, right?
- [31:04]
Shira Bowler
No, it's 100% true. That's why I called my foundation. Cancer doesn't care because it doesn't care that he should be there and I should be there. If you have money or you don't. And it's affecting. They think 40% of Americans are gonna be diagnosed with cancer in their lifetime. And I hope that cancer becomes like a chronic illness that we die with, not from. And if we catch it in stage one, if we do these scans, if we are lucky enough to catch it before bad symptoms occur, then we have a 90% chance of survival.
- [31:35]
Savannah
That's amazing. That's amazing. I also too, just in the world that we live in, the lack of humanity is very much present. And I just think I have heard and I've known people who have had cancer and their spouse just didn't show up for them or. And your husband very well could have gone and gotten that last hostage, you know, but chose to be here at Vanderbilt with you. I think that just goes to show a lot. Which is sad, right?
- [32:06]
Shira Bowler
It better be.
- [32:07]
Savannah
But of course, yeah, that should be expected. But the amount of people that I know to where their spouse didn't show up is honestly heartbreaking. And so your faith in the midst
- [32:17]
Shira Bowler
of all of this, you know, has gone through the roof. It's insane. I often say that the reason I got that follow up ct, my aunt passed away in August and she was like my guardian angel on my shoulder telling me to follow up. I think that when I think about my options back in October, after I had my surgery to remove half my lung and then figuring out what I was going to do going forward. A lot of my neighbor, for example, said to me, I can't believe you're writing a book. And you're out there yelling and screaming and trying to change guidelines. Like, you could just say, great, cancer's gone. I'm going to go back to be bopping around. Right. And I didn't. And I think it's because I feel like this is my chance and somebody put me on this earth to do this and to focus on it and to, like, go out there and yell and scream. So I'm Jewish, and the word we use in our religion and our culture is beshert, which is similar to, like, meant to be.
- [33:14]
Savannah
Okay.
- [33:15]
Shira Bowler
And I think sometimes, you know, meeting Kim, and she being a thoracic radiologist specializing in lung cancer for young women who've never smoked. We met in the school parking lot. Our kids aren't that close, but we forged this relationship. We meet for sushi every other month, and all of a sudden, she's on ground zero. I'm her clinic of one. She found my lung cancer. What are the chances of that? What are the chances that my dad's a lung doctor and knew how to navigate the system, that my husband's a healthcare entrepreneur and investor, knew to go get that SC all of these different things?
- [33:49]
Savannah
That's amazing.
- [33:50]
Shira Bowler
It has given me a lot of faith. And it is all Bashar. I mean, all these pieces, even over the last six months that have fallen into place, I have become much, you know, more into realizing that somebody's out there looking out for us.
- [34:04]
Savannah
I love that. Do you think a part of to your organization? Right. Cancer doesn't care. Would you, when you look at that from an outside perspective, would you say that there's some survivor's guilt that goes along with that? You know, you had the tools, you had the resources, you had your husband saying, go and get this. And if you didn't, it could have ended very differently.
- [34:31]
Shira Bowler
You're right. I do. So my forward is written by a woman, Ann woJcicki. She's the CEO and founder of 23andMe. And I've known her since we were in our early 20s. Like, talk about another bashert moment. We randomly met. She wasn't even married, no kids yet.
- [34:47]
Savannah
Wow.
- [34:48]
Shira Bowler
We've known each other long time. Used to get up to no good in San Francisco together and lost touch for a few years. Reconnected just around the COVID time. We both were living In Montana. And her sister passed away from lung cancer. Susan, she passed away in August of 24. She was the CEO of YouTube.
- [35:08]
Savannah
YouTube, yeah.
- [35:08]
Shira Bowler
Yeah. Had five healthy kids, was a big runner, very active individual. And I, you know, was tangentially around Ann and her family during this, like, terrible 18 month period of her being sick and ultimately passing. I saw it really weigh on the family, financially, emotionally, everything like that. So a year later, when I found out I had lung cancer and had to call her and tell her, she was like, oh, my God. And what I realized in those following weeks when I was stage one and that I have a chance to beat it, I talk to Ann about it a lot, that I feel bad and that I want to keep Susan's memory alive and I want her to be part of my book and I want to share her name and share her story. Because Susan wasn't a big. Wasn't a smoker. She was a runner. She did all the right things. She tried to be healthy. She did everything she was supposed to do. And it's not fair that her kids lost their mom, that Ann lost her sister, that her parents lost their daughter. And so it's like this survivor guilt, but I'm trying to channel it into,
- [36:13]
Savannah
like, in a healthy way.
- [36:14]
Shira Bowler
Yeah. Promote these amazing young, healthy women and try to change it so that no one else has to go through what Ann went through.
- [36:22]
Savannah
Yeah. And would you say that your kids have a lot to do with this as well? You know, like their resiliency throughout this entire process and what you're fighting for now is really fighting for them?
- [36:34]
Shira Bowler
Yeah. I mean, 100%. When all of it started happening, my youngest is in third grade. I was like, am I gonna make it to her elementary school graduation? And it's something I think about all the time. My oldest are freshmen in high school. Will I see them graduate high school? And I'm hopeful and grateful and try to be positive on it and try to spread the word, because I want more people to be lucky like me. If you're gonna have lung cancer, let's catch it in stage one. You know, I don't wish lung cancer on anyone, but the more I can get the word out and get people to look at their lung CTs and advocate for themselves, the better. My website, cancerdoesn't care.com, it has access to my book or the foundation or information on. You can put in your zip code and find an accredited radiology group to go see and get your lung ct. That's amazing. But the Other thing it does is it teaches you how to ask your doctor for it. Since we have this shared approach right now and you can print it and be like, this is what I want. This is how I want to do it. This is what's important to me that
- [37:35]
Savannah
is brilliant to help.
- [37:37]
Shira Bowler
Because doctors are going to say no. That's the reality.
- [37:40]
Savannah
They're going to say no until you fight them.
- [37:41]
Shira Bowler
Right. First of all, insurance isn't going to cover it right now. So going in, you have to understand you're going to have to pay the 200 bucks. But also the doctors are going to push back. Why would you get your lung CT? You're not 50 and smoking a pack a day for 20 years. Those are our guidelines. Don't worry about it. So you have to advocate and advocate and push and push and push until you can get it. And so that's other stuff that's on my website or resources about bills that are going through the House and Senate that are trying to change and push to say women, young, healthy women, not just over the age of 50, smoking a pack a day should be getting their lungs checked.
- [38:17]
Savannah
I love that I say so many times, do you go to the doctor and you feel like you're just left there? You know, when you leave the doctor's office, you leave nine times out of ten with very little resources and you don't know which way to turn or who to ask questions or how to ask those questions.
- [38:37]
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- [39:07]
Shira Bowler
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- [39:38]
Savannah
And something too. I want to touch on that I thought was pretty funny. You speak about how your children laughed when you told Them that you had cancer. Can you go into that a little more?
- [39:51]
Shira Bowler
I know it seems ridiculous. Like, they're heartless. I think they were in shock. So, as I said, I did that scan on the Monday morning, went for my run, did the scan. My husband walked in, met the pulmonologist. They said, you have lung cancer. We talked for a while with the doctor. What do you mean, what are the chances? Could it be something else? Could you be confused? Like, let's go through it? And ultimately, when we left the doctor, I said to my husband, you have to go pick up the kids. We have to go tell them. Like, we tell our kids everything. Our oldest actually lived in almost seven states before they turned 10. We moved and traveled a lot, and so we're. They're resilient, but we, you know, lay it all on the line. We don't hide anything through all the hostage stuff. They've met a lot of the Hamas hostages or the one in Iraq or different ones all over the world. And we tell them everything. We don't lie. So I had my husband pick him up from school, and I went home, and I told him I didn't want to use the C word. Cancer just feels really scary. And so he brings them home, and he says, everyone on the white couch, which is like our TV room, we need to talk. And the kids walk in, and my daughter looks and she says, are you getting divorced, or does mom have cancer? And we froze. And my husband's like, what are you talking about? And she said, I don't know. I'm 14. Dad's never picked me up from school before.
- [41:11]
Savannah
Wow.
- [41:12]
Shira Bowler
So we all start kind of laughing.
- [41:13]
Savannah
That's exactly how I was when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer. My dad picked me up from school, and I got checked out of school early. And the moment I saw his face, I was like, it's cancer, isn't it? Because he never picked us up from school.
- [41:31]
Shira Bowler
So my kids knew immediately. And then they said. And then we said, well, you know, mom saw a doctor today. We're gonna figure this out. You know, she has a procedure tomorrow. Cause the bronchoscopy is basically a biopsy to tell you.
- [41:43]
Savannah
Yeah.
- [41:44]
Shira Bowler
So we said, we're gonna have. She's gonna have a biopsy procedure tomorrow, and then we'll know. So then my son said, well, what are the chances it's cancer? And I think that they all thought it was gonna be like 1 or 0.1 or 3%. And my husband said, 90. And they all started laughing. And I Think it was because it was like, this is ludicrous. Mom has lung cancer. Like, this doesn't make sense.
- [42:06]
Savannah
Yeah.
- [42:07]
Shira Bowler
So that's kind of what happened, you know, and fast forward. I don't talk about it in the book. My son's friend on his soccer team, the mom was just diagnosed with breast cancer. And so I said to him, you should talk to your friend and say if you wanna talk about anything, you know that it can be really scary that you just this with your mom a few months ago. And my son said to me, mom, that is so embarrassing. You have fake cancer.
- [42:32]
Savannah
You have fake cancer.
- [42:34]
Shira Bowler
And I think what he meant by that and what I realized with them, because my youngest just brought it up again yesterday, is that I didn't lose my hair. I don't look like I have lung cancer. I don't look sick. I look fine. Everything's okay. I'm actually running.
- [42:47]
Savannah
Kids, right. They.
- [42:49]
Shira Bowler
They don't see it. They don't know that I go to the hospital at least once a week for blood work or scans or different appointments. They don't see that. And they see me as young and healthy still. Their mom, like, I'm back to running. I was running after five weeks, you know, holy cow. And so I just think that to them is fake cancer. I think that that cold capping process that they now have that insurance doesn't cover and so they should again, helps.
- [43:12]
Savannah
That's insane as well.
- [43:14]
Shira Bowler
It helps because it's. It. It still shows the mom as a strong mom and not weak or feeling sick or bald like that.
- [43:22]
Savannah
For kids, when they see that, it's so traumatizing. Because I feel like you correlate that with death. Right. Like when things start looking different and you start looking frail or you lose your hair. Insurance should be forced to cover the cost of some of these things. Yeah. And that's where I think a lot of you, the work that you're doing is going to be beneficial. And I've always said, you know what? Be as loud as you can possibly be. That's how like my family and our situation, our outcome would have never happened if I wasn't as loud as I could possibly be.
- [43:57]
Shira Bowler
Yeah.
- [43:57]
Savannah
And I think people are so afraid of being told no. But I'm like, okay, what's the worst that can happen? You being told no. Okay, great. Then you find another way.
- [44:07]
Shira Bowler
Right? You're still in the same situation you're in. That's why you have to advocate for yourself and yell and scream. I, with my book, I have been Yelling and screaming. And I use the book as an anchor, but I'm really trying to change policy from the top down and educate people from the top up. And then with the foundation, and it made New York Times bestseller last week, which was super exciting.
- [44:27]
Savannah
That's amazing. Congratulations.
- [44:30]
Shira Bowler
Because I just want to yell and scream and get people their lungs to get people to get their lungs checked. And I want insurance and Medicare and Medicaid to pay for it. And I want you to advocate for yourself. And if you go and you get a scan or your doctor pushes back and doesn't want to give it to you, find another doctor.
- [44:45]
Savannah
Find another doctor.
- [44:46]
Shira Bowler
Get another opinion. I just always say that. And people say to me, oh, I'm nervous. I don't want my doctor to be mad at me. And I'm like, you have to advocate for yourself. Yell and scream.
- [44:55]
Savannah
Who cares if they're mad at you? Your life is on the line.
- [44:57]
Shira Bowler
Yeah, yell and scream. That's what I say. From all the rooftops.
- [45:01]
Savannah
Wow. That is. Hey, I am the same way. You and I are very similar. I'm like, I don't care if they're mad at you. Like, go and scream. It doesn't matter if they're your friend. If they're not your friend. Like this. This is your life that's on the line. And why. Do we know why lung cancer is affecting so many women under the age of 50?
- [45:21]
Shira Bowler
Yeah, you know, they don't. They haven't done the research. They don't know why. Why is 40% of the country getting cancer? Why is breast cancer so high? At least with breast cancer, it's almost like the cancer to get. They seem to be able to catch it early. They seem to have good medicine for it. They seem to be able to beat it, which is a great place to be, and I hope that's where we go for lung cancer.
- [45:42]
Savannah
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- [45:48]
Shira Bowler
If my teenager starts calling me Leslie, that's a family thing.
- [45:51]
Savannah
Leslie. Verbo Care and 24. 7 Life Support. If you know you verbo terms apply. See vrbo.com trust for details.
- [45:57]
Shira Bowler
This is a paid message from GoFundMe. Meet Juan Naula. When his son was hospitalized for a viral infection, Juan started a GoFundMe to pay for medical expenses.
- [46:07]
Savannah
It was 5k to pay the bill for my son, and I need only 22 hours.
- [46:12]
Shira Bowler
It was amazing.
- [46:14]
Savannah
People really trust on GoFundMe.
- [46:16]
Shira Bowler
How did Juan raise $5,000 in less than a day? He posted a short video on GoFundMe telling his story in 30 seconds. 30 seconds.
- [46:25]
Savannah
Be specific. Be quick and tell.
- [46:28]
Shira Bowler
What are you going to be using the funds for?
- [46:31]
Savannah
I was nervous to do it because it doesn't feel okay to ask money. But you shouldn't be nervous. Sometimes you just have to do it
- [46:38]
Shira Bowler
and see the results. We were able to save my son's
- [46:42]
Savannah
life thanks to gofundme that we still have my son with us.
- [46:47]
Shira Bowler
Start your GoFundMe today at gofundme.com that's gofundme.com gofundme.com this message reflects one person's experience. You know, I told you earlier, my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer when I was 49. And I remember when she would tell people. And then I think about how it is when I tell people. So almost 100% of the time when I tell someone I have lung cancer, they say, do you smoke? Did you smoke? I didn't realize you smoked. Do your parents smoke? And it's almost like they want a reason, and it's to protect themselves. She has lung cancer. I won't because I don't smoke. My parents didn't smoke. Whatever the reason is. And the reality is, if you have lungs, you can get lung cancer. When my mom told people she had breast cancer, when your mom had to go through it, I'm sure people were like, can I help you with the kids? What meal can I make? Let me see what I can do to help. And for me, it's, why do you have that? It's your fault.
- [47:39]
Savannah
It's your fault. It's always so much easier, right, to make it seem like it's someone's fault.
- [47:44]
Shira Bowler
Right? And it isn't. If you have lungs, you can get lung cancer. Just like boobs give you breast cancer, a tushy can give you colon cancer. And so we need to check for it, and we need to change that narrative, because that stigma isn't gonna help anyone. And it's not true. And so I think there is a reason that cancer's on the rise. Breast, you know, colon, lung, it's probably in our air, it's probably in the food we eat. It's probably something they don't know.
- [48:13]
Savannah
Well, that was something, too, that, you know, I spoke about recently was the farm bill and how in the farm bill it was giving these pesticide companies full immunity so that you can't come back and say, Well, I got cancer because of your product. And luckily, that was removed from the farm bill. But when you look at things like that, you know, for me, obviously, in this administration, everyone knows where I stand. Huge supporter. But when I saw that, I was like, whoa, what are we doing? What are we doing? To try to set proper boundaries so that my future children aren't harmed by what's going on in our food.
- [48:52]
Shira Bowler
Yeah, I mean, they're missing something. So we've got to figure it out and find it. And that's gonna take time and money and research and resources. And I hope they figure it out, because if 40% of us are gonna get cancer, we have to figure out how to beat cancer, and we have to figure out how to lower that. I don't wanna just see it keep ticking up and up and up so that. That our kids see 60 or so. I don't know. And so it's not.
- [49:16]
Savannah
And it's like you said, cancer doesn't care. Cancer doesn't care if you're a Democrat or a Republican. If you're rich, you're poor, female, male, child, adult. Like, cancer does not care. And this is very much a bipartisan issue, as it should be. And we have to focus on this. We have to put money into the research in our foods and what we're consuming. And. And, you know, I think we saw the first step, obviously, with Secretary Kennedy and hospital food, and that was huge because I have a really good friend here in Nashville. Their little girl was diagnosed with cancer. And she was. I think she was four maybe when she was diagnosed. And when I tell you they live the healthiest life imaginable, like, her dad is a. A big time, you know, trainer and health and wellness guy. He came on my podcast and talked about it. But when she was in the hospital here at Vanderbilt, she was in the room to where they were receiving, you know, their treatments. And a kid comes up and asks her, I believe, if she wanted, you know, one of these popsicles. And her mom was like, no, you can't have that. And it was the Flavor O Ice brand, and it's all red dye 40 and the blue dyes, high fructose corn syrup. And they donated to over a hundred childhood cancer institutions. And her mom is like, this is literally killing kids. Like, children are already being, you know, their bodies are being put through so much with this chemo, and then we're just going to stack it on. And now their little girl is like, nope, I can't have that. And you shouldn't be eating it either. And this is why, like, now she's seven, she's doing so good. But, you know, her mother had to advocate for her. She had to tell doctors, no, we're not doing this. We're doing this. You know, she went all around the world making sure that she was providing the best treatment for her child possible versus just listening to what a hospital saying.
- [51:22]
Shira Bowler
Yeah, no, I mean, it's true that that's why it goes back to the fridge, not the pantry. But then you talk about pesticides, and it's scary because doing the best I can with the fridge, not the pantry, but who knows what's in it?
- [51:33]
Savannah
You know, what was a. I just saw. I think it was maybe Moms for America just posted about. It was Driscoll's. I think, you know, the strawberry brand and the amount of pesticides on it. And I was like, oh, my God. Gosh, I would have never thought. Like, you said fridge versus pantry. But it just goes to, you know, I. You see all these, like, crunchy moms, right? And it's like, all right, this is how you clean your fruit and baking soda and this and that. And I'm like, all right, you were on to something. We all should have listened to you. Time to clean everything that you buy. Yeah, that is wild. So what is next for you? First off, your healing journey. Your better. Now you're back to running what is.
- [52:20]
Shira Bowler
So there's actually no medicine for me because research is behind for lung cancer. So I. My medicine right now is aggressive surveillance. So I get blood work every six weeks in, a CT every 12. And they're just gonna watch.
- [52:33]
Savannah
Okay.
- [52:34]
Shira Bowler
And the idea is, if it does come back, I can have surgery again. I can do, like, a very, you know, aggressive of chemo. But the markers on my tumor, there's no real medicine for me yet. But with anything, I'm sure it will come. So that's kind of where I am. And then for me, I've just been yelling from the rooftops, and I think that's been a lot of my healing journey. I'm a little bit like, don't go inside. Just start yelling outside. And it's helped me to spread the word about my book and about the foundation and about just getting people's lungs checked. I often say, like, get your lungs checked. Cancer doesn't care. Get your lungs checked. Cancer doesn't care. Because that's true. Right? And so if we can check it and catch it early, we can be in better shape. And I try to do a lot of Patient advocacy or meet with doctors or a lot of times with Secretary Kennedy or Dr. Oz and you know, the government officials that can help change those guidelines.
- [53:27]
Savannah
And that's the thing is they can change it. And I think what's so hard for people on the outside, Right, because they don't know the world of politics like you and I have come to know it. Just because it's not happening today doesn't mean that they don't care.
- [53:42]
Shira Bowler
Right.
- [53:43]
Savannah
They are dealing with a, than what we're dealing with in our day to day life. So our advocacy work may be for me, prison reform, yours, lung cancer, there's a million other of those, you know, things that they're worried about. But just cause it's not happening today doesn't mean that they don't care. And they are taking steps to move these initiatives forward. It does unfortunately just take time.
- [54:08]
Shira Bowler
Right. I mean it's good that we're not in a dictatorship or autocratic society. So everything needs to be done. They want the research, they want to make sure they follow the right guidelines and right protocols for all that research. They can't just do things flippantly.
- [54:21]
Savannah
Yes.
- [54:22]
Shira Bowler
And I think they are moving in that direction and I think we see it in other pieces with the bills or this or that, that Secretary Kennedy's been working on. And I think, I think we'll get there, but in the meantime, get your lungs especially.
- [54:34]
Savannah
Yes, I was going to say you're like. But we'll get there. Especially with your work and advocacy that you're doing. It is honestly amazing. You know, a lot of people could have taken their journey and just gone inward and been angry or. I'm fine, so let me go on about my life. But you've chosen the other path which is to care about others and hopefully prevent this from happening to others. So that is absolutely amazing. Where can I want you to tell people where they can find you and your book and, and maybe learn more about lung cancer. Yeah.
- [55:11]
Shira Bowler
So my book, I mean you can get it on Amazon. There's the Audible too, it's Myvoice.
- [55:15]
Savannah
Oh, I love it. Your voice is very therapeutic.
- [55:18]
Shira Bowler
So if that's the way you read it. Right. And then my website, cancerdoesincare.com has a lot of information. You can buy the book, you can email me through that website if you want, like a bulk order of books. We have opportunity for that. It has information about how to talk to your doctor to get a lung ct. It has information about where to go to get it. Some of the Bills that are going through the House and the Senate. So everything is kind of on that website. And you can buy the book through that too. But oftentimes people like Amazon. Cause it's a quick click.
- [55:48]
Savannah
Yes, exactly. And before we wrap up, we are going to be doing a giveaway. So we have two amazing boxes. One scan saved my life. And I'm gonna let Shira tell us what's in it.
- [55:59]
Shira Bowler
Yeah. So in the box I have a signed copy of my book. And inside the signed copy of my book, there's a discount code for 23andMe, as well as a free low dose lung CT scan from Function Health and a little bookmark insert that has some interesting facts and ways to learn more about lung cancer and my foundation, Cancer doesn't care. And then you can get this cute little hat that says cancer doesn't care and a book light so that you can read your book in bed and not bother your spouse.
- [56:36]
Savannah
I love that. I think. What? As much as I love everything that's in it, the lung scan that is huge for someone that needs it, that maybe can't afford it, that hasn't gone and gotten. Whatever your circumstances may be, I think this is absolutely amazing. So thank you so much for coming on. I love this and I know you're gonna change millions of people's lives just with the work you're doing.
- [57:02]
Shira Bowler
This is awesome. Thank you so much.
- [57:04]
Savannah
Of course, at first, I didn't think it was real.
- [57:08]
Shira Bowler
I woke up to this blinding light
- [57:09]
Savannah
and I was transported to another place.
- [57:13]
Shira Bowler
Pluto tv.
- [57:14]
Savannah
Then I heard a voice.
- [57:16]
Shira Bowler
Come with me if you want to live.
- [57:18]
Savannah
There were thousands of movies and shows, and they were all free.
- [57:21]
Shira Bowler
Truth is, it's just so Beautiful on Pluto TV. Free streaming of Terminator 2, Fringe Arrow, the 100 hundred and the X Files may cause excitement, loss of sleep, and sudden belief in extraterrestrials. No credit cards or alien encounters necessary. Pluto TV Stream now pay never.