Migration and Trade with India, Trump and Putin Chat, Future of Education Department

Summary

Up First from NPR – February 13, 2025

Episode: Migration and Trade with India, Trump and Putin Chat, Future of Education Department

NPR’s Up First for February 13, 2025, delves into three major stories shaping today’s headlines: the evolving trade and migration dynamics between the United States and India, President Trump’s recent diplomatic engagements with Russian President Vladimir Putin amidst the Ukraine conflict, and the contentious nomination of Linda McMahon to lead the Department of Education. This detailed summary captures the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode, enriched with notable quotes and timestamps for context.

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1. US-India Trade Tensions and Migration Issues

Overview: The episode opens with a focus on the strained trade relations between the United States and India. President Trump has criticized India for what he perceives as unfair trade practices, particularly high tariffs on US imports. This tension coincides with an upcoming meeting between Trump and Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi in Washington, D.C., raising concerns about the potential impact on their bilateral relationship.

Key Points:

• Trade Disputes:

  • Trump’s Accusations: President Trump labeled India as "the biggest charger of all" regarding tariffs, emphasizing his administration's push for "reciprocal tariffs" to balance trade deficits. (Layla Falden, [00:03] & Michelle Martin, [00:07])
  • India’s Response: Despite Trump’s criticisms, Modi has maintained a cordial relationship with Trump, highlighted by their shared populist styles and joint rallies. Modi recently announced a reduction in tariffs on motorbikes, potentially opening the door for increased US exports like Harley Davidsons. (Asma Khalid, [02:02] & Janaki Mehta, [02:30])

• Negotiation Dynamics:

  • US Trade Deficit: The US is currently running a trade deficit with India, making trade negotiation a top priority for the Trump administration. Lisa Curtis from Trump’s National Security Council noted Modi’s efforts to mitigate broader trade conflicts by offering to increase imports of American oil and gas. (Janaki Mehta, [04:27])
  • Risk of Souring Relations: Layla Falden cautions that failed trade negotiations could significantly damage the longstanding US-India relationship, especially given the high expectations from Trump’s team. (Layla Falden, [04:38])

• Immigration Concerns:

  • Illegal Immigration: With Indians constituting the third largest group of undocumented immigrants in the US, immigration remains a critical issue. Recent actions, such as the Trump administration’s deportation of a group of Indians on a military plane, have sparked political backlash in India. (Asma Khalid, [04:50] & Janaki Mehta, [04:50])
  • Legal Immigration Pathways: India emphasizes the importance of maintaining legal immigration channels, particularly work visas, amid Trump's focus on curbing illegal immigration. (Janaki Mehta, [04:50])

Notable Quotes:

• Michelle Martin on Trade: “The biggest charger of all is India. India's a very big charger. We have a great relationship with India.” (Michelle Martin, [02:54])
• Lisa Curtis on Education Department: “I believe abolishing the Department of Education is definitely a big part of the solution.” (Lisa Curtis, [12:16])

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2. Trump’s Diplomatic Engagements with Putin and Ukraine Conflict

Overview: The second major story explores President Trump’s recent diplomatic moves aimed at resolving the ongoing war in Ukraine. Trump engaged in long conversations with both Russian President Vladimir Putin and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, signaling a potential shift in US foreign policy and its approach to the conflict.

Key Points:

• Trump-Putin Discussions:

  • Negotiation Intentions: Following a lengthy phone call, Trump asserted that negotiations to end the war in Ukraine would commence immediately. (Layla Falden, [00:15] & Trump, [06:12])
  • Alignment with Russia: According to NPR’s Russia correspondent, Charles Mainz, the discussions between Trump and Putin were consistent across their public statements, with Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov confirming that both leaders are “in sync” regarding the desire to end the conflict. (Pete Hegseth, [06:32] & [07:26])
  • Market Reactions: Putin and Trump’s talks were met with positive reactions in Moscow, with Russian markets rising in response to the diplomatic overtures, marking a notable shift from the previous administration’s stance. (Pete Hegseth, [07:26])

• Trump-Zelensky Interactions:

  • Communication with Ukraine: Trump updated Zelenskyy on his discussions with Putin, but the interaction was perceived as unfavorable for Ukraine. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth dismissed the likelihood of Ukraine regaining pre-war borders and ruled out NATO membership for Ukraine, two demands central to Putin's negotiation strategy. (Pete Hegseth, [08:00])
  • Perception of Obstruction: Zelenskyy might interpret Trump’s remarks as placing blame on his leadership rather than Russian aggression, potentially complicating the peace process. (Pete Hegseth, [08:00])

• Prisoner Exchange:

  • Mark Fogel and Alexander Vinnik: Russia agreed to release Mark Fogel, an American schoolteacher imprisoned on marijuana charges, in exchange for Alexander Vinnik, a Russian cryptocurrency trader convicted of money laundering in the US. This exchange is seen as a trust-building gesture but may raise concerns about the optics of rewarding Russian actions and sidelining Ukraine. (Pete Hegseth, [08:51])

Notable Quotes:

• Michelle Martin on Peace: “I think we're on the way to getting peace. I think President Putin wants peace, and President Zelensky wants peace, and I want peace. I just want to see people stop getting killed.” (Michelle Martin, [06:12])
• Pete Hegseth on Negotiations: “Trump threatened massive new sanctions on Putin to force him to the negotiating table. That more aggressive tone by Trump was gone completely yesterday...” (Pete Hegseth, [07:53])

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3. Future of the Department of Education: Linda McMahon’s Nomination

Overview: The episode shifts to domestic policy, focusing on the Senate confirmation hearing of Linda McMahon for the role of Secretary of Education. This nomination is controversial, particularly because the Trump administration has signaled intentions to dismantle the Department of Education, raising questions about McMahon’s future in the role.

Key Points:

• Nomination Challenges:

  • Planned Dismantling: President Trump has unequivocally stated that the primary goal for McMahon would be to abolish the Department of Education. “I hope she will work herself out of a job,” Trump remarked, indicating a swift and significant reduction of the agency’s functions. (Layla Falden, [09:55] & Rich Couture, [10:47])
  • Scope of the Department: The Department oversees crucial programs, including funding for schools in low-income areas and protections for students with disabilities, with an annual budget of $79 billion and 4,200 employees. Any significant cuts would require Congressional approval. (Rich Couture, [10:47])

• Confirmation Hearing Expectations:

  • Partisan Lines: The hearing is expected to be highly partisan, with Democratic lawmakers criticizing the administration’s approach to education. Representative Bobby Scott (D-VA) highlighted the contradiction between discussing education dismantling while on the Hill. (Rich Couture, [11:49])
  • Republican Stance: Republican Representative Bob Onder (MO) accused the Biden Education Department of promoting “liberal identity politics” over educational quality, reflecting the broader GOP agenda to reform education policies. (Rich Couture, [12:16])
  • McMahon’s Platform: Although McMahon lacks extensive experience in education, her background with WWE and previous service on the Connecticut State Board of Education positions her as a potentially transformative, albeit controversial, leader. She has expressed support for school choice and educational reform but remains largely silent on specific plans for the Department. (Rich Couture, [12:30] & [12:37])

• Future Implications:

  • Potential Abolition: Eliminating the Department would necessitate legislative action, and even if confirmed, McMahon’s focus would likely be on reducing the department’s scope rather than outright abolition. (Rich Couture, [11:35] & [10:47])
  • Program Continuity: Key programs could persist if Congress chooses to maintain them, despite administrative efforts to streamline or reduce departmental functions. (Rich Couture, [11:31])

Notable Quotes:

• Republican Representative Bob Onder on Education Department: “The Biden Education Department basically pushed liberal identity politics over learning.” (Bob Onder, [12:16])
• Lisa Curtis on Department Abolition: “I believe abolishing the Department of Education is definitely a big part of the solution. How can we get back on the focus of educating kids rather than indoctrination...” (Lisa Curtis, [12:16])

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4. Additional Update: Federal Workers' Resignation Program

Overview: In a related development, the Trump administration has implemented a program allowing federal workers to resign while continuing to receive pay until September. This move has led to significant resignations but also confusion regarding eligibility and exemptions.

Key Points:

• Program Implementation:

  • Acceptance Rates: Over 65,000 federal employees have accepted the resignation offer, though many may not meet eligibility criteria. (Rich Couture, [13:27])
  • Legal Challenges: Labor unions contested the program, arguing that it was implemented hastily and overstepped governmental authority. However, a Boston federal judge denied blocking the program, citing procedural grounds. (Rich Couture, [13:27])

• Impact on Federal Workforce:

  • Confusion and Exemptions: The program has primarily affected exempt positions such as field office workers, hearing office workers, and teleservice center workers. Many opted to resign without realizing their ineligibility, leading to ongoing uncertainty. (Rich Couture, [13:27])

Notable Quotes:

• Rich Couture on Resignation Program: “Most field office workers, hearing office workers, teleservice center workers, payment center workers, most of those positions are exempt.” (Rich Couture, [13:27])

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Conclusion: Today's episode of Up First provides a comprehensive look at critical international and domestic issues, highlighting the complexities of US-India trade relations, the delicate diplomacy surrounding the Ukraine conflict, and the contentious future of the Department of Education under Linda McMahon’s potential leadership. The discussions underscore the intertwined nature of trade, immigration, and education policies in shaping the current political landscape.

For more in-depth coverage and ongoing updates, subscribe to Up First and support your local NPR station at donate.npr.org.

Transcript

[Layla Falden]

President Trump says India is taking advantage of the US when it comes to tariffs.

[Michelle Martin]

The biggest charger of all is India.

[Asma Khalid]

He and Prime Minister Modi will meet today in Washington. Will a dispute over trade drive a wedge in their close relationship?

[Layla Falden]

I'm Layla Falden. That's Michelle Martin. And this is up first from NPR News. Trump also had a long phone call with Vladimir Putin. And afterwards he said negotiations to end the war in Ukraine will begin immediately.

[Michelle Martin]

I think we're on the way to getting peace.

[Layla Falden]

How did the leader of Ukraine respond?

[Asma Khalid]

And will Trump's nominee to lead the Department of Education work herself out of a job?

[Lisa Curtis]

I believe abolishing the Department of Education is definitely a big part of the solution.

[Asma Khalid]

Senators, question Linda McMahon later today. Stay with us. We'll give you the news you need to start your day.

[Ron Rutson]

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[Asma Khalid]

Modi will meet with President Trump here in Washington, D.C. today.

[Layla Falden]

In Trump's first term, the two men seem to have a natural camaraderie. But these days, Trump is focused a lot on trade and immigration, two issues that could put a dent in the long standing relationship between the US And India.

[Asma Khalid]

Joining us now to talk more about this is NPR White House correspondent Asma Khalid. Asma, good morning.

[Janaki Mehta]

Good morning.

[Asma Khalid]

So let's start with trade. We've heard a lot in recent days about tariffs. How does India factor into that?

[Janaki Mehta]

Mm, well, the president has been talking a lot about reciprocal tariffs. And Michelle, that's the idea that if a foreign country charges, say a 20% tariff on U.S. imports, then the U.S. ought to slap a 20% tariff back on them. Trump was actually talking about this idea even months ago during his campaign last fall, he accused India of being a, quote, big abuser of tariffs. Take a listen.

[Michelle Martin]

The biggest charger of all is India. India's a very big charger. We have a great relationship with India. I did, and with especially the leader, Modi.

[Janaki Mehta]

And so, as you notice there, despite the accusations he's making about India on trade, you know, Trump has a really fond relationship with India's leader. He had a very warm personal relationship with him. And Modi, quite literally, and famously gave Trump a bear hug when they two first met at the White House. And, you know, they're known to have similar populist styles. They went on to host these joint mega rallies together, first in Texas and then later in India with tens of thousands of supporters.

[Asma Khalid]

So if India has high tariffs on US Imports, and Trump, as you say, as he certainly says, repeatedly wants more fair, what he considers more fair trading relationships, what is the room for negotiation there?

[Janaki Mehta]

Well, trade is certainly the number one priority for the Trump administration in this relationship. The US Is in a trade deficit with India. Ahead of this visit, India announced that it was lowering tariffs on motorbikes, and that opens the door for more exports of Harley Davidsons, which is something that has been important to President Trump. Lisa Curtis was in Trump's National Security Council during his first term. She told me that Prime Minister Modi understands Trump, and he's also offering to increase imports of American oil and gas to avoid a broader fight over trade issues. But she also knows from experience that India is a tough negotiator.

[Layla Falden]

I think there's a greater risk that a failed trade negotiation this time around could really sour the overall US India relationship. I think the expectations of the Trump team of India are higher.

[Asma Khalid]

So, Asma, before we let you go, are there other issues that you expect these two leaders to discuss?

[Janaki Mehta]

Certainly immigration. Illegal immigration is a big priority for Trump. And according to estimates from the Pew Research center, the third largest group of people in the United States without legal status are actually Indians. Earlier this month, the Trump administration flew a group of Indians back to India on a military plane, and it caused some domestic political backlash for Modi. But I would say it's not just illegal immigration. I mean, India is very concerned about maintaining pathways to legal immigration, especially work visas. So I do expect immigration and trade, of course, to be major issues, because these are major fixations for President Trump. But other issues, I would say, Michelle, that are likely to come up are technology and defense cooperation India has had a very strong bipartisan relationship and bipartisan support over the last several administrations, Republican or Democrat. And we've seen that, especially as the United States has worked to counter China's influence in the region, that is.

[Asma Khalid]

And Asma Khalid. Asma, thank you.

[Janaki Mehta]

Nice to speak with you.

[Asma Khalid]

Donald Trump returned to the White House vowing to end the war in Ukraine, and yesterday he took action.

[Layla Falden]

He held his first confirmed talks with Russian President Vladimir Putin, followed by a conversation with Ukrainian leader Volodymyr Zelensky. And he says they went well.

[Michelle Martin]

I think we're on the way to getting peace. I think President Putin wants peace, and President Zelensky wants peace, and I want peace. I just want to see people stop getting killed.

[Asma Khalid]

We want to talk more about this. So we have here with us NPR's Russia correspondent Charles Mainz. Charles, good morning.

[Pete Hegseth]

Good morning, Michelle.

[Asma Khalid]

Let's start with that Putin call. What do we know?

[Pete Hegseth]

Well, you know, sometimes after calls between leaders, you see the two sides have very different takes on what was discussed, what was agreed upon. That's not the case here. You know, between Trump's postings on social media and his comments to the press, everything really aligned with what we heard from Moscow. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov may have issued a more formal readout, but one that made clear these two men are in sync. So here Peskov says Putin and Trump spoke for a full hour and a half. He went on to say that Trump reiterated his desire to end the war, and Putin agreed that was possible, provided it was a durable piece that addressed the root causes of the conflict. Now, the spokesman also said Putin agreed with Trump that it was time for the two countries to work together, and the two men agreed to meet in person. Trump says that may happen soon in Saudi Arabia, but the Kremlin said Putin also invited Trump to Moscow.

[Asma Khalid]

And what was the reaction in Moscow?

[Pete Hegseth]

Well, you know, there's a sense of celebration. The Russian markets went up this morning. This is a complete reversal by the US not just from the politics of the Biden administration, which, after all, spent the past three years trying to isolate Putin. But even from the first days of the Trump administration, you know, Trump threatened massive new sanctions on Putin to force him to the negotiating table. That more aggressive tone by Trump was gone completely yesterday, and it's still unclear what led to the change.

[Asma Khalid]

And, of course, there's another key party here, which is Ukraine. What do we know about his conversation with President Zelensky?

[Pete Hegseth]

Yeah, you know, Trump said he called Zelensky directly after speaking with Putin and brought him up to speed. But this was clearly not a good day for Ukraine. U.S. defense Secretary Pete Hegseth in Europe delivered a speech to NATO allies in which he said the US Believed it was unrealistic for Ukraine to regain its pre war borders. He also ruled out NATO membership for Ukraine, two key demands Putin has made repeatedly for a negotiated settlement. Meanwhile, it didn't help Zelenskyy to also hear Trump suggests Zelenskyy might not be around politically when and if are held in Ukraine. It just gave the feeling that Trump thinks Zelensky, not Putin, is the one who's the obstacle to peace here.

[Asma Khalid]

So, Charles, another issue here, Russia's release of Mark Fogel, an American schoolteacher who was serving a long sentence in Russia on charges he bought marijuana into the country illegally. Do we know more about the trade now, more details about this?

[Pete Hegseth]

Yeah. In exchange for Fogel, the US Is releasing Alexander Vinnik. He's a Russian cryptocurrency trader who'd been convicted of money laundering charges in the U.S. you know, clearly this is good news for the Fogel, also clearly a diplomatic sweetener. You know, both sides have made clear this was a trust building gesture as the US And Russia pursue a large deal over Ukraine. But there's plenty that could still go wrong. I mean, particularly I think around the optics of seeming weak in negotiations, whether it's Trump appearing to sideline Ukraine and reward Russian aggression or for that matter, Putin allowing Trump in the US to play sheriff and impose an end of the conflict. You know, that could be a hard sell for either side to bring as a win.

[Asma Khalid]

That is NPR's Russia correspondent, Charles Maines. Charles, thank you.

[Pete Hegseth]

Thanks, Michelle.

[Asma Khalid]

Linda McMahon's Senate confirmation hearing for education secretary today could be dramatic and unusual.

[Layla Falden]

Yeah, that's because the Trump administration has made clear that it plans to dismantle the department she's been nominated to lead.

[Asma Khalid]

NPR's Janaki Mehta has been following this story. Good morning, Janaki.

[Rich Couture]

Good morning.

[Asma Khalid]

Before we get to what we can expect on the Hill today, would you just start by telling us the latest at the Education Department?

[Rich Couture]

Yeah. So on Monday, Elon Musk's unit, the Department of Government Efficiency, or doge, made severe cuts to the Education Department's independent research arm. I'm talking about the Institute of Education Sciences, or IES. DOGE eliminated most of the contracts. The institute holds nearly $9 million worth. And IES is responsible for collecting and sharing massive swaths of data that help shape the education system in this country. And they rely heavily on contractors to do it. Their work is on hold right now.

[Asma Khalid]

President Trump has made it clear that job one for McMahon will be dismantling the department. Will anything be left if she steps in to lead it?

[Rich Couture]

Yeah, well, I would say the first of all, the elimination of the department would require an act of Congress. But, yeah, if McMahon's confirmed, her first order of business will probably be to slim the department down further. In fact, on Tuesday, President Trump said he hopes she will work herself out of a job. By the way, this is an agency that has an annual budget of $79 billion, 4,200 employees. It's one of the smallest federal agencies. And the Education Department oversees some pretty consequential programs, like one that sends money to schools and low income communities, another to protect the civil rights of students with disabilities. So hypothetically, McMahon would be charged with overseeing these kinds of programs as long as Congress, Congress plans to keep protecting them.

[Asma Khalid]

So what exactly are we expecting at the confirmation hearing today?

[Rich Couture]

Yeah, so I think one clue came from a House hearing on education last week. If that's any indication, the line of questioning to McMahon is probably going to be split along party lines. Here's a taste from that hearing.

[Michelle Martin]

The irony is not lost on me that we're here to discuss the state of American education while current administration is actively discussing how to dismantle the main federal agency responsible for ensuring safe, quality education for all students.

[Rich Couture]

That's Democratic Representative Bobby Scott, Virginia. And here's Republican representative from Missouri, Bob Onder, arguing the Biden Education Department basically pushed liberal identity politics over learning.

[Lisa Curtis]

I believe abolishing the Department of Education is definitely a big part of the solution. How can we get back on the focus of educating kids rather than indoctrination and, you know, bloating our school bureaucracies?

[Rich Couture]

I should say, Michelle, the department doesn't actually play a role at all in shaping school curriculum. The law prevents it from doing just that.

[Asma Khalid]

Has McMahon shared anything about her own thoughts about where she stands on what should be done with the Department of Education?

[Rich Couture]

Yeah, I'll start by saying McMahon doesn't have much of a background in education. She did serve on the Connecticut State Board of Education for a year. She's probably best known for leading WWE for decades, World Wrestling Entertainment. So she hasn't said anything in recent days about what she'd do with the department, but in December, she said on X she would work on, quote, reforming the Department of Education. And we know she supports school choice. For example, we tried reaching her for an interview multiple times and we haven't heard back. So we'll wait and see how she brings those skills to this department if she's confirmed.

[Asma Khalid]

That is NPR education reporter Janaki Mehta. Janaki, thank you.

[Rich Couture]

Thank you, Michelle.

[Asma Khalid]

And now an update on a story we're following. The Trump administration's offer to let federal workers resign and continue to be paid until September is going ahead. On Wednesday, a federal judge in Boston declined to block the program. Labor unions had filed lawsuits arguing that the government's offer was rushed and overstepped its authority. But the judge said the complaint should have been brought to the independent agencies that settle labor disputes. The Office of Personnel Management, which can now begin processing the resignations, said more than 65,000 people had accepted the offer, but some of them may not be eligible. Rich Couture is president of the American Federation of Government Employees Council 215 and Works for the Social Security Administration. So most field office workers, hearing office workers, teleservice center workers, payment center workers, most of those positions are exempt. He says many people may have opted to resign before being told they were exempt and that there's still a lot of confusion about the program. For more on this story, listen to MORNING edition or visit npr.org and that's up first for Thursday, February 13th. I'm Michelle Martin.

[Layla Falden]

And I'm Layla Falden. Your next listen is Consider this from npr. We here at up first give you three big stories of the day. Our Consider this colleagues take a different approach. They dive into a single news story and what it means to you. Learn about a big story of the day in 15 minutes or less. Listen now on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Asma Khalid]

Today's episode of up first was edited by Steve Drummond, Roberta Rampton, Ryland Barton, Alice Wolfley and Ali Schweitzer. It was produced by Ziad Butch, Nia Dumas and Chris Thomas. We get engineering support from Nisha Hyness, and our technical director is Carly Strange. We hope you'll join us again tomorrow.

[Steve Drummond]

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