The Betrayal of Trans Troops

Summary

Up First (NPR) – The Betrayal of Trans Troops

Date: March 22, 2026
Host: Ayesha Rascoe
Guest Reporter: Lauren Hodges

---

Episode Overview

This episode of Up First’s Sunday Story presents an in-depth look at how the Trump administration, in its second term, has enacted and enforced policies that forcibly separate transgender troops from U.S. military service. Through a mix of policy history, personal stories, legal insights, and expert commentary, the episode highlights both the human and institutional impact of these policies—recounting a climate of fear, what feels like betrayal to many service members, and raising broader questions about military readiness and the social contract with those who serve.

---

Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. A Ceremony Marking an Unprecedented Moment

• [00:00-03:30]

  • NPR’s Lauren Hodges reports from a retirement ceremony in D.C. for five service members being forcibly separated due to their transgender status.
  • The ceremony, led by retired Gen. Stanley McChrystal, was unique—not a celebration of career endings, but a somber acknowledgment of involuntary discharge.
  • The retirees, not allowed to wear their uniforms, displayed them on mannequins, highlighting the personal loss of identity and honor.

  Quote:

  "First off, we shouldn’t be here." – Gen. Stanley McChrystal [01:31]

2. Historical Context: From ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ to Present Policy

• [03:43-06:12]
  • Hodges reviews LGBTQ+ service in the military:
    • 1994: ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ allowed gay, lesbian, and bisexual troops to serve if they kept their orientation secret.
    • 2010: President Obama repeals DADT, allowing open service—but transgender troops not explicitly protected.
    • 2016: Rand Corporation study finds minimal impact from allowing open trans service; Obama administration allows trans people to serve openly.

3. Trump’s First Term: The Policy Shift

• [06:12-08:07]

  • 2017: Trump announces trans ban, citing disruption and cost—claims disproven by data.
  • 2018: Memorandum forces trans troops to choose:
    • Serve according to their birth gender,
    • Or be discharged,
    • With an exception: If diagnosed with gender dysphoria by a deadline, they could stay.

  Quote:

  "You need to make the decision right now about where you might be in the future." – Col. Bree Fram [09:47]

4. Personal Stories – The Dilemma of Diagnosis

• [08:24-11:21]

  • Many, like Col. Bree Fram (Space Force), experience extreme stress over forced diagnosis, fearing both professional impact and later use of medical records against them.
  • Bree’s wife, Peg, preempts concerns about how such documentation could later enable targeted removal.

  Quote:

  "We have this piece of paper that says that you have gender dysphoria, and we don’t like that. So anybody with that in their record is now gone." – Peg Fram [11:07]

5. Trump’s Second Term: A New Wave of Bans

• [12:47-15:34]

  • After re-election in 2024, Trump reinstates a trans ban—now without the diagnostic exception.
  • The very paperwork that once protected is now being used for separation.

  Quote:

  "They basically had a list of transgender service members now, and...felt like this trap was set." – Lauren Hodges [15:15]

6. Rationales, Expansion, and ‘Anti-Woke’ Policy

• [16:07-18:38]

  • Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth’s memo asserts the military must eliminate “subgroups” for readiness; despite studies to the contrary, he frames identity as a threat.
  • Hegseth expands scrutiny to women in combat and diverse service populations; implements policies challenging DEI initiatives.
  • Example: Beards/hair rules affecting Black and religious soldiers, disparagement of body types.

  Quote:

  "No more identity months, DEI offices, dudes in dresses." – Pete Hegseth (quoting 2025 Quantico speech) [18:38]

7. Life Undercover: ‘Stealth’ Trans Service Members

• [19:20-22:10]
  • Some trans troops remain by staying “stealth” (not out, sometimes pre-transition), protecting identity to avoid discharge.
  • They describe constant stress, limited trust, and a sense of never being able to serve openly or fully ("I constantly feel like the rug is going to be pulled out from underneath me." – A [30:34]).

8. Separation Process & Loss of Benefits

• [22:30-27:10]

  • The Air Force tests separation protocols; involuntary separations come with limited lump-sum compensation, loss of traditional retirement, and medical benefits.
  • Voluntary separation allows slightly better outcomes, but even this is arguably not a true choice.
  • Legal experts argue the system is rigged; separation boards for trans members are non-autonomous, lack due process, and offer no real appeals (e.g., no transcript).

  Quote:

  "The government has really set itself up to purge these people out of our ranks." – Priya Rashid [26:37]

9. Broader Impact and Concerns Over Mission Readiness

• [24:28; 25:35; 29:06-30:34]

  • Denial of accrued benefits undermines the military’s social contract and risks expertise loss that could impact war readiness (ex: combat-tested officers).
  • Separation process continues despite global tensions, raising fears of shortages in critical roles.
  • Ongoing legal battles remain as the Supreme Court upholds the ban, but appeals continue.

  Quote:

  "You’re just cutting your nose off to spite your face...when you talk about war fighters—people who actually fought—and she did." – Mick Wagner [25:35]

10. Emotional Toll & Final Reflections

• [30:41-31:01]

  • All interviewed trans service members share a common thread: They wish to serve their country but feel increasingly alienated and betrayed, treated as enemies by the institution they dedicated their lives to.

  Quote:

  "It’s really strange and painful to be treated like the enemy by their own country." – Lauren Hodges [31:01]

---

Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• "First off, we shouldn’t be here." – Ret. Gen. Stanley McChrystal [01:31]
• "You need to make the decision right now about where you might be in the future." – Col. Bree Fram [09:47]
• "We have this piece of paper that says that you have gender dysphoria, and we don’t like that. So anybody with that in their record is now gone." – Peg Fram [11:07]
• "No more identity months, DEI offices, dudes in dresses." – Pete Hegseth [18:38]
• "The government has really set itself up to purge these people out of our ranks." – Priya Rashid [26:37]
• "I constantly feel like the rug is going to be pulled out from underneath me." – A, Navy sailor [30:34]
• "It’s really strange and painful to be treated like the enemy by their own country." – Lauren Hodges [31:01]

---

Key Segments & Timestamps

• Unprecedented retirement ceremony: [00:00-03:30]
• History of LGBTQ+ military policy: [04:00-06:12]
• The first trans ban and diagnosis dilemma: [06:12-11:21]
• Trump’s second term and updated ban: [12:47-15:34]
• Hegseth’s rationale and anti-DEI efforts: [16:07-18:38]
• Stealth service member experiences: [19:20-22:10]
• Separation process and consequences: [22:30-27:10]
• Mission readiness and ongoing legal fights: [24:28-30:34]
• Personal reflections: [30:41-31:01]

---

Tone and Language

The language throughout is empathetic, sober, and direct, amplifying the personal heartbreak and policy confusion experienced by troops. The reporting balances history, legal detail, and lived experience, while refusing to soften the gravity of what’s at stake for those affected.

---

For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode provides vital historical background, contemporary policy breakdown, and deeply human insight on the forced removal of trans troops. Through the lens of real service members’ lives and expert perspectives, it underscores the far-reaching personal, institutional, and societal implications of policy crafted amid rapid political change. The narrative moves from the pain and confusion of individuals, through systemic barriers and legal battles, to broader questions about America’s values and readiness in a volatile world.

Transcript

[Aisha Rascoe]

Aisha.

I'm Aisha Rascoe and this is a Sunday STORY where we go beyond the news of the day to bring you one big story. Not long ago on an unseasonably warm January afternoon in Washington, D.C. nPR's Lauren Hodges attended a retirement ceremony for five service members who are being forcibly separated from the military.

Thank you for being here to honor five extraordinary service members whose combined service exceeds 120 years.

[Lauren Hodges]

We gather today to recognize Colonel Brief

[Aisha Rascoe]

Ramm, United States Air Force Commander Blake Dremmond, United States Navy Lt. Col. Aaron Grazek.

As part of their removal, these former service members were not allowed to wear their uniforms. Instead, to the left of the stage, a table of mannequins were dressed in the retirees, uniforms from army green to Navy blue, decorated with pins and medals along with a pair of well worn boots.

This ceremony is unprecedented, not because their careers fell short in any way, but because they shine so brightly in the military. That cast them aside is unworthy.

71 year old retired four star General Stanley McChrystal arrived in a suit and tie to preside over the ceremony. He walked up to the microphone.

First off, we shouldn't be here.

This was not a normal ceremony. These service members were being separated because they're transgender. Today on the Sunday story, we take a closer look at how the Trump administration is using medical records to remove thousands of transgender troops, a part of Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth's anti DEI push. And we'll talk about how this effort may be distracting from mission readiness. We'll be right back.

[Michael Hosmar]

This message comes from Fisher Investments. Senior Vice President Michael Hosmar shares one way their fiduciary duty comes to life when working with clients.

[Aisha Rascoe]

We listen to our clients goals, their objectives, their personal needs, and we build a plan that puts their needs first. They want to know what we're truly thinking about, how that thinking is being built into our plan for them because that's how seriously we take our fiduciary responsibility.

[Michael Hosmar]

Learn [e-mail] Investing in securities involves the risk of loss. This message comes from BetterHelp. As a dad, BetterHelp President Fernando Madera relates to needing flexibility when it comes to scheduling therapy.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I have kids under 18 so like time is very limited. That's why at BetterHelp, our therapists try to have sessions, sometimes at night, depending on the therapist or during the weekend. So I think that's what we need to tell the parents. You're not alone. We can help you out.

[Michael Hosmar]

If a flexible schedule would help you visit betterhelp.com NPR for 10% off your first month of online therapy.

[Carvana Announcer]

This message comes from Carvana Finance. And buy your next vehicle with Carvana. Shop a huge selection, customize terms to fit your budget and buy completely online. No hassle, no pressure. Get the car you love the easy way with Carvana.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I'm Aisha Rascoe and this is THE Sunday story. We're joined now by NPR producer Lauren Hodges, who's been reporting on the Trump administration's effort to remove all transgender troops. Lauren, welcome.

[Lauren Hodges]

Thank you. Hi.

[Aisha Rascoe]

So, Lauren, we started this story at a retirement ceremony for transgender troops and we heard a retired four star general say we shouldn't be here. So how did we get here?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, let's take a quick trip through time since what's happening now does have these echoes of don't ask, don't tell, the policy implemented in 1994 under then President Bill Clinton. And many are going to remember that don't ask, don't tell meant if you're gay, lesbian, bisexual, you were allowed to serve in the military, but not openly. Now, at the time, some saw the don't ask part of this policy as mildly progressive because it also meant that military personnel couldn't harass or inquire about anyone's sexual orientation. So that was a change. But troops were forced to serve in the closet. It was a culture of silence. And when President George W. Bush took office, he left this policy in place.

[Aisha Rascoe]

But and didn't President Obama in Don't

[Lauren Hodges]

Ask, Don't Tell, yeah, he did. In 2010, President Barack Obama signed a bill to repeal the law.

[Aisha Rascoe]

So this morning I am proud to

[Michael Hosmar]

sign a law that will bring an end to don't ask, don't tell, which

[Lauren Hodges]

paved the way for gay, lesbian, bisexual troops to serve openly.

[Aisha Rascoe]

No longer will our country be denied the service of thousands of patriotic Americans

[Michael Hosmar]

who were forced to leave the military regardless of their skills, no matter their

[Aisha Rascoe]

bravery or their zeal, no matter their years of exemplary performance, because they happen to be gay.

[Lauren Hodges]

But trans troops weren't specifically protected in Obama's new law. Recognition for them came later and gradually in stages in 2016. This pivotal study came from Rand Corporation's National Defense Research Institute. This is a global policy think tank. Among other things, this study looked at whether a trans military population affected mission readiness and unit cohesion. And the study found it would have, quote, minimal likely impact. So the Obama administration announced in June of that year that transgender individuals could serve openly. But that policy was pretty short lived because only a few months Later, Donald Trump was elected president.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Okay, so when Trump took office in 2017, what did he do?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, a few months after Trump was sworn into office, he tweeted that transgender people would be banned from serving the military, calling it, quote, disruptive and citing tremendous medical costs. That statement doesn't hold up mathematically, by the way. Transgender care costs the Pentagon a pretty small percentage of personnel medical budget. But ultimately, In March of 2018, Trump issued a memorandum giving trans service members already serving a tough choice. They either had to serve under their gender assigned at birth, which for many of these people, meant going back in the closet. Some had already transitioned. It was just not an option. Or they could leave the service altogether. But there was this short window offered. If they went to a military doctor by April 2019 and got an official diagnosis for something called gender dysphoria, they could stay, and they could serve openly.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Well, remind listeners what gender dysphoria is.

[Lauren Hodges]

Gender dysphoria is defined as a marked incongruence between one's expressed or experienced gender and their assigned gender. But getting a doctor to make this diagnosis for military service didn't sit well with a lot of people. Some felt like it didn't apply to their situation. For example, if you're trans and you've already transitioned, you've already received the treatment for gender dysphoria. So you may have had it at one point, but not anymore. You've been treated for it. But there wasn't room for any of these gray areas here. Trans people were sort of seen by the administration as a monolith, and all service members who wanted to keep their jobs to go get this diagnosis.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Okay, so. So the trade off was either go back in the closet or get a diagnosis of gender dysphoria, which would allow you to continue serving openly. How many people went and got this diagnosis?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, it's hard to know the numbers for sure because they're medical records. There are strict privacy issues around that. But what we do know is that back in May 2025, the Defense Department said it had about 4,000 active duty transgender service members. So these are the people they have on file, but we don't actually know how many went and got the diagnosis at that time. But let me introduce one person whose story I've been following for years. I met her in 2019, right before that window for diagnosis appointments closed. She was telling me she had mixed feelings about going to get this diagnosis. This is Colonel Bree Fram.

[Michael Hosmar]

What held me back for the longest time from getting the diagnosis is you must have clinically significant distress. And the thought of going to someone saying you're clinically distressed and in some way incapable of doing something was really painful because it never affected my ability to do my job in any way. But having that on a medical record is still scary.

[Lauren Hodges]

Bree wasn't sure she was ready to transition just yet. She had very recently come out to her family, and she was hoping to sort of take her time with this, not only for her own sake, but for her wife's sake and her kids sake. She wanted some more time to come out and adjust to this new identity and give others time to adjust to this new identity.

[Michael Hosmar]

Being put on the clock was awful. You need to make the decision right now about where you might be in the future.

[Carvana Announcer]

Yeah.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I mean, that sounds extremely stressful.

[Lauren Hodges]

Yeah. But of course, the alternative is also really stressful. To lose her job. And she'd been in the Air Force for a long time. She joined after 9 11, deployed during the Iraq war, and she eventually joined the Space Force as an astronautical engineer. She's literally a rocket scientist. This is her career. The other option was to go back into the closet and try to stay hidden while also trying to focus on her work. And she says that also seemed just impossible. So even though she wasn't sure about all this, Brie ended up going to the doctor to get the diagnosis. And despite all this pressure and anxiety, she says she tried to focus on the positive.

[Michael Hosmar]

The ability to serve openly is an amazing one because you can bring your whole self to work.

[Lauren Hodges]

So it was behind her for now, she thought, and she could just focus on her job. But something about the administration's tone, the mandated registration with the diagnoses was worrying to Bree's wife, Peg.

[Priya Rashid]

I'm scared that now it's easier for someone to come through later on and

[Aisha Rascoe]

change the policy and say, we've called you out. We have this piece of paper that

[Michael Hosmar]

says that you have gender dysphoria, and

[Aisha Rascoe]

we don't like that. So anybody with that in their record is now gone. It opened up another avenue of fear for me.

[Lauren Hodges]

And remember, Aisha, this is back when I spoke to them in 2019, when all of this was just starting.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Coming up after the break, Trump 2.0 and how those fears come true.

[Carvana Announcer]

This message comes from Carvana, who makes buying and financing your next car easy. Thousands of vehicles, terms up front and 100% online. Even get it delivered to your door. Buy your car the easy way with Carvana delivery fee may apply support for

[Michael Hosmar]

NPR and the following Message come from Warby Parker the One Stop Shop for all your vision needs. They offer expertly crafted prescription eyewear plus contacts, eye exams and more for everything you need to see. Visit your nearest Warby Parker store or head to warbyparker.com support for this podcast

[Carvana Announcer]

and the following message come from Strawberry Me. If you could go back and talk to your younger self, would you tell yourself that you have a job that truly makes you happy? Many people are stuck in jobs they've outgrown or never really wanted. A career coach from Strawberry Me can help you move on to something you actually love. Benefit from having a dedicated coach in your Corner, and get 50% off your first coaching session at Strawberry Menpr.

[Aisha Rascoe]

We're back. So, Lauren, we've talked about what happened during Trump's first term and how the administration required the diagnosis of gender dysphoria for military members to serve openly as a trans person. They were told that if they went and got the diagnosis, they could stay. So why are they being forcibly separated now?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, so first we should mention that after Trump lost the 2020 election to Joe Biden, Biden signed an executive order reversing Trump's memorandum. So that meant trans people could now serve openly in the armed forces and removed the requirement for that diagnosis. But a lot of people had it on their files already. And of course, Trump would be back in a few years. After he was reelected in 2024, several trans service members who didn't have the diagnosis on file were proactive and started making doctor's appointments ahead of time, thinking, okay, this will save my job, just like it did last time.

[Priya Rashid]

So we have clients that said, I wouldn't have come out. I only came out because I thought that the ban was going to be the same.

[Lauren Hodges]

This is Priya Rashid. She's legal director of the National Institute of Military Justice Transgender Representation Project. She's representing trans service members who are navigating this change in policy and being forcibly separated. Rashid says a few of her clients went to go get this taken care of when they saw the election results so they could be grandfathered in before the second ban took place. They assumed it was going to work the same way as the first Trump administration.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Well, did it work the same way? No.

[Lauren Hodges]

As expected, when Trump took office again, this is in 2025, he reinstated that transgender ban, but this time there was a key difference. This ban doesn't come with that exception for those who get a diagnosis by a certain date. So that paperwork that Bri and many other trans service members filled out back in 2019, thinking, okay, this is going to save my job. It's now being used against them.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Yeah, I mean, that's exactly what Bree's wife Peg feared. I mean, she was almost psychic in that. Right. That the paperwork would provide the means for removal.

[Lauren Hodges]

Yeah. They basically had a list of transgender service members now, and Briefram, who was at this point the highest ranking openly transgender member of the entire armed forces, said she felt like this trap was set. And so did several other people I spoke to. They felt betrayed and confused.

[Aisha Rascoe]

And so what happened to Bri Fran?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, she was one of those being forcibly separated after more than two decades serving her country. Here's her final moment at that retirement ceremony I went to back in January.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Colonel Bree Fram, United States Space Force departing.

I mean, how did the administration justify this complete reversal?

[Lauren Hodges]

In a memo, Defense secretary Pete Hegseth gave the following rationale for the reversal. It says, quote, the department must ensure it is building one force without subgroups defined by anything other than ability or mission adherence. Efforts to split our troops along lines of identity, weaken our force, and make us vulnerable. Such efforts must not be tolerated or accommodated. End quote.

[Aisha Rascoe]

So even though you mentioned there was a RAN study that concluded that transgender service members didn't have a big impact on mission readiness or unit cohesion, Hexseth is still basically saying that it does. And he's shaping his policies around that idea.

[Lauren Hodges]

Yeah, and that scrutiny is spreading to other service populations. In January, NPR's Tom Bowman obtained this memo from the Pentagon announcing a six month review of women in ground combat jobs to ensure what it calls the military effectiveness of having several thousand female soldiers and marines in infantry, armor, and artillery. Hegseth has openly opposed women in ground combat units even before he was appointed Secretary of defense. Here he is talking about his position in a November 2024 podcast hosted by Sean Ryan.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Because I'm straight up just saying we should not have women in combat roles. It hasn't made us more effective, hasn't made us more lethal, has made fighting more complicated.

[Lauren Hodges]

He has backtracked on this. During his confirmation hearing last year, he said women can serve in combat roles as long as, quote, the standards have not been eroded. Essentially, he's saying everyone needs to meet male standards. And there are a bunch of other examples of just how focused Hegseth is on cutting out any kind of what he calls woke ideas and anything he associates with dei, diversity, equity, and inclusion, even during wartime. For example, he's put out a memo about hairstyles and beards. That disproportionately affect black troops or anybody with facial hair for religious reasons. And he's made disparaging remarks about certain body types and weight ranges. Back in September, he gave a speech at Quantico and required hundreds of generals and admirals from commands all around the world to fly in and attend the speech in person.

[Aisha Rascoe]

This administration has done a great deal from day one to remove the social justice, politically correct, and toxic ideological garbage that had infected our department. To rip out the politics. No more identity months, DEI offices, dudes in dresses.

[Lauren Hodges]

He also required all personnel so anyone who works at the Pentagon to read or watch the speech in its entirety.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Okay, so the administration is in the process of separating thousands of active duty trans service members under this ban. Is anyone managing to stay in?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, yes, but it requires them to stay hidden. I spoke to two people who don't have the diagnosis and are currently still serving in the military. They both call themselves stealth. And we are only going to use first name initials for these people because they have a legitimate fear of retaliation. Let's start with W. This is a trans woman in the Navy who has not transitioned.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I present very masc because I have a very deep voice. I am male at birth.

[Lauren Hodges]

So she presents as a man and serves as a man.

[Aisha Rascoe]

And most people I just let believe I am a CIS man. See, I can count on one hand four. Four people that I work with are

[Michael Hosmar]

aware

[Lauren Hodges]

right now as people are struggling to understand what's going to happen, and there's all this whiplash. W is staying quiet, and she has these trusted confidants who are helping her out by asking questions about the policy, like, on her behalf so it doesn't get traced back to her.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I will say there is a lot of quiet support for transgender sailors, at least at my command. Like, people are trying their best to follow the exact wording of these orders without completely outing their trans sailors. Stealth really is a. In apt word to describe it.

[Lauren Hodges]

And then on the other end of this stealth spectrum, we have a. A trans man also in the Navy who transitioned before joining.

[Aisha Rascoe]

And I'm. I'm not out at my command. It's a lot easier to stay stealth than I thought it would be. And now it's not a staying stealth because I want to. It's not because I have to.

[Lauren Hodges]

He says he got through boot camp and other training by telling a few trusted colleagues and superiors who made quick concessions for him, like showering separately.

[Aisha Rascoe]

And.

[Lauren Hodges]

And while he's really grateful for the protection, he says he feels like he's not being as useful to the Navy as he could be. He's recently had to forego some training because he was concerned that his identity would be revealed during the drug testing.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Ever since the executive order came out, it feels like, okay, is today going to be the day? Is today going to be the day? Today it's going to be like, no. Well, I went through a boot camp. Nothing happened. I got to my first command, nothing happened. So, like, in my head, I know I'm doing nothing wrong. I feel like I'm hiding something, but I shouldn't have to hide it. Yeah. It just weighs aways more and more on me every single day. Yeah.

That seems like such a heavy burden to carry while trying to just, you know, do your job.

[Lauren Hodges]

Yeah.

[Aisha Rascoe]

So now I'm thinking about the people who do have the diagnosis on their paperwork. What's happening happening to them right now. How is this new policy being enforced?

[Lauren Hodges]

Well, Priya Rashid, the military attorney, helped walk me through this because it's really complicated. So this process started with the Air Force last year. They were sort of like the test branch for how this could all work. And the branches are separate. They kind of do things their own different ways. So let's focus on the Air Force. If you are identified for separation, no matter how long you've been in the Air Force, you will get a separation package. And it's just a small amount, like what a junior service member would receive. And this would be in lieu of the traditional benefits veterans receive, like medical benefits, which are pretty significant. The Pentagon's policy says if you self identify and separate voluntarily, you're eligible for more money. But the deadline for this was last summer. That's already passed. So anyone who's being identified now is being separated involuntarily according to this policy. And in any case, we should mention that the word voluntary is relative here. Right. Because a lot of people told me they wouldn't leave their jobs if they had a real choice. According to the attorney, Priya Rashid, this separation package shouldn't even be considered separation pay at all.

[Priya Rashid]

When they get older and they're this older veteran who needs medical and financial support, they are not going to get their accrued benefits because when we kicked them out, we said, here's your lump sum.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I mean, that's incredible. I mean, for a lot of people who join the military, the benefits are a huge part of that decision.

[Lauren Hodges]

Yeah, definitely. I mean, especially with an uncertain economy, those benefits are attractive and they play a big role in the military's recruitment Efforts. I spoke to Mick Wagner. He's the founder and executive director of Veterans Legal Support Network. He says denying or reducing benefits after years of service sets a bad precedent.

[Aisha Rascoe]

You know, it is a fundamental break with the quid pro quo promise of, you know, you serve you. There's some. There's some benefits on the end of that. And that's just a fundamental breaking of that social contract, if you will, that the military has.

[Lauren Hodges]

One big example of this is how the Air Force is denying early retirement benefits to transgender service members with 15 to 18 years. Years of service. And even for those who don't qualify for early retirement, there's still a lot at stake. For example, joining the military to pay for college is a really common incentive for military service. And if a service member is pushed out before a certain year of enlistment, they'll end up having to pay back that tuition. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth has listed, quote, lethality, meritocracy, war fighting, accountability, and readiness as his top priorities for the armed forces. But Wagner says this whole cumbersome effort to identify and remove transgender troops hurts mission readiness.

[Aisha Rascoe]

You're just cutting your nose off despite your face. You've got this expertise in so many fields. I've got a friend of mine. She is a lieutenant colonel in the Marines. She was enlisted, she transitioned. She fought in Fallujah. So, you know, when you talk about, you know, war fighters, people who actually fought, and she did.

Did you reach out to the Pentagon?

[Lauren Hodges]

I did contact the Pentagon three times to see comment and clarification on my reporting, and no one was made available to talk with me. Instead, I was sent some links to their website, which just had rundowns of the memos and the guidance we've already been explaining here.

[Aisha Rascoe]

So tell me more about this process for separation. How does it happen?

[Lauren Hodges]

So service members identified for separation go before these things called separation boards. Basically, it's supposed to be this independent board of your peers. This is the due process given to each service member where you can plead your case to keep your job. But for trans service members, it's going to work a bit differently.

[Priya Rashid]

What we see is that the entire process is flawed from beginning to end. We know that the outcome is generally predetermined and that the government has really set itself up to purge these people out of our ranks.

[Lauren Hodges]

Rashid says for the trans service population, at least in the Air Force, it's a predetermined outcome, because more guidance has since come out stating that the separation boards must find anyone with gender dysphoria or A history of it unfit for service, and move to separate them.

[Priya Rashid]

They are being given a fake board, a board that is deprived of due process and any type of autonomy that a typical military service member would be afforded.

[Lauren Hodges]

She says new rules also prohibit any recordings of the hearings or the use of court reporters.

[Priya Rashid]

Things like the Administrative Procedure Act. They are required to provide appeals. The transcript is the mechanism of appeal. So, like, that's a first amendment and a fifth amendment right.

[Lauren Hodges]

Rashid says cutting off access to due process is illegal. In May of 2025, the Supreme Court decided to did uphold the transgender ban, but appeals are ongoing.

[Priya Rashid]

It's really important for our team to present these people's incredible service records and to make sure that we are bringing witnesses and evidence forth that these people are incredibly honorable service members, incredibly honorable soldiers who've given up years of their lives for our country. And even in a unfair board proceeding, we're going to make sure that we set the record straight and we preserved their fitness and their record for, hopefully, appellate review someday, and that we do trust our processes and our legal system to essentially protect these people, if not today, but on some type of tomorrow.

[Aisha Rascoe]

You know, looking at the kind of geopolitical environment right now, we're engaged in several global conflicts. Iran, Venezuela. Is there a chance that they'll pause this process? Because they need people, especially experts, who are willing to serve.

[Lauren Hodges]

They're continuing with the separations. And this made me think about my interview with General McChrystal back in January. This is exactly what he was worried about.

[Aisha Rascoe]

God forbid, if we in a major war and we need to start calling everybody up, I would hope that we would not suddenly say we are only going to draft people of a certain type because we wouldn't have enough.

[Lauren Hodges]

I reach back out to A. He's the sailor who transitioned before joining the military to see if there have been any updates on his situation, if anything has surfaced that might identify him as trans. And he says nothing so far. He's focused right now on what's called a workup cycle, basically getting ready to deploy. He's slated to ship out in the fall, and he's seen how risky the situation in the Middle east is.

[Aisha Rascoe]

My heart breaks for my fellow sailors, marines, airmen, and soldiers that have either lost their lives or will lose their lives.

[Lauren Hodges]

And A says while he's just trying to focus on his work right now, the fear of being found out is always in the back of his mind.

[Aisha Rascoe]

This is the most stressful time that you can be in when you're deployed. All you're worried about is doing your job while there's that added stress of, you know, being away from home. And also it makes me feel, you know, I'm investing all of this time and energy. And then it's like, okay, well, what if two months from now my CO calls down to my shop and he's telling me that, you know, I'm being removed from the Navy? It's like, okay, well, what, what was all my, my effort for? Right. So it's extremely, extremely taxing. I constantly feel like the rug is going to be pulled out from underneath me.

[Lauren Hodges]

Wow.

[Aisha Rascoe]

I can't imagine being in that precarious position.

[Lauren Hodges]

Yeah. And, you know, a really common thread throughout all of these interviews I've been conducting over the years for this story is that all of these service members just want to do their jobs. They signed up to serve their country and they say it's really strange and painful to be treated like the enemy by their own country.

[Aisha Rascoe]

Lauren, thank you so much for bringing us this story.

[Lauren Hodges]

Thank you for having me.

[Aisha Rascoe]

That was NPR's Lauren Hodges. This episode of the Sunday Story was produced by Justine Yan. It was edited by Jenny Schmidt. It was engineered by Robert Rodriguez, and fact checked by Sarah Knight. The reporting featured in this episode was originally edited by Andrew Sussman. The Sunday Story team includes Andrew Mambo and our senior supervising producer, Leanna Simstrom. Irene Noguchi is our executive producer. I'm Aisha Rascoe. Up first is back tomorrow with all the news you need to start your week. Until then, have a great rest of your weekend.

[Carvana Announcer]

This message comes from Midi Health introducing agewell Longevity Care, designed by women for women. Whether you're looking to prevent future health issues or just feel more like yourself, learn [e-mail] that's join midi.com this message comes from Ameriprise Financial. Vice President Dina Healy shares why Ameriprise Financial advisors strive to understand what matters most to each of their clients.

[Lauren Hodges]

Being curious about a client's situation is, I think, where you start. What are their values? How did their family think about money growing up? It's important to understand what clients want to achieve with their money. From there, we can put together a plan that will help them meet those goals.

[Carvana Announcer]

For more information and important disclosures, visit ameriprise.com Advice securities offered by Ameriprise Financial Services, LLC, Member FINRA and SIPC.

[Michael Hosmar]

This message comes from Rosetta Stone. Spring Travel coming up, Rosetta Stone has been the trusted leader in language learning for over 30 years. Ready to start learning a new language this spring. Visit rosettastone.comn today.