Trump's Tariff Talks, China's Tariff Response, SCOTUS Probationary Workers

Summary

NPR's Up First: April 9, 2025

Hosts: Layla Fadel, Danielle Kurtzleben, A Martinez

In this episode of NPR's "Up First," released on April 9, 2025, the hosts—Layla Fadel, Danielle Kurtzleben, and A Martinez—unpack three significant stories impacting the global and domestic landscape: President Trump's implementation of sweeping new tariffs, China's robust tariff response, and a pivotal Supreme Court decision concerning federal probationary workers. This detailed summary captures the essence of each topic, enriched with notable quotes and insightful analyses to provide a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the episode.

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1. Trump's Tariff Talks

Implementation of New Tariffs

The episode opens with Layla Fadel announcing the enactment of new tariffs under President Trump's administration. These tariffs are part of a strategic move to renegotiate trade deals, aiming to protect American industries and address trade imbalances.

• Layla Fadel [00:02]: "New tariffs are now a reality. And President Trump says trade partners are lining up to talk."

President Trump emphasizes the tailored nature of these trade deals, distancing them from generic agreements.

• Donald Trump [00:08]: "We're doing very well in making, I call them tailored deals, not off the rack. These are tailored, highly tailored deals."

Negotiation Dynamics and White House Messaging

Danielle Kurtzleben delves into the countries interested in negotiating with the U.S., highlighting that while several nations are receptive, China remains a significant hurdle due to its strong opposition to the tariffs.

• Layla Fadel [00:16]: "China is not willing to talk over the 104% tariffs on its goods."

The White House's stance on the negotiability of the tariffs has been somewhat inconsistent, adding layers of complexity to the negotiation process.

• John Ruich [02:57]: "The White House's messaging on this has been confusing."

Press Secretary Caroline Levitt clarifies the administration's position, emphasizing openness to negotiation despite initial perceptions.

• Caroline Levitt [03:27]: "The entire administration has always said that President Trump is willing to pick up the phone and talk. And the president met with his trade team this morning and he directed them to have tailor made trade deals with each and every country that calls up this administration to strike a deal."

Internal Pushback and Political Ramifications

The tariffs have not been unanimously supported within the Republican Party. High-profile figures like Elon Musk have publicly criticized the administration's approach.

• John Ruich [04:35]: "Elon Musk ... lashed out at top trade advisor Peter Navarro in several really insulting posts. At one point, he called Navarro, quote, 'dumber than a sack of bricks.'"

Moreover, bipartisan efforts to restrict presidential tariff authority signal emerging fractures within the GOP.

• John Ruich [05:29]: "Republican anger is starting to show... there have now been bipartisan bills introduced in both the House and the Senate seeking to restrict the president's tariff authority."

This internal dissent highlights potential challenges the administration may face in maintaining unified support for its trade policies.

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2. China's Tariff Response

China's Firm Stance and Retaliation

China has responded to the U.S. tariffs with a steadfast refusal to negotiate, implementing steep tariffs of at least 104% on Chinese goods. This aggressive stance is intended to safeguard China's economic interests and sovereignty.

• Lin Jian [00:28]: "We will not tolerate any attempt to harm China's sovereignty, security and development interests."

Expert Analysis: Guoshan Xi's Insights

NPR's international correspondent, John Ruich, connects listeners with Guoshan Xi, a partner at Beijing-based research firm Hutong Research, to provide deeper insights into China's strategic positioning.

• Guoshan Xi [07:38]: "So there's a widespread expectation that China is going to follow through and actually retaliate and soon."

Xi explains that the high tariffs are a deliberate strategy to make meaningful negotiations difficult unless one side yields.

• Guoshan Xi [07:38]: "The tariffs are so high now that meaningful negotiations are impossible basically until one side or the other cries uncle and caves."

China's preparation for potential economic fallout includes policies aimed at boosting self-sufficiency and resilience against external shocks.

• Guoshan Xi [07:38]: "China's been doubling down on policies to boost its self sufficiency and become more resilient to outside shocks."

Economic Impact and Global Reactions

The severe tariffs are expected to have significant repercussions not only for U.S. businesses but also for the global economy. Asian markets have predominantly reacted negatively, prompting countries like India to adopt accommodative monetary policies to cushion the impact.

• Guoshan Xi [08:42]: "Asian markets were mostly down today on top of big drops lately as the tariffs kicked in."

China's exports to the U.S. constitute a relatively small portion of its GDP, reducing the immediate economic pressure and allowing Beijing to leverage its broader trade relationships.

• Guoshan Xi [07:38]: "Chinese exports to the US only amount to about 3% of GDP, which isn't exactly massive."

This strategic diversification helps mitigate the adverse effects of the tariffs, ensuring that China remains economically robust despite the trade tensions.

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3. Supreme Court Decision on Probationary Federal Workers

Supreme Court's Partial Victory for the Trump Administration

Another significant development discussed in the episode is the U.S. Supreme Court's decision to allow the Trump administration to proceed with the termination of 16,000 probationary federal employees. This decision marks a critical step in President Trump's efforts to reshape the federal workforce.

• Layla Fadel [09:26]: "President Trump has set out to drastically reshape the federal workforce, and yesterday he got some help in the effort from the U.S. Supreme Court."

However, the Court did not fully endorse the legality of the firings, leaving room for future legal challenges.

• Nina Totenberg [10:01]: "The court said that the plaintiffs in the case were not the employees themselves, but nonprofit groups who failed to show that they themselves would be hurt by the firings."

Understanding Probationary Status

Nina Totenberg clarifies what it means to be a probationary employee within the federal system.

• Nina Totenberg [10:47]: "It means the fired employee has to be on the job for a year or less or in some cases, more time."

These employees, often in the early stages of their federal careers, now face uncertainty regarding their employment status.

Next Steps for Terminated Employees

The path to reinstatement for these workers involves challenging their firings through the Merit Systems Protection Board (MSPB). However, the process is fraught with challenges, including a backlog of cases and potential delays.

• Nina Totenberg [11:12]: "The employees have to first challenge their firings at the Merit Systems Protection Board... there have been more than 10,000 cases filed since October, including 20 class action suits."

The MSPB aims to resolve these cases swiftly, but recent developments, such as the board lacking a quorum, may hinder timely proceedings.

• Nina Totenberg [12:01]: "The MSPB Board might well cancel each other's votes out. And in any event, the law allows a relatively quick appeal to the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit."

This situation leaves thousands of employees with potential legal avenues to contest their terminations, though outcomes remain uncertain.

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Conclusion

This episode of "Up First" offers a comprehensive overview of critical issues shaping today's news landscape. President Trump's aggressive tariff strategy continues to provoke complex international responses and internal political tensions. Concurrently, the Supreme Court's decision on federal probationary workers underscores ongoing judicial and administrative battles within the U.S. government. As these stories unfold, their ramifications on both global trade dynamics and the federal workforce will be closely observed.

Listeners are encouraged to stay informed and engaged with these developments, as they hold significant implications for economic policies, international relations, and federal employment practices.

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For more detailed reporting and analysis, subscribe to NPR's Up First and support your local NPR station at donate.npr.org.

Transcript

[Layla Falden]

New tariffs are now a reality. And President Trump says trade partners are lining up to talk.

[Donald Trump]

We're doing very well in making, I call them tailored deals, not off the rack. These are tailored, highly tailored deals.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

Which countries want to negotiate?

[Layla Falden]

I'm Layla Falden. That's a Martinez. And this is up first from NPR News. Now, China is not willing to talk over the 104% tariffs on its goods.

[Lin Jian]

We will not tolerate any attempt to harm China's sovereignty, security and development interests.

[Layla Falden]

How is China retaliating?

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

And the Trump administration gets another partial victory from the US Supreme Court. The court has ruled the federal government can proceed with firing 16,000 probationary employees, at least for now. Stay with us. We've got all the news you need to start your day.

[NPR Sponsor]

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[Danielle Kurtzleben]

Member FDIC President Trump's sweeping new tariffs took effect shortly after midnight on nearly all U.S. trading partners. And those tariffs will mean U.S. businesses will pay extra to import products into.

[Layla Falden]

The U.S. and for some of those major trading partners, that new tax is steep, from an added 20% on goods from the European Union to an extra 46% on goods from Vietnam. And they will likely mean higher prices for consumers. But Trump has opened the door to changes. Here's what he said yesterday.

[Donald Trump]

And we're doing very well in making, I call them tailored deals, not off the rack. These are tailored, highly tailored deals. Right now, Japan is flying here to make a deal. South Korea is flying here to make a deal and others are flying here.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

Danielle. Kurt Slavin is NPR's White House correspondent. So, Danielle, what is the White House saying about how long these tariffs will last?

[John Ruich]

Well, the White House's messaging on this has been confusing. There were several days there where you'd have one administration official saying these tariffs are non negotiable, that they're going to stick around a while. And then you'd have another official saying Trump was open to negotiation. But yesterday, the White House seemed to have settled on the idea that, yes, these tariffs are negotiable. They've said that about 70 countries have reached out for some sort of talks. And yesterday press Secretary Caroline Levitt insisted that these tariffs have always been open to negotiation.

[Caroline Levitt]

The entire administration has always said that President Trump is willing to pick up the phone and talk. And the president met with his trade team this morning and he directed them to have tailor made trade deals with each and every country that calls up this administration to strike a deal.

[John Ruich]

And that's a narrative that fits with an image Trump really likes to project, which is that he's a master deal maker. But he did say yesterday it's a long list of countries and it could take some time to get through.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

All right, so long list, which countries have reached out?

[John Ruich]

Well, Trump has said he's spoken to leaders of multiple major trading partners, including Japan, South Korea and Vietnam. But one country that has not reached out, according to Trump, is China. Now, there's been some back and forth on retaliation with them, but as a result, the tariff on Chinese goods is now at least 104%. So that more than doubles the cost of a lot of consumer goods from them. And if China's retaliatory tariffs on US Products stays in place, that could very much hurt some US Businesses like farmers who send a lot of crops there.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

Yeah. Is Donald Trump getting any pushback from within his own party?

[John Ruich]

Well, not only that, there's been pushback from within his own team. Elon Musk has openly opposed these tariffs. He's the head of Tesla and SpaceX. And yesterday on social media, he lashed out at top trade advisor Peter Navarro in several really insulting posts. At one point, he called Navarro, quote, dumber than a sack of bricks. Now, on Capitol Hill, things are much more polite. But Republican anger is starting to show. U.S. trade Representative Jameson Greer faced the Senate Finance Committee in a hearing yesterday, and several Republicans really pressed him on the tariffs. They asked, for example, when and how the tariffs might go away. Now, in addition, there have now been bipartisan bills introduced in both the House and the Senate seeking to restrict the president's tariff authority. Those bills, they're unlikely to pass, but they do have a little Republican support, and that represents some cracks in what's usually a very unified GOP.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

That's NPR's Danielle Kurtzleben. Thanks a lot, Danielle.

[John Ruich]

Thank you.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

All right. So how is China reacting to those steep new tariffs? With me now to explain is NPR international correspondent John Ruich in Beijing. John, how is China so far?

[Guoshan Xi]

With very strong words, here's Foreign Ministry spokesman Lin Jian speaking through an interpreter just a little while ago.

[Lin Jian]

We will not let anyone take away the Chinese people's legitimate right to development. We will not tolerate any attempt to harm China's sovereignty, security and development interests. We will continue to take resolute and strong measures to safeguard our legitimate rights and interests.

[Guoshan Xi]

So there's a widespread expectation that China is going to follow through and actually retaliate and soon. We don't know when exactly, but the expectation is that they won't blink. The countermeasures many say will probably be similar to what we've seen in the past. You know, tariffs on U.S. goods coming into China, restrictions on U.S. businesses, investigations into U.S. companies, and possibly limits on exports to the U.S. of things like rare earths.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

Some of the countries are choosing not to retaliate, to maybe focus on negotiation instead and maybe offering concession. So why is China taking this path?

[Guoshan Xi]

Yeah, China's, you know, casting this whole thing in pretty stark black and white terms. It's essentially right versus wrong. Beijing projects itself as a champion of free trade and fair trade and multilateralism, while it says the US Is engaged in selfish and irresponsible protectionism, even blackmail. Trump said yesterday, of course, that China wants to make a deal and he's waiting for them to call. The Chinese leadership has, in fact flagged that it's willing to negotiate, but it won't do so under duress. You know, the Foreign Ministry spokesman said that the US Needs to adopt an attitude of equality, mutual benefit and respect. I mean, ultimately the leadership here believes that China can tough it out and that in the long run, this trade war is probably going to be more damaging to the US Than to China. It's worth noting, of course, that China's not alone in taking this path of retaliation. The European Union is planning to put sanctions on a range of US Goods from steel to non alcoholic beer.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

You said China thinks they can tough it out, But I mean, 104% tariffs, that gotta be painful.

[Guoshan Xi]

Yeah, I mean, There will be pain from the terrorists, but also from the retaliation. And that's sort of the point, according to Guoshan. Xi is a partner at the Beijing based research firm Hutong Research. She says the tariffs are so high now that meaningful negotiations are impossible basically until one side or the other cries uncle and caves is a strategy. Escalate to de escalate, escalate to de escalate. So she says Beijing has been preparing for this since the first trade war back in 2018. The economy, of course, has challenges, but the leadership's pretty confident. You know, China's been doubling down on policies to boost its self sufficiency and become more resilient to outside shocks. Policymakers feel like they got a lot of ammunition for economic stimulus if they need it. The currency's already actually being allowed to weaken a bit. The government's been propping up stock prices. It's been buying gold. And get this, A. Guo says that Chinese exports to the US only amount to about 3% of GDP, which isn't exactly massive. And that US share of China's exports has been shrinking as China's been expanding its trade and diplomatic relations with other countries.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

What other reactions have we seen outside of China?

[Guoshan Xi]

Well, Asian markets were mostly down today on top of big drops lately as the tariffs kicked in. Some countries in the region have been trying to sort of position their economies to cushion the blow. India's central bank, for instance, cut benchmark interest rates today and signal a more accommodative monetary policy. But officials haven't been saying much. You know, they're working quietly to get negotiations going so they can get those tariffs lowered or dropped. And so far, there's no word of breakthroughs.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

All right, that's NPR's John Ruich in Beijing. Thank you, John.

[Guoshan Xi]

You bet.

[Layla Falden]

President Trump has set out to drastically reshape the federal workforce, and yesterday he got some help in the effort from the U.S. supreme Court.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

In a brief unsigned order, the court said the administration is free to move forward with the firing of 16,000 probationary federal employees. But the decision wasn't a total victory for the administration since for now at least, the court made no ruling on whether the firings themselves were actually legal.

[Layla Falden]

NPR's Nina Totenberg has been following the case and joins us now to break it all down. Hi, Nina.

[Nina Totenberg]

Hi, Layla.

[Layla Falden]

Okay, so let's jump in here. This is only the latest case in which the Supreme Court has taken a so called emergency action at the behest of the Trump administration. And lately they're winning more than they're losing, right?

[Nina Totenberg]

Yes. On Friday, the court allowed the Trump administration to cancel millions of dollars in education grants. Then two days ago, the court threw out a lower court action temporarily barring the deportation of alleged Venezuelan gang members, though there was a caveat that required all the deportees to have a hearing before a federal judge on their individual deportation orders. And yesterday, the court threw out a lower court order that barred the administration from firing 16,000 probationary employees. The court said that the plaintiffs in the case were not the employees themselves, but nonprofit groups who failed to show that they themselves would be hurt by the firings.

[Layla Falden]

Okay, let's drill down on this latest one. What does probationary in this context mean?

[Nina Totenberg]

It means the fired employee has to be on the job for a year or less or in some cases, more time. That includes people who are serving in a job that they were promoted to, for instance.

[Layla Falden]

Okay. So the Trump administration asked the Supreme Court to get rid of that lower court order, and it did. So what happens now? Do these fired employees have any recourse left?

[Nina Totenberg]

Yes, but it's going to take time. And therein lies the rub. The employees have to first challenge their firings at the Merit Systems Protection Board, which is the federal agency charged with protecting civil servants. And for the most part, the most efficient way to do that is systematically with a class action that says, essentially we are representing all of these similarly situated fire at employees and we as a class should be reinstated. But in order to be certified as a class, they have to go before an administrative judge at the Merit Systems Protection Board. And so far, there have been more than 10,000 cases filed since October, including 20 class action suits. And I would presume that when the dust settles, there will be lots more class actions, a lot of suits.

[Layla Falden]

Can the Merit System Protection Board actually act quickly?

[Nina Totenberg]

The MSPB system is meant to be fast, with cases finalized in 120 days and the judge's decisions become final in 35 days unless there's some intervening action by the Merit Systems Protection Board. Initially, any appeal would be taken by the MSPB Board, but the agency didn't even have a quorum until two days ago. And the two board members there, for the moment, might well cancel each other's votes out. And in any event, the law allows a relatively quick appeal to the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit. And in that setting, for sure, there will be thousands of employees who do have legal standing to sue and have been harmed.

[Layla Falden]

NPR's Nina Totenberg. Thank you, Nina.

[Nina Totenberg]

Thank you.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

And that's up first for Wednesday, April 9th.

[Layla Falden]

Amy Martinez, and I'm Layla Falden. For your next listen, consider Consider this from npr. We here at up first give you the three big stories of the day. Or consider this colleague's Take a approach. They dive into a single news story and what it means to you in less than 15 minutes. Listen now on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Kurtzleben]

Today's episode of up first was edited by Roberta Rampden, Robbie Griffiths, Anna Yukonoff, Jason Breslo, Lisa Thompson and Jana Williams. It was produced by Zia Butch, Ian Dumas and Christopher Thomas. We get engineering support from Nisha Hyness, and our technical director is Carly Strange. Join us again tomorrow.

[Donald Trump]

Foreign.

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