US Senator Visits Abrego Garcia, Florida State University Shooting, Fed Independence

Summary

NPR’s Up First - April 18, 2025

Hosts: Layla Fadel, Amy Martinez, Scott Horsley

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1. U.S. Senator Visits Illegally Deported Individual in El Salvador

Overview: U.S. Senator Chris Van Hollen made a noteworthy trip to El Salvador to meet Kilmar Abrego Garcia, a Salvadoran citizen who was deported to the country by the Trump administration. Garcia, who resided in Maryland for approximately 15 years, is currently held in a notorious mega prison in El Salvador. The meeting comes amidst legal battles and political tensions surrounding Garcia's deportation and potential return to the United States.

Detailed Discussion:

• Initial Deportation and Detention:

  • [00:02] Layla Fadel: Introduces the story of Senator Van Hollen’s visit to Garcia.

• Senator Van Hollen’s Mission:

  • [00:08] Scott Horsley: Van Hollen states, “My mission today was simply to see how his health is, what his condition is.”
  • [00:13] Amy Martinez: Queries about Garcia’s potential return.

• Meeting Challenges and Outcome:

  • [02:27] Amy Martinez: Introduces NPR’s Ryland Barton for updates.
  • [02:32] Ryland Barton: Details that soldiers initially blocked Van Hollen’s access to Garcia.
  • [02:51] Scott Horsley: Van Hollen describes being stopped by soldiers, emphasizing his humanitarian intent.
  • [03:06] Ryland Barton: Reports that President Nayib Bukele of El Salvador acknowledged the meeting and confirmed Garcia’s health, allowing him to remain in custody. Senator Van Hollen shared a compassionate message to Garcia’s wife.

• White House Response:

  • [03:50] Amy Martinez: Mentions the White House's stance.
  • [03:59] Ryland Barton: White House spokesman Kush Desai criticizes Democrats for prioritizing Garcia’s welfare, labeling him an “illegal alien ms.13 terrorist.” However, Garcia’s lawyers rebut, noting his lack of a U.S. criminal record.

• Judicial Rulings:

  • [04:06] Ryland Barton: The Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals criticized the administration for unjustly deporting U.S. residents to foreign prisons without due process. Judge J. Harvey Wilkinson highlighted the Justice Department’s own admission of the mistake.
  • [04:25] Ryland Barton: Highlights that the administration's arguments against Garcia’s return have been weakened, with potential for further appeals.
  • [04:48] Amy Martinez: Inquires about the court’s opinion on the administration’s non-compliance.
  • [04:53] Ryland Barton: Judge Wilkinson warns of a “slippery slope” where executive actions could undermine the rule of law, advocating for executive branch adherence to legal norms.

Notable Quotes:

• Senator Chris Van Hollen: “My mission today was simply to see how his health is, what his condition is.” [00:08]
• Judge J. Harvey Wilkinson: “We are in a moment where the executive and judicial branches are close to grinding irrevocably against one another in a conflict that promises to diminish both.” [04:27]

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2. Active Shooter at Florida State University

Overview: A tragic shooting occurred at Florida State University (FSU), resulting in two fatalities and six injuries. The shooter, Phoenix Eichner, a 20-year-old student and son of a local sheriff's deputy, was apprehended after a standoff with law enforcement. This incident reignites debates on campus security and gun control legislation in Florida.

Detailed Discussion:

• Incident Description:

  • [00:28] Amy Martinez: Announces the FSU shooting, with students taking refuge in basements and bathrooms.
  • [00:33] Layla Fadel: Reveals the shooter is the son of a local sheriff's deputy.

• Eyewitness Account:

  • [06:46] Craig Jacobson (FSU Freshman): “We have no idea what's going on. And they said we can go back, but how do I know that campus is safe?” [06:21]

• Law Enforcement Response:

  • [06:15] Greg Allen: Provides a timeline of events, noting the swift police response and campus lockdown.
  • [07:14] Sheriff Walter McNeil: Confirms the shooter’s access to his mother’s weapon and mentions ongoing investigations into additional weapons. [07:28]

• Shooter’s Background:

  • [07:44] Greg Allen: Details that Phoenix Eichner was involved with the Sheriff's Department Youth Advisory Board and had extensive training.
  • [07:56] Sheriff McNeil: Emphasizes the tragedy and commitment to prosecuting the matter. [07:56]

• Motivation and Investigation:

  • [08:10] Greg Allen: Notes that no clear motive has been established, as the shooter refused to communicate post-arrest.

• Reactions from Officials:

  • [08:19] Greg Allen: Shares responses from President Trump and Florida Governor Ron DeSantis.
  • [08:19] Scott Horsley: Quotes DeSantis saying, “We are a strong and united community.”

• Historical Context and Policy Debate:

  • [08:46] Greg Allen: References a 2014 FSU shooting and annual legislative attempts to permit concealed weapons on campuses in Florida.
  • [09:18] Amy Martinez: Highlights the connection to students from the Parkland shooting, adding depth to the ongoing gun control debate.

Notable Quotes:

• Leon County Sheriff Walter McNeil: “This event is tragic in more ways than you people in the audience could ever fancy from a law enforcement perspective.” [07:56]
• Governor Ron DeSantis: “We are all Seminoles today.” [08:10]
• President Trump: Describes the shootings as “horrible” but reiterates his support for the Second Amendment. [08:19]

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3. President Trump Pressures the Federal Reserve on Interest Rates

Overview: President Trump has publicly criticized the Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell for not reducing interest rates, despite Trump's own tariff policies exacerbating economic challenges. This tension underscores the ongoing debate over the Fed’s independence and its role in managing the U.S. economy.

Detailed Discussion:

• Trump’s Criticism:

  • [09:27] Layla Fadel: Announces Trump’s dissatisfaction with the Federal Reserve.
  • [09:35] Amy Martinez: Reports Trump’s claim of public demand for lower rates and his goal to fire Powell. [09:35]
  • [09:44] Scott Horsley: Describes Trump's social media post seeking Powell’s termination. [09:44]

• Economists’ Perspectives:

  • [10:11] Amy Martinez: Introduces economist Austan Goolsbee for insights.
  • [10:27] Austan Goolsbee: Explains Trump's frustration stems from the Fed maintaining high rates while Europe cuts them, and Trump's tariffs increasing inflation. [10:11]
  • [10:34] Goolsbee: Highlights Powell’s stance on serving until the end of his term and the legal protections against his dismissal. [10:34]

• Defense of Federal Reserve Independence:

  • [11:12] Goolsbee: Argues against Powell being political, emphasizing the Fed’s insulation from political pressures.
  • [11:31] Scott Horsley: Quotes Goolsbee on the necessity of central bank independence, citing global examples where lack thereof led to poor economic outcomes. [11:31]

• Historical Context:

  • [11:47] Goolsbee: References the Nixon era when the Fed succumbed to political pressure, resulting in prolonged high inflation.
  • [12:00] Goolsbee: Mentions Paul Volcker’s decisive actions to control inflation, despite initial public resistance. [12:00]

• Current Economic Challenges:

  • [12:27] Horsley: Emphasizes the real-world impact of Fed decisions on everyday lives.
  • [12:46] Goolsbee: Discusses how Trump’s tariffs complicate the Fed’s efforts to manage inflation, noting rising mortgage rates as an example. [12:46]

Notable Quotes:

• Austan Goolsbee: “Powell and his colleagues are doing their best to respond to what's happening in the economy, not buckling to political pressure.” [11:12]
• Austan Goolsbee: “We saw that in this country during the Richard Nixon era, when the Fed did bow to White House pressure to lower interest rates. And the result was stubbornly high inflation that lasted the better part of a decade.” [11:47]
• Scott Horsley: “This is not just a game. This is not just the markets. What the central bank does, what the Fed does affects real people.” [12:00]

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4. Upcoming Feature: Grady Hendrix’s New Novel

Overview: The podcast briefly mentions award-winning horror writer Grady Hendrix’s latest novel, "Witchcraft for Wayward Girls," which delves into the historical period between 1943 and 1973 when unmarried women and young girls were compelled to give birth and place their babies for adoption in maternity homes.

Detailed Discussion:

• Historical Context and Novel Setting:

  • [13:23] Amy Martinez: Highlights Hendrix’s exploration of this harrowing period.
  • [13:42] Ryland Barton: Quotes Hendrix on the emotional trauma faced by young mothers. [13:42]

• Promotion of Upcoming Content:

  • [13:59] Amy Martinez: Announces the feature on "The Sunday Story" where Hendrix discusses his book. [13:59]

Notable Quotes:

• Grady Hendrix (via Ryland Barton): “The fact that millions of kids were born in these homes and that these were kids, you know, these were girls and they were 14 and 15 and 13 years old. And we were telling them, give up your baby, never think about it again. I mean, that's impossible for a mother to do.” [13:42]

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Conclusion

NPR’s Up First delivered a comprehensive update on critical issues affecting the United States, including the controversial deportation and detention of an American resident in El Salvador, a tragic active shooter incident at Florida State University, and the escalating tension between President Trump and the Federal Reserve over monetary policy. Additionally, the podcast teased an upcoming literary feature exploring a dark chapter in reproductive history. The episode underscored themes of justice, public safety, economic policy, and historical reflection, providing listeners with in-depth analysis and diverse perspectives on pressing national matters.

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Notable Contributors:

• Layla Fadel
• Amy Martinez
• Scott Horsley
• Ryland Barton
• Greg Allen
• Austan Goolsbee
• Walter McNeil

Produced by: Ziad Bunch, Nia Dumas, and Christopher Thomas

Editing: Villa Marks, Susanna Capilouto, Rafael Naom, Mohammed Zadbadisi, and Janae Williams

Engineering Support: Damien Herring

Executive Producer: Jay Shaylor

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Stay informed with NPR’s Up First, available weekdays at 6:30 a.m. ET, and subscribe to support local NPR stations at donate.npr.org.

Transcript

[Layla Fadel]

A U.S. senator traveled to El Salvador to visit the man illegally deported there by the Trump administration.

[Scott Horsley]

My mission today was simply to see how his health is, what his condition is.

[Amy Martinez]

Is he any closer to returning to.

[Layla Fadel]

The U.S. i'm Amy Martinez with Lay La Fadel. And this is up first from NPR News. Students at Florida State University locked themselves in basements and bathrooms to escape an active shooter on campus.

[Craig Jacobson]

We have no idea what's going on. And they said we can go back, but how do I know that campus is safe?

[Layla Fadel]

The alleged gunman is the son of a local sheriff's deputy.

[Amy Martinez]

And President Trump is pressuring the Fed to cut interest rates and it's got economists worried.

[Scott Horsley]

Just look around the world at places where there isn't independence. The inflation rate is higher. The unemployment and the job market are worse.

[Amy Martinez]

Stay with us. We've got the news you need to start your day.

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[Amy Martinez]

More, [e-mail] Prevention Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen held a face to face meeting with Kilmar Abrego Garcia yesterday.

[Layla Fadel]

He's the Salvadoran citizen who lived in Maryland for about 15 years before the administration illegally deported him last month. Now he's being held in a notorious mega prison in El Salvador where the administration is sending people deported from the U.S. now the White House insists he will not be returning to the U.S. despite a federal judge's order to facilitate his return.

[Amy Martinez]

Joining us with the latest is NPR's Ryland Barton. Good morning, Ryland.

[Ryland Barton]

Hi, Leila.

[Amy Martinez]

Okay, so Senator Van Hollen says Salvadoran officials initially refused to let him meet with Abreco Garcia. And then we see a meeting happened, what changed?

[Ryland Barton]

Yeah. So we know very little about how exactly the meeting happened. But in an interview yesterday on All Things Considered, Van Hollen said soldiers had initially prevented him from reaching the prison.

[Scott Horsley]

I was stopped by soldiers about 3km out who said they'd been ordered not to allow me to go see him. My mission today was simply to see how his health is, what his condition is.

[Ryland Barton]

So later in the day, the president of El Salvador, Nayib Bukele, tweeted that Van Hollen had met with Abrego Garcia and said that since Abrego Garcia had been confirmed healthy, he gets the honor of staying in El Salvador's custody. The senator then tweeted out a picture of the two of them sitting at a table and said he had called Abrego Garcia's wife to pass along a message of love. In a statement, White House spokesman Kush Desai said the meeting showed Democrats were prioritizing the welfare of what he called an illegal alien ms.13 terrorist. The Trump administration has repeatedly said Abrego Garcia is a member of Ms. 13, which is a transnational gang. But Abrego Garcia's lawyers dispute that, pointing to the fact that he doesn't even have a criminal record in the U.S.

[Amy Martinez]

Now, there was yet another court ruling against the Trump administration's handling of Abrego Garcia yesterday. What did it say?

[Ryland Barton]

Right. So the fourth Circuit Court of Appeals tore into the administration, saying they are, quote, asserting a right to stash away residents of this country in foreign prisons without the semblance of due process. Judge J. Harvey Wilkinson headed up the three judge panel. He noted that the Justice Department had already admitted it deported to Brago Garcia mistakenly, and asked, quote, why then should it not make what was wrong?

[NPR Sponsor]

Right.

[Ryland Barton]

Earlier this week, a judge had ruled Abrego Garcia's lawyers should be able to question administration officials. But the Department of Justice argues that that was untenable and said the government had no powers to return Abrego Garcia. But with this latest ruling, they have lost that argument. So now officials must explain what they're doing, if anything, to bring him back, or they could appeal again, this time to the Supreme Court.

[Amy Martinez]

And what did the court say about the administration's refusal to comply with these orders?

[Ryland Barton]

Yeah, so Judge Wilkinson said this is a slippery slope. In his order, he imagined a future in which there would be no assurances that the executive branch would not deport American citizens or train its powers on political enemies. He said, we're in a moment where the executive and judicial branches are close to grinding irrevocably against one another in a conflict that promises to diminish both. But he also said there is an opportunity here saying, quote, we yet cling to the hope that it is not naive to believe our good brethren in the executive branch perceive the rule of law as vital to the American ethos. This ruling follows a decision from U.S. district Judge James Boasberg earlier this week where he said he might hold Trump officials in contempt for disregarding his order to stop sending deportees to that same salvadoran prison.

[Amy Martinez]

That's NPR's Ryland Barton. Thank you, Ryland.

[Ryland Barton]

Thank you.

[Amy Martinez]

In Florida, Police have a 20 year old man in custody after a shooting at Florida State University that left two dead and six people injured, one critically.

[Layla Fadel]

The person arrested was a student at the school and the son of a sheriff's deputy. He allegedly used his mother's gun in the shooting.

[Amy Martinez]

NPR's Greg Allen is following the events in Tallahassee and joins us now. Good morning, Greg.

[Greg Allen]

Hi, Layla.

[Amy Martinez]

Sadly, this kind of violence feels familiar in the U.S. what happened on this campus?

[Greg Allen]

Well, it began around noon yesterday on Florida State University's campus in the center of Tallahassee, the Florida State Capitol. A campus wide alert went out that an active shooter was reported near the student union building. Police responded quickly and began evacuating students. It set the whole campus into lockdown. Students locked themselves in basements and bathrooms while they heard gunshots being fired outside. Here's FSU freshman Craig Jacobson.

[Craig Jacobson]

So I was like barricaded in a room and then there was police knocking everywhere and we got brought into another room. I mean, still everything's going crazy and we still don't know what's going on. We have no idea what's going on. And they said we can go back, but like, how do I know the campus is safe?

[Greg Allen]

By 3pm yesterday, law enforcement said the campus had been secured and the threat was over. But it left two people dead, several others wounded. Police say the shooter didn't surrender when they confronted him and he was shot and wounded before being arrested.

[Amy Martinez]

And the man arrested is the son of the sheriff's deputy?

[Greg Allen]

Yeah, that's right. Police identified him as 20 year old Phoenix Eichner. His mother is an 18 year veteran of the Leon County Sheriff's Department. Leon County Sheriff Walter McNeil spoke at a news conference yesterday.

[Walter McNeil]

Unfortunately, her son had access to one of her weapons and that was one of the weapons that was found at the scene. And we will continue that investigation into how that weapon was used and what other weapons perhaps he may have had access to.

[Greg Allen]

Police also recovered a shotgun at the scene, but they don't believe it was used in the shooting, McNeil said. Phoenix Eichner was a member of the Sheriff's Department Youth Advisory Board, and he'd gone through extensive training with the sheriff's department.

[Walter McNeil]

This event is tragic in more ways than you people in the audience could ever fancy from a law enforcement perspective. But I will tell you this, we will make sure that we do everything we can to prosecute.

[Greg Allen]

We don't have a motive at this point. Police say that he wouldn't talk to them after his arrest.

[Amy Martinez]

Now, this campus is very close to Florida's state Capitol. What's the reaction been in Washington?

[Greg Allen]

President Trump said he was briefed on the shootings and called them horrible. When asked about stricter gun laws, he said he would always protect the Second Amendment. Florida's Governor Ron DeSantis said, We are all Seminoles today, which is, of course, the school mascot. Florida State University President Richard McCullough visited some of the shooting victims at the hospital and said counseling was available for students and faculty.

[Scott Horsley]

We're a strong and united community.

[Ryland Barton]

We're family.

[Scott Horsley]

And so we'll take care of all of you and we'll get through this together.

[Greg Allen]

Now, this isn't the first shooting on the FSU campus, Of course, in 2014, a gunman fired into a crowded library there, wounding three people before he was killed by police. And following that shooting, and just about every year since, Republican lawmakers have filed bills to allow concealed weapons on campuses in Florida, this shooting will probably revive that debate. But some of the FSU students who were evacuated during the shooting yesterday were high school students at Marjory Stoneman Douglas in Parkland, where there was that horrific shooting seven years ago. So I think that will also be something to be considered.

[Amy Martinez]

That's NPR's Greg Allen. Thank you, Greg.

[Greg Allen]

You're welcome.

[Layla Fadel]

President Trump is bashing the Federal Reserve for not cutting interest rates, even as his own tariffs make that more difficult.

[Amy Martinez]

Speaking to reporters in the Oval Office yesterday, Trump suggested without evidence that there's a groundswell of people demanding lower rates from Fed Chair Jerome Powell.

[Walter McNeil]

He's going to have a lot of political pressure. You know, they are political also, and I think there's a lot of political pressure for him to lower interest rates.

[Amy Martinez]

So far, most of that pressure is coming from the president himself. Trump said in a social media post that Powell's termination, quote, cannot come fast enough.

[Layla Fadel]

NPR Scott Horsley joins us now. Not the first time President Trump, Scott, has tried to politically pressure the central bank about lowering interest rates. So what's he unhappy about?

[Austan Goolsbee]

Trump complains that over in Europe, the central bank has been cutting interest rates. But here in this country, the Fed has been sitting on its hands, keeping rates relatively high. The president is also unhappy about a speech that Powell gave this week in which the Fed chairman warned that Trump's tariffs are likely to push inflation higher, at least temporarily. Trump stopped short of telling Powell, you're fired. But he made it clear he wouldn't be sorry to see the Fed chairman.

[Walter McNeil]

Go, oh, he'll leave if I ask him to. He'll be out of there. But I don't think he's. I don't think he's. I don't think he's doing the job. He's too late. Always too late. Little slow, and I'm not happy with him.

[Austan Goolsbee]

Powell insists he plans to serve out the remainder of his term as Fed chairman, which runs through May of next year. He also says Trump doesn't have the legal authority to fire him over a disagreement about interest rates. Now, Powell has Supreme Court precedent on his side, but the White House seems willing to test that by firing board members from other independent agencies.

[Layla Fadel]

Now the President accuses Powell of playing politics. Is he?

[Austan Goolsbee]

No. Powell and his colleagues are doing their best to respond to what's happening in the economy, not buckling to political pressure. In fact, the Fed is designed to be insulated from politics. Economist Austan Goolsbee, who also takes part in these interest rate decisions, is head of the Chicago Federal Reserve bank, says that works better than letting politicians call the shots.

[Scott Horsley]

Economists are virtually unanimous on the importance of central bank independence. Just look around the world at places where there isn't independence. The inflation rate is higher, the growth rate is lower, the unemployment and the job market are worse.

[Austan Goolsbee]

We saw that in this country during the Richard Nixon era, when the Fed did bow to White House pressure to lower interest rates. And the result was stubbornly high inflation that lasted the better part of a decade.

[Layla Fadel]

And how did that change?

[Austan Goolsbee]

Ultimately, it took another stubborn Fed chairman, Paul Volcker, to wrestle inflation under control using very high interest rates. Now, that was not popular at the time. Construction workers famously sent Volker protest messages scrawled on two by fours. But it worked, and eventually Volcker was remembered as a hero. Goolsbee told the Economic Club in New York that Volcker's widow later gave him a piece of one of those two by fours as a reminder.

[Scott Horsley]

I keep that on the shelf in my office right by my desk for two reasons. One, this is not just a game. This is not just the markets. What the central bank does, what the Fed does affects real people. And two, sometimes the Fed has to do the hard job.

[Austan Goolsbee]

Now today, that job of fighting inflation is made even harder by Trump's tariffs, which are pushing up prices and making everything the US Imports more expensive. That's a big reason interest rates are staying high for now. You can see the ripple effects of that in the mortgage market, where this week the average rate on a 30 year home loan jumped to 6.8%. If it's any consolation, though, mortgages in Paul Volcker's day soared as high as 16%.

[Layla Fadel]

Yeah, send someone a 2x4. You know it's serious. It's NPR. Scott Horsley. Scott, thanks.

[Austan Goolsbee]

You're welcome.

[Amy Martinez]

Before Roe v. Wade, there was a period from 1943 to 1973 when many unmarried women and girls were forced to give birth and put their babies up for adoption in places called maternity homes. Acclaimed horror writer Grady Hendrix made this shadowy history the setting for his new novel.

[Ryland Barton]

The fact that millions of kids were born in these homes and that these were kids, you know, these were girls and they were 14 and 15 and 13 years old. And we were telling them, give up your baby, never think about it again. I mean, that's impossible for a mother to do.

[Amy Martinez]

This weekend on the Sunday Story from Up First, Hendricks talks about his new book, witchcraft for Wayward Girls. That's this Sunday right here in the Up first podcast feed. And that's Up first for Friday, April 18th.

[Layla Fadel]

I'm Layla Falden and Amy Martinez. Just a reminder, Up first airs on Saturday, too. Ayesha Rascoe and Scott Simon have all the news and look for it wherever you get.

[Amy Martinez]

Those pops episode of up first was edited by Villa Marks, Susanna Capilouto, Rafael Naom, Mohammed Zadbadisi and Janae Williams. It was produced by Ziad Bunch, Nia Dumas and Christopher Thomas. We get engineering support from Damien Herring, and our technical director is Zach Coleman. Our executive producer is Jay Shaylor. Join us again next time.

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