Texas Floods, Biden Doc PLEADS THE FIFTH, Leftists Try to Murder ICE Agents plus FBI Investigates Brennan & Comey

Summary

Verdict with Ted Cruz: Episode Summary Release Date: July 11, 2025

Host: Senator Ted Cruz
Co-Host: Ben Ferguson
Produced by: Premiere Networks
Sponsored by: Jobs, Freedom, and Security PAC

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1. Introduction

In this episode of "Verdict with Ted Cruz," Senator Ted Cruz and co-host Ben Ferguson delve into pressing national issues, offering their perspectives on recent events affecting the United States. The discussion is segmented into four main topics: the catastrophic Texas floods, the controversial testimony of President Biden’s doctor, escalating violence against ICE agents, and the FBI's investigation into former intelligence officials John Brennan and James Comey.

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2. Texas Floods and Camp Mystic Devastation

Timestamp: [03:18] - [11:14]

The podcast opens with a heartfelt discussion about the devastating floods in Texas, particularly focusing on the tragedy at Camp Mystic.

• Impact Overview: Senator Cruz describes the unprecedented nature of the floods, noting that "1.8 trillion gallons of rainwater fell on the Guadalupe River," leading to a "30ft rise" within an hour. This rapid influx caused widespread destruction, resulting in "119 people confirmed dead" and around "200 people missing" ([07:39]).

• Personal Connections: Cruz shares a personal connection to the tragedy, mentioning that his own wife had to pick up their daughter from a camp near Camp Mystic just before the floods hit. He states, “If you go to my home in Houston, on my front yard, the tree, we have a green ribbon around the tree, mourning the girls lost in Mystic” ([07:39]).

• Community Response: The hosts highlight the remarkable outpouring of support from across the nation, emphasizing unity and resilience. Cruz reflects, "Texans coming together and we will overcome this" ([07:39]).

• Quotes:

  • "Seeing firsthand what happened at Camp Mystic remains the most horrible thing I've ever seen." ([03:18])
  • "Texas is suffering. But we will come through this, and we'll come through this because we're coming together." ([07:39])

---

3. President Biden’s Doctor Pleads the Fifth

Timestamp: [11:14] - [36:50]

The conversation shifts to a significant political controversy involving President Biden’s physician, Dr. Kevin O’Connor, who recently testified before Congress.

• Testimony Highlights: Dr. O’Connor refused to answer questions during his deposition, invoking the Fifth Amendment. He stated, “I must respectfully decline to answer based upon physician patient privilege and in reliance on my right under the Fifth Amendment of the Constitution” ([13:43]).

• Co-Host's Analysis: Ben Ferguson criticizes Dr. O’Connor’s refusal to cooperate, suggesting it indicates potential wrongdoing: “The degree to which that is a confession of deliberate dishonesty” ([16:31]).

• Senator Cruz’s Commentary: Cruz argues that the doctor’s actions are unprecedented and suspicious, emphasizing the obligation of the president’s physician to provide transparent health information: “The president's doctor has an obligation to the American people to be candid” ([11:35]).

• Second Deposition Excerpt: An exchange during the deposition reveals the doctor's continued refusal to answer, raising further questions about the integrity of President Biden's health disclosures ([15:31] - [16:12]).

• Quotes:

  • "I'm not going to answer anything. If I lied to the American people, I'm not going to answer." ([13:43])
  • "He is refusing to answer any question... this is a big damn deal that the former head of the FBI and the former head of the CIA are being criminally investigated for felony conduct." ([36:02])

---

4. Rising Violence Against ICE Agents

Timestamp: [19:47] - [28:33]

Senator Cruz and Ben Ferguson address the alarming increase in violence targeting Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents, attributing it to incendiary rhetoric from left-leaning officials and media.

• Recent Incidents:

  • McAllen, Texas Attack: An active shooter targeted ICE agents, resulting in the shooter’s death and one police officer being wounded ([20:26]).
  • Alvarado, Texas Plot: Eleven individuals were arrested for planning an ambush on ICE correction officers, with charges including attempted murder and firearm offenses ([22:41]).

• Rhetorical Influence: The hosts link the violence to derogatory remarks from Democratic figures who have labeled ICE agents as "Nazis" and "Gestapo," fueling extremist actions. Examples include:

  • House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries urging people to "fight the Trump administration in the streets" ([22:41]).
  • Representative McIver’s call to "shut down the city because we are at war" ([24:13]).
  • Former Vice Presidential candidate Tim Waltz labeling ICE agents as the "modern day Gestapo" ([24:13]).

• Consequences of Rhetoric: Cruz emphasizes that such language dehumanizes law enforcement, leading to real-world violence: “They are acting with violence” ([24:13]).

• Quotes:

  • "Words have consequences and we have seen an awful lot of Democrats... call them Nazis, call them Gestapo" ([20:26]).
  • "This morning, an individual opened fire at the entrance of the United States Border Patrol SECTOR Annex in McAllen, Texas." ([22:41])

---

5. FBI Investigation into John Brennan and James Comey

Timestamp: [28:33] - [36:50]

The episode concludes with a discussion on the FBI’s new investigations into former high-ranking intelligence officials John Brennan and James Comey, who were pivotal during the Trump-Russia probe.

• Investigation Details:

  • John Brennan: Former CIA Director facing criminal investigation for potential wrongdoing, including allegedly making false statements to Congress ([29:13]).
  • James Comey: Former FBI Director also under investigation with similar allegations related to the Trump-Russia investigation ([29:13]).

• Senator Cruz’s Perspective: Cruz characterizes the investigation as a significant development, suggesting it exposes dishonesty within the intelligence community: “It is a big damn deal that the former head of the FBI and the former head of the CIA are being criminally investigated for felony conduct” ([36:02]).

• Historical Context and Critique: Through a discussion with Ben Ferguson, Cruz critiques the political maneuvers surrounding the investigations, drawing parallels to past elections and alleging a deliberate attempt to undermine the Trump administration ([32:08] - [36:02]).

• Impact on Public Trust: The co-host underscores the severity of officials pleading the Fifth Amendment, hinting at widespread deception: “The fact that he’s refusing to answer any question... this is what’s happening right now” ([36:02]).

• Quotes:

  • "John Brennan was the head of the CIA. James Comey was the head of the FBI. Both of them are right now under Active criminal investigations." ([29:13])
  • "James Clapper... lied to Congress... John Brennan and James Comey are being criminally investigated for felony conduct." ([36:02])

---

Conclusion

In this episode, Senator Ted Cruz and Ben Ferguson provide a comprehensive analysis of several critical issues facing the nation. They highlight the resilience of Texans in the aftermath of devastating floods, scrutinize the transparency of President Biden’s medical disclosures, condemn the rising violence against ICE agents fueled by divisive rhetoric, and reveal deep concerns about integrity within the nation's top intelligence agencies. The hosts emphasize the need for accountability and unity in addressing these challenges.

---

Notable Quotes:

• "Texas is suffering. But we will come through this, and we'll come through this because we're coming together." ([07:39])
• "The president's doctor has an obligation to the American people to be candid." ([11:35])
• "Words have consequences and we have seen an awful lot of Democrats... call them Nazis, call them Gestapo." ([20:26])
• "It is a big damn deal that the former head of the FBI and the former head of the CIA are being criminally investigated for felony conduct." ([36:02])

---

Disclaimer: This summary is based on the provided transcript and aims to encapsulate the key discussions and viewpoints presented in the episode. Listener discretion is advised.

Transcript

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[Jamie Rubin]

Welcome. It is verdict with Senator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you. It's so nice to have you with us across the country. And Senator, let's just start with obviously the most important story and that has been coming out of Texas. You have spent a lot of time in Kerr county and Kerrville. You're also coming back with President Trump from Washington, D.C. to tour the devastation with him as well. And our thoughts are and prayers are still with so many people affected by this incredible horrific fl.

[Unknown]

Well, we are one week out from these catastrophic floods and the damage in Texas. There are not words that can describe it. I can tell you I've spent this entire week dealing with the devastation, dealing with the little girls who were lost to Camp mystic, talking with parents who lost their daughters, talking with families who are grieving, talking with first responders. As you noted. On Friday, I'm going to be flying on Air Force One with President Trump down to Texas to see firsthand the flooding damage to visit with first responders on the ground. We're going to break that down. We're going to tell you what is happening. What is the latest on the Texas floods? I will tell you, it remains seeing firsthand what happened at Camp mystic remains the most horrible thing I've ever seen. We're going to talk about that. We're also going to talk about President Biden's doctor testified on Capitol Hill and did something really remarkable. You would think about president's doctor. That would be straightforward. That ought to be easy. Well, no, the doctor pled the fifth, refused to answer questions. He said if I give an answer that will incriminate me in criminal conduct, we're going to break that down for you. We're also going to talk about the rising wave of terrorism directed at ice. Left wing radicals who are firing weapons, trying to kill ICE agents. It is a phenomenon that is fueled by the radical rhetoric from the Democrats, from the media. We're going to do a deep dive on that. And finally, the FBI announced an investigation into John Brennan, the former head of the CIA. We're going to talk about why the FBI is investigating him and what that means. All of that in today's podcast.

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[Unknown]

Well, we are one week out now from these catastrophic floods. It was a week ago on July 4, in the early hours of the morning that the flood waters rose and the Guadalupe river, who is ordinarily a Calm, peaceful, beautiful river. A river that people love to vacation on, to canoe, to swim. 1.8 trillion gallons of rainwater fell on that river. And in less than an hour, the river rose 30ft and it carried out utter devastation. As we are sitting here, one week into it, 119 people are confirmed dead. And there are roughly 200 people that are missing that they're still searching for. And one of the challenges, if you look at Kerr county in central Texas, it is a vacation spot. It is, I think, and this is widely agreed, the most beautiful part of Texas, the Hill Country. There's the reason it's called the Hill Country. It's beautiful rolling hills, it's canyons, it is beautiful, gorgeous rivers. And so people come there. And on the 4th of July weekend, you had thousands of thousands of people who came from all over Texas to vacation. They were in RVs, they were in vacation homes right along the river. One of the challenges is the local authorities don't know everyone that was there. Many of them were from out of town. They were from across Texas, across the the country. The RV camps, we saw RV after RV swept into the water. The vacation cabins, many of the cabins are right on the river. The 30 foot wall of water ripped cabins off of their foundations and took them into the water. And so we don't know everyone who is missing. And the story that has captured the heart of really the country and the world is Camp Mystic. Camp mystic is a Texas institution. It is 100 years old. It was founded in 1926. And for a century, Texas girls have gone to Camp mystic and they make the best friends of their lifetimes. When you go to a closing ceremony at Camp mystic and the other summer camps that are in the Hill country, the closing ceremonies are typically one to two days. And. And you see, literally you see grandmothers and moms and little girls, three generations of women and girls who have been to these camps. And it is a beautiful, wonderful tradition. And right now, the extent of the agony, I really cannot overstate it. Every city in Houston, in Dallas, in Fort Worth, in Austin, in San Antonio, all across the state, in West Texas, in the Rio Grande Valley in East Texas, Texans, their little girls go there. As you know, my daughters have gone to camp in the Hill country for a decade. My wife Heidi picked up Catherine a week before these floods from her summer camp just a couple of miles away from Camp Mystic. And so the agony. Look, if you go to my home in Houston, on, in my front yard, the tree, we have a green ribbon around the tree, mourning the girls lost in Mystic. Just about every single home on my street has a green ribbon around the trees mourning the girls lost in Camp Mystic. Texas is suffering. But we will come through this, and we'll come through this because we're coming together and it is inspirational to see Texans coming together and we will overcome this.

[Jamie Rubin]

This is one of those stories that I'm so glad we get to shine light on it. Joe Biden's father, former doctor, when he was the president, refused senator to answer questions in the House oversight probe and to basically, like, who was running the country? Who was in charge of the auto pin. Joe Biden may not have known what he was even doing.

[Unknown]

Well, this was really astonishing this week. You know, ordinarily, if the president's doctor is testifying, the president's doctor is speaking at a press conference. It's kind of a nothing burger. The president's doctor lays out, here's what happened when we engaged in investigation. And by the way, there's no notion that presidents have a right to privacy, to have if the president has cancer, if the president has dementia, the president's doctor is supposed to tell the American people, the American people have a right to know if there's a serious health condition affecting the president. Well, instead of answering reasonable questions, The President's doctor, Dr. Kevin O', Connor, sat in front of the House of Representatives and he pleaded the Fifth. He said, I'm not answering anything. I'm not going to answer. If I lied to the American people, I'm not going to answer. If I lied to Congress, I'm not going to answer anything. Now, typically, when people plead the Fifth, they're doing it to avoid incriminating themselves in criminal conduct. That is an astonishing thing. It would be one thing if he said, I'm not going to give the precise diagnosis that I gave to Joe Biden about particular health maladies. He had that. That is. That's not an unreasonable thing to say. I don't think you should say that because I actually think the president's doctor has an obligation to the American people to be candid. But if he wanted to say that, that would be one thing he's saying he refused to answer. Were you asked to lie to the American people? I want you to listen to some of the cross examination because his answers are astonishing. And you mentioned the question, who was running the country? I have heard, literally over the last four years, hundreds of times people have asked me who was running the country. And I got to tell you, if the president's doctor has to Plead the Fifth to avoid saying, were you lying to the American people? That really raises incredible questions about the degree of duplicity, the degree of lying to the American people that occurred for the last four years. Here, give a listen to this exchange with Joe Biden's doctor.

Dr. O', Connor, were you ever told to lie about the President's health?

The advice of counsel, I must respectfully decline to answer based upon physician patient privilege and in reliance on my right under the Fifth Amendment of the Constitution. I am not a lawyer. I must follow my lawyer's advice in this matter.

[Jamie Rubin]

Simple. 18 seconds, right? Hey, I can't even answer the question if I was told to lie about the President's condition. That is shocking coming from a doctor.

[Unknown]

It's shocking and it's lawless. The Fifth Amendment does not protect. There's nothing in the patient doctor privilege that protects that bars you from answering the question. Were you ever told a lie that has nothing to do with the President's condition? Were you ever told a lie? By the way, I think virtually every president's doctor, that would be an easy question because a president's doctor, Ronny Jackson, who is now a member of Congress from Texas, he was the president's doctor. He was President Bush's doctor, He was President Obama's doctor. He was President Trump's doctor. He has gone on TV and said, hey, were you ever asked to lie? No, I was the president's doctor. So I told the truth to the American people. The degree to which that is a confession of deliberate dishonesty. And it's not just on the part of the doctor. Look, the doctor was complicit. The obvious reason he's pleading the Fifth is because the answer is, yes, he was lying. He was lying to the American people. But it wasn't just the doctor that knew that. It was the White House staff, it was the chief of staff, it was the senior staff, it was Jill Biden, it was everyone around Joe Biden. His mental diminishment was massive. And so when the doctor was trundled out to the American people to say, he's sharp as a tack, he was lying. And everyone knew he was lying. And yet he's right now refusing to admit this. I want you to listen to this other exchange from the hearing this week.

Dr. O', Connor, before we begin, I would like to go over the ground rules for this deposition. The committee will conduct today's deposition in accordance with the House of Representatives regulations for the use of deposition authority which were furnished to your counsel. This regulation is Incorporated into the rules of the committee on oversight and government reform. At Rule 15, which was also furnished to your council, the questioning will proceed in rounds. The majority will ask questions for an hour, and then the minority will have an opportunity to ask questions for an hour if they choose. There will be one staff council per side asking the questions during each round. To the extent members have questions for the witness, they will be propounded during their side's respective rounds. Do you understand?

On the advice of Castle, I must respectfully decline to answer based on the physician patient privilege and reliance on my right under the fifth amendment, the constitution. I am not a lawyer, and I must follow my lawyer's advice in this matter. So, gentlemen, we intend to assert both privileges with regard to any questions that.

[Jamie Rubin]

Would be asked at this deposition. And Dr. O' Connor will not answer any questions. Can we go off the record for one second? I mean, you hear that and then they go off the record. This is just a doctor that clearly can't answer a single question, I guess, truthfully, because it puts him in such a bad light. As a doctor, why wouldn't you want to clear your own name as a doctor, say, no, I didn't lie and make up things. I didn't lie to the American people. I didn't lie on behalf of the president. United States of America. Wouldn't you want to clear your good name if you're a doctor?

[Unknown]

Of course, the reason he didn't say that is because he's a liar. The only reason you plead the fifth, when you're asked, were you asked to lie to the American people? That should not be a complicated question. Any doctor, by the way, any public official ought to be able to answer that. No, that I'm not lying to the American people. I did not lie to the American people. The fact that he's refusing to answer any question. And by the way, I think the house of Representatives is going to seriously consider granting this doctor immunity. Now, why is that important? Because if they grant the doctor immunity, it means they can force him to testify. You don't have a right to a fifth amendment privilege if you have immunity. That fifth amendment privilege only protects you from testifying if you face the jeopardy of criminal prosecution. If they grant him immunity, that immunity.

[Jamie Rubin]

Though, like, does he have to agree to that?

[Unknown]

He does not. They can grant him immunity.

[Jamie Rubin]

Immunity. Now you got to talk.

[Unknown]

They can grant him immunity. They can drag him in front, and if he refuses to testify, they can hold him in contempt and put him in jail. Wow. You don't. Once you are no longer facing criminal prosecution. The fifth Amendment does not give you the right to refuse to answer questions. I think there's a very real possibility that's what the house is going to do.

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[Jamie Rubin]

Senator, I want to move to another big story and that is the rising threat that has just become oh so real with federal law enforcement. And there was a shooter that ambushed Texas Border Patrol agents. Words from elected officials, in my opinion, have major influence, but also consequence. We have seen time and time again right now, Democrats coming out and saying that ICE are evil. Stand up to ice, Fight ice. These are words coming from so many Democrats that are actually elected to office.

[Unknown]

Well, listen, as you noted, words have consequence and we have seen an awful lot of Democrats. We have seen the corporate media denounce ice, called them Nazis, call them goose stepping fascists. And unfortunately, that rhetoric fuels a rage. It fuels a rage that we have seen manifesting in violence over and over again, leftists engaging in active violence against ICE agents. So just a few days ago, an active shooter opened Fire on Ice agents in McAllen, Texas. And here's the story from Fox News. Active shooter killed. An attempt to ambush Border Patrol agents in Texas. One McAllen police officer wounded but in stable condition following apparent planned ambush at Rio Grande Valley facility. And here's what the article says. An active shooter armed with tactical gear and a rifle opened fire upon Border Patrol agents as they arrived at a Border Patrol Annex facility in McAllen, Texas, in the Rio Grande Valley on Monday. Law enforcement sources say agents and local police returned fire and killed the gunman. No federal agents were hit, but one McAllen police officer was struck. Law enforcement sources say the officer is in stable condition. Quote, this morning, an individual opened fire at the entrance of the United States Border Patrol SECTOR Annex in McAllen, Texas. Both, both Border Patrol agents and local police helped neutralize the shooter. The Department of Homeland Security said in a statement to Fox News, this is an ongoing investigation led by the FBI. More information will be shared as it becomes available. Now, I'll tell you, I have walked into and out of that Border patrol facility in McAllen, Texas, multiple times. The fact that you have violent criminals, and this is a criminal who lost his life because he showed up and wanted to shoot at law enforcement officials. He was doing so. We don't know this conclusively, but we can certainly infer that he was doing so because he's been listening to the extreme rhetoric that these are Nazis. And so he was like, you know what? If you've got Nazis, let's kill the Nazis. That is the consequence of the unhinged and deranged rhetoric on the left right now.

[Jamie Rubin]

You talk about that rhetoric. Let's give actual quotes. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries of New York said employed people to, quote, fight the Trump administration in the streets, quote, unquote. He also declared ICE agents, quote, will be unsuccessful in protecting their identities no matter what it takes. Advocating for doxing and putting their families at risk. ICE agents. Representative Jay Apollo of Washington called ICE agents, quote, unquote, deranged and said it is, quote, inspiring to obstruct immigration enforcement. Representative McIver of New Jersey, who was arrested and charged with forcibly impeding and interfering with federal officers outside nights detention facility, incited her supporters to, quote, shut down the city because we are at war, quote, unquote. And even the former vice presidential candidate, the Minnesota governor Tim Waltz, getting in on the action, called ICE agents the modern day gestapo. Chicago's mayor. This past week, Johnson accused the ICE agents of being, quote, unquote, the secret police and, quote, terrorizing our communities. And, and you add in Eric Swalwell of California. He said it was, quote, his priority to ensure ICE agents, quote, are no longer faceless, comparing them to some 1800s bank robbers or some KGB officers in Russia. Words have consequences and this is the rhetoric coming from some of your colleagues.

[Unknown]

In D.C. well, and not only do they have consequences with the armed shooter who was killed in McAllen, Texas, but in North Texas, 11 people were arrested for plotting to ambush to kill ICE correction officers. And I want to read from this story from the Daily Wire, quote, eleven people have been arrested in what law enforcement officers described as a, quote, planned ambush of corrections Officers at an ICE detention facility in Alvarado, Texas on July 4. One Alvarado police officer was shot in the neck during the attack and is expected to survive. Quote, early reports indicate that more than a dozen masked individuals dressed in black arrived at the Prairieland ICE detention facility late Friday night and vandalized vehicles and security cameras in the parking lot. CBS News reported the individuals launched fireworks in an apparent effort to lure law enforcement. On July 5, Deputy Attorney General Tom Blanch posted on X, quote, we are closely monitoring the attacks on DHS facilities in Prairie Land, Texas and Portland, Oregon and are coordinating with usaos and our law enforcement partners. The department has zero tolerance for assaults on federal officers or property and will bring the full weight of the law against those responsible. On Monday, Acting U.S. attorney Nancy Larson stated, quote, we're here to tell you that late at night on July 4, Friday night at approximately 10:37pm at Prairieland ICE Detention center in Alvarado, Texas, 10 to 12 individuals dressed in black military style clothing began shooting fireworks and engaging in acts of vandalism at the facility that was part of an organized attack. Today, my Office has charged 10 individuals with three counts of attempted murder of a federal officer. Wow. Each of the 10 are also charged with three counts of discharging a firearm in relation to a crime of violence. Each of these defendants faces a mandatory prison term of 10 years and up to life in prison. An additional co conspirator was charged with obstruction of justice and conspiracy for attempting to conceal and destroy evidence in relation to the attack and faces up to 10 years in prison. And she continued, quote, let's discuss the incident. It was a planned ambush with the intent to kill ICE corrections officers. Make no mistake, this was not a so called peaceful protest. It was indeed an ambush. This is the Violence we are seeing. And it turns out when you call law enforcement officers, federal law enforcement officers that are keeping us safe, when you call them Nazis, when you call them Gestapo, lunatics on the left hear that? And sadly, we are saying over and over again, they are acting. They're acting with violence.

[Jamie Rubin]

You look at, even on Tuesday, you had Democratic Senator Padilla of California and Cory Booker, New Jersey, they introduced that legislation to require ICE officers to, quote, display clearly visible IDs and not wear masks no matter what during their enforcement operations, accusing, quote, the Trump administration of alarming immigration enforcement tactics that have terrorized communities across California and the nation. And we know what the left has done here. They want to dox these ICE agents, their family members, they've been putting their kids even online and posting people and posting their home addresses, hoping that basically people go after the ICE agents who are just doing their jobs. That's how sick these people are.

[Unknown]

Well, listen, there's a simple choice. There's a choice for Americans all across the country. Who do you stand with? Do you stand with cops? Do you stand with law enforcement agents? Do you stand with the men and women who risk their lives to keep us safe? You and I both stand with them. Or as the Democrats have chosen, do you stand with illegal immigrants? Do you stand with murderers? Do you stand with rapists? Do you stand with child molesters? Do you stand with Venezuelan gang members who are engaged in human trafficking? Sadly, the Democrats, and inexplicably, they've decided to stand with the criminals and not law enforcement, and we're seeing the consequences.

[Jamie Rubin]

Senator, I want to get into this and get your reaction to the FBI launching an investigation into John Brennan, into James Comey over the Trump Russia probe. I think we need to go back and just remind people of what they were peddling that they knew was false. Basically, in my opinion, it was a. It was a coup attempt against the American people who chose Donald Trump in 16 to be their president. They didn't like it. They're like, no worries. You know, we'll do what the Lisa Page, Peter Strux were doing, right? We'll fix it. We'll take care of it after the fact, after he gets sworn in. And we're going to go after him and we're going to undermine him, we're going to get him impeached, and that'll be all. Fine.

[Unknown]

Well, I got to say, this is an astonishing story. John Brennan was the head of the CIA. James Comey was the head of the FBI. Both of them are right now under Active criminal investigations. Here's what Fox News has reported. Quote, former CIA Director John Brennan and former FBI Director James Comey are under criminal investigation for potential wrongdoing related to the Trump Russia probe, including allegedly making false statements to Congress. Justice Department sources told Fox News Digital. CIA Director John Ratcliffe referred evidence of wrongdoing by Brennan to FBI Director Cash Patel for potential prosecution, DOJ sources told Fox News Digital. The sources said the referral was received and told Fox News Digital that a criminal investigation into Brennan was opened and is underway. DOJ sources declined to provide further details. It is unclear at this point if the investigation spans beyond his alleged false statements to Congress. As for Comey, DOJ sources told Fox News Digital that an investigation into the former director is underway, but could not share details of what specifically is being probed. The full scope of the criminal investigations into Brennan and Comey is unclear, but two sources describe the FBI's view of the duo's interactions as a, quote, conspiracy, which could open up a wide range of potential prosecutorial options. The FBI and the CIA declined comment.

[Jamie Rubin]

I mean, this is massive on so many different levels. And John Brennan, by the way, he, he went on TV on MSNBC and it was pretty funny because it was like he was just playing dumb. And it was like, I don't even know why they would be investigating me. I don't know what they would be looking at. I don't understand how this is even, even a thing. In his own words. And in fact, I'm going to play it because I want you to hear it. I want to get your reaction. Here's John Brennan, msnbc After finding out that target of an investigation, if there.

[iHeart Podcast]

Is an investigation that people will be questioned, I would be questioned about it. But again, I've had no contact from them. But again, I testified in front of many, many congressional committees in the House and the Senate over the years. And I continue to explain exactly what we did during this process, why we tried to make sure we stayed true to our intelligence responsibilities and that we were not going to do anything at all to try to interfere in that election. And again, it was a, it was a challenging time, but also one, I think the people who actually work this, both in terms of trying to collect intelligence prior to the election and then the ones who put together the intelligence community assessment, they really, I think, showed the best of what the intelligence community and what CIA is made of. So, again, I am clueless about what it is exactly that they may be investigating before.

[Jamie Rubin]

That may be the fastest senator I've Ever heard John Brennan speak on tv? Ever? And I've watched him a lot over the years. That seemed like a very nervous man to me.

[Unknown]

Well, let me give a little more background on who John Brennan is. He was the director of the CIA from 2013 to 2017 under. Under Barack Obama. Now, in 1976, John Brennan was a young man. 1976, you were not alive, is that right, Ben?

[Jamie Rubin]

I was not, no.

[Unknown]

Now, you're enough of a political student and scholar, let me ask you, who were the presidential candidates in 1976?

[Jamie Rubin]

Jimmy Carter.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Jamie Rubin]

All right. And on the Republican side, I love when you play these games with me. Did Reagan. Was Reagan 76 as well?

[Unknown]

No, no, he. So Reagan ran, but he lost.

[Jamie Rubin]

It was Ford.

[Unknown]

It was Ford. Ford was the incumbent president. So remember, Richard Nixon had been president. He resigned. So Ford was the incumbent president. Reagan primaried Ford, but he lost in that primary. So the general election was Gerald Ford versus Jimmy Carter. Now let me ask you, all right? In that election, who would you vote for?

[Jamie Rubin]

I'm gonna probably go with a Republican there. Not Jimmy Carter.

[Unknown]

Yeah, look. Although I will say. And by the way, do you know this is my first political memory? I'm about 10 years older than you are. My first political memory is when I was five years old, 1976, and my mother voted for Jimmy Carter. My mother's a strong conservative. She just thought Gerald Ford was an idiot. And I remember my father, my father, who's an immigrant from Cuba, he was not yet a U.S. citizen. He is today, but he was not in 76. And my father was furious because he felt like my mom had the family's vote and she voted for Jimmy Carter. And it's funny, my mom is 90 now, and she's incredible and a wonderful conservative and incredible person. But when I bring this up, she's like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I didn't know. Jimmy Carter was an absolute disaster. He was a left wing wacko. He was the worst president this country had ever seen. Until Joe Biden. Joe Biden managed to be worse than Jimmy Carter. Now, how is this relevant to John Brennan? Well, John Brennan was in college at the time. He was faced with a choice between Gerald Ford and ultra left wing crazy Jimmy Carter. What do you think John Brennan did?

[Jamie Rubin]

I'm ready. Give me the punchline here.

[Unknown]

He cast his vote for a guy named Gus Hall. Do you know who Gus hall was?

[Jamie Rubin]

I do not.

[Unknown]

He was the presidential candidate for the Communist Party usa.

[Jamie Rubin]

And there's your sign.

[Unknown]

So John Brennan decided Jimmy Carter is too right wing for him. And he voted for someone who, I'm not calling him a communist. He was the nominee of the Communist party. And John Brennan said, I want America governed by a communist president. That's who Barack Obama put in charge of the CIA and that's who played an integral role in orchestrating the whole Russiagate fraud. And it's just, it's important to understand just how extreme and radical this guy is. I gotta tell you, I don't know, to be honest, I don't know anybody else in public life who thought Jimmy Carter was too conservative. John Brennan is literally to the left of every Democrat senator, every Democrat House member, every single person I've ever encountered in public life. The lefty loons all voted for Jimmy Carter except for John Brennan who said, nope, we need a full on communist. That's who this guy is.

[Jamie Rubin]

Final question on this. How concerned do you think these two individuals should be about this investigation? Or is this one of those moments where you say, okay, yeah, there's investigation, but I don't have to worry because nothing ever really happens to us when we're the elites.

[Unknown]

Well, listen, the greatest exposure they have is for lying to Congress. Because lying to Congress, you're under oath. And lying under oath, that carries a prison sentence. That carries up to five years in prison. James Clapper, who was the Director of National Intelligence under Barack Obama, I think the evidence is very clear that he lied to Congress. Whether John Brennan did, whether James Comey did, I think this investigation will reveal. It will depend upon. There's no doubt they were terrible heads of the CIA and the FBI whether they committed criminal conduct or not. I think that that is the purpose of this investigation. But I got to say, it is a big damn deal that the former head of the FBI and the former head of the CIA are being criminally investigated for felony conduct. That's what's happening right now.

[Jamie Rubin]

Don't forget, we do this show three days a week. So make sure that the subscribe or auto download button and the center and I will also see you back here for the weekend review tomorrow.

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[Rodney Williams]

I'm Rodney Williams. And I'm Travis Holloway. Welcome to the wealthbreak podcast, a real conversation about finance. Let's be honest, building wealth doesn't look the same for everyone.

[Unknown]

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[Rodney Williams]

To revisit that and we're not stopping at success stories.

[Unknown]

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[Rodney Williams]

Because wealth isn't just about money, it's about creating a life where you thrive and help others do the same. Listen to the Wealth Break podcast on the iHeartRadio app.

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[Christiane Amanpour]

I'm Christiane Amanpour and I've been on the front lines and interviewing world leaders for more than 30 years.

[Jamie Rubin]

And I'm Jamie Rubin, a former advisor to both Presidents Clinton and Biden.

[Christiane Amanpour]

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[iHeart Podcast]

This is an iHeart podcast.