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- [00:00]
A
What if you could have even more and more and more help to pursue your goals? At LPL Financial, we offer more ways for advisors and their clients to thrive. So what if you could Paid Advertisement Investing involves risk, including potential asset principal LPL Financial LLC Member FINRA SIPC Being a small business owner isn't just a career, it's a calling. Chase for Business knows how much heart and effort go into building something of your own. Manage all your business finances, from banking to payments to credit cards all all in one place with Chase's digital tools. Plus access online resources designed to help your business thrive. Learn more@chase.com business chase for business make more of what's yours. The Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply JPMorgan Chase Bank NA member FDIC Copyright 2026 JPMorgan Chase Co. So there's a lot of noise about AI, but time's too tight for more promises. So let's talk about results. At IBM, we work with our employees to integrate technology right into the systems they need. Now a global workforce of 300,000 can use AI to fill their HR questions, resolving 94% of common questions, not noise. Proof of how we can help companies get smarter by putting AI where it actually pays off, deep in the work that moves the business. Let's create smarter business. IBM. Hello and welcome to the Votes and Verdicts podcast hosted by the Litigation and Policy team at Bloomberg Intelligence. Bloomberg Intelligence is the investment research platform on the Bloomberg terminal with 500 analysts and strategists working across the globe and focused on all major markets. Our coverage includes over 2,000 equities and credits and we have outlooks on more than 90 industries, 100 market indices, currencies and commodities. This podcast seems examines the intersection of business policy and law. I'm Nathan Dean, an analyst with Bloomberg Intelligence, covering financial policy and joining me is Holly Frum, an analyst with Bloomberg Intelligence covering consumer and trade litigation. We're delighted today to be joined by Jeffrey Schultz, partner at Foley Hoag, where focus where he focuses on practice his practice on representing cannabis industry operators, investors and ancillary businesses on corporate and security law matters, early stage corporate structuring and financing joint ventures, strategic partnerships as as well as state and federal regulatory matters impacting the cannabis industry. Jeff also advises cannabis industry operators on M and A banking laws and intellectual property matters. So with that, Jeff, welcome to the Votes and Verdicts podcast.
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B
Thank you very much for having me.
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A
No thank you. It's always great to have you on, especially the timing of this podcast just giving you so much is happening with reschedulization on marijuana. So just as a little bit of a background, can you just tell us a bit of how you got to where you are and what drew you to the cannabis industry in the first place?
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B
Sure, great question. Nobody's my route and I don't think anybody's route into this industry and through it is, is, is, is a straight line for sure. But my, my background is in corporate insurities law. I've worked on Wall street for 20 years and I got into the industry because I started work at a, a hybrid venture capital hedge fund, private equity fund called Navy Capital in 2018. I was deeply interested in the industry for a variety of reasons. Really recognizing that medical has cannabis use many, many years ago and, and also seeing the opportunity in a total white space for this industry is. I've always viewed legalization as a one way road. And here we are eight years later, a little bit further down that road.
- [03:54]
A
No, that's great. And I think just, I think, and I'm just going, based off of your LinkedIn profile that you went to law school at the same time as Hol and also as Elliot Stein, who is one of our votes and verdicts podcast individuals. And you are a Michigan grad, which our tax analyst Andrew Silverman is also a Michigan grad. I went to Purdue. So we won't talk about football all right now but so let's just get a little bit further into the marijuana discussion. So we always have to timestamp this discussion. Today is June 12th at 1101 8am the reason why we timestamp it is just because things happen so quickly in the policy landscape. But let's start with the state of play of marijuana and its role in both the federal and state legal system. So going back on April 27, we saw orders on the Federal Register appear after a long winded thought out there in terms of rescheduling where it took marijuana from section three, sorry, section one to section three. And there were some limitations about marijuana. This wasn't full marijuana. Correct. This is just a small subset. Right.
- [04:58]
B
The DOJ took two distinct actions a couple of months ago. They immediately placed state licensed medical cannabis operators with state licenses on Schedule 3 as well as FDA approved drugs. And they use the treaty pathway to do that, which we can get into. And they also established a hearing that begins on or announced the hearing that begins on June 29 to deal with the best way to say it is everything else, anything that is not medical cannabis. So two Very different pathways, they do intersect with one another. But I think the big headline and takeaway, which I still think is sinking in is that medical cannabis is now legal at the federal level. If you have a state license, state medical license, you are now invited to apply for a DEA license. There is this, there was, there's a 60 day window. We're in the middle of it. We're actually close to the end of that. That window ends essentially right before the hearing begins on the everything else type of cannabis. So we're in the middle of that process right now.
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A
So can you explain a little bit more about like, so federally illegal for state marijuana? So is this recreational federal illegal, or is this for certain types of product use and service?
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B
So adult use, recreational cannabis is still Schedule 1, meaning that according to the federal government, it has no medical accepted use. And most importantly, it's still a crime to possess it, let alone cultivate it or sell it or distribute it. That again is, is going to be subject, that is going to be the primary subject of the, the ALJ hearing that begins on the 29th very soon and will be watched very closely by a lot of folks. So it remains as a Schedule 1 drug. I think the biggest impact for the industry, as you know, remaining on Schedule 1, at least for the time being, is the tax status and the distinction in the tax status between medical and adult use cannabis today. The long and short of it is that there's a, a section in the tax code called 280E. 280E effectively treats. It's, it's a, it's a punishment for drug dealers. And what it says is if you're a drug dealer, you may or may not end up going to jail, but you certainly are going to pay taxes and you're going to pay taxes in a punitive manner. Essentially, 280e does not allow anyone to deduct any ordinary business expenses. The only thing that a company that's subject to 280e can deduct from their taxes are cost of goods sold. It has a particularly significant impact on standalone dispensaries whose only really material cost of goods sold is their inventory. So imagine a business with effectively call it 70 to 75% effective tax rate. It's very difficult to operate in this industry, notwithstanding what, what the public may view of it.
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A
So I want to back up a little bit and just go back to the reschedulization decision. So, you know, this is something that started under the Biden administration. It's been going on for a long time President Trump signed this executive order back in 20 directing the DEA to move forward. There was a little bit of hesitation, I think, at least anecdotally I've been hearing from the dea, so finally saw the Department of Justice go forth and announce this reschedulization from Schedule 1 to Schedule 3. You mentioned the treaty aspect. Can you dive a little bit deeper into specifically what the treaty impact of this is? Because I think this is a fascinating justification for what they did here. So can you explain a little bit about why international treaties come to play in something that's largely a domestic, you know, product?
- [08:51]
B
Sure. So the, the treaty, the treaty pathway is very interesting. Not frequently used and has been used before. It is not the first time that we've, that we've gone down that, that process. But essentially what the treaty pathway does and rescheduling is allow for an expedited process. And it's look at section 811D one of the controlled Substances Act. It effectively allows us to, it allows the federal government to skip some of the notice. A lot of the procedural aspects of this, which frankly we dealt with under the Biden administration. And that process for rescheduling got caught up in an interlocutory appeal. And of course the ALJ judge retired in the middle of the hearing and effectively everything just got it delayed indefinitely. Allowing, going, going through the treaty pathway allows us to, allows the federal government really to pick up almost where they left off. It allows the DOJ to follow through with the President's order from December. His executive order was very specific about getting this done in an expeditious manner. And this is the most expeditious manner. So it's really, we've short circuited part of that process in a completely legal manner, in my opinion. But I suppose we will find out and there will be challenges.
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A
So I guess what's the next step? We have this hearing on June 29th. Can you walk us through what's going to go through in that hearing and then what's the process beyond that after the hearing?
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B
So the hearing begins on the 29th and that is really to determine what to do, where to schedule the rest of cannabis. This is a very complicated, complex issue because even the definition of the rest of cannabis is not entirely clear. It. It, there's a wide spectrum of potential outcomes. I won't begin to predict which ones, but it could be anywhere from keeping it on Schedule 1, which seems exceedingly unlikely, to moving it to Schedule 2 or 3 or below, or potentially descheduling cannabis could be a potential outcome, albeit unlikely, that that is a potential outcome here. All of those outcomes have, will have a significant, very different impact on the industry and operators across the country and all of the investors in this industry. It's just difficult to really tell what that outcome will be. However, what I can tell you is that they've set a deadline to end the hearing on July 15. Whether that deadline is adhered to, I guess, is to be determined. A lot can happen between now and then. A lot can happen during that hearing. But the President has been pretty clear, DOJ has been pretty clear that they want this to wrap up by July 15th. Now, when I say wrap up, that means end of the hearing. That does not mean that a binding, final, conclusive decision will be made with respect to the rest of cannabis. What it does is the ALJ judge will notify DOJ of their decision and really DEA has an opportunity at that point to issue a final rule. There is not a clear timeline on when the judge will relay that decision to DEA or when the DEA will actually issue a final rule, let alone what it will say. That said, you know, we've, we've heard it from political commentators, from government officials that they're looking to have everything complete and finalized by the midterms, which would make a lot of sense politically.
- [12:50]
A
And so if you see the DEA or the DOJ come out and say, right, we're going to go for all marijuana to Schedule 3 or even deschedule it in itself. Is that, does that remove all aspects of federal, is that a full comparison to full federal decriminalization, meaning that if they reschedule this, then you can't be arrested for it at the federal level or anything like that, you know, for. And I'm just thinking, for recreational aspects, sure.
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B
And I think it's really important to point out and answering a question, yes, it would. And it's really important to point out that that has not happened yet. Right. Non state sanctioned medical cannabis, any adult use really remains a federal crime. Right. Possession, distribution, cultivation or sale of it. And so that has not changed now that will change the criminal status of adult use cannabis. However, it, it introduces a panoply of other issues. Who's going to regulate it, which agency. And a lot of that's going to depend on what the actual decision from ALJ is, what the DEA final rule is as a result of that decision. And really whether, you know, whether it's moved to schedule 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 or descheduled completely will have a tremendous Impact really on what happens next. But suffice it to say, even if and when adult use cannabis is decriminalized at the federal level, that is not the end of the story. The question then becomes who steps in to regulate it and how would that happen? And there's, you know, a variety of very interesting ways in which this can proceed at that point.
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A
Do you need Congress to step in at that point to provide a framework? I mean, I just call it like something like the Safer Banking Act. You know, do you think if we were to see that type of scenario where on the regulatory side they decide to move forward with this, do you foresee Congress stepping in here and saying, look, we need to put a new regulatory framework on it, we need to actually decide how this is going to be managed. Because I think pretty much every listener who votes in verdicts, plus I think most Americans out there know it's very difficult to get legislation through Congress these days. What happens in that type of scenario?
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B
Sure, I, I, I, I think, I think Congress is going to have to step in one way or another. I think the extent to which they have to step in and, and, and at least attempt to legislate a resolution to the regulatory framework is, is tbd. I, I am not, you know, I'm not terribly optimistic about how quickly they'll get that done if necessary. However, I will say if no matter what happens, the political pressure to pass some legislation to handle everything here will never, has never been greater. And certainly if cannabis is descheduled, it becomes decriminalized, but pretty much unregulated at the federal level, which will be unacceptable. That would, I think, place the most amount of pressure on lawmakers to come up with a resolution. Not just safer banking, but the, you know, essentially the Democrats have introduced their, their federal legalization bill and what you could call it federal regulation of the industry. And so has the gop. The Democrats have a growing list of sponsors for the MORE act and the GOP has a growing list of sponsors for the state's reform Act. They're different. They differ in ways that down party lines with the amount of regulation, the addressing social equity and similar issues. I think, you know, Congress has to really would have to come together at that point and agree on a bipartisan pathway that is likely borrowing from both of those draft pieces of legislation as it relates to safer banking. I think it's a really fascinating issue because of the way things have transpired over the last two months with medical cannabis being legal, safe, safer banking is still necessary. And I'LL continue to say that, you know, in many respects to allow for credit cards really to introduce much cheaper access to capital, both equity and debt and really remove a lot of the barriers that, that create a lot, a lot of the friction in the industry right now like, like it being primarily cash. And I, I say safer banking is needed because the bank Secrecy act is the bank secrecy act. At the end of the day, if you are engaged in money laundering and you are handling the proceeds of a crime, you're still handling the proceeds of crime. So until adult use cannabis is removed from Schedule 1, that will be the case. Whether we need safe, safer banking will depend on the outcome of the ALJ hearing. What's interesting about that, and I think some people may disagree with the need for, for safer banking, what it will say. And then last week, right, two days ago, Trulieves started trading publicly on the New York Stock Exchange. What a massive paradigm shift and what a positive, you know, update that is really for the entire industry. For that to have happened, uplifting to the New York Stock Exchange or NASDAQ really unlocks, I think in my opinion, and has been for eight years the real value for publicly traded companies. And they were able to do that by restructuring their business to basically to hold non voting shares in any of their adult use license operations. They own it, they don't have voting shares. But effectively they went to, went to NYSE and said we are, look, we are a state sanctioned medical cannabis company. Yes, we have financial exposure to adult use at the moment, but look at us, we're federally legal now. Notwithstanding the fact that their DEA registration is still very much in process, that the, the final order said if you have a state license, state medical license, you are federally legal now. And I'm certain that's what they relied on. So you already have a company that is uplifted as a result of the order, notwithstanding the fact that safer banking has not passed.
- [19:20]
A
Yeah, and I think this is probably a good time for me to plug that. Every time I talk about marijuana equities on Bloomberg TV or radio, I like to say that these things have hot sauce because they're spicy, they're volatile. And so anything happens in Washington, you see these stocks go up 15% and then people like you, Jeff, come in and say this is actually what it means. And some of these investors are like, oh wait, wait, wait. And then subsequently they either decline. So it's really a volatile trade out there. So we've talked about a lot of like, you know, a lot of cool things that are happening in the industry at the moment. We've talked about, you know, the original decision. We've talked about the DEA hearing on June 29. We've talked about Congress coming in potentially after the fact, depending on what that decision says. What are. And I think this is my last question before I turn it over to Hollywood. What are probably the three things that you're advising your clients right now that they should keep in mind for the rest of the year or 2027 is their business planning as they're trying to figure out the murkiness that we're, you know, looking at the moment, what are the three things that you really think those clients should be aware of?
- [20:24]
B
So the top three things, I mean, there's, there's one and two, and then the third one's a little bit more general. I'll start with that, which is everyone who is an operator in this industry needs to be paying very close attention to what is happening. You have to have your head on a swivel because a lot can happen. It can happen very quickly, often with very little or no notice. So it's a call to action to everybody who's, who's an operator in the, in the domestic cannabis industry to keep it extremely close eye on what's going on. Two and more practically speaking, operators should be doing two things, which is looking at their tax status, whether you are adult use, medical or hybrid, understanding what you may or may not need to do, particularly if you're both. If you operate in the medical and adult use industry together, right, you can take advantage of the removal or disapplication of 280E, but only to the extent of your medical operations. So that involves a few things, right? Making sure that your books and records are separate and effectively bifurcating your operations both operationally and on paper. I think it's critically important to be doing that. Now, the second piece of advice and the section called the second call to action is really if you have a medical license to be looking at and making a decision in the very, very near, future, with only two weeks left is DEA registration. We have a number of clients who are applying for DEA licenses right now. It is, on its face, appears to be relatively simple process, but as you unpack the questions in the DEA application, a lot of issues begin to rise. So I think that anybody operating in this business, I'm sure they're already doing it, but, but get a jump on it and try to figure out whether it's appropriate for you to apply for a DEA license with, with any of your medical licenses or not. And, and really to manage your tax situation very, very carefully, speak to your tax advisor, speak to your attorneys about whether you need to take any actions proactively, whether, you know, it could be a variety of things, but they should be speaking to their professional advisors about that now.
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C
Yeah. So you talked about the final order that went into effect April 22, rescheduling medical marijuana, state licensed medical marijuana and FDA approved medical marijuana. And the President did that by invoking international treaty obligations and that allowed him to avoid notice and comment, which, which you talked about, which expedited things. Is that the only reason why he did, did it that way to expedite things, or do you see another reason why he avoided, why, why notice and comment was avoided?
- [23:24]
B
It's, it's a good question. I mean, I, I think that it was done because it made a lot of sense to pursue the treaty pathway on an independent legal basis, not simply, not simply for efficiency's sake. And, and, and it goes into a lot of technical rules in the Controlled Substances act around monopolization and an inventory control related to the csa and specifically around compliance with the single, with the Single Convention on Narcotics, UN Single Convention on Narcotics. So there's a completely independent and valid reason for, for pursuing the treaty pathway, why it was, why it was requested beyond trying to avoid some of the traps that frankly that the Biden administration fell into. So I think it had a dual purpose. One, it was arguably required by law to pursue the treaty pathway. And two, yeah, it does have the, it certainly has the added benefit of accelerating the timeline here.
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C
So do you foresee any legal challenges being raised based on the invocation of the, the obligation, the treaty obligation, rather than, you know, rescheduling under normal procedures and the Controlled Substances Act?
- [24:45]
B
Sure. I, there is absolutely no doubt and as you can can read a little bit more about it on, on our, our blog, Cannabis and the Law. We're pretty clear about it that litigation is a guarantee. It's a guarantee. There are folks who do not want this happening and it's probably the same group of people who challenged it the first go around. I'd be shocked if it isn't. There may be some additional parties to this, but it, it will get challenged and I think it'll get challenged primarily on procedural grounds.
- [25:21]
C
What do you think of those challenges? Do you think that they'll succeed or fail?
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B
You know, it's, it's very, I, I, I think some may, but probably most will not. It's somewhat Airtight. What I will note, though, and it's, it's impossible to predict. Right. The outcome here, but you know, what I'll note about that is that the final rule was very, very clear and explicit that the bill can be broken up into parts. So if. Or not the bill, the, the final rule can be broken up into parts. So if anything is deemed, you know, deemed to be illegal, and, and anybody successfully challenges any part of the final rule, it'll be isolated. And if something needs to change or be removed from that final rule, it will do so in a vacuum, preserving, really preserving the integrity of, of, of the rule itself. I, I don't see the entire thing getting thrown out the door.
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C
Got it. So you also talked about the proposed, the rule that was proposed under the Biden administration and that rule proposed to legalize all marijuana, whether recreational or medicinal. And that rule, you said there was a hearing, I believe you said, in June. Do you think that rule, if it's enacted, would that withstand legal challenges? So the recreational, Adult recreational use rule. I'll call it that. So the rule to legalize recreational use, so all marijuana, I guess. Do you think that would withstand legal challenges?
- [27:05]
B
It's difficult to predict whether, you know, the hearing process is going to be successful for the administration. It's, it's difficult for me to believe that they haven't thought this out in extreme detail. And they've also. Now, this is true of everybody involved in the process, but they've also had the opportunity to see how this did not work well under the Biden administration. And, and where the case, where the ALJ hearing really got caught up indefinitely, there's. There. They can certainly navigate that and have a preview.
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A
Right.
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B
They've been able to look into the crystal ball and glean what some of the arguments may be for those who intend to challenge it. So I think they're going to be extremely. DOJ's gonna be extremely well prepared. Everybody involved in this case, however, is going to be extremely well prepared to litigate this in the hearing. Although, like I said, very difficult to tell where this, where this ends up. But I don't think that the Biden administration would go about all of these deliberate. Excuse me. The Trump administration would go through all of these deliberate steps in the manner that they did if they didn't have a high level of confidence that it would be successful.
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C
Got it. I think there. We still have some questions about this tax angle. Nathan, did you want to talk about that?
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A
Yeah. I mean, there's nothing more exciting in this world. Than tax. So let's go ahead and ask. I wanted to dive a little bit deeper about 280e for a moment. You know, so you know, treasury and the IRS have both indicated that forthcoming guidance is expected to clarify how 280 applies. And it only applies to those activities that are Schedule 1, Schedule 2, so not Schedule 3. How much of the relief is actually coming? And is it realistic that in the current scenario that companies would have to separate medical marijuana business revenue versus non medical business revenue to take the tax relief from that?
- [29:07]
B
They have to separate it to an extent. Right. And the extent to which they need to do so really is going to depend on that IRS guidance which is forthcoming. And yeah, sure, there is nothing sexier than talking about tax. But in this situation we're talking about billions of dollars at stake. So it is fascinating, it's highly consequential how operators go about this and what the ultimate interpretation of the extent of 280 relief is, is sort of TBD. But again, that's, that is why one of my primary calls, that, one of my two main calls to action really is to deal with this and speak to your professional advisors immediately about it. Yes. So they will have to separate their businesses to an extent. Right. Like I mentioned earlier, books and records, the way that you're handling your operations, you need to be able to draw some, you know, sufficient level of distinction between those. But again, we're going to wait for the ira. I think most folks are going to wait for that IRS guidance to get a little bit more detail on exactly how that should be pursued. And you know, as far as how big of an impact it's going to
- [30:15]
A
be, that was going to be my next question.
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B
Yeah, it's, it's huge. It's. This is the single most consequential event that's occurred in the cannabis industry from a financial perspective, economic perspective, really, since the first state legalized medical cannabis. Absolutely. There are billions and billions of dollars at stake. It's a very big number. And on a going forward basis, it's, it's, it's critically important. It may in fact save certain companies that may be on the brink. And those, you know, that are generally healthy, I think just are going to have a larger war chest. I will say I think the number's huge. It's going to be very significant. But you have to weigh that against the fact that a lot of companies have not always paid their taxes consistent with 280e. Right. And some have taken certain tax positions and, and some frankly, some companies just have not been able to afford it. Right. And haven't paid it and they owe the IRS a lot of money. One thing that is absolutely worth noting here is a little detail in, in the order that, that suggested that the IRS or Treasury look at the potential retroactive application of 280e. In other words, if you've been paying 280e, if you've been paying taxes compliant with 280e this whole time as a cannabis company in the U.S. are you now going to be entitled to a refund? And if you haven't paid or you owe money to the IRS because you've underpaid as a result of Your position on 280E, will you ever need to pay that now? And, and I think those are two questions, the answers to which everybody in the industry is very eager to understand.
- [32:10]
A
Do you think that if recreational marijuana gets the call it hallucinated called deschedulization? We'll go, we'll go there, we'll say deschedulization. If recreational marijuana gets descheduled, do you see Congress stepping in and saying we need to do a new federal tax on marijuana?
- [32:30]
B
It's hard for me to believe that they don't want to put their hands in the cookie jar. They already have. Right. That, yeah. I've always joked the biggest, the biggest launderer of money in the United States must be like the US treasury because they're collecting taxes from state licensed cannabis companies for all these years. So we're going to need, are they going to add something to if Congress does need to act, I could see a tax being placed back onto cannabis. I don't think it's going to look like 2:80. It's completely, you know, the way that 2:80 applies is absolutely egregious. It's intended to be a penalty. You raise money, you need to raise tax revenue. Look, that this is a way to do it. When you introduce a bill into Congress and it has to go through the Congressional Budget Office, it's going to get a. But it's going to get a score. And if it's budget neutral, great. I don't know how many lawmakers introduce bills to the floor that have a negative impact on the federal budget. So if you're now going to introduce a piece of legislation that's going to require a lot of resources from a variety of federal agencies, the fda, the dea, the usda, you name it. There are a ton. Right. That comes at a cost. How are they going to offset that cost? It would Seem very convenient if they introduce some federal tax. I hope they don't, but it wouldn't surprise me.
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A
So let's just game it out. The year is 2030, maybe 2031. We're all retired because we've all made millions and we're sitting on the beach somewhere, but let's game it out. So it's 2030 or 2031. Deschedulization occurs this year and we've gone to a world that marijuana is effectively decriminalized. You know, five years from now, are we in a scenario where the marijuana industry is thriving or are they struggling because of high taxation, high regulation? One of the questions I've always, I've always had, and I just, I'm turning to you for your expertise here is if you've got a product that will be taxed, they'll be regulated, etc, and it's competing against something that people can grow in their basement. You know, how does the, what does the marijuana industry look for you in, in four years?
- [34:42]
B
I wish I knew the answer to that question. Probably wouldn't be sitting here if I knew. And, and it doesn't. Look, I could tell you this, it doesn't, this is not the, the, the, this is not the, the story that I thought I'd be telling. Right. The way that it's happened now, it's so unique and very few people I think have, have really could have predicted how it's happened. So I, I have no clue really what'll happen, but I have a sense and what I think happens that, you know, take it five years from now, the cannabis industry is not going to mean the same thing that it means today. And in all likelihood you have an industry that's really multiple industries with a connective tissue of the cannabis plant. We are already seeing the pharmaceutical application of cannabinoids happening now. There already are FDA approved drugs. The pharmaceutical and drug discovery pathway is going to create massive opportunity. It is creating, has created and there is a tremendous amount of opportunity in that space. There will be a pharmaceutical aspect to the cannabis industry. It will be, you know, on its own, which is very different and completely distinct from the adult use industry. The adult use industry, instead of looking like perhaps the pharmaceutical pathway will probably look a lot like alcohol, there are a lot of reasons to believe that it will be regulated in a very similar fashion. This looks a lot like, of course it's different, but you can draw, you know, a lot of similarities here. History doesn't often repeat, but it usually rhymes the way that prohibition ended and what happened following that? You have federal regulation of an industry around interstate commerce and transport and the end of organized crime in the liquor industry post Prohibition in the 30s. However, I believe it was Mississippi. Could be wrong. It's one of the southern states, but Mississippi was dry until 1964, so it's not going to be legalized. Regulated cannabis is ubiquitous across the country. That's not going to happen. Certain states may never or may not for many, many years, if not decades, legalize cannabis in any form or fashion. They may just not allow it in their state and they'll. Instead of being dry, I guess they'd not. They won't be green. And so it's important to note that it won't be everywhere. Right. It's a state level decision in all likelihood as it relates to adult use, but it probably is going to look quite a bit like alcohol at the end of the day. Cannabis when even framing it under the, the within the Controlled Substances Act. And what we're about to see in the hearing, adult use cannabis may not have a currently accepted medical use. If it does, it's already. That's Schedule 3 cannabis. But you know, it has some potential for abuse. What, what looks like that? What else can we compare that to? We can compare it to caffeine, alcohol, nicotine, and those things are all regulated by a variety of agencies. And you know, the one that it looks most like is probably alcohol.
- [37:53]
A
No, that makes sense. And you know, when I was, I mentioned before, I had gone to Purdue, you know, Purdue is in a dry county for a certain extent. So on Sundays we had to drive 35 miles to Hoops in Illinois to buy alcohol. Not that we did. My dad's listening. I was studying. But you know, obviously, you know, obviously state laws have to come into play here. So let's go to our last fun question. This is a question that we always ask our guests. You know, each episode we ask them, which three records or albums would you take on a deserted island? So Jeff, if you were stuck on that deserted island, and to be fair, we use records or albums very loosely. It could just be bands, could be whatever you'd like. What would you bring with.
- [38:34]
B
That's a. It's a great question and very difficult answer. I could say that I'll give you three albums, but I probably would swap them out with a long number behind it. The, the top three of what would I bring with me? I would take with me. I would take with me the first one. I'm gonna go with a live show. It's now available on Spotify, but but a Grateful dead show. Oh, excellent. 5877. I know that's a controversial show, but it was my favorite. That's how I started listening to the group and it's in my opinion their best performance of all time. Number two would be an album called J Dilla Donuts. He's a hip hop producer who's passed away from Detroit. I'm from suburban Detroit and I think it's the best, best hip hop album that's that's ever been produced. And I listen to it all the time. Last one, I'd say Miles Dave is Kind of Blue.
- [39:30]
A
Okay.
- [39:31]
B
Probably the most listened to albums of the three, but I've got an eclectic interest and could replace this with almost anything.
- [39:39]
A
No, that's great. Now I'm actually going to Google the, the, the second one you just mentioned. I'm going to pick that up and listen to Donuts. Yeah, I'm going to listen to that this afternoon because I've never heard that before. So we're definitely going to do that. But you know, we'll go ahead and end that there. So Jeff, thank you very much. We are extremely grateful you for attending votes and verdicts. As a reminder, you can read all of our Bloomberg Intelligence research on the Bloomberg Terminal at BI Go. You can access all of our BI litigation and policy dashboard research at BI Laws. We'd like to thank our producers Aditi Asamani and Mariam Traore, who without whom this episode would never publish on time or maybe at all. So thank you again and have a great day. From game day crowds to memorable meals, Genius by Global Payments keeps your kitchen
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B
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- [41:37]
A
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B
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