#2769 RHOBH S1416: Catamaran Got Your Tongue

Summary

Watch What Crappens Podcast Summary: Episode #2769 - RHOBH S1416: Catamaran Got Your Tongue

Hosts: Ben Mandelker & Ronnie Karam
Podcast: Watch What Crappens
Episode Release Date: March 19, 2025
Based On: Real Housewives of Beverly Hills Season 14, Episode 16 – "Sutton on Trial at Sea"

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1. Introduction and Tour Updates

[03:04 - 04:09]

Ben and Ronnie kick off the episode by expressing their excitement about the latest Real Housewives of Beverly Hills (RHOBH) episode. They also announce their upcoming "Mounting Hysteria" tour, highlighting stops in Charlotte and Atlanta where they plan to recap other Bravo shows like Southern Charm and Real Housewives of Orange County. They encourage listeners to attend their live shows and support them on Patreon for exclusive content.

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2. Episode Recap: "Sutton on Trial at Sea"

[04:09 - 43:03]

Setting the Scene in St. Lucia

[07:03 - 07:59]

The episode begins at Windjammer Landing Resort in St. Lucia, where tensions are already brewing among the housewives. Ben remarks on Kathy Hilton's unusual beauty routine:

• Ben Mandelker: "Of all the crap Kathy Hilton puts out of her bag, and she's still putting blush on her lips. Like, why?"

Jennifer "Garcelle" and Sutton are getting ready for the evening. Sutton humorously mentions her affinity for vodka:

• Sutton (Transcript): "I'm wearing vodka. Isn't that hilarious? Vodka's my favorite color."

Group Dynamics and Conflicts

[07:59 - 21:07]

• Intentions vs. Reality: Bose expresses her desire for a harmonious girls' trip while Nico contradicts her, highlighting past traumas from similar trips.

• Apologies and Accusations: The core conflict revolves around Erica's comments about Garcelle peaking and her hypocrisy in attacking Sutton. The hosts emphasize the backlash Erica faces for her remarks and her history of bullying other housewives off the show.

• Notable Quote:

  • Ronnie Karam ([04:25]): "They're angry at Erica and they're, it's a very... People were really pulling up everything."

Dinner Disputes

[09:19 - 10:09]

During dinner, Kyle's offhand comment about not wanting mashed potatoes sparks outrage among the group. Ben criticizes Kyle for making insensitive remarks without facing consequences:

• Ben Mandelker ([10:07]): "She says, 'Shit like that.' Just stupid, ignorant shit, you know? Why is everybody else getting canceled and kicked off shows when Kyle can get away with saying something so fucking hateful?"

Sutton and Dorit's Tension

[10:52 - 21:07]

Dorit confronts Sutton about her alleged mean-spirited behavior, leading to a heated exchange. Sutton attempts to apologize for her earlier comments about Dorit being "poor," but her sincerity is questioned by the group.

• Notable Quote:
  • Ronnie Karam ([16:07]): "Dorit's like, we're not gonna put this all on me just because I started this feud."

Ben highlights Sutton's struggle with authentic apologies:

• Ben Mandelker ([20:37]): "And of course, Garcelle's like, well, as Jennifer Tilly would say, Dorit's taking accountability for two minutes. I mean, come on."

Erica's Hypocrisy Exposed

Erica's attempts to apologize are seen as insincere, with the hosts pointing out her pattern of criticizing others while avoiding accountability for her own actions.

• Notable Quote:
  • Ronnie Karam ([20:46]): "It was horrible."

---

3. Analysis of Housewife Interactions

[43:03 - 65:00]

Garcelle's Stance Against Sutton and Erica

Garcelle becomes a focal point in the conflict, siding with Erica against Sutton. The hosts dissect Garcelle's motivations and her reluctance to support other housewives genuinely.

• Ben Mandelker ([64:13]): "We all saw last season, you and Morgan Wade. And I'm not saying it's like. I'm not being like, oh, you slut."

Ronnie emphasizes the inconsistency in Erica's behavior, contrasting her public persona with her private actions.

• Ronnie Karam ([64:40]): "Erica's like, oh, she's triggered because she knows I'm right."

Kyle Richards' Involvement

Kyle's interactions are scrutinized, especially her relationship with Morgan Wade and how it affects group dynamics. The hosts express frustration over Kyle's private life being selectively discussed on the show.

• Notable Quote:
  • Ben Mandelker ([62:17]): "How come it's okay for Garcelle, like her kid doesn't want to film and that's fine."

Sutton's Continuous Apologies and Conflicts

Sutton's repeated attempts to apologize are portrayed as manipulative and insincere. The hosts mock her for needing to "sell" her apologies, undermining their authenticity.

• Notable Quote:
  • Ronnie Karam ([75:13]): "How dare you speak to a woman like that?"

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4. Highlights and Notable Moments

[65:00 - 80:54]

• Thirst Traps and Materialism: The group indulges in their luxurious lifestyles, with emphasis on fashion and brands, further straining relationships.

• Sutton's Public Breakdown: Sutton's emotional outburst is dissected, highlighting her inability to handle criticism constructively.

• Erica's Defense Mechanisms: Erica's strategies to deflect and attack others while maintaining her image are analyzed critically by the hosts.

• Notable Quote:

  • Ben Mandelker ([77:42]): "It's called being an adult."

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5. Hosts' Insights and Conclusions

[81:16 - 89:39]

Ben and Ronnie offer their perspectives on the ongoing drama, criticizing the lack of genuine accountability among the housewives. They highlight the superficiality and performative aspects of apologies and confrontations on the show.

• Ben Mandelker ([85:05]): "The whole thing about this. I'm sorry, but just before we go on, because of all these clips they showed, they make it look like Sutton and Sutton was the main one who would go after Erica and be like, but I read this article, and everyone else was like, it's too long. I couldn't read it. But what pisses me off is she's doing all of this, and then she's standing up for Kyle later."

Ronnie draws parallels between the show's portrayal of friendships and real-life dynamics, emphasizing the importance of genuine support over scripted alliances.

• Ronnie Karam ([83:26]): "She's lashing out. She's angry, angry. And I'm seeing a different side that I'm not sure I like."

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6. Final Thoughts and Closing Remarks

[89:39 - End]

Ben and Ronnie wrap up the episode by reiterating their frustration with the lack of authentic relationships and accountability among the RHOBH cast. They encourage listeners to attend their live shows and support them through various platforms.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Ben Mandelker ([07:03]): "Of all the crap Kathy Hilton puts out of her bag, and she's still putting blush on her lips. Like, why?"

• Ronnie Karam ([04:25]): "They're angry at Erica and they're, it's a very... People were really pulling up everything."

• Ben Mandelker ([10:07]): "She says, 'Shit like that.' Just stupid, ignorant shit, you know? Why is everybody else getting canceled and kicked off shows when Kyle can get away with saying something so fucking hateful?"

• Ronnie Karam ([16:07]): "Dorit's like, we're not gonna put this all on me just because I started this feud."

• Ben Mandelker ([20:37]): "And of course, Garcelle's like, well, as Jennifer Tilly would say, Dorit's taking accountability for two minutes. I mean, come on."

• Ronnie Karam ([20:46]): "It was horrible."

• Ben Mandelker ([64:13]): "We all saw last season, you and Morgan Wade. And I'm not saying it's like. I'm not being like, oh, you slut."

• Ronnie Karam ([75:13]): "How dare you speak to a woman like that?"

• Ben Mandelker ([85:05]): "The whole thing about this. I'm sorry, but just before we go on, because of all these clips they showed, they make it look like Sutton and Sutton was the main one who would go after Erica and be like, but I read this article, and everyone else was like, it's too long. I couldn't read it. But what pisses me off is she's doing all of this, and then she's standing up for Kyle later."

• Ronnie Karam ([83:26]): "She's lashing out. She's angry, angry. And I'm seeing a different side that I'm not sure I like."

---

Conclusion

In this episode of Watch What Crappens, Ben Mandelker and Ronnie Karam provide a critical and humorous breakdown of the latest Real Housewives of Beverly Hills episode. They delve into the complexities of housewife interactions, highlighting issues of accountability, sincerity in apologies, and the performative nature of reality TV drama. Through their insightful commentary, listeners gain a deeper understanding of the underlying tensions and motivations driving the show's narrative.

Transcript

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

Visit RevivalRugs.com WWC and use code crappins20 for 20 off your first order. That's RevivalRugs.com WWC code crapins20. One more time, RevivalRugs.com WWC with code C, R, A, P, P, N S. 20 to save 20% off your order. Who cares what happens when there's so much that crappens? Hello, and welcome to Watch what Crappens, a podcast about all that crap on Bravo that we just love to talk about. I'm Ben Mandelker and joining me today, Mr. Ronnie Karam. Hi, Ronnie, how are you?

[Ben Mandelker]

Hi.

[Ronnie Karam]

Good to see you as usual.

[Ben Mandelker]

Good to see you. What's going on with you?

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, you know, today is a big day because we're talking about Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. People on Twitter are. They're really worked up, as they should be because it was a. It was a really good episode.

[Ben Mandelker]

What are they worked up about?

[Ronnie Karam]

They're angry at Erica and they're, it's a very. People are really angry at Erica for saying that Garcelle peaked. And they're also, they find that Erica's really hypocr for attacking Sutton and saying that Sutton attacks women when they're at their lowest moment, when they say, what about you, Erica? You know, going after Lisa Vanderpump when she just lost her brother, being part of that and bullying like Lisa and Denise off the show. Come in, Erica. You came in as Yolanda's friend, and then you joined the Fox Force five to get her off the show. Like, people were really pulling up everything.

[Ben Mandelker]

Ooh, I love it.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, everyone, a lot of feelings. People attacking Dorit for being inauthentic. Da da da da da. It was hilarious. It's great. So great work, everyone on Twitter. In the meantime, though, before we get into our Beverly Hills recap, we are hitting the road again this weekend. Our tour, the mounting Hysteria tour continues to power on. So this weekend, we are going to Charlotte and Atlanta. In Charlotte, we're going to recap the Southern Charm season finale, which will be great. I'm very excited to talk about that. And then over in Atlanta, we're going to do a classic episode, one of our favorite episodes, which is going to be Orange. Real Housewives of Orange county, season 11, episode 16, bringing up old Ghosts. That is a part of their Ireland trip. And if memory is correct, now, I haven't rewatched it, but this is, I believe, where they get Kelly drunk and then they have a big fight in the van at the end of the night, which should be really, really good. Other places that we're going to on the tour, we are going to dc, Philadelphia. Then we'll be going to Boston, Detroit, Chicago. We will then eventually go to Texas for Austin and Dallas. And then we will end things. Unless we get some new shows, which might very well happen. But for right now, we have in May, our grand finale is in Las Vegas, our very first ever Las Vegas show, which will be great. So that's all the news. Go to watchforcrappens.com to get your tickets. Also, go to patreon.com watchforcrappens to catch our bonus content. We did all of Traders there, so if you want to catch up there, listen to our recaps there. We also had some really fun airport snaps where we sat in the Cincinnati airport and we talked about all the people and things around us in the airport, and we had a great time doing that. So thanks to everyone who came to our shows this past weekend, and we look forward to seeing a bunch of you this coming weekend.

[Ben Mandelker]

So here we go. Real Housewives of Beverly Hills Season 14 Episode 16 Sutton on trial at Sea.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, so we're here. We're back in St. Lucia at the Windjammer Landing resort, and Kathy and Kyle are getting ready. And Kathy's like, well, hey, Kyle, do you ever put anything on your lips? And Kyle's like, kathy, you're putting blush on. She's like, no, I know. Just gives it a little, you know, it just makes your lips look more like cheeks, you know, I just want to have a nice cheek face. And she's like, yeah, but it's gonna make your lips dry.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, I guess that makes sense. I guess that's why my lips are always dry.

[Ben Mandelker]

Of all the crap Kathy Hilton puts out of her bag, and she's still putting blush on her lips. Like, why? So then we go to Jennifer Garcelle and Sutton, and they're getting ready, and, you know, Jennifer's like, this is what I'm gonna wear tonight. And Sutton's like, I'm wearing vodka. Isn't that hilarious? Vodka's my favorite color. Actually, red's my favorite color. Red. Vodka. I love vodka. Please, nobody call me an alcoholic. Offensive. I can't. The vodka.

[Ronnie Karam]

I mean, really? Now? How dare you insinuate that all I do is drink vodka? Anyway, tonight I will be wearing an evening gown made entirely of distilled vodka that has been turned into wood. I don't know what I'm talking about. Because I'm drunk on vodka. I love vodka.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Bose is telling Nico in her room. She's like, I have intentions, right, for the trip. I want it to feel like a girls trip where everybody gets along and it's Kumbaya and we enjoy each other. And Nico's like, girl, what kind of girls trips do you go on? My girls trips are never like that. And I love Nico the gay being like, no, this is not how girls trips works, because I'm the gay on many girls trips. And, yeah, it's never peaceful. I'm still traumatized from a couple of girls trips to this day.

[Ronnie Karam]

Quiet.

[Ben Mandelker]

A decade ago.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, quiet. Nico, get back to bedazzling some seashells. So then we have Erica, who is standing by the edge of the pool, and Dorit. Everyone's doing, like, photos, because of course they are. They're all like, well, I put on the socks, so it's time to do a photo shoot. So they're all taking photos for their Instagram and everything. And Bose is like, okay, well, everyone gather in my. In my suite. So they all go to her place, and Kyle and Garcelle are wind up wearing the same outfit.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And she's like, well, I did call Kyle style hideous in the past, so I guess this is my karma. Now I'm eating those words because we're twinning. She's come a long way.

[Ronnie Karam]

And then they do, like, a little Runway moment where Kyle goes stomping around the living room. And Garcelle, of course, is a model and knows how to do it, so that was fun. And then they hug.

[Ben Mandelker]

Now it's time for dinner. So they're ordering, and Kyle's like, I'll have this, but I don't want the mashed potatoes. And they're like, wait, please. Hang on, Missy. No one said that should be illegal. Says, hold the mashed potatoes. And this is why I can never get behind Kyle. She says, Shit like that. Just stupid, ignorant shit, you know? Why is everybody else getting canceled and kicked off shows when Kyle can get away with saying something so fucking hateful? Pulled the mashed potatoes.

[Ronnie Karam]

Fuck off, mashed potatoes.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm never buying another caftan again.

[Ronnie Karam]

So yeah, everyone's like, we'll have the mashed potatoes, please. So then we have Dorit, who's likes. So everyone, how is your villa compared to ours? And Jennifer's like, oh, it is gorgeous. Like, it's just like yours. Yes, it's just wonderful. And Bose is like, wait, okay, I have a question. I have a question. Can we discuss the outdoor shower though? You said that you will not use an outdoor shower. Okay. She says, Dorit says I don't really like outdoor showers. And she's like, well, no, but I'll do them occasionally. I mean, even with my husband, I'm like, don't. I don't walk around naked. Or rather it's more like I don't want him to go to the outdoor shower. And then I'm sitting there watching that.

[Ben Mandelker]

The problem with walking around naked when you're with someone, like, picky, it's if he thinks he can be naked too. So I just rather I sleep in long johns. Right? Sleeping long johns.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, she doesn't like getting naked in front of her own husband. I can't imagine being in a relationship where I'm holding anything back. And might I also add, I mean, there's this whole point of intimate. That's the whole point of intimacy. I could be naked, physically naked, emotionally naked. Naked. Naked in front of Keely. And Keely's naked too. We're all naked and we're drinking naked juice. And guess what? The reason why we're doing that is because I invented nakedness. And furthermore.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I guess that's why I'm not in a relationship, among other things, because I'm not doing any of that. Any of what she just said. I was like, yeah, that makes a lot of sense with my own life. I'm not getting naked. I'm not getting naked alone. I'm not going to get naked emotionally. I'm not going to get naked in any way. Put a jacket on. That's what I say. Put a jacket over your emotions. Nobody needs that.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. So Jennifer is like, well, it's actually very funny. I had a scene in Broadway where I stood up in a bathtub and I was a full frontal nude. And they're like, what? And we see that she was in the woman, which I didn't even Realize the women.

[Ben Mandelker]

She was great. I actually saw it. I wanted to see it when I lived there. It was playing when I lived there. I mean, it was a long time ago, but I couldn't get into. Well, I couldn't afford to go see it. But they ended up doing a great performances taping of it. And it is so, so good. I loved it. And the lady from third Rock from the sun is in it. She was great on that. I can't remember anyone's name.

[Ronnie Karam]

Kingston Johnson.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yes, she was in. And Miranda from Sex and the City was in it. I mean it was incredible. The entire cast was amazing. But Jennifer Tilly was Crystal, the bad girl. He stole the husband. And so, yeah, I guess she had a scene in a bathtub and she was like, I had an English boyfriend at the time and you know how the English are. You know, he said, but you're gonna be naked. And I said, no, I'm wearing bubbles. So I stood up in the bubble bath and the bubbles slid off of me. And he said, but the bubbles fel. People are hilarious.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well then I realized he had actually never seen me standing up and so walking around naked before. He had never seen that. Cuz I would go into the bathroom and we had a very good sex life. And he just lay down and arrange myself in a very attractive position and like turn the lights down low. And then I'd be like, I am ready. Yes. I realized that I. Kathleen Turner wasn't that famous. Like, because Kathleen Turner originated that role in London. Right? Everyone was like, oh my God. Kathleen Turner was did full frontal on stage. Was this the same show?

[Ben Mandelker]

No, I don't think so.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

The women. I don't think Kathleen Turner was spreading.

[Ronnie Karam]

Misinformation about Kathleen Turner because why not? It's, it's Wednesday. What's your lie about her?

[Ben Mandelker]

I don't think so, but I mean, I have no idea. She's like, I used to wake up at five in the morning and put on makeup and go brush my teeth. So you would wake up thinking I'm perfect. See, I just don't agree with any of the ladies today. I say just wake up as nasty as possible. And if they can take that, they can take anything. You know, I've got like my original pictures. I don't like put any airbrushed pictures on dating sites or anything like that. It's me just looking old and smelly, you know. And then if you can take that, we can go on at least more than one date.

[Ronnie Karam]

Exactly. So you got to lead with honesty. You got to be open and honest. You know, it's called the Kyle Richards method of dating.

[Ben Mandelker]

So it's like people ask you how old you are, you should always say a little bit older, because then they're like, oh my God, you don't look that old. And then you can feel good about it, you know? Right.

[Ronnie Karam]

That's like from 30. Remember on 30 Rock where Jenna was telling everyone that she's just turned 60? So that way everyone say, wow, okay, there you go for 60.

[Ben Mandelker]

There you go.

[Ronnie Karam]

Thank you. Thank you. I am 62 years.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, Kyle, funny.

[Ronnie Karam]

Kyle has something really important to say. There's just something about this tropical air that feels so good, doesn't it? Well, thanks, Kyle. Thanks for that amazing insight on tropical air.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like, well, those are those negative ions I'm always trying to tell you about, and you wouldn't listen to me. But now that you're here getting negative ions, now they're acceptable. Well, I see how you are. She's like, well, Sutton, that positive attitude. So now Sutton's like rubbing her shoulder against Kyle because she's just besties with Kyle. And we see another example of how just desperate Sutton is to be liked by people she considers popular. And it's so sad, but also so funny. It's like she got somewhat tacit approval from her mother this season, and so now she's moving on to her next biggest goal, Kyle Richards.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, Seriously. So Garcelle is of course watching this. Like, no. So Dorit's like, by the way, in all seriousness, Sutton, you know, I have thought about it a lot and I have felt in the last few months that you've been in particular very mean spirited to me. I kept thinking to myself, gee, a lot of little jabs coming my way. Gee, gee, gee.

[Ben Mandelker]

So I've wanted. Look how hard I've tried. I've just tried so hard to come back to a good place with you something. But you know, I put my heart on the table and said, well, I think that we have both had times where we have failed each other. So let's just go with the we both are terrible and let's just stay with that. How do you feel about that, Dorit? Something's already like starting to boil over. Her satanic eyes are like, kind of starting to come out.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's like, we're not gonna put this all on me just because I started this feud. Because I got angry. Because you whispered something at one point at dinner, even though we were supposed to be pretending to be a sisterhood. So she's like, but wasn't the feud.

[Ben Mandelker]

When she made that. When Dorit made the alcoholic or the. Of course there's alcohol in that drink comment.

[Ronnie Karam]

That was the latest iteration of it. But it all started. The things went sour between them in Oceanside when, like, they were sitting at that restaurant and there was some comment about. I forgot it was. There was. Dorit muttered something, and then sudden did the whole thing. Okay, everyone, we're going to tie our hands together with a ribbon, and we're sisterhood. And then that night, she was like. You know, it really bothered me that she said something under her breath. I mean, we are supposed to be sister. You're supposed to say out front, and then on the sprinter van, she was like, you said something under your breath, and we're supposed to be a sister. That was sneaky. And then they started fighting, and then they have been at each other's thro all season as a result of that.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, okay. I thought it was alcoholic thing.

[Ronnie Karam]

That was just the latest manifestation. Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

So she's like, you're the one who wanted this group to have an attention. And then it was 48 hours, and it's out the window. And then we see flashback to two months earlier when Dorit wouldn't admit to being Teddy's friend. I love that we're trying to remember. It's in the notes. Dorit admitting she won't admit to being Teddy's friend. And so Dorit's like, well, you know, a lot of it was we're gonna have, but we should be able to talk it out. Am I right, Sutton? Am I right?

[Ronnie Karam]

That's right. But any attempt to converse or to have a conversation with you is rejected. Rather than trying to work it out. You want to go lower. You want. You're like PK reaching into a can of Pringles. You just want to go lower and deeper and deeper and sadder. Okay, and now you want to have an issue.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, in the moment, Sutton meant that she wanted to have a sisterhood. That's what I feel. She just doesn't really understand what that means. And Kyle's like, yeah, I mean, she met it. She meant it when she said it. So that's something. And we see later that then Sutton turned her and was like, thank you. Thank you so much for saying that, Kyle. Thank you.

[Ronnie Karam]

I know Kyle says one sentence. One sentence. Because also, Kyle, Kyle. Kyle and Dorit are seem like they're good now, but they're still not great. So Kyle will still pile on. So Sutton's like, I brought it to the group. I said I thought it was important. It's like, yeah, but I think she means that, what she says every time. And so that's. That's. So that's where it gets confusing. Because it's like, okay, well, sometimes if you mean what you say, and sometimes it feels sincere, and sometimes it's very earnest. And she's like, I was sincere.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, hold on, let me finish. Let me finish. Hold on. My hat's flopping all over the place. I love that. Erica's hat. She's like, let me finish, Let me finish, let me finish. And she says, and then sometimes it turns and something's like, okay, well, should I place my hand on a bible? Should I? Because you know what? We are not doing this. I'm not gonna do this again. You are not gonna beat me with a stick. She gets so bothering you. She's so over the top. Just calm down, lady. Your head's gonna pop off.

[Ronnie Karam]

Nobody's been you the stick. We're just gonna bring up the same thing over and over again until you submit. I will not do that. And Kathy's like, well, we're just having a discussion. I don't know what we're talking about, though. I haven't been paying attention. So Dorit's like, every time there's a chance to take accountability, you cannot just make yourself a victim. You know, say, I'm an adult. I take accountability whenever I make a mistake, which is. Should we just, like, roll all the scenes of dorit Garcelle having to explain to dorit why the things she has said in the past have been either problematic or sound like they have a tin ear or whatever. And her just saying, you know, refusing to hear anything Garcelle has to say at any restaurant.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I take accountability every time I make a mistake. For example, the time I said that I'm very close to minorities who happen to work for me, how I said, yes, they do work for me. Is that so bad? That's taking a kunda bully me.

[Ronnie Karam]

I mean, is it so wrong that I said that Garcelle attacked me when she raised her voice?.3 decibels. I don't think so. It was an attack.

[Ben Mandelker]

And of course, Garcelle's like, well, as Jennifer Tilly would say, dorit's taking accountability for two minutes. I mean, come on. Now all of a sudden she's an accountability guru. Please. She's like, well, there has been no point where you have tried to rectify any of our little Mishaps.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know what, Dorit? I have been thinking about this long and hard, and what I want to say is that I'm not wearing vodka tonight. I'm actually wearing more whiskey. But anyway. Well, I don't know what you just said, but where? Where, like, here's what I've got to add to that. Okay, I said something at the caviar party, and I did not feel like myself at all when I said that. And we see the flashback is when she said, like, you know, basically, like, you're poor. And Sutton's like. And I sincerely apologize to you because what I should have said is, you are very poor, not just regular poor. And I really did not lean in enough to how low in society you are, and I apologize for that.

[Ben Mandelker]

I learned lessons as a little girl that I should have brought to this. You don't speak to poor people. You have security escort them out. And so I apologize for speaking directly to you. I know that must have hurt.

[Ronnie Karam]

I apologize for filling you with hope when I looked you in the eyes, that I gave you the feeling that maybe rich people would also look at you in the eyes. But no. No, we don't. We don't do that. And I should never have given you that. That sense of aspiration and the fact.

[Ben Mandelker]

That we sat at that caviar party together and I purposely wore a loss prevention jacket across from you. That wasn't right. That wasn't right. I mean, let's face it, this is California. I can't really get you arrested anyway, so it wasn't right of me to do that. That's all right. It's time for a commercial. It's time for a crappin's commercial. Elevating my style used to mean breaking the bank. But with quints, I get high end, versatile pieces at prices I can actually afford. Now I can upgrade my style by snagging killer luxury essentials that sync with my vibe and my wallet.

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[Ronnie Karam]

I sincerely apologize. And Erica's like, yeah, it was, it was. But you know, it was just beneath you. It was beneath you. Oh, come on, you're on a real house. I've like, honestly, I feel like it was so, this, this thing that she said was so like, of all the things that could be said on a Real Housewives show, for someone to say, like, what was it like? Like, go talk to someone with a wallet that fits or whatever. Whatever that, whatever the phrase was.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, go talk to someone.

[Ronnie Karam]

Compared to any other show on Bravo, yeah, this is.

[Ben Mandelker]

You think you're better than her? My wallet is whatever. I mean, I think that was pretty shitty. But it's really funny how Sutton tries to apologize because, because right after that we see, we saw the confessional where something's like, I don't regret saying that not one single second. I wish I said it more. I wish I said. I wish I came up with rhymes for poor that little idiot. I wish that I had the server walk up to her and say, I'm sorry, ma'am, we don't accept WIC cards here.

[Ronnie Karam]

That would be good. Oh, goodness. So Dreet's like, I appreciate that. And I think that if you had at any point, maybe had said that at some point, if you really felt sorry, if you didn't have to wait this long to have it pry out of you. And she's like, well, I'm doing it now. Well, you're very passive aggressive about it. She's like, well, Dorit, I'm sorry. And Rose's like, she's actually trying to apologize. Dorit. Like, dorit, listen, She's. This is Sutton. This is the closest you're gonna get to a sincere apology from Sutton.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Sutton's like, excuse me? I mean, and she's just telling us this, but she's like, if she'd shut up, she'd hear me apologize for calling her Brokey. Okay, Brokey Roberts.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm very sorry for what I said, even though it was admittedly hilarious, and everyone at Caviar Caspia laughed because we all knew it was true. But anyway, you did not need to be embarrassed by the Caviar Caspia people. And what I said was low, even though, true, but low. And I shouldn't have said it into your face, only behind your back.

[Ben Mandelker]

But unfortunately, Sootin, we've moved on to other things. She's like, oh, now there's a lot more you need to apologize for. So Bos is like, dorit, you're not even taking any of it in. It's an apology. Take it. And she's like, goyce, Goyce. I said, thank you. I said, thank you. I appreciate it. But wait, there's more.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, Dorit is not gonna think Sutton is genuine at this point, and I don't blame her. Sutton does a lot of things, apologizes for them, and then we, as a group are left wondering which was true. The low blow or the apology. You just don't know. It's a mind game.

[Ben Mandelker]

I mean, a magic mirror.

[Ronnie Karam]

I can't see which way is right. I'm like, oh, relax, relax.

[Ben Mandelker]

Am I fat? Am I thin? I don't know. Why am I shaped like an hourglass? Why is my face so big? Erica. Erica is not this whole.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm sorry, Erica. You're having a great season, and I've really grown to enjoy you on this show, but you cannot Be accusing Garcelle. I mean, a sudden saying things that you don't know what's true and what's not true. When you had an ent season where you were like, well, it was snowing in Pasadena, so my son took his car out and. Well, it turns out he was driving on a roller coaster, and he was in roller coaster tycoon and went up in the loop de loop, and then all of a sudden, Tom, he got into his car and they crashed into the roller coaster.

[Ben Mandelker]

Tom went down the mountain, he spun.

[Ronnie Karam]

Around, and he was lying in a ditch.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. Yeah, agreed. So. But she's also, like, on the poor side. You know what I mean? So she's standing up for the other poor. And also, when Sutton apologizes and you don't know what was real, the slam or the apology can't both be true. I mean, most hurtful things you say are meant, but then you feel bad for saying them, so you apologize. It's called being an adult. Okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. I'm sorry that she is so smart that she knows exactly what Dorit's trigger is, which is calling her poor. Okay. Which I guess you don't have to be that smart to figure that trigger out, but still.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. You know. Well, I think what made it actually really mean is that Dorit is like, she's really going through it and losing her house and stuff, but I don't think that was happening at this time. I think if she called her poor, like, right now, when the house is being taken away and all that other stuff, that's a allegedly being hap. That's allegedly going down and PK not paying any bills and stuff like that, that would be different. But, you know, it was when Dorit was still pretending to have money, so, yeah, it didn't count.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, I mean, it was mean. It was a mean thing to say. I keep on making excuses for it because it's like classic, you know, recapping housewives when there's one that you like more than the other, so you'll be like, honestly, yeah, it was a compliment if you think about it.

[Ben Mandelker]

No, it was horrible.

[Ronnie Karam]

It was horrible.

[Ben Mandelker]

It was a shitty, shitty thing to say.

[Ronnie Karam]

It was a shitty thing to say. It made me laugh.

[Ben Mandelker]

So not guilty, but also, like, I.

[Ronnie Karam]

Guess, you know, when we watch other shows, people say so things that are so much worse. I mean, it's like, find someone whose wallet fits compared to, like, you. Your husband has one foot on a. One foot in the grave and one foot on a banana peel, and you sucked your Way to the top. I mean, like, it gets a lot worse than this.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I also didn't think that it was so bad when Doris made fun of Gar, made fun of Sutton's alcohol intake.

[Ronnie Karam]

So I think I'm just definitely not.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I think I'm just. This whole season, I'm like, I mean, this is pretty mid as far as things to be mad about go, so I don't really care.

[Ronnie Karam]

They're very sensitive. So Beau's like, dorit, I think the question is there anything that you feel accountable for that you could actually apologize to Sutton about? That's where we actually need to go, since you just bragged about how you take accountability. And she's like, well, you know what? The joke about the drink that I. That I made, you know, wholeheartedly was not to start anything or to hurt you, but just to highlight to everyone in the group that you are something of an alcoholic. And that's in many ways very humorous. So that's all I was merely doing.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, so we're calling. We're calling that a joke now? Well, the comment. The comment. Listen, it wasn't my intention to call you an alcoholic, especially when everybody can see that you're keely in your kahunik.

[Ronnie Karam]

And probably if you hadn't called me a bitch after I said that you were an alcoholic, I probably would have said, I'm so sorry. That wasn't my attention. But you called me a bitch, which meant that me calling you an alcoholic first, in retrospect, is actually allowed.

[Ben Mandelker]

So to be fair, it's not that you called me a bitch, it's that you called me a bitch. In me who?

[Ronnie Karam]

In me who.

[Ben Mandelker]

That was like the. The ultimate. Because Dorit can't be offended. She's called everyone the C word all season. Like, how many times has she been like, what?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, that's true.

[Ben Mandelker]

Now she's like, how dare you speak to a woman like that? So Kathy's like, well, listen, we're here for another four days, all right? You can't conquer Rome in a day, which isn't the saying, you know, because the saying is, you can't build Rome in a day. Because I'm pretty sure Rome burnt pretty fast. It didn't take very much long to. It didn't take that much time to burn it to the ground, but it didn't take long build.

[Ronnie Karam]

It did. You can't build in a day. So both like, well, I appreciate the honesty and the candor, and I really think, like, you said, Rome wasn't Built in a day. I'll subtly correct you, but hopefully some bricks are being laid because I do feel like we've made some progress in making one small building in an entire empire, so. Yeah, you know, it only took, you know, a few thousand years for Rome to get to where it was, so that's a good sign for you, too.

[Ben Mandelker]

While we've got a break in the fighting, I just want to say that Bows. You know, I really appreciate when you came to my house the other day and said that you like me better than Tariq now and you apologize for ever going on to her side and becoming my best friend. So thank you. That meant a lot to me.

[Ronnie Karam]

Bose.

[Ben Mandelker]

Everybody hear that? Everybody hear that?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. Like, Bose is kind of like my best friend now, so just want to, like, announce that to the table. Like, I'm friends with her now too, so I guess that makes me pretty cool.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, from that moment, I said, look, whatever I can do to help Kyle, I'll do it. Did you get my note about never bangs again? Good. And God answered my prayer when I went to Soho House. And sitting across from me, not even an arm length away, was John Turturro making out with him with a homely, homely lady.

[Ronnie Karam]

And I thought, oh, my goodness, he's making out with his sister. But then it turns out it was not even Aida. It was a different person entirely.

[Ben Mandelker]

It wasn't until I said, I love that show where you had to deal with toe jam. That was a good drama on hbo. Did you ever see that the night of his character had, like, crippling foot disease, like crippling athlete foot or something. And it was just him picking at his toe jam with a pencil for eight episodes. I mean, that was a decent show. But God, I will never forget that or forgive John Turturro.

[Ronnie Karam]

So as I sat there at the Soho House enjoying some very okay food, I was looking at Mauricio making out with the girl. And I said, never again. I will text Kyle Richards right now. So she texted me.

[Ben Mandelker]

I don't know why this made me laugh, but she goes, there's Mo with his girl. And Kathy went, a female. A female. And she went, a girl. And Garcelle says, with a woman. With a woman. Okay, let's all decide how. Let's all agree how we're going to refer to women.

[Ronnie Karam]

All right, kylo's. Kylo's ready to call her a little fucking bitch slut. That's like a grossitude.

[Ben Mandelker]

It was a girl. One of. One of the girls.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Garcelle's like, well, Greece, not Malibu. I mean, who knows where else? Doesn't sound like a random girl. Sounds like it's his girl. And if you were to say it's just some stranger, I would say, no.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then I texted Kyle and I said, girl. And then afterwards, I gave her the full report, and Kyle's like, yeah, three and a half minute long voice. No. Oh, God. I haven't gotten one of those since. Jamie Lee Curtis actually forgot to press end when she was leaving me a voicemail. God, that was. I got ugly.

[Ronnie Karam]

It technically wasn't a voicemail. She was actually trying to call her husband. And then she dialed me by accident. Because, honestly, I got into her phone and I put my number under Christopher. Guest contact. But, like, whatever. Was still fun. Still fun. We laughed about it afterwards. And my laugh, I mean, I laughed by myself because I'm like, wow, Jamie Curtis knows me. Because I made her know me. Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

So then we get to hear Bozo's voice now. Hey, babe, full report. She's not cute. I mean, look, if you're gonna go do it, like, get the cutest girl on the planet, right? No, actually, I was sitting there. They were there. I was dreaming of scenarios where I could push them in the water. Let me know what you want me to do. Kill him. I'll run up on a man. Let me know.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know what? That's being a girl's girl. I invented girls. And I bended being girls. Girls.

[Ben Mandelker]

Bloop.

[Ronnie Karam]

So then Kathy's like, that's a girlfriend right there. I'm sorry, that's a female friend right there. That's a female friend. Well, we all have your back.

[Ben Mandelker]

We all want to fight for you. So what? If I'm being completely honest, I feel that we tiptoe about scissoring Morgan. Can we get into that? How does that work?

[Ronnie Karam]

I was like, what? Like, we.

[Ben Mandelker]

We.

[Ronnie Karam]

We had a pact not to mention her. She who Shall Not Be Named. And she looks totally shocked. And Garcelle's like, well. Well, we don't know what the situation is. And if we were being supported in a way, in that way, then we can back off. Which is such a funny way to put it. Like, tell us more. Because if she's giving you all the emotional support that you would get from a boyfriend or a spouse or a lover, then we'll know you're set and we're okay. But if you're not being supported by her, then that way we can go in on her as well. She's just messy. But she's just putting it under the guise of like actual like, I want to make sure you're okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. I mean, during this. Generally, I agree with Garcelle in general that Kyle doesn't have the right to be like, open and honest to everybody else. But then she won't talk. But it's also. She said 5 million times she's not going to talk about it. Morgan refuses to be talked about on the show, this and that. So I'm kind of like, why are we going back to this? Well, but then I saw in the after show, I just saw a clip that was posted and Garcelle's like, listen, She's. It's everywhere. It's on all the blogs when we're shooting. It's literally everywhere. And Kyle flying everywhere with this girl and then has like, everyone else has to be open and honest, but she doesn't. It's just fucking annoying. And then it cuts to Kyle in her own room and Kyle's like, well, you know, like, she knows my situation and why I can't say it. And how come it's okay for Garcelle, like her kid doesn't want to film and that's fine. She doesn't want to talk about that. And then her other son had stuff going on and she doesn't want to talk about that. Those are her children. How are you even going to compare somebody requesting that their child, especially after one of them was bullied by you guys on. On national tv? Why? How are you going to argue that that's even close to being the same thing? Give me a fucking.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, the thing is, I think also Kyle has. There's an expectation that they all should rally around Kyle. And you know, if they see Mauricio out in the wild, they're going to report back to her and they're going to. They're going to support her and yada, yada, yada. And it's like, fuck this guy. Which in some ways they should because Kyle is their castmate. And ultimately they are friends with Kyle first. But I think that like, there's an element that they have to really put themselves out for Kyle. And Garcelle's like, honestly, I don't even like this woman. She's like. She's superficial, she's fake. Everything is about her. And you know what? I'm sick of like. Like, here I am on tv, kind of like co signing this. This group bashing a Mauricio. And. But the truth is like, we don't even know what's going on in Kyle's side, and I'm kind of, like, sick of it. And so I want. I think it's time for Kyle to also, you know, if we're gonna, like, rake some random girl over the coals and start saying, like, oh, she's. She's. She's not. This random person's not cute. She's a girl. You know, like, how about, like, Kyle, you talk. You know, you've got some stink on your side as well, so why don't we talk about that?

[Ben Mandelker]

And also, Garcelle did talk about her son on the show quite a bit, so I'm surprised that never happened. And then we get Erica backing up. Of course, the party line. You know, the Kyle party, that's a sad party. But the Kyle party line, where she's like, well, Garcelle wants information about Kyle, but we know nothing about Garcelle. I mean, who's Garcelle sleeping with? I know she had a roster back in the 90s. That was good. And then we see Garcelle talking about how she's banged, you know, all these famous people. And then she goes, well, maybe she's Pete. Oh, my God. Look who's talking, lady. The last person you bragged about was fucking Armie Hammer before he got canceled for talking about wanting to eat people.

[Ronnie Karam]

People.

[Ben Mandelker]

Shut up, Erica. And what do we know about you? You still won't even. You're still pretending you're innocent in this whole thing. What about Marco? Marco? Lady, you're lucky nobody brings that up. So I don't want to hear America.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, I know. Like, at least. At least Garcelle's roster of the 90s included, like. Like Johnny Depp. And you know all these people, and yours was Tom Girardi.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, yours was old nuts on the ground. Tom Girardi. Who? Over, like. Like, how many. How many victims? And then you helped over Marco. Marco. So, whatever, lady. Don't worry.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, I liked Garcel's. Garcel's response on Someone asked Garcelle on Watch Happens Live. Someone's like, what did you think about Erica saying that you peaked? And Garcelle just goes, erica. Erica.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, well, there is no situation, you know? I mean, you guys know everything. I mean, sure, you saw me at a concert, but I had that on the books for, like, six months, so. And she says it like it was an. She says, I literally had an appearance that I had on the book. So you're booking appearances. Morgan is booking appearances of you in the wings at her Shows.

[Ronnie Karam]

No, yeah, I think that that doesn't. That doesn't seem right. And also, I just want to say one other thing about this piece. Sorry to go back a little bit. This peaking, like, oh, Erica saying, well, maybe she peaked. Like, how sad is it that the definition for Erica of Garcelle peaking is based off of who she slept up with? Like, I would argue that Garcelle is ascendant. Right? Like, this is. I think this is the most exposure. I mean, Garcelle obviously was famous in the 90s. She was on the gym and then she was in the Jamie Foxx show, late 90s, early 2000s. She's been around all these years. She was coming to America back in the 80s, etc. Like, she's been with us all the time. But I would argue her being on the show is like her most high profile gig that she's had. Or like the one. The thing that she has had had her. Her name on more people's mouths than ever before. And so I would say she has not even reached her peak.

[Ben Mandelker]

So.

[Ronnie Karam]

But for Erica, it's like, well, who your represents, what your peak is? Like, there's actually something very sad and inherent in what was just a shady comment. Yes. But it really is an extra revealing shady comment.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And she's got more going on than who she's. I like that point. And she's producing film after film. Erica, what are you doing? You're like speaking over garageband loops. Like, give me a fucking break, okay? And mooching tables off reunion sets for your fucking house remodel. Give me a break. Oh, did you see that, by the way? Did I send you that Reddit thing? Somewhat Reddit. Let me tell you, if you ever have a mystery to solve, Reddit is who to give it to. Okay, Someone posted. Isn't this the same coffee table from the reunion set? And sure enough, Erica's new table in her remodeled home is from the reunion set. Wow, she's just taking shit right off the set. So get out of here. Wait to that I've been manufacturing the shit that you're mooching off reunion sets. Come on.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm gonna say good for you on that front. I'm gonna say, you know what? You should take that. Take that coffee table. But by the way, those garage band loops powered Erica to be all the way into the background. Her song all the way in the background of In Anora. So, you know, I will give flowers.

[Ben Mandelker]

Where they're in the background of a. Of a movie about a Russian or About a whore marrying a Russian billion is like, the height of a compliment. You know what I mean?

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, maybe a Nora peaks.

[Ben Mandelker]

I don't know. It's like, wow. My song got played in the strip club on the Sopranos. Like, wow. It's huge.

[Ronnie Karam]

Honestly, if I heard any one of my stupid musical tracks that I made five years ago playing in the background of literally anything, I would be, like, issuing press releases. I'd be so happy.

[Ben Mandelker]

Anyway, she shouldn't be happy. I'm just, you know, I know. I'm just Erica. Because she's like. She's on everybody else's accomplishments. Yeah. She's. Kyle's like, whatever. That was an appearance. It was on the books. And she's. Well, Right. But that brings attention, right? And she's like, well, what am I supposed to do? I mean, going to the gas station brings me attention, you know? Like, I can't even get granola out of the bin at the Sprouts without getting attention. It's everywhere I go. The Pauper are everywhere. Because you're calling them everywhere. And I'm so glad that Garcelle just keeps her foot on her neck, because she's like, yes. Yeah. Does paparazzi really follow Kyle Richards everywhere? I mean, Julia Roberts can go to the grocery store, but Kyle can't. Please.

[Ronnie Karam]

I know. I can't even do my favorite hobby shopping, because I can shop anywhere. Gas station, 7 11. And the paparazzi are always there. So Doritos. Like, Coyle's been in this town for a very long time, and she knows how things work. And if you want to avoid being seen with Morgan, you know how to do it.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And so Kyle's like, well, like, maybe one day, like, I'll have a great story to share with you guys. Maybe. And Kathy's like, maybe you won't. She goes, okay, well, maybe I don't.

[Ronnie Karam]

Sounds like 54 years so far. Still haven't gotten a good story out of you, Kyle.

[Ben Mandelker]

Still waiting. Yeah, I wipe parties. The guy from Fat Burger comes over and makes and makes stuff for people. So Garcelle Sutton goes, I hope you do, Kyle. I hope you have a great story to tell. Now let me nuzzle my chin against your. Your shoulder a little bit. Just tell you is your best friend. Here's what I. Here's. Here's the kind of author I want to be. The kind of author that supports a friend writing a beautiful story about herself.

[Ronnie Karam]

Kyle, well, I hope you have a great story, and furthermore, I hope you dance. Were you just singing that song the other day on the show.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yes.

[Ronnie Karam]

Is that why that came to me?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yes. In the Below Deck recap.

[Ronnie Karam]

Naturally. Of course. Yes, of course. Where it fits in the best.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Garcelle's like, is it annoying that Sutton's infatuated with Kyle? Yes. But I needed her tonight. And she was so blinded by Kyle's light. And they make a little twinkling sound. It's like, but she didn't have my back. And you know, part of this, I'm like, why is it. Why does she have to help gang up on Kyle? This is ridiculous. And you've done it a million times. Like, give it a rest. Like, it is kind of getting old to me. The whole, like, hounding Kyle about the same shit over and over. But then I remembered and they showed us clips of this later that they actually had a discussion where they. They're like, we're going to get Kyle tonight about the lesbian thing.

[Ronnie Karam]

Right?

[Ben Mandelker]

It's like, yeah, get her. And then once they do it, Sutton's just like, oh my God, Kyle, I'm so sorry she's being mean to you. You know, she has that kind of an attitude. So I'd be pissed too.

[Ronnie Karam]

Commercials.

[Ben Mandelker]

Here comes one right now.

[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

Provided investing involves risk. Acorns Advisors LLC and SEC registered investment advisor. View important [e-mail] Crabbins hello, I'm Dax.

[Ben Mandelker]

Shepard and I'm Monica, Padman. And we are in our seventh year of hosting actors, musicians, athletes, presidents, CEOs, scientists, and professors. Monica and I do three weekly shows with celebrities on Monday, experts on Wednesdays, and crazy stories from listeners on Fridays. It's got an ample dose of irreverence, humor, and vulnerability. We regularly get sides of our guests that were previously unknown, and it is a celebration of all the messiness that makes us human. We like it here.

[Ronnie Karam]

We love it here.

[Ben Mandelker]

We're chatterboxes and it's a good excuse.

[Ronnie Karam]

Used to talk.

[Ben Mandelker]

Also, we're friends, barely hanging on by a thread. We're so excited to officially be a part of the Wondry Network. So follow Armchair Expert on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts and subscribe to armchair expert on YouTube.

[Ronnie Karam]

I would be furious. I have childhood trauma around this topic. Because when I was in kindergarten, my. I was cast as a tree in the. In the production of Snow White, in the kindergarten production of Snow White. And as a tree, I was a part of an ensemble of trees. And together we created a forest. And when Snow White is banished from, you know, the castle, she has to go running through the woods where she, you know, eventually finds, famously, the dwarves. And so as the trees, the direction that we were given as actors was that we could either be kind trees and say, run, Snow White, run. Get to safety. Or we could be evil trees and.

[Ben Mandelker]

Go, whoa, lesbian relationships, Snow White.

[Ronnie Karam]

We could be very nosy trees and say, what's the deal with Morgan Wade? Am I right?

[Ben Mandelker]

You fuck with Cinderella or not? I heard they found her slipper in your place.

[Ronnie Karam]

You could also be a bad, jokey tree and say, is there vodka in that? Which was strange as a kindergarten. Or to ask.

[Ben Mandelker]

You could be a really offended tree.

[Ronnie Karam]

How dare you.

[Ben Mandelker]

Go. Be not colic.

[Ronnie Karam]

Or you could be a gossipy tree. I just saw Mauricio with a girl, and she is not cute. Keep running, Snow White.

[Ben Mandelker]

Mauricio had his dick in an ugly tree. I'm telling you that right now, girl. Okay, so what kind of tree did you choose to be?

[Ronnie Karam]

So all the boys, of course, the boys were like, we'll all be evil tree as well. And all the girls are like, no, we want to be nice trees. We want to support Snow White. Like, okay, so boys are gonna be mean, Girls will be nice. You know, classic. So we all. It comes the big scene, and we all are lined up, right? Cause we're trees. And I'm like, the first tree, I think, like, stage right. And so Snow White comes Running through. So I'm the first tree that Snow White encounters. So I go. And then every single other tree went, run, Snow White, run. Even the boys.

[Ben Mandelker]

So the only evil tree, I was a psychotic tree.

[Ronnie Karam]

Everyone was like, oh, that poor kid lost it, forgot his line. I was like. I was like, no, we had an agreement to all be psychotic trees, but I was the only one. So everyone was like a nice tree. And there's one strange tree that's literally trying to kill Snow White, and that was me. So I understood Garcelle's pain when she stood up there like a psychotic tree and did the muaha to Kyle. And Sutton did not do her part. And Sutton said, run, Snow White, run to Kyle.

[Ben Mandelker]

All the other trees played by Lisa Vanderpump.

[Ronnie Karam]

There was one played by Lisa Rinna, actually.

[Ben Mandelker]

Hello, Snow White. How are you? How are you? So then this fight is pretty much over. So Bose announces that tomorrow is the boat excursion, which is terrifying because we know what happens on boats, all these shows, and this show is no exception. Dun, dun, dun. So now. Now we go back to the villa and Kathy gets a call.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, sorry, I just want to say. Kathy's like, what time? She goes, we start at 9:30. Okay, that means 10 for me. She's like, I mean, we start at 9. It's like, that's so Kathy to be like, I'm not even going to pretend like I'm gonna be on time. I'm building in 30 minutes for me. And all boats can wait.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Kathy gets a call from Carol, her brand manager, and she's like, oh, hold on, hold on. She's like, put. Putting on, you know, creams and sucking down vitamins and doing all the stuff that Kathy Hilton does. Injecting stem cells from a baby she stole on the beach, you know, that kind of stuff. And it's like, hold on a second, I'm changing. Just hold on one second. Okay? And she just puts the phone on the bed and never comes back. Never got into it. Ten minutes later, you just hear Carol going, kathy, Kathy, Kathy.

[Ronnie Karam]

So then Garcelle, everyone's getting ready and everything. So they're all. They're all settling in and stuff. And Garcelle is not happy with what happened at dinner, but in the meantime, Bose is talking to Erica and she's like, so why don't we even start with something like this? I may have to go to sleep with my. My hair is too big. I'm not gonna take it all. Take it all off. And Erica's like, yeah, well, whatever and she. Erica starts pulling out her. Her clips and everything. And Bose is horrified. Bose is like, what is going on? Like, why are you taking your hair out right now? She's like, this is the second time. Can I just say that this is only the second time in my life I've seen white women rip out tracks clipped in and just throw it on the chair next to them. And.

[Ben Mandelker]

I love that. It's a cultural thing. It's just a white lady thing that they just start ripping out their hair and throwing them on the couch.

[Ronnie Karam]

And Bose is, like, staring, because we see the first time she saw it was at the party at the beginning of the season where they were pulling out Kathy's clips and everything. So they're then starting to have this. As they go on with the scene, Erica is still pulling out the hair. And every time she puts hair down on the sofa, you see Bose looking at it like, you're disgusting trash.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Dorit's like, well, booze. Now, I understand the intention tonight, but that. Because she's about to come for Bose for not having her back and, like, standing up to her at the party or saying something against her at the party. So Buzz is like, no, look, look, this is. I can't concentrate on anything but the hair. Can we talk about this in a minute, please? White women, please explain. So then Dorit's like, well, remember we were having these conversations and Sutton said, sisterhood. It's just how hypocritical she was being. Do you remember? Do you remember? And Erica's like, oh, God damn it, this hurts. Does this look real, by the way? Is anybody falling for this bullshit?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. And Dorit's like, you know, I think Bose wants to believe the best in people. It's one of the things I love about her. Unfortunately, I have enough experience to realize Sutton isn't sorry about the wallet comment, and she's worried about the way it made her look to all these women, and she's trying to save face, which is probably true. I'm gonna say that Dorit is probably accurate about. Accurate on that.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, that's true, but it's also hypocritical because when is Dorit. Ever since he here. Like, when is. I mean, give me a break.

[Ronnie Karam]

And then there's that. Yeah. I mean, you can't say that you felt bad about making the joke about the booze, but then you decided you were not going to call it back because you called you a. Like, okay, so she's like, you do realize that I've been Sitting for three weeks with the. That she slung at me. Yes. But then when you finally get it, acknowledging the apology is important. She's. I did. I did. By. I acknowledge it by saying, I do not accept this.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. It's like dorit. You keep going back. And she says that dorit has a challenge with being able to give apologies and now receiving apologies. So she's starting to see some cracks in the dorit facade. And she's like, okay, so what do you want this chick to do? And she's like, well, for us, it has to be more than just words. Erica. She's done this 9 million times.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's like he's seen pyramid over there.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. I think it's just letting things be and seeing how it develops. She's like, well, but, you know, you have to not put it on the back burner, because that doesn't solve anything. And so Dorit's like, well, maybe there's no solution. Sutton's just evil. So in the other villa, of course, Sutton is talking about this shit with Jennifer and Garcelle, and so she's like, well, how do you feel, Sutton? Because I really feel like you guys made a little progress. Dress today. No. No. Okay. Your eyes are slitting, and they're turning red and green.

[Ronnie Karam]

O.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay. Christmas is cancelled. Damn those puppies. I get it. I get it. I'll just be sitting over here quietly.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Sutton says this is her classic warning, that she's. She's unhappy and she's about to say something shady. Well, I'm gonna say this. You're like, oh, she's. If she's gonna. She's announcing that she's gonna say something. Something.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm not gone today.

[Ronnie Karam]

Okay, everybody, I'm gonna say, I think that you've been. I think that, like, maybe move the needle a little bit. She's like, I moved the needle. Okay? I picked up that needle and I moved it, and that needle pierced me in the heart. I'm not apologizing again. And Garcelle is pissed. She's still pissed at Sutton. And she's. Well, I don't think you should apologize. No. Unless you're apologizing to me. Hint, hint. And she's like, well, I'm not. And I'm actually. Actually, I will say this. I did appreciate when Kyle, my new best friend, did step up and defense of me for Dorit for about three seconds. That was very special, Kyle saying like, dorit, that's not nice. She's like. I mean, the way she stood up, it's just so wonderful having a best friend. I never had someone who had my back like that. And it's just hearing those words for the three seconds while I sit in my cocktail, it just. It just filled me with so much love. I felt like I had a wind beneath my wings.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then she tells us, Kyle stepping up for me. I knew we were friends. I knew it. I knew it. And now everybody does, too. It's just so sad to be this insecure when you're so rich and, like, have so many years under your belt. Like, come on.

[Ronnie Karam]

You're like, the better. You're like, the better. Like, you. You are the prize in this situation, not Kyle. So Garcelle's like, okay, well, when somebody says to you, you know, when you say, I'm going back to Kyle. When she said, if there's anything to tell you, I will tell you. Then we do say. And then, like. And then we say, okay, I'll leave it alone. And Sutton's like, well, I do think it's a bit unfair to just say, we want to know everything right now, and you just got to tell us. She's like, yeah, but remember, we made a plan. Remember, we sat there and we're like, we're gonna get her on this one. Should we roll the flashback?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, well, we made that plan before. Me and Kyle were best friends, so, I mean, we're basically friend married now. So you're basically coming after my friend. My friend. Girl. Woman. Female. What am I supposed to say now?

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, all of a sudden, you're not doing it when it comes to Kyle, you know, you have a blindfold on. That's not true. Why would I have a blindfold on to the most radiant and beautiful person at the table? Well, I believe it. I mean, it's how I feel. And you want me to tell you how I feel, so I'll tell you how I feel.

[Ben Mandelker]

And so why could we do it? Last year, she goes, well, last year, I asked a lot of questions because there were a lot of, you know, changes in her life. Say, it seemed dramatic. Also, she wouldn't ask me. So that was pretty much it. You know, what do you want from me? What do you want from me? You know, I had listened to friend to friend, and she goes, I don't want anything. You know what? I'm going to bed. Good night. You know, you've got blinders on. Good night. And she's like, well, you did the same thing, Garcelle, last year. And then Garcelle trips, and she's like, oh, damn it. She goes, oh, forget about it. Admit to doing the same thing last year. She's like, well, I'm not saying I didn't, but now when it comes to her, you're just so protective.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. She's not always been the most amazing fan. She says, I am not protecting her because she can do everything herself. She is wonderful and she is self reliant. I don't need to do anything for her. Well, for some reason, your loyalty is beyond. She's like, well, I am not protecting her. And there's no loyalty. I just will do whatever Kyle wants to do, and that is my choice. That is not out of loyalty. And I want Kyle to do whatever she wants to do. I'm not gonna protect her. That's her life. Her wonderful, glorious life that I'm so lucky to be a part of. And I am not gonna babysit a grown woman woman, because I will be a friend to the grown woman a lot. I will not do that. Whatever is a woman, I'm going.

[Ben Mandelker]

Who survived an attack from a brick hitting her in the nose on the set of Halloween, One of the greatest films of all our time.

[Ronnie Karam]

Have some respect. Have some respect.

[Ben Mandelker]

Garcelle's like, I'm going to bed.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Garcelle's like, all of a sudden, she's taking a different stance. I mean, I've had sons back so many times, but tonight she just left me out to dry. Okay, I see you. I see. You know, it reminds me of. It's. This is. I think Garcelle was like, this is the moment to land the death blow. We are going to finally get Kyle on the Morgan Wade stuff tonight. It's all set up. It's queued up, it's ready to go. And then Sutton's not there to. To help do it and bust it wide open. It's like on a reality. It's like on Big Brother. That's one season, the season six of Big Brother when there was like, the friendship versus the other people. And the other people were going to like the. The Sovereign six. They were going to finally take out the friendship. And then Howie, for some reason, put up people from the Sovereign six. And you're like, why? Why? I know this is a very specific reference, but to those who don't know that, who saw that season, they will see it here in Sutton, in Sutton's actions.

[Ben Mandelker]

Sutton. So she goes to bed, and then Jennifer Tilly comes to comfort Sutton and she's like, what do you like? Good and plenty. And there's a couple with some hairs on them. There's glitter on this one. I don't even think I have glitter in my suitcase at the moment. I need a moment alone, please. I need to take some time to myself for a second.

[Ronnie Karam]

Listen, it's very hard for me to think about the dulcet tones of Kyle Richards voice when other people are talking. So please leave me alone so I can just hear her sounds. Oh, yeah, that sound.

[Ben Mandelker]

That sounds great. So now, the next day, they're all getting ready to go to the boat, and Jennifer's putting on earrings, and she's like, oh, God, there's a hole here somewhere. That's what he said.

[Ronnie Karam]

And those narco are getting their glam done. Erica's like, well, I take sleeping pills on a trip like this. She's like, you do? She's like, I have to. Otherwise I don't, you know, you don't wake up. Yeah, well, how. How do you wake up?

[Ben Mandelker]

Magic.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's like, okay, so the next.

[Ben Mandelker]

In the next villa, Sutton and Garcelle said to have a little chat over there. Coffee. And she's like, okay, well, listen, have you seen the girls? She goes, how could I see the girls? Like, I've been perusing the neighborhood in my night game. I have some sense. How would Kyle Richards feel if she knew her best friend was walking around with her not getting.

[Ronnie Karam]

So listen, I want to say something. I'm sorry. I got a little frustrated last night, and I stormed off. I just wanted to see what it was like to be petty like Kyle Richards. She's like, oh, okay. Well, I hope you enjoyed that. You know, it was our first fight. She's like, I know, I know. It was. It was exhilarating, but also kind of sad. I'm like, if I'm gonna fight, I want it to be about against someone that's more entertaining, you know? I get that. I get that. So then Garcelle's saying, I just feel like we're tipping toe tippy. We're tiptoeing around Morgan. You know, when I brought that up at the table, you went on full protecting mode of her. And I get it. You guys are in a good place now. And I am. I am. So am I with her. But I felt frustrated, and I just felt like you weren't listening to me. And I guess I just wanted backup, since I've done it for you for so many, so many years.

[Ben Mandelker]

You want a backup. And it was hard for me to get back up because I was being backed up by Kyle Richards. Which felt so amazing. And, you know, if she's back in me up and then I'm backing you up, we basically got a pyramid. And I don't have the upper body strength to do that. Do you understand? Okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know, this year, I really wanted to have a deeper relationship with Kyle. But it's like wanting to do the butterfly in a puddle. No matter what your aspirations are, a puddle is still just a puddle. Can't get any deeper than that. So anyway, you know, she's out with Morgan here, she's out with Morgan there, and she's on the side of the stage. And we're not allowed to say anything about it. Why can't we ask about it? Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

So we see a clip of Kyle being like, oh, my God, you know, like, all his stories out there. I'm aware. I'm aware of how famous I am, you know, and there's just so much curiosity about that person that I, you know, forced a tattoo on of myself. And then, you know, fed vegetable kebabs at a memorial service. And, you know, I don't know why anyone's curious about it, but I don't have to speak on anyone's behalf but my own. So Garcelle's like, you know, like, how are we supposed to have a friendship if you're hiding your life?

[Ronnie Karam]

You know, sometimes when somebody's just so adamant about not want to talk about it, you just have to respect it and move on. Unless it's your mother, in which case you just ask her every single day to say, I love you, until finally she breaks down and does it because there's a TV crew there. But that's a special occasion. Well, that's what I'm gonna do. So Bo said she was at a restaurant and she saw Mo with a girl and called Kyle and told her. How about that? Yeah. Yeah. This is the first time I've heard that he's been there. And Garcelle's like, yeah, but that girl, like, yeah, she's dating. Like, yeah, they're dating.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, but why? Why shouldn't he? He's. She left.

[Ronnie Karam]

I agree.

[Ben Mandelker]

She left him for a young woman. And now everyone's like, I can't believe Mo is such a villain. Dating. Listen, let the man live his best life.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, yeah. Well, I just like, you're separated. You also kind of cast the first stone. And I mean, one could say, who knows?

[Ben Mandelker]

He cast the first Bo.

[Ronnie Karam]

The first bone, right? I mean, look, Maurice, it sounds very much like Mauricio was not there for Kyle when She needed him. And so in some ways, that is the first stone. But the point is, like, we all saw last season, you and Morgan Wade. And I'm not saying it's like. I'm not being like, oh, you slut. I'm just saying, you know, the point is your relationship with Mauricio has run its course, and now you guys are starting to see other people, and that's just the way it goes. And if you can do.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's just, like, stale outrage at this point. So. And it's not even Kyle outrage, really. It's everybody else trying to make it a big deal. So then they all go down downstairs and start taking pictures, and Jennifer Tilly is taking a naked photo of herself in the pool. You know, say, oh, look at this thirst trap. And Son's like, why? Why is everybody else doing these thirst things? You know, I'm. I'm only thirsty for the material of my bathing suit. Vodka.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. They're all doing thirst traps, and they're having a fun time with it. And now they all got. And this is a. Oh, my God. Whoa. You look great. You look great. What are you wearing? It's Valentino. Oh, my God. Fantastic. Blah, blah, blah. It's, you know, it's the whole classic Beverly Hills 10 minutes of admiring brands.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So now it's time to go on the catamaran. She's like, well, there'll be swimming, food, sunbathing, swimming, more swimming. And Garcelle's like, could someone be thrown overboard? Absolutely. Can't wait to see who. So now they get on the boat and stuff. And Eric, you know, Erica's about to turn on Sutton, because every time Erica does it, she butters her up first. That's so fucking funny. I wish they had, like, a montage that they showed of Erica doing this. So Sutton's like, please excuse my butt in your face. She's, oh, actually, it looks good. You look cute, girl. What are you weighing now? 100. She's like, oh, come on, 110? She's like, oh, good. Well, I'm 128 to 130. And that's it. Just us Southern ladies obsessing over calories together. Aren't we besties?

[Ronnie Karam]

That's such a funny observation. I never noticed that, but it's true. Like, she does butter her up.

[Ben Mandelker]

She butters her up, and then she gets her all happy and then just breaks her down.

[Ronnie Karam]

So they're all getting on the boat and everything, and they're all sitting at the table, and Kyle, of course, her eyes. She notices Jennifer's earrings, and she's like, her eyes, of course, are like, bling, bling, bling. She's got the terminator eyes. She's got the display where it's like, it zooms in on the earrings. She's like, I can't get over your earrings. Like, hi, yeah, the Dolce and Gabbana. She's like, I love them. I want them. Yeah, well, it's Altamota, so there's only one. So you can't get it off of. You can't get it at the Dolce and Gabbana boutique. But they. Which, I'm sorry, I know that sounds really obnoxious. Carl's like, one of a kind. I can't buy them. Like, she's spiraling.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So now they go to the buffet of cheese and they're eat. You know, they start getting their eating and stuff like that. And so Jennifer standing there, and she's like, okay, do you need anything? And Kathy's like, do me a favor. Take my plate. Okay. Thank you. Thank you so much. Okay. You want this too? Yes. What is that, a fork? Yes. Oh, thank you, love. Could you hand me a napkin? And did you see any dressing over there? Is there any butter? Could you please get that? There's some crumbs on this table. That would be great if you could maybe decrome the table.

[Ronnie Karam]

And the producer is like, does Kathy think that you're the help on the boat? She's like, I don't know. Sometimes I think she's not quite sure who I am.

[Ben Mandelker]

Girl's like, yeah, if you're around Kathy, she's gonna ask you to do things for her, you know, I mean, that's just how she is. Oscar nominee. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. So Sutton's like, yeah, there's a hierarchy. And Kathy's on the top, thankfully best friends with her sister. So I'm getting there. Getting there.

[Ronnie Karam]

So everyone's now lazing about on the boat, sunbathing, etc. And, you know, Dorit hangs out with. With Kyle. And she's like, honestly, Kyle, Kyle. Oh, my gosh, If I fall into your face. I'm just saying. And Kyle's like, oh, my God. By the way. I have a very good view, by the way. I'm like, your butt is like, right over my head. Oh, my God. And she's like, you know, you're like a rock, Kyle. You have the body of a rock. She's like, really? I mean, I try, you know, that's like, what I'm doing, I'm just going through the. Going to the gym at 6am not eating mashed potatoes, sending them back.

[Ben Mandelker]

So dorit asks about Kim, and Kyle's like, she's good, but I don't see her. Like, how the fuck would I know? She's kim. She's a mess. I don't want to talk about it. So then she's like, well, I haven't seen you three together in sue long. And she goes, yeah, well, I mean, we're just not that close. So then we go to the other ladies, and they're right.

[Ronnie Karam]

Just the Richard sisters. Like, dorit should know by now you can never have three in the same room. One's always got to be on the outs.

[Ben Mandelker]

And it's interesting too, because dorit's kind of on the goods with kyle right now, but she's bringing up another subject she knows Kyle does not want to discuss, which is kim. You know? So I thought that was interesting. So then Erica is talking to Sutton, like, oh, what happened to your head? Come on. She's like, well, I just don't want it to fly off, you know? So, you know, guys, I was talking to garcelle today about my apology to dorit, and I really meant it, and I just want you all to know I mean it. I wouldn't put them on my ears, okay? It was a thing I said. And listen, my name is gonzay, okay? I'm going to say this. I'm going to say, well, it wasn't.

[Ronnie Karam]

A good thing to say. It wasn't a good thing to say. It was a terrible thing to say.

[Ben Mandelker]

Terrible. I beaten myself up about it. Thankfully, the gold chain I was beating myself up with was a lot more hurtful than what other pleather leather strap dorit would be beating herself with because she's poor. But I do feel bad. Very bad.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know what I've noticed by the way? You look great. I love the earrings on you. Your hat's wonderful. You just look better than ever. But you know what I've noticed? You are very critical and sometimes very not. You're just not the most compassionate to women that are going through the worst time in their lives. And I felt it with myself. And so it's like. And, like, her eyes, she has these very feline eyes, and they just start to, like, lower, and sun's like, oh, really? This is. This is what we're. This is what we're gonna do. And then we see, like, actually a very, very long montage of of Sutton going after Erica do Kyle. So Erica's like, you know, you poof.

[Ben Mandelker]

The whole thing about this. I'm sorry, but just before we go on, because of all these clips they showed, they make it look like Sutton and Sutton was the main one who would go after Erica and be like, but I read this article, and everyone else was like, it's too long. I couldn't read it. But what pisses me off is she's doing all of this, and then she's standing up for Kyle later. But it was Kyle who was the one saying, we're questioning Erica on this shit. If you're on a TV show, you have to be questioned. And that's just the fucking way it is. So we're gonna do it, you know? And now she's off, like, she didn't do anything. And the only one being held to the fire is Sutton. And that's not fair. And it's also not the same thing. Erica, when you're. It's a. It's a whole scandal that's all over the national news that you don't get to just talk about. Like, that's crazy. Of course you're gonna answer. And then you come on making excuses for Tom and saying he's got dementia and all this other shit, trying to help his defense. Like, you don't just. You get questioned. And none of this has anything to do with that. So, Erica. The fact that Erica. Every fight, Erica brings it back. What about what was done to me last year? You fucking deserved it. And you're lucky that you got off and even got to come back and get a chance at redemption, because you fucking deserve those questions, and you still do. There's so much stuff that they're not asking you right now. So consider yourself lucky. I wouldn't piss off Sutton while you still got that Marco. Marco thing going on, because a lot of the audience doesn't even think about that one. And she could nail your ass with that one. So be careful, Erica. Be careful, my little lamb.

[Ronnie Karam]

No, I mean, I think that you bring up a very good point, which is that, like, Erica is conflating, you know, being. Kicking people when they're down with someone who's trying to get clarity about something. And, you know, when you have a show where you have, like, the. Probably the biggest star on the show, the biggest principal who champions the idea of being open and honest. Open and honest, but then is very protective and is very private about when stuff is happening in her life or her friend's life, her allies, lives it feels like hypocrisy. And I think Sutton is triggered by hypocrisy. Most people are, but she is particularly triggered by it, and she wants to get to the bottom of it, because I think Sutton's also, like, I have been really open about everything in my life. I've been very raw on this show. And then you get to just poke at me, and you get to have fights with me, and you get to do all these things with me, and yet I'm not allowed to. To say question you, and I've had it. I'm going to ask you questions. And it's uncomfortable for Erica and for Dorit and for Kyle, but, like, it's also. She's doing her job, okay? It's not. It's not like she's going around, like, fat shaming them or something like that. I mean, you know, when sudden. When sudden with the whole thing with the invasion. And so I was like, well, I had a hard day, too, because there was someone who's supposed to be on a plane. It couldn't come in here. It's like, that was shit shitty. Yes. But the truth is, like you said, this is a show about being sort of putting yourself out there on tv. And they're not. They're being very protect. They get selectively protective, selectively open and honest. And Son's just kind of like, you, you can't do this. And now you're gonna make me look like the shitty person when I'm just doing the thing I'm supposed to be doing.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And so Erica's like, well, you pose as a friend, and oftentimes work, as in Italy. Garcelle just goes, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's like, you know, I've had enough of sitting back watching Sutton Strax. Fake apologies, fake sisterhood. If Sutton was sincere about the apology last night, she wouldn't have had to bring it up and sell it to us one more time. I'm like, well, she would have, because if you didn't bring it up, it's like, can you believe she just thinks she can say it this one time? And then everything is fine. So Sutton is like, she. I'm just going to emphasize that it. It was so important for me to bring it up that I'm gonna say it again. And they're like, oh, really? Wow. Now it's. We know it's fake because you had to sell it to us a second time.

[Ben Mandelker]

And of course, Sutton is going to blow this up into a much bigger deal. So she's like to say that I mistreat women.

[Ronnie Karam]

How dare you?

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I mean, these women here, she's. That is a very strong statement set in. Strike mistreats women. How dare you? Where are you?

[Ronnie Karam]

Ramona Singer pops up. I believe the phrase you're looking for is you don't support other women, Erica. So Erica's like, well, it's a true statement for me. And what I've observed for the last three years, and this is just my observation, is that it's okay for you to say things. And me can't say this. Oh, for someone like you to say that. That I mistreat women as like to imply that I would ever mistreat someone as saintly and as godly as Kyle Richards over there. Absolutely not.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And she's like, well, I mean, you do this thing, you say, I want to help you. I feel bad for you. And then we see the clip of her saying, I'm here for you. I got you a care package kit. Okay? There's chips, there's candy, there's champagne, there's handcuffs. Those are for sexuality, not for prison, and I'm here for you. And then kind of like confronting her and taking her down. And she goes, but then you turn around and call me a liar because you were lying about a lot of. That's why. Okay, she did one thing, then you lied about stuff, and then she asked you about the lying about stuff.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. So Erica's like, I'm just pointing out a pattern in the way that you've treated people at their lowest point. And sounds like, well, I'm sorry. I didn't realize that you cared about patterns because there were a lot of patterns in the Tom Gerardi case of you involved in it. So we're gonna go talk about patterns. We're gonna go there. But anyway, I'm sorry that I asked questions about the LA Times. I'm sorry that I'm the only one here capable of reading more than three sentences in an article, and therefore, it all was on my shoulders. Ask questions about it. It really seems to bother you.

[Ben Mandelker]

Of course it bothers me. She goes, okay, well, that's on you. That's not on me. She goes, no, it's on you for doing what you did. Just. I apologize, Erica. She goes, well, I do accept your apology, but you still did it.

[Ronnie Karam]

So, Colin, dude, are like, oh, my God, there's like a scene happening without us. Let's get involved. So they come in. By the way, Dorit, we haven't talked about this. Dorit is wearing, like, a Yosemite Sam hatch hat. It is this the most enormous beach hat. It is like. It's like a. It looks like a. A giant, like, tortilla chip fell on her head. I took a picture of it because it was so funny. I don't know if I've ever seen a beach hat that was as big as that.

[Ben Mandelker]

So she's like, and you know, you've been hard on Dorit has been hard on me. She goes, I know this, but you're kicking a dog when she's at her lowest. Well, I apologized, I apologize, and then I apologize today, But I'm not going to be sit here and put on trial by a judge and a jury like, I'm a terrible person when I am not. I am not. I will not demand to have a jury of my peers. Not a jury of my pores.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, she wants a jury of beers. I'm telling you, she does have a drinking problem. Oh, come on. Listen. Better. Erica's like, you can feel the way you want. And I'm just telling you how I feel. She's like, oh, well, I can feel. I can feel the way. I want to thank you for the permission, ma'am. So Erica's like, well, I just knew the other she was gonna drop with a There. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That was me doing my Erica Girardi impersonation, which was quite accurate, I believe. I just knew the other shoe was gonna drop with Erica at some point, and I knew not to trust it because she did this before to me. And so now we have montages of before, of all those times when Erica has buttered up sudden and then turned on her, like, at the reunion.

[Ben Mandelker]

And they're like, but I thought you said that you forgave. I thought you said that you forgive. Forgave Sutton. Erica. And she goes, oh, I was just playing a.

[Ronnie Karam]

She was after that reunion. That was one of the worst reunion performances.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, my God. She just looked crazy, too. Oh, my God. Whatever. She looks like a totally different person. That was. That was nuts.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Sutton's like, you're not a real friend, Erica. You know what? I gave you a pizza party at Chuck E. Chase.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, I basically. Everyone, guess what? Here's the news flash. I'm basically. Basically a terrible person. That's what I am. You said, I'm unkind to women who are going through their bad at the worst point in their lives. It's like, well, you in this group. No, you said women as a whole okay, let me tell you something. I was always nice to him. I was nice to Nancy Reagan when I met her that one time. Like, oh, don't talk about women in this group. I mean, don't get into semantics. Oh, and now I'm anti Semitic? Is that what you're trying to say? Oh, wow, that's real convenient.

[Ben Mandelker]

Do you know how many Jewish people I have tried to help get divorce lawyers when their husbands cheat?

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm not even talking about Jewish people. Well, see, look at me. I'm being inclusive in this argument, and you're not. So now who's the mean one? And by the way, Kyle converted Judaism also. And guess what? She is a wonderful person. Aren't you, Kyle? Kyle, I'm your best friend. I'm your best friend.

[Ben Mandelker]

Right, right. Well, she's just trying to clarify. She's just trying to clarify. Let's let Erica clarify. And sounds like, oh, my God, Kyle's jumped ship now.

[Ronnie Karam]

I can't believe it. I can't believe that.

[Ben Mandelker]

But Sutton sticking to this whole thing now, like, you say, I. I'm anti woman. She's like, oh, shut up, Sutton. I'm not saying anti woman. I'm saying us. Anti us. I mean, this group anti woman. How dare you. So Sutton's trying to make it this much worse thing, and then she's like, what do y'all want from me? What do you want? Seriously, what do you want from me? I'm tired. I get blamed for everything. All you do is telling me I'm wrong constantly. Oh, God. Now you are not gonna kick me when I'm down.

[Ronnie Karam]

And this. And during this time, I'm like, wow. I'm like, Garcelle is really being, like, quiet. You know? Like, normally they have been accusing Garcelle being Sutton's mouthpiece, but Garcelle's not doing it this time. And she says, well, well, there's so many times that, you know, Kyle could step in to have Sutton's back, and she doesn't. She's not doing it today, and Sutton refused to see it, and I've been seeing it for years, and Garcelle's kind of like, I'm not doing this. I've jumped. Like, you know, she didn't have my back last night. I'm not going to be have her back this time. Let's see if her new friend Kyle will jump in. And of course she doesn't.

[Ben Mandelker]

Which, of course, Kyle jumps to the wrong side. So they're like, oh, come on. So Dorit's in it now she's like, come on. Come on, Sutton. And Sutton's like, pick on somebody else. But why is it okay for you to pick on people? And she goes, I'm not picking on anybody. You picked on me. It hurt. It's been three weeks of peen. Pure peen.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, come on. Do reach. If you don't think you like, if you don't think you've picked on me, that's okay. That's fine. But you have. He's like, well, you know what? That's what I said. She's like, and. And son's like, I'm sorry. Erica's like, that's what I said. I'm getting, like, very stimulated because it was a really good fight. And Sutton's like, I was. I was so handpicked by you. I was the picking. I was like a little kernel of corn in your beak. And you're picking and picking and picking. Okay, again, you actually need to speak English so I can understand. Please. Hand picking. I don't get it.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, please speak English words. I don't understand what you're saying. And she's like, well, maybe if I did it in an Eng. I accent, it would work better for you. Maybe so. Maybe so.

[Ronnie Karam]

That did actually help quite a bit. Thank you. I was a little confused. I can only take so much. Okay, so good. You know, I apologize to you, and I meant every single thing. She's like, well, you apologize for caviar, Caspia, but what are you. What you're not understanding is that there's more to apologize for. Well, that's all I am going to apologize for. For calling you poor at the caviar place.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, really? What about bitching me? Who? Boom.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know what? That's it. I'm not gonna apologize for anything else. I am good. I am good right now.

[Ben Mandelker]

Do you want to move forward? Do you want to move forward, Zen? Well, not right now. I'm good right now. I am good. She's like, well, well, well. Her actions have been saying all along, but for the first time, her words and actions match. And this is why I don't believe your apology. Oh, please. You pick and you pick. Sutton's right. That dorit just keeps picking and picking until Sutton gets pissed, and then she goes, there she is, losing her temper. Well, what you ordered. Don't order a hamburger and be mad that you got fries on the side.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know what? I apologize, and I meant my apology, but I want to be on ass with you, Carcass Ian. Bo's like, oh, well, this is really surprising to me. I don't know this Sutton in this way. She's lashing out. She's angry, angry. And I'm seeing a different side that I'm not sure I like. Where have you been, Bose? That's personality lashing out.

[Ben Mandelker]

I had like 30 breakdowns this season alone. It's not like it's your first time seeing them. So it sounds like this is not gonna be sudden on trial for Etsy. We are not doing that.

[Ronnie Karam]

Last week on crazy yachts from hell. Sutton, she's like, she has her hat. She put on her hat and she's just like, I'm, I'm going go. I'm going go. So she like walks off and Gar's like, normally I would have something to say and I really don't like to see them pile up on sudden. And under regular circumstances, I would just say everyone. No, but I'm not going to do that because the other night she didn't have my back. I'm not going to stick my neck out for her when she doesn't do it for me. She can deal with it.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Kyle's like, I mean, seven loves to start an issue and then just like create a whole chaos around it and then like, act like, like a victim. Okay. She didn't start this, though. You were sitting right there. She just said she apologiz. Yeah. So then Erica's like, oh, she's triggered because she knows I'm right. So Kyle goes to follow Sutton and Sutton's like, I just need to be by myself. Two seconds. Two seconds. I've got things to say. Very important things to say. And Kathy goes, these boat rides do not really work. I don't think these are working.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know what? So, hi. I came down here to console you. One very rich lady to another very rich lady. Sometimes poor people just don't understand. And you have to let poor people just be poor. And that's okay. She's like, thank you. Thank you for saying that. You know, I hate these fucking bitches. They're such a fuck. They're such fucking fitnesses. Such a fucking bitch.

[Ben Mandelker]

And that's where we end. Sudden having a breakdown out of a. Of a boat window, holding her son hat on, just saying the C word over and over.

[Ronnie Karam]

It was really good. It was a really good pile on on Sutton. And she acted exactly how you'd expect her to act, which is why she's so wonderful, why she's been wonderful all along, because she just can't help but be the disaster that she is. So everyone, thank you for being here, for listening. Go to watchcraftens.com get your tickets for the shows that are happening this weekend and beyond and we will catch you on the next episode. Bye, everyone.

[Ben Mandelker]

One bye.

[Ronnie Karam]

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Plain she ain't no shrinking violet Coutar we love you guys. If you like watch what crappens. You can listen ad free right now by joining Wondery plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short [e-mail] survey have you ever wondered how a circus performer could become the most powerful woman in the Byzantine Empire?

[Ronnie Karam]

Even the Royals is a podcast from Wondery that pulls back the curtain on royal families from ancient empires to modern monarchs to show you the darker side of what it means to be royalty.

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Before she ruled an empire, Theodora was a teen sensation in circus shows featuring dancing bears, burlesque performers and blood soaked chariot races. But when her star came crashing down, she clawed her way from rock bottom to the very top top, using everything from comedy to espionage to get there.

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Empress Theodora didn't just survive, she revolutionized women's rights across the Byzantine Empire, like changing laws to let women divorce men, own property and bring abusive men to justice. For all her work in pioneering, she's remembered as the most powerful Byzantine empress in history.

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