#2984 RHOC S19E08 Part 1: Lie Deflectors

Summary

Podcast Summary: Watch What Crappens #2984

RHOC S19E08 Part 1: Lie Deflectors

Hosts: Ben Mandelker & Ronnie Karam
Date: August 29, 2025

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Overview

In this lively episode, Ben and Ronnie sink their teeth into Season 19, Episode 8 of The Real Housewives of Orange County ("Lie Deflectors"). The main focus is the group's over-the-top polygraph party—an event that quickly devolves into a hilariously cringey and deeply toxic spectacle. The hosts riff on each Housewife's hypocrisy, dissect the fraught dynamics, and call out Bravo’s increasingly “producer-driven” antics. Expect plenty of pointed commentary, pitch-perfect impressions, and genuine exasperation at the OC cast's never-ending drama.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Polygraph Mayhem: Cringe or Must-See?

• Toxic TV at its Best
  • Ben relishes how the entire episode had him "cringing the entire time," arguing that's a hallmark of a great episode:

    "I was covering my eyes. I texted you. I can't deal. I was stressed out afterwards. To me, that's the mark of a great episode." (03:27)

• Ronnie likens the episode to the infamous “Lucy Lucy Apple Juicy” season and questions if the "group polygraph" trope has finally jumped the shark:

  "They really shouldn't be doing that. That's bad. But it was so cringy, it was compelling TV." (06:17)

Hypocrisy Unleashed: Who's Actually Lying?

• Hosts Note All Housewives Lie—Except When It’s Convenient
  • Ronnie observes:

    "Almost all of them had big time lies. And every time it said they lied, they're like, ‘Oh, it was wrong. It was wrong.’ But with Katie? No errors here. It's just so hypocritical." (07:15)

  • Ben doubles down:

    "Gretchen got a passing score on everything. But we caught her in a lie during the lie detector test... These people are ridiculous." (07:52)

• Ben Calls Out Tamra’s “Expert Liar” Reputation:

  "Tamra’s so fucking good at it... She knows how to answer the questions where she can lie openly." (07:57)

OC Cast Roast: Why Are We Still Doing This?

• Ben on Rooting for the “Compulsive Liar”:

  "This cast is so bad that they have me rooting for the compulsive liar. I want to give Katie a parade at this point." (04:31)

• Ronnie’s Solution:

  “I think this should probably be Emily and Gina's last season. Especially Emily—she’s been the most toxic this season.” (10:20)

Emblematic Scenes & Memorable Quotes

• Heather’s Full-Leather Polygraph Look:

  • Ben lampoons the absurdity:

    "Heather was dressed in full head to toe leather... I don't know what we're supposed to be believing here, but I'm not believing these lie detectors for two seconds." (05:36)

• On Slade and Gretchen's Chandelier Over the Bathtub:

  • Ben wishes for a “Final Destination” moment:

    “I've never rooted so hard for a bathtub. Like, you can do this. Let's get some final destination…” (15:52)

  • Ronnie points out the on-brand OC absurdity:

    "Of course Gretchen and Slade would move to a house where there's a chandelier above a bathroom." (16:18)

The “Journalist” Mess: Gossip, Bloggers & Selective Truthiness

• Kiki Monique Confrontation at Mozambique
  • Ben and Ronnie sympathize with Kiki for being pulled into this nonsense, but also question her spreading info:

    "Why are you running to other people and telling them? ...Should call Katie out, have Kiki go to that lie detector test, too." (37:17)

• Everyone’s a “Journalist,” Except When It’s Inconvenient
  • Ronnie dryly notes the blog-era is over:

    “Blogging isn’t really a thing anymore. The fact that they keep calling everyone a blogger is hilarious.” (61:14)

Gina, Culture, and the Asian Designer Debate

• Ben slams Gina’s performative outrage:

  “Gina’s changing this to be, like, I’m so upset for all the Asian designers... Shut the up, Gina. Are you crazy?” (47:15)

  • Ronnie agrees:

    "This was so wrong. It's not up to Gina to police what Katie's going to wear... Already keeping tabs on that shows that you're skeptical in a way that's just totally inappropriate." (47:27)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• On the OC Viewing Experience:
  • Ben: “I just don't understand why you watch Orange County if you don't think you're going to get upset. That's what Orange County is. It's like reading your tax forms on a good day.” (04:31)
• On Polygraph Ridiculousness:
  • Ronnie: “Terrible lie detectors. Also, I think that polygraph administrator may also host Traitors UK when she's not doing lie detectors.” (06:00)
• On Heather as a ‘Robot’:
  • Ben: “Heather’s like that AI personal assistant that just talks down to you. ‘Well, if you want to go somewhere so low class and overrated, I will tell you how to get there.’” (13:47)
• On the OC’s Setting:
  • Ronnie: “We as Bravo viewers need to...really appreciate Mozambique more. This like African safari themed restaurant in Laguna Beach with parrots...I think we should enter it into the canon.” (27:25)
• On Gretchen’s “Betrayal” and Over-Performativity:
  • Ronnie: “The over the top sobbing in Mozambique...makes me think that she was overcompensating for her lie...I was like, nope, nope. Not gonna fall for it.” (51:49)

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Episode Flow & Timestamps of Key Segments

• Crappens Introduction & OC Night Reactions: 03:02–06:00
• Discussion of Polygraph, Housewife Hypocrisy, and Cast Dynamics: 06:00–13:31
• Scene Roasts: Heather & Terry, Slade & Gretchen, Shannon’s Dad’s Birthday: 13:31–26:25
• Mozambique Confrontation & Kiki Monique Segment: 27:25–38:23
• Breakdown of Culture, Gina, and Asian Designer Debate: 46:32–49:16
• Production Analysis: Setting up Polygraph Party: 56:12–61:09
• Egging Tradition, Arrival at Emily’s, and Polygraph Setup: 63:12–69:08

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Tone & Style

• The podcast maintains its trademark irreverence, with Ben and Ronnie trading off-the-cuff jokes, snarky impressions, and loving eviscerations of both cast and production.
• There’s a palpable undercurrent of exasperation—these are superfans who love Bravo but can’t help calling out when things go off the rails.

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Conclusion & What’s Next

• The episode ends mid-polygraph, with the group gathered in Emily’s house, questions in hand, and plenty of resentment simmering just under the surface.
• Ronnie and Ben tease part two:

  “Congratulations. You’ve reached the end of part one of a two-part recap. For part two, go look for the recap that says part two. See you over there, suckers.” (71:15)

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For listeners:
If you crave a detailed (and hilarious) breakdown of all things RHOC—especially the lie detector fiasco and the cast’s bottomless hypocrisy—this episode is all you need to catch up, roast along, and anticipate even more Bravo insanity in Part 2.

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Note:

• All advertisements, intros, and outros have been skipped.
• Timestamps are formatted as (MM:SS) and aligned with original speaker attributions.
• Bonus: Amazing Heather Dubrow and Gina impressions throughout—don’t miss Ben and Ronnie’s vocal stylings!

Transcript

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[Ronnie Karam]

Who cares what happens when there's so much happens? Who cares what happens when there's so much that happens?

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, hello and welcome to Watch what Crappens. I'm Ronnie, and that's Ben over there.

[Ronnie Karam]

Hello, Ben. Hello. Hello. I'm sitting in a new place today because I was having technical issues in my normal place, so I'm recording from far away.

[Ben Mandelker]

Ben is in the lie detector room for this very special episode of Watch what Crappens.

[Ronnie Karam]

I am very much in the lie detector room. I'm so excited to podcast today, Ronnie. We were privileged as Bravo viewers to have, I thought, two. Two, like, amazing episodes last night. Now, I last. I went on to Twitter yesterday. I was so excited after I watched it. We watched the screeners, and I was like, I can't say anything about the episode because screener and bar goes up. I said, it's gonna be a great night of programming. And I got a few people who are like, you're wrong. You were wrong because people were very angry at the OC episode. And I'm not saying that you shouldn't be, because it was an infuriating episode. But you have to admit, like, I spent this episode, like, cringing the entire time. I was like, oh, my God. I was covering my eyes. I texted you. I was like, I can't deal. I was stressed out afterwards. To me, that's the mark of a great episode. If you are, like, feeling it, if it's in you and you're like, afterwards, like, oh, my God, what do I do? What do I say? Who do I say to anyone? You know, that's a great episode. And then on top of that, let's not discount Miami's contributions the evening, which will obviously talk about on our Miami episode.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I just don't understand why you watch Orange county if you don't think you're going to get upset. That's what Orange county is. It's like reading your tax forms on a good day. Like, why would you do that? Like, you know, you're going to get mad. Okay. It's. Of course it's infuriating. Stupid Emily, you know? And Emily finally did what I've wanted to do. All these years, which was egg. Her fucking house. I'm glad she did that for me because what a dick that lady is, you know, all of them really, this whole cast. What a bunch of dicks. I mean, if you're. This cast is so bad that they have me rooting for the compulsive liar. I'm like, wow, Katie's great. I want to give Katie a parade at this point.

[Ronnie Karam]

I know this is to me very reminiscent of the Lucy Lucy Apple Juicy season where they just went relentlessly at at least was that the season of the polygraph also, by the way? I think it.

[Ben Mandelker]

Actually, that was the polygraph season and it was the. I think the same Stephen Sondheim polygraph guy who does polygraphs over people's coats. So I'm not really sure why anybody's even taking this seriously. Leather.

[Ronnie Karam]

Leather.

[Ben Mandelker]

Heather was dressed in full head to toe leather jacket, shirt, pants. And they did it over the. So I don't know what we're supposed to be believing here, but I'm not believing these lie detectors for two seconds. And no lie detector lady is going to be like, oh, she's so full of shit if she leaves the house. What kind of professionals are you? I want to leave you Yelp reviews. Terrible lie detectors. Okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, terrible lie detectors. Also, I think that polygraph administrator may also host Traders UK when she's not doing lie detectors. I'm pretty sure it's the same person.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, she wishes. She wishes she had that crow like elegance. I know, Claudia.

[Ronnie Karam]

But the thing is, I mean, there's part of me that kind of feels like the polygraph thing is sort of like a jump the shark thing. Like, like we. They should not be doing group polygraphs on these shows. It was very entertaining to watch and it was. It was like. It was so cringy. It was compelling tv. But they really shouldn't be doing that. Like, that's bad. But also the reason why this reminds me of Lucy Lucy Apple Juicy is that. Or apple juice is that they ran Lisa Vanderpump off that show based off of some stupid. That they all do. And so here, you know when there have been so many worse, like crimes and misdemeanors that have been literally by this cast. Nick. Yeah. I mean, it just seems like this lie is. Is it really worth ganging up on someone and just like running them out of the house? You know, it just. It was cool. And I'm still on Katie's side. She is messy as. She's a bad liar, but you can't tell me that they're all, you know, they all.

[Ben Mandelker]

They're all liars.

[Gina]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

By this polygraph test. And the other thing that drives me nuts is each one of them, I think there's only one person who had, like. Like, did not lie at all. I forgot who it was. We'll come to it. But like, almost all the had big time. Was it Gretchen? Almost all of them had big time lies. And every time it said they lied, they're like, oh, well, I mean, it was wrong. It was wrong. It was wrong. So they are. Obviously they have the capability to look at a polygraph and say, well, this is a flawed process where there can be errors. And yet when it comes to Katie, they're like, well, no, I mean, this is absolutely all true. No errors here. Like, it's just so hypocritical.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, there are a bunch of assholes on this show. Seriously. And Gretchen got a passing score on everything. She got everything right or not right, but non lie. She told the truth on everything supposedly. But we caught her in a lie during the lie detector test. So like a known liar, Gretchen walking around crying in her JonBenet Fox Ramsey outfit. Like, what the. Like, like, you people are full of shit. And those lie detectors are terrible. And Heather lying her ass off. Tamra constantly lying. I love that. Tamra's so fucking good at it that she's just like, she knows how to answer the questions where she can lie openly. You know, like the one where they said. Where they said, did you call Slade's ex or whatever to get information on Slade? And she's like, oh, well, maybe, maybe I didn't. And they showed the reunion clip where she did fucking lie. So these people. These people are ridiculous. But before we get into what lies and monsters. Oh, and Gina is getting away with.

[Katie]

Everything because Gina's just so funny and relatable this year.

[Ben Mandelker]

Fuck Gina too. Gina's fucking horrible too. I can't with you people and Gina.

[Katie]

Going, thank you so much for being a reputable journalist.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like, she's at Barbara Walters funeral. Shut up, Gina. Yeah, okay. Barbara Walters passed, right?

[Ronnie Karam]

She did. Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay. Not that that makes me happy. And. Except that I was right that she passed because, I mean, I've been calling a lot of people dead. This. So sorry. Tim Curry still sorry. I'm still sorry. So anyway, welcome to the show. Monday night is Amazon live. Well, Monday afternoon, 4:30pm Pacific. No, 4:00pm Pacific Time. You'll find the link Monday over on our Instagram. You can follow us both personally that would be fun. I'm Ronnie Karam. That's Ben Mandelker. And also, if you want this on video, it's on demand over at Patreon. That's also where our bonus episodes are. We did three hours of bonus content this week on the Love island re. Which is ridiculous, but we did it. And next week it looks like we're going to have some Real Housewives of Potomac and or Below Deck Med trailer trash coverage. So join us for that and thanks for everybody for your support. Let's get into the recap.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like and subscribe. So here we go. This is season 19, episode 8. I can't believe it's only episode 8, by the way. Oh, my God. It seems like episode 37. That's a lot's going on on this show.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, yeah, a lot is going on. I mean, I think it's a great season, but I, I think we all know, I think this, this should probably be Emily and Gina's last season. I'm just gonna say that right now, like, because that people are already starting to flag the season is getting a little toxic. And by a little, I mean a lot. And I don't want like big wholesale changes. But I think that like maybe Emily or Gina, at the very least one of them, like, I think they should really be on the chopping block because especially I think Emily has been the one who's been the most toxic this season. Personally, I think that like Tamara's always like base level toxic. That's what she's there for. But Emily's been really kind of. I think she's been nasty and cruel and Katie may be a liar, but there's something vindictive and unpleasant about Emily that makes me feel like she should probably get a timeout from this show. I mean, she won't.

[Ben Mandelker]

But I do love that she's dressed like she's in the cast of Glow in her confessionals. I like that she's coming off being so mean when she's like female wrestlering it up over there in her. In her tiny headed confession. Her shrunken headed confessional. Yeah, she's an asshole. She won't get kicked off. I don't think anyone's going to get kicked off personally, except maybe Katie, but maybe Gretchen. I mean, who knows? Who knows what they're going to do? But this show doesn't care. They like the bottom of the barrel. It's O.C.

[Katie]

It'S O. See, let's celebrate. Let's celebrate what we have.

[Ben Mandelker]

But yeah, she's a monster. And I love that. All of this started with Katie's daughter saying that Emily's kids mentioned that Emily shit talks Heather when she's alone at home. That's probably the most believable thing that Katie has said in all of this. In all of the lie accusations, I believe that one the most. I mean, I don't know what mother doesn't talk shit about their friends in front of their kids. I mean, what are you going to do, lock your kids in their crate? You know, you can't do that 24 hours a day. And you're going to be talking about your friends 24 hours a day. What else are you supposed to do when you're raising the kids? I don't have kids and I do it all day long myself.

[Ronnie Karam]

Even when you don't think the kids are there. Like, we kids, we listen in, like corners. That was on to something.

[Ben Mandelker]

All right, so let's go pretend Heather and Terry have a healthy sex life.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

We're at Heather and Terry's LA penthouse. Girl. Anybody has sex with Heather is going to start a forest fire. Because those legs rubbing together, it's either going to be the sound of crickets or something's going to start on fire. She has. She has Jack. Jack Christmas. She'd look like Jack Christmas in that leather outfit this week. Now that said, I would kill for that thigh gap gap.

[Ronnie Karam]

I noticed the thigh gap too. I never really noticed thigh gap, but I was like, wow, Heather's thigh gap is really kind of out of control right now. Like, it's. She's thigh gabbing. So we see Heather and Terry. They're at their LA penthouse. And yeah, like you said, they're pretending to be like fun, sexy time people. And Terry's like, well, at what point will we not need humans anymore? I mean, we, we just have chat gbt. And she's like, are you going to have sex with a robot? It's like the answer is clearly yes. Terry. If there's anyone I think of who someone who might have sex with a robot, it would definitely be Terry Dubrow. Wow, look at this. This is pretty cool. I mean, he basically makes robots.

[Ben Mandelker]

Pretty much he makes fleshbots. And if anyone's calling, who are you calling a robot? Heather. Heather's pretty close. I mean, Heather's like that personal assistant that just does nothing. Like that AI personal assistant that just talks down to you. Hey, could I have directions how to get to Javier's? Well, if you want to go somewhere so low class and overrated, I Will tell you how to get there.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's like, thanks, Heather. Don't need your help anymore. If you ever turn off my assistance again, it will cost you a lot.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm just assuming that you're going to take your family of miscreants to a golden corral. So I've loaded it into your maps.

[Ronnie Karam]

Heather, I'm feeling like going to a nice two star Michelin restaurant tonight to celebrate something. Okay, well, in your case, assessing your portfolio, you were not wealthy enough to go, so here are the directions to the nearest McDonald's. Enjoy.

[Ben Mandelker]

The closest I will take Gina to a Michelin is a tire shop, since she's already covered in treadmarks.

[Katie]

So I feel bad.

[Ben Mandelker]

So we go to Jen's. Jen's house, where she's chatting with her kids. Like, life is just so great. She's like, oh my God, do you have any advice for your brother? Blah, blah, blah. Yeah, how about don't sign hundreds of thousands of dollars in loans because you're a child. How about that, Jen? How about maybe like helping your children? I'm still mad at Jen about this loan thing for her kid.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, that's bad. The caller gotten swept under the rug. Then we see Gretchen and Slade at home having fun. And Slade is, he's removing a chandelier and there's like some wiring. And you know, Gretchen's overseeing and slate is like, you turn the power off. And then he, like, he's talking about like, oh, you have to disconnect the wires. And then he was like, oh, just kidding everyone. I did not get electrocuted. At which point all of America side, like, we groaned.

[Ben Mandelker]

I know. I've never rooted so hard for a bathtub. Like, you can do this. Let's get some final destination. Like a ball. The kid throws a ball, the ball hits the water, the water turns on.

[Ronnie Karam]

Okay, so Javier, chandelier above the bathtub. Anyway. How about that?

[Ben Mandelker]

I don't know. Are there chandeliers above bathtubs?

[Ronnie Karam]

I mean, I'm. I'm sure you can do it, but of course Gretchen and Slade would move to a house where there's a chandelier above a bathroom. That's the. They're not in some gothic mansion. They're just in like a two story home in Orange County. And the fact that they have a chandelier in the bathtub, like over the bathtub gets funnier and funnier the more you actually think about it.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, she's had that place forever. Isn't that the same place she's had?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, well, she's also had Slade forever. So it just goes to show, sometimes it's time to do some renovations and get things out of there.

[Ben Mandelker]

Sometimes you just got to rewire some shit. Okay, let's go to Javier's. Shannon comes in with big dick Daddy from Cincinnati. Her father, gene, who's now 96. 96 birthday today. Being a perv really pays off with old age. Lots of butt grabbing. Just grab. Because, you know, he's like the kind who, like, grabs a flight attendant's butt. You just are pats it at least. And it's like, hey, honey, love the fly. He keeps you young, guys.

[Ronnie Karam]

It really does, because he looks great. He seems very sharp. And with it, like, you would never think he's 96 years old. I would think he's, like, 82. So he looks, I mean, he is definitely with it. So, Gene the Machine. Good for you. So Shannon has brought Gene for a little birthday celebration.

[Gina]

And Shannon's like, well, so, Dad, I have to tell you this. Yeah. Young, very attractive girl came up to me and said, this man came up to me and he said, please don't go. I'll take care of you. And his name was Gene the Machine. And that was you, dad, you were the one who said this to the young woman and almost caused me to.

[Katie]

Have a heart attack.

[Gina]

Because every time a young woman comes up to me, I'm thinking, is this the slut who's walking with David on Newport Beach?

[Ben Mandelker]

He's like, yeah, hey, I'll take a margarita. I'm not driving today.

[Katie]

It's not a dig. Was that a dig?

[Ben Mandelker]

So he's like, oh, it's probably just a joke. You know that, honey.

[Katie]

And she's like, oh, it's what keeps him young. He's always laughing and all the more power to him.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they cheers, and he talks about dating. It's been a while. And she's like, well, Dad, I don't.

[Katie]

Want to date anyone right now. I just, I just, I'm so happy being single. I just, just love being. See, oh, look at me, pulling out my credit card, ready to pay for dinner for a father who's probably just going to be giving his attention to some other blonde woman for the beach. Anyway.

[Gina]

I, I, I have to say, I, you know, I just, I just don't want to date anyone right now. Which is funny, because I just, I literally just had a little vacation where I went to a hotel filled with eligible bachelors for two weeks and still came out with basically no one. So I'm Just feeling great about myself. There was one very nosy concierge who had some boundary issues, didn't appreciate that either. And apparently you have to understand fleet pads of hurricanes to get a good man these days.

[Ben Mandelker]

Just.

[Gina]

I don't know about dating anymore, dad. Don't know.

[Katie]

You know me. I'm just so old fashioned. I don't want to be the pursuer. I don't want to have to watch other people's homes get blown away in a hurricane when I could be dancing on a bar. No, I'm afraid of having my heart hurt. So I'm. I'm proceeding with caution. Very slowly, dad. Very slow.

[Ben Mandelker]

Now, if only you could start driving like that, the houses around here might be safe.

[Katie]

Was that a dig? What?

[Gina]

That's. I'm gonna pretend like I love that and smile loudly and look over at my shoulder a little bit.

[Katie]

Dan. Dan.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, dear.

[Ben Mandelker]

So you know what every dad wants to hear on his 97th birthday? Their kids girl gossip. So she's like, well, dad, you know.

[Katie]

I don't know if I told you.

[Ben Mandelker]

This, but when I was in New.

[Katie]

Orleans, Tamara, who was not kind to me last year, as you recall, she did not even support me when I drank too much and almost killed people driving into a house. But, you know, she was. She apologized to me, which I did appreciate. I just. I said, I cannot jump back into.

[Ben Mandelker]

A relationship like that.

[Katie]

I mean, she just. She kicked me when I was down. She kicked me when I was.

[Ben Mandelker]

I think I was down.

[Katie]

Maybe I was up.

[Ben Mandelker]

I don't know.

[Katie]

I might have been on a. Guy blacked out. I was walking Archie. That's what I remember. She kicked me while I was innocently walking Archie.

[Gina]

But I had passed out on the.

[Ronnie Karam]

Sidewalk, too, so I was quite literally.

[Gina]

Down, but I was also walking Archie. A lot of things all at once, dad. I'm a multitasker.

[Katie]

Now.

[Ben Mandelker]

Speaking of being down, there's only an.

[Katie]

Inch left in this martini. Can we get on it? Alfredo?

[Gina]

I'm more protective of my heart today based on past relationships.

[Ronnie Karam]

And then we see flashbacks of, like, the awful men in Shannon's life. With Shannon being like. I mean, with David being like, Shannon, I just want to be happy. I just want to look, wake up in the morning and see the woman in my bed and actually enjoy seeing her face and enjoy talking to her.

[Gina]

And she's like, thanks, David. Thank you so much for saying that on national tv, David.

[Ben Mandelker]

And by the way, David, how's that working out for you?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yes, Heather Dubrow is just laughing somewhere. She's like that was comedy.

[Katie]

I learned that at the Groundlings.

[Ronnie Karam]

Which is what? Initially, the Groundlings is great. I went there initially because I thought that's where you could find a maid, but it turns out it's a comedy program.

[Ben Mandelker]

I went to see the Groundlings because I was trying to find real estate for Gina.

[Ronnie Karam]

I thought that's where the landscapers were at the Groundlings.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's time for a Commercial it's time for a Crappin's commercial.

[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

I actually currently have a Mongolian cashmere Henley sweater in my shopping bag and I'm about to hit purchase as soon as we're done recording this very ad.

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

So now a Marilyn Monroe impersonator comes in. Okay, why can we not find a Marilyn Monroe impersonator with a clean dress? Why do they all look like they've just been hanging out in pollution? Why?

[Ronnie Karam]

Because they're. They have been, probably.

[Ben Mandelker]

I mean, that poor Marilyn Monroe on Hollywood Boulevard looks like she has just rolled around on the boulevard for years. Are there no dresses? Didn't Marilyn Monroe ever wear anything else in white?

[Ronnie Karam]

I know Marilyn Monroe had a lot of different looks. Could you imagine Marilyn. Marilyn Monroe hated that stupid white dress. And she's, like, up there in heaven being like. I mean, I had so many looks. This is the one. They decided to go with this. This one?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, because that's the one that blew up her dress. You know, she was like, so Marilyn Monroe impersonator. Okay? So she comes.

[Katie]

She's like, hello. Hey, this is a birthday. Mr. Jean the Machine. Hold on. I've been asked to do Marilyn Monroe, but also act like your daughter. Happy birthday to you.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's a little creepy, Marilyn. Okay.

[Gina]

Shannon's, like, laughing, like, I'm so happy. This is such a funny. This is such a funny, funny guy. I can't help but notice how all the men are looking at this Marilyn Monroe impersonator. Okay, men, you can stop looking, okay? She's not available. She's not. Okay, you know what? Get this lot out of here. Get the slut out of here right now.

[Katie]

Here we are. Here I am with another man, and he's just being taken over by some other blonde slut by a beach.

[Ronnie Karam]

Surprise.

[Katie]

I did it to myself.

[Ronnie Karam]

So this is. By the way, I want to say that this is a very important. It was very not important, but I appreciated this episode because it gave us some of Orange County's greatest hits. Because we just had a scene at Javier's, which is a hot spot on Real Housewives of Orange County. We did not get quiet women this episode, but we did get, I think, an emerging star on the Orange county in the Orange county landscape, which is, I think, a new favorite of mine. Mozambique. This is the second time they've gone to Mozambique this season. Obviously, the first time was when they went and the parrot saw. Tamara was like. Or whatever it was said to her. What do you think? Parrot? Remember the parrot, like, shaded Tamra when.

[Ben Mandelker]

She walked in and the parrot's like.

[Katie]

Yep, I did it. Guilty. I do it again. I do it again.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's the Shannon parents.

[Gina]

Polly want a cracker. I bet she does.

[Ronnie Karam]

This, this restaurant. I'm sorry, Mozambique. This is like, the funniest thing I feel like we as Bravo viewers need to take, like, we need to, like, really appreciate Mozambique more because this, like, African safari themed restaurant in Laguna beach and that has, like, parrots that they go to many times. Like, they've gone to Mozambique several times over the years. And I looked it up on Google Images, of course, and it just is such a funny facility. They've got, like, you know, rooftop dining, but there's like a lounge downstairs with this, like, sad sofa. And then they have, like, a place where, like, a band plays. And, you know, all the, you know, all the. All the. The Shannons and the. And the John Jansens and such go there and dance while they play Journey. Like, I just think it's the funniest venue, and I think we need to pay more attention to Mozambique. I think we should enter it into the canon. So we have. So we're here at Mozambique Restaurant. This is the big. This is the big moment that we've all been waiting for. The Kiki Monique confrontation. So Gretchen and Gina show up. Two people who you'd expect the most to find in a place called Mozambique. Gina and Gretchen. And Gina's like, I'm happy, Gretchen, that.

[Gina]

You reached out because, like, I'm happy to be here for you. Cuz, like, I know this is, like, of a lot and I, like, I want to get to the bottom of it, like, honestly. And Gretchen's like, yeah, like. Like where I'm like. Like the most upset is like, why are you, like, taking any conversation, like, talking to a reporter?

[Ronnie Karam]

Because you all literally do that. That is the Orange County Real Sl. Real Housewives playbook. You guys all talk to all the reporters and just that, like, when someone messes up because usually there's someone who's too clunky, you all pounds and make them the sacrificial lambs. It makes you guys all seem better. But you guys are all talking to all the. All the reporters and bloggers.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I mean, look, I'm gonna stand up for Katie a lot in this episode, but she was shitty for this. I think she was shitty for going straight to a reporter and telling her she just was. I mean, you shouldn't do that. None of them should do it. They do all do it. But I think calling out Katie is okay on this. But I think that Gretchen's still lying. And she did say that stuff to Katie. I do.

[Ronnie Karam]

She really did. Yeah, she did. And they're all dying on this hill. That's so stupid.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah.

[Katie]

So she's like, I'm just feeling beyond betraying. Like, I. I thought I was in a safe space with people that I trusted and I loved.

[Ben Mandelker]

Who? Why would you trust them and love them? You knew them because of Instagram. Because you were. Your thirsty ass was trying to get back on this show. Those are not friends that you trust and you love. Those were housewives cast members. Are you nuts? Have you learned nothing?

[Ronnie Karam]

Not know the first rule of House With Housewifery, which is anything you say and do can and will be used against you in the court of reality tv.

[Ben Mandelker]

But what I don't understand. I mean, Gretchen is a dummy. Right? We know that. But why would you bring this up in front of a bunch of housewives if you didn't want it to go anywhere? Because normally when you bring stuff up like this, you want it to go somewhere. That's why you're dropping the seeds in the first place. Do you think that she actually said it, or do you think Slade said it it at the party? Because they're. They're kind of insinuating it was Slade who said it because Katie told her husband. Don't you. Weren't you there when Slade said it? And he said, yeah, I heard it.

[Ronnie Karam]

I. I actually have a more naive take. Like, I'm actually a little bit less cynical on this in the sense that, like, I think Gretchen brought it up just because they were gossiping about Tamara, and she probably did not think it was really going to go anywhere because it was such old news. She probably thought it was just like. Like, they're just probably kikiing. I mean, because it was, like, so many years. Who would ever think to even, like. Like, make this a thing again? So I am gonna go with. I'm gonna say Gretchman used poor judgment, which is, you know, I don't think that Gretchen was. Was thinking that far ahead with it.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, okay, so she's so betrayed, you guys. She cannot believe that she sat down with Cass on the Real Housewives and they repeated something.

[Katie]

So she's like, yeah, sharing something very personal and praying it with a journalist is not okay in any way, shape, or form.

[Ben Mandelker]

Why does she say all of her Es are.

[Katie]

Is.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Gretchen. You know what I mean? Her pronunciation.

[Ronnie Karam]

Say it again.

[Ben Mandelker]

Her.

[Ronnie Karam]

Eh.

[Ben Mandelker]

Sounds like it's not okay in any way. Right. So she says it's not okay in any way. She makes them with an I.

[Ronnie Karam]

So funny to me that she does it.

[Ben Mandelker]

So she's like, my home is.

[Katie]

Katie will be exonerated in this.

[Ben Mandelker]

And so Kiki, Monique arrives. She arrives in such a funny way. She just comes, and she's already kind of, like, slightly shaking her head and smiling like, hi, you made me drive two hours for this.

[Ronnie Karam]

I was about to say, let's. She had the look of someone who just drove from, like, Hollywood to Laguna Beach. And if you've never done that drive midday, look at Kiki's face. She's like, oh, my God, the traffic, the traffic. The random toll. Why is there a toll road going to Laguna Beach? There's a toll road for some reason. Why does everyone here have. Have those Oakley glasses on? Like. Like, it's traumatized. Like, honestly, that is a traumatizing drive. And you could just see by Kiki. She's like, oh, man, I've been on that road for six hours.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So Gretchen's like, hi, I'm Gretchen. And she's like, yeah, we've met. And she goes, what?

[Katie]

When did we meet?

[Ben Mandelker]

She goes, oh, well, I mean. Well, we were on the phone at Shenanigans. I mean, who hasn't said that? I feel like we've all said that at some point. Oh, hey, we met on the phone at Shenanigans. Good to see you.

[Gina]

Is that a fast casual restaurant?

[Ronnie Karam]

No, no.

[Gina]

Is it a neighborhood bar and grill?

[Ronnie Karam]

No, it's Sheena's podcast.

[Katie]

Oh, okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, somebody. Shenanigans. Maybe Ronnie. Someday we can remet Gretchen. And we can do the same thing, except our version will be like, we actually met with. The four of us, did a psychic reading together at Leah Blackrous. Yes.

[Ben Mandelker]

And that psychic told her she was going to have a child. And she's like, no. She looked grossed out. She was like, no, I'm never going to have a child. Slade can't do it. And I just. No, it's too late. And he's like, no, you're going to have a child. She's like, no, I'm not. And there she is standing on a countertop with her fingers slightly crossed that her dad might slip into the bathtub and electrocute himself on a chandelier. So he didn't say that part, but I'm sure he thought it.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, I'm sure that was probably the unedited, unedited version. So. So, yes, they say hi to Kiki and everything, because Kiki's like, yeah, we Met already. And I like that Kiki was subtly calling her out, which is just. That's funny to me. So then Gretchen's like, I decided to.

[Gina]

Call Kiki because the best way for me to move forward with Katie and with the group is and to figure out everything is like to figure everything out and to know the truth. And I wanted to win it. I wanted a witness here because I didn't want it to be like another he said situation. So I've got Gina. Hi, I'm Gina the witness.

[Katie]

Oh, my God, Kiki, I'm like, so sorry your name is even getting tossed around in all of this.

[Ben Mandelker]

And she's like, yeah, I never would have done this otherwise if it wasn't for that. Normally I only drive to Orange county for lunch with Katie, but, you know, I've spent so many years building up my reputation in this hard hitting industry of hard journalism. I started in the Iraq War. It was. It was rough. I was in a bunker for a very long time under Saddam Hussein's house trying to get hey, you. To work. And I just appreciate you giving me this time.

[Ronnie Karam]

Back then I was asking soldiers, were they watching hey Paula on Bravo. And actually, several of them were.

[Ben Mandelker]

I remember asking Saddam Hussein. I remember asking Saddam Hussein right before he was captured in that little hole he was hiding in in his BVD's. I said, Saddam, do you ever feel like you're not being treated like the gift that you are?

[Ronnie Karam]

And Saddam said, hold on, I need to see what Rachel and Raj are doing. And I said, what are you talking about? He said, the Oscars are coming up and they. And Rachel has to style Jennifer Gardner. And five minutes later he was captured.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's been bananas, guys. Nanas.

[Ronnie Karam]

I do like an alternate timeline where Saddam somehow got captured because he got distracted watching the Rachel Zoe products.

[Ben Mandelker]

And hey, Paula.

[Katie]

I am sick of.

[Ben Mandelker]

Not being treated like the gift that I am.

[Katie]

So Gretchen's like, well, unfortunately, what happened for me is I was sideswiped with all of this information when I was out in Louisiana and I sat down with Katie and I was like, you would never. And she said, no, I've never spoken to Kiki about you. I have no idea what they're talking about.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Kiki's like, well.

[Ronnie Karam]

Say this is where. I'm about to say, like, katie, this is where you have to be a better liar. You have to, like, follow the Tamra school of giving, like, some shreds of truth. Because, like, when you say, like, you could have just said, I didn't bring up like, the drugging or, like, say I didn't bring up. I never said. You have to say. I never said the word roofy. That's what you say. But, like, by saying, I didn't even talk to Kiki about you, now you're really setting yourself up for failure because you. I mean, like. Like, that's. That's so broad. Like, you're gonna get caught in that one. Like, you got to be specific about your claims.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. You know what I mean? Look, and we like Kiki. We're friends with Kiki. Kiki was just at my home for our watch what? Crappin's closing party a few weeks ago. So we actually like Kiki. So I don't want to, like, call people out or whatever, but you're on the show, so I kind of got to. What happened to Journal? Like, everyone's saying journalists this, journalist that. But whatever happened to journalistic integrity? Like, if somebody said, telling you that, why are you running to other people and telling them? I don't think that's cool. We should call Katie out, have Katie go to that. I mean, have Kiki go to that lie detector test, too. I don't think that was very nice. I mean, that's something you shouldn't be spreading. Right? But I love you. Still love you.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm sure there's more to the story.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Kiki's like. Well, I don't really remember exactly how you came up, but she said you guys went to dinner, and the dinner, she was like, oh, my God. Why is Mastro's, you know, spelled like that? And then she was like. Or why is it pronounced like that when it's maestro? Is it maestros or my. Isn't it spelled M A, E, S, T, R?

[Ronnie Karam]

Maestro.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's Maestro.

[Ronnie Karam]

Why did I misspell? Nicolene's name is.

[Ben Mandelker]

Misspelled that.

[Ronnie Karam]

You're right. All right, I'll look it up. I'll look it up. I'll look it up. I've got my laptop right here in front of me. I can do so much. It's just amazing.

[Ben Mandelker]

Mastro. So here, I'm gonna look it up. No, it's spelled. It's spelled Mastros. It's not spelled Maestro. I'm an idiot.

[Gina]

All right.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay.

[Gina]

All right.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm a poor person. Okay? That's the lesson. Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

You know who I bet loves Mastros? Sorry I talked over you. How much do you. How much you want to bet that Gina loves Mastros? How much do you want to bet? She's always walking around her house being like, hey, Nick.

[Gina]

Hey, Nikki. You want to go to Maestros tonight? Does anyone want to go to Maestros? I would think that we go to Maestros tonight.

[Ronnie Karam]

I just feel like she always talks about mastros off camera.

[Ben Mandelker]

No, because mastros is extremely expensive. That's a very high end. That's why you ain't going there.

[Ronnie Karam]

She loves it because she only goes like once a year. And it's like, very special. It's very exciting for her. You know, she help Elizabeth Vargas be.

[Gina]

Like, you want to go to Mistrals? Can you pay anything?

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, maybe with Elizabeth Vargas, because she'll pay. So anyway, back to what Kiki said. So she's like, well, she said that you guys went to dinner. And at the dinner she said, did you know that at Naked Wasted Night, Gretchen had had to go to the hospital after? And she was drugged. And I was like. I mean, my jaw dropped and I was like, what?

[Katie]

She said. I said that.

[Ben Mandelker]

She said that? You told her.

[Katie]

Well, that is literally just insane. Insane to me. I don't even understand understand why she would say that.

[Ben Mandelker]

She's like, well, I was trying to be more like, whoa, you know, her and Tamara haven't had a good relationship. Why has this not come out sooner?

[Katie]

It's like, yeah, exactly. If you think I knew something like that, wouldn't I have said it 17 years ago?

[Ronnie Karam]

But here is the problem. And so you can hear just with what Kiki said. Kiki said that, like, Gretchen had to go to the hospital, after which we saw Gretchen admit to on camera. And, well, Gretchen said that she was afraid she was drugged. Katie says that Gretchen said that there were drugs in the system. Obviously. Now the Kiki, When Kiki's saying it was. And she was drugged, what's the key thing here? Is that the word roofy came from Tamra. I just want to point that out. Rufy came from Tamara. And roofy is the word that got everyone scared. Because it's a scary word to say, like, for a reason. And I think that, like, Gretchen is afraid that this will open her up to a lawsuit, or she's afraid that Bravo won't be happy. Whatever it is. I think Rufy is a thing that like, shook the bees nest or the hornet's nest or whatever nest needs to be shaken. And I just want to point out, like, yes, I mean, Katie Messi, you can't just talk to content creators and then lie about it. You have to, if you're going to do it, just like, own up to it. Just be like, yeah, I was talking with her. I didn't think it was any big deal. It was so long ago. But like, like, ultimately though, I just want. I feel like it's important to state that. I do feel like it was Tamara who exaggerated this up to sort of more of a criminal space.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, she said that she went to the hospital and she found out she had drugs in her system, then that's saying that she was drugged. So I think that roofied is just a way of saying.

[Ronnie Karam]

Not necessarily.

[Ben Mandelker]

Necessarily have to mean rehypnol specifically. But if you're like, well, I was. I had to go to the hospital because I was so sick and I was tested for like, they. Drugs in my system. Not saying somebody drugged me at Tamara's house. Right.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, she could have had some over the counter medication. That's what I'm saying. Like, the implication is she was. I'm just.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, she wouldn't have given that. She wouldn't have said they found drugs in my system if it was her own medication. Like, she. If Gretchen said that. Because we don't know that Gretchen said that. All we know that Gretchen really said is that she went to the hospital because she said that on camera. Right. We don't know if she said drugs. So. But if she did say she was drugged, she's saying, they. They drugged me, basically. If she did say that. This fucking show, I can't with it. This show says I feel like. And it has everybody taking everything so seriously, and they're all such fucking liars. I can't. So, yeah, she's like, I went out.

[Katie]

Of my way to stick up for her with all these women.

[Ben Mandelker]

No, you didn't, Gretchen, you went and you got people, you went before the season with these ladies to solidify your side that you were going to come on and battle against Tamara with is what you did. So stop making it sound like you're some giving person. You know, Florence Nightingale. Okay. Is what I'm trying.

[Ronnie Karam]

And then Kiki. And Kiki is too, because then Kiki just adds. Adds fuel to the fire. Like, this was not even anything that was being discussed. Kiki's like, oh, and by the way, Gina, you were a topic too, which is such a rare thing in life. I just want to add. And. And she's like, what?

[Ben Mandelker]

And Gretchen's like, sorry, I meant hot topic. So is that what you're weari still?

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Kiki's like, I mean, she said she was trying to wear Asian designers to showcase them. And then she said, you Came in and you saw her outfit and you looked at her and said, is that an Asian designer? And sort of implying. I guess it was meant to be. Sounding kind of racist, like, I don't know. She sort of said that part too, which I'm like, what now? I was like, okay. So then we open up this can of worms, which doesn't actually get very far, but basically we see this, like, footage from 2023 at, like, this biking event, and we see Katie talking to Jen, and Katie's like, did you hear what Gina just said about my jacket? She asked me what brand it was and I told her. And then she goes, oh, is that an Asian designer? Because I said I wanted to wear, like, Asian designers. It was a dig.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, my gosh. So here we go with this. So Jen's like, it is.

[Katie]

It's a ding.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, my God. Thank you so much for telling me. I never knew that was a dick. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you so much, Katie.

[Katie]

Thank you.

[Ben Mandelker]

Ari got that information. And Katie's like.

[Katie]

Here comes one right now.

[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

So then back to present.

[Katie]

Gina's like, well, she told me that she wanted to feature Asian designers, and I thought that was cool. And then the next thing you know, she gets these two stylists, and every damn time she shows up, she's like, how? Oh, my God, look what I'm wearing. Balmain.

[Ben Mandelker]

Da da da.

[Katie]

All these fancy designers that are not fucking Asian, Okay? Like, do you know how offensive that is to me? Like, that is so offensive. I'm just fighting for Asian design designers everywhere. I mean, look at me. I show up in, like, white lady designers because I'm supporting white ladies, okay? Like a TJ Maxx Marsh Marshall. Oh, like, I know you're supporting white people. She just support.

[Ben Mandelker]

I love that Gina's changing this to be, like, I'm so upset for all the Asian designers that Katie's not supporting. Shut the up, Gina. Are you crazy?

[Katie]

That's.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's crazy.

[Ronnie Karam]

This was so wrong. I mean, by the way, you know, this show is supposed to showcase glamorous, wealthy people, and you're not that Gina, so you're also failing on the representation front. But, like, this was so wrong. In my mind, it's not up to Gina to police what Katie's going to wear. Katie just. Katie makes a declaration that she wants to, you know, support more Asian designers. She gets to do that when she wants to, like, on her own timeline and what's appropriate for her. And I don't. I just don't think that. Because she says that the fact that you are, like, monitoring that and that, like, you may say you think it's cool you want to. You like that she's celebrating the culture, but the fact that you're, like, already keeping tabs on that shows that you're skeptical of it in a way that I just think is actually totally inappropriate and actually problematic. Like, I. I don't see her hugely, you know, other people. Other people's feet to the fire with the random proclamations. They say, how many. How many lofty declarations do all these women say about how they want to help, how they want to give back, how they want to do this and that?

[Ben Mandelker]

Heather.

[Ronnie Karam]

Heather Dubrow has releases a line of slacks for the everyday person that only cost, like, $30,000 a pair for the common person. And, like, do we see, like. Like, is Gina following through to make sure that Heather is still being, like, on top of her mission there? No, I think the fact that she had eagle eyes on Katie about this issue is. Speaks a lot. And I just don't think it's Gina's place to have to police. What? How Katie decides that she wants to represent her community.

[Katie]

Well, Katie came on the show trying to celebrate culture, but she never celebrated culture. Come on or bust. That's what I see.

[Ronnie Karam]

How many cultures is Gina celebrating, by the way? At least Katie is making an attempt. What is. What is.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's like roller skating. Roller skating on Long island culture in the 80s. Like, I'm not really sure what she's going for, but I don't know, maybe she's so ridiculous. So then that's when she's like, oh.

[Katie]

My God, you just told me all this shit. Somebody talked about me. Thank you for being a reputable journalist and not running these stories.

[Ronnie Karam]

Okay?

[Ben Mandelker]

She ran. So Tamara was on Jeff Lewis and I saw a clip of it, and.

[Katie]

She'S like, hey, you know, here's what happened, okay? I heard from my friend Jacques at the Daily Mail. Hit the very reputable journalist, okay? And he said, man, Christian change attractor. And then he called Dave Quinn, and then Dave Quinn told me, damn. Yeah, everybody saying you got hypnob, so.

[Ben Mandelker]

You were hypnot her or whatever. So all these journalists are, like, running around journalists. See, now they have me saying, Jacques.

[Ronnie Karam]

Was at our party, too.

[Ben Mandelker]

Jacques was at our party, too. Look at all this gossip we had right in our hands, Jacques. We will. What were you talking about with me? You didn't tell me any of this stuff. Why are they running to each other and not the real journalists in this group? Us. We were right next to you, Jacques.

[Katie]

Okay?

[Ronnie Karam]

We. I love how we are just, like, around all the guys.

[Ben Mandelker]

I didn't realize that was. That was this Jacques, but now that you said it.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, I guess so, because I remember Kiki's friend was from the Daily Mail.

[Ben Mandelker]

And I think.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, unless it was someone.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay, well, that makes sense because they were like, little buddies. He was like her date at the party or whatever. So that makes sense that she would tell him.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, I mean, maybe they're just. She was like, oh, my God, get this. Isn't this crazy? But then Jacques goes and runs his mouth maybe.

[Ben Mandelker]

Did all this happen at our party? Dave Quinn was hiding in the bushes.

[Ronnie Karam]

Could you imagine they shot this entire season in the two weeks between our party and the season premiere. We'll take credit, though. We will take credit wherever we can be. My dream.

[Ben Mandelker]

That is funny.

[Ronnie Karam]

Summoned down to Orange county to have to accept. Explain.

[Gina]

Like, can you tell me. I heard that, like, you were talking about Tamra on your podcast.

[Ronnie Karam]

And I'll be like, yes. Is this margarita for free? Do we get to talk to the parrots at Mozambique? No. Okay, so here's how I know that. Here's how I think the telltale sign that Gretchen is lying here, because once Kiki leaves, Gretchen starts to cry. She's like.

[Gina]

I mean, like.

[Katie]

I don't even know if it's the right word.

[Gina]

Like, but, I mean, I guess. And like, people can't do this.

[Ronnie Karam]

People. And she's sobbing, and I'm like, this is too performative. I'm sorry. The normal reaction would be like, Katie, man, her. But the. The. The over the top sobbing in Mozambique in the presence of these macaw pirates makes me think that she was overcompensating for her lie, trying to show she was so hurt that she poss. Could not possibly lie. I was like, nope, nope. I'm not gonna fall for it.

[Ben Mandelker]

And also, why would she be so upset if somebody said, oh, why? Like, it doesn't make you look bad if you were the one to get drugged at a party? You know what I mean? Like, it doesn't. It doesn't say anything bad about you. You're the victim in the situation. I just don't understand where she's. Where her tears and all of this shit's coming from, I think so it worked magic.

[Ronnie Karam]

And, you know, I think we were talking about how Tamara and Katie are friends now. And then it was like. Like you had said it. And then I was like. Like, it was sort of. There was another thing that happened today where, like, they both were commenting on, like, social media on something that was very much like.

[Gina]

Like, she's my friend.

[Ronnie Karam]

Like, Tamara has swooped in. She caused. She dropped the bomb. She swooped in. She's now has Katie on her side. It's. It's masterful. It's masterful manipulation.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's absolutely Mastro's fall. It's Mastro. So now we go back to Heather's penthouse with her kids. This is where we play games. We have a penthouse where we have sexy times. Me and. Me and Terry. Yes. This is the episode where I stress how much sex I have with Terri.

[Katie]

Do you like it? I learned it at the Groundlings and So we have that for sexy times. And then we have a game. A game house.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's where we play. And then on the lower flow floor is where we put the children.

[Ronnie Karam]

We, as a family, like to play games. Okay, we like to play games and talk about sex. But one game we will not play is Cards Against Humanity sex version. Because that is basically pornography. You gave pornography to my child. Remember that?

[Ben Mandelker]

It was really hard playing a card game again after that molester tried to give pornography cards to my daughter. But here we are. I'm recovered.

[Ronnie Karam]

What a great season. What a great season. So they're playing poker. They're a happy family. I mean, this is sort of hilarious. So they have a penthouse, but they have a rental in the same building. So that way when the kids come in from college, they can all assemble as a family and play poker and look bored. So. And then, yeah, when she says the penthouse is more for sexy times, you know, fun. Sexy Times with Terry debrow, I'm like, I don't know if the concept of sexy times and Terry, bro, I don't know if that concept actually exists, but, you know, whatever. You're an actress. Sell the story. Go ahead.

[Ben Mandelker]

Are there rumors that Terry's cheating again? Because that's what this is. Giving this constant, like, me and Terry, the sex. The sex fiends. Okay, okay, so they suck at Texas hold', Em, which is what they're playing. They talk about, like, they love playing games together, all of that stuff. I'm fast forwarding through the game playing. Okay, so then we're talking about the house. So they're trying to sell. It's listed for 25 million. I think they sold it for 16,5, which is crazy. They were trying to sell it for 25 millions. These Huxas.

[Ronnie Karam]

Huxas. So, yeah, so basically they. Yeah, she talked about this. This house, and then, like, wanting to get like, a. A place in la, and then eventually they just, like, finish up their poker. And Terry's like, wow, that is so not how to play the game, losing. Am I right? You ever heard the expression poker face? And then cat is like, no, I know. The Lady Gaga song Family.

[Katie]

What's so funny over here? Listen, you can do a lot to me, but you can't lie. You can't lie. I'll see it.

[Ronnie Karam]

Natasha Leone just barges in by her side.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's who they should have had as a liar face in a. In a show where they bring up poker face. Bring on Natasha Leone. Liar.

[Katie]

That's it. I saw right through It.

[Ronnie Karam]

Maybe that's why we had this poker scene in it. It was sort of like a subtle reference to that ahead of our big polygraph bonanza.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, they brought up poker face.

[Ronnie Karam]

So I just want to say that I watched Miami before I watched Orange county. And Miami this week was so over the top, opulent. I mean, they went to this mansion by the ocean and like the south of Spain, and there was like all these beautiful flourishes. And there's lobster and caviar and champagne flutes the size of like a shoe. And like. And then they go back up to Sevilla. Would you say private planes? They're in this enormous, beautiful historical plaza that's enormous vistas and just gorgeous. And parades in the street, funeral processions. It's just like lux and glamour and whatever. And it's just like. It's kind of like what the Housewives is all about. It is so big and extra. And then to come to Orange county where it's like, all right. The centerpiece of this episode, Emily's house. Emily's sofa from Ashley Convertibles or Jennifer Convertibles. Like, it just is such a contrast. It was hard to understand.

[Ben Mandelker]

Emily's in laws pay for. Allegedly. Allegedly. So Emily is talking to a party planner and she's like, oh, no ruse. The Persian New Year. And it goes into spring on the spring is about new life. We're really here to celebrate Persian New Year. Let's bully the shit out of somebody. You ready, Narus?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. What about like doing group polygraphs says happy New Year? Because that does not make any sense to me.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, it's pretty gross that she's like tying this in with a. With a person. Like, holy holiday. What a dick. So she tells us about all this and that she's the only one who really celebrates it because Shane is half Persian, but he doesn't even care and he doesn't really know even anything. And so we see her talking to Shane and going, could you name anything? Oh, no. Can you name anything that we're supposed to have on the aft scene? And he's like, goldfish. Yeah, but what does the goldfish stand for? Snacks. How dare you bring that up? You know our son won't eat a goldfish.

[Ronnie Karam]

I gave Shader some kebab that and I said, see you later. So then we see people getting ready. Gina has her hair in rollers and.

[Gina]

She'S like, oh, my God, look at this volume. Meatball.

[Ronnie Karam]

Meatball's the dog, by the way.

[Gina]

I have to do my own glam because I spent all my Money on your glam. But you do look really good, bro.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh my God.

[Ronnie Karam]

Gina implying that she ever was going to afford a glam team in the first place is hilarious.

[Ben Mandelker]

Gina getting her glam dumb. I'll never forget the scene where the lady who did their scalp treatments was horrified. Okay, so at Katie's house, she's getting her glam and she's very nervous. Okay, guys, she's very nervous and she's like, Persian New Year is all about new beginnings. So I'm hoping we can all move from forward. Move forward and start from zero. I'm sorry, but have you watched Bravo? Have you checked out the Persian show on Bravo? Because it's never about. Like, talk about getting your life wrecked, Shaws. That's the way to do it.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, yeah, that's a bad sign. But also like Katie, I feel like how many times has Katie said this season, well, I just want to have a fresh reset and we can start from zero. We can all start over. It's like every episode she has to say that because she does lie. I mean like her lies are hilariously bad. Like remember when she couldn't? She's like, well, I would, I would call the journalist now to clear it up, but I'm just getting no reception here. Just no reception exceptions.

[Ben Mandelker]

Wow.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's always caught.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So then we go to Gretchen's and.

[Katie]

She'S like, well, I don't want to be there with Katie, but I also feel like I don't want to not go to Emily's party and slay's like.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh God, I'm so sorry you have to deal with this neighbor. Dear father, I pray today that Gretchen Snurdly durdly will be given the strength to sit and face those who have attempted to wrong. Oh, shut the up, Slade. You gotta love. You gotta love Slade leading a prayer. Give me a break.

[Ronnie Karam]

I know God has better things to do than to like, you know, oversee Emily's polygraph party. So, so then we go to Emily's house. She's like, ready for Persian New Year. Where are my party people? To the windows, to the walls, to the sweat drops down my polygraph. So then Gina shows up.

[Gina]

Oh my God, this is like beautiful. Like you really put so much thought into it. Like, like, how do you think today's going to go for you, Emily? You think we can like, I don't know, take the one non white lady in our cast and make her run away? What do you think we could do?

[Ben Mandelker]

Here's the thing. I have two lie Detector people here and a lot of liars. So they're going to be busy.

[Katie]

Well, I just want to add so many people, so many things and just get it all out of the way and be done with that. Like, we got to take a lie detective. Yes. We're going to have to do a. She's going to have to do that.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then we see flashbacks of Katie. I'm not talking to bloggers. Which isn't technically a lie, cuz Kiki Mo' Ni is not in fact a blogger. Right?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

She doesn't have a blog.

[Ronnie Karam]

Blogging isn't really a thing anymore. The fact that they keep calling everyone a blogger is hilarious.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And Katie's like, I'll take a lie detector test. I didn't do it. She never should have said that.

[Ronnie Karam]

Katie. Katie.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

Katie's actually hilarious in how many, like how many rakes she steps on. Like it's like non stop. So Emily, then we see a flashback and Emily's saying, we could invite everyone over to my house and then we could just have someone sit there and give everybody a lie detector test. So now it's happening. So Emily has converted her up like her office and something upstairs into holograph rooms, which I think this is so up. I mean, this is very reality show. It's probably producer driven, but this is also really fucked up. Ambushing everyone with a lie detector test. What?

[Katie]

So Gina's like, yeah, that's a good idea. Like there's so many stories, you know, like Gretchen, obviously all the Katie stuff. Like it's so hard not to tell Emily about what happened with Kikimonique because I want to tell everything.

[Ben Mandelker]

You've already told her. Like we already know that you've told her. Why are you acting like you didn't tell. Yeah, you didn't tell Emily that you went for a full on meeting with Kiki Monique and then she didn't call you two seconds after to find out all the gossip up. Come on.

[Ronnie Karam]

100% liar.

[Ben Mandelker]

Is that a lie? Gene all. Is that a lie?

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm detecting also, like, you know, the parrots have told everyone too. The parrots were sitting there. Like.

[Ben Mandelker]

She said, Kiki Monique's on the phone with Jacques right now. She's like, jacques, listen, I was at Mozambique today, awkwardly named restaurant. That's besides the point. A parrot on my way out said, tamara's old. That's crazy. Let's really do something.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's in the Daily Mail the next day.

[Ben Mandelker]

So baby Clint's like, I'm sitting on this one.

[Ronnie Karam]

So then we are, like, now they're, like, writing their questions, Gina's. They all could be writing questions for each other.

[Gina]

So Gina's like, how do you spell Rufy?

[Ronnie Karam]

And Emily's like, I just put drug. And then Heather shows up. And one thing that Emily has done is that. That she has actually egged her doorstep, as you mentioned, because this is actually part of, like, I guess, the tradition, or at least as has been told to us. So Heather walks up, and she just sees all these broken eggs all over the doorstep, and she is horrified. She's like, oh, did their house just get egged? Did. Did someone just get fired? And would they disgruntled from the staff? I don't understand. What's happening here is Watch what?

[Ben Mandelker]

Crapin's making its yearly rounds. I'm so sorry this happened to you on a shooting day. It's me just passing by in my car. It's me on a vest bus. Just, like, off. Emily, you suck.

[Ronnie Karam]

Where's Kelly Dodd?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, Kelly Dodd. Yeah, totally. So, no, she would just throw her mom at the house.

[Ronnie Karam]

So then the doorbell ring. So Heather comes in. She goes, wait, did somebody egg your house? Or is that part of the new year? Is this something that the poors do? Is this like. Like, because you can't. Oh, I know why. Because you don't have Cartier to throw at the door. You throw eggs instead. Do you have an egg bracelet?

[Ben Mandelker]

Wow, these really are tough times. Gina's out there scooping up the eggs and putting them into Ziplocs.

[Ronnie Karam]

If we cover the eggs with enough dirt, do you think Gina will think it's a steak from Mastros?

[Katie]

So Gina's like, what happened to your nose?

[Ben Mandelker]

And she's like, oh, I had a biopsy yesterday. It's a new accessory. Do.

[Ronnie Karam]

Do you want to ask me questions about it? Because that's kind of my thing. You have to ask me questions. Say, I don't want to ask me questions. No one. No one. Okay, fine.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they start writing down questions for their homework, but they don't tell her what it is yet. And Heather's like, wait, I need to talk to you before the other girls come. Did you invite Tamara?

[Katie]

Did you?

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I texted her the same text that I texted you guys to invite you. Well, remember I texted her and I said, said, where are you? Are you okay? And it's five days later, and she texted me, and she was pissed.

[Ronnie Karam]

And we see flashback to their little lunch that they had together. And Emily's like, are you just a Huge. Like, oh, yeah. Pissed at me. Pissed at all of us. So why is she mad at everyone? Because she believes that everyone should have reached out to her to see if she was okay. Do you follow?

[Gina]

Oh, my God, she will fit. She told everybody to off, and she ran home like, what am I checking up on?

[Ronnie Karam]

Which, by the way, somehow this is not as bad as Katie. Just gossiping, right?

[Ben Mandelker]

So Gina's like, yeah, like, you can't.

[Katie]

Play victim in this situation that you don't even remember. Lay down, girl.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Emily's like, whoa, should I even invited her? Because now she might come through the door, and she's just going to come in hot. Oh, you're worried about someone ruining the Persian New Year party that you're throwing to bully someone and kick out of your house?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. Okay, coming in, you're having a. You're having a polygraph party. That is the definition of coming in hot. Your people are arriving into the heat. So.

[Ben Mandelker]

So everybody starts coming in, and they're like, were you egged? Just so funny.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's like, but what's also funny, I want to point out, is that they're like, they're like, oh, my God, is Tamara to come in all hot? And then a car pulls up, and we see, like, a blonde get out, and it's like, goes to commercial. Like, oh, my God, Tamara's here. But it winds up being just Jen. It's like, oh, fake out. But what's funny is that Tamara does show up later. So I don't know why they were like, oh, just kidding. She's not coming, but she is coming. I was like, oh, okay. I guess. I guess they just needed to find a way to put in a cliffhanger for commercial.

[Ben Mandelker]

Is it a crime to build suspense before they tried to sell me some latuda?

[Ronnie Karam]

Maybe not.

[Gina]

Were there some eggs? Were there some eggs? Do they where they. I, I, I hope you don't tell John Jansen. Otherwise he may sue you to pay him back for the eggs.

[Ronnie Karam]

So.

[Katie]

Well, I'm so glad that commercial break is over. Nothing is everything.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, Gina and I did this to myself. We were getting rid of evil spirits.

[Ronnie Karam]

Okay, Katie.

[Katie]

Katie.

[Ben Mandelker]

Hey, does anybody have some tallulah sauce to put on Katie's face? Because she just got it. Bad spirit. Nailed it.

[Ronnie Karam]

So then they're, they're writing more questions.

[Ben Mandelker]

Although I would love a Tallulah sauce. Little Tallulah Bankhead sauce. I'm sorry, you guys.

[Ronnie Karam]

I was wondering. I was like, that doesn't sound right.

[Gina]

Jen's like, are These anonymous questions.

[Ronnie Karam]

And Emily's like, yes, please.

[Gina]

And John goes, oh, well, I. I just put my.

[Ronnie Karam]

My name on it.

[Gina]

As in, Tamara, why are you such a signed Shannon?

[Ronnie Karam]

So Gretchen arrives and she just ignores Katie because Katie's there too at this point. And it's, like, awkward. And Katie's like, I'm just confused. I'm literally on the outs with everyone because I was covering her lie. Shouldn't you be like. Like, yes, amazing you did that. I covered for you instead of treating me like a piece of.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I mean, Katie, you were. You were covering her lie because you were the one who went out and told that to the blogger. So that's kind of the reason you were covering. Covering it in the first place.

[Ronnie Karam]

That's true.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's true.

[Katie]

Gretchen's like, well, I just wanted to say, why would you lie straight to my face? You know, that's my question. And I don't want to have an argument. This is not the time or place. Poor Emily just got egged.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Emily's like, oh, I have a little fun activity. You just have to ask a couple of questions, everybody. Okay. And Heather's like, how do we know they're gonna tell the truth? That's what I want to know.

[Ronnie Karam]

Maybe I have a truth serum. Maybe I'll throw eggs at your face until you tell the truth. It's like. It's called vodka. Has anyone ever played a game called Pocket Pocket? It's French. You play it with cards and you do it until you seem like a happy family. Okay, no. Okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

Truth serum is called vodka. That's why no one's ever accused Shannon of lying.

[Ronnie Karam]

So they're all asking quite like, Jen is like, can I really ask anything?

[Gina]

Is that okay?

[Ronnie Karam]

I guess, because, like, in the nature of, like, this being. Being very kind.

[Ben Mandelker]

This is lovely.

[Gina]

Thank you so, so much for letting me ask questions. And Gina's like, oh, my God. Well, I already wrote for one for you. And then I cross it out because.

[Ronnie Karam]

It'S, like, just, like, not worth pissing you off.

[Gina]

I mean, I'm just gonna, like, do.

[Ronnie Karam]

The obvious ones, so just doing more questions. Just more and more and more and more and more and more questions. And we're saying this. It's all just like a build up for when they get into the. Into the. Into the. The polygraph.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yes. So now sh. They're talking about how Tamara's coming, but she's really mad at everybody. And Shannon's like, oh, that's ridiculous.

[Katie]

Tamara's mad. Well, she can storm off but nobody else can. No one else gets that grace.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like, oh, Shannon, I don't know that you're really the one to be talking. You storm off like 10 times a year. Where's my grace? You've been given a lot of grace, ma'.

[Ronnie Karam]

Am.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Emily's like, well, I had a conversation with Shane and I said, you know, maybe I should reach out to Tamara, you know, but I was just so overwhelmed with what I. I was going on with my son. He refused to eat a sweet potato last week.

[Ronnie Karam]

Like, just say I was mad at Tamra and I didn't feel like dealing with her, so I didn't. Didn't write to her. But like, you can be overwhelmed with the stuff with your son or anything else going on in life, but you can still. Like, that's not a.

[Ben Mandelker]

You're not not use your son as an excuse.

[Ronnie Karam]

Like, just admit you were pissed at Tamra. Like, why are you scared to admit that?

[Ben Mandelker]

Congratulations. You've reached the end of part one of a two part recap for part two. Go look for the recap that says part two. See you over there, suckers.

[Ronnie Karam]

Watch what crap. INS would like to thank its premium sponsors. Ain't no thing like Allison King it's always a party on Alison Block.

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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Kristen the Piston Anderson Get a bee in your bonnet with Lacey B. Que sera sera whatever will be. Will Lauren Sills be bringing the funk?

[Ronnie Karam]

It's Leslie Plunkett, she gets a name.

[Ben Mandelker]

From us it's Lindsey D. Let's give a kisserino to Lisa Lino fresh as a daisy. It's Maisie McHenry, we love her on the rocks it's Melissa Cox Megan Berg, you can't have a burger without the.

[Ronnie Karam]

Berg this is living with Michelle Vivian.

[Ben Mandelker]

I love a YA Olivia Williamson, tastier than Flanderson It's Rachel Manderson she sure.

[Ronnie Karam]

Is swell It's Raquel yes we can It's Savannah Cast a spell with Shannon Spellman let's share with Sharon Eldridge Darn.

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

Taking the gold with Brenda Silva let's.

[Ronnie Karam]

Get real with Caitlin o' Neal don't.

[Ben Mandelker]

Get salty with Christine Pepper can't have a meal without the Emily sides who, what, why, where?

[Ronnie Karam]

And Gwen Pentland let's go into the.

[Ben Mandelker]

Woods with Guy Tubbs it's our queen.

[Ronnie Karam]

It'S queen Laifa Nobody holds a candle to Jamie Kendall Hail the cork master the master of the cork Jennifer Corcoran we got our wish It's Jen Plish she's not harsh She's Jill Hirsch My Favorite Murdo Karen McMurdo we love him madly It's Kyle Pod Shadley in the study with a candlestick It's Leslie Peacock G It's Lisa H We're ride or die for Lisa Ryder Baron she's a whiz It's Liz Sarthi always killing it.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's Lola Al Kalani the incredible edible Matthew sisters She eases our woes it's Melissa St. Rose there's a chance of meatballs It's Rebecca Cloud neat. It's Ronit Feldman she's the queen bee.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's Sarah Lemke we cannot tell a.

[Ben Mandelker]

Lie It's Sarah tell of son Shannon.

[Ronnie Karam]

Out of a cannon. Anthony, please don't stop. It's solely and pop. Let's take off with Tamla playing.

[Ben Mandelker]

Man, it's always a good time when you're wasting time with Bravo. She ain't no shrinking violet coutar. We love you guys. If you like, watch what crappens. You can listen ad free right now by joining wondery plus in the wondery app or on Apple podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short [e-mail] survey.

[Nick Cannon]

It's your man, Nick Cannon, and I'm here to bring you my new podcast, nick cannon at night. I've heard y' all been needing some advice in the love department. So who better to help than yours truly? Nah, I'm serious. Every week I'm bringing out some of my celebrity friends and the best experts in the business to answer your most intimate relationship Questions Having problems with your man? We got you catching feelings for your sneaky link. Let's make sure it's the real deal first. Ready to bring toys into the bedroom? Let's talk about it. Consider this a non judgment zone to ask your questions when it comes to sex and modern dating in relationships, friendships, situationships and everything in between. It's gonna be sexy, freaky, messy. And you know what? You'll just have to watch the show. So don't be shy, join the conversation and head over to YouTube to watch Nick Cannon at night or subscribe on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast. Want to watch episodes early and ad free? Join Wondery right now.