#3059 RHOC S19E17 Part One: And Just Like That…

Summary

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Watch What Crappens — Episode #3059

RHOC S19E17 Part One: And Just Like That…
Release Date: October 31, 2025
Hosts: Ben Mandelker & Ronnie Karam
[Recapping Real Housewives of Orange County Season 19, Episode 17]

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Episode Overview

In this Halloween-themed episode, Ben and Ronnie dig into Part One of the RHOC Amsterdam trip with their signature Bravo fan snark and rapid-fire riffing. They roast ongoing housewife feuds, analyze the messiness between Gretchen and Tamra, mock some questionable fashion choices, and unpack the recurring saga of housewife insecurities and personal baggage—all while keeping it delightfully irreverent. Along the way, they detour into side stories about stroopwafels, the semantics of Spanx, and the haunting power of “lethargic” vs. “cathartic.” This is the first part of a two-part Amsterdam recap, ending right as things are set up for messier showdowns.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Amsterdam: Day Three — Shannon’s Unhinged Energy

• The episode opens with the cast getting ready for Day Three in Amsterdam.
• Ronnie insists it’s time for an intervention over Shannon’s “wackiness”:
  "It's too much. The sticking your tongue out and, like, through your lips and being unsteady as you put on Spanx or on a bike…" (06:36)
• Ben: "Shannon riding the bike like that with an American flag on in Amsterdam… I just believe that's totally Shannon." (08:17)

2. Gretchen vs. Tamra: Ancient Grievances & Emotional Drain

• Gretchen FaceTimes Slade (now in a cowboy hat, unrecognizable):
  "What happened to Slade? Slade is not aging well… the California sun just bakes the guys." (09:01)
• Gretchen, emotionally spent, reflects on her unresolved issues with Tamra.
  • Notable exchange: Gretchen means to say “cathartic,” but says “lethargic”:
    • Slade: “You mean cathartic.”
    • Gretchen: “Cathartic? Is that the word? Yeah. Stupidity is my thing. I love it. Nailing it.” (13:41)
• Ronnie marvels that Gretchen always seems to lose against Tamra, the "Satan" figure:
  "You can't fight Satan. Satan never wins, okay? You fight Satan and Satan loses... And you can't even beat Satan in a horror movie—like, you're failing, Gretchen. Get the fuck outta here." (11:54)

3. Mom Guilt & Parenting Stress

• Emily gets teary over Shane struggling with the kids alone at home:
  • Ronnie shares the “rich mom” at the pool story and reassures Emily:
    "Enjoy Amsterdam. Shane's got it. Even if he doesn't, you’ll come back, fix it later. Please stop crying on your vacation because your kid had a tantrum." (17:47)
• Ben: "It's your kid's job to be a little asshole." (18:05)

4. Amsterdam Activities: Mushrooms, Swings, and Maze Madness

• Half the group tries mushrooms at “Amaze,” an Instagrammable fun house.
• Shannon, high, starts hearing the Real Housewives theme everywhere:
  "I'm high. I am high. Like the youth of TikTok." (31:26, Shannon)
• Heather gets creeped out by mannequins and jokes about her own AI-generated photo in the maze.

5. Swing Set Drama: Gretchen & Tamra Bond… Sort Of

• Gretchen and Tamra are forced to sit together on a giant swing:
  • Gretchen: "All I see are gay and trans people down there! This is not how I want to die!" (28:45)
  • The sequence is mocked for going on too long and for manufactured tension.

6. Fat Talk, Spanx Shaming, and Biscuits

• The group snarks about Spanx, with metaphors like “can of biscuits”:
  • "Calling her a sausage and a can of biscuits… especially Emily… I mean, who doesn't wear Spanx?" (25:01, Ben)
• Gretchen stirs the pot by tattling to Shannon about what others said behind her back:
  • Ronnie calls her out: "When Gretchen does it, she always carries the bone as if she weren't part of the messiness." (59:13)
  • Ben recognizes the hypocrisy: "Didn't you just get someone kicked off this show because they repeated something you said?" (61:53)

7. Heather’s Sentimental Homecoming

• Heather revisits her childhood Amsterdam home, shares memories, FaceTimes her mom, and ultimately scatters her dad’s ashes in the canal:
  • Ronnie: "She successfully put ashes into a body of water without having them blow in everyone’s faces. Congratulations, Heather Dubrow. You had proper ash form." (50:17)
  • Ben: "I'm sure her dad is in heaven, like, that woman just threw me into the street… dumped me into a piss-filled canal in Amsterdam." (50:35)

8. Jen’s Independence Journey & Relationship Insecurity

• Jen’s storyline focuses on building confidence and financial independence outside of her relationship with Ryan.
  • Gina: "You need to be... enough. You need to be kenough." (77:20)
  • Ben: "I just look at Ryan like… he’s a sex addict. I don’t think he’s gonna be… I think he’s gonna cheat on you." (78:54)
  • Tamra on getting “real” with Jen: "You need to establish yourself financially. You don't want to be dependent on some man." (79:54)
• Discussion turns to the Bravo trope of women “finding themselves” after divorce.

9. Miscellaneous Moments & In-Jokes

• Spanx, can of biscuits, and pop culture gags abound.
• Digressions into European hotel rooms, the problem of “small homes,” and classic housewife tropes.

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• "You can't fight Satan. Satan never wins, okay? ...and you can't even beat Satan in a horror movie—you're failing, Gretchen." — Ronnie (11:54)
• "That was some really weird, premature aging sexy guy thing to say." — Ben on Slade (08:59)
• Gretchen: “It was really lethargic to get it out."
  Slade: "You mean cathartic."
  (13:32–13:41)
• "I just believe that's totally Shannon... I just believe that's her. I love Shannon. You just keep on with your Spanx." — Ben (08:17)
• "If only I had a child in another room having a tantrum, this would basically be the Ben Mandelker story." — Ben (20:20)
• "She did something significant. One would say historical... She put ashes into a body of water without them blowing in everyone's faces. Congratulations, Heather." — Ronnie (50:17)
• "There's no category gayer than Bravo Podcaster." — Ben (26:30)
• "The only thing gayer than that is, like, a penis in a butthole." — Ronnie (26:47)
• "You were my safety net... like Travis's balls." — Gina & Jen (76:42)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-----------|------------------------------------------------| | 06:36 | Shannon’s wacky Amsterdam energy | | 09:01 | Gretchen FaceTimes Slade: "aging badly" | | 13:32 | Gretchen confuses "lethargic" & "cathartic" | | 17:47 | Emily’s mom guilt over Shane & kids | | 22:09 | Shannon & Gina try mushrooms | | 28:45 | Gretchen & Tamra swing set drama | | 31:26 | Shannon “high” at the maze | | 50:17 | Heather scatters her father’s ashes | | 59:13 | Gretchen brings back “fat talk” to Shannon | | 77:20 | Jen’s insecurities & Gina’s “kenough” moment | | 79:54 | Tamra’s advice on financial independence |

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Tone & Language

• Playful roasts, sarcasm, and comedic exaggeration:
  Ben and Ronnie keep the energy breezy, with a friendly but sharp irreverence for the Housewives’ endless drama.
• Lots of cross-talk, Bravo in-references, and running jokes (re: Spanx, gay culture, podcasting, parent guilt, and food metaphors).
• Empathy for genuine struggles is tinged with affectionate ribbing—never letting sentimentality linger too long before a punchline.

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Notable Section Transitions

• Spanx Conversation:
  Joking leads to real feelings—first laughter, then confrontation, and finally (sort of) resolution.
• Heather’s House Visit:
  Snark about old décor becomes a rare moment of emotional authenticity, ending with a textbook Bravo sentimental montage, promptly skewered.
• Jen’s Independence:
  Supportive moment that concludes with skepticism about her boyfriend’s fidelity—classic Crappens balance.

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Episode Cliffhanger & What’s Next

As the group prepares for more Amsterdam adventures—with fights scheduled for every evening—this part one ends with unfinished business, specifically around Emily’s homophobic-post confrontation and the remaining emotional baggage in the group.

• Teaser:
  "Congratulations, you've reached the end of part one of a two-part recap. For part two, go look for the recap that says part two." — Heather (80:25)

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Summary prepared by Watch What Crappens superfan podcast summarizer.

Transcript

[Ben Mandelker]

Welcome aboard Virgin Voyages, where luxury meets drama. Free sailing. As you know, the Real Housewives of Miami took a trip on beautiful Virgin Voyages cruise this season.

[Ronnie Chieng]

But we thought, why did the Miami girls get to have all the fun? So we're putting the C in SLC and seeing what it'd be like if our favorites from Utah went on the same boat.

[Ben Mandelker]

Today we're joining Lisa and Angie from the Real Housewives of Salt Lake City as they indulge in one of our world class restaurants. With Virgin Voyages, you'll experience the same delicious food and good times that these housewives are about to enjoy.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Remember, the cruises are all included, so there's no need to worry about hidden fees or surprise charges. Now let's see what Lisa and Angie are up to.

[Heather Dubrow]

Oh my God. This restaurant is amazing. I absolutely love the food here.

[Ben Mandelker]

May I take your order?

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah, I'll have some.

[Tamra Judge]

So how could you order soup? That is so rude of you.

[Ronnie Chieng]

At least be Greek. Soup.

[Heather Dubrow]

No, I said so.

[Tamra Judge]

Soup? Are you talking about soup, man?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I don't even know any soup, man. Why are you bringing soup into this?

[Heather Dubrow]

I said so.

[Tamra Judge]

Why are you being like this? I thought we settled everything, Lisa. I just want to have a lovely.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Appetizer in this delicious restaurant.

[Heather Dubrow]

I am so sick of being accused.

[Tamra Judge]

Of things I was trying to do is honest. So a lot.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Here.

[Tamra Judge]

Lisa, I brought back all the soup.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Bowls you gave me. Since we are obviously not friends anymore, they're in a crate for you to take home.

[Ben Mandelker]

What a meal. Virgin Voyages offers top notch dining experiences with menus curated by Michelin starred chefs. While we can't guarantee your friends will be as entertaining as Lisa and Angie, we can promise you'll have an unforgettable time.

[Ronnie Chieng]

From the Caribbean to the Mediterranean, Virgin Voyages takes you to amazing destinations in style. Make your next vacation truly fabulous with Virgin Voyages.

[Ben Mandelker]

Learn more@virgin voyages.com or contact your travel advisor today. Audible's Romance collection has something to satisfy every side of you.

[Ronnie Chieng]

When it comes to what romance you're into, you can't be pinned down. Unless you want to be. Here's your invitation to have it all.

[Ben Mandelker]

Fancy a dalliance with a duke? Or perhaps a sexy billionaire? Find a book boyfriend in the city and another on the hockey field. Or if nothing on this earth satisfies, you can always find love in another realm.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Hear modern rom coms from authors like Lily Chu and Ali Hazelwood, the latest romantasy series from Sarah J. Maas and Rebecca Yarros, and Regency favorites like Bridgerton and Outlander plus all the really steamy stuff.

[Ben Mandelker]

Your first great love story is free when you sign up for a free 30 day trial at audible.com crappins that's audible.com crappins.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Watch what crappins. Watch what happens. Who cares what happens when there's so much that crapping? Who cares what happens when there's so much that crappens? Hello and welcome to Watch what crap Ends, a podcast about all that crap on Bravo that we just love to talk about. I'm Ben Mandelker joining me today on this very spooky recap. It's Ronnie Caram.

[Emily Simpson]

Hi, Ronnie. Happy Halloween.

[Ben Mandelker]

Hello.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Happy Halloween.

[Ben Mandelker]

Happy Satan's birthday.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I forgot to get a little spider or some spider webs to put up on our crap is on the crap is on demand display and I feel like a total failure. I feel like I every year I feel like I add a little spiderweb to something or another. Oh, that's, that's spooky. I love those color blocks. Spooky color blocks. I will. I'm gonna wait for you to do some, have some sort of monologue, some rant during one of your Gretchen Rossi rants today, I will find a spider web gif and I will put it up on our screen. Welcome. How you doing, Ronnie?

[Ben Mandelker]

Good. What's going on with you?

[Ronnie Chieng]

Not much. It's Friday. It's Halloween. We have a very spooky show to recap today, which is a horror show that is. Oh, thank you. Thank you, audience. Thank you. The undead has risen up to applaud our decision today to to recap the Real Housewives of Orange County. So just a quick reminder, Monday is crappy hour. You all better be there because I feel like some Bravo news is going to break over this weekend. I just have a feeling it's going to happen. Someone's going to wear a bad costume tonight. Someone's going to be offensive. Someone's going to do something. We're all going to want to talk about it. That's going to be Monday at 5:30 on the West Coast. 830 on the east coast. That is our Bravo headline show. It's live. We do it on YouTube. It's also on Patreon. It's also on Instagram. We are just everywhere. We're taking over the world with crappy hour. Come join us. And of course on Patreon. Speaking of which, patreon.com watch crappins get access to crappings on Demand where you can watch us. And also we have a weekly bonus episode. We're going to record it after this, and we're going to probably talk about our, you know, Halloween plans and things like that. Ron and I went to a Halloween party, and so we'll talk about costumes and things like that, and who knows what we'll talk about? We could talk about something else entirely. Who knows? That's it. So shall we get into this madness? Ronnie, are you ready for it?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I'm ready.

[Ronnie Chieng]

The monsters don't like that. They don't like that.

[Ben Mandelker]

Let's do it. They added sound effects to our platform here, so I'm just playing with it. Yeah. Could you send me that sound effect that we've been using? Because I love it and I need to have some control, too. Okay. I've relinquished too much control on this show in the past three weeks. I'm sick of this set.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm sorry.

[Ronnie Chieng]

What. What sound effect? All I know is that there's been a very natural, almost cosmic reaction to Heather Debro's very funny comedy. I wasn't. She wishes she had that big of an audience. That was like an Oscar. That was like a. That was like the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion laughing at Heather Debo. We're reverting.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, you know.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Wow.

[Ben Mandelker]

What an episode. So we finally got our Gretchen stuff. How they ended up switching this at the end of the episode is pretty ballsy of bravo. I can't believe they did this. I don't. I'm not believing one second of this bullshit they're trying to peddle. But I guess we'll get there when we get there, eh?

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, we'll.

[Emily Simpson]

We'll.

[Ronnie Chieng]

We'll get there. We'll get there. I. I am bracing for this episode, but here we go. So it's Amsterdam. It's day three. The girls are getting ready. Tamara's putting on sunscreen on her back. Shannon is really leaning into her wackiness. It's time. It's time to have an intervention, I think. I think all the sins of this episode could be forgiven if all the women just gathered around Shannon said, shannon, it's too much. The sticking your tongue out and, like, through your lips and being unsteady as you put on Spanx or on a bike or walking around. It's too much. It's too much.

[Tamra Judge]

Not. No, because she's.

[Emily Simpson]

She doesn't have.

[Ronnie Chieng]

The thing is, she doesn't have to do that.

[Emily Simpson]

She.

[Ronnie Chieng]

She is crazy on her own, so she doesn't have to go that extra step. Right?

[Emily Simpson]

Like, she doesn't need to sell it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

She is.

[Ben Mandelker]

She is enough you're enough Shannon. But I think she is like this in real life. I really do think this is how she puts on Spanx and rides a bike. I don't see Shannon living any other way. Do you. Do you think, like, in real life, Shannon's like some ballet dancer who's walking around with grace and, you know, all that? I don't. I think she's a mess, you know? I'd love to see a mess. Listen, I love to see someone putting on Spanx. I guess. What can I say? I was into it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah. I just. It's. It's just a little bit too much. I do believe that that was actually her authentically riding that bike like that. That did not feel fake to me. That seemed like how I think that Chan would ride a bike. However, some of the other stuff, like the Spanx, like, you put on the Spanx every day. You know how to put them on. You don't have to stick your tongue out of your mouth and pretend like you don't know what you're doing. Right.

[Ben Mandelker]

I mean, I don't know. Spanx are hard. But here's what I'll say. I mean, Shannon riding the bike like that with an American flag on in Amsterdam. I mean, I just believe that's totally Shannon. And not only in an American flag, but, like, knitted ones. You know, one of the ones that look like you stitched at home, like, in a rocking chair, like, girl, yes, I do believe it, Shannon. I just do. I just believe that's her. And I. I love Shannon. You just keep on with your Spanx. So Gretchen is FaceTiming Slade, who's wearing a cowboy hat for some reason, and.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

She'S like, oh, hi. Are you going to a rodeo or what?

[Ben Mandelker]

And he's like, no, when you get home, you'll be a part of the rodeo.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

That was some really weird, premature, aging.

[Heather Dubrow]

Sexy guy thing to say.

[Ben Mandelker]

What happened to Slade? Slade is not aging well. I feel like that happens to a lot of, like, formerly hot people in the California sun. It just bakes the guys.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah. And his, like, just for men sort of light brown hair he has these days. I feel like he's, like, in the righteous gemstones.

[Ben Mandelker]

God, so weird that you would say just for men in this episode.

[Jen Shah]

Because.

[Ben Mandelker]

You know, that's how he is in every public bathroom he's ever in.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

However.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Gretchen's like, I feel better this morning.

[Gretchen Rossi]

I think I just had to have, like, a good cry, you know? Right? You know, a good cry. Like, I just had to sit down and be like, oh, my God, I've attached my wagon to sleep ox. Oh, God. And then I just cried and cried and cried and realized this is just my path in life. And now here I am.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Everyone's like, just move on. Just get over it. But trauma, grief, pain. That's not linear.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay, okay, Gretchen. So she's saying, yeah, you know, the stuff with her and Tamara was a long time ago, but it doesn't mean.

[Heather Dubrow]

That her feelings and emotions just disappear. Things can come up again, you guys.

[Ben Mandelker]

So let's keep talking about the same shit over and over and over, because no matter how many times she says she's willing to move on, she's not willing to move on. Nobody's willing to move on.

[Gretchen Rossi]

And.

[Ben Mandelker]

And I think it's just time to go, Gretchen. You know, just pack it up and go home. I'm tired of you, and I don't want to move on from you either. So just everybody go. I'm. I haven't forgiven you yet.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Okay?

[Ben Mandelker]

I need more time.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I mean, I just don't understand how Gretchen is just losing this battle because she has every. I feel like she has so much on her side. I think, like, every time Tamara says, 12 years.

[Gretchen Rossi]

12 years, she's been doing this to.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Me, I'm like, what has Gretchen been doing to you for 12 years? She's done nothing. Maybe she, like, the. The one thing that Gretchen did that I think was really, like, the bad thing was commenting on what's her face is Facebook. Like, that was the thing. Like, that was Gretchen's big infraction. But compared to, like, the stuff that Tamara has brought up about Gretchen on her podcast, I mean, Gretchen. Tamara's always had the larger platforms, had a platform for 12 years. Gretchen stands on a shoebox for a platform. That's the best that she can do. And yet Tamra said, like, she's tom and dig me. And yet still somehow Gretchen, who has really, I think, like, the moral high ground on this entire thing is just failing. Just failing. Well, moral high ground in terms of her arguments with Tamara. Not moral high ground in terms of her social media activity, but in terms of, like, all of this. How now when Gretchen is sitting here.

[Emily Simpson]

Talking about, like, well, it's not linear, but pain is grief, and pain is not linear.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It's just like, ma', am, ma', am, you're losing this battle, and you shouldn't be.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, you're coming on a show, and your only goal for the season is to fight Satan, and you can't Fight Satan like it's Satan. How are you getting the more of the audience's side on Satan's side you're fighting Satan? I mean, it's like the easiest. It's the easiest. Satan never wins, okay? I watch a lot of horror movies and stuff. That's the whole point. You fight Satan and Satan loses. I mean, he keeps coming back, but he always loses. And you can't even beat Satan in a horror movie. Like, you're failing Gretchen. Get the fuck out of here.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

So Gretchen's like, yeah, I'm just mentally exhausted.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm like, learn how to say please. It's not another thing I can just ask from Gretchen with her weird fucking talk.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I think you just get to a point where you mentally know it's not mentally.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's not that. I'm so sick of you. Why are you worried about where people are going?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Pee.

[Ben Mandelker]

Worry about your. Your pronunciation. Hate her.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Cratchers.

[Jen Shah]

Not you too.

[Ben Mandelker]

So she's over it because Tamara's never going to take true accountability. And I'm over it, and I don't.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Want to do that anymore. So Gretchen's like, yeah, well, Emily said Mimi was really lethargic for me to cry it all out.

[Ben Mandelker]

And he's like, yeah, it's not lethargic. Okay?

[Ronnie Chieng]

The one time I was grateful for Slade to say something, I was like, please, please, please. Can someone please correct Gretchen Rossi on lethargic?

[Gretchen Rossi]

It was really lethargic to get it out.

[Ronnie Chieng]

She just got lazier and lazier and lazier as she cried.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Slade says, you mean cathartic. And she's like, huh?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Cathartic? Is that the word? Yeah. Stupidity is my thing. I love it. Nailing it.

[Ben Mandelker]

So we go to. Speaking of. We go to Gina's room, and their room is disgusting, of course. Emily and Gina's room. And she's like, oh, my God.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Like, everything is so tiny in Europe.

[Ben Mandelker]

I know. You're not saying that lady with six children in a bedroom who, like, hung up a curtain.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Her storyline last season was that she hung up a curtain between the beds.

[Ben Mandelker]

I know.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh, my God.

[Ben Mandelker]

I did it for Europe. Right now you live in a shower.

[Emily Simpson]

So she's like, I'm almost horrifying. Oh, my God.

[Lisa Barlow]

Well, last night I couldn't even sleep. I was so exhausted.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Okay, well, that doesn't make any sense.

[Lisa Barlow]

Shane called, and then he's, like, so frustrated. I get it, because I've been in this situation. Annabelle had cheer practice and he had to go to pick her up, and Luke was just Losing it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So there we see a flashback of them speaking on the phone because basically Shane called up, and it's like that classic thing where the dad has to deal with the kids for the first time. And it's like, I don't know what to do because Shane, Luke started throwing food around. He's having a tantrum, and so now Emily's gonna cry about it in Amsterdam.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, but I think it's also kind of a normal thing. Like, if your spouse calls you and says, hey, what's going on? You're like, oh, my God, the kids are fucking nightmares today. Right? And then you're like, oh, God, I'm sorry, babe. Don't worry, I'll be back. Whatever. But he's like, yeah, he doesn't want to go to soccer.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

He doesn't want to do his homework.

[Ben Mandelker]

He started throwing food. And we hear Luke go, I didn't throw anything. And then, like, Shane comes back to the screen and he's got, like, spaghetti hanging off of his face. And he's like, oh, I just lost it. I lost it.

[Jen Shah]

It's like, oh, God, you make me feel so bad about it.

[Lisa Barlow]

What am I supposed to do? I'm in another country.

[Ben Mandelker]

He didn't call you a bad mother, for Christ's sake. He deserves the right to talk shit about his kids. Who else are you going to talk about him to? I mean, I would talk about them to everybody. You know, I would.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

The mailman would show up and be like, how's it going to dad? My kids are fucking monsters. How are you doing?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'll always remember the time I went to my friends and we got drinks at, like, on the rooftop of a hotel here in la. And there was. You know, there's a hotel. So there was this family. There were these kids in the pool and they were swimming.

[Emily Simpson]

And I went.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I was like. Walked to go to the bathroom or something. I was walking alongside the pool, and this mom, and she was like, this wealthy. Like, she was definitely, like, very wealthy mom in a bikini. And she just had this, like, Margarita in her hand. And she's walking towards me. I'm walking towards her. And the kids are saying, mom, Mom, Mom. And she's, like, not answering. And then they start going, barbara, Barbara. And every time that she's. They said mom. And every time they said Barbara under her breast, she just went, annoying, annoying, annoying. And I remember thinking at the time, like, that's hilarious. Look at this, like, rich mom who's so disconnected from her kids. Like, she doesn't even like, she's like. Probably doesn't even know what to do with them because she doesn't have her nanny. But now that I'm older, I realize, oh, she was. She was like. Like she was going through it. Like, I feel like that's not a unique thing. This was not some crazy, like, rich lady who is, like, disconnected from her kids. I feel like all my mom friends are constantly, like, annoying. And I feel like Emily should feel.

[Emily Simpson]

Okay to lean into that.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Like, you're allowed to be annoyed. I think she has so much baggage about her own mom. And she's complained so much on this show about, like, my mom was never there.

[Lisa Barlow]

She never called. She never showed up then.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Now she's, I think, painted herself in this corner where she feels like she has to be the mom that. That her mom wasn't. And now she. She worries that when she is, it has moments of being inattentive, that she's repeating a pattern. And I just want to be like, emily, it's okay. Enjoy some Stroop waffles. Your kid will be fine.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I think it's one of those things. I'm just surprised she's not getting to the point where I've gotten. Where you just get older and you start seeing like, my mom had a point. Just kidding. Just kidding.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I feel like, listen, Emily has wore it out my last nerve this season. But I just want Emily, if you're out there and listening, it's okay. It's okay. Enjoy Amsterdam. Shane's got it. And even if he doesn't have it, you'll. You'll come back, you'll fix it later. But please stop crying on your vacation because your kid had a tantrum.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, that's what kids do. He's doing his job. It's like crying that you're having a tantrum on this show, you know? You think Luke sitting at home being like, my mom's having a tantrum right now on tv? No, that's her job. You know, that's your kid's job. It's your kid's job to be a little asshole.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Eddie also probably knows that if he has a tantrum, he's going to get your attention and be like, should I come home?

[Ben Mandelker]

Should I come home?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I mean, yeah, don't give him the power. Okay?

[Ben Mandelker]

Also, you gotta love, like, a Real Housewife being like, I don't know why.

[Jen Shah]

My kid has tantrums.

[Ben Mandelker]

Does he have a tv? He learned it from watching you mother. You have, like, three in this episode alone. So Emily is like, yeah, Shane's never.

[Jen Shah]

Lost it when it comes to the kids.

[Gretchen Rossi]

So I don't know.

[Jen Shah]

You know, this makes me feel terrible.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

And she was like, oh, my God. Like, to watch him flounder, you mean?

[Ben Mandelker]

Gina breaks in to finish her sentence.

[Jen Shah]

She's like, yeah. And then for him to lose it. And I'm here. I'm just such a shitty mom. Like, I'm not even at home. I'm here. I'm here instead of being at home.

[Emily Simpson]

And she's like, emily, no, you have to take care of yourself, too, Emily, okay? And so does Shane. And you guys, like, you guys cannot let it break you guys, okay?

[Lisa Barlow]

But I think what's so hard is that this is a journey. It's a long journey. And it's not like you could just go to therapy. It's better, but it just makes me feel like I can't ever go anywhere. It's a long journey.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Like, you want to talk about a long journey? How do you. How about us watching? Okay, this is like, what? This is like watching a dashcam on an Uber all day. It's a long journey, and it's not fun to watch.

[Ben Mandelker]

And stop saying, you can't go anywhere. This is your, like, fourth trip this year. So Gina's. You know, Gina's trying to comfort her.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

She's like, you guys are going to be okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

So then now we get into vans to go places, and Shannon is about to run into a million bikes.

[Heather Dubrow]

So Heather's like, whoa, watch the bikes.

[Ben Mandelker]

So it's Heather, Gina, and Shannon in one van, and.

[Ronnie Chieng]

They are. So half of them are going to go on a swing set that is going to be high above the city. And fun fact. It was also, I believe, high above the place where I took a stroopwafel class when I went to Amsterdam, which then happened later in this episode. I basically felt like I was watching my life. I was like, if only I had a child in another room having a tantrum, this would basically be the Ben Mandelker story.

[Ben Mandelker]

I mean, basically, if there was someone standing behind the swing saying, take off your seat belts and push the swing harder, it would have been just like this.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, so. So half of them are going to do that thing, and then the other half are going to go. This is not. Though later in the episode is biking and shopping. This is swing. Swing setting.

[Ben Mandelker]

This is one of these is like, we're gonna do.

[Heather Dubrow]

We are gonna do shrooms. Like.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, this is like, clearly, the Amaze is one of those Instagram activation places where you Go and take cool pictures. And Heather is like, my daughter at.

[Tamra Judge]

Tufts told me that this is a cool place for young people. And I just hope that if I get high, I don't fall down, because I may be higher than the people on the swing set who are high.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Above in a building.

[Tamra Judge]

So I'm just saying I will be higher than people who are physically higher right now. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Amsterdam. Thank you. Okay, you're too kind. Okay, you have to stop. I have a joke. Okay, my turn, my turn. Still me making jokes. Audience.

[Ben Mandelker]

It'S time for a commercial. It's time for a crappin's commercial.

[Heather Dubrow]

Let us do shrooms together. Bottoms up, ladies.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Shannon and Gina take their little mushroom, and Shannon's like, I've never done mushrooms before. Is this the new Shannon Shannon?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

No, this is not the new Shannon. This is Amsterdam Shannon. And I'm just. I'm just trying little.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's no big deal at all.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Nothing wacky is gonna happen.

[Ben Mandelker]

With my face melting. Swallow it first, Shannon.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So then in the other van, the ladies are talking, and Jen's like, have.

[Emily Simpson]

You guys ever seen Shannon?

[Ronnie Chieng]

Have you ever seen her? I'm sorry.

[Emily Simpson]

Her Shenanigans, when she pulled up her dress on the way to the tulips. Remember when she pulled up her dress? Wasn't that hilarious?

[Ben Mandelker]

Guys, how have we not had Sheena doing an entire episode of her podcast and then putting out 10 episode clips on Instagram about the word shenanigans? I, like, pioneered that name, and I've been using that name for a long.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Time, and they're trying to come for.

[Ben Mandelker]

Me on the OC And I will not stand for it. Maybe I should be on the cast next year to have my say about this, because that is my name.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It's just, like, really hurtful because we spent, like, a lot of time coming up with shenanigans. And I remember I was at, like, the. The El Pollo Loco in West Covina, and I thought, oh, my God, my name is Sheena. And then you can, like. And then I want to go to Bennegan's after this and be like, sheena Bennigan's Sheena Bennigan's shenanigans. It just, like, came together. And so now, like, Shannon just doing it, it just feels like she's stolen it. But I'm, like, not gonna complain to Bravo because, like, I am a team player, and I am a people pleaser, and I just, like, want everyone to be happy, but it's, like, really hurtful. That, like, I spend this energy, like, being supportive of Shannon, but she hasn't once decided to support my podcast. It just, like, really hurts a lot.

[Tamra Judge]

That's right. It's my audience, and they're loyal to me.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Thank you.

[Tamra Judge]

I didn't even have to make a joke. I'm not going to be making any jokes today, because today I will be scattering the ashes of my father. No, Alfredo, No.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Shannon's van. So Shannon's like, wow, look at everybody.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I got new Spanx. Look, it hides the back fat.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, they're talking about when she was showing them the Spanx and stuff. And Emily's like, yeah.

[Jen Shah]

Gosh, she is so, so funny.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Yeah, she is funny.

[Gretchen Rossi]

She's a harder.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

She's a lot of work. It's hard to get into that today. Am I right? Try and get your penis draw in Spinks, my man.

[Lisa Barlow]

It's a lot of layers. It's hard to get through there. I mean, the Spanx kill me. They kill me almost as much as knowing that Luke might be having a tantrum right now.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I'm a bad mom.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Jen's like, I mean, is that even doing anything for her? What are those Spanx doing?

[Jen Shah]

And mom's like, no, it just redistributes. That's it.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Yeah, it just pushes her up here and into her armpits. It's like a big sausage.

[Lisa Barlow]

Yeah, it's like a can of biscuits. And then when you cut it open, it's like, boom, Boom goes the dynamite. And the dynamite is made of biscuit.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So they're laughing like, that's like, That's a funny idea.

[Ben Mandelker]

What a bunch of dicks, though. Like, honestly, I mean, teasing Shannon about her Spanx, I think is fair game, because that's like, Shannon's personality this season is like, I wear Spanx, but calling her a sausage and a. And a can of biscuits. I mean, especially Emily, because Emily's always like.

[Jen Shah]

You made me wear a size.

[Ben Mandelker]

Pair of jeans my size. How could you?

[Lisa Barlow]

Susan Bender.

[Jen Shah]

Susan Bender's a cuff fit as.

[Tamra Judge]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And the. The truth is, they'll all be wearing Spanx soon enough, because that's just. I mean, I.

[Ben Mandelker]

If they're not already. Who doesn't wear a Spanx? I mean, my God doesn't ever.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Let me tell you something. I had to put on a. I had to put on a. A tank top yesterday for. For my costume. Like, I went to Target. I got one of those, like, you know, like, Hanes tank tops. It's not flattering. And I Thought to myself, gosh, I think I could use some. I could use some man Spanx. I think I'm at that.

[Tamra Judge]

I'm.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'm ready now. I'm ready for the man Spanx around the chustle areas.

[Ben Mandelker]

No, I just like to thank the gay community for coming up with the word bear, because I just go with that. I'm like, I'm a bear.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Bare body. I don't have bare body. I don't. See, I'm not like, I don't have your body, and I don't have, like, otterbox. I'm just like, I don't know. It's. It's very frustrating. I don't fit into any gay category. And that was not me choking up, but in some ways, maybe I am choking up. That was just my voice.

[Ben Mandelker]

There is no category gayer than Bravo Podcaster. So, you know, put yourself to bed at night with that one.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'm a Bravo guy. Okay, so they.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm a Bravo Podcaster. There's, like, literally the only thing gayer than that is, like, a penis in a butthole.

[Ronnie Chieng]

That's. That is significantly gayer than that. I just want to say. Yeah, the only thing gayer than that is, like, being gay porn star. So, Jen, So that the swing set people arrive like, oh, my God, I.

[Emily Simpson]

Don'T know about this.

[Lisa Barlow]

And I was like, oh, my God, that's high.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Whoa.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And they're getting nervous because it's funny and, you know, it looks scary.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Tamara's like, that doesn't look that scary to me.

[Heather Dubrow]

The.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And so they're just, like, apprehensive about getting on it. And Tamara says, never thought about being a swinger.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Not my thing. But wait, an Amsterdam. Let's become a swinger. See, because the joke is not like.

[Emily Simpson]

We'Re going on swing set, but it's.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Like, when you say swinger, it sounds like you're having sexual parties.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Keep it. I didn't pay for an Alfredo to give me a damn chair, but it doesn't mean it wasn't funny.

[Tamra Judge]

Alfredo, do not padump your Tamra.

[Ben Mandelker]

He's sweating over there. Sweating over there.

[Heather Dubrow]

Okay, what did I tell you? What did I tell you you could do if anyone else tried to be funny? Good.

[Tamra Judge]

Good job. But dumpcha for me. Gong everyone else. Okay, I'll accept that.

[Heather Dubrow]

Reprimand. Reprimand.

[Ben Mandelker]

Madam Chair.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'll take it.

[Tamra Judge]

He was trying.

[Ben Mandelker]

So now the other ladies are like, oh, my God, Gretchen, you're gonna do the swing. You should do it with Tamara. That's crazy.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

But she tried to murder me on a bow.

[Ben Mandelker]

And so she's like, I'm basically being.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Set up on my murder cruise.

[Ben Mandelker]

So then we go. Emily's like, well, it didn't work.

[Jen Shah]

She tried to murder you. But she didn't. So now we'll give her a second attempt.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Emily is like, let's take a.

[Lisa Barlow]

Video of their final moment together. God, I'm wacky and hilarious.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So they're swinging, and it's funny, and Gretchen hates it. So Tamara is, like, pushing the swing to go harder and harder.

[Gretchen Rossi]

And she's like, stop it. Stop it. All I see are gay and trans people down.

[Jen Shah]

I can't.

[Gretchen Rossi]

This is not how I want to die.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Tamara, of course, is like, make it go higher. And Gretchen's like, she's been torturing me.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Mentally for years, and now she's trying to torture me physically.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, yeah, you know, it's like a wacky swing scene.

[Jen Shah]

It's crazy.

[Ronnie Chieng]

For a very long time.

[Ben Mandelker]

It goes on for too long. And then Shannon, Heather, and Gina arrive at their amazement, and Shannon's like, oh.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Stella must have found this on tick tock. Where is my daughter sending us? Wacky.

[Emily Simpson]

It's, like, trippy already. Whoa.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It's like, Gina, you're just in the lobby.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh, my God, there's, like, walls here. This is, like, wild and crazy.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So they're gossiping a little bit about how Tamara and Gretchen are spending time together.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

And Gina's like, I feel bad for. I felt bad for Gretchen's last night. I felt so bad.

[Ronnie Chieng]

She did bad. I think this is one of three this episode. She actually ended the season with, like, a really big. I feel.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, she really comes later.

[Emily Simpson]

Really, really big. She's like, this is it, you know, like, this might be my final season. So let's go out with the bang. I feel really, really, really bad.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, it was a really feel, really bad finale. Like, the big. All the fireworks going all off all at once.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Heather's like, well, Gretchen, on the.

[Tamra Judge]

Way home, she was so upset. She was crying and taking accountability for all her own actions. Isn't Gretchen a great friend? I love defending her.

[Ben Mandelker]

And we see a flashback of Gretchen.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Being like, I don't want to be the person that you guys are saying I'm being. I guess I'm not recognizing that I'm doing that.

[Heather Dubrow]

Well, Gretchen definitely doesn't like to apologize, but someone had to put the sword down first, and it feels like Gretchen is doing that.

[Gretchen Rossi]

The last thing I want to participate in are sword fights. If you Know what I'm saying?

[Ronnie Chieng]

So.

[Emily Simpson]

So Gina is like, well, maybe it'll be okay. But, like, also, I'm like, sick of likes that. They say they're gonna, like, move on, and then they both, like, take their digs when they're around us.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So then it's time to. At this point, Shannon is, like, watching them, but her mushrooms are kicking in.

[Emily Simpson]

And she's just like, huh? What?

[Ronnie Chieng]

And you hear Heather's voice.

[Tamra Judge]

Like, there's nothing wrong. Things have to move.

[Emily Simpson]

What?

[Ronnie Chieng]

Oh, what?

[Gretchen Rossi]

Whoa.

[Emily Simpson]

I'm high. I am high. Like the youth of Tick Tock.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

You guys, are those draw. What are those drums? Is this the Real Housewives music?

[Ben Mandelker]

Like, what?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Listen to it. Listen. You can hear it. Am I the only one hearing this? Gina's like, I did not hear that. I think Shannon's just fucking nods, man.

[Tamra Judge]

Shannon's brain is melting in real time. I don't hear the creepy cloud music of our theme song. I don't know what she's talking about. I said I don't know what she's talking about.

[Ronnie Chieng]

No, no.

[Tamra Judge]

This is a Heather joke, but dump your me, Alfredo. Oh, God. We're going to have to have a real talk when we get back to America.

[Heather Dubrow]

Alfredo, why are you sweating? Why are you sweating? Something's wrong with Alfredo. Someone help. Alfredo.

[Emily Simpson]

You just. Hi, Heather. Your high, Heather. The mushrooms are kicking in.

[Heather Dubrow]

Oh, okay, I'm back.

[Tamra Judge]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they go through this wacky maze, and there's, like, little doors. And Gina's like, oh, my God.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

It's like a doggy door, but for.

[Heather Dubrow]

A large breed of dog.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

This is claustrophobic. This is claustrophobic.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Oh, God.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh, God. I'd love to you. Oh, God. This is. It's. It's claustrophobic, but it's also like a big hug. It's like a hug from the walls.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Wow, I'm high. I am high right now.

[Ben Mandelker]

And there's a bunch of mannequins in one of the rooms. And Heather's like, oh, my God, Are.

[Heather Dubrow]

There real people here? This is a little creepy for me.

[Ben Mandelker]

Have you seen yourself? Imagine how the mannequins feel. They're like, why does she get to walk around?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I know who.

[Ben Mandelker]

Kim catralled her ass.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I know she learned the secret.

[Tamra Judge]

She did it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And then they go to a room where they. I guess the amaze has taken their faces and like, kind of AI'd them into some other kind of, like, versions of them. So it's like they don't. It's not them. But there's enough, like, there's enough, like, signals or like, signifiers to show that it is them. And so it's crazy.

[Ben Mandelker]

Basically their Instagrams.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, basically.

[Tamra Judge]

Heather's like, hey, I have too many wrinkles. Don't look. Don't look at the picture of me. They put wrinkles on me. That's terrible. I will adjudicate the amazing adjudicate.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, yeah, they. Heather is like some weird school marm with a bunch of. And she looks kind of like an onlyfans picture or like a porn picture.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Where they're like, I'm a teacher.

[Ben Mandelker]

And everyone else like, Shannon's actually looks kind of good. And they're like, wow, why does Shannon look so good? She has this big, like, poofy windblown hair. So they like her.

[Heather Dubrow]

But Heather's like, why do I get screwed in this whole deal?

[Ben Mandelker]

So then, let's see, we go to the lookout and the ladies are sitting down and ordering drinks and Gretchen, but, you know, whatever. So they're asking Gretchen how she feels.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Today, saying, I don't know, like, I can't expect something from you that you're not able to give me, Tamara. You know what I mean?

[Ben Mandelker]

And so Jen's like, well, what do you want to work out differently? But we should talk about you and Tamara again. We should have another whole meal talking about you and Tamara. That sounds great. I'm sure the audience is really down for that. Thank you so much, Gretchen. Thank you so much for all you bring to this show.

[Gretchen Rossi]

So, like, I lost, like, a lot of people in my life to cancer. And, like, I would just hope that, like, Tamara would say, you know what? Now that I'm dealing with that, with Teddy, I feel bad about it. Like, what was that? Did someone say, I feel bad? Go back to the maze.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Okay.

[Gretchen Rossi]

I just want to. I just want Tamara to say that she feels bad right now.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Tamara's like, oh, yeah, I do feel really bad now. Like, my heart breaks that, like, you know, now that you went through that. They have like, actually, like a vaguely human moment where Tamara is like, oh, I guess it was kind of shitty of me to make your life hell while your fiance was dying of cancer.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I guess that was shitty of me to call you out for cheating on your. Your cancer ridden fiance at the time. Yeah, Gretchen, I guess that was bad.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

And she's like, I'm so sorry, Kristen. I'm so sorry for hurting you during that time. It's like, well, thank you. Thank you for seeing that. Yeah, this is definitely the first time Tamara's actually heard what I had to say. And, you know. You know, it's unfortunate that it took her having to be in the exact same situation for have her to have any empathy.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Tamara pulls out the whole like.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Hey, can we sign a friendship contract?

[Gretchen Rossi]

Hey, Ch.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Chatgpt. I'm here talking to somebody who dresses like a murdered child beauty star, and she wants me to be nice to her. Is that fucking funny? Chatgpt. Chatgptch. What you want from me?

[Gretchen Rossi]

The contract hereby acknowledges the chaotic rekindling of a friendship between Tamara Judge and Gretchen Rossi. Both parties agree to refer from taking any kind of shots at each other.

[Emily Simpson]

So Gretchen's like, that's gonna be tough. And she's like.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And I was like, I think these.

[Lisa Barlow]

Two Ding dongs need to sign a contract because they should sign in blood. They should shut the up.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Emily, who is the one who exasperated their. Their piece? It was you. When Gretchen was being messy at the sleepover, you went and ran and told Tamara. You reignited it, and it was worse now than it was all season. You can't be like, these dig dongs.

[Lisa Barlow]

Need to shut up already, because you.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Were the ones who brought the Ding Dongs together. You were the ding dong unifier.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, that's what Emily does. She sets them against each other.

[Jen Shah]

And then she's like, well, why is everyone fighting?

[Ben Mandelker]

So then we go to the hotel, and Heather almost gets hit by a bike, and she's like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Heather Dubrow]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then Tamara almost gets hit by a moped, and Emily's like, always forget.

[Jen Shah]

About that bike path.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they talk about the swings and how much fun they were having, and then how much fun they were having on the boat. And they're like, why does this feel like we've been here a year?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I know. So then they're just like, now Tamara and Gina are walking, they all kind of, like, break off to do, like, little activities.

[Emily Simpson]

So Tamara's like, ah, Tina, I feel.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Like we should get back and pedal around. And then maybe I could, like, remind you that you're supposed to confront Gretchen.

[Emily Simpson]

About those homophobic Instagram posts.

[Gretchen Rossi]

You know, remember when I showed you that, like, two weeks ago? Like, you snooze, you lose. So come on, get to it.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

She's like, yeah, you know, like, you feel like you have it figured out, but, like, I keep going back to the post that you shared with me.

[Ben Mandelker]

And so we see two weeks earlier, Tamara showing Gina her phone and saying that somebody had made a thread that you know about all the anti LGBTQ posts that Gretchen has liked and stuff. So Gina's like, well, there's, like, a.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Big part of me that's still thinking I. And then there's, like, another part that's like, feel. And then there's another part of me that thinks, but you know what? Like, maybe it's not true. Like, I want to make. You know, I want her to make me feel better about this whole thing.

[Gretchen Rossi]

But I have questions for her too, but I'm not gonna ask them.

[Emily Simpson]

I'm just gonna have you ask them and then pretend like I had nothing to do with it. And Gina's like, I mean, I understand that this is, like, calculated on Tamara's part. And if there's one thing I do every single season on this show, I say I'm not gonna participate in these games anymore, and I'm not gonna do someone else's dirty work. So with that in mind, I'm gonna do Tamra's dirty work because, like, I'm upset and it bothers me. Okay? So, like, yeah, I'm not being manipulated this season.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I like this time.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Like, I totally understand. I'm doing Tamara's dirty work, so it's not doing a dirty work because I.

[Ben Mandelker]

Want to do it.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

So I' manipulated.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like, okay, so. But I do have to say Tamara does. At least when they say it, she's.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Like, oh, you mean you're going to talk about the best that sent you?

[Ben Mandelker]

So Tamara's not pretending she had nothing to do with it. I think Tamara just wants other people to also be there with her. She doesn't want to be the only person. She's like, why am I the only person that's mad about this? You guys should be mad about this with me. So she doesn't, at least to Tamara's credit, hang her completely out to dry.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Tamara is like, but don't.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Don't leave.

[Emily Simpson]

Don't bring it up tonight, okay? Because tonight I think Shannon has a fat schedule.

[Gretchen Rossi]

So let's give her.

[Emily Simpson]

Let's let her have it like, a pre fight before the big fat, and then, like, we'll have our big fat tomorrow night, okay?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I don't want this getting mixed up in the spanx fight.

[Emily Simpson]

Okay? Let's let the spanx fire have, like, its own night. And then, like, homophobia fight could be, like, the big one the next night. And there's also gonna be, like, some fish.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Let's make it last.

[Ben Mandelker]

So now we go to Emily and Heather in a van, and Emily's like.

[Jen Shah]

Do you have the ashes with you? Oh, I have them here in my purse. Sorry. It's a taco. It's a taco.

[Tamra Judge]

Alfredo. Never. Badamtcha.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Emily.

[Tamra Judge]

Never.

[Heather Dubrow]

Apology accepted. Apology accepted. Okay. Yes, I do have my father's ashes. He's here. I like to call this bag of ashes.

[Ben Mandelker]

Go. Wait.

[Heather Dubrow]

Go.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Wait.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Ashes.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's like this tiny little bag of ashes.

[Jen Shah]

Well, just means so much to me that you wanted me to be here. That is so sweet.

[Tamra Judge]

Well, part of the fun of having a really expensive town home in Amsterdam is that you get to show it to the poor people. I mean, if I just look at it, I mean, it's just like looking at a house. But if you show it to someone and you have a poor person with you, you get to really see how expensive this place was.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Am I right?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And Emily says that she's become close with Emily because they about their families together. So. Sounds good to me. That's a friendship. So she's like, remember how you and.

[Heather Dubrow]

Me the other day were talking about Terry and Shane and how irritating it is because they all take the kids side sometimes? Isn't that annoying? Gosh, being a mother. Am I right? Oh, hold on. Let me have a piece of this pizza that is dripping all over my purse. So casually.

[Tamra Judge]

The other day. It just. It's so funny. I mean, like, why is it that husbands always take the side of the kids? It was like such a funny thing happened. So Alfredo came in through the main door instead of the servants entrance. And my son said, it's okay, mom. And I said, what are you talking about, it's okay? Would you be okay if an elephant just walked through the front door? No. You have to be careful about who comes in the front door. And Terry said, heather, you're being a little irrational. I said, oh, so now you're gonna take the elephant side and Alfredo's side and the kid's side, and I'm just chump change.

[Lisa Barlow]

Am I right?

[Tamra Judge]

Am I right? Wow.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I don't know.

[Lisa Barlow]

Sorry. That was my team.

[Ben Mandelker]

Alfredo's changing it up.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It's the rival.

[Lisa Barlow]

Well, I. I heard we could all bring a percussionist on our trip. Since they.

[Jen Shah]

They wouldn't.

[Ronnie Chieng]

They didn't.

[Lisa Barlow]

We don't have a budget for glam, but we do have a budget for percussion.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So I just like the Cosby show about to begin.

[Heather Dubrow]

Sorry, what?

[Ronnie Chieng]

It sound like the Cosby show was about to begin. When you started playing that, I was like, you know, we allowed to mention the Cosby show is it? It's 2025.

[Ben Mandelker]

I mean, I think so. I don't know.

[Ronnie Chieng]

That was a joke. That was a joke.

[Tamra Judge]

That was a joke.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Thank you.

[Tamra Judge]

Oh, I almost missed it.

[Heather Dubrow]

Although I can't say I have all these beautiful, warm, fuzzy memories about my dad. I will tell you that we share a birthmark. And when I was little, I had this autograph book, and my dad wrote me a little note, and he said, no one else is going to ask you for an autograph, so I might as well remind you, you have an earmark in your. A birthmark in your ear, you fucking loser. So remember that.in your ear, and we'll be together forever. Love, dad. And that's why I hit myself in the ear constantly. Oh, the tinnitus.

[Tamra Judge]

Yes, I often will look back and yes, I will often look back at that autograph book, and I look at my dad's sweet message. And then I turn the page and I get angry all over again as I see that Wendy Malik wrote her.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Name in my autograph book.

[Tamra Judge]

How dare she? Is she that desperate?

[Jen Shah]

I just felt abandoned, you know, because I'd love to be able to call my mom and tell her everything that's going on with Luke and ask for advice, but I can't.

[Ben Mandelker]

So she talks about having, you know, terrible parents, so she can't ask her parents for advice on her children. So who do you ask?

[Heather Dubrow]

And Heather's like, well, that's why you get maids.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Heather is talking about how she feels.

[Tamra Judge]

Richard Marx.

[Heather Dubrow]

And no one tells you how to raise your child. Like Daisy Fuentes, husband.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Go on. Sorry I interrupted.

[Ben Mandelker]

She says that she's, you know, she finds herself upset and irritated. But, you know, at some point you have to realize, you know, your dad's just not capable of it, and he did the best he could. And, you know, are we doing the best we can? And Emily's like, yeah, you know, like.

[Jen Shah]

We'Re doing better than we had.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they're standing there outside the house. Cause they're just talking outside this house now. And this guy comes out and he's like, hello. Does no soliciting. And she's like, oh, hello.

[Heather Dubrow]

My parents used to live here in B. Are you in the garden? You don't look rich enough.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yes, that is me. I'm here. Welcome. My name is John Pierre, and nice to meet you.

[Tamra Judge]

I am television's Heather to BRO.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Oh, so. Oh, do you want to go on? You want to make films inside? I thought that was so cute. He's like, ah, I See television crew. This is very American. You want to make the films in here?

[Tamra Judge]

Like oh well, if you insist. I mean this does count as an IMDb credit, does it?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Does it not?

[Tamra Judge]

Okay, great.

[Ben Mandelker]

So he takes them in and she's like thank you.

[Heather Dubrow]

My mother is going to freak. Oh my gosh, you even kept her wallpaper. My mother loves green.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then we see a side by side of the room then and out, which is a little different. And one has a dark green fireplace and he's painted it and he's like, oh yeah, we changed a bit of the green though. We had to paint that fireplace because.

[Heather Dubrow]

Oh, the green before it was so toxic. So toxic.

[Tamra Judge]

If you ever come for my color of green again, it will cost you a lot. John Pierre.

[Emily Simpson]

Whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Tamra Judge]

By the way, did you find my posters? If anything goes in the attic.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Oh, we were wondering what was that about?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

You know what was interesting, we had.

[Ben Mandelker]

A dart board in the kitchen and.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

On the face over where you throw.

[Ben Mandelker]

The darts does was ladies face. That looks like she is on the.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

TV show Happy Place.

[Tamra Judge]

Like oh yes, yes, yes, yes. The Reba. The Reba bulletin board. I, I, my mom would get very upset when I would throw darts across the kitchen when she was trying to make lamb chops.

[Heather Dubrow]

In America, we call her Reba McIntyre.

[Tamra Judge]

So Heather says, I haven't been in this home for maybe 23 years. This home felt alive. We had dinner parties. We had very good energy. At one point in my life, this was the biggest house I'd ever seen. And now this is just something I would just gift to a maid. But it's still adorable and I'm so happy to be back here.

[Heather Dubrow]

Hold on, I'm having a touching moment. Let me FaceTime my mother.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Okay.

[Heather Dubrow]

She's not answering.

[Ben Mandelker]

Her mom's like, oh God. Heather's facing me from Amsterdam. God knows what she's up to over there. Like I want to see that ugly green fireplace, please.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Like I want to be taken back to the city with all the canals and the bikers give me 684 and a Honda. I'd take that over all those bikes.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they just go through the whole house. I mean, this guy's really nice. He lets them just go through everything.

[Heather Dubrow]

This was the walk in closet. This is where I first tried on my first pair of pantyhose. Oh, look at these. They fit, Jean Pierre, they fit.

[Tamra Judge]

This is the, this is where I got the call where I'd be starring in a 1996 pilot with Jane Leaves called have Fun Tonight. Oh, God. We were playing waitresses in a fast, casual restaurant with a boss who was wacky and played by Martin Mull. It never made it to air, but we had a great time.

[Heather Dubrow]

It was always fun. I hope you don't mind me telling you this story while I show you where I used to shave my legs.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Oh, please leave less DNA in my house, please.

[Heather Dubrow]

This is my house. John Pierre, back the off.

[Ben Mandelker]

Home stealer.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So she's like, oh, by the way.

[Tamra Judge]

Here are the ashes. I have the ashes of my dad right here in your kitchen.

[Ronnie Chieng]

He's like, okay, this is creeping me out a little bit. I do not want dead ashes in close to my. My lobster bisque that I am making.

[Heather Dubrow]

Okay, well, calm down, Jean Pierre. I'm just gonna do a facial for you with my father's ashes, okay? Just gonna do a little exfoliation.

[Ben Mandelker]

John Pierce.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Oh, my God. Please don't.

[Tamra Judge]

Hold on one second. John. Beer. I'm getting your call. Oh, it's Josh Altman from. You may be familiar with Million Dollar Listing Los Angeles. No.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

No.

[Tamra Judge]

Well, the news. The news is we have bought this house, and you can leave now. Thank you.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It's mine.

[Ben Mandelker]

So now they go outside and they sit at the canal. And Heather's like, maybe I need a little private moment. And Emily's like, oh, sorry, I'm already sitting here.

[Jen Shah]

But I guess I' right over here then. Okay, I'll just go right over here. Just pretend there's me a churro and then you. Okay, I'm not even here. Not even here.

[Tamra Judge]

Alfredo, don't you dare. Don't you dare. Alfredo, don't you dare. Alfredo, don't you. Oh, my God. He joked. He joked. He couldn't resist. Don't put dump to Emily.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Heather actually has a nice moment here.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's really nice. So she sits down and she takes the bag of ashes, and she just looks over the. She juts out her chin like she does when she's, like, doing a very serious scene.

[Heather Dubrow]

She's like, dad, just wanted to say you're a real sucker.

[Ben Mandelker]

She throws the. Throws the ashes in there, and she's done with it.

[Jen Shah]

Emily's like, that was beautiful.

[Lisa Barlow]

Do you mind if I call those ashes?

[Ronnie Chieng]

Asher, I have to applaud Heather.

[Emily Simpson]

Debra.

[Ronnie Chieng]

She did something significant. Actually, one would say historical. I don't think in the 13 years we've been doing this podcast, we've seen this before. She successfully put ashes into a body of water without having them blow in everyone's faces. Congratulations, Heather to bro. You had proper ash form.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, yeah, it was nice, it was nice. You know, she took him, she wanted to throw his ashes in a place where he was always happiest. And I'm sure her dad is in heaven. Like that woman just threw me into the street. Basically. She just dumped me into a piss filled canal in Amsterdam. Wow. You know what? I guess I earned that. I guess I earned that.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'm just waiting for one of those floating jacuzzi boats to come through again with some bachelorettes like.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Woo hoo.

[Ben Mandelker]

Bachelorette.

[Gretchen Rossi]

It's Cindy's bachelorette.

[Emily Simpson]

What are we breathing in right now?

[Ben Mandelker]

Just Shannon passes by.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Oh God, I got. I have a blister on my toe. I can't get it in the wall.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Heather Dubrow]

I got my toe in the water.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Whoa, whoa.

[Ben Mandelker]

Heather, Heather. I do not approve of your career choice.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

What's happening to me?

[Ronnie Chieng]

She gets possessed by Heather's dad. That's like a wacky 80s movie. It's like all of me.

[Emily Simpson]

It's like. Heather, I'm, I'm. I enjoyed this conversation, but I have.

[Ronnie Chieng]

To go to work.

[Emily Simpson]

Leaving at 6:30 and back at 6:30.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Bye.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Heather end up in the.

[Ben Mandelker]

How did she end up in the Gorgo wife swap episode?

[Emily Simpson]

Well, it turns out there's a tangled.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Web that we weave.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Speaking of tangled webs, There it is. Spooky, spooky frame on the crappin.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

On demand.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Wow.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh, I bounced off of. Bounced off of the wall there. Was that my padumpcha? Adeline? Are you my padumpta Adeline? Hi, Adeline, this is your mother. I'm in Amsterdam and apparently we're all freaking percussionists and I don't have one, so could you send a thing? Well, do we have something better? I don't need the sound of my Spanx coming out.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay.

[Emily Simpson]

Okay. That was from David.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I did not appreciate that.

[Emily Simpson]

Not appreciate that. Here lies Shadow Door, killed by an audience that's manipulated by my ex husband while he walks around on the beach with a slap. You liked it.

[Gretchen Rossi]

You liked it. They liked it.

[Tamra Judge]

Analy.

[Gretchen Rossi]

They liked my joke.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Woohoo.

[Ben Mandelker]

So back at the hotel, the ladies are getting ready and Jen is FaceTiming Ryan and they're talking about how hot she is and stuff and he's like, hey babe, I had two in my bed last night.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Excuse me, what did you say?

[Heather Dubrow]

It's like cats.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Two cats in my bed.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh my God, Ryan, that is so funny. Do we, can, can we get a. What does a Gen Badmcha sound Like, no one.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm out.

[Emily Simpson]

No one.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm out of Bo.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I guess I am one of the New York.

[Ben Mandelker]

I have literally no more to offer. Okay, hold on, hold on.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I only have the.

[Emily Simpson]

Wow. Okay. I was not expecting that sound, but that's okay. Was that my son passing out again?

[Ben Mandelker]

That poor guy. Why is he always passing out?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'm a little concerned, to be honest.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I'm concerned too.

[Ben Mandelker]

We see at the end of the episode, he's passed out in the army. They're like, oh, look, he made it to the army. And then he passed out. What the hell's going on over there? Somebody get that kid his iron.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, I know. Seriously. So Gretchen Facetime Slade.

[Emily Simpson]

She's like, Scott.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And then Skyler's like, I miss you so much, Mommy.

[Gretchen Rossi]

She's like, oh, my God, look at that voluminous Gretchen hair that you have. Wow, it's so lethargic to see you.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then we go over to Gina and Emily using a lot of hairspray. And then everyone goes to a seafood bar for dinner. And Shannon gets out wackily. She's like, whoa, whoa.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I gotta pull all my Spanx down. I gotta pull my Spanx down. Hold up, everybody. Oh, God. Heather is a good for nothing little.

[Ben Mandelker]

Brat who never does her chores.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And people are just walking in. It's like this seafood bar and everything. And it's Heather's like.

[Tamra Judge]

So everyone, Emily came with me today and we went to where my parents lived. And it reminded me that I should be really making another good effort to.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Get onto Real Housewives of Beverly Hills.

[Tamra Judge]

I'm just in a different class from all of you.

[Heather Dubrow]

It was amazing. It was the first time anyone in her price level has been there. So that was something great. You know, it was the first time that someone in her price bracket walks through those doors and wasn't handed a feather duster. So we are making progress.

[Tamra Judge]

Making progress. And here's what's crazy. We were standing outside filming our scene, and then a man comes out and says, do you want to come inside? Later on, I found out he is the Drake of Amsterdam. That's what we call Bashirte.

[Heather Dubrow]

It was almost like my dad said, come on in. Except he was nothing like my dad. He was actually there.

[Ben Mandelker]

Gave me attention.

[Heather Dubrow]

Told me hello and goodbye.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's actually nice.

[Ronnie Chieng]

God.

[Emily Simpson]

Wow.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Miss that.

[Emily Simpson]

I really, I have, I, I, I really, I have chills with that story. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for sharing that story with me. That was, like, really one of the most powerful Stories you could have ever shared with me. That was really beautiful. Thank you so much. Thank you.

[Tamra Judge]

Why is she still talking?

[Ronnie Chieng]

I'm just waiting for Bajamcha. Just hoping I get a Bajumbcha. Okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

I guess Alexa's gonna kill you.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Gretchen's like, I think that was so cool for Heather. To me, that's definitely divine intervention.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, of course, Gretchen's like, it's Jesus.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

It did it, girl.

[Ben Mandelker]

They stood out on somebody's patio with cameras. Okay, leave us out of some things. My God. Jesus was like, can I have one day? Can I just have a break? I can't even have a break while you guys are vacationing in Amsterdam, for Christ's sake.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, seriously, let him focus on other things.

[Emily Simpson]

Well. Well, since we're all having a nice dinner, I have something I'd like to bring up. Because Gretchen told me that when you guys were driving to your swing, I came up in conversation and in a way that I didn't really appreciate.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So we see a flashback to them having their Spanx conversation right after.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Gretchen's like, I just hope me and Tamara can be friends and just, like, stop doing this to each other. She's like, oh, my God, everybody was calling you fat in the car.

[Ben Mandelker]

Shut up, Gretchen. So she's like, how.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

How is she ever gonna get laid if they were saying, yeah, how is she ever gonna get laid if they have all these space and it's like, when you got it open, it's like popping open a box of biscuits.

[Heather Dubrow]

Sounds like, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Who said that if I was made out of biscuits, I would eat myself? Everybody knows that.

[Emily Simpson]

Are they? Question. Is this the Pillsbury brand of biscuits? Because I actually do not approve of their ingredients. I prefer more of a natural biscuit. And if it were. If there were. If I knew the source of the biscuits, I wouldn't be so mad. But I. I am concerned that this is. This is a Pillsbury Doughboy situation. I'm just. I just. I cannot get behind that.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

And Gretchen's like, yeah, like, Emily was. Said that. So it's like she fat shaming you.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, my God. Look, I think the ladies were being assholes, especially Emmy Emily for the. For that comment. But, Gretchen, you're. Aren't you trying to, like, be friends with everybody? She's just so bad at this. Gretchen's just really bad at. This is my only point, right?

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Shannon's like, well, I was told.

[Emily Simpson]

You guys said, no guy is gonna wanna be with me because I wear spanx and all that does is redistribute the fat.

[Gretchen Rossi]

And Trevor's like, no batch. No, we never said. You said no guy ever wants to be with you just cause of your personality. Totally different thing.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Well, it sounded like you accused my fat of being the socialism of fat. Just redistributing themselves to everybody. And that's just not how Spanx works. Work. And you can say whatever you want about me, but how dare you come for Spanx. How dare you.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh, my God. The visual of Shannon just, like, poof. That's like. There's, like, no defending this. Like, this is, like, nuts. That's. But that's hilarious to think of, like, biscuits, like, popping open. Like, that's, like, hilarious.

[Jen Shah]

You told her about the can of biscuits.

[Ronnie Chieng]

As Emily. As if she is not the messiest person on this cast.

[Lisa Barlow]

I can't believe you told someone what we were saying behind their back.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I mean, look, Gretchen's annoying me for doing this, but she's not wrong. And also, you're right. Yeah. The rest of them are even worse, Especially Gina and Emily. They're like, the worst.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I think what's bad with when m. When Gretchen does it, she always. She carries the bone as if she weren't part of the messiness that was happening behind.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's right. And also, it's just.

[Ronnie Chieng]

That's.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's just means, like, it wasn't great when they said it, but they were kidding. I'm not gonna stand up for them because it was shitty what they were saying. But I think we're doing in the spirit. Like, isn't fat? Isn't Shannon great? And Gretchen take it back to hurt Shannon's feelings. So it makes Gretchen the hurtful one, if that makes any sense.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah. Gretchen was actually making it sound like it was way worse than what we saw. Like, it was like she's trying to. It was like, you're critical.

[Ben Mandelker]

Calling you fat.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, it was like, it was sort of shitty of Emily to say some of the things she was saying. It was hypocritical. But ultimately they actually were coming from a place of, like, God, we love this crazy lady. And Gretchen made it. Ran back and made it seem like it was way worse than it was, which is. Which is also shitty.

[Emily Simpson]

And so Gina's like, sometimes with Gretchen, she tries to act, like, very pious and, like, she's above everything, but then she's, like, causing problems. I'm. I'm sorry. Did someone say that there was pie? Can we get that before the fish? No, fish. Pie. Oh, that's different.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Well, when it comes to me, I can make fun of me, but especially the last year, you know, Emily, when you had your issues, and she's like.

[Jen Shah]

Oh, well, I wasn't talking about you specifically. I was talking about business. Biscuits being in a can and popping.

[Lisa Barlow]

Out of a can.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay, just say you're sorry, Emily. Miss. Like, why don't you just apologize?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

It's like, well, no guy's gonna want to be with Shannon because she's gonna have to pull all the Spanx out. Tamara's like, I didn't say that. I mean, I always say that no guy's gonna want to be with Shannon, but it doesn't have to do with Spanx. Has to do with your alcoholism.

[Emily Simpson]

I mean, we were very much, like, talking about Shannon. That's. That's for sure.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Yeah, but. And the Shannon definitely has a right to know what her supposed friends are.

[Emily Simpson]

Saying behind her back.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So we see the flashback again of. Of what was being said, and Gretchen's.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Like, that's not very funny. It's not very nice.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Like, all they said was that she's wearing so many Spanx that it's hard to have sex with her because you have to take off a lot of layers.

[Ben Mandelker]

And the can of biscuits and the sausage, like, they weren't great. I just wouldn't repeat that.

[Tamra Judge]

Right.

[Ronnie Chieng]

But it's not the word. Like, it wasn't the worst. Well, I mean, I feel like the. I mean, look, I don't want to defend this stupid scene, but, like, I think an argument can be made that they were saying that the nature of Spanx is that you squeeze everything together, and the moment you take the Spanx off, everything pops out and. And everything. I don't know if they were specifically saying, look at Shannon. She looks like a big piece of dough that's been molded into a corset, you know?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, but also Gretchen. Also Gretchen. You know, just an added layer. Gretchen being like, well, her friends were.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Talking about her, and she has the right to. She has the right to hear everything that was said. Head.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's like, didn't you just get someone kicked off this show because they repeated something you said to them at dinner?

[Ronnie Chieng]

Absolutely.

[Ben Mandelker]

You hypocrite. Not that it's a shocker that Gretchen would be a hypocrite, but there you go.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Emily says, okay, lawyer, speaking from.

[Lisa Barlow]

My perspective, and Jen was there. There was no malicious intent.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And Gretchen.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Emily, you just said scratchers.

[Lisa Barlow]

Shut up. Actually, no, I'm gonna say Gretchen. I'm gonna make That r a little bit longer and turn it to an end, because I may have.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Gretchen, shut up.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Oh, my God. You just can't be called out about anything.

[Jen Shah]

Really, You. You really. You're gonna piss me off, and I'm gonna fucking lose it on you. Listen, Shannon, you're my friend. I love you very much. I also love biscuits. And if I said something that hurt your feelings, that was not my intent. It was funny. Okay? We started it by talking about how funny you are.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

And she's like, well, okay, well, thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much.

[Jen Shah]

We love how you, you know, you look like you're about to be baked into a delicious breakfast treat.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Well, I appreciate that.

[Ben Mandelker]

Thank you so much.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

This is why I love Emily, because we can have these discussions and I can say you hurt my feelings, and.

[Ben Mandelker]

Then she will literally order me biscuits at the table.

[Emily Simpson]

I'm just glad I didn't. Didn't explode like a can of biscuits. Oh, I guess that's. That's my punch.

[Ben Mandelker]

Thanks a lot, Sophie. God damn it. So back at the table, Shannon's like.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Well, I'm gonna go to the restroom. I might be a while unwrapping myself for Spanx.

[Ben Mandelker]

So she leaves, and Jen's like, okay, but pull your shirt down, Shannon.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Shannon, pull your.

[Ben Mandelker]

And she stands up, and there's like, a big price tape pat tagging the knockover skirt.

[Gretchen Rossi]

She's always such a hot mess, but.

[Emily Simpson]

I'm the hot batch.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Emily is like, okay, don't make.

[Lisa Barlow]

Fun of her right now. We can't. She can't take anymore. That's it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So now it's day four. It's time for a final day in Amsterdam. And first they're going to start off by doing split activities again. Biking or shopping.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So Jen goes to get Shannon, and Shannon's like, I'm ready.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I'm ready to go.

[Ben Mandelker]

And she's still in her pajamas. And Jen's like, there's just something about you. You just do it for me, Shannon. You really do.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

You were just hilarious, Shannon.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then the others, Tamara, Gina, Jen, and Shannon are getting on bikes.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

So Gina's like, oh, my God, you guys. Like, I look like I'm riding my bike to school.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Honestly, you look like you're going to Hogwarts right now.

[Tamra Judge]

No.

[Emily Simpson]

Gretchen's like, oh, my God, I love that author.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Gina's.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

That's the only book I read.

[Ben Mandelker]

And Tamara, I'm sorry, Gina's doing this thing the whole episode. I don't know if you noticed, but every Time she says something in confessional, she just starts cracking up at herself. Like, she's not even saying anything funny.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

She'll be like, oh, my God, I look like a little girl going to school.

[Ronnie Chieng]

She is like. And she's, like, really highlighting her front teeth, too. Like, she is just. She is delighted with herself. And I say this as someone who often laughs at my own jokes, too.

[Ben Mandelker]

Which is okay, but at least we legitimately laughed ourselves. She's, like, fake laughing at herself. It's bizarre. Like, she knows it's not funny. She's just trying to, like, yeah, I'm.

[Emily Simpson]

Gonna sell you guys. Fake it till you make it. Oh, my God, you're being fake.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So they are trying to bike, and.

[Emily Simpson]

Gina's like, they take, like, cycling to a whole nother level here. Like, you have be, like, freaking, like, what's his name? Lance Armstrong. No, wait. No, he's natur. Wait. No, he is a bike. Okay, this is. Honestly, Ronnie. This is like, one of those moments where I'm, like, not only, like, laughing. I'm laughing a lot because, like, the Lance Armstrong, Neil Armstrong mix up is, like, legitimately, like, so funny to me. Like, I almost feel bad by how funny it is. Neil Armstrong, Lance Armstrong. Am I right?

[Ben Mandelker]

Gosh. Such a. I believe that you rode a bike. I do not believe that you rode it to a school. So then Heather, Gretchen, and Emily wrote.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It into a tree. I think she wrote it into a tree.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Heather, Gretchen, and Emily are arriving to go shopping.

[Heather Dubrow]

Now there's, like, love some retail therapy.

[Ben Mandelker]

So they try on some sunglasses, and, you know, it's like, all fun and games. And they're asking Emily about how things are at home.

[Jen Shah]

And she's like, well, Shane sent me pictures of Luke, and he'll put, like, everything. Everything's okay now, hanging out on the couch. And I guess it's kind of his way of saying, I'm sorry. But, you know, he's saying, like, sorry, we're stressed out and yelling on the phone or whatever.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So it's probably also his way of saying, like, actually, everything's cool now, so go enjoy yourself.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. She's so r. And she says, you know, it's going to be a lifelong struggle with Luke. I'm sorry. Is there a child in the country that doesn't have tantrums? Like, why they don't want to go somewhere? I just. She's making me crazy with this. I don't even think.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I mean, look, I also. If he's on the spectrum, I'm. You know, I Also don't want to. Well, but we don't know what his diagnosis.

[Ben Mandelker]

She said his diagnosis. She said it wasn't. He's not on the spectrum after all that he's got. She listed him a couple weeks.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, she listened well, either way, I, I mean, I do. It does sound like it will be a lifelong journey, etc, but like, actually, I don't know what point I'm making. I'm just talking. I'm just talking. So Emily is like, oh, I was so stressed out.

[Lisa Barlow]

But I, I, I was like, do I need to go home?

[Tamra Judge]

Yes. It's hard to go back to your home. So small, so small. But you always have to remember, how.

[Ben Mandelker]

Do you even find it?

[Heather Dubrow]

You know, I wonder how people, when they're sitting in an airplane, they say, look, there's my house. Like me, you know, as we see.

[Ben Mandelker]

From, from a town away.

[Heather Dubrow]

But how do you do that, Emily.

[Tamra Judge]

When you go onto Google Maps, do you ever say to yourself, why do they even bother putting my address on here?

[Emily Simpson]

Right?

[Tamra Judge]

I mean, it's barely in a house. I mean, does every blade of grass get a mentioned on Google Maps now? Am I right?

[Heather Dubrow]

Google craps just have to go on for all the crappy little houses. Use a micro camera.

[Ben Mandelker]

Whoa.

[Jen Shah]

I was thinking maybe I should go home.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's like, whatever.

[Heather Dubrow]

Get a nanny.

[Emily Simpson]

Me.

[Jen Shah]

She's like, oh, God, she always talks me off the edge with my kids. I appreciate that.

[Emily Simpson]

Of course.

[Heather Dubrow]

I love you, Emily Simpson.

[Tamra Judge]

That is your name, right?

[Ronnie Chieng]

So now the other ladies are in the park and Shannon. This is actually a little stressful because Shannon was biking like crazy. Now the thing is this. I feel like Newport beach and Orange county is awful of bike paths and everything, but I guess Shannon just doesn't. Maybe Shannon has, like, not wanted to get back onto a bike, right? Like, ever since David Bedor essentially strapped her to a peloton and was like, if you want to, if you want to save this marriage, start pedaling. He's like, happy birthday.

[Ben Mandelker]

Here's a peloton that was so horrible. And when he strapped her feet, I'm not laughing that he bought her that. I'm just laughing that at that scene because she strapped her feet into the peloton and then couldn't get out.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I just was staring at the cameraman for help, and he was like, nope, we're gonna film this.

[Ben Mandelker]

Classic. So, yeah, this is where she's wearing her, like, knitted American flag shirt and just driving like an idiot, like, being the most American American on the road. And this is Serious. Like, everyone's going really fast, and she's doing like a wacky Shannon scene.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And they're in, like, a park, so there's pedestrians too. Like, I really thought she was gonna crash into someone. I mean, they already crashed into a boat last episode.

[Ben Mandelker]

She crashed into about some. Yeah, she don't.

[Heather Dubrow]

Don't put everybody else in this.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It was shad on B door. If you ever loop.

[Tamra Judge]

Does this jacuzzi have a second floor, by the way? Does it have a second floor?

[Ronnie Chieng]

No.

[Heather Dubrow]

Okay, guys, I just searched on my telephone and there is a waffle place where you can make your own druggie waffles. We should go. We love drug waffles. Now we are youthful. Hey, everyone.

[Ronnie Chieng]

One.

[Heather Dubrow]

We are cooking. These stroopwafels will be busting.

[Tamra Judge]

I can't wait to tell one of the Josh's from Bravo's Million dollar listing. Remember that show John Pierre and tell them that I'm doing something wacky.

[Ben Mandelker]

So the stroopwafel guy is like, oh, stroopwafel itself from the 1800s. It was called Poor man's Cookie.

[Heather Dubrow]

Oh, God, we should have brought Gina.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Emily does actually.

[Lisa Barlow]

She goes, you're in the wrong place.

[Tamra Judge]

Why is that?

[Lisa Barlow]

He said poor man's Cookie. Heather.

[Tamra Judge]

If you're making a joke, I.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Am not amused because I'm deeply uncomfortable with the concept.

[Ben Mandelker]

I didn't know this about stroopwafels. They called them the poor man's cookie because the baker made it from leftover cookies and leftover bread. What the hell?

[Ronnie Chieng]

It was like leftover. Leftover, like, ingredients that they just. Because.

[Jen Shah]

So what do you do?

[Ben Mandelker]

You crumble them all up, make them into a ball, and then put them with some caramel and just flatten it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Well, delicious. I took a class. I made a delicious strip waffle. And I don't know, maybe back in the day, maybe in 1800s, they did use, like, leftover cookies or something. But it was essentially a very simple, like, flour and sugar kind of recipe where you add, like, water and an egg. I don't even know if there was any leavener in it. I don't remember. Maybe there's some baking soda, I think.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, no, she got.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Sorry.

[Heather Dubrow]

Lava.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay, so I don't know if there was like, 11. No, I don't think there's a leavener. Because they don't rise, Right? You squish them, they don't really rise.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah. And so then you. You make.

[Ben Mandelker]

Isn't that what lavender does? It helps it rise.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, I don't think you, you. I, I don't know. Sometimes you may even need it for something like a waffle. But like, either way, I, I agree. I, you, Then you put it in a special dedicated strip waffle machine that you saw and they were. I, I wish I had the, I have the recipes somewhere in my things. But like you, you cook it for like a very specific number. Like my instructor was like, some people say you do it for 1 minute and 19 seconds. Others say 59 seconds. Like a really weird. Like, like I'm below deck when they say it's 1:23pm it was like a really weird number. And then you, you open it and then you have this thing. It's almost like one of those, one of those like, like a scraper that you scrape. Like a, like a sticker. What do you call those things? You know, the scrapers. Like the metal scraper thing. You slide it under and then you have to. I think, I think you, maybe you flip it or. I don't remember what's. But you put the caramel on it and you close it up and. Oh, you split it in half. Then you put the caramel on it. This is the most boring retelling. Apple street waffle. I'm sorry, everyone. This is not.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's made it more difficult than the damn stroopwafel.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I should have been, I should have prepared my pontification and I'm doing it on the fly and it's just really not killing it.

[Ben Mandelker]

But you're doing great. I'm following, I'm following you.

[Ronnie Chieng]

But your little scraper, you actually, the little waffle thing, it actually splits in half. And then you put the camera on that, you close it back up again and then it's like, oh, okay, fabulous right now.

[Ben Mandelker]

But they're also your teeth. I'm surprised that you like them so much cuz you're so teeth health conscious. Like, you take really good care of your teeth and those things are terrifying to me. I mean, stuff.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Oh, they're not like chewy like that. They're like. It's like a soft caramel. It's like a soft, it's like, it's.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like whenever I have them on the airplane. Who's a Delta that gives you those? Oh, United. Yeah.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Oh, no, no, no, no. But it's like a soft, luscious caramel. It just sort of like. But you like, you bite it.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm gonna eat my face off.

[Ronnie Chieng]

I literally almost bought like, it was so good. I almost like bought myself a strip offel machine. And I was like, I cannot. I am. I am okay with a single use appliance, but even this, I have my limits. That being said, if someone wants to donate a strip waffle machine to the Mandel Kerr Kelly household, I will not say no, because I cannot.

[Tamra Judge]

In my own.

[Ronnie Chieng]

In my heart of hearts, I cannot buy my own one. But if it just arrived, then I know that I was not being ridiculous. Yeah, watch me get, like, 10 stroopwafel machines now.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yes.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Do it, Ben.

[Heather Dubrow]

So Heather's like, poor man, rich, Poor man's waffle. Rich man's waffle. I don't care. It's a waffle, and I'm not touching it.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And then she tries to be relatable.

[Tamra Judge]

She goes, I mean, it's so good.

[Emily Simpson]

And I.

[Tamra Judge]

And I made it myself. What was that thing from Shake and Bake? And I helped, right? Isn't that how it goes? You know, just give me a line that's relatable. You know, the poor's watch Shake and Bake commercials, right?

[Ronnie Chieng]

They eat it all the time. Time.

[Tamra Judge]

Right. Alfredo. That was terrible. The audience laughed before you could even do your badamcha. I mean.

[Emily Simpson]

Oh, no.

[Tamra Judge]

It's Alfredo. Oh, dear. His hand got stuck in the stroopwafel machine. That explains it. I. Okay, someone get him some bomb.

[Heather Dubrow]

Alfredo exploded. All right, give me a new Alfredo. Get me a new Alfredo.

[Tamra Judge]

Oh, so sad.

[Ronnie Chieng]

It's parting words.

[Ben Mandelker]

So now we go back to the other ladies having a picnic in a park, and Gina's like, oh, my God.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Jen, I saw your Instagram, and, like, I'm so proud of you posting a post without rain. I'm like, you're so proud. I feel so proud, Mom.

[Ronnie Chieng]

This was actually hilarious because, like, Gina just basically says, like, I saw your Instagram, and I was so proud of you. And then we see the footage of Jen doing a workout, and I was like, what is Gina talking about? It was like, Jen doing a hotel workout. I'd forgotten the larger context, and she hadn't said it yet that, like, oh, yeah, Jen is working on having a solo content. It's just this. This arc that they introduced last episode and are now wrapping up this episode. So but at first I was like, why is. I was like, this is. This is how sad Gina is that she's just, like, proud of a hotel workout when she sees one on Instagram.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's the new wave of feminism. It's like, wow, you have your own Instagram account now. You work out on your own Instagram. Account. Now it's like burning a bra. And she's like, yeah, she did it.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

It was just her.

[Ben Mandelker]

And she's like, oh, my God. Thank you, Gina. Thank you so much.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

You know, because when you said, I.

[Ben Mandelker]

Need my own account, at first. First I was like, what the are you talking about, Gina?

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

What the are you talking about?

[Emily Simpson]

And.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And, yeah, we see a flashback to them giving her a pep talk about posting your own content.

[Emily Simpson]

You know, it's almost like Ryan's like, a little bit of a safety net for you, you know, Kind of like Travis's balls.

[Ben Mandelker]

He's a little bit of a safety net. She was living in a parking lot. Yeah, he's a little bit of a safety net.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

And it's like, yeah, like, sometimes I feel like it. It's in the way. Way of you developing that inner confidence. Yeah, well, you know what?

[Ben Mandelker]

Sometimes they get in my head because, you know, Ryan has a very colorful past.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Yeah, he was a playboy for a long time to send me stick pictures.

[Gretchen Rossi]

Pretty good mean when you need her.

[Ronnie Chieng]

So Jen's like, yeah.

[Emily Simpson]

And sometimes I think, am I gonna be enough?

[Ronnie Chieng]

No, the answer will be no. So Gina says, yeah, you need to.

[Emily Simpson]

Feel like you're enough. You need to be ken off. Remember, Bobby?

[Ronnie Chieng]

And Jen is like, yeah, like, when.

[Emily Simpson]

I'm 72 and shit's falling and things like. And we're still like, okay, like, I'm still your girl. Like, I'm still here. I'm still her for you, right? I want to feel that way.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, you can feel that way. Maybe not with Ryan, though.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's like a piece of pizza looking at me straight in the face and being like, you only want me, right? No, I want all of you. That's not how this works. I'm not eating one piece of pizza for the rest of my life. Get the fuck out of here. Get into my belly so I can move on to the next.

[Emily Simpson]

This is.

[Ronnie Chieng]

And actually, I. I kind of like this micro moment because she's talking about how she feels like, you know, I still feel like a young woman, but I know I don't look like a young woman anymore. It makes. And they're all like, yeah, we all have insecurities.

[Emily Simpson]

And Shannon's like, no, that's. That's a realistic insecurity.

[Ronnie Chieng]

We've all been through it. We've been.

[Emily Simpson]

We're divorced women, and at one point, we're marrying the person we thought we'd be spending the rest of our lives with. And then another moment we're trying to be Wacky on a bike while your friends call you a can of biscuits.

[Gretchen Rossi]

So, yeah, I'm a little insecure.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, yeah. My pizza comment wasn't even like, all.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

Of them, like, oh, yeah, you get.

[Heather Dubrow]

Some guy, they're all gonna cheat on.

[Ben Mandelker]

You and leave you. I don't mean everybody, but Ryan specifically. Yeah, I just. I just look at Ryan like. Like, I think, yeah, he's. Yeah, he's like a sex addict. I don't think he's gonna be. I think he's gonna cheat on you. I think everybody knows he's gonna cheat on you. He was just sending pictures, like dick pictures on accident to your friend last year. So. Yeah, I. I don't know that I would trust that.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Yeah, I really don't. But there's also a part of me that says, you know what? Have fun with him while, you know. Yeah, I know this is.

[Tamra Judge]

So.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm not necessarily saying dump him. I'm just saying you got to kind of know what you're buying, you know?

[Tamra Judge]

Right.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Like, there's. It's like a little up, but I. There's part of me that says, you know what? You know, it's going to. You know, it's going to eventually, like, the bottom will fall out, but in the meantime, you like him, he likes you, enjoy, and then you'll figure it out later. And I know it should be more like. Like, leave him and go to someone who, Who. Who sees you for you and loves you for you and will always want to be there for you. And I feel like, largely, yes, that's how it should be. But there's a part of me that says, you know, at this point, I'm. I can't. I can only, you know, throw the pizza against the wall so many times. So just. Just go and have fun. And then you'll. You'll. You'll cross that bridge when. When he has sex with it. Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I'm. I don't. I don't know. But good luck.

[Tamra Judge]

Good luck.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Good luck.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

So Tamara's like, yeah, you need to establish yourself financially.

[Emily Simpson]

Okay.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

You know, you don't want to be dependent on some man.

[Ben Mandelker]

Which I agree. She's like, pay for your own kids, you know, and then you'll. You won't be so stressed out that he's leaving you all the time, because one of the reasons you're so stressed out that he's going to leave you is money based. So if you're okay on your own, you know, which I think is good advice. And Jen's like, well, it's amazing to have a real conversation with Tamara without snark.

[Gina Kirschenheiter]

I mean, I just wish she could.

[Ben Mandelker]

Do this more often. And I just love this Tamra. Kind of want to hug her. God, I want to hug her.

[Tamra Judge]

But I won't.

[Heather Dubrow]

Congratulations, you've reached the end of part one of a two part recap for part two. Go look for the recap that says part two.

[Ben Mandelker]

See you over there, suckers.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Watch what Crappens would like to thank its premium sponsors. Ain't no thing like Allison King it's always a party on Alice Alison Block.

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You can't have a burger without the Berg.

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All.

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Olivia Williamson.

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She sure is swell. It's Raquel.

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Yes.

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Cast a spell with Shannon Spellman. Let's share with Sharon Eldridge.

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Darn Skippy, it's Tippy. And our super premium sponsors She's VV VIP It's Amanda V. Can't lose when you're with Amy Baldwin.

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Somebody get us 10cc's of Betsy MD.

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Put us on a stretcher. It's Charlotte Fletcher.

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Can't have a meal without the Emily sides.

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Who, what, why, where? And Gwen Pentland.

[Ben Mandelker]

Let's go into the woods with Guy Tubbs. It's a star queen. It's Queen Laifa Nobody holds a candle.

[Ronnie Chieng]

To Jamie Kendall Hail the cork master the master of the cork Jennifer Corcoran we got our wish It's Jen Plish she's not harsh She's Jill Hirsch My Favorite Murdo Karen McMurdo She's a total.

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Knockout It's Katie Manock, we love him.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Madly It's Kyle Pod Shadley in the study with a candlestick It's Leslie Peacock G It's Lisa H We're ride or die for Lisa Ryder Baron she's a whiz It's Liz Sarthi always killing it.

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It's Lola Al Kalani the incredible edible Matthew Sisters she eases our woes it's Melissa St. Rose there's a chance of meatballs It's Rebecca Cloud maximum love for.

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Sandy Maximoska she's the queen bee It's.

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Sarah Lemke we cannot tell a lie It's Sarah tell of son Shannon out.

[Ronnie Chieng]

Of a cannon Anthony, please don't stop it's solely in pop let's take off with Tamla Plain we're obsessed doll with.

[Ben Mandelker]

Tessa V she ain't no shrinking violet Coutar we love you guys. If you like watch what crappens. You can listen ad free right now by joining Wondery plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short [e-mail] survey.