Podcast Summary: Watchman Privacy – Episode 211 with Naomi Brockwell: "Nothing to Hide"

Date: December 22, 2025
Host: Gabriel Custodiet
Guest: Naomi Brockwell
Main Theme:
A wide-ranging discussion with Naomi Brockwell—privacy advocate, founder of the Ludlow Institute, and prolific educator—about the existential threat of surveillance, practical paths to privacy, challenges with current tech ecosystems, and how individuals can regain autonomy in an increasingly monitored world.

1. Why Naomi Brockwell Chose Privacy as a Life’s Mission

[01:58-06:14]

• Naomi’s entry into privacy wasn't a formal career decision; it began with an obsession over surveillance as an existential threat.
  • She believes we're in a unique, closing window to spread privacy tools before society crosses a tipping point into inescapable surveillance.
  • Quote:
    “I kind of see privacy as this existential threat right now. I should say surveillance is an existential threat... I think that window of opportunity of getting [tools] out to more people will close when the surveillance state gets too, too powerful.” — Naomi Brockwell [02:18]
• Her journey started in economics and the pursuit of separating money from state—a pursuit encouraged by the arrival of cryptocurrency.
• Realization: Decentralized protocols are insufficient if individuals are not private; governments target people, not just networks.
  • Quote:
    “If this decentralized tech is going to have any meaningful impact, people need to know how to use the Internet privately.” — Naomi Brockwell [04:34]
• Privacy became her mission simply by documenting her own learning and journey, recognizing the vast gap in public understanding.

2. Onboarding the Reluctant: Empowerment Strategies and Counteracting Learned Helplessness

[06:14–12:57]

• Most resistance to privacy stems from learned helplessness and disempowerment, not apathy.
  • Quote:
    “They’re trying to justify their helplessness and make themselves feel better about not doing anything.” — Naomi Brockwell [06:54]
• Empowerment through action:
  • When people are given simple, actionable alternatives, they are likely to adopt privacy tools and become their own evangelists.
  • It’s critical to push back against the narrative that privacy is dead or hopeless; these stories often serve state or corporate interests.
• Companies must recognize data exfiltration risks, not just from outside hackers but from employees sending data out via mainstream tools (like ChatGPT, Gmail, telemetry).
• Practical advice: Migrating from Gmail to Proton is as simple as clicking a button; people underestimate how easy privacy upgrades have become.
  • Quote:
    “They can start small and see how they go and as they get used to this new tooling, add new things... they’re absolutely empowered to make those decisions for themselves.” — Naomi Brockwell [12:10]
• Emphasize that privacy tools can increase convenience and efficiency—counter to their historic reputation as clunky.

3. The Value Proposition (and Newfound Convenience) of Privacy Tools

[12:13–13:44]

• Modern privacy tools often add convenience (e.g., faster browsing, fewer ads).
  • Quote:
    “A lot of these privacy services, they don’t have any account creation... I do think there is a convenience to privacy services that certainly we should be emphasizing.” — Gabriel Custodiet [12:46]
• Example: Using Brave browser’s ad-blocking saves time and bandwidth; negates the need for YouTube Premium.
  • Quote:
    “Understanding that actually there's a good reason to use privacy tools outside of the privacy benefits can actually be a powerful messaging.” — Naomi Brockwell [13:44]

4. Surveillance Infrastructure: Flock Cameras, Ring Doorbells, and Libertarianism

[14:08–22:16]

• The debate over public surveillance through Flock cameras and private networks (Ring) exposes weaknesses in both private property arguments and constitutional law:
  • The Mosaic Theory: Single snapshots are harmless, but massive aggregation creates powerful, invasive patterns.
  • Quote:
    “One tile doesn’t reveal much, but once you have 10,000 tiles, you start to get a complete picture of their life.” — Naomi Brockwell [15:26]
• Outsourcing governmental searches to private parties (e.g., Flock) skirts constitutional protections (e.g., requiring warrants).
  • Naomi argues this is a dangerous loophole, and calls for legal and public reevaluation.
• The insidious public-private partnerships (e.g., Ring & law enforcement) erode checks and balances on surveillance power.
  • Quote:
    “We’re just hoping that a benevolent person will always be in charge... that’s a terrible security posture.” — Naomi Brockwell [20:26]
• Feature creep: Tools justified for crime prevention become infrastructure for generalized monitoring—eventually for ideological or political control.

5. Apple’s Privacy Promises and the Reality of Ecosystem Tradeoffs

[22:16–29:53]

• Naomi’s background: Used to carry both iPhone and GrapheneOS, but left iOS for good; uses Mac for video work due to limited options, not because she trusts Apple.
• Apple’s failings:
  • Privacy marketing is misleading; real-world privacy is limited and obfuscated.
  • Apple’s lack of transparency (e.g., bypassing VPNs for core functions without user knowledge) is more problematic than mere data collection.
  • Even “private” features (like Apple Intelligence AI) can pipeline data through non-private services like Siri, undermining privacy.
  • Quote:
    “It’s that transparency I have an issue with. It’s not data collection. If a company wants to collect my data, collect it, but tell me about it so I can make an informed decision.” — Naomi Brockwell [22:47]
• Many privacy features are illusory (e.g., no true end-to-end encryption for Apple Mail, contacts, or calendar).
• Siloing devices/software and using tools like Little Snitch to monitor/block outbound traffic are essential for damage control.
• Reality check for users: If you cripple all Apple’s interconnected features, what are you really paying for?
  • Quote:
    “I realized at some point, like, what… why… what am I getting from this? Like, why did I pay the Apple tax? Because it’s just a… dumb device now…” — Gabriel Custodiet [28:00]

6. Desired Tech vs. Privacy Compromises: Wearables & the Lack of Private Alternatives

[29:53–33:32]

• Wearables offer amazing health insights—Naomi wishes there were options that didn’t require surrendering all data.
• She’d gladly pay a “privacy tax” for end-to-end encrypted health/fitness wearables, but market offerings are minimal and janky.
  • Quote:
    “Why can the compute not be done on an app in my phone and the company actually doesn’t get access to it?... Surely there’s a market opportunity here that companies are missing.” — Naomi Brockwell [30:44]
• Even companies with good privacy policies are limited by the legal third-party doctrine; data can be subpoenaed or breached.
• The demand: Private, functional, user-controlled technology—not just step counters.

7. The Role and Risks of Cryptocurrency in Privacy

[33:32–39:59]

• Bitcoin/crypto’s core value: Decentralization and resilience to censorship and expropriation.
  • But: Bitcoin’s lack of privacy is a major vulnerability.
  • Quote:
    “My biggest… one of the biggest weaknesses of bitcoin is the lack of privacy in it… It’s very hard to add privacy to a non private thing.” — Naomi Brockwell [34:15]
• Cryptocurrency is critical for those targeted by banking systems—many in the West don’t understand this urgency.
  • Crypto is “both terrible and incredibly important”—filled with scams and volatility, but provides the only way to transact privately online.
  • Quote:
    “Despite all the criticisms of crypto and why it’s terrible money, it is the only possible way to send a digital transaction with meaningful privacy today.” — Naomi Brockwell [38:15]
• Overton window: The shift is toward more individual responsibility and parallel economic systems, especially as mainstream finance becomes more surveilled (with threats like CBDCs).
  • “VPNs are a necessary evil... The VPN world is the scammy, scammy place... and at the same time, a VPN is a necessary privacy tool.” — Naomi Brockwell [40:04]

8. Children’s Privacy: The Dangers of “Sharenting”

[42:41–48:34]

• Children are 50% more likely to be victims of identity theft because parents overshare online.
• The addiction to likes and validation rewires adult behavior, causing parents to ignore long-term costs for kids.
  • Quote:
    “Their children deserve the respect that when they turn 21 and they look back and there’s just like a treasure trove of data where AI has… analyzed their faces... they had no choice and no say in that.” — Naomi Brockwell [47:20]
• Advice: Parents, be mindful—Internet sharing is permanent and public, not akin to a private scrapbook; children inherit the real risk.

9. Final Words: Hope, Call to Action, and Movement-Building

[49:07–50:28]

• Spread the message—supporting the privacy movement matters more than supporting any individual project.
• Opportunities to contribute:
  • Testing software, providing feedback, contributing documentation, code, or simply raising awareness in your community.
  • Changing societal culture around privacy is key: “Let’s just renormalize it.”
  • Quote:
    “I think it’s a really good time to have an outsized impact right now with every small step you might want to take.” — Naomi Brockwell [50:14]

Notable Quotes in Context

• On the fleeting window to change:
  “When that window closes, I think we may hit a tipping point where society is so heavily surveilled that it will no longer be possible to freely proliferate such tools.” — Naomi Brockwell [02:32]

• On learned helplessness:
  “People are far more empowered than they realize. They’re far more empowered than people would have them believe.” — Naomi Brockwell [08:17]

• On convenience as a privacy value:
  “For a long time privacy tooling has been terrible... these days you can [replace mainstream options]." — Naomi Brockwell [13:04]

• On the dangers of unchecked surveillance:
  “If the safety of everyone in the country relies on some benevolent person being in control… that’s a terrible security posture” — Naomi Brockwell [20:36]

• On the reality of privacy in tech ecosystems:
  “I don’t like hyperbole, I don’t like giant sweeping statements about, you know, privacy that’s iPhone. It’s just not.” — Naomi Brockwell [26:31]

• On the unwitting risks to children online:
  “And also their children deserve the respect that when they turn 21 and they look back and there’s just like a treasure trove of data ... they had no choice and no say...” — Naomi Brockwell [47:20]

Episode Flow (Timestamps)

• 01:58 Mission Origins: Why Naomi advocates for privacy
• 06:52 Onboarding strategies, empowerment, and counter-narratives
• 12:57 Modern privacy tools: convenience and value
• 15:07 Flock cameras, surveillance, and legal gray zones
• 22:16 Apple/Ecosystem tradeoffs, transparency criticism
• 29:53 Desirable tech vs. privacy costs—Wearables
• 33:32 Bitcoin, crypto, and the struggle for private money
• 42:41 Children’s privacy & “sharenting”
• 49:07 Closing thoughts & call to action

Conclusion

This conversation blends philosophical urgency (“surveillance as existential threat”) with tactical advice for individuals, companies, and policymakers. Naomi Brockwell presents privacy not as a “paranoid” niche, but as a social imperative with immediate, tangible tools available—if only we empower ourselves and each other. The episode’s enduring takeaway: privacy is possible, activism matters, and every small empowerment today is a safeguard for tomorrow.