Ilona Maher: Awkwardness is Her Superpower

Summary

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Welcome to the Party – Ilona Maher: Awkwardness is Her Superpower

Podcast: Welcome to the Party
Hosts: Abby Wambach, Julie Foudy, Billie Jean King
Guest: Ilona Maher (U.S. Rugby Olympian, body image advocate, social media star)
Date: January 15, 2026

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Episode Overview

This energetic and heartfelt episode centers on Olympian rugby player Ilona Maher and how her honesty, vulnerability, and proudly “awkward” persona have sparked real conversations about body image, confidence, and visibility — both in women’s sports and beyond. Abby, Julie, and Billie Jean create a lively "party" atmosphere, digging into Ilona’s family, career arc, and what it takes to make a positive impact as an athlete and as a person.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Family Foundation & Body Confidence

Timestamps: 11:46–15:59

• Ilona’s upbringing: Details about her supportive family, including her mom (a nurse and Catholic school sex-ed teacher), her dad's encouragement of sports for his daughters, and her two sisters.
• Sports as empowerment: Dad championed sports as a tool for his daughters’ confidence and individuality, refusing to let Ilona "tone it down" for others.
• Naked Mom Theory: Ilona credits her mom for body confidence, explaining the “naked mom” concept: "I had a naked mom. So my mom would just be naked around us...and it helped because you get to see a woman’s body as it is...that really helped us all." (18:40)
• Open talk about sex and body image: Ilona’s mom normalized body talk and sex ed, even fielding a call from Ilona the night she lost her virginity (15:14) — and Ilona was never embarrassed by her mother’s boldness.

"She would come and we’d be talking and she would yell, penis. And then everyone would just, like, quiet down...I always thought she did so well."
– Ilona Maher (14:27)

2. Embracing Awkwardness as a Superpower

Timestamps: 09:09–23:41

• Socially awkward roots: Ilona describes being shy and struggling to make friends growing up, relying on sports for social connection, and only finding her voice late in college and with Team USA (17:15–18:21).
• Owning awkwardness: Ilona reframes awkwardness as connective and empowering, both for herself and her followers: "Awkwardness is my superpower." (02:09)
• Letting it unfold naturally: She wouldn’t change anything about her younger self, emphasizing that moving through those awkward stages paved the way to her success (20:39–21:25).

"I wouldn't tell her anything. I just actually did a post...I promise you, you’re going to get out of it. If life was meant to be just beautiful from the get, it would be kind of boring. You’re gonna struggle. But then you look at me now — I'm the Sports Illustrated model."
– Ilona Maher (21:25)

"Make awkwardness cool. Let us please make awkwardness cool."
– Abby Wambach (02:18)

3. Vulnerability & Social Media

Timestamps: 23:42–26:33

• Challenging the “perfect Olympian” norm: Ilona intentionally shares vulnerable, “real” moments online — revealing mental struggles, insecurities and awkwardness.
• Business savvy: She notes it was both a personal and strategic choice: “Not many people are doing this… I know that awkwardness connects people. I think awkwardness is a superpower.”
• Helping both herself and followers: Sharing honestly not only enables others to relate, but helps her hold onto perspective and confidence.

"Talking about these vulnerabilities heals you. It makes you feel, like, centered and not, like, performative… It’s just — you’re just so badass."
– Abby Wambach (26:19)

4. Body Image, Sport, and the Bigger Picture

Timestamps: 27:15–28:05, 30:34–31:30

• Sports as body liberation: Rugby showed Ilona — and her teammates — their bodies are for strength and capability, not just for being “looked at.”
• Visibility matters: Her Sports Illustrated cover and "Dancing with the Stars" appearance meant girls saw athletic, powerful bodies on major stages, challenging beauty norms.
• Advocacy: Ilona actively posts about resisting early dieting culture and instead supports “awkward phase” growth.
• Pushing for equity: Billie Jean King underscores the need for young athletes to also learn the business side: "I want the kids to make money… players, quite frankly, learn the business they're in." (42:45)

5. Life Beyond the Field – Dancing with the Stars & Rugby Futures

Timestamps: 28:05–32:32, 33:02–42:07

• Dancing with the Stars: Ilona recounts the physical and mental challenge of the show, the boost to her visibility, and her insistence on being costumed "as naked as the other dancers" to model body confidence for young girls.
• Rugby achievement & challenges:
  • First U.S. Olympic medalist (bronze); experienced in both sevens and 15s forms.
  • The league landscape: U.S. rugby remains semi-pro, few women’s clubs; most “pros” must work full-time jobs. A real league needs resources, stars, and structures to grow (35:58–38:21).
• Making rugby stars: Ilona’s unique social presence draws fans ("when I went over to England, we had record numbers because Alona was there," 41:21), but she notes the sport needs more standout personalities if it wants to grow like basketball or soccer.

"They forget about the medal. But I think the impact it showed in England with what I did in the 15s space really solidified me as — ‘Oh she has…’ And I have all these 15s…best 15s men's players in the world, who know the impact I have."
– Ilona Maher (33:34)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On connection through awkwardness:
  "When you are in a collective environment where these women… the aspiration is to be the strongest, to be the fastest… the rest of the world is telling little girls to be small, to be quiet. And you have just completely, like, shattered that."
  – Abby Wambach (20:06)

• On being a “naked mom”:
  “My mom would just be naked around us, and it helped because you get to see a woman’s body as it is. Instead of hiding from this and thinking it’s bad.”
  – Ilona Maher (18:40)

• On family support:
  “I was pitching once and he always would, a fast pitcher. I had another dad yell at me to slow my pitches down because none of the girls could hit. My dad pulls out the fast pitch rule book and says, ‘No, this is a fast pitch league, we’re playing. She’s going to throw fast.’”
  – Ilona Maher (12:41)

• On business realities for women’s sports:
  “You can’t eat your medals… the reality is you cannot eat your medals…most players, quite frankly, don’t learn the business they’re in.”
  – Billie Jean King (42:16)

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Fun & Community

“Never Have I Ever” – Game Segment

Timestamps: 46:15–52:14

A playful game where the group exposes fun facts (Abby’s DUI and sobriety journey, Billie Jean’s accolades and reflections). Notably:

• On being arrested:
  "Yeah, I got arrested…I got a DUI ten years ago. And I’ve been sober ten years from that."
  – Abby Wambach (49:04–49:11)
• On mental health and “bangs”:
  "Because whenever my sisters would come back from, like, not good times, they’d get bangs. Really? Oh no, it’s actually an alert."
  – Ilona Maher (50:14)

Cheers & Party Vibes

Timestamps: 52:17–54:46

The show ends in spirited fashion, as Ilona, Abby, Julie, and Billie Jean trade favorite team cheers, champion community, and reflect on the “fun rules” that make Welcome to the Party a standout for women’s sports.

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Body confidence, naked mom, and sex ed: 11:46–18:40
• Awkwardness as superpower: 18:21–23:41
• Vulnerability and social media: 23:41–26:33
• Dancing with the Stars experience: 28:05–32:32
• Rugby’s challenges, business reality: 33:02–42:07
• Never Have I Ever: 46:15–52:14
• Team cheers and wrap-up: 52:17–54:46

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Conclusion

This episode exemplifies the “Welcome to the Party” spirit with its honesty, laughter, and depth; Ilona Maher’s journey embodies the power of embracing one’s awkwardness, breaking body-image taboos, and driving women’s sports forward. The stories shared, wisdom offered, and camaraderie make this conversation a must-listen (or read) for anyone passionate about empowering women, sports, and self-acceptance.

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Summary by Welcome to the Party Podcast Summarizer

Transcript

[Billie Jean King]

Two sisters are taller than you. Okay, you're the baby. You're the baby.

[Alana Moore]

Confidence. I told you that. Confidence, Billy.

[Abby Wambach]

I don't know why we're so pure here in America. But, like, parents don't talk to their kids enough about sex. They don't talk enough of their. To their kids about body image.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

And it's, like, all so connected.

[Alana Moore]

Have you heard of, like, the naked mom theory?

[Abby Wambach]

No.

[Alana Moore]

I had a naked mom. You're gonna struggle. But then you look at me. Now I'm the sports illustration model. But you would not have thought that back in the day. Attention.

[Abby Wambach]

The party is about to commence.

[Alana Moore]

Welcome to the party.

[Julie Foudy]

What's up, party people? I'm Julie Foudy.

[Billie Jean King]

I'm so.

[Alana Moore]

Are you kidding me?

[Billie Jean King]

I'm ready. Let's go.

[Abby Wambach]

I'm Abby Wambach.

[Billie Jean King]

I'm Billie Jean King.

[Alana Moore]

Yo.

[Abby Wambach]

I'm so excited for today.

[Billie Jean King]

I'm so excited. Who are you?

[Alana Moore]

Look at? I feel like we're. I'm Julia Gulia.

[Julie Foudy]

I feel like we're so productive in this new year.

[Abby Wambach]

We're vibing.

[Alana Moore]

We are. We are here.

[Abby Wambach]

We've.

[Julie Foudy]

We've hung our sign up.

[Abby Wambach]

We are here.

[Alana Moore]

We are here, everyone.

[Billie Jean King]

The sign is a big. You'll see. You guys listen and watch.

[Julie Foudy]

We're here. And who do we have? Oh, my God.

[Abby Wambach]

Yo, it's so good. The conversation where we just had. Y' all be ready. You are not going to believe this. Have you heard of. Did you guys hear of the naked mom fear?

[Alana Moore]

I had not.

[Billie Jean King]

No, I didn't. But sure have now.

[Julie Foudy]

Now we have.

[Alana Moore]

Sure have. Now.

[Julie Foudy]

Do you have a naked mom?

[Billie Jean King]

So you guys, were you a naked mom?

[Abby Wambach]

I am a naked mom.

[Billie Jean King]

You are?

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

Tell them what naked mom is she talks about.

[Abby Wambach]

Do you have dogs?

[Julie Foudy]

Ilona talks about it.

[Billie Jean King]

No, we don't now. Not now because we're traveling too much. We want to take the babies with us.

[Abby Wambach]

Would you have been a naked mom if you were a parent?

[Billie Jean King]

Probably. Because my parents were pretty good.

[Alana Moore]

I mean, they didn't tell the party.

[Julie Foudy]

People what a naked mom is.

[Abby Wambach]

Okay, well, I don't know. I don't want to give it away.

[Alana Moore]

We're not giving it away.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah, don't give it away.

[Alana Moore]

You gotta watch the episode.

[Billie Jean King]

Alona, she'll tell you. She'll tell you the story. She's fantastic.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

Her other thing that she said was so great because this is totally me. She's like, my awkwardness is my superpower.

[Billie Jean King]

That's true.

[Abby Wambach]

Make that cool. Let us please make awkwardness Cool.

[Julie Foudy]

And she said what it does is it actually connects people. Because it does. They're like, oh, okay. Oh, she's kind of quirky. Like me.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah, like me. Right.

[Abby Wambach]

And how much did you just love her? Like her energy, her joy?

[Billie Jean King]

We went to dinner with her last night, Ilana and I did. And I cannot tell you how great, much fun it was and understanding why she is who she is. And she's so wonderful and popular. She's just helping not only herself, but she's helped her sport. Rugby.

[Julie Foudy]

Come along.

[Billie Jean King]

Anyway. I just love listening to her.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. And everybody's got to stick around for the very end. You're not going to want to miss it. We do play.

[Billie Jean King]

Never have I ever.

[Abby Wambach]

You're going to not want to miss this. I promise you. And also, if you wouldn't mind rating Leave a comment wherever you get your podcast. Apple Podcasts, Spotify. We really would love it. Follow us on Instagram, TikTok or wherever you consume us.

[Julie Foudy]

It's huge.

[Abby Wambach]

Welcome to the party Show. It really matters to us. We really appreciate it.

[Julie Foudy]

Kinger, I don't know if you've ever gone to Apple podcast page and checked out welcome to the party, but I highly suggest you do this.

[Abby Wambach]

The comments.

[Julie Foudy]

Because the comments are the best.

[Billie Jean King]

That's what we want. Because it's their show. It's not really our show, party people. It's their show.

[Julie Foudy]

And us, we're almost at a thousand five star likes.

[Billie Jean King]

Like it. I like those five stars.

[Julie Foudy]

So we're gonna get there.

[Abby Wambach]

We're gonna get there. Ilona's episode, it's so good that I do believe it might get us there, folks. Come on.

[Billie Jean King]

I think it will.

[Abby Wambach]

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[Alana Moore]

And.

[Abby Wambach]

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[Julie Foudy]

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[Alana Moore]

They're like, that's. Or so bright.

[Abby Wambach]

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[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

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[Alana Moore]

It's so cool, the swivel. I was like, what?

[Abby Wambach]

It's the best. It's also. It's been a game changer for me because, like you, I can't run, but I can't run because I have foot problems. And so the tread and the forgiving nature of the actual tread helps me to be able to actually move. I can walk on there. I can get an incline on there. I can swivel that screen. But I think what I love most is that the screen swivels in a way where I can guide and I can do the pilates on the ground. I can do weightlifting. I'm like, literally looking at this Peloton plus tread. It's just.

[Julie Foudy]

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[Abby Wambach]

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[Alana Moore]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

I love it too. I love it. So let yourself run, lift, sculpt, push, and go.

[Abby Wambach]

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[Julie Foudy]

Explore the new peloton cross training tread [e-mail]. Okay, party people, now to the partiest part of our party. This one is special. Our guest actually didn't grow up chasing rugby dreams, but once she found the sport, she changed what it looks like, who it's for, who gets seen. She's a two time Olympian, an Olympic bronze medalist, a collegiate national champion, an incredible dancer who knew a social media rock star who's reshaped the body image conversation, and someone who's been honest about the highs, the lows, the pressure that comes with carrying that visibility. You have seen her light up the rugby pitch, the Internet, and now everywhere in between. Aluna Moore.

[Billie Jean King]

Welcome to the party.

[Alana Moore]

Welcome to the party.

[Billie Jean King]

People.

[Alana Moore]

Thank you for having me. I am. I'm happy to be here in this party space.

[Julie Foudy]

Yeah, we never actually get together like this. So thank you for gathering us.

[Alana Moore]

Oh, really?

[Abby Wambach]

No, we don't.

[Alana Moore]

Just all on the zoom.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, we do. We do remote and we're so. Actually, this is so fun.

[Billie Jean King]

This is the first time we all three been actually together in the same space. I love it.

[Alana Moore]

You guys forget I'm here and just start talking to each other.

[Billie Jean King]

Usually in New York or someplace. Joining him from someplace. Yeah. So now that. Oh, look at the ball.

[Alana Moore]

Whoa, look at that. She's like, oh, I haven't signed it yet though.

[Billie Jean King]

No, but it's just the shape, you know, up close like this.

[Julie Foudy]

That's mine. Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

Look how. Look at the shape.

[Julie Foudy]

It was the, I believe the 2016 Olympic team.

[Alana Moore]

No, we can't. I see one of my teammates who's played now. I love Kelter Signature. I'll sign it. Don't sell it. Okay.

[Billie Jean King]

This is beautiful.

[Abby Wambach]

I know the autograph seekers and. Okay, I have to ask.

[Billie Jean King]

They do.

[Julie Foudy]

Yes.

[Billie Jean King]

What do you call that shape?

[Alana Moore]

Oblong.

[Abby Wambach]

Oblong.

[Billie Jean King]

Oblong. Oblong.

[Abby Wambach]

Oblong. It sounded like it was a wine.

[Alana Moore]

I don't know. It's very much so. I mean, we say football came from rugby. We think we are the father of football. Whether that's true or not. I think it is true. But yeah, it's just like a football, but it's just bigger than a football and doesn't have the stitching like they do. So whenever people want to put, you know, a rugby ball, they always pick the football emoji. And I'm like, yeah, close.

[Abby Wambach]

Is there a rugby emoji?

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, I know there's not a rugby emoji and I. Yeah, so that's exactly.

[Abby Wambach]

There we go.

[Alana Moore]

And can we get one of those? I'M left out.

[Julie Foudy]

Yes. Come on.

[Alana Moore]

Rugby matters, too.

[Julie Foudy]

Emoji, people.

[Billie Jean King]

If we write it in rugby ball or something, would it come up?

[Alana Moore]

No, I think they'd probably do football. Be like, here's what we have.

[Abby Wambach]

Close enough.

[Billie Jean King]

I know. I hate that, though. I like it precise.

[Julie Foudy]

I'm gonna find that out.

[Alana Moore]

See if you have influence.

[Billie Jean King]

Like, they always have three runners that are all blonde. And I'm like, really?

[Julie Foudy]

You get to do this podcast with your sisters like this? Yes. Your podcast is amazing, by the way.

[Abby Wambach]

Thank you.

[Alana Moore]

Thank you.

[Abby Wambach]

So good.

[Julie Foudy]

Listen in. You're the middle of three sisters.

[Alana Moore]

Yes.

[Julie Foudy]

And so you guys gather, and we don't. Which is why we were like, this is perfect because we can see each other.

[Alana Moore]

It's really. It's nice to be able to do that with your sisters. I'm my oldest sister in the room right now. She's my manager. But now to get to work with her has been so cool. And then my youngest sister, amazing, like, girl, she just knows so much about day. Day in life, politics. So we always go to her. So to have voices in so many realms. And, you know, me being the athletic side, we had our guests on recently who was like, well, I'm not. I don't really know sports. Is it okay if I. Come on. It's not really sports so much as it's just us talking and us, like, having conversation. I think it was just really fun. We want to learn about you, but we also just want to. Four people vibing.

[Julie Foudy]

Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah. And your two sisters are taller than you are.

[Alana Moore]

Okay.

[Billie Jean King]

You're the baby.

[Alana Moore]

You're the baby. I told you that in confidence. I told you that. Confidence, Billy. I didn't know that. Yes, they are.

[Billie Jean King]

And I. I love it. I thought you were bragging when you said it because you kind of liked it when you said.

[Alana Moore]

Well, I. It's. I guess I'll brag. I'm just so tiny and like.

[Billie Jean King]

Well, no, I can tell you.

[Alana Moore]

I'm just so tiny.

[Billie Jean King]

I can tell you loved your sisters. You really care about them. That's why. That's why I like it.

[Julie Foudy]

Your older sister does not look taller than you on air.

[Billie Jean King]

No.

[Alana Moore]

Well, it's sitting down, I guess. Yeah. But she is the tallest out of all this. What are you, 5 11? Oh, sorry.

[Julie Foudy]

Your younger sister Olivia is 5 11.

[Alana Moore]

She's 5. Younger sister is, like, a little bit taller than me, but I always said I started drinking coffee pretty early, so maybe it is your girl.

[Abby Wambach]

Whoa.

[Alana Moore]

We don't know. I'm barely shorter than Them, let's all be clear. It's like a half an inch. I love it.

[Julie Foudy]

I need to hear about mom and dad. Yeah. Because I want to, like, crawl into your family. When I hear you tell the stories, I'm like, I love this family.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, they are amazing. So Mom's a nurse, dad is a salesman, and I kind of followed them in both ways. So I went to nursing school and it wasn't until senior of high school when I actually found rugby and decided to play it in college kind of on a whim. And my dad, rugby player, had been playing for years, never got us into it because it wasn't like varsity anywhere. There was no money. Like you'd rather have them play soccer or where that was sponsored by the school. So I did Philoki basketball, softball instead of rugby, but decided to try rugby out and then turn out to be very good at it. I think, like, not being told to calm down or anything like that and to. To tackle as hard as I can to do all this, whereas in some sports where you just calm down too much or, you know, you can't do that. So my dad, though, and I think maybe probably similar for a lot of our parents, if maybe not, but he was. He saw that sports can be very valuable to girls. And he loves the article, loves research, and he saw that the way that sports impact girls body image. And he only has three daughters, but he knew he wouldn't treat us any differently. And he loves it. And like, my biggest story I tell is that I was pitching once and he always would a fast pitcher. I had another dad yell at me to slow my pitches down because none of the girls could hit. And my dad pulls out the fast pitch rule book and says, no, this is a fast pitch league we're playing. She's going to throw fast. And that, I think was my first memory of like, oh, not to tone it down when somebody else told me to. And he's done it throughout my career. So I followed in both their paths and I loved nursing, but rugby had an excitement to it, and there's Olympic possibility. So I got my nursing degree, passed my boards, but I went. Ended up, you know, you guys. I do. Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

She's an art.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

That's awesome, isn't it?

[Alana Moore]

Don't ask me to save anyone's life. I remember anything. I just say. I say things with confidence. And then people believe it. They're like, what do you think of this rash? I'm like, you're fine.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah, exactly.

[Alana Moore]

Don't worry about it. You're good.

[Abby Wambach]

Well, we want to talk a little bit about your mama, too, because there's this funny story that you couldn't resist.

[Julie Foudy]

She was.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, that she was. She's a sex ed teacher.

[Alana Moore]

Yes. Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

And tell us a story about her. What would she say walking into rooms.

[Alana Moore]

Yes. So first off, she's a sex ed teacher at a Catholic school.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. Yes.

[Alana Moore]

So there's. I went to Catholic school.

[Billie Jean King]

Oh, my God.

[Alana Moore]

I knew you.

[Billie Jean King]

Oh, there's something joking over there. I'm joking. I'm so sorry. But at least you could sex ed. You can feel.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes.

[Alana Moore]

Sin, Billy. There's not a lot you can really say, you know, Abstinence is key, everyone, if you haven't heard, but she.

[Abby Wambach]

She was.

[Alana Moore]

Would come into our classrooms, and I graduated in a class of nine people, so it was all my brothers and sisters. But she would come and we'd be talking and she would yell, penis. And then everyone would just, like, quiet down. But I.

[Julie Foudy]

That's my mom.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah. I'm like, that's my girl up there. I never found myself embarrassed by it. I always thought she did so. Well, we make the joke that. And Olivia. I don't know if I could. My mom will hate this, but we make the joke that some of my classmates ended up getting pregnant pretty soon on, like. Like, pregnant as young people. And I was like, mom, well, you got to refine that. You're obviously gotta be better. But she's always been a source that we can come to for any questions. I tell the story of, like, I called her, you know, the night after I lost my virginity, because she opened a really open dialogue.

[Abby Wambach]

That's amazing.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, I called her. I was like, mom, she's like. I was like, can I talk to you? She's like, yeah, yeah, of course. So she runs upstairs. She had guests over, and I was like, mom, just let you know, I lost my virginity, so we're gonna need to do a gyno appointment soon. And she was like. She's like, yes, of course. Thank you. Yep, of course. And I guess she didn't sleep a wink that night.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

Because I was like, well, I think.

[Abby Wambach]

That that's just so indicative of the kind of relationship that you guys all have formed inside of, like, your little family unit. And to be Europeans do this. I don't know why we're so pure here in America. But, like, parents don't talk to their kids enough about sex. They don't talk enough about to their kids about body image. And it's, like, all so connected. That like, no wonder why you have the confidence of a thousand people.

[Alana Moore]

Right.

[Abby Wambach]

Like, it's like the background and the family systems that we come from really do matter.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

So it's incredible.

[Billie Jean King]

It does matter. But I went to public school and in fifth grade they showed us films, the boys and the girls, films of sex, totally explaining the anatomy, everything. No, but how you get pregnant. No, but that was fantastic because some kids, the parents, they couldn't talk to their parents or anything. I could, but it's like, no. You could.

[Julie Foudy]

Your parents would talk about it too.

[Alana Moore]

My parents were.

[Billie Jean King]

Great question.

[Abby Wambach]

Did they separate the girls and boys? Because that's what they did for me.

[Billie Jean King]

I think they might have.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

They separate and they like call the parents and at home the night before, they're going to have their sex ed talk and sex ed the next day at school. So my mom came up and I'm the youngest of seven kids. My mom came up to my bedroom and she said, honey, tomorrow you're going to have a lesson about sex ed education. Do you have any questions? And I have six older brothers and sisters. I was like, no, I've figured this out.

[Alana Moore]

I'm good.

[Abby Wambach]

I know what's going on.

[Julie Foudy]

And she was like, honey, this is a vagina.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, yeah. She's like, great. And she just stood up and left. And I was like, perfect. Didn't have to have that weird conversation with my mom.

[Billie Jean King]

And I'm sure she was thrilled.

[Abby Wambach]

She was.

[Julie Foudy]

Wait, you said one of nine in your high school.

[Alana Moore]

I was very socially awkward. This was middle school.

[Julie Foudy]

Middle school.

[Alana Moore]

So I went to a Catholic school, a very small Catholic school. And I grew up with these kids and they were my brothers and sisters. So I didn't have any. Ever have any crushes or anything like that. I would go play sports at the local middle school. And I mean, those were some scary kids. My mom was like, just, just, just go into a group of them and just stand there. So I would just go and stand in a group of them. And I later learned I was weird. They. They thought of me as weird.

[Abby Wambach]

So good.

[Alana Moore]

But I genuinely didn't know. I think the only thing that really. And then I went into high school and I think the only way I really had friends, I've had trouble making friends, was I was good at sports. And that earns you a certain level of respect or a certain level of placement in school, which is like, it's very cool. And I got that. But I means, I just didn't. Wasn't able to form connections really, because My friends were just who my sports teams were at the time. So it'd be feel hockey, then basketball. But I really no one believes it. But I was. Olivia and I both were very socially awkward. I was very quiet, my parents will say only until I would say end of college did I kind of learned to have my own voice. And even then I think it was more going to the USA team where I really learned to have it.

[Julie Foudy]

Interesting.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

What was it that brought that out? Because you seem so comfortable in your own skin.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes.

[Julie Foudy]

It's what everyone strives for.

[Abby Wambach]

Right.

[Julie Foudy]

As we know.

[Alana Moore]

I think it's the people I'm around and like you said, the parents. I have, we talk about it. Have you heard of like the naked mom theory?

[Abby Wambach]

No.

[Alana Moore]

I had a naked mom. So my mom would just be naked around us.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes. I'm naked around my kids.

[Alana Moore]

And it helped because you get to see a woman's body as it is.

[Julie Foudy]

Yes.

[Alana Moore]

And instead of hiding from this and thinking it's bad. So when we'd be at the ymca, I'd see my mom and then I'd see the other ladies and to me I was like, okay, that's just what a woman's body is after whatever it is. Three kids living a full life. So that I think really helped us all and I think we Naked mom theory is something. So she helped me with the body confidence. My sisters as well. I think going into usa when you're around women who are very like minded and you're all striving for the same thing and you're striving to be stronger, to be faster, it's that really helped me. I think I always was meant to be an extrovert, but I was never, never allowed myself to because I was afraid to be judged and like finally found a space where I could be who I wanted to be. And I think it's about people who I'm around. My sisters and teammates and best friends. Friends.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. And I think about like I, I can relate a lot to what you're saying and what really is ringing true is like when you get a chance to go play for your country, there is something that there's like a level of confidence that I just like kind of tucked in my back pocket and I brought with me everywhere I went. And, and, and then when you are in like a collective environment where these women are. And everybody is like the, the aspiration is to be the strongest.

[Alana Moore]

Yes.

[Abby Wambach]

To be the fastest and, and you have other people around because the rest of the world is telling little Girls to be small. Exactly. To be quiet. Right. And you have just completely, like shattered that in so many ways. And I like to. This leads to my question, like, what would you tell that middle school shy, awkward kid, like now sitting where you're sitting, like, would you tell that kid something different or did it happen how it was supposed to happen?

[Alana Moore]

People would be like, what would you tell your younger self? And I was like, I wouldn't tell her anything.

[Abby Wambach]

That's right.

[Alana Moore]

I'd put on a mustache and I'd be like, across the way. Like, I don't want her to change anything of what she did. It wasn't fun. I think I didn't have a lot of friends. I grew up, I think, being not an outcast, but a little bit of a wallflower. And I've been burned by friends in many ways, but I think it all led me to Olympic medal. It's kind of funny when I think about, oh, that was the reason I started rugby, and then that was the reason I transferred. And that transfer then led me to want to try out for USA team. So I wouldn't tell her anything. I just actually did a post about it because my mom came to me and was like, you know, I just have a question for you. I've had a couple of moms come to me with like, their young daughters and their young daughters who want to start diets. Like we're talking 6 to 10 year olds. Wanting to start diet.

[Julie Foudy]

Crushes me.

[Alana Moore]

It crushes me. It's just like, what would you say to them? So I made a video and I showed them pictures of myself when I was younger. And I was, you know, just a, a normal, a little bit chunky kid, but that's just how it is. And I said, you're not meant to be sexy then look at me now. This is when you're supposed to be sexy and you're supposed to, you know, get into your, to your beauty. It's like that's a phase of awkwardness. And I promise you, I promise you, you're going to get out of it. So to my younger self, I wouldn't, I'd say to the other ones, but you're gonna, it's gonna get better. You're gonna get out of it. If life was meant to be just beautiful from the get, it would be kind of boring. You're gonna struggle. But then you look at me now, I'm the sports illustration model. But you would not have thought that back in the day going to those middle school practices, that's Right. Not my best years.

[Julie Foudy]

I did see that post.

[Alana Moore]

It was so good.

[Billie Jean King]

Can you recognize. Do you know how great it is for someone my age to know she's on the front, that you're on the front? Leona of Sports Illustrated.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

Because when we were Sports Illustrated, never even worried about women except the swimsuit issue early in the year. But there's no way that would have happened back then. No way. So it makes me so happy when they chose you. And you're proud of yourself. God, it's just. I have perspective. I do. I mean, I'm a pre. Title IX baby. You say, oh, I went to college, I played rugby, and I'm like, man, that's great. You had that opportunity. We didn't have that. So I love to see how each generation continues to drive it forward, to get better, to be proud of yourself. No matter how you look, who you are, what face, it doesn't matter. Your color doesn't matter. Go for it. Believe in yourself. But you're beautiful the way you are. And I love the fact you're doing this because you're now. You're now. You have a strong personality. Yeah. And you're successful.

[Alana Moore]

Thank you.

[Billie Jean King]

And I think success helps. I think success helps kids to understand when they hear everyone's story, how we're all, like, you know, just shy. Didn't know. We're going just. We're trying.

[Alana Moore]

We're trying to figure out.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

Like, I'm sorry, kids.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

I'm not going to tell you the secret sauce of how to be confident. You got to be each person and look awkward and feel weird.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

And then you're gonna.

[Alana Moore]

And then this. Other times when you're older, you're gonna be like, this is great.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

You're gonna get hotter.

[Abby Wambach]

Where did it come from? Exactly. You eventually will. Where did the. The confidence in your vulnerability online come from? Because I think that that is. That's not a very common trait, especially for athletes.

[Alana Moore]

Yes. You know what? I think it was a couple things. I think it was in a business sense, and then. And also just that's who I am sense, but in a business sense. I saw that not many people are doing this, and I.

[Billie Jean King]

Doing what?

[Alana Moore]

Like, being vulnerable online. Okay. Like being, like, showing the ins and outs of being an athlete. Showing the mental battles. And I just remember I. You know, people put Olympians on a platform. They are the. The toughest of the tough. They. There's nothing wrong with them. You have to be. You have to be, you know, mentally sound everything to be An Olympian. And I look around and I'm like, that's just not the case. No one People are obsessed with is Olympics, and they're obsessed with being looking inside the Olympic village because it's so, like, something you don't get to see. I know that vulnerability connects people. I know that awkwardness connects people. I think awkwardness is a superpower. I think that I am a very confident person, but awkward is also makes people feel like they can talk to me when I bring that in. So vulnerability was just that. I know that if I'm feeling this way and I'm Olympian this or that, all these other people are feeling that, and no one's saying it.

[Abby Wambach]

That's right.

[Alana Moore]

So it was just like, maybe I just try saying it one time and I tried saying it. I was like, okay, that worked. Maybe I do it again. Okay, that worked. And it just kept building. And it helps me as well, the vulnerability. Like, I know it's helping others, but I think pushing, putting that message out there, whether it's about body, you know, positivity also helps me.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

Because I'm like, especially in the age we're in, get to see my own videos and know that. Okay, don't change, lona. Or don't feel like. Don't let them think. Don't let them want to make you want to change, because girls are looking towards you.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. And I mean, look, I. I retired in 2015 when the Internet isn't what it is today. But it was, like, kind of coming online, and I struggled a lot with mental health stuff personally, and I wasn't confident enough to come forward and speak about it publicly, and that got the best of me. Right. And so I just think, like, what you're capable of doing, like, the impact you're making, not having anything to do with sport is just. It's. It's going to be pervasive throughout the rest of your life. Mostly because talking about these vulnerabilities heals you.

[Alana Moore]

Oh, yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

It makes you feel, like, centered and not, like, performative and not, like, getting too caught up in the bullshit of, like, sport and Hollywood and all of it. It's like. It's just. You're just so badass. I think it's amazing.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah. It's great that kids. I mean, people, all of us hear it and because they go, oh, that's how I feel.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, exactly. Wow.

[Abby Wambach]

Me too.

[Alana Moore]

It's not revolutionary. I could talk to all you guys.

[Billie Jean King]

No. But I'm not isolated.

[Julie Foudy]

Someone else is young because kids and.

[Billie Jean King]

People young People, when I listen to them, they feel so isolated. They're not. And social. I mean, that's a whole nother discussion. That could be five shows how it's changed everything. Because people see you, they hear you, and they listen to your words and then it reflects because they go, oh, that's how I feel. Oh, wow. And look at. You're going. You're making it so that helps them have more self confidence and make it so. I mean, it's just. It's great. I just really thank you for all your sharing with all of us.

[Alana Moore]

Well, I think that in also ways we're, you know, we're all uniquely made, of course, but also we're going through a lot of the same stuff. Yeah, we are also. We're all our own people, but we also experience a lot of the same. And I think I realized that when you're on a team. And I wish that's also why I wish so many girls could play rugby or play any sport, really, to see what your body is capable of other than just something to be looked at. Because how rugby has made me perceive my body. And then you're around women where I remember, like, even just some stuff that went on in my personal life, whether it was like in intimate settings or whatnot. And I would talk with my friends about it and they would say the same thing and I'd be like, you. Oh, so that happens to you too. It's just open dialogue, I think could help us all, but we're so afraid of being judged or not being normal. But I promise you, so many people are feeling the same way.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah. And it's very connective and people need to connect.

[Alana Moore]

We need to connect.

[Julie Foudy]

Can we just talk about Dancing with the Stars real quick? Because the big reveal that I just learned from Billie Jean King as we were walking onto this set was that you would have gone on Dancing with the Stars.

[Alana Moore]

There's still time, Billie. I've told you.

[Billie Jean King]

No, not with eight knee operations. Not happening. They would love having shoulder operations. You let me say the word.

[Julie Foudy]

I'm getting you.

[Billie Jean King]

No heels. Not happening. I was like, I would have loved it. No, we used to dance. The tennis players and all of us used to dance like crazy.

[Abby Wambach]

I'm begging Dancing with the Stars to get in touch with Billy's people do.

[Billie Jean King]

Not get in touch. It's DM me.

[Alana Moore]

I will give you Billy. They're in touch.

[Abby Wambach]

They love it.

[Billie Jean King]

No, but I just love it. I like your comfort, but I love movement.

[Alana Moore]

So did you guys ever think about it?

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, they asked me. They asked me what happened. So I don't. Tell me.

[Alana Moore]

You said, no.

[Billie Jean King]

You should have gone on then.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, no, I said, can I dance with a woman? And they said, okay, that's fair enough. They said, no.

[Billie Jean King]

Oh, when was this?

[Alana Moore]

That's too bad, because they're changing.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, 20 minutes.

[Alana Moore]

And with your height, you would have looked great.

[Abby Wambach]

I just was not gonna. I was like, I'm not gonna get in the femme. The leotard.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, right. And with a 5, 9 male.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, exactly.

[Alana Moore]

So.

[Abby Wambach]

And I was like, and I want a women. A woman partner. And they were like, no, it's too soon.

[Billie Jean King]

Whoa.

[Alana Moore]

Get your wokeness out of here.

[Abby Wambach]

2015. Yeah, I mean, it was like the year gave.

[Billie Jean King]

Did you ask them when it's going.

[Abby Wambach]

To be all right? Like, they've done it. They've done it since.

[Alana Moore]

They've since done it.

[Billie Jean King]

So what year. Do you know what year they did?

[Abby Wambach]

It was 2015 or 2014. When they asked.

[Billie Jean King]

When they asked. But when did they.

[Alana Moore]

I don't know, 20, 21 or something.

[Billie Jean King]

Well, that's good that you probably started them thinking, which is.

[Julie Foudy]

Yeah, good job.

[Alana Moore]

That's you. That was you, baby.

[Abby Wambach]

I love it so much.

[Billie Jean King]

No, but you made.

[Julie Foudy]

Like, that could have been me, though.

[Abby Wambach]

But we had teammates that did it.

[Billie Jean King]

Now, how hard is it?

[Julie Foudy]

It looks brutal.

[Alana Moore]

Oh, it's. It's very hard. It's every day. Four hours a day in the studio, no breaks. And I think what's, like, different in our sports are very similar in that they're very reactive. So in our sport, it's okay, she's done this, so I'm going to do this now. Okay, Now I'm going to do this. Whereas in dance, it's. I'm going to do this, then I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this at certain times in certain movements. So it was very different for me. I mean, I can make a decision on the go, but then to have a routine in and to remember, put my hand like this. This. Like this. It was. It was very hard. And it. More. Everyone was like, is it physically tough? I'm like, usually I get tackled. This is a really nice break.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes, exactly.

[Alana Moore]

Enjoying this.

[Abby Wambach]

That's amazing.

[Alana Moore]

Mentally, was very exhausting because it's something not natural. Like, if I love dancing, I would have gotten into dance.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

I'm so happy I did it. I think I was telling Billy this last night, like, Olympics is such a small moment in time. And I was, you know, went viral in that Time I think what Dancing with Stars did was put me on people's screens for 10 weeks and. And put me my videos on their pages in that time as well. So they really got to get to know me. And I think it just helped me as well with my brand of seeing who I was seeing. A body type like mine. Yes. On the ballroom floor, I remember reading a comment from a girl who was like, my mom doesn't like watching this season because she doesn't like seeing Alona like dance like a big girl like that out.

[Billie Jean King]

What?

[Alana Moore]

What the hell that mother has.

[Billie Jean King]

The mother that just shows you what the mother has. Don't watch.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, ex.

[Billie Jean King]

That's about the mommy.

[Alana Moore]

I just loved that girls were seeing that. And yes, I wasn't the B. I improved. But I love there was times when I felt like I was being dressed too much. Like I saw the other dancers, they were wearing. They weren't wearing as much as I was. And so I went to costume and I was like, I want to be like the other dancers. I want to be as naked as the other dancers.

[Billie Jean King]

Good for you.

[Alana Moore]

And so cuz I was wearing a long sleeve I was wearing. I was like, no, take, take the fabric way. Finally they did a naked, very like revealing piece on me and I did a video and people loved it because I'm like, my body is just as impeccable as those ones. It just doesn't look as a normal dancer does. I'm so happy I did it. You know, I got a great friend out of it. Alan Burstyn was my partner. Do I need to do it again? I don't know. Very hard. I would highly suggest if you can do it, it's a moment in time. There's an all stars. I will do it.

[Billie Jean King]

What was interesting also to listen to you is how you had to learn a different dance every week. That has to be. That was mind boggling. It's one thing to get the one dance down, but then, oh, next week it's going to be a different one. Yikes.

[Alana Moore]

Then you have to forget you've learned get into waltz for learn to get into jinger.

[Julie Foudy]

I think you could do it.

[Abby Wambach]

But it's kind of fun to know all that now.

[Billie Jean King]

Back in the old days I could.

[Alana Moore]

I love that I can differentiate between apostle doble and then a ven Waltz versus a foxtrot.

[Abby Wambach]

One, two, three.

[Billie Jean King]

Is waltz, right?

[Alana Moore]

Yes.

[Julie Foudy]

She's a natural.

[Alana Moore]

Billy. This is happening, this is happening. You know what I love?

[Billie Jean King]

That's why I love sports. This movement. And of course if there's a ball in it. If there's a ball in it, I love it. No, I like to react. Give me the ball. Whether it's. Whether it's rugby, soccer or tennis, it's all reacting to love.

[Julie Foudy]

You could chase a ball.

[Abby Wambach]

Love. Give me the ball.

[Billie Jean King]

Give me the ball. I love it.

[Julie Foudy]

Let's switch over to actually the sport you play, rugby, rugby. What's next for you? I know you're taking a bit of a break right now. You had the World cup this summer. You won bronze at the last Olympics, which was amazing. Congratulations.

[Billie Jean King]

First time, right?

[Alana Moore]

First medal in any usa.

[Billie Jean King]

Thank you.

[Alana Moore]

Men's or women?

[Billie Jean King]

I'm sorry. That's a beginning. Great.

[Alana Moore]

Yes. We're hoping so. Yeah, I'm taking some time off. I mean, rugby is a very violent sport as soccer in many ways as well, with, like, fitness and. But with us, it's just the. Taking the hits can really deteriorate and you realize how many injuries you have. So I. After the World cup was amazing. I'm so happy I got back. I did the Rugby 15s, which is a different form than the Olympic form.

[Julie Foudy]

I'm happy to play that often.

[Alana Moore]

Is that she's a sevens girl. Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

But Rugby 15s is the traditional form, so it's a form that the old men in England think is that's rugby. So I did the Rugby 15s because that's solidified me as a rugby star player, rugby player, rugby star. Where sevens are like, well, you know, she's just an influencer. Does they forget about the medal? But I think the impact it showed in England with what I did in the 15 space really solidified me as. Oh, she has. And I have all these 15s. The best 15s men's player in the world, who know the impact I have. And it's really cool to see. And so I'm taking this time off. But I'm also. And you probably all feel this when you retired. I'm like, even though I'm taking this time off myself, I'm getting antsy. And I am an athlete through and through. And I introduce myself as. I'm alone, a rugby player. Even though I'm not playing. And it's been very hard for me to not be playing rugby right now and to not be with my team. I think that brings me so much joy. It's so hard. My body feels great, but I'm missing that energy going into training, being with some of your best friends and. And like, even though you're getting beat up and it sucks so much. There's a love with it.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

So you don't have to do this, you know? I know I don't, but I love it.

[Abby Wambach]

I know.

[Alana Moore]

This is so interesting. I'm not retired. Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

I thought you said retired. I was like, what?

[Alana Moore]

I'm just taking time off. I can't imagine, even with retirement, how you feel too, because then you're fully done.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

But my goal is LA 2028.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

Okay.

[Billie Jean King]

That's great.

[Alana Moore]

And to. Hopefully, we're gonna be there.

[Billie Jean King]

I am. Aren't you guys?

[Abby Wambach]

Well, the good news is. The good news is, I think the fact that most players who are doing their sport don't have the ability to make enough money off the field and to actually have kind of a career off the field in a way where you're like, you know what? I'm going to take a little time off to recover and heal. Like, most players don't have that, like, luxury. And you have, like. Like. Like a rocket ship yourself into, like, this, like, stardom stratosphere. That. The way that I think about you is like, the way that I think about Mia Hamm in, like, the late 90s around where I think rugby could potentially go and how much room for growth and to get a league going. Like, I know that there are leagues here, but nobody knows about them.

[Julie Foudy]

Like, what is the league situation?

[Abby Wambach]

Can you tell us? Like, a little background?

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah. But what I was thinking today is, like, if somebody's out there listening, can you explain quickly? I don't know if you can. If you can't, just say you can't. But how do. How should we know about rugby? I mean, why should I get, like, okay, they're asking you about leagues and do you make any money and do you. There's all these questions. I don't know if that's possible.

[Alana Moore]

That's what we got here.

[Billie Jean King]

We talked about it, about the lack of money, the lack of opportunity. And there's the sevens and there's fifteens. I don't think. I would think maybe the average American probably doesn't even know.

[Alana Moore]

Nobody knows. Here's the thing. So we have sevens. That's the Olympic form. When I play rugby, I just play for usa. So your soccer players, they're going to play for, you know, Portland Thorns, whatever it is, and then they'll go called up for camps. Right. We are just USA Sevens players throughout the year. That's how we get our. Our money, our stipends is just from that. And then we do tournaments around the world. So that's sevens. If you want to play 15s which is a traditional form, which is just the World Cup I did is there's some club leagues around. There's clubs everywhere. They recently started a league called the Were, which is women's elite rugby.

[Julie Foudy]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

And they're trying to build that up.

[Julie Foudy]

It's like six teams.

[Alana Moore]

I saw six teams around the country and then. But what most people do if you want to play 15s professionally, most girls go over to England to play.

[Abby Wambach]

Okay.

[Alana Moore]

And even then when I say professionally, I, I'm talking. You're hoping to get £200amonth.

[Abby Wambach]

Wow.

[Alana Moore]

You're hoping to get £300.

[Billie Jean King]

This was difficult to have these discussions.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah. So this use of pro sometimes in rugby is a little interesting to me. I want us to be more pro and we use that term but we're not at that point. And so I don't like using until we're getting exactly what that's right we deserve. So yes, it's very semi pro. Many leagues. So a lot of girls have like the ones who play 15s have to have full time jobs. Sevens, you can make it just doing your own thing. But everyone you want to do sevens, that's the Olympic dream and everyone wants to, to find that. So we're in a weird place right now with rugby of trying to build it up. You know, seven seems to be really working in the US because it's a very fast game. It's really fun to watch. Their attention span's a little better. If you don't grow up watching rugby, you have to be. You're kind of like what the, what's happening? As you've probably seen, I think that's.

[Billie Jean King]

With every sport if you don't know it. But I thought was interesting. How long is a rugby game?

[Alana Moore]

80 minutes. Whereas in soccer, I mean you kind of, you want the offsides can get confusing. But other than that we're just kicking around and we're getting it in the goal. Right. Rugby, if you're, you're in that ruck, it's hands in, it's over the ball. This. Oh no, he couldn't have done that because of this play back then. Oh, we're going back. So there's little nuances in it that can be very tough. I do want to see a league arise. I think I have been approached by many but I want to see a league that is going to really succeed and is not going to just. I don't, I don't know what's best. Just use up money and promise these players so much and not give it to them is what I've seen is promising these players these new leagues. I'm like, what have you prom. What have they promised you?

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah, I think they're telling you billionaires behind you.

[Alana Moore]

Like, so I hope there's expansion for rugby and we've seen after every Olympics to see some uptick. But we have a long way to go.

[Julie Foudy]

Bronze medal. And the moment we're living right now in women's sports, right. Where there is not just money pouring into women's sports, like institutional money, where if people have of great wealth coming in because they're realizing now like, oh, this is a good business. It's an investment.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah, yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

There's a return on investment. There's an roi.

[Billie Jean King]

There's a chance.

[Julie Foudy]

And that's where I'm surprised with the success of 24, that there hasn't been more move or maybe there has more movement around, you know, professionalizing.

[Alana Moore]

That's interesting. And Billy and I were talking about it last night. But what I think we need more of in rugby is superstars and what you've seen from the wnba, Caitlin Clark, Angel Reese, what you saw, even, you know, ndsl, going to see Trinity, Rodman play or when Alex Morgan was playing for San Diego wave. I mean, who. Everyone.

[Billie Jean King]

Yeah, but that's what made him famous. They had this league, they were seen by the media. You need, you need a platform or something so people start to see you and hear you.

[Alana Moore]

In some ways, I think it's also on us as players.

[Billie Jean King]

Oh, it's totally on.

[Alana Moore]

You put our players message out there.

[Billie Jean King]

They have to promote it, especially in rugby.

[Alana Moore]

Because. Because for me, I knew that I could like who. Who is the best rugby player in the world?

[Abby Wambach]

You see.

[Billie Jean King]

And that's what, see last night we talked about this.

[Alana Moore]

This is really great. I'm for sure not.

[Billie Jean King]

So who is the best?

[Alana Moore]

Right. She could be considered one of them, but she's kind of retired.

[Abby Wambach]

One of the England players.

[Alana Moore]

Yep. So that's the funny thing is that I am far from the best, but people know me and they don't even know what I do on the field. I'm actually, I'm one of the best sevens players in the world, but fifth like a rugby sense. So that's what I was like. I knew from early on. Like, you know what, it actually doesn't matter for what I'm doing on the field, I can be the best player in the world and not they're not going to know who I am.

[Billie Jean King]

But you're communicating through social media was.

[Alana Moore]

Like, you know what? I'm going to put myself.

[Billie Jean King]

And being on Dance with the Stars, getting yourself out there, being heard.

[Alana Moore]

Exactly. And that's how I get all my money. And I also. I made do for many years on my stipend. But I want to live comfortably. I like to go out to eat.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

And I like to get there.

[Abby Wambach]

Well, you deserve to have a retirement. You deserve to have all these things.

[Alana Moore]

So I use social media in that way. And I think we need more stars in rugby because right now I. I'm not. I'm not full of myself when I say I'm kind of the only one who's at that level that can fill us. Not even fill a stadium. I'm barely filling stadiums. I just get more than normal. People are coming for the individual. A lot of times at sports, like Caitlin Clark is filling arenas because Caitlin Clark's there. When I went over to England, we had record numbers because Alona was there. But I am one person. And you want to build this sport up in the world. Like in England, they have some stars, but it's a small country. New Zealand, they have some stars. It's a small country. Even in those countries, we're not getting fans. Yeah. And I think it's now on us as players to. We saw the effectiveness of me on social media. We have to do more.

[Julie Foudy]

I'll tell you what, it shoots you right to the top.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

You win.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

Once you start meddling and winning like that, that for us was like, oh, yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

But that's, you know, that's great. We were talking last night at dinner, and I said, you can't eat your medals. I know they're great, and everyone's bought into it psychologically, but the reality is you cannot eat your medals. And I remember Althea Gibson, who was my. She was the first person of color to break the barrier and win a major. And I always remember her. Her interview saying, oh, you're this, you're that. She said, but I can't eat my trophies. I can't eat my medals. I have no money. And this is back in the 50s.

[Alana Moore]

Oh, yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

And it's like, no, I want the kids to make money. And also, I don't think players, quite frankly, learn the business they're in. And most people kind of know the business they're in, but most of them do not.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, they let their agents.

[Billie Jean King]

They think the agents are going to take care of it, but even the agents sometimes. I'll Listen to agents. They kind of know the business. Not really.

[Abby Wambach]

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[Billie Jean King]

It.

[Abby Wambach]

It saves my life. I swear. It's like every time we have to file taxes, I'm like, thank God for this service, because I would have absolutely no idea. Outdoit with Intuit QuickBooks. Learn more about Intuit [e-mail].

[Julie Foudy]

Before we let you go. What we're doing, Our last segment is called Party Poppers. That we do with a lot of people we interview. But we've got a new version of Party Poppers, okay. It is called Never have I Ever.

[Alana Moore]

Okay, I can't do this. I haven't played this.

[Billie Jean King]

Polish.

[Abby Wambach]

Okay.

[Alana Moore]

I don't.

[Billie Jean King]

I can't play this. Never ever have I. Never, ever.

[Alana Moore]

I can't get that right.

[Billie Jean King]

Never ever have I ever.

[Alana Moore]

And then you say some weird stuff and you're like, of course I've done that.

[Julie Foudy]

Back in the day, we used to drink with it. But we're just going to hold fingers up.

[Alana Moore]

We're just going to hold fingers.

[Julie Foudy]

You're going to hold three fingers up.

[Abby Wambach]

Three fingers, Kinger.

[Billie Jean King]

Three fingers. Okay, that's great.

[Julie Foudy]

To learn from balls. We're going to go around the room and first person's going to say, never have I ever. They're going to say a phrase, and then if you have done it, you drop a finger.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah. Okay.

[Julie Foudy]

The winner gets this.

[Billie Jean King]

Golden Rugby football, you guys love these games.

[Alana Moore]

I know.

[Julie Foudy]

And there's always a winner.

[Abby Wambach]

And sports show Billy.

[Julie Foudy]

We decided. We decided that the first person. They don't usually play this way, but we're playing this way. First person to lose all three fingers. So you've done it. Wins.

[Abby Wambach]

Great. What?

[Julie Foudy]

Because you've lived.

[Abby Wambach]

Because you want to win.

[Alana Moore]

So we're trying. I got you. Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. Trying to drop it.

[Billie Jean King]

Okay.

[Julie Foudy]

Three fingers. Who wants to start?

[Abby Wambach]

Billy, do you want to start?

[Billie Jean King]

I don't know what I'm doing. Never ever, ever, ever. Never ever have I killed someone.

[Abby Wambach]

Okay.

[Julie Foudy]

We'Re still standing.

[Billie Jean King]

Still standing.

[Alana Moore]

I'm hoping.

[Billie Jean King]

It should be helping everyone. All right, well, I love Law and Order. I'm a Law and Order freak. Not all of them.

[Alana Moore]

Oh, I love an svu.

[Billie Jean King]

That's svu. I watch all of them.

[Abby Wambach]

Put all three.

[Billie Jean King]

I love svu.

[Abby Wambach]

Put all three up.

[Alana Moore]

Alana, you're next.

[Julie Foudy]

We're gonna go.

[Billie Jean King]

Okay, I could do better than that.

[Alana Moore]

Never have I ever won a World Cup.

[Abby Wambach]

Wait, I did.

[Billie Jean King]

I have a World Cup.

[Alana Moore]

You have won a World Cup.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Alana Moore]

So put a finger down. I have to think this me.

[Julie Foudy]

Stay with us.

[Abby Wambach]

Have you won a World Cup, Billy?

[Billie Jean King]

Well, we just.

[Abby Wambach]

The Fed. The Fed Cup. Is that a World Cup? Oh, yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

I did win.

[Alana Moore]

Okay, sure. Give it to them.

[Billie Jean King]

It's not I. We. Because it's team.

[Julie Foudy]

Yeah, we'll give it to you, Billy.

[Billie Jean King]

Oh, thanks a lot.

[Julie Foudy]

Same with us as a team. But I'm taking it.

[Abby Wambach]

Never have I ever.

[Julie Foudy]

Wait, it's my turn.

[Abby Wambach]

Sorry.

[Julie Foudy]

Stop jumping. Never have I Ever been put in jail?

[Alana Moore]

Drop the finger, Abby. Oh, my God. Come on, Billy. That was exciting. Oh, my God.

[Billie Jean King]

Okay, I'm gonna tell you. I went back to college, and I have spoken virtually to three prisons. Two men's and one woman's. And it's changed my life. So, anyway, when we get into this, we'll. Anyway.

[Julie Foudy]

Okay, but you have.

[Alana Moore]

But have you not been in jail?

[Billie Jean King]

I've never been in jail.

[Julie Foudy]

You've just been to a jail, but not in.

[Abby Wambach]

You visited it, too?

[Billie Jean King]

Yes, I have. I've been to commencement. That's a whole nother discussion.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, I got arrested.

[Alana Moore]

What? You do?

[Abby Wambach]

You got arrest? I got a DUI 10 years ago.

[Billie Jean King]

That's right. You told us.

[Abby Wambach]

And I've been sober 10 years from that.

[Billie Jean King]

Bless you. That's fantastic. All right, everybody out there, you heard it. Go get them.

[Alana Moore]

Abby, your turn right now. I'm winning.

[Abby Wambach]

What was I going to say? Okay.

[Billie Jean King]

I can't remember any.

[Julie Foudy]

Never have.

[Abby Wambach]

Never have I ever been on the COVID of. Of Sports Illustrated.

[Alana Moore]

Down.

[Billie Jean King]

Are you sure?

[Julie Foudy]

Down. Look at that.

[Billie Jean King]

Good.

[Alana Moore]

One, two.

[Julie Foudy]

Okay, so have you been on the card?

[Alana Moore]

Back. Higher.

[Billie Jean King]

Yes, I have, actually. Yes, I have.

[Julie Foudy]

Nice. Kinger, go down to one.

[Abby Wambach]

Okay, you're down to one.

[Julie Foudy]

You two are down to one, and Ilona and I are at two. Okay, Kinger, I got one for you.

[Billie Jean King]

Good.

[Abby Wambach]

Go for it.

[Billie Jean King]

Thank you.

[Julie Foudy]

Read my second one. That's a good one for you.

[Billie Jean King]

Getting what?

[Alana Moore]

Bangs.

[Billie Jean King]

Regretted having bangs? What is that? What? Yeah, yeah, bangs. God, bangs.

[Alana Moore]

Who got bangs? I never regretted it. I never got it, because in our house, that was a sign of bad mental health. You got bangs? Really?

[Billie Jean King]

How so?

[Alana Moore]

Because whenever my sisters would come back from, like, not good times, they'd get banged. Really? Oh, no, it's actually an alert.

[Billie Jean King]

She's struggling.

[Alana Moore]

Bang alert. No, it's actually.

[Abby Wambach]

Actually a thing. Cutting her hair is, like, a thing that people turn to because it's, like, the only thing they can control during a hard time. I buzz. I buzzed my head. During a timeline, I buzzed my head.

[Julie Foudy]

Like, I shaved my whole damn head.

[Alana Moore]

A real Britney Spears moment.

[Abby Wambach]

Exactly.

[Julie Foudy]

All right.

[Abby Wambach]

Who's that? Alona. Okay.

[Julie Foudy]

I'm still at 2.

[Alana Moore]

Never have I ever had a really cool ad come out that was like, forget me. Forget me. I love that. I love that ad.

[Abby Wambach]

Forget me. I am down.

[Alana Moore]

Was so good. Y.

[Billie Jean King]

Whatever.

[Alana Moore]

That's one of my favorite ads.

[Abby Wambach]

Look at this.

[Billie Jean King]

Six, seven.

[Alana Moore]

It's actually.

[Julie Foudy]

You know what? You're so lucky that she asked that, because my next question was going to Put Kinger as the winner. Never have I ever received the Presidential Medal of Honor.

[Abby Wambach]

Freedom.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

I'll give it to you.

[Billie Jean King]

The good thing or the great thing and the bad thing at the same time was I was the first woman athlete to ever get it. And I'm thinking this is whatever year it was. 09. Pathetic. Because I know so many other women I would have given it to.

[Julie Foudy]

Who would you have given it to?

[Billie Jean King]

Me. Yeah. I got a lot. Babe Dietrichson. Althea Gibson.

[Julie Foudy]

Wilma Rudolph.

[Billie Jean King]

Wilma Rudolph.

[Abby Wambach]

Unbelievable.

[Billie Jean King]

Fantastic human being who had polio and had to learn how to even walk. And she became number one in the world. I mean, I can go on and on and on.

[Abby Wambach]

All right, well, I won.

[Alana Moore]

So you want it?

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Billie Jean King]

You won the Presidential Mina Freedom.

[Alana Moore]

No, no, she won this really important game we just played.

[Billie Jean King]

No, but you should.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, well, not now.

[Alana Moore]

Sometime I have anyone in this room.

[Billie Jean King]

No, you should get it.

[Abby Wambach]

Not right this second with this. I'm going to.

[Alana Moore]

Sure. Yeah. All right.

[Abby Wambach]

I'm good.

[Julie Foudy]

You get to stay and close out the show with us.

[Alana Moore]

Okay. Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

Because we want you to hear our team cheer that we did. Because I'm interested in what you're cheering.

[Billie Jean King]

Oh, this is very special when you have a cheer.

[Abby Wambach]

What's your USA Rugby cheer?

[Julie Foudy]

Usa.

[Alana Moore]

Okay, we're going to spice it up a little bit, and then maybe they get.

[Julie Foudy]

Maybe they start using this one.

[Alana Moore]

I don't think I do anything. Yeah, we don't have any cheers. Like, I think soccer, we have cheers.

[Billie Jean King]

In tennis when we play team sports. And I can't remember what it is.

[Alana Moore]

You have cheers in tennis. Who's cheering?

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, who are you cheering?

[Alana Moore]

Are you cheering with yourself?

[Billie Jean King]

No, we have a team.

[Abby Wambach]

I believe.

[Alana Moore]

I believe that I will win, you guys.

[Billie Jean King]

No, we have teams. We have team situations.

[Abby Wambach]

Oh, yeah, you do Doubles.

[Alana Moore]

BJK Cups.

[Abby Wambach]

Oh, BJK cup, which is the World.

[Billie Jean King]

Cup of women's tennis. Then we have. Well, we have other things. This team, like, they're playing United cup and Australia. Now it's men and women together, so. And we used to do team tennis with women and men together. We used to always have, you know, whatever they wanted to say. I can't remember.

[Julie Foudy]

I love it.

[Billie Jean King]

But anyway, this is them. This is so great.

[Alana Moore]

What cheer am I doing?

[Julie Foudy]

Thank you, first of all.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

Thank you for taking the time and all your craziness. Thank you for being here like you've.

[Abby Wambach]

Got it all going on.

[Alana Moore]

Thank you.

[Abby Wambach]

And let us know if you need anything. Like, not that I have much pull, but I know Billie she does.

[Billie Jean King]

You know people.

[Alana Moore]

And now you know Bill know people.

[Billie Jean King]

Relationships are everything, by the way. So.

[Alana Moore]

Yes, thank you.

[Billie Jean King]

But I think I'm gonna go on your show anyway. All right.

[Alana Moore]

Yes, we'll talk.

[Julie Foudy]

Oh, you're going on House of Mars.

[Billie Jean King]

That's awesome, because I keep learning from them.

[Alana Moore]

Everyone should check.

[Billie Jean King]

From your sisters, from you.

[Julie Foudy]

I love this podcast as well. House of Mar. Billy's gonna be on it. The Kinger's on it. All right, our cheer. This is what we do in the huddle to this day. It started which year? It started in 1985. First trip the US ever took as a national team. They were in Italy playing, and the Italians, as they often do in Europe, instead of saying usa, they say, usa. Ooh.

[Abby Wambach]

Oh, yeah.

[Alana Moore]

They, like, read it.

[Billie Jean King]

They can't really.

[Julie Foudy]

So they were chanting, oo sa oo suh for the team, and the team was like, this is amazing.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Julie Foudy]

So the team made that our cheer. And to this day, the last thing the team says together before they go out on the. On the field is USA.

[Abby Wambach]

USA.

[Alana Moore]

USA.

[Abby Wambach]

Ah, but 40 years from your soul, 40 years later.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah. So you did it when you were.

[Abby Wambach]

Yep.

[Alana Moore]

That's amazing.

[Billie Jean King]

That's how things get started.

[Alana Moore]

I love it.

[Billie Jean King]

And you can do that with your rugby.

[Abby Wambach]

Pawn the middle paw in the middle.

[Julie Foudy]

Paw in the middle. On three. Who's counting us in?

[Abby Wambach]

I'll count us in.

[Julie Foudy]

Okay.

[Abby Wambach]

Yep. One, two, three.

[Alana Moore]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Welcome to the Party is an independent production brought to you by Treat Media. Treat Media makes art for humans who want to stay human. Silver Tribe is our production partner, and you can also watch our full conversations on the welcome to the party YouTube channel and follow us at welcome to the Party show on Instagram and TikTok.