C (4:16)

Hey, thank you for having me.

A (4:18)

Just to start, can you tell me a little bit about your background and how you became a journalist?

C (4:23)

Yeah. So it's been an odd path. I grew up in a household that votes Republican. I watched a lot of Fox News as a kid and really believed in the whole war on terror thing. So right out of high school, I joined the military, went to Afghanistan, realized that we were not the good guys here. We were telling people what to do who didn't want to be told what to do. And I don't blame them. I don't like being told what to do either. So it made me wonder what else I'd been lied to about. And over the next several years, I changed almost everything that I believed at the time. And this after, you know, kind of a meandering path, led me to journalism because I like to write and also because I remember what it's like to believe things that I no longer do. And I wanted to write about why people believe what they do, especially the American conservative movement. That's been kind of my beat for a long time.

A (5:11)

Yeah, that's actually how I got into writing about American conservatism. You know, I grew up in a very liberal household that was surrounded by conservatives.

C (5:17)

Yes.

A (5:18)

And I was like, all of these people must have gotten somewhere. And I want to know where their path took them and why mine didn't take me to the same place. But I want to get to your story. And this story started last summer when you went to an Immigration and Customs Enforcement Career Expo in Arlington, Texas. What was that event and what was your goal going into it?

C (5:38)

And yeah, so I just wanted to write about the event. I thought it would be interesting to write about how ICE was hiring people, what kind of questions they were asking. So rather than go in as a journalist and get some canned answers, I decided to apply, which I thought I could get through round one. You know, my military background, I look pretty good on paper also, though, I'm a very googleable person. I have a very unusual name and I have a pretty big Internet presence. If you type my name into any computer, you'd find that I am a very outspoken critic of the Trump administration and a very outspoken critic of ICE specifically. So I assumed that I would, you know, get through the first interview, they'd run my name through a computer and that would be the end. And I'd write about what the expo was like. That was the plan.

A (6:18)

You talked to and observed a lot of people at that event. What struck you the most? And I have to ask, what kinds of people did you meet?

C (6:27)

So I didn't actually chat with any of the applicants. Nobody was very chatty, which I think is interesting. People were mostly keeping to themselves or if they'd come with friends, like an obvious friend group, they would be talking amongst themselves. But it was not, not a friendly crowd. A lot of people with former law enforcement experience who getting priority with processing for this on the spot hiring event. You know, like the kind of thick neck types, like look like they do steroids but maybe don't know how to work out. Then you had a couple like, you know, real muscular guys who look like they do know how to work out the big spec ops beard, clearly wanting to be that kind of person. And then honestly, just a lot of kind of dorky looking guys, pretty even split racially between Hispanic and white people, with a smattering of other racists rounded out and almost no women. I'm sure that comes as a shock to everybody.

A (7:11)

The Washington Post reported on the same event you attended and said 3,000 people showed up to submit resumes. Did it seem crowded to you? No.

C (7:20)

And I am Curious whether that number came from DHS or not. And I don't know, like I went for three hours of a two day event and it's possible maybe day one was mobbed and maybe the afternoon was mobbed, but when I was there, it was in no way mobbed. There was no line to get in, no line to get through security. There couldn't have been more than 150 people there at any given time while I was there. And, you know, people were going in and out there, but it didn't seem like a very big event to me.

A (7:45)

What was your interview like?

C (7:47)

So the interview itself, 4ice, lasted about six minutes. It was the most basic questions you could imagine. You know, name, date of birth, military, like was I retired or did I get out after one tour, stuff like that, and where I wanted to be stationed, but there was no interest in anything else. And I mean, honestly I thought it was a pre interview. I thought when she finished up that was like, okay, I've like cleared this, now the real interview will happen. But that is not the case. Then I had the option to talk to an ICE agent. That was not part of the hiring process. It was just a thing that you could do if you wanted to, and there was no line for that. So I went ahead and talked to an agent about the job and he really wanted me to understand that I wouldn't be out there cracking heads right away, that there would probably be some paperwork I'd need to do. There are other jobs that aren't getting out in the street. And he said directly, you know, I've talked to a lot of people who are like, I want to get out there and put people in cuffs right away. But I try to temper expectations and I mean, that speaks to the motivation.

A (8:44)

That says something about the fact that he was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, you won't be able to start denying people their constitutional rights right away.

C (8:50)

Be patient.

B (8:51)

Be patient.

C (8:52)

Yeah.

A (8:53)

So how did you find out that actually you had been offered the actual job?

C (8:59)

It was very strange. So I got an email about a week after the expo that, you know, said you have a tentative offer. You have 48 hours to accept. Here's a bunch of paperwork. And it was paperwork you would expect. You know, have you committed any domestic violence? We need you to sign an affidavit that says you have it. Some medical clearance stuff, background checks, stuff like that, you know, like just basic paperwork. I didn't see the email because I wasn't looking for it. I kept an eye out for the first couple Days. When it didn't come, then I was like, okay, well, they Googled me and this is the end. So I missed this email, completely filled out. None of those forms, none of the paperwork ever went in. A couple weeks later, I did see an email that said, you know, for the next step of your application, we need you to take a drug test. Which, you know, I didn't realize there was a next step. And it was unfortunate, the timing a little bit. Cannabis is legal in New York. I'd partaken about six days before the date, but I decided why not waste their money a little bit and see what happens? So I went in and at this point, I am expecting to hear back, because if you fail a drug test, they're supposed to tell you. When I didn't hear back, I ended up logging onto the ice hiring portal through USAjobs.com and what I found. According to this portal, I received a final offer. I had accepted the final offer and I had an entry on duty date, an EOD date that was three days before I checked. It was September 30th, was the date that I supposedly entered ICE.

A (10:19)

So to be clear here, according to the jobs portal, you not only got the job, you accepted the job and you had your first day of work scheduled.

C (10:30)

Yeah, I mean, I'm sure there was more paperwork to do after the EOD date, but that's the official beginning. You know, when they calculate your retirement, that's the date they use. So, yeah, without signing a single piece of paper, the mind boggles. It really does.

A (10:43)

I mean, I'm. I'm boggled right now. But when you looked through the jobs portal, what concerned you the most?

C (10:51)

The thing I found the most concerning was, you know, obviously I clicked through to try to figure out what had happened and a couple things like, you know, physical fitness was listed as pending, Drug test was still listed as pending, but my background check was listed as completed, and it was listed as completed as of three days in the future. So this was October 3rd, background check completed October 6th. And to me, look, maybe if I'd gone forward with the process, I'd accepted the tentative offer, which was the last step I needed to do. Weirdly, I'd apparently accepted the final offer, but the tentative offer still had to be accepted. Maybe if I'd done that, they would have run the background check. Maybe that was a glitch, but it sure looked to me like they weren't going to run one.

A (11:30)

So you didn't take the job, which on the one hand seems like the Most obvious decision to make. But on the other hand, I'm sure as a journalist and as someone who's very interested in what this would look like, there must have been some part of you that thought about like, I could click the green button, I could take this job, I could go through ICE training until somebody eventually maybe Googles me and is like, hang on a second. Was there a temptation to just be like, let's just see how far we can go with this?

C (12:02)

Oh, yeah. And to this day, I'm not sure I made the right decision. I went back and forth, I stared at it for a while. Ultimately my concern was it wouldn't even have to be ICE themselves that Googled me. If I went to training and some classmate put my name into a Google Doc, it just seemed impossible that eventually the jig would be up. And if that happened while I was in an ICE training facility, I mean, I'm not a domestic terrorist sent from antifa headquarters. That's not a real thing. But they're high in their own supply. And I was very worried that they would decide that I was and that it would go very, very poorly for me.

A (12:34)

The Department of Homeland Security actually responded to your piece on Twitter writing, and I quote, I can't do a Trisha McLachlan imitation, but I imagine I am. This is such a lazy lie. This individual was never offered a job at ice. Applicants may receive a tentative selection letter following their initial application and interview. That is not a job offer. It just means they are invited to submit information for review and similar to any other applicant. Which one? It's kind of telling that you got that far anyway. They're kind of acknowledging like, yes, this person would have gotten that. But you, you posted a great response. Could you tell me about that?

C (13:07)

Yeah, well, I mean, the thing is, they did send me a tentative offer. That part's true. That's not what the article was about though. The article was about the final offer and the EOD date. So I just posted the screen grab video that I took of the portal. Just said, you sure about that? Because again, look, if final offer means something different to them, I'd love to hear about it. I reached out for comment before the article published. Heard nothing. Haven't heard anything about the respons, but I mean, they just haven't responded to the actual article and the actual thing that happened.

A (13:35)

What do you want people to know after you had this experience and what questions do you still have?

C (13:41)

Well, I'd love to know how this happened. I would love to know, if this was just me, which I find very unlikely, or how widespread this is, was this just this event? Is this widespread? Are they doing background checks at all? And that to me is the big takeaway. The most obvious one is like we have these people, they're running around in masks, they're armed, they're on our streets, they are acting with de facto absolute immunity because the DOJ won't prosecute them. And not only do we not know who they are, it seems like ICE might not know who they are. And that should bother everyone, including ice. Frankly, if I was in charge of ice, I would be very concerned that we maybe hadn't vetted everybody. I wouldn't immediately write it off. And I think that is the kind of unprofessional, cavalier indifference that we're seeing towards the well being of really everybody in America. They just don't seem to care.

A (14:34)

Laura, thank you so much for taking the time.

C (14:37)

Yeah, wonderful to be here. Thank you for having me.

A (14:39)

That was my conversation with freelance journalist Laura Jadid. She writes the substack firewalled media.com, we'll link to her work in the show. Notes. Yes, there's more news to get to. Don't worry, we'll get through it all together. If you like the show, subscribe, share with your friends and leave a five star review wherever you're listening. And watch us on YouTube because podcasts are a visual medium now. More to come after some ads. Whataday is brought to you by Deleteme. Deleteme makes it easy, quick and safe to remove your personal data online. At a time when surveillance and data breaches are common enough to make everyone vulnerable, it's easier than ever to find personal information about people online. Having your address, phone number and family members names hanging out on the Internet can have actual consequences in the real world and makes everyone vulnerable. With Deleteme, you can protect your personal privacy or the privacy of your business from doxxing attacks before sensitive information can be exploited. As someone with an active online presence, privacy is really important to me and Deleteme keeps me safe online. Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for Deleteme now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your Delete Me plan when you go to JoinDeleteMe.com wad and use promo code WAD at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to JoinDeleteMe.com WAD and enter code WAD at checkout. That's JoinDeleteMe.com WAD Codewad what a Day is brought to you by the International Rescue Committee. I know the headlines can be overwhelming. There's so much happening and it can make you feel hopeless. Like, what can I do to make a difference? How can I help? Well, for people living in places like Gaza and Sudan, you can make a difference with a gift to the International Rescue Committee. Albert Einstein helped found the organization that became the International Rescue Committee. Ingenuity, fortitude and optimism remain at the heart of the work. The IRC helps people whose lives and livelihoods are shattered by conflict and disaster to survive, recover and gain control of their futures in conflict zones around the world. They respond within 72 hours after an emergency strikes, and they stay as long as they are needed, helping people rebuild their lives. Donations help the IRC provide families with emergency supplies in the aftermath of a crisis and the resources they need to recover and rebuild their lives. From Ukraine to Afghanistan, more people are displaced from their homes than ever before and are in need of emergency assistance this winter. The frigid cold of winter is difficult for anyone, but for children and families in crisis zones, it can be unbearable. Without adequate shelter, heating or cold weather gear, they are fully exposed to the elements. The cold is constant for families living in tents, makeshift shelters or half destroyed buildings without any heating source. With only a thin layer of material separating them from the harsh weather, children and families living in tents are especially vulnerable. Donate today by visiting rescue.org rebuild. Choose to show up with the bold styling of the Mazda CX30.

C (17:48)

I wake up.

A (17:51)

Here's what else we're following today.

C (17:53)

Head of Lines.

D (17:57)

The way that this agency has been functioning is completely against every tenet of law enforcement. So before us right now we have a bill about funding them, giving them more money. I'm not voting for that.

A (18:12)

Minnesota Senator Amy Klobuchar and other Democratic senators are vowing to oppose a funding bill for the Department of Homeland Security, increasing the chance of a partial government shutdown by the end of the week. Democrats were already hesitant to support the bill after an ICE agent fatally shot Renee Goode in Minneapolis earlier this month. But it was the public killing of Alex Preddy over the weekend that prompted Dems to take a more forceful stand. Senator klobuchar spoke to NBC's Meet the Press on Sunday about ICE's budget.

D (18:39)

No, I am not voting for this funding and what could we do to overhaul them? Oh, let me start new leadership stopping these surges across the country, not just in my state, training them like they were supposed to be trained, not just 47 days, which the president picked out because it's his. He's the 47th president. Mandatory body cameras stopping, ramming into people's houses without a judicial warrant. And I could go on.

A (19:06)

Washington Senator Patty Murray, the top Democrat on the Senate Appropriations Committee, initially pushed her colleagues to vote for the DHS bill. But after the shooting, Murray wrote on Twitter that she would not support the bill as it stands and called for it to be split off from the larger funding package. This is where things get tricky. The House sent several funding bills to the Senate as a package. Along with the DHS funding, the measure includes funds for other agencies like the state health and labor departments. Since the bills are packaged together, stripping out the DHS portion would be difficult. The deadline to avoid a shutdown is Friday.

E (19:42)

This is again, as the attorney general said, Donald Trump telling everybody that the election was rigged. Who started all this nightmare for America has nothing to do with it. And I just, I would just give a pro tip to the attorney general. There's 2 million documents in the Epstein files we're still waiting on. Go ahead and work on those.

A (20:01)

On Sunday, Minnesota Democratic Governor Tim Walz clapped back at Attorney General Pam Bondi after she sent a letter of demands to, quote, restore the rule of law in Minnesota. Bondi's ransom like letter comes as the Trump administration has spent weeks pressuring Minnesota to give ICE more access to local penitentiaries. And if Minnesota plays ball, Bondi suggested immigration operations could be scaled back. She's like a mob boss, but with more guns. Bondi also demanded access to Minnesota's voter rolls, claiming the Justice Department needs to verify the state's registration practices comply with federal law. Minnesota Secretary of State Steve Simon said Bondi's letter was, quote, an outrageous attempt to coerce Minnesota into giving the federal government private data on millions of US Citizens in violation of state and federal law, simons said. The answer to Bondi's request is no. The US Said it finalized its withdrawal from the World Health Organization last week, further isolating America on the international stage. The WHO is the United nations specialized health agency. Its job is to coordinate the response to global health threats like MPOX and Ebola. It also provides technical assistance to poorer countries and sets guidelines for hundreds of health conditions. Nearly every country in the world is a member. But on Thursday, Trump made good on his promise to pull America out. The WHO said in a statement that the action makes both the United States and the world less safe. So what to do now? Well, California Democratic Governor Gavin Newsom has a plan to counter Trump's decision. Newsom announced that California became the first American state to join the WHO's Global Outbreak alert and Response Network. Newsom said being a part of the group will in part help California foster partnerships across the globe and remain at the forefront of public health preparedness. Treasury Secretary Scott Besant tried to explain President Trump's latest tariff threats while speaking with ABC News Jonathan Karl on Sunday.

F (21:56)

There's confusion from President Trump on this. I mean, we heard from him just, I think it was nine days ago, eight or nine days ago he had this to say about Canada negotiating with China.

C (22:08)

How do you see the deals?

E (22:09)

Canada and China just signed trade deals.

A (22:12)

Between the two partners.

G (22:14)

Well, that's okay. That's what he should be doing. I mean, it's a good thing for him to sign a trade deal. If you can get a deal with China, he should do that.

F (22:21)

Okay, so he gives a green light to a deal with China just after they do it, and then nine days later he's saying that's it, 100% tariffs?

H (22:27)

Well, no, there's possibility of 100% tariffs.

A (22:30)

If they do a free trade deal. I am still confused. Over the weekend, Trump threatened to impose a 100% tariff on goods imported from Canada if Canada went forward with a trade deal with China. But Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney noted his recent agreement with China merely addresses tariffs between the two countries. Carney very calmly told reporters on Sunday he had no intention of pursuing a free trade deal with China. Earlier this month, Carney cut Canada's 100% tariff on Chinese electric cars in return for lower tariffs on Canadian products like canola oil. Makes sense to me. And that's the news. Before we go, you see the headlines ICE raids heightened federal policing. Now learn the strategy in response. If you're in Pittsburgh, join us on February 17th for a night of learning and organizing featuring Empire City host Chenjerai Komanika alongside Pennsylvania Democratic Representative Summer Lee. Get your free tickets@crookedideas.org EmpireCity if you're asking how we got here, Crooked's award winning podcast Empire City the untold origin story of the NYPD breaks down how the biggest police force in the world was built and what that history tells us about power, policing and public safety. Today, Tianjerai is also hosting a virtual Crooked Ideas Empire City podcast club starting March 31, where you'll dig into the themes of the show, connect the dots, wrestle with big questions, and imagine what real safety could look like for all of us. Sign up@crookedideas.org EmpireCity that's all for today. If you like the show, make sure you subscribe, leave a review, stand with the good people of Minneapolis and tell your friends to listen. And if you're into reading, not just about how the Minnesota Timberwolves held a moment of silence in honor of Alex Bright Pretty on Sunday and fans, well, they said what needed to be said.

H (24:29)

Please join us in honoring the life in memory of Alice Purdy with a moment of silence.

A (24:45)

Like me, what a Day is also a nightly newsletter. Check it out and subscribe@qriket.com subscribe I'm Jane Coston and stay safe. Minnesota. What a Day is a production of Crooked Media. It's recorded and mixed by Desmond Taylor. Our associate producers are Emily Foer and Chris Allport. Our producer is Kaitlyn Plummer. Our video editor is Joseph Toutra. Our video producer is Johanna Case. We had production help today from Ethan Oberman, Greg Walters and Matt Burke. Our senior producer is Erika Morrison and our senior vice president of news and politics is Adrienne Hill. Our theme music is by Kyle Murdoch and Jordan Kanter. We had help today from the Associated Press. Our production staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America. East Foreign.

I (25:49)

Hey, this is Will Arnett, host of Smartless. Smartless is a podcast with myself and Sean Hayes and Jason Bateman, where each week one of us reveals a mystery guest of the other two. We dive deep with guests that you love, like Bill Hader, Selena Gomez, Jennifer Aniston, David Beckham, Kristen Stewart and tons more. So join us for a genuinely improvised and authentic conversation filled with laughter and newfound knowledge to feed the smartless mind. Listen to Smartless now on the SiriusXM app. Download it today.

H (26:24)

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