What A Day – Episode Summary Episode: The Vax Wars Are Here
Date: December 9, 2025
Host: Jane Coaston (A)
Guest: Dr. Dimitri Daskalakis (B), former CDC Director of the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases
Podcast: Crooked Media

Main Theme & Purpose

The central theme of this episode is a seismic change in American vaccine policy: the CDC's Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP) voted to end its universal recommendation that all newborns be vaccinated against hepatitis B. Jane Coaston breaks down what happened, why it matters, and what it reveals about the current turmoil in public health institutions, with expert commentary from Dr. Dimitri Daskalakis. The episode also touches on broader news in politics and business, but its heart is the dramatic and controversial shakeup in vaccination guidance.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. CDC Recommendation Change: The End of Universal Hepatitis B Vaccination for Newborns

• Overview: The CDC’s ACIP voted 8-3 to drop universal Hepatitis B vaccination at birth, instead advising parents of hepatitis B-negative mothers to discuss “when or if” to vaccinate with their doctors.
• Approval Pending: The policy still requires sign-off by Acting CDC Director Jim O’Neill, who lacks medical experience and is a former investment fund manager with close ties to Peter Thiel and Vice President J.D. Vance.

  “No medical expertise or data showed the vaccine caused any harm ahead of the decision and it didn't matter.” — Jane Coaston (00:52)

2. The Scientific & Public Health Context

• Hepatitis B Vaccine Success:

  • Since its broad implementation in 1991, universal newborn vaccination dramatically reduced hepatitis B cases among children.
  • The vaccine is key because the virus can be contracted not just through birth or intravenous drug use, but also ordinary household contact (sharing razors, nail clippers, etc.).

  “Before the birth dose…there were tens of thousands of newborns diagnosed... Now, it's just a dozen or so cases a year.” — Dr. Daskalakis (02:39–03:46)

• High Stakes:

  • 90% of infected newborns become chronic carriers, with a quarter dying of complications later.

  “I like to think of the hepatitis B virus kind of like a toxin in your body… and as long as that toxin's floating around, your liver can potentially get very sick.” — Dr. Daskalakis (04:41)

• No Scientific Basis for Change:

  • No evidence or new data suggests the vaccine is harmful or unnecessary.
  • The new policy—testing mothers, individualized decisions, lab tests after first dose—lacks scientific support and is impractical.

  “There's no new science that would indicate there's any reason to change it.” — Dr. Daskalakis (05:06) “They recommended getting the first dose, checking a lab…then deciding on subsequent doses… There's no data that supports that.” — Dr. Daskalakis (05:24)

3. ACIP’s New Ideological Make-Up & Dysfunction

• Committee Purging:

  • In July 2025, the CDC fired all 17 long-serving scientific members, citing "conflicts of interest," and replaced them with ideologically-aligned individuals, many with anti-vaccine leanings.

  “They replaced them with a group of people who were mainly ideologically aligned with Secretary Kennedy, conspiracy theorists, people who support, for lack of any better terminology, anti vaccine ideology.” — Dr. Daskalakis (06:34)

• Decision-Making Chaos:

  • The meeting was marked by confusion, shifting language, and apparent lack of clarity among members about what exactly they were voting on.

  “It was a dumpster fire as far as meetings go.” — Dr. Daskalakis (07:50)

4. Anti-Vaxx Comparisons with Other Countries (e.g., Denmark)

• Some involved justify ending universal hepb vaccination by citing countries like Denmark, which do not vaccinate all newborns.
• Dr. Daskalakis counters that the U.S. lacks Denmark’s robust universal healthcare system and detailed medical records; the American policy errs on the side of caution to prevent any child from dying of vaccine-preventable diseases.

  “I would love to mimic the Danish…schedule once we have universal health care.” — Dr. Daskalakis (09:38)

5. Why This Vote Is Profoundly Important

• Precedent Set:
  • Changing vaccine policy on a whim, without a new public health problem or supporting science, paves a dangerous path.
  • The White House followed up by empowering the CDC and Secretary Kennedy to “fix” the vaccine schedule in the same arbitrary fashion, possibly without public input.

  “It is a precedent that says that they can just do that…without any supporting data…they can change the schedule for children in the US.” — Dr. Daskalakis (11:01)

6. Where Should Parents Turn Now?

• Loss of Trust:
  • With the CDC’s judgment compromised, Dr. Daskalakis advises parents to follow guidance from their pediatricians and professional organizations like the AAP and ACOG.

  “All of them say to ignore this recommendation.” — Dr. Daskalakis (12:32)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “If we're going to make our decisions based on data, I want to see the data. And I repeatedly asked for it and… No data of harm was presented. There were speculations.” — Dr. Joe Hilbin, ACIP member, via CNN (01:44–01:57)
• “When you take care of someone like a child, they're bloody, sometimes they're snotty, they're messy… that virus can live… for a while. And so it could happen that a child is infected just in the routine course of taking care.” — Dr. Daskalakis (03:46)
• “They pretty much got up there and said whatever they wanted to say, and then they voted however they wanted to vote.” — Dr. Daskalakis (11:03)
• “It kills me to say, as someone who loves CDC, all of them say to ignore this recommendation.” — Dr. Daskalakis (12:32)

Important Timestamps

• 00:19–02:10: Jane Coaston introduces ACIP’s controversial vote & its political context.
• 02:10–06:26: Deep dive with Dr. Daskalakis on hepatitis B vaccine’s history and efficacy.
• 06:26–09:20: Discussion on ACIP’s ideological shift and dysfunction.
• 09:20–10:22: Comparisons to Denmark and international vaccine standards.
• 10:22–11:47: Why this policy change is alarming and sets new precedent.
• 11:47–12:38: Advice for parents in a destabilized public health environment.

Additional News Briefs (from [15:14] onward)

While the main focus is on vaccine policy, the episode also covers:

• Supreme Court Hearing (15:20–16:58): Trump's push for more presidential control over independent agencies, and its far-reaching implications.
• Media & Streaming Wars (16:58–18:15): Paramount’s surprise hostile bid for Warner Bros. Discovery against Netflix, political angles, and the involvement of Jared Kushner’s investment firm.
• Trump’s Aid to Farmers (19:55–21:13): New $12B farmer bailout funded by tariffs; a policy circle reflecting his first administration.

Overall Tone

Informative, urgent, and laced with the podcast’s trademark irreverent wit. Jane Coaston demystifies complex public policy and scientific issues for listeners who want to understand not just what is happening, but why — and what to do about it.

Summary prepared for listeners who want a concise yet thorough understanding of the episode’s major themes and takeaways, particularly regarding the controversial upheaval of the U.S. vaccine schedule.