← What Are You Made Of?
What Are You Made Of?
From Ethics to Evidence: The Truth About Veganism, Muscle, and Aging with Karina Inkster
00:32:30
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- [00:00]
A
What's happening everybody? We're back on the what are you made of show. It's your boy C Rock here. I'm with Karina Inkster. She's going to share what she's made of today and we're going to get into what she's doing and why she's doing it. She's all about. No, no bs. It sounds like to me based on reading her her bio. That's the podcast she has. No bs. Vegan podcast. Karina, welcome to the show.
- [00:22]
B
Thanks so much for having me on, Mike.
- [00:23]
A
Yeah, my pleasure, my pleasure. Okay, so first of all, before I forget, let me ask you this question. What are you made of?
- [00:32]
B
I love that question. What am I made of? Okay, well, structurally probably tofu and dark chocolate and an unreasonable number of chin ups, but psychologically, I would say compassion, skepticism, a very low tolerance for diet culture, which might go along with the skepticism. Yeah, but it's kind of a good mix of like skepticism, not as cynicism but you know, being evidence based, questioning things, but also being positive and kind of ridiculous.
- [01:08]
A
All right, good mix, good mix. So you're, you're not one of those people that see something on social media and then all of a sudden just takes it up and then goes and tells people, hey, they say you should do this.
- [01:17]
B
Right, Exactly.
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A
I don't know who the hell they are.
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B
I don't know who those people are.
- [01:22]
A
Yeah, yeah. And in this space of health and wellness, it's very dangerous nowadays because somebody be a very good marketer or not afraid to put content out and be consistent with it and high volume with it and then everybody just listens to what they say because they see them all the time.
- [01:37]
B
Well, this is the issue. Well, one of many issues in the fitness industry. I'm part of the fitness industry, but I have a lot of critiques about it. So I feel like I'm chipping away at this giant mountain of BS just doing what I'm doing. But part of the challenge is you have legitimate evidence based information that will help people with their health, but at the same time, people are making money. And when that happens, you have crazy marketing claims and you have pseudoscience and you have people saying whatever the hell they want on social media. So the combination is.
- [02:08]
A
Yeah. The kind of conflict at least. Well, that's what we're dealing with with Big Pharma too, of course. It's a money making machine. And, and it's like, man, you know, those with money get to do what they want to do. It Seems like, you know, and if you get in their way and you start making some money, then they come after you. I. I just talked to a guy earlier that was doing very well, had plenty of attorneys that. That would make sure he was doing things the right way and everything, and the. The Fed still came after him.
- [02:35]
B
Oh, wow.
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A
And. And there was a. There was a. What do they call that? A hidden agenda, I guess they had. So they.
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B
Oh, yeah, right. There's a lot of those.
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A
Yeah. So, man, it's like crazy world we live in. But anyway, why vegan? Why no meat?
- [02:50]
B
Good question. It started when I was 11. So when I was 11, I had a pet hamster. His name was Basil. Oh, no.
- [02:56]
A
I don't know. I don't like where this story's going.
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B
Don't worry, I didn't eat him. Don't worry.
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A
Okay.
- [03:00]
B
But at some point, I don't know how, I don't know why, I realized the roast chicken dinner I'm about to eat is kind of similar to my hamster, Basil. Like, they both. The chicken and the hamster both have a heartbeat. They both have, you know, brains and eyes and favorite foods, presumably. But one of them got dessert and one of them became dinner. I made a little birthday cake for my hamster when. When I was 11, as one does, right? And I was like, okay, that's a bit weird, you know, go about my day. But as I went further into it, I realized, oh, actually chickens can count. They can play tricks on each other. They're actually kind of smart. Smarter than the hamster who can't even count to one. But one of them I'm eating and one of them I'm not. So there's this cognitive dissonance bubbling up.
- [03:47]
A
Right.
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B
Anyway, I went vegetarian at the age of 11, but it took me five years to realize that the meat, dairy and egg industries are all connected. You know, I mean, the dairy industry produces veal calves because the cows have to be pregnant to make milk, you know, and the chicken meat and the egg industries are intertwined. So at that point, I was 16, went vegan for ethical reasons. But at this point, it's more than that. At this point, it's climate action. At this point, it's, if we don't do something about this climate emergency, we're screwed in like eight years from now.
- [04:23]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [04:24]
B
So a lot of it is now kind of larger, but it started from ethics. Okay.
- [04:29]
A
So I'm going to. I'm going to need some education here as we go through this, so please excuse My ignorance. So first of all, I want to know, when you were at 11 years old and went vegan or vegetarian, I'm sorry, vegetarian at that age, were you like, in the know of what you needed to do to make sure you had all the nutrients you needed for anything that you were missing?
- [04:47]
B
I did not. But my parents are both academics and so the first thing they said was, you got to get your ass to the library because we had no Internet at the time, this is the 90s, and do some research, learn about getting your nutrients and your variety of your foods and your protein and et cetera. So thanks to them for kicking me in the butt for actually doing it properly. You hear sometimes about people who went vegetarian or vegan and they like withered away or they had no energy or whatever. It's usually because they're just cutting out stuff, right. They're not replacing it with anything. They're, you know, nutrient deficient somehow because they're just removing things. So I didn't know at the time, but I learned and I'm grateful. My parents were, were backing that up at the time.
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A
Yeah, yeah, I'd say so. Because you get real sick if you don't do it the right way, you know?
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B
Yeah. With any diet, any, any kind of big dietary change like that.
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A
For sure, sure. Man. And then, and then how, how many years until you went vegan and why did you switch to vegan?
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B
Five years. I went vegan when I was 16, which was 23 years ago. And that was entirely for ethical reasons because the meat, dairy, egg industries are all one and the same, morally indistinguishable from each other.
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A
And the difference between vegetarian and vegan? Vegetarians only vegetables. Right.
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B
Vegetarian is no meat.
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A
Okay, gotcha.
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B
Vegan is no animal.
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A
Okay, gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. Yeah, I told you. Excuse me for my ignorance. I think I knew that before, but I just wanted to test you and see if you knew it.
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B
Does it does, it does include vegetables in both contexts.
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A
Okay, so no eggs. No eggs, no cheese, no dairy. So then as far as milk goes, it's coconut milk, almond milk, soy milk, those kind of things. What about the things that we're hearing nowadays about those kind of milks being.
- [06:32]
B
Bad for you, health wise? I mean, it could go either way. There's, there's this faction in veganism that is like very whole foods only, no added ingredients, no added sugar, no oil, Right? Yeah, that's kind of, I would say excessive. Honestly, it's not evidence based. You don't have to go that far for your health. What I don't hear a lot because dairy is subsidized by the government and soy milk is not. Is how the vast majority of the population worldwide, like 70 to 75% of humans everywhere are lactose intolerant. So, you know, food guides that have dairy as a category now are being called racist because they only apply to people who can digest lactose, which is mostly non indigenous people. So there's kind of the other side to it is like, okay, yeah, not every vegan food is. Is built equal. I mean, I could sit around and eat Twizzlers and french fries and Oreos all day and call myself vegan.
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A
Right, yeah.
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B
But on the other side, what are we not hearing about animal products and why?
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A
Yeah, well, yeah, there's so much to the story of everything that we don't know and then we just accept and then we just go into it. So. So there was something about, oh, the food pyramid in the United States. They just flipped the food pyramid.
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B
They did, yes.
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A
Can you speak to that?
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B
Oh my God, don't even get me started, dude. This is like a whole other podcast episode. Well, unfortunately, the vast majority of the folks who had a say in that have direct connections, like direct personal involvement with the dairy and the meat industries. You know, not to put Canada against the States, but I will in this case. We finally, for the first time ever, have a food guide that isn't connected to industry. They actually made it a big deal. You know, it's. It's evidence based only. And the interesting thing is it has no dairy category.
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A
None.
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B
And it's evidence based. Isn't that interesting?
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A
Wow. Well, what about like the fact that we, we drink. If we nurse as kids, we drink our mother's milk.
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B
Yeah.
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A
But it's not true. It's not. It's not cow milk, but it's.
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B
It's not cow milk. That's the thing.
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A
It's a human. It's a organism's milk.
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B
Yep.
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A
But your, your issue. Yeah, Your issue is mainly that it's the cow or from another species, basically.
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B
Yeah. And also that it's, it's like. I don't know if consent is the right word. I'm not trying to place animals and humans on the same moral scale because they're not. But it's. Exploitation is the word I would use, I think, is it's not necessary. We can be perfectly healthy without animal products. Perfectly delicious diets too, by the way. So I don't see it as being necessary. And it's A cruel industry. It's just not.
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A
Yeah, there's.
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B
There's no compassion there. It's all about profits.
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A
There was something.
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B
Even on small scale farms, you have to take the calf away from its mother to get its milk.
- [09:37]
A
Yes. There's a documentary on milk and a company. I'm not going to name the company right now, but I remember seeing that and I was like, oh, wow. But I. But I grew up drinking milk and I'm just going to continue and all this is what. I honestly was just telling you what went through my head, you know, And.
- [09:52]
B
Well, this is the thing. One of my podcast guests called it the cultural coma of food. Like, I grew up eating meat and loving beef jerky and drinking milk every single day. Like, we're all. Well, I wouldn't say we're all. A lot of us have been raised in that environment and it's just normal. We don't, we don't second guess it. We don't think about it.
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A
Yeah. Have you, have you sacrificed muscle at all, volume, muscle at all by not eating meat or dairy or anything like that? Is it a different, I don't know, different quality of muscle? I don't know.
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B
Well, I wouldn't know because I started strength training when I was 16, which is the same time I went vegan. So I've never strength trained as a non vegan, but there's a recent study that came out that pitted an omnivorous diet against a vegan diet. They had to match calories and protein, though, and there was no difference, no difference at all in strength gain, muscle gain, hypertrophy, et cetera. The important thing is matching your diet for calories and protein.
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A
Yep.
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B
Like you could eat a salad the size of your torso for a hundred calories, which is not much. Right, right. A lot of people will eat the same volume of food. Like their plate is the same amount full as before, but they're not getting as many calories, which is great if you're trying to lose weight, but if you're an active person, you want to build muscle, you might actually need to eat more in terms of volume.
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A
Right.
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B
To get the same number of calories, right.
- [11:19]
A
Yeah, a hundred percent. And. And something I wanted to say on that was the. We talked. You just mentioned something about the protein amount. Yeah. So protein amount. Let's talk about that for a second. Um, well, but I know what I wanted to ask you. Don't. Do you ever miss having a burger like. Like that?
- [11:36]
B
I did. You know, beef jerky was my favorite food when I Was a kid. Oh my God. Like seriously, I'm not, I always say I'm not vegan because I don't like the taste of meat. I think meat is freaking delicious. Like objectively, it just is. So I did miss beef jerky, maybe burgers.
- [11:53]
A
Do you ever cheat and have a beef jerky? Once in a while and don't tell anybody?
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B
No, no, not at all. But here's the thing though. Nowadays, like you know, 23 years ago we had like the soy burgers that were basically cardboard and disgusting. But now we have impossible burgers and beyond burgers. And they're delicious. We grill them on the barbecue.
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A
Yeah.
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B
They're awes. Awesome. Yeah. So at this point. No.
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A
Yeah. And, and the other thing is gerontology, isn't that the study of aging?
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B
Yes.
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A
Yeah. So let's talk about aging with. When it comes to vegan versus omnivore diet, you know.
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B
Yeah, I like Omnivore because, you know, everyone who's not vegan, unless you're on the opposite spectrum and you're legitimately only eating meat, which is its own problem. But omnivore is just like animal and plants in some combination. Yeah. So there's a lot of research that shows plant based. So like a hundred percent vegan diets are associated with lower risks of things like cancer, diabetes, cardiovascular disease and they're also associated with a longer lifespan. Here's the thing that I think needs more research though. What do those diets actually look like and what are they being compared to? I'm not one of those vegans who's going to tell you that vegan is the only healthy option. I think the Mediterranean diet has a lot of evidence behind it to also be very healthy and to lead to people living long healthy lives.
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A
So yeah, Mediterranean diet. Mediterranean diet has. Is fish. Does it have red meat in it? Is the Mediterranean?
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B
I don't think so. I don't think so. It's more olive oil, vegetables, fish, Seafood mainly.
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A
Maybe chicken. Maybe chicken.
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B
Yeah, possibly, yeah. Like lean meats. Yeah.
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A
Poor smart chickens that can count. I just, I just went to a Greek restaurant last night and they have kebabs. Right. And they had the chicken and oh, you know what else? They use lamb too. Oh.
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B
So yeah, yeah, yeah.
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A
But, but yeah, so I get it. And yeah, it seems like there's those Mediterranean diet people, they, over in Europe, I mean, it's like, what do they call them? Blue zones. Right. Or people live longer.
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B
Exactly. Yeah.
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A
Yeah. It's interesting. All right, so then as you were growing up and into this lifestyle, diet, the way you're eating. When did you decide to get into fitness and nutrition? Was it at that time or wait, did you wait till you got to university or.
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B
Well, I got into strength training, specifically fairly young. I don't even remember how, honestly.
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A
Were you an athlete?
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B
No, no, I was a band nerd. I grew up hating anything PE related in school. I'm like the music geek, basically. But there was a class in my grade 12 year in a brand new high school that had a full weightlifting room that was strength training. Like, as a high school credit class, I was like, this is sweet. So my friend Holly and I were the only two females in that whole class. Absolutely crushing it. Learning correct form, learning all the big lifts. You know, I think that started something.
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A
Yeah.
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B
I was already interested enough to be like, oh, this is cool, let me take this class. Yeah, but it did start something.
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A
And then the first time, do you remember like, the first time lifting and overdoing it and how sore you were?
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B
No, but I do remember, like, chin ups are my favorite thing in the world. I do remember hanging from a bar, moving like 0.5 of an inch and being like, how is this even possible? How do people do this?
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A
Yeah. You know, I have a story. I played college football and I used to do pull ups all the time. And then.
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B
Right.
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A
And then I got fat. I got married. My wife had her. I had that sympathy weight and I got out of shape and my buddies were like, hey, let's go back to the gym. You know, let's go work out today. And I was in the mortgage business and we're sitting around all day, you know, and so I go to the gym with them and I could barely get halfway up. And I was just like.
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B
Right.
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A
I was so, like, discouraged, pissed off at myself. And I was just like, how does that go away so quick?
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B
I know.
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A
And then I just work my way back. It's all about working your way to it though, right? I mean, exactly. Get one.
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B
Yeah.
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A
Then the next day, keep going, get another one. How many can you do at one time now?
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B
Well, my PR with really good form is 15, but I also can do them with 50 extra pounds. Like on a weight belt.
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A
Yeah.
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B
You know, it's all right.
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A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love doing that. Actually, I haven't done that in a while. I usually. And I'm not a kipper either. You know how. No, no, super strict.
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B
None of that.
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A
Like, if I'm gonna do pull ups, I'm gonna do them the right way. You know, I even actually put my toes, like point my toes to the. Make sure my legs are straight and I don't bend my knees, chest to bar.
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B
Full range of motion.
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A
Yeah, yeah. When you're, when you're rocking that though, man, like there's, I don't, I don't know that there's a better feeling of, of in the gym of like doing, doing a pull up and it feeling easy. Yeah, that's. I don't know anybody else has experienced that besides us too, but it's like.
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B
I'm sure they have.
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A
When it's hard, it sucks. Like sometimes it just doesn't feel good. Maybe you haven't done them in a while or maybe it's just a bad day, but those days, well, it does.
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B
You lose it pretty quickly. Right. So to your story.
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A
Yeah.
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B
If you don't do them regularly, they decrease pretty damn fast.
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A
Yeah, yeah. It's a powerful thing, man. When you feel like. And you could actually, when you're doing it and you're locked in, you can actually, it feels, you feel like a machine. You feel the back muscles, the biceps are working great.
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B
Absolutely.
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A
Yeah. I'm kind of geeking out on pull ups right now. Thanks.
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B
Hey, I got no issues with that.
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A
Yeah.
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B
So my favorite move in the world.
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A
Yeah, I, I really, I like that. Yeah. And by the way, I just want to throw this out there. I just turned 49 last Friday and I PR'd on my front squat. I got 315 on the front squat.
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B
And congrats.
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A
I, I was really shocked by that because I hate front squats. Like, I don't like the way it makes my wrist feel. I had a good rack position.
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B
That's awesome.
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A
Yeah.
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B
Happy belated birthday too.
- [17:37]
A
Thank you. Thank you. Doing something right, you know. All right, so you got into the gym, the gym life from high school. And then when you went to college, did you immediately know what you were going to do when you got there or did you take a look?
- [17:50]
B
No, I had like 12 different career ideas at the time. So I did my undergrad in psychology being like, oh, maybe I'll do some counseling or something. And then I did my master's in gerontology being like, oh, maybe I'll become an academic researcher type. And then halfway through the ma, I was like, I kind of miss working with people one on one. This is very 10,000 foot level social sciences, you know, looking at population data and such. So I, I did a 180 and became a fitness coach in the same month that I Defended my thesis, which I would not recommend. Would not recommend. But I was like, okay, enough of this. Research has a time and a place. I learned some super important skills, like lit reviews. I had to run my own scientific study. Super grateful for all that, but I didn't want to do that as a career. So became a trainer. Started working with people one on one.
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A
Like at a local gym.
- [18:41]
B
Yep. Yeah. In one of those. Like, like you're running your own business, but you're in a shared space.
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A
Okay.
- [18:47]
B
You rent by the client kind of thing. So that was great. I did that for seven years, focusing just on general population. People who want to get strong, people who want to kick butt till they're 100. You know, lift heavy things. But then in 2017, my husband and I decided we wanted to move from Vancouver to Powell river, which is a very small town. Beautiful spot. Like, our backyard is a forest. There's black bears walking through our backyard. It's amazing. And the open water swimming here is amazing. That's a huge thing of mine. Oceans. There's 36 lakes within like a 20 minute drive of my house. Jeez.
- [19:22]
A
Ridiculous.
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B
It's nuts. Pacific Northwest, beautiful. Mountain biking, hiking, paddleboarding, all the things. The thing is, we had to bring our businesses with us. And I didn't want to restart an in person coaching business in a tiny little town where I didn't know a single person. So we both made a plan to go 100% online so that we could move, which we did, by the way. And we bought our house sight unseen in a town we'd never visited before, which is kind of insane. Anyway, my husband is a web developer, so he's already doing most things online. He's doing like zoom calls with his clients. He doesn't have to be in an office. But I had to really change my business model from in person coaching to online programming. It felt like starting a new business. So that's 2017. And at that point I decided I needed a niche. For online businesses of any kind, it's best to have a really specific niche where you're servicing one type of client so they can find you and they connect with your messaging. And that was vegans over 40 who want to get super strong so they can kick ass till they're 103. So we don't do, you know, like physique comps, we don't do like endurance training events, that kind of stuff. It's like real life strength. So at that point, the veganism part became part of the business.
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A
Okay.
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B
Fairly late in the game.
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A
Gotcha. And then, and then how did you know how to market online? I did not take us through that part.
- [20:53]
B
I had to BS my way at that point.
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A
Was it basically social media or did you start running ads or how did that work?
- [20:59]
B
No, I'm actually not really big on social media. Like I'm on there to show prospects that I'm a real human, but that's about it. Yeah, it's all organic search, it's all SEO, mostly unpaid people typing in vegan personal trainer. And then we show up.
- [21:15]
A
Okay, so you, you created a great landing page website with great keywords to get your SEO maximized and then sat back and wait, waited.
- [21:25]
B
It's a long game for sure. Mind you, at that point I already had a book out, so my first book came out in 2014. So there were a couple years of a vegan related book about active living and it's got recipes and stuff. There were a couple years of that book being out in the world, creating backlinks, setting up my name, et cetera. So I was a little ahead of the game because of that.
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A
Okay, so take me through this. So when you did this, then people are organically searching, they find you, you pop up. Then you optimized your site for them to be able to click on something and fill out a form or something. Or how did, how did you pull them in exactly?
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B
Okay, yeah, it's an application kind of thing. So they're warm leads. Because usually folks are searching for specifically what my team and I are offering. Vegan nutrition coaching, vegan strength training, whatever. And the vegan part is important because we also deal with nutrition. So all of our, all of our. We don't do diet plans because we're not dietitians, but you know, nutrition resources, menu ideas, et cetera. They're all plant based.
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A
Gotcha. Did you, did you have a blog going as well?
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B
I did, yeah. So that's articles and content I don't.
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A
Know about nowadays, but it was definitely important. I think it still is with AI.
- [22:32]
B
It is. You know what though? I've noticed that we're showing up in AI summaries, but fewer people are clicking because they're getting the answers they want from the AI summary and then they don't go to the website.
- [22:42]
A
Yeah, yeah. Oh, let's talk about that for a second. So we have to evolve as technology evolves. That is true. Because if I wanted a meal plan, I don't need to go to anybody anymore. I can just search AI and then also have it Shape it the way I want it as well. Go back, say, yeah, no, change this. Add some pizza in there too. So I can eat pizza once in a while.
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B
Right. Gotta be realistic.
- [23:07]
A
How do you eat pizza?
- [23:09]
B
I use non dairy cheese or no cheese at all. So nowadays there's actually pretty decent, like stretchy, melty. Yeah, Lots of options.
- [23:17]
A
What do they make it out of?
- [23:19]
B
Oh, all sorts of things. I'm actually allergic to tree nuts.
- [23:21]
A
Yeah.
- [23:21]
B
But a lot of it is made with cashews.
- [23:23]
A
Okay.
- [23:24]
B
I can't have that kind.
- [23:25]
A
Never heard of that.
- [23:26]
B
Tell me it's good.
- [23:27]
A
Wow.
- [23:27]
B
Yeah, we've got a local pizza place here that makes like the fire oven, whatever it's called.
- [23:32]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [23:33]
B
You know, like from scratch pizza. And I don't know what vegan cheese they use, but it's freaking amazing. Like melts and. Yeah, it's awesome.
- [23:40]
A
Well, I've had cauliflower crust pizza before. I like that. That's pretty good.
- [23:44]
B
Okay. I don't know. I don't know. I'm. I'm not 100. I'm just like, dude, if you're gonna eat pizza, do it properly.
- [23:49]
A
I know, but I mean, I've had it before when I'm trying to like keep the carbs low, you know, like some days, like it's a carb cycle sometimes.
- [23:55]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [23:56]
A
So sometimes I'll have that thin crust cauliflower pizza and you know, it's just pat myself on the back for doing a good thing that day and then.
- [24:03]
B
Move on and go eat some ice cream. Yeah.
- [24:05]
A
Last night I had a couple slices of pizza, real pizza though. And anyway, there you go. So, yeah, talk about like, what are you doing to evolve with AI coming out and, and things like.
- [24:15]
B
Well, I think I'm still figuring that out. I mean, all of us, even people who have been in business forever, I mean, I started in 2011, so it's, you know, 15 years. All of us are figuring things out as we go along. None of us really know exactly what we're doing. It's not exactly like, you know, throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks. We do, we do have a plan generally, but we got to try things, we got to test things. So at this point it's actually not so much about the content anymore. It used to be, this is like a very recent change. It used to be about giving a whole crap ton of value, fixing someone's problem, giving them information on vegan protein sources, whatever it is. And you're building trust that way. Now it's more about positioning yourself as the answer to their problem, not the content.
- [25:08]
A
Yup. 100%. It comes down to differentiation, Right?
- [25:12]
B
Yes.
- [25:13]
A
We used to have to differentiate ourselves from other people that were in our space.
- [25:16]
B
Exactly.
- [25:17]
A
But now we got to differentiate ourselves from technology.
- [25:20]
B
Yes, exactly.
- [25:22]
A
Because there's no connection there. Really. I mean, no.
- [25:25]
B
And I mean, from a coaching perspective, I don't think coaching is going anywhere. Like, we're not going to be replaced by AI because 90% of what we're doing is human relationship. Yeah, sure, it's online, but we know our clients pretty well. We're in contact with them every day in some contexts. So the relationship and the iteration, you know, and changing things on the go, listening to people, that's not going anywhere.
- [25:51]
A
Yeah, here's, here's something. I create AI bots that are coaches and consultants and advisors for me in different areas. Right. Here's what I have a problem with, though, is that I got to be honest with myself with it, because if I try to BS it, it doesn't pick up on my bs. Speaking of. Yeah, right. Yes. All you want through the AI. And it usually is not going to call you out on it unless you build it that way so that it picks up on your bs. But it still doesn't know that you're BS in it. A coach.
- [26:19]
B
No. And it's, it's usually very like, oh, what a great idea. You're a genius. And it's not really. Unless you tell it.
- [26:26]
A
Yeah.
- [26:26]
B
Specifically call me out on my bs. It won't.
- [26:29]
A
Yeah, but, but like, that's how it responds to you. Right. In the attitude or the tone that you can program it like that, but it still doesn't know if you're BSing it and telling the truth.
- [26:41]
B
Yeah, that's true.
- [26:42]
A
Right. That's the part I'm talking about. And that, that's like a nervous system thing. And, and when, like, let's say you were having a call right now and you're coaching me, you'd be able to see through my stuff by just some of the questions you asked me. Right. And.
- [26:53]
B
Right.
- [26:54]
A
That's not happening. So that's.
- [26:56]
B
And body language and how you're responding and that kind of stuff. Yeah, that's not getting picked up.
- [27:00]
A
Yeah, Yeah. I think people, you know, but. And a lot of people still aren't using AI. They're still afraid of it.
- [27:06]
B
It's true.
- [27:07]
A
They might be using it. I think a lot of people go to AI first and they, they Google search on it. Like they use it like it's Google instead of prompting it effectively.
- [27:16]
B
Exactly.
- [27:17]
A
I think I did that at first, but then I figured it out. But anyway. All right. And then podcasting for you. When did you start the podcast and what has podcasting done for you in your business?
- [27:28]
B
Well, I started the podcast in 2018, so the same year that we moved and started being completely online. Mostly what it's done is grown my network. It's been insane for making connections. So speaking about this connections thing with other humans. Right. There are so many people I never would have had hour long one on one conversations with if I didn't have a podcast. Now it's also helping other people. It's a free resource on plant based fitness and myth busting and you know, nutrition, all that kind of stuff. So it's great as a resource but for me personally, it has absolutely ballooned my professional network.
- [28:13]
A
Yeah, I agree. I agree. I like, I tell people this all the time. Right. Because we work with high level people and they want to get on podcasts. I want to get exposure and that's great. Don't get me wrong, that's icing on a cake as far as I'm concerned because I guessing obviously hosting too. I made some great relationships, but guesting for me, for some reason podcast hosts are some of the most connected people on the planet. Not everybody's a guest is really connected, but hosts are and they love connecting people. And if I look to serve them and paid, you know, any kind of interest, genuine interest in them, paid attention and interest in them, it's like a switch would go off and they would want to champion me and introduce me to people and invite me to exactly different places and, and so one, one podcast has been worth over a million dollars to me in relationships. Not sales from the podcast. Right. Not like.
- [29:00]
B
No. But like connections.
- [29:01]
A
But the connection.
- [29:02]
B
Yeah. Follow through and stuff.
- [29:03]
A
Yeah. And it's been. And, and people only knew. Well, I'll tell them all the time. But if they only knew what I've experienced and what I'm seeing now experienced through some of the clients we work with is like they would, it would be a no brainer. It's, it's totally. You can't reach your potential if you're not doing probably one to two a week that, that are on top intentionally aligned shows. So I'm glad you said that because that's. I preach that all the time about the network. Yeah.
- [29:27]
B
Well to, to use that kind of same rule. Like a recent example, not from podcasting, but from networking.
- [29:34]
A
Yeah.
- [29:35]
B
Is doing a TEDx talk. So I did my first TEDx talk.
- [29:38]
A
Congratulations.
- [29:40]
B
Oh, thank you. I have some critiques about the TEDx ecosystem. I think it's a little performative and I don't know, it's not totally my jam, but anyway, me neither. Great opportunity. And you know what? One of the main things for me that came out of that experience was the networking with my fellow speakers. Wasn't expecting that. There's 12 speakers all going through the same process for months. Of course we would hang out and of course we would network. These are high level professionals.
- [30:09]
A
Yep.
- [30:10]
B
Some of whom have absolutely insane life experiences. So now when someone comes to me saying, hey, do you know someone who, blah, blah, blah, those people are front of mind.
- [30:20]
A
Yep, a hundred percent. So, you know, for me, I'm all about networking and people. Everything I do, like if I go to an event, I don't even sit and listen to speakers anymore. I used to sit and listen to speakers, but I'll sit out the hallway, stand. I don't sit, stand out in the hallway and just talk and network with people. And then the parties and the events and the social things, that's where it's at. Like I, I don't care about the other stuff as much anymore. Yeah, I still have a lot to learn. I'm sure I could have learned something if I sat there and listened to a speaker. But if I had to choose and.
- [30:49]
B
Well, you know, priorities.
- [30:50]
A
Priorities. Right. Well, listen, I, we're running out of time here. I want to, I want to make sure everybody knows where to find you and, and, and you know, that way they don't have to worry about AI pulling you up and all that. Karina, where can people go deeper with you?
- [31:02]
B
Karinainkster.com Karina with a K K A R I n a karinainkster.com is the hub of all things nerdy vegan fitness. And they can get all the links to social from there as well.
- [31:13]
A
And also check out the no BS Vegan podcast hosted by Karina Inkster. Hey, Karina, I got to ask you one last question before we go. What is a didgeridoo? I don't know how to pronounce it.
- [31:27]
B
Oh yes, now we're going into real nerd territory now. Well, actually, not really in my life when I'm not kicking people's butts or working. My other career is music. So I teach and perform accordion, piano, and didgeridoo. Didgeridoo is an indigenous Australian instrument. You've probably heard it. A lot of people know the sound it's like a hollow tube made out of a eucalyptus branch.
- [31:53]
A
Okay.
- [31:54]
B
It's tens of thousands of years old. You gotta learn how to circular breathe. It's all.
- [31:57]
A
So it's a wind instrument.
- [31:58]
B
It's a wind instrument.
- [31:59]
A
Okay. Okay.
- [32:00]
B
Wow.
- [32:00]
A
I was guessing it was a string just because of the piano, but. Gtd. Redo. How do you pronounce it again? Did you read?
- [32:07]
B
Did you redo?
- [32:07]
A
Did you redo. Did you read it? Okay, I'm gonna go look that up after the show.
- [32:10]
B
Oh, you totally should, Karina.
- [32:12]
A
I'm gonna show my daughter. She's into music. Music as well. Oh, there you go. And guitar. All right, great. Well, thank you so much for being here and I appreciate it. And hang tight while I wrap this up, folks. Thank you so much for being here on the Woody Made Up Show. Make sure you hit the subscribe follow button at the top of your favorite podcast platform and keep coming back until next time. Be that one.