← What Had Happened Was
What Had Happened Was
Do You Want More?!!!??! Part 3
00:50:56
The conclusion of the story of The Roots' major label debut
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- [00:08]
A
You notice as the season goes on I start getting into that that little intro sound more and more. It just gets in me. What can I say? I'm open my giggle. This is what had happened was last episode we left off Questlove was telling us the story of the Woot. The woots, the woots, the roots making do you want more? Black Thought was making me feel bad for being a rapper because he' so good at being a rapper so why should anybody else also be a rapper? And we were just getting into the making of the song the Lesson featuring an amazing freestyle by a 13 year old dice Raw. We pick up today with more on that song and how they found Rahzel the human beatbox. And then they round out the album with the story behind the amazing Ursula Rucker spoken word piece at the end of the album. Speaking of the end, I haven't ended being a rapper even though Black Thought makes me feel bad. I'm still going on tour this December doing open mic Eagle Rap music. I'm going to be in Houston and Dallas, New Orleans, Brooklyn, Philly, D.C. boston, Miami and Orlando this December. Tickets are going fast. For details, hit up mikeeagle.net this podcast is part of the Stony Island Audio Network, the home for hip hop podcasts that you can actually listen to. Like the Questions Hip Hop Trivia Podcast or Super Duty. Tough work with Blueprint and Illogic or stories about songs with Kevin Beacham. Support this podcast by using the codes in the ads and giving it 13 stars on whatever podcast platform you listen to. And with that, let's get into it. Season 4 Episode 6 Do you want more? Part 3. This is Open Mike Eagle. This is Season four. What had happened was we're pretty deep into it, but the question remains. Do you want more? Do you want more? Ask for encore we slides the condors shout to the sponsors we got to the top floor it's all organic like we pass to the popcorn Come on and get on board do you want more? Ask for encores Flies to condors shout to the sponsors they got to the top floor it's all organic like you passing the popcorn Come on and get on board the train crazy gets osbornes I asked if you want more you ask for encore we fly as a condor shouts to the sponsors we got to the top floor it's all organic like we passing the popcorn Want more or ask for encore Flies and condors to shout to the sponsors they got to the top floor it's all organic like the past the popcorn.
- [02:47]
B
Whenever we got the announcement that Kurt Cobain committed suicide. My manager called panicking. It's like, yo, I think shit's about to hit the fan. We're about to lose all this shit. I was like, huh?
- [02:59]
A
Hi, I'm Kurt Loder with an MTV News special report on a very sad day. Kurt Cobain, the leader of one of Iraq's most gifted and promising bands. Nirvana is dead. And this is the story as we know it so far.
- [03:19]
B
And I was like, what do you mean? Because it was like seven in the morning and incidentally my dad had to go to the hospital for a heart attack. So he's really. It's. It's now three months later and shit's worse than it's ever been. His health is getting bad. He's in the hospital, you know, and I just, I got home at 5 in the morning and he wakes me up panicking, like six in the morning, like, whatever. It's like, yo, man, we're fucked. And I was like, what are you talking about? He's like, fucking Kurt Cobain, man. We're about to be fucked. And I was like, what's that got to do with us? And he says, look, they signed us on the strength of the billions that Aerosmith, Guns N Roses and Nirvana have brought into the label, right? Aerosmith decided not to re sign the Geffen and go back to Sony. So they lost their moneymaker with Aerosmith. And it was very obvious that Guns N Roses was not going to come up with a follow up record. Well, how long did it take Chinese Democracy given, like 23 years or something, right? So they have been waiting for a Guns N Roses follow up for like three, three to four years all of a sudden. And now this happens and, you know, there's still no staff. Like they promised that, you know, we don't have a staff yet. So they basically gave us everything we needed, handed us like three or four credit cards, said, look, just they trusted us. That's how rich they were.
- [04:53]
A
And quick tangent. So that was their involvement staff wise. But were they. Were they checking songs? Were y' all sending songs to them? Were they trying to be involved in the creative process at all? Were they trying to weigh in?
- [05:05]
B
Wendy, you know, Wendy was very active, but pretty much Wendy was trying to build a staff there. By January, she also signed the Jizza. I'm on a mission that N say is impossible but when I swing my swords they are choppable I beat the Body Drop or the Heartbeat and then by February, she signed about 15 other acts.
- [05:29]
A
Gotcha.
- [05:30]
B
All City, the Brooklyn Funk Essentials. They were going to really do build a department, right? But they didn't have anything. And, you know, so they piecemealed it together. There was Derek and Fran, formerly of Def Jam. She basically had to call in favors from different labels. Even Steve Rifkin of Loud Records was gonna handle, like, promotions and things like that. So we had to go to other labels to get other employees to moonlight and secretly work on our record in addition to what they had. So, again, like Francesca Spiro, Steve Rifkin, like, all these names that we don't have a staff. But we had to go to other labels and piecemeal like that together. And Rich was like, well, because we don't have an infrastructure yet, and there's no brick and mortar, like floor for the urban department. They could easy, easily drop us. And I was like, so what does this mean for us? And he said, we got two and a half weeks to finish this shit. I got a plan. So in 14, 15, 16 days, all that we recorded, we had only mixed the. From the ground up stuff with Bob, right? There's about, what, 16, 17 songs on do youo Want More? So it was crunch time. So basically, Bob, we're mixing, like, a song every two days. Like, we'll mix a song, go home and let's tweak the drums. And so basically, like, a song every day and a half. We're not. Rich is like, stop recording new music. And then he remembered, damn, we met that guy at Lyris Lounge. So I guess when Hub and I were on tour for that gospel thing, Tariqa Malik and Rich went to Lyris Lounge to meet with Bobbito. Bobbito suggested that, hey, why don't you guys come to Lyricist Lounge? And this is the night that I believe Biggie. There's an infamous Biggie Smalls, like, Lyricist Lounge appearance that is on one of those, like, Lyricist Lounge compilations or whatever. It's clobbering time when I rip robbed I punch thirst like very far and I'm still thirsty. This is the night of that. But they tell me they. They met this guy that can do the beatbox and all these crazy noises. And we gotta get down with that guy. We gotta put him in our show.
- [08:12]
A
Enter.
- [08:13]
B
And this is when we meet Razel. Razel. So Rich is like, we're gonna bring Razel to Philly and figure out something for him to do some horn parts or whatever.
- [08:31]
A
As I kick along, I speak of the children of the Corn as Roselyn Godfather annoys both Me some horns as I kick along. I speak of the children of the corn as myself Like a father annoys with me some horn.
- [08:48]
B
And then we're gonna nip this shit in the bud. We gotta shoot three videos, shoot the album cover, and then we're gonna come with the plan. And I'm like, well, what's the plan? So Razel comes to Philly when we do that Questlove question versus Razel skit before. Do youo Want More? Razel didn't even meet me yet. Like, Razel was mic checking. I walk in the studio and he's like. So I just get on drums and I start playing. Come on, we gonna do a lesson like this, baby. Break it on down. Come on. Razel doesn't even know my name. So even when on that sketch, he's like, yeah, we got my man roots on the drums. Like, we didn't even meet each other yet. Wow. And so that's how we meet. Like, incidentally, when I worked on Al Green's record, same way, like, we were just playing and suddenly, like, I hear Al Green's voice and we just. We didn't even meet yet. Wow. So that's how it happened. So. What more do you want from me? I just about giving you. Razel came down to do, like, stuff on Lazy Afternoon, to do stuff on, you know, various things. And, you know, we decided last minute, let's do a straight beatbox song. So I think they were taking a dinner break, and I was trying to figure out. Razel was like, what do you want me to do? And I was like, all right, well, what I'll do is I'll just go in the studio, do some mock stuff, and you come in and do it for real. So, like, all that voice stuff you hear on, like, the Lesson. Yeah, That's me. Just like. And there's a point where you even hear me laughing. I didn't realize. Like, I had the headphones on. I didn't realize. Turn around, Drink startled me. And, like, that's where that laugh comes from. And, you know, so Rahzel does his parts and then.
- [11:01]
A
Joe, did you hum the bass line?
- [11:06]
B
No, that bass line came off. So there was another auxiliary crew member named Bun. Bun was down. There's a brother named King Brit who is now Professor King Brit out in San Diego. King is like, one of the most instrumental.
- [11:30]
A
He.
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B
He's the Giles Peterson of Philadelphia, right? One of our very first gigs. Like, he's first guy that, like, would throw these parties of, like, rare grooves. Like the idea of like, wait a minute. You mean my dad's record collection can work in a nightclub today? Like, I can take the War record and the Roy Ayers record and the Commodore's record and come to a nightclub and you guys like it. Like, that's a thing. So he's instrumental. My DJ career and all that stuff. So, like, King Brit was also the DJ for Digable Planets. And, you know, like, so one of his boys, his name is Tone, he came up with the baseline. And, you know, Tariq did a verse. And I had left by that point. So the next day, you know, Keela was like, yo, let the boy get on. Like, let. Let dice do it. And so Tariq had to readjust his rhyme to, like, dice, roll the melon, you know, dice roar the motherfucking wild north. Get on a mic. Get on a mic. And perpetrating his voice, that motherfucker just freestyled that entire. Like, I sat there flabbergasted. Cause it reminded me of meeting Tariq in the first day of high school.
- [12:49]
A
When he was roasting everybody, right?
- [12:51]
B
And I just remember, like, he made one mistake and I was like, no, no, no, just punch it in, whatever. And I was like, say my name too. Like, give me a shout out. Like, no one said, like, I don't have my own. Like, Questlove, the big beat blaster. He like, I don't know shout outs yet, so. And then he's like, if you want no, better ask Brother Questing. If you want to know, better ask Brother question. Cause he know the time. Like, I know the time when I grab the microphone. He did that. And then Rich is like, the album is done. We have to go up to New York and mix everything. So pretty much we. We locked out Battery Studios, mixed everything. In the meantime, we shot videos for Distortion Proceed. And I remember the night that we did the Lesson and Lazy Afternoon. It was like maybe almost midnight. And then Rich remembered we had to shoot an album cover. So I was like, what do we do? What do we do? And we called one of my boys that went to Performing Arts, the Great and Posey Top. And Posey came down to the studio and he was like, let's go in the alleyway behind the back. I was like, that rat infested alleyway. So it's like midnight and we're taking all the instruments out of the studio and setting up in the alleyway. And he's like, yeah, let's set it up like a jazz club or whatever. So if you ever seen the back cover of do youo Want more where like, we're setting up and Hub has the, you know, the upright bass and Scott's on keyboards and Tariq and Malika freestyle. And you see like an audience of watching people that's just like the studio staff and some friends. Like, that was done at like, basically, you know, midnight, 12:30 in the morning. We shot the back cover and then we sat back in. And then right before we left to go to New York, I said, yo, we don't have an album intro. And they were like, ah, man, just do it. Ah, no, we need an album intro. And he's like, nah, I'm going home, man. Whatever. It's like late or whatever. So I stayed behind. Me and Hub stayed behind and, you know, we figured out a baseline or whatever. And so that winds up being the intro. Something's going on. Something, yo, something's going on.
- [15:29]
A
There's something going on.
- [15:36]
B
I called Tariq and Malik once they got home because it sounds like they're on a telephone. They were literally on a telephone. We didn't mix it. Beastie Boy styles like, you know, and you literally hear like, I'm on three way. And I'm telling Malik, don't talk to me in real time because you're on the mic. Like. But he's still like, amir, cue me in, right? Tariq and Malik do their, their ad libs for something going on. And everything was done. We mixed it. And then Rich was like, still not done. I don't want this album ending on the lesson. Like it's. We need a statement Now. Rich, you know, is a jazz head and is knee deep in like the bohemian, like the original, like what people think. We are like these incense burning Erykah Badu dating head rap. Like, Rich is from the 70s generation of that. And so he's like, I got the answer. He's like, I'm gonna get Nzozake Shange to write a sex poem now. Nsuzake Shange wrote for colored girls and she's a Philadelphian. Rich was like, yo, write me a sexually salacious poem about female empowerment. Female as the alpha in a toxic male world. He basically said, right About a gang bang. And I was like, wait, what? Huh? He says, trust me, it's gonna work like gangbusters. Female empowerment. Listen. And I was like, well, okay. Be as though there's always, there's all, you know, there's always that token song where like the MC gotta tell the woman about herself. Yeah, Like, I know a girl and you live in fat. Like all that Shit. Which, which is really the reason why I had to create the pie in the face moment for you ain't fly.
- [17:43]
A
That makes sense.
- [17:44]
B
My name's Question who are you? She didn't respond. She didn't respond. Continue on thought to myself should I said a little louder Better hurry up before she gets lost in the crowd. Excuse me, miss. Excuse me, miss. No, I'm not having it. I just got this. I didn't get mad was calm and collect I didn't call a. I didn't break a neck Start to wonder why the brothers disrespect the the cuties so place the 180s in the high price fousies. As she walked away man I couldn't deny started lying to myself she wasn't that. You ain't flying this first existed was just like, what, we're just randomly dissing a girl for no reason only because.
- [18:25]
A
She don't want to talk to you? Right?
- [18:28]
B
And I, I have problems with it. I told Rich, like, yo, like cuz in my mind and this is, this is sort of the difference between Reek and I. In my mind, I'm thinking about the Critical Clan.
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A
Yeah.
- [18:40]
B
How much mics are we getting? How many stars in Rolling Stone? And later, what's our Pitchfork rating? What's our Metacritic rating? Reek's thinking about the Barbershop. What's the crew around the way. And you know, like, we're the original Equimani, right? So, you know, I told Rich, I was like, yo, man, like this, this, this is misogyny or leaning, you know what I mean? Like, like I always thought it was cool, like the, the Deary Vet song. Like I' ma tell you about yourself, girl.
- [19:10]
A
Right?
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B
You know, you foul and I'm gonna air you out.
- [19:13]
A
Yo, Yvette, there's a lot of rumors going around. It's so bad, baby, you might have to skip town see something smelling fishing. And they say it's you. All I know is that you made it with the whole damn crew. They say you're a man eater the ring.
- [19:25]
B
I always hated those types of songs, so I didn't want to rhyme. Like, I'm working on that MC song. So like you, I was like, I'm never getting on the mic again. Like, Tariq is the narrator guy, I'm the music guy.
- [19:36]
A
Is that the reason you stopped? Cause you had rapped on organics. Yeah. You rapped on this album.
- [19:40]
B
Yeah. And so I, I, I felt the need to save, save our angle. You know, I wanted to be the rap group that, you know, embraces women and not to be that thing. So I was like, I have to write a verse in which I get the pie in the face so that the song gets balanced out. So we had talked to Nazake. We told her, like, times of the Essence. We got, you know, 72 hours and to turn this record in. So can you come with it? She's like, all right, I got it. I'm ready. We called her that morning, like, all right, we're gonna pick you up. It's like, nine in the morning. We're gonna pick you up. Around, like, 11:30. We go to her apartment, going to pick you up. It's like, nine in the morning. We're going to pick you up. Around, like, 11:30. We go to her apartment. Nothing. Her husband's like, she left last night. She's in Barbados.
- [20:33]
A
Whoa.
- [20:36]
B
And it's like, yo. So we're literally just sitting there in the car, and we're thinking. He's like, damn, do I got Mary Baraka's number? Do I got. He's trying to think, like, what notable poet can we get to close this shit? And it just hit me, yo, there's this new community of Philadelphia poets, like, and, you know, by this point, you know, like, the Nuyorican poetry community, like, the poets of the world were, like, coming to Philly and doing these things, like, on Sunday night. Rich Medina was a poet. Tripita Mason, this girl I never met before named Jill Scott.
- [21:22]
A
My name is J I L L S C O T T. Jill Scott represent North Philly, y'.
- [21:35]
B
All. So there was, like, a Philadelphia poetry community that was brewing. And the epicenter of this community was a young woman named Ursula Rucker, who just happened to work at this theater in Philadelphia that was, like, maybe three blocks away from where Ntozake lived, which, you know, I knew its location because it's also near Roughhouse. And I was like, wait, Ursula works at the Painted Bride? Literally went. Walked in, like, yo, this is your moment. Like, would you write a poem? And Rich, explain everything. You know, Seatta even had, like, the.
- [22:12]
A
Words that Ntozake Rich just said.
- [22:15]
B
You know, it's a female empowerment thing. It's a gang bang going disastrous. And he explained all the nuances of everything. And she was like, she didn't even bat her eye. She's like, yeah, I could do this. What, the female protagonist versus eight guys in a sexual situation? Yeah, I could do this. And she came to the studio after she got off work, 5pm knocked that shit out in, like, One take.
- [22:46]
A
I, the voyeur peer as she begins her ritual, paying sexual tithes for few and untrue words of admiration. Translation, sucker ass. Lines of trash spewing from first ones. Unskilled lips that beg for pussy, tricks that make his dick go quickly.
- [23:05]
B
And we were like, jaw dropped. And Rich was like, now that's how you end the motherfucking album. So we did it. Now, I mentioned earlier the plan. So here's the situation. The plan was Rich was out of his mind to do this, but he said, all right. So when you finish an album, you're supposed to turn the master tapes in. You turn the master tapes in and then you wait. And if you came in under budget, they give you what's left of the budget. So we're owed maybe like somewhere between 90, 90 to, like $140,000. We'd spent about 600,000, which is unheard of, right? And so something out of, like, I guess you could say. Do you. Do you remember in Ghost when, like, when Patrick Swayze has, like, Whoopi Goldberg, get dressed and go to the bank to close out the account and whatever, and they're looking, like, all suspiciously like, are you Mrs. Swornstein? Or whatever? And she's like, yes, I am. And so is that a cashier's check? Yes.
- [24:22]
A
Well, Rita, it looks like you'll be.
- [24:24]
B
Withdrawing $4 million from us today.
- [24:28]
A
$4 million. Say yes, say yes. Is that correct?
- [24:32]
B
Yes. Yes. Well, how would you like that? Tens and twenties. Pardon?
- [24:39]
A
Cashier's check. Tell him a cashier's check. I think better cashier's check.
- [24:43]
B
A cashier's check.
- [24:45]
A
Fine.
- [24:45]
B
Well, it's our money, right? We took our money and we purchased six, seven one way tickets to London, England. And Rich is like, we're gonna go live in London. So I'm like, well, wait, what do you mean by live in London? He's like, look, this is the way I see it. This Cobain shit scare me. So the way I see it, we gotta go out and make some critical noise real quick and not wait for the label to do the work for us. That way, when they be like, guys, nevermind, we're gonna drop you. We could be like, ah, ah, ah, ah.
- [25:25]
A
Mm.
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B
Here's read our press first.
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A
Look at all this press. Look at all this noise we making, right?
- [25:31]
B
So the first thing he did was, I mean, we got an agent. We decided. Now, Carol Lewis is Carol Lewis. Infamously shouted out in Peyton Poole. Carol Lewis is our agent, Nobie Walker Entertainment. You know, at the top of Peyton Poole. Yo, Rakim, what's up? Yo, I'm doing the knowledge, E. Man. I'm trying to get paid in full. Well, check this out.
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A
Since Norby Walter is our agency, right? True. Kara Lewis is our agent.
- [25:56]
B
Kara Lewis has been every A list rapper's, like, agent. She's literally the will of Kara Lewis is how you know who we are. Because we certainly weren't selling records or on TRL or 106 in part, but it was her. Like, she was like mobster style. Like, you're not even think, you know, you're not going to get Jay Z or Eminem until you get me eight Roots dates here and there. You know, promoters, like, for this much money. No. Well, I'm going to take Jay Z and then. Okay, okay, I'll do it. I'll do it. So all those shows that you've seen of us between, like, 93 and 99 now, eventually, a few of those right now, eventually, like, we caught on and it was word of mouth, like, yo, you gotta come see the Roots show, man. It's really dope. And then, like, more people, more people. But them early days, she literally was like, that's how she would play the Roots. Like, fuck you. Her version of Fuck youk Pay Me was literally like, you do not get this A list person until you promised me 20 roots gigs in your territory. Ain't selling any records.
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A
Fuck you pay me.
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B
Oh, you want me in your video?
- [27:04]
A
Fuck you pay me.
- [27:06]
B
Promoters were pissed, but then they're like, oh, we do like you guys. Oh. And then they tell us the story. Like, well, yeah, we, you know, we resisted at first because you guys were nobody. But, you know, that's literally how it was. We decided not to keep Kara for Europe. We wanted the Kara of Europe. Right?
- [27:26]
A
And they all operate different anyway, right?
- [27:28]
B
So Nigel Hassler, who's still our agent to this day, Kara's still our agent to this day in America. Nigel was our European person. And it was like the. The movie, the Commitments. We was like, yo, get us a tour bus and have us perform anywhere worth our grain of salt. Like, literally just do that. And we. For those early runs, it wasn't even like a tour. It was basically like, we would set up shop a month at a time. Like, okay, we're gonna go to Italy for a month. And he would have us play in every dive bar or every whatever for, like, you know, 16 cities in Italy. Then we go to Switzerland, then we go to the uk. Then we go to Ireland. So we would do long Month long residencies.
- [28:17]
A
And all this is before the album has come out.
- [28:20]
B
So from the Ground up gets released.
- [28:25]
A
In Europe, which is another reason to be out there, right?
- [28:28]
B
And does the job for the Giles Peterson left, the center set, right? But it's not like it's making all that much noise, you know, like we're not a sensation yet. Something happens in France that's really incredible. So we, we are gaining. We're getting the attention of tastemakers, like the hip tastemakers. Oh, you ain't up on the. On the. On the Roots. You know, we're getting the attention from them. So there's a rap group in France called whatever fuck your mother means in French, like Nak tout mater or Narc Tout mater or whatever. There's another French rap group called I Am. Now these guys, like, these are like the biggest rap groups, right? These are the. This is the Wu Tang of like France or whatever. They know who we are. And so there's this show called Tarata, which is a French late night talk show that's the equivalent of being on the Tonight show or David Letterman back then. Now this group called I Am just wanted us to be their band. Think of like Jay Z and the Roots, like that sort of thing.
- [29:52]
A
I got the most incredible roots band with me tonight, y'.
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B
All.
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A
It's a beautiful thing.
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B
On the show. Also, Da Brat is making like a lot of American hip hop is starting to make a lot of noise over there in ways that the epmds and whatever, like, they're now getting mainstream love. So this is like the post chronic period where mainstream hip hop is now getting mainstream love. So the rule of the show is that you have to perform live. You can't lip sync. Da Brat's team did not understand the assignment and was like, we got a debt, so we're gonna do Funktified the debt. So we were there and I was like, hey, you know, we're backing them up. We could do your stuff too. And she's like, who is y'?
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A
All?
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B
I was like, where are the Roots? So literally she's looking at us up and down like the Roots. What, y' all from Africa or something? I was like, no, we're from Philadelphia. She looking at us like, oh, y' all look corny. And we start playing Funk the fight. She's like, nah, I ain't feeling that. And they're like, well, you know, well, you can't perform. She's like, good. Cause I'm going to sleep.
- [31:19]
A
Damn.
- [31:20]
B
So what she winds up doing is freeing up 12 minutes of slot time that's unfilled. So they're like, can you guys do like two songs? Or whatever? So this is the most important 12 minutes of our life. So we do a song. We. We back up the I Am group.
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A
I am a big.
- [32:17]
B
I think we wind up doing Proceed. And we're like, what are we going to do for a second song? And again, it's like, do we try to sell the song or do we try to sell the idea and the novelty of the group? Because again, it's like the world has not seen a beatboxer or none of these things. And so we managed to do like some sort of freestyle song that showcased that we were a band and that this guy does this crazy beatbox noise or whatever. Ladies and gentlemen, gentlemen, you are now being introduced to you and yours to millions. The Roots coming to you live. And literally overnight, like, this is like one of the first and this is viral before viral was a thing. But in every French speaking country from Africa to France, anywhere where they spoke French, suddenly, like, we became a thing.
- [33:48]
A
There's a French intro to proceed to.
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B
That's at Montreux Jazz Festival.
- [33:54]
A
Welcome to the Roots. The Roots.
- [33:57]
B
So thus once people see that, then suddenly everyone's calling Nigel Hassler. We gotta have that group. We gotta have that group. So suddenly, now we can go to Switzerland and get a good hotel and not stay in the prostitute hotel. Three at a time, dude. Strict. Yo, you get the pillow, you get the blankets, you get the da da da. You get the da da da. I look now kind of as fond memories, but it's also like, that was such a trial by fire moment because what winds up happening, the reason why the album did not come out on the 28th of June, I'll never forget this moment. So Distortion Ecstatic is about to be released, like in May of 1994 to set up the 28 June release. This is also subsequently the day that a rapper from Brooklyn releases his single called Juicy J. It was all a dream. I used to read Word up magazine. Salt and pepper and heavy. Now, back in the day, the way that you felt, the way that they would give you the temperature of what your future was going to look like based on your singles. There was a periodical called Hits Magazine and Hits magazine basically took like college.
- [35:13]
A
They would gauge each, like radio station plays, right?
- [35:15]
B
That sort of thing, like BDSS or now we call it Views, but it's the views of the day. So Geffen, Wendy calls us up, says, guys, great news it's like we got the initial numbers for distortion, static spins. It's 683 ads, which is like, oh, is, is that good number? That's a great number. It's like, hey, it's like, it's better than what Biggie doing. Biggie got. Biggie only got 75 ads. We're like, oh, yo, the celebrating that we did that week is like, yo, we got 680 something ads and that Biggie guy only got under 100 ads. Like, we're the most added record of the week. This is what we didn't know. Flavor in your ear and Juicy were so red hot that some DJs would violate the. So what they were supposed to do was wait a week to the next week to add Biggie.
- [36:11]
A
I see.
- [36:11]
B
But they were so anxious to play it that the overages, the spillover overages 75 radio stations like, nah, fuck that, we're going to add it now. Instead of like waiting for the big accumulated number. So the next week, all that celebrate. We didn't like, yeah, we made it. We made it. Yo, what's the numbers this week? You guys got a. Okay, you went down a little bit. You get. It's 487 spins. I say, oh, what did Biggie get? Like 40,000 spins. We're like, wait, huh. And literally once they explained to us what this. That Biggie's low numbers due to like seven radio stations leaking it early, playing it early. So we thought like we legit. Our five day total was only like, you know, 800 spins. His full week total was more closer to 40,000. And then it was like, we're gonna fail. So this, this leads to. If, if you remember the, the beginning of Go back to the Rising down album, the, the argument that ensues, like Officer on the line, like screaming at each other. Yeah, people tell me some like this screaming at me. I'm telling you where the energy needs to go. Amir, I got somebody on the fucking line. I can verify the with me.
- [37:32]
A
Amir, please tell him what the fuck happened.
- [37:35]
B
It doesn't matter. It matters why you keep acting like always. Don't talk about, always talk about today. That was that like, wait, what's like the day that we realized, oh shit, this is not going to work the way that we thought it was going to work.
- [37:52]
A
Why, why was it, why was the choice made to go with Distortion and Static as the first single anyway? Because it's like a dark kind of song.
- [37:58]
B
Like, you want to know something funny? In my mind, this is how dumb I am. I'm going to play this interlude. And again, as I told you at the top, all roots ideas are sort of derivative of whatever hip hop is going on, so. All right, this interlude premiering his damn interludes. See you in the background.
- [38:28]
A
Yeah, I heard that, right?
- [38:34]
B
We used to just always. I mean, we just do dumb things, you know what I mean? Like, you hear that enough times in the car driving to some city and.
- [38:42]
A
Then suddenly, ah, that becomes a car joke, right?
- [38:45]
B
And then next thing you know, you're doing a sound check, right? And in my mind I was like, yo, that should be the H. I feel some sort of way that like, even though we're the type of rappers that would also, like, put down mumble culture, the fact that we've attempted twice to do nonsensical hooks and the world hasn't caught on that we pioneered that shit. But also, I believe that whoever pioneers it never gets the credit, right?
- [39:27]
A
I think y' all started verses looking at these, you know what I'm saying.
- [39:32]
B
Right? And so I remember, I was like, yo, let's not have a hook and just do the lap. Ha ha ha ha. I said, yo, every kid's going to do that shit. Every kid's going to do that. We didn't know what a hook was because in our idea, the reason why Ready to Die was such a game changing moment in a weird way is that if you remember what hip hop records were beforehand, they would have that one token R B cut, right? Brand Newbiens, like, you tried to do me. But see, baby, Do you know Diamond D at the. I'm so confused. I don't know what to do.
- [40:40]
A
L. Cool Jade have I need love.
- [40:42]
B
Well, walking with the panther, yeah, like four of them joints, right?
- [40:46]
A
I need love.
- [40:50]
B
But it was always like, you did your street joins, but you always had that one or two token radio joints. Even NWA would talk about, like, I won't curse on the rail so I'll just chill, you know, that sort of thing. And then what separates Ready to Die from the Chronic was Diddy's like, nah, let's make a whole album of the R and B stuff and just have the one token. So suddenly the premier token cut, right, is the street cut instead of the opposite way, right? And so we didn't know what song structure was. We didn't know what a hook. Like, we were very lucky for Scott Storch's right hand. So, like, you know, if I tell you to sing Melo, my man, you could be like, da da da da Da da da da. I'm sorry. The right hand is what the melody is. What part can you whistle? And I didn't realize that until the age of. Wait, what was before the iPhone? Like the two way pager joints. Right, Right. I started getting mad because I'm like, how come? No, so if you remember, there was points, there was a time period in which you could program two way pager ringers to be like your favorite song. Yeah. You know? And one day I was mad at the studio. I'm like, yo, how come everyone's making. How come no one's made a Roots 2 way pages song? And Rich would laugh like. He's like, because y' all don't know what a melody is. And I was like, huh? He said, man, what's. He's like, what's the melody of? He said, what's. What's. What's going. What goes on melody? And I was like, what? Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba. He says, no, that's. Y' all scatting. Like, what's. What's the part. What's the part that I would whistle if I were a five year old kid? And I was like. He's like, well, what about Swept Away you could do? He said, that's the baseline, man. That's the choice is yours. He's like, no, man, it's a whole different time period. Like, you guys only concentrated on the drum and bass and creating an atmosphere. Like, you guys paint pictures, but you guys don't know what a melody is. In my mind, getting some R and B dude to sing, a hook is going pop. So I didn't know. We didn't know what songwriting was. And the thing was, I was. I was caught by surprise by distortion myself, because here's the thing, and this will bite us in the ass. Also around things fall apart time, which is we're not fragmented as a group, but it's like Tariq and Malik are in their particular headquarters working on lyrics. So I'm not there as a traditional. None of us are there as well. Rich is there to sort of micromanage everything, but I'm not there to be like, hey, you should change it like this. Like a guy like Dr. Dre will give you notes and whatever, but in my mind it's like, well, I don't know how to write a rhyme. So Tariq let Tariq and Mellon do what they do. Distortion of Static had a lyrical structure that was something more closer to maybe like past the plugs on De La Soul is dead. Like I had a pattern. Staticy and scratchy, kind of catchy.
- [44:29]
A
First.
- [44:29]
B
P is past I am known as pasta noose Plug one to the whole.
- [44:34]
A
Race rhyme on a tour Small and munchy or dispatch obstacle themes with a Mac was once 19, now I'm one year old.
- [44:44]
B
So that's what I knew. Distortion is static as we've had it in our repertoire for at least three years by that point to be. But this is, this is going to be a long running thing with the Roots, where I'm already in New York with Bob Power at Battery Studios, waiting for someone to courier up the 2 inch reels from the studio session last night so we could start mixing. So thus, when we put the distortion of static reels on, when we put them on the real thing, this is the first time I'm here. Like, yo, I'm every mc. It's calling me and I'm calling Rich, like, wait a minute, where's the lyrics? He's like, malik and Tariq changed the lyrics. And I was like, well, why didn't they do the staticy and scratchy? And it's like, like in my head I'm thinking like, I don't know if we should do an 11 hour change. And I just kept asking Rich like, yo, you sure about this? Cause I don't know if I like it. Cause the thing is like, if you listen, like in my mind, this doesn't sound like the same guys that did. Like I'm out there on organics or good music. Like I was. I even said like, yo, this, this feels like a Black Moon song. Like, this is like, this is like a real MC thing, Which I. I guess in my mind, you know, Tariq has, I mean, not like a chip on his shoulder, but it's all sort of like in his mind. Like, I got to let motherfuckers know I'm a real ass MC to offset all this cutesy jazz shit that Amir keeps adding to the mix. So it's almost like the more esoteric.
- [46:44]
A
I am, the harder he got to get right.
- [46:47]
B
And that will happen a lot. This, in this, you know, when we get to things fall apart. This will also explain like the Eve situation because literally, like on the second verse, another wait, who the fuck is this?
- [47:09]
A
While politicking with my sister from New York City, she says she know this ball player and he think I'm pretty psy. I'm playing boo.
- [47:18]
B
Literally, I'm like on the phone like, yo, man, I stopped the mixing session that you got me. I was like, no, like, stop. This is. This is the one song that can help us get out of hell. Like, who are these other people? Roots and Erica. Just let it be that. Like, I was hell set. I didn't. I didn't know who she was. I didn't know what her name was or none of that stuff. So, you know. Well, this.
- [47:41]
A
This becomes a.
- [47:42]
B
We'll pay for that. We'll pay for that mistake later, you know?
- [47:45]
A
Well, we're gonna. We're gonna leave it here for now. You got a big day. We gotta get you.
- [47:49]
B
Yeah.
- [47:49]
A
Out of here.
- [47:50]
B
I gotta book to sell.
- [47:51]
A
And that was a great. That was a great tease of a future episode. So we'll get into that next. We'll pick up with Illadelph. Half life, though, but thanks for your.
- [48:00]
B
Time, AKA get rid of Amir. Peace.
- [48:05]
A
Talk to y' all soon.