Shannon Malone (3:52)

Thank you for having me.

Anne Bogle (3:53)

Oh my gosh, the pleasure is mine. I love talking books with you, whether or not it's being recorded for posterity and our readers. Me too. Okay, Shannon, you are here in your capacity as what should I read next? In Patreon Community Manager, which I mean, I think like a nice summary of your job description is you do the planning and the dreaming. Not that we don't all like get in on that, but specifically you are making sure everyone gets what they need in those communities.

Shannon Malone (4:23)

I tried to. Yeah, it's so much fun.

Anne Bogle (4:31)

I love you in this role and I love that you love it. So while we're here together, we wanted to tell everyone what we're doing in Patreon. On Fridays, we release a new bonus episode and we have a nice rotation that we really love that. Like, I think every patron has their own favorite category of episode, but we rotate through many matchmaking episodes where our patrons tell me three books they love, one book they don't, and what they've been reading or what they're looking for. And I recommend just like real quick, a couple books they may enjoy reading next industry insights to illuminate some aspect of the reading and broader literary landscape that you might not really understand how it works, but it's making a difference in Your reading experience. We have one great book style episodes. We have themed book episodes, which Shannon, like, I feel like we need a good name for these kinds of episodes. This is where we recommend books on a theme.

Shannon Malone (5:23)

Yes. I'm thinking of one that we're kind of pulling together now, which is going to be about books about money in lieu of the upcoming tax season.

Anne Bogle (5:33)

I saw that on a note someplace that you and Will were gonna talk about your favorite books about money. Cause it came up at a team meeting that, like, you're both fans of Ramit Sethi's work. And I thought, oh, my gosh, I didn't know that I wanted to hear those two talk about that topic, but I absolutely do. And I thought tax day was a really fun way to play that. Yeah, but those are books on a theme. But I feel like it needs something catchy and ideally alliterative to say instead of these are books on a theme. Readers, if you have a recommendation for us for what we should call these episodes, we are listening, but know that those are in the rotation every five or six weeks. And then we have what we call them wildcard episodes. These are ones that don't quite fit, except that they feel like they belong in our literary landscape and we're interested in talking about them. Like, ask us anything episodes, conversations about fun stuff like book to movie adaptations or footnotes or like, what's another fun one we've done along these lines?

Shannon Malone (6:30)

Well, I'm thinking of one this upcoming. Donna and Ginger last year played the enthusiasm meter game.

Anne Bogle (6:37)

Oh my gosh.

Shannon Malone (6:37)

Which I just insisted. Insisted on being a part of this year. And that's coming to the Patreon bonus feed in the next couple weeks. And I'm really excited about that one.

Anne Bogle (6:48)

Well, I'm really looking forward to this one because the first enthusiasm meter episode was so fun. So that's what's happening in Patreon. This is a great way to support the show, contribute to the show, get some extra audio every Friday. And we're so grateful to our patrons because they really help us keep the lights on to pay our team, to pay our tech support people to keep the lights on at what should I Read Next? Hq. And these are wild times, friends. And it's really economically bumpy. And we're so grateful to our patrons for making it possible for us to keep doing what we do every week. Okay, Shannon, I'm interested in hearing what you're especially excited about. That's on the Patreon Horizon.

Shannon Malone (7:29)

Holly is returning to the bonus feed with A one great book style episode. And you had particular thoughts about the book she's picking?

Anne Bogle (7:39)

Yeah, I did. Okay. If you don't know one great book, we tell you about a book we love from our personal bookshelves in 10 minutes or less. Although sometimes we fudge it a little bit. It's Patreon. We got flexibility. We love that. Yeah. Shannon said, what do you think about this book? And I went, oh. And then I told you the premise real fast because I don't think you were familiar with it.

Shannon Malone (8:00)

I was not.

Anne Bogle (8:00)

And you were like, oh, yeah, it's nonfiction.

Shannon Malone (8:03)

Looking forward to it.

Anne Bogle (8:04)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Shannon, what episode are you working on right now? I mean, you have your hand in all of them, but, like, are you really getting into, like, the audio and creation of.

Shannon Malone (8:17)

We are working on a starter guide for the romance genre style episode. This is something new. We've never done it before. And team member Lee, who is our resident romance expert, is going to come and answer questions from me and the patrons because we're going to solicit questions from them and we're going to get to know all about romance. And so I'm really looking forward to that one.

Anne Bogle (8:46)

That sounds so fun. I know some readers read a ton and some don't, and I love that, like, we can have great conversations about these books, no matter what your experience is with them, because readers always have something to talk about. And I just worked on an industry insight episode about what's up with all these special editions these days. That was a special patron request that we heard over and over. Like, over and over. I don't get it. Can you talk about this? And I'm also working on an episode about classics that feel modern with our modern Mrs. Darcy Book Club community manager Ginger. Because we knew we wanted to do something on classics and I thought, I know who on our team to ask.

Shannon Malone (9:25)

Yes, that has been an oft repeated request from the patrons. And we like to give the people what they ask for, right?

Anne Bogle (9:32)

Yeah, we do. Shannon, what's an episode that you keep thinking about that we've done on Patreon?

Shannon Malone (9:39)

Well, recently I have been thinking a lot about my reading intentions for the year. And so I keep going back to things that I said there probably in anticipation of this episode. And, you know, it's still Jan. Well, it's not January, thank God.

Anne Bogle (9:57)

It is February.

Shannon Malone (9:59)

And yeah, I keep referring back to those intentions and my conversations around that. So that's kind of stuck in my.

Anne Bogle (10:06)

Head right now for me, I wanna say your one great book episode on how to keep house while drowning is something I think about all the time. Also, I think about a bonus episode I did a while ago about the seasonality of the publishing calendar when our patrons ask questions. I find myself so often Copy Paste have you listened to this? You should really listen to this like every green episode that explains a little bit about what to expect to find at your local bookstore at any given time. That sounds very like service oriented, but I think these episodes are really fun. Like educational but I hope also really fun to listen to. Now is a great time to I mean there's never a bad time to join to support a podcast that we hope you love and jump on into our community. You can listen to as little or as much as you want to, but we have good stuff for you every week and would love to have you join us there. Oh, which we should say is@patreon.com whatshouldIreadnext we have a $5 a month tier and a $10 a month generous supporter tier. Exact same benefits. Choose whatever you want and we'll see you there.

Sponsor (11:12)

Readers I love seeing updates from my friends and fellow business owners over on LinkedIn. It's a great place to celebrate a new job, announce a promotion, or just keep up with the latest accomplishments of the people I know professionally. But LinkedIn does a lot more than that. In fact, their LinkedIn ads platform specializes in B2B ad targeting that helps B2B marketers connect with the right audience and drive results. When you use LinkedIn ads, you unlock direct access to decision makers including a billion members, 130 million decision makers, and 10 million C level executives. Plus, LinkedIn ads features targeting and measurement tools that are built specifically for B2B. They know and respect the B2B world you operate in. So if you're looking for results in 2025 for your B2B marketing campaign, check out LinkedIn ads. Start converting your B2B audience into high quality leads today. We'll even give you a hundred dollar credit on your next campaign. Go to LinkedIn.com ReadNext to claim your credit. That's LinkedIn.com ReadNext terms and conditions apply. LinkedIn the place to Be, to Be Readers Winter weather gives me the perfect excuse for something I love, and that is spending the day with a book. Lately, some days it's been too cold to do anything else, and cold winter days call for cozy essentials like socks, underwear and slippers from bombas. It's no secret that we love bombas in our House. We rely on them for everything from everyday socks to boxer briefs for the guys and dress socks for special events. I recently picked up a few pairs of their frilly socks and reloaded ankle and athletic socks for both Will and me. We love their premium fabrics that feel luxurious against your skin like merino wool and merino cashmere, or their slippers featuring warm and fluffy Sherpa lining. Plus they paired comfortable fabrics with thoughtful design that means no annoying toe seams, no socks that slip down, and perfect fit with every wear. Plus the colors I just got are super fun. Bombas wants to make sure you love what you order, so if you're not a fan, you can take advantage of free returns and exchanges under their 100% happiness guarantee. And once you find your perfect pair of socks or anything else that Bombas makes, you won't be the only one who benefits. For every purchase, Bombas donates another item to someone facing homelessness. That is truly a win win. So try Bombas. Now head over to bombas.com readnext and use code readnext for 20% off your first purchase. That's B O M B-A-S.com readnext code readnext at checkout now for what's saving our lives?

Anne Bogle (13:46)

Or specifically our reading lives. So today, Shannon, you and I get to discuss our own answers to this question that is what's saving my reading life right now? And at the end we're also going to talk about what's saving our lives outside our reading lives. I mean, I feel like it's all intertwingled, but we're still going to ask ourselves that question. And while we were preparing this episode, we also reached out to our Patreon community members and invited them to tell us what saving their reading lives are right now. And I really enjoyed reading all those responses.

Shannon Malone (14:19)

We had so many responses.

Anne Bogle (14:21)

So many.

Shannon Malone (14:21)

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Anne Bogle (14:24)

We kind of wondered if y'all would be like, what are you talking about? And instead you were like, I was waiting for you to ask. We got to read all those as we got ready to sit down together today and we can't wait to share some of them with you. Let's get to it. Okay. So I should really have looked up what year we started doing the what's saving your life right now question on modern Mrs. Darcy. But I'm not the biggest fan of winter. I love my daylight. I don't want it to get dark at 4:30. I like to go outside. I had a really hard time when we had ice and snow here, which was beautiful, so it felt like we had more light. But also, I couldn't walk on the sidewalks or the streets because it was like a skating rink. And that did not feel good. Everybody gets sick in February. It's just. It's not my favorite. And so to beat back the gloom, I think, is what I said the first year I latched onto this idea from Barbara Brown Taylor in her memoir, Leaving Church. And in it, she tells the story of how once she went to the speaking engagement and her host said, hey.

Sponsor (15:29)

Would you just tell us what's saving.

Anne Bogle (15:30)

Your life right now? And she was like, nobody's ever asked me that. But she said that the brilliant thing about the question is that it's easy to put your finger on, like, what's killing you, like, what is making things so hard right now, but it's harder to name. And it doesn't come as naturally to focus on what's saving us. And it's a great question. And I do, like, I really struggle to put routines into place, but love it when I find a good routine or tradition. And we've been coming back to this question annually at the midpoint of winter, right around. Right around February 2nd, for over a decade now. So every year that means I write about what's saving my life. And sometimes what I'm writing about is, like, it feels deeply meaningful and reflective and, like, dare I say it, about my own thoughts, like, profound to me. Like, I wrote about communion wine once and travel philosophy as life philosophy, but I've also written about jigsaw puzzles and coffee and laundry and sitting on the couch. It's funny to look back. Every year I look back and see again, like, what have I written about in the past? And over and over again, it's sunshine and long walks and good books and sleep. So some are very predictable and some are very specific. This year, I wrote about flexibility and how I was just, like, totally brought up short when someone older and wiser in my life asked me recently, like, oh, hey, I was just thinking, do you stretch? Are you a person who does that? And I was just like, oh, mind blown. Wow. And I wrote about that on Modern Mrs. Darcy. That post went up February 3rd, so you can go read it there. I won't tell you the whole same thing over again, but those are some things saving my life. Today we're going to focus on what's saving our reading lives. Shannon, I know you've had some time to reflect on this.

Shannon Malone (17:28)

I have.

Anne Bogle (17:28)

What would you say is Saving your reading life. I mean, maybe historically, but maybe like right now, February 2025.

Shannon Malone (17:37)

I'll start with historically. Historically, reflection is what saves my reading life as well as my non reading life. And I've really over the past year understood how journaling and writing down what I'm thinking and feeling makes a huge difference. I believe you often quote Annie Dillard.

Anne Bogle (18:00)

Love Annie Dillard.

Shannon Malone (18:01)

When she says something about I'm huge paraphrase here. I don't know what I think until I write it down. And the older I get, the more I'm finding that to be true. So writing things down and reflecting on them has really, really helped me and it is saving my life and reading life right now. And as I was thinking about the question of that, I wrote down the reading light and Bridget had mentioned the kind that hangs around your neck. And I tried that one, it didn't work. So I got one that hooks to the book itself. I love reading in the evenings with the lights off. And I was tired of just reading from my Kindle because screens and trying to reduce that. And also I wasn't reading as many physical books as I wanted and they were just piling up in my TBR shelf. And so Bridget suggested a reading light and I have been using that and it is wonderful. And I started using that last year and that saved my reading of physical books. Right now what's saving my reading life is reading what I really want to read in the moment. And I know that's unusual for me because I kind of like to plan things out, but finding something that I'm like, yes, I want to read that and then opening the book and actually reading that has been very interesting this past month or so and I'm loving it.

Anne Bogle (19:43)

I love that for you. Okay, historically, I mean, I feel a little bit like a broken record. I love good books, like whether I'm going through like when I'm having like.

Sponsor (19:57)

A happy go lucky life.

Anne Bogle (19:58)

Not like I remember when that might have happened last, but like it's better with a good book. But when I'm going through hard things, I love a good book, especially a family drama. These are my favorite that make me feel like my experience is seen and normalized and sometimes put into words in a way that I was unable to do myself.

Shannon Malone (20:17)

We joke that you added a second category in the SRG so just you could. I mean. And that's summer reading guide for those who don't know about family dramas. So you could have more family dramas in the book.

Anne Bogle (20:29)

What joke. I think that's what happened. It's true that y'all tease me about it. I'm okay with that. But I also love the, like, the interesting, the unexpected, the off the beaten path. I think it's interesting to be interested. Like, I just like to find out about new stuff and read about what's fascinating and have something thought provoking to latch my mind onto. And I love books that prompt good conversation, like ones that first you get to enjoy reading. Or sometimes, like I talked about a book in spring book preview, where I was like, ooh, I don't know about this book, but oh my goodness, the conversations I'm having and I'm going to get to have because of it. Amazing, Fantastic. So meaningful. And historically, audiobooks have always been huge, I think in part because long walks save me are saving me in the present progressive tense. And that's been true for like, probably my entire life. And audiobooks and walking go so nicely together. Sometimes I walk with nothing in my ears and sometimes I catch up on my messages. But I do love a good audiobook for many miles at a time. So saving my life right now. I'm going to say good books, especially family dramas. I'm reading for the Summer Reading Guide right now, and there are some really good ones. But also morning reading is saving me. I know that some people have been doing this for years. I've done this in the past, but I've been doing other things first thing in the morning, especially when I'm working on like a big writing project. I tend to do that first thing in the morning, that or go to the gym, but I'm not reading. But this past year, I've been reading first thing in the morning. And it's been such a nice way to linger with the sort of books that I like to read a few pages at a time. Because most of the rest of my reading, I don't read a few pages at a time. I read it like a hun. I mean, sometimes I'll read it 10 pages at a go, but every day I'm reading more like a hundred pages, not five. And the morning reading rhythm is really working for especially like philosophical, personal growth, kind of reflective nonfiction that I don't want to read 100 pages at a time. Also dabbling. I've really enjoyed just kind of seeing what looks good to me right now. Like last night I read a chapter of a book that was really good. It was nonfiction. I thought, I want to read this, I want to come back to it. But, like, what else is on offer. What am I really in the mood for? So just trying things, especially nonfiction or pulling books off my shelf. I'm thinking about reading and reading the first chapter to imagine what that reading experience might be like. I'm really having a lot of fun with that. Also, I'm trying to figure out what's happening with the Zeitgeist, but talking with other readers who are trying to figure things out like in their life and also what's happening in the literary world. What does it mean for me? What do I want from my reading life? I'm finding those conversations really affirming and helpful and life giving. Oh my gosh. I have a big one. I left my Kindle Paperwhite at my mother in law's house the day after Christmas and bless her, she went to the post office the next day to mail it to me. And then it sat in Cincinnati for three and a half weeks. Stuck. Oh no. And I didn't realize how dependent I was. I mean I call it my security Kindle because I want it with me at all times like a security blanket. So maybe I shouldn't have been surprised, but I missed it so much and I had an alternate Kindle I could use, but it didn't light up. And reading in the dark is magic. My own Kindle is magic. I love it so much and I'm really glad to have it again. I have fresh appreciation for my Kindle paper White. I will say on a related note to that reading light. Will got a reading light and that might be saving me too because I almost always read my Kindle in bed. But he switches back and forth between print and Kindle and I really like that wind down period. That's more effective if it's dark. Yes. And now it is dark because he's got his reading light to go with his his paper books.

Shannon Malone (24:35)

Yes, life changing.

Anne Bogle (24:38)

It really is. We asked our patrons what's saving their reading lives and I thought it was so interesting what everyone said, like we're going to share a sampling listeners. But I thought it was so interesting how like back to back some people would say short books, some people would say long books. I know some people would say dabbling like I did. Some people would say like focus and commitment. Yeah, it was all over the place in a way that felt like really representative of the fact that your reading life is your reading life. Like reading is a very individual experience. And also I love to hear the vast variety of things that work for different people in different seasons. For sure, if you are a What should I read next? Patron who shared what was saving your reading life. Thank you so much. That was so affirming for so many readers, including Shannon and me, and we plucked out some representative or sometimes highly unrepresentative. Whoa. I never thought of it like that. Comments to share Now Shannon, do you have a few you'd like to share?

Shannon Malone (25:42)

Well, I wanted to tell Liv if she's out there and listening to this episode, thank you for putting words to something that I have been feeling for a very, very long time. And let me tell you what Liv says and I'm quoting turning the volume down on reading resolutions, number goals, and just focusing on only reading what really works for me. Not the me I aspire to be but or the summer me, or the well rested me, but the me I am right in this moment. I read about five books less this January than usual, but all the ones I finished have been four or five star reads and I'm perfectly content with that. Liv, I'm going to take your expression turning down the volume, declare that my 2025 motto and aim and I'm running with it. So I'm giving you all due credit on this episod, but I am running with that. Turning down the volume is going to save my reading life. And I kind of had that in my head already but just not able to articulate it as concisely as Liv did. Here. I only have one reading intention, that's to read 25 five star reads. That's it. I have adjusted my Goodreads reading challenge to reflect this. Usually I try to read as many books as I am old. That's been my goal for years. But this year it is set for 25 and I'm loving that. Allison talked about reading shorter books and I said, you know, that has worked this year and I need to keep finding novellas because I've read two this year and they were both five stars. So yeah, that's how I was relating to some of what the Patreon members were telling us.

Anne Bogle (27:46)

Maybe not the point, but I can't resist. What were your two five star novellas, Jana?

Shannon Malone (27:52)

Well, I think anyone who has been around here long enough knows that I love A Song for the Wild built by Becky Chambers. I make it a habit to reread that every year. Ever since I heard Ginger mention that she reads Lillian Bach Fish Takes a Walk and I was like yes, I'm going to do that. Which and coincidentally coincides with what Ashley said in the comments. I was in a terrible reading slump through most of 2024. Then I decided to reread a book I knew I loved and since then I've had the best reading months of my life. I've done a few rereads recently and they have helped tremendously. I'm with Ashley. That has worked. So started my reading year with the Song for the Wild Build and then my second novella was the River Has Roots and you talked about it in spring book preview. I managed to get advanced readers copy. I loved it so much. I'm definitely going to reread because I missed so much in that first read just trying to find out what happened and now I have to go back and find out. The wordplay and the talk about grammar and conjunctions and oh, it was. It was great.

Anne Bogle (29:14)

And you want to reread books you've enjoyed in the past. So that just works perfectly for you.

Shannon Malone (29:18)

Yes. So those are two of my 25 five star reads.

Anne Bogle (29:24)

It sounds like you're off to a strong start.

Shannon Malone (29:25)

I am.

Anne Bogle (29:28)

And it feels good. Okay, here's what jumped out to me. Cheryl left this comment. She said my volunteer work with our friends at the library and our senior center, but mainly a few really good books that were a big surprise if you're a regular listener. You know my theory on surprise and delight. Often the books that really stand out to us are ones that had an element that we did not expect or we're off our beaten path. And I'm so glad that worked for Cheryl. Also, I noticed that serving others is feeling like a lifesaver to her and I love that. This next one from Emily was interesting to me because deep reading and focus seem to be themes I saw over and over again in our comments and that I'm also hearing in conversations with our team and with readers in my life. So here's what Emily said. I've started reading books while listening to the audio at the same time. I'm doing this with three different books, two nonfiction and one big historical fiction. With the nonfiction, I tend to listen to one chapter and then read the book right after. With the fiction I read while listening, it took some trial and error to get the speed right, but I'm really enjoying the experience. She says my only question is should I count this as reading the book once or twice?

Shannon Malone (30:40)

Twice.

Anne Bogle (30:44)

But. But maybe she's going to be in intrigued by the idea that she could turn down the volume on that mattering at all. Yes, but you know what, Emily? You do what you want. But this sounds so immersive to me and I just said how much I love audiobooks for multitasking. Both things could be true, but like, this really struck me as a comment. And then I saw social media appear as a theme or be mentioned over and over. Like Elise said, getting off social media has been the best decision for both my reading life and my mental health. I only go on LinkedIn now because I have to for work, but luckily it's boring and I'm not tempted to spend much time there. Instagram and TikTok were sucking up so much of my time without me being fully aware of it in the moment and I didn't even really enjoy it. And then I'd feel bad that I didn't spend that time doing something I really wanted to do, like reading. I don't think it's a coincidence that in 2024, being off social media, I tripled the number of books I typically read in a year. I could go on and on about my other issues with social media, but I'll just say that if you've been feeling like your relationship with it is souring, take the plunge and get off. I've not regretted it at all. Yeah, I mean, we've all read the headlines and maybe the whole articles. Probably nothing surprising there. And then Barbara said, books are always a lifeline for me, as they are right now. However, keeping TV turned off has helped me to control the content in my life and more books. So she wasn't the only person to talk about turning the TV off. Some of you just for January, some of you like as an ongoing thing that you started last year. But I don't think I realized until I read Barbara's comment like, oh, TV might be one of the things saving my life.

Shannon Malone (32:23)

Which is very interesting that you should say that, Ann, because one of the reasons why I'm focusing on 25 good books is so that I have more time to watch all the shows that I'm very enthusiastic about.

Anne Bogle (32:38)

All right, I want to hear more about that.

Unknown (32:41)

You just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy. Just use Indeed. Stop struggling to get your job posts seen on other job sites. With indeed sponsored Jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people you want faster. According to INDEED data, sponsored jobs posted directly on indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Don't wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs. More visibility@ Indeed.com Arts just go to Indeed.com Arts right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need.

Jane Perles (33:38)

As a longtime foreign correspondent, I've worked in lots of places, nowhere as important to the world as China. But these days, few journalists are able to get the inside story. That's because China has shut the door to much of the media.

Anne Bogle (33:53)

Authorities have far more efficient tools to to control the press, and they're far.

Shannon Malone (33:59)

Less reluctant to use them.

Jane Perles (34:01)

I'm Jane Perles, former Beijing bureau chief for the New York Times. On Face off, the US versus China. We're trying to break through. We'll talk about Trump and Xi Jinping, AI TikTok, and even Hollywood. New episodes of Face off are available now. Wherever you get your podcasts.

Anne Bogle (34:30)

Here'S specifically what I mean. So now our two older kids are in college. We have two kids at home. They're both in high school and this year we've always had a show going and it's just so fun to look forward to seeing what happens next in a show that we're loving and like to look forward to that together and debrief it together and to get our TV snacks together. We haven't really landed on our new one, but we just finished Silo, which I was only watching to humor my 15 year old because it didn't seem like my jam. But I love Rashida Jones and I give it a try for him. And oh, I was hooked so hard and fast. We just blazed through the two seasons. How long till season three? Readers keep telling me I need to read the books, but it's brought me a lot of joy. But now we need to find another show and we're taking recommendations. Okay, Shannon, what do you want to watch?

Shannon Malone (35:24)

Well, it's very interesting and you can decide whether we're going to keep this in this episode or not.

Anne Bogle (35:31)

Now, I'm curious, but a few members.

Shannon Malone (35:35)

Of Team MMD are watching season three of the Traitors together.

Anne Bogle (35:42)

I will admit you all have me intrigued.

Shannon Malone (35:44)

We have a vox going, so we watched the episode and then we vox each other our thoughts and it's so much fun. It's like a water cooler, but virtual.

Anne Bogle (35:58)

You've got laughter, you've got community, you've got definite escapism, definitely.

Shannon Malone (36:04)

And it's a great season. I'm also enjoying watching the show with my husband. We have one going now and it's very nice to look forward to watching that every week. He likes to binge things I kind of like the anticipation of what's going to come out next and what's going to happen next and kind of talking about that throughout the week, off and on, plus all the wonderful adaptations that are coming out. Like, I want to watch them.

Anne Bogle (36:34)

I hear you. I have had seasons in my life where keeping the TV off has served me well. And also this is where I am right now.

Shannon Malone (36:43)

Yep.

Anne Bogle (36:44)

Okay. Just for fun, what is something that is saving your non reading life? And I feel like that's not a hard and fast like, line of demarcation. It's all intertwined, but also, you know what I mean.

Shannon Malone (36:56)

You've said this before, but I'm finding very strongly that my reading life is a microcosm of my non reading life and vice versa. So when I talk about taking that line from live, turning down the volume, I have been doing that in my non reading life and I have talked about this in all the places, but then I find that I lapse in doing it. Like, I don't. I say that I want to do it and then I don't actually do it. But I've been really focused this January and part of February on turning down the volume of expectations, turning down the heat of, oh, I gotta get this done. Like, I've noticed that I will rush the buddy man.

Anne Bogle (37:47)

Like, let's go, let's go, let's go.

Shannon Malone (37:49)

And it's like, why? We'll get there, it'll be fine. So what if we're five minutes late? So I'm really, really working on doing that and that turning down the volume again, thanks. Liv has really been saving my life recently.

Anne Bogle (38:05)

I love that.

Shannon Malone (38:07)

Also, we mentioned Ramit Sadie in earlier in the podcast. And I am reading slowly. I will teach you to be Rich and Money for Couples, which is his new release that just came out in January. And these two books are saving my money life and thus my non reading life. Because money touches everything, including my reading life. They're making me more confident about money, which weirdly is translating into the rest of my life, including my reading life. So, yeah, those, those two books are amazing. And his podcast, he also has a podcast too, Money for Couples.

Anne Bogle (38:53)

This is me leaning forward, hoping you'll say more. Translating into the rest of your life.

Shannon Malone (39:00)

Yes. I have not journaled about this because remember I said I don't know what I think until I write it down fully. But it is weird how confident using some of his techniques have made me. And he's almost like a family counselor and a psychologist and he uses phrases that I find myself thinking about outside side of money. One of the things he says a lot is we need to tell the truth to ourselves and to others. Usually he's talking about money, but I find his voice in my head when I'm thinking, you know, I really should read this book. You know, he's like, tell the truth to yourself. And I'm like, I. I don't want to. Okay, I'm not reading it. You know, it's just little things like that. And he, he's become pervasive. I say pervasive like it's a bad thing, but it's. It's really, really a good thing. And I am loving it. I feel like I'll be able to speak more eloquently about this at a later date. And I do plan to. But yeah, it's. It's funny how these books and his concepts are. Are saving my life right now.

Anne Bogle (40:19)

Okay. I'm realizing as you're describing this book that I've gotten used to the kind of shock of the title, I will.

Sponsor (40:25)

Teach you to be rich.

Anne Bogle (40:26)

Because it's like, wait, what? Like, I. That's not where my. Why. But, but his whole thing is figure out what's important to you and go from there.

Shannon Malone (40:37)

Yeah. He says, spin extravagantly on what matters and cut mercilessly what does not. And I think he actually flips it. He says, cut mercilessly on what does not matter, so you can spin extravagantly on what does. And that has kind of just pervaded my thought process. Like, stop reading the books that you don't want to read so that you can read the books that you really do want to read, you know?

Anne Bogle (41:06)

Oh my gosh, I love that connection because I can imagine that many people listening will be like, who has the money to spend extravagantly on anything? But when you're thinking about where to put your attention and where to put your time. Yeah.

Shannon Malone (41:18)

Yes. That's why I said it's not just money for me. It's time. It's energy. You know, turning down the volume on things that don't matter so that you can fully concentrate on what does. It's all interconnected.

Anne Bogle (41:32)

Cut mercilessly. Oh, I didn't get that part the first time. Okay.

Shannon Malone (41:35)

Yeah, it's really great. I feel like a one great book style episode coming on about this stuff.

Anne Bogle (41:43)

I look forward to listening. Okay. For me, on the blog, I wrote about flexibility, like the yoga kind, but also the flexibility of mind and mental posture and scheduling and all that stuff. But also because you Gotta bring something new to the podcast. Hot tea with honey. I've been sick this week, and this is why we talk about what's saving our life at the midway point of Windsor. Because I get really, like, anxious about my kids coming home from school being like, oh, 400 people were absent today with the flu. And if it's not the flu with norovirus, I'm like, oh, maybe we could just all stay home until spring break. Maybe we could do that. But we're not going to do that. We got to keep going. But the hot tea with honey is helping. I've got some in front of me right now, so it's soothing. It tastes good. I have been fortunate to receive gifts of really, like, fancy honey at some point, and I love that. But right now, like, honey from Trader Joe's is totally doing the job to just keep me able to speak and keep my throat comfortable. And I like drinking it more than water when it's 4 degrees outside. But also, I'm drinking my tea and this ember mug, which, if you don't know what these are, they're these mugs that you plug in and charge so it can keep your drink hot for a long time. And Bailey, on our team, is the aficionado of all things related to hot drinks. So she's the one who told me about this, and she told me about it, and I thought, people buy those things, like, why? But I thought it would be a good gift idea for my mom. So last Christmas, I got my mom an ember mug, and I thought it would be perfect for her because my whole childhood, and I see her less in my adult life drinking her coffee in the morning, but my adult life as well. I have so many memories of her being like, now, where did I put my coffee that is now freezing cold? Let me microwave it again. And she didn't like microwaving it, but she didn't want to drink it cold. And I thought ember mugs were made for my mother, so I got her one for Christmas. And real talk, y'all, like, my mom died just a couple weeks after, and when we were at her house last spring, I saw her ember mug in the pantry, and I thought, oh, if it's okay, can I take this home with me? And I did. So now, surprisingly, I really love this ember mug. One of the reasons it's very practical.

Sponsor (44:10)

If it keeps your tea hot for.

Anne Bogle (44:12)

An hour, then it keeps your tea hot for a whole podcast recording or book club author talk. So if you're not Feeling the greatest. I mean, you know, it's on zoom, like you're not gonna make anybody sick. But if you need to be able to talk for an hour, but only.

Sponsor (44:26)

Hot tea will let you do that.

Anne Bogle (44:28)

Then, like, the ember mug will keep your tea hot for an hour. But I bought a color. I bought a bright red, which is the color that my mom loved for all her kitchenwares, but it's not my color, so every time I get it, it feels really nice in my hand. But I've got my bright red ember mug that was my mom's briefly. And it just has such. Oh, it takes my mind to, like a specific place that at this point is welcome to go to. Just every time I pour a cup in here. I mean, first it's pressed into service in the morning for coffee, but I think it's saving me right now.

Shannon Malone (45:00)

Yeah, sounds like it.

Anne Bogle (45:03)

Shannon, thanks so much for coming on to talk about what is saving us right now. I, like, kind of want to shorten that to lifesavers, but I feel like the connotation's wrong.

Shannon Malone (45:10)

Yeah.

Anne Bogle (45:11)

You know what I mean?

Shannon Malone (45:12)

Yeah, I do. But thanks for having me because it forces me to think about these things and not spiral into the wintry doldrums or seasonal affective disorder, which I have. And yeah, this was a very good tradition that you've started over on the blog. Thanks for bringing it to the what Should I Read Next Patreon community and to the podcast and.

Anne Bogle (45:36)

Well, that is so kind and thank you all for being a part of it for so many years. So thank you for your blog comments, thank you, patrons for your contributions to our thought process and also to each other. And I hope no matter where you are in your life, you're reading life in our community, that this gets you thinking and put your focus in a really welcome place for what remains of Windsor. Or really, anytime you're listening. What's saving your life right now is not a question that ever has bad timing. You know, that's true. Never bad time. Readers, I hope you enjoyed our conversation today. We would love to hear what is saving your life right now. You can tell us pretty much anywhere. Leave a comment at what should I read next? Podcast.com. that's where you'll also find the links to the books we talked about, to the mug and tea I talked about, and the other resources that we mentioned today. You can also comment on my blog post that went up on February 3, and you'll see lots of reader comments there as well. Follow along on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, wherever you like to get your podcast. If you could subscribe and set your settings so that you automatically download each new episode that impacts us in concrete ways here at what Should I Read Next? So thank you so much for taking the time to check your subscription settings. If you're not on our email list, sign up at what Should I read next podcast.com newsletter so that you're in the know on what is happening around here. You'll also find us on Instagram at what Should I Read Next? Come over and follow us there. Thanks to the people who make the show happen. What Should I Read Next? Is created each week by Will Bogle, Holly Wilkachevsky and Studio D Podcast Productions. Thank you Shannon for joining me for this episode. Thank you for having me, readers. That's it for this episode. Thanks so much for listening. And as Rainer Maria Rilke said, ah, how good it is to be among people who are reading. Happy reading everyone.