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What the Fundraising
263: Reframing Fundraising - Unlocking Donor Potential with a Data-Driven Approach with Karen Kelly
00:30:35
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- [00:00]
A
When you're asking somebody for a donation to an organization, no matter what your organization does, you're not asking them for dollars, you're asking for them to invest in the work that you're doing. And I think that that shifts the way that you have conversations with people, whether those are face to face conversations, whether those are appeals that you're sending to them. We're building relationships. And I think that that's a big shift that I have come come to understand over the years is that it's not just we need your money so that we can do X, it's we need you to be a part of this. We are in this together. We are building a better future together.
- [00:42]
B
Hey, my name is Mallory and I'm obsessed with helping leaders in the nonprofit space raise money and run their organizations differently. What the Fundraising is a space for real and raw conversations to both challenge and inspire you. Not too long ago I was in your shoes, uncomfortable, comfortable with fundraising and unsure of my place in this sector. It wasn't until I started to listen to other experts outside of the fundraising space that I was able to shift my mindset and ultimately shift the way I show up as a leader. This podcast is my way of blending professional and personal development so we as a collective inside the nonprofit sector can feel good about the work we are doing. Join me every week as I interview some of the brightest minds in the personal and professional development space to help you fundamentally change the way you lead and fundraise. I hope you enjoy this episode, so let's dive in. Welcome everyone. I am so excited to be here today with Karen Kelly. Karen, welcome to what the Fundraising.
- [01:43]
A
Thanks so much. I'm really excited for our conversation.
- [01:46]
B
Me too. Why don't you start by just telling everybody a little bit about you and your work and what brings you to our conversation and then we'll dig in.
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A
Sure. So I am currently the Development Manager at the Anne Arundel County Food bank and we are located in Crownsville, Maryland which is in the Annapolis area. I do a little bit of everything. Database management, recurring giving, new donor outreach. We're a very small team as most people can relate to. So I've been in this role for about two years now, but prior to that I spent about 10 years running the day to day operations for a startup nonprofit that I co founded with my husband called through the Heart and we provide pregnancy loss resources and support. So I did all the things and but my background is actually in higher education. I have a doctorate in Educational leadership and I worked in A variety of staff roles and also taught as an adjunct instructor for many years. So I am definitely one of those people who did not intend to become a fundraiser, but here I am.
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B
Yeah, it's so interesting. We actually have some. Like, I started in education also as a middle school educator. And so I love that. That's a interesting background to sort of bring you to all of this. So I love what we're talking about today because you had posted something on LinkedIn that I got so excited about that I was like, we gotta talk about this. On what? The fundraising. And then of course, time passed and my nice little ADHD had me forgetting what. What I had gotten excited about. But you had talked about your identity, your evolving identity as a fundraiser and kind of what it looked like for so many years when you were doing the fundraising, but not considering yourself a fundraiser and how that has evolved into now. And I think this is such a common experience for folks and was so true for me too. So talk to me a little bit about that.
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A
Sure. So when I was at through the Heart, we again started it up from absolutely nothing. And so I walked into it not really knowing anything about running a nonprofit. So probably not the best strategy. But we were coming off of our own pregnancy loss and in a place of grief and wanting to help other people. And so. So we decided to start a nonprofit in order to help others and just kind of jumped into it. And that meant learning everything. And of course, you need money to be able to run a nonprofit. And so one of those things was, of course, the fundraising. And when you're small and just trying to get off the ground and trying to learn everything about what you're doing, you definitely don't think of it as fundraising. You think of it as, we need money to run our programs. We need money to, you know, file all the reports we need to file with the government. We need those couple of dollars that we need to just keep going day to day. And so I just never thought of it that way. My title was not fundraiser or development or had anything to do with that. We didn't have any development people, we didn't have a staff. So I never thought of it that way. I just thought of it as, if we're going to operate, we need money. And so we ran fundraisers, we asked for donations, we did all the things that fundraisers do on a very small level. But it was just never something that I ever considered to be part of my identity, and I never considered myself any good at it. If you asked me what one of our biggest challenges as an organization was, and maybe still is over the years, is that we never had anyone that really was a fundraiser. And, you know, that was from, you know, staff, board members, volunteers. We just. That was kind of a missing piece. We had people with a lot of skills, a lot of backgrounds, and so that was just an identity that never crossed my mind. And as I worked in that role for about 10 years, and then I decided it was time to move on into something else. And so when I started working at the Food Bank, I actually started in the role. It was very specifically to work in the database, the donor database. And I have an extensive background working in databases, so it was a great fit for me. But the position, you know, very quickly became evident that there were other ways that I was going to be able to contribute to our team. And so after my first year, you know, we're very big as an organization on looking at employee goals and things of that nature for the upcoming year. And so when I was sitting and looking at my. My goals for the upcoming year, I said, well, I want to be able to contribute in new ways. I really want to get involved in donor relations. I just think there's a lot of things that we, as a team, could be doing that we previously hadn't had the manpower to be able to do again. You know, very small team, but growing. My position was brand new when I joined the organization, and so I was like, I'm going to learn how to do all these things. So I spent basically all of last fiscal year learning how to do all of those things. I did a lot of trainings, Mallory, I listened to you speak many, many times. Just a lot of learning, a lot of growing and implementing a lot of what I learned and able to be able to help grow our fundraising at the Food bank. And fortunately had a very successful year. And so I got to the end of the year, and I was reflecting back, and I said, wow, you know, I did all these things. I created a recurring giving program and launched that. And we had a 23% increase in monthly giving over year, over year. And we started reaching out to lapsed donors. We recaptured 12% of our lapsed donors in under 12 months, which we were really excited about, and we had really great, great success. And I thought about it, I said, you know what? I was like, I think I'm a fundraiser. And it was just all of a sudden, it clicked for me, and I was like, wow, that identity was there all of a sudden, and it was just something that Never was there for me before. But it really took that last year of all those pieces coming together and just really kind of immersing myself in the industry and really just kind of taking that step back at the end of it and saying, wow, this is who I am now. And so I'm proud to say now that I'm a fundraiser.
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B
Okay. I love this story for so many reasons, but I'm curious, you know, that I'm bad at fundraising piece that's such a big part of my story, right? I was like, there's no way that good fundraisers feel this way or there's no way that good fundraisers are nervous before talking to somebody about money. And so, and I think part of my like not identifying as a fundraiser mixed with those feelings about how bad I was at it became this like, self fulfilling prophecy in so many ways and created a lot of like resistance for me. And I'm curious for you, like, how did, now that you've adopted this identity, how has that shifted some of those internal narratives or has it shifted some of those internal narratives about being, quote, unquote, good at it?
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A
A big thing for me is I've realized that fundraising encompasses a lot of different skills. I used to always think that fundraising was a very talkative person. Going out and working the room, you know, talking, talking to people and just being very outgoing and likable and sociable. And that to me was a fundraiser. And that's not me as a person. So I'm a savage introvert. I have social anxiety. I'm very worn down by talking to people for very long stretches of time. If you put me in a room and have me make small talk with people, that is, I'm going to shut down. So I'm not what you would think of as a fundraiser. At least not what I would have thought of as a fundraiser. But through the last year especially, I've learned that fundraising is also, it's especially data. I've learned that a lot of success that I found was because of data that we have, that we strategies that we put together. It's building plans. It's not just going out and talking to people, it's having those strategies. So that when you do talk to people, there's a plan there and there's a strategy and there's a method to talking to people. And so it is. Fundraising is a team effort. If you have the team, which is wonderful, but there's a lot of skills that go along with it. And it's not just talking to people. And it's not just one characteristic of being a social person. And so that was a really a big revelation for me. I think that you can contribute a lot and not be always be that forward facing person.
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B
I so appreciate that reflection and I would say even like, so you know, I started this company this year, practivated, that helps fundraisers practice for donor meetings. And one of the most interesting things that we've heard is how many introverted fundraisers are in there. Like that same thing, like trying to find their voice or their way of doing it or feeling like all this kind of trainings that they've been to or workshops where people are kind of giving them very specific scripts or telling them very specific ways to build connection that aren't true to who they are, like naturally feels really like they're like, I can't be good at that because I am not that way. And so I think this point is so important that like, number one, yes, like there's all these pieces around fundraising and components of fundraising that like, if you never want to be the person who's talking to anybody, like, you can be a great fundraiser and raise a lot of money and not be that person. And I would just say for folks who are like, who feel like, oh, I can't be that person because I am introverted or whatever, like we I've just met over the last few months in particular, so many incredible frontline fundraisers who are introverts. And I even people do not believe this. I am actually an introvert in terms of like how my energy what refills me and like energetically. And I also being neurodivergent feels super uncomfortable in big networking, like surface level conversations with neurodiversity. So a lot of what you said, I think also probably were reasons why I was maybe like, ooh, I'm not the person to be like launched into a networking event and I'm going to start to build all these relationships. I definitely didn't feel like that was a strength of mine. So I love this because I think the diversity, we need more diversity of people in all different ways across fundraising. And so I think you're touching on something really like beautiful there. I'm curious, like, why do you think or for folks who are maybe rewind 10 years and I'm kind of trying to do the same without the lived experience of like all the learning or the success, like being able to have that like personal reflection moment. What are some like shifts that you think people could start to incorporate into maybe how they talk to themselves or how they think about certain things to open up their curiosity around maybe their identity related to fundraising.
- [12:58]
A
I think a big thing for me was again just starting to connect with people in the industry in a different way. So I did a lot of trainings, I'm a lifelong learner, so I did a lot of trainings. But I also started becoming a little more active on LinkedIn. I wasn't really posting myself, but I was starting to follow the conversations a little bit more. And that's a platform that I have been on technically for a really long time. I haven't done much with it. And I started noticing when I went to the conferences and the webinars that people, especially the presenters, were dropping their linkedins. And so I said, well, I'm going to go check them out on LinkedIn now. And so I realized, okay, there are some great conversations happening here. And I think that helped to kind of feel a part of the community and to kind of understand the identity of the fundraising community a little more from a different perspective. So it didn't even mean that I had to start posting all my own thoughts right away. It's something that I have started to try to get into a little bit and I'm still at the very early stages of getting my thoughts out there. And it's a little nerve wracking when you're trying to put your stuff out there and you feel like no one cares and no one's looking at it. But I think even just reading what's out there and commenting and just engaging and just kind of getting a pulse on what's going on because you realize one, a lot of people are going through a lot of similar, similar challenges that you are, whether you're early in your career, any point in your career, whether you've, you've changed completely what you're doing, there are a lot of people that you can relate to in some way. And so that's been a really helpful platform for me in order to be able to just kind of connect and find that community. And so I've been really grateful for. So that's, that's a place that I would recommend for people to get involved.
- [14:47]
B
Yeah, I love that. I also don't think I really like knew what LinkedIn was like, like three years ago. And then I started to like it cuz it felt a lot more conversational in the comments than other social media platforms. And I was like, wow, this is cool. You can like engage back and forth in a really different way, but your post led you here. So there's some positive reinforcement. But I agree there's so many ways to engage and learn and connect with people on LinkedIn. I think that's really, really, that's really great advice. You said something early when you were telling your story that has sort of like stuck with me and is something I think about a lot. When you were talking about the founding of your organization, which also, I don't know if you know this, but it's like so personal to me too. So I just so appreciate the work that you've done around the grief and loss work there. But I was thinking about how, you know, you were talking about not really knowing, like, okay, yeah, we need money for this, but like that this is sort of like a function or a skill set of the organization. And I think that trickles down for a long time sometimes in organizations into mindsets around the fundraising is a necessary evil or a means to an. And I really believe that like good fundraising is the work, you know, like when we're bringing people into our organization and building momentum and community and helping people express their values and it changes parts of who they are to give and be a part of like your monthly giving program. So talk to me. I think especially with the lens and the fundraising work that you do and the way you like look at data and then are making kind of strategic decisions in some of those grassroots fundraising ways. How do you think about that now? Like the role of fundraising in your organization and how that connects to really like the impact work more than just like the money itself.
- [16:37]
A
Something that I learned is that when you're asking somebody for a donation to an organization, no matter what your organization does, you're not asking them for dollars, you're asking for them to invest in the work that you're doing. And I think that that shifts the way that you have conversations with people, whether those are face to face conversations, whether those are appeals that you're sending to them. We're building relationships. And I think that that's a big shift that I have come to understand over the years is that it's not just we need your money so that we can do X, it's we need you to be a part of this. We are in this together. We are building a better future together. And so I remember very early on asking people for money was in any form was like the most nerve wracking thing to do. I don't want to ask people to give me their money, but in order to do anything, we need money. And so I realized it's asking them to invest in the work that we're. And by showing them what the impact of that donation is, how we're able to help people, by sharing the stories and the testimonials of the people that they're helping, that is allowing them to see where their investment is going and allowing them to be a part of something that we are doing that is really important and that is helping people. And so I think that it's that general kind of mind shift of this is a community building, relationship building activity. I think that sometimes fundraisers get this kind of this label that we're almost like salespeople, and that we're just. We're just out there to just get money from people. And if, you know, we are nonprofits are doing incredible work. We're doing work to help people. And so donors are a part of that work, and they're what makes that possible. And so by building those relationships through, again, storytelling and just sharing the impact of where those dollars are going, yes, at the end of the day, they're donating their money, but they are a part of that. And we also have people, you know, that volunteer time. Not everybody gives money. So people give in different ways. Right. So people become engaged with the organization in different ways. And so I think that's been kind of a big shift, is just understanding that building those relationships makes the ask a little bit easier, because you're not asking people just to give up their money. You're asking them to be a partner with you, with what you're doing. And if they believe in the work that you're doing and they see the need and they understand how you're addressing that need, then it becomes a little bit easier for them to that donation and to. To be involved with you.
- [19:12]
B
Yeah, you said something there that I need to, like, think about more before I'm gonna have a, like, clear way of articulating this. But you said something there that I think is, like, so brilliant in that reframing from we need your money for this versus, like, we want to invite you to invest in this work that we're doing together. And can't remember exactly the difference, but something about how you said that really made me think that shift in language really changes, like, the immediacy and the transactional nature of the invitation. Like, there's something about the, like, we need your money to do this thing that I think leads to then all these other kind of patterns of how we talk about fundraising. Like, I remember when I'd sit down at a donor meeting. And they'd be like, so, tell me about your sustainability plan and what you plan to do after I give this money next year to make this money. And I was like, oh, my God, like, what? I don't know. Fundraise? More like, ask you again. Like, I was like, what does this mean? Like, is there a secret here for, like, how we don't have to ask for money anymore? Like, I will take that, you know, whatever it is. But I think, like, what you're talking about, even that language, and I use the investment language a lot too, but there's, like, something that I heard in the way that you said it that just made me, like, really feel and realize how much that shift in language changes the kind of, like, being there for the long run. Not that you don't have to talk about the impact of that investment, of course, like, in the way that you talked about. But there's a really different, like, component or there's, like, a really different feeling around, like, to, you know, we need money to do this one very specific thing versus investing to support this type of work. Like, just that framing, I think, is really. Is really huge. Okay, I want to make sure before we run out of time that I get to ask you one other question. So, because you are in the data, and that's a big part of your, like, fundraising superpower, and I hear in how you're talking, Talking, I feel at least, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, this sense of, like, abundance or at least sufficiency. Like, I don't hear a lot of scarcity language in how you talk about fundraising. And obviously, you guys had a good year last year, and things grow. But I, like, have this sense that, like, you see a lot of opportunity. And I'm curious, like, is it the data? Is it your intimate relationship with the data that makes you feel that way? And talk to me a little bit about that.
- [21:49]
A
It definitely has to do with the data. So I think part of the reason we've had success is because we looked at our data. We made very strategic decisions based on our data. Of course, we have a great donor base that is part of it, but we have also refined our appeals. We have made decisions based on the data that we get from those appeals, and everything that we do is very strategic. And so I think that has a lot to do with the success that we're seeing. Again, we know that there's a need in our community. We have great donors who are stepping up and addressing that need. But it's also not an accident that we're getting to where we are. So I think that having the data, utilizing it in a way that allows us to make really strategic decisions is important. And continuing to keep clean data and continuing to look at the data in new ways is always really important. So I have branched out into doing a lot of other roles in my job right now, but at the end of the day, it comes down to I work with the data. I'm the data person still. So that's really one of the things that I love doing. And for me, it's always going to come back down to that. So I think that it does allow us to really inform what we do and to make changes or to keep some things the same. You know, sometimes we do keep things the same as they. That was really successful. Let's do the same thing. But we're able to. To look and to say, you know, hey, here's where we have some opportunity. We, last year started reaching out to our lapsed donors. We were a food bank, so we saw a really big influx of donations in 2020 and 2021 because of COVID and a lot of those donors at the time, there was no development staff, so they were not receiving much back in. In terms of any kind of donor relations. I can't speak exactly to what was happening at the time, but we know that it was not much. And so a lot of them, they kind of fell off and because there was no one speaking to them. And so we had a very large database of people who hadn't given in several years. And it didn't mean that they didn't care about what we were doing. It's just that no one had spoken to them in possibly any way, whether that was email, mail, any in any way in a couple of years. And so we saw that as a really good opportunity to look at that data and say, hey, let's reach out to some of these people. And so we said we had really good success reaching out to our lapse donors, where it's a project in progress, still working on it. But I said, we're coming up on close to a year now since we started that, and we've recovered already 12% of those lapsed donors. So that is a very strategic, again, way of looking at the data, making sure it was clean first. But then the plan of how we were going to outreach to them was very strategic. But I think part of it was just recognizing that we had it there, that that was something that we hadn't tapped into yet. And there was an opportunity. And so we crafted messaging very specifically for that segment of donors. And, and I think that's always a great opportunity. And I know that it's, it's time consuming and I know that not everybody has the opportunity to be able to always do those things, but it's definitely in my mind worth the investment in the time to be able to look at that data and then make those decisions based on, on what you have to work with.
- [25:17]
B
I love that. And I just wanted, I know we're, we're out of time, but I just want to double click on like something that you are doing there that maybe you all don't even realize you're doing, which is you're looking at hard data that I think sometimes leads fundraisers and teams to like self doubt or paralysis or fear. Right. They'll look at a lapsed donor list, folks who haven't been communicated with in years. And they're like, and this was so true for me, like, embarrassed, like, oh my gosh. And so then they're like, well, I definitely can't reach out to them because I am so embarrassed that we have not talked to them in three years. But you guys didn't do that. You were like, what an opportunity.
- [25:57]
A
And I remember when I first started this project, the statistics were if they were three years or more lapsed, the likelihood of them donating again was very, very slim. And, you know, everyone said, really, you don't really want to bother with them. We've actually had some success with that population. We started out with email because of course, it doesn't cost us anything to send the emails. So we said, why not? Right? Of course, we also don't have emails for about half of that segment, but we are seeing some results from that population. So I think that it, it goes to show that, you know, yes, that might be true generally, but you also can't say that is true all the time. And so I think that it does depend on your donor base, depends on the individual situation. So I figured let's just kind of jump in. Let's, let's give it a try. And we have been adapting our plan as we go along based on the results that we've seen. And since we are seeing success, we figured let's just keep going with it.
- [26:51]
B
I love it. I love it. Thank you so very much for this conversation, for sharing all this wisdom and your story with everybody. I think this is like, probably one of the most relatable stories in nonprofit and just, I love hearing about how you found like your place in fundraising, that does feel good and just sort of demonstrated that there are so many different roles in fundraising that make you a fundraiser, whether you're having those frontline conversations or not. And the way that embracing that identity, like, supports you today. So I'm so grateful. Tell everyone where they can connect with you on LinkedIn if they're inspired to give to the Food bank or anything else you want to share.
- [27:31]
A
Absolutely, yes. Please come join me on LinkedIn. Karen J. Kelly would love to make more connections there. And if you'd like to visit us at the Anne Arundel County Food bank, we are aafoodbank.org amazing.
- [27:45]
B
Thank you so much for your time today.
- [27:47]
A
Well, thank you. This was wonderful.
- [27:55]
B
I hope today's episode inspired or challenged you to think differently. For additional takeaways, tips, show notes, and more about our amazing guest and sponsors, head on over to Mallorykson.com backslash podcast and if you didn't know, hosting this podcast isn't the only thing I do every day. I coach, guide and help fundraisers and leaders just like you. Inside of my program, the Power Partner Partners Formula Collective. Inside the program, I share my methods, tools and experiences that have helped me fundraise millions of dollars and feel good about myself in the process. To learn more about how I can help you, visit MalloryErickson.com PowerPartners Last but not least, if you enjoyed this episode, I'd love to encourage you to share it with a friend you know would benefit or leave a review. I'm so grateful for all of you and the good hope hard work you're doing to make our world a better place. I can't wait to see you in the next episode.