← What the Fundraising
What the Fundraising
302: Philanthropy's Role in Preserving Black History with Kristi Williams & Emma Willis
00:29:35
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- [00:04]
Mallory Erickson
Before we dive in, I want to
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Podcast Host
give a huge shout out to donorperfect
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Mallory Erickson
for supporting this podcast and the fundraisers
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Podcast Host
who listen to it.
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Mallory Erickson
They're not just a CRM, they're a partner in helping fundraisers feel more confident, aligned and supported. Learn more@donorperfect.com Mallory.
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Emma Willis
When I think of philanthropy, I actually get a little bit more technical because I think we forget that while philanthropy is this charitable act and it's meant for community benefit, they also get some critical learnings about us in society too. Which is why the Grant report is always this amazing creature that's associated with funding that you receive is what am I going to report back? And so we think about that in terms of how our lived experiences add to future planning of society.
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Mallory Erickson
Hey, my name is Mallory and I'm obsessed with helping leaders in the nonprofit space raise money and run their organizations differently.
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Podcast Host
What the Fundraising is a space for
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Mallory Erickson
real and raw conversations to both challenge and inspire you. Not too long ago I was in your shoes. Uncomfortable with fundraising and unsure of my place in this sector. It wasn't until I started to listen to other experts outside of the fundraising space that I was able to shift my mindset and ultimately shift the way I show up as a leader. This podcast is my way of blending professional and personal development that so we as a collective inside the nonprofit sector can feel good about the work we are doing. Join me every week as I interview some of the brightest minds in the personal and professional development space to help you fundamentally change the way you lead and fundraise. I hope you enjoy this episode, so let's dive in.
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Podcast Host
Welcome everyone. I am so excited to be here today with Kristi Williams and Emma Willis. Welcome both of you to what the fundraising.
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Emma Willis
Thank you for having us.
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Christy Williams
Thank you.
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Podcast Host
Do you want to start just by giving some introductions to who you are and the work that you do and then we can dig into this conversation together.
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Christy Williams
You want to go first?
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Emma Willis
No, you got it.
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Christy Williams
My name is Christy Williams. I am a descendant of the 1921 Tulsa Rice Massacre. Also a Creek Freedman descendant and a member of Historic Vermin AMB Church and also a National Geographic Explorer and founder.
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Emma Willis
Emma Willis, founder of the firm Impact Period. Our focus is on community led efforts that have high lasting and long, long standing impact in their communities and spaces beyond where they live. I've been doing this for three years now. Previously was in finance where I managed my state's 529 plan as well as a tech founder. Pleasure to be here today.
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Podcast Host
Amazing. Well, why don't we start by talking a little bit about the importance, partnering with descendants to uncover and preserve things, like, you know, the true history of the 1921 Tulsa Race Massacre. And then maybe from there we can go into how that relates to the critical role that philanthropy can play in historic preservation and black history in particular. So wants to take that one first.
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Emma Willis
Definitely, Christy, because it's descendant led. She's a descendant.
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Christy Williams
I'm always talking about descended led, descended led. It's so important. And especially communities like Greenwood in Tulsa, Oklahoma, where our history has just been intentionally ignored, deleted, rewritten. I always use this African proverb. Until the lion learns to tell its own story, the story will always glorify the hunter. And so it's really important that we learn our history because it is being deleted intentionally. And a lot of those elders in our community holds those stories, but we forgot how to pass those stories now to generation to generation to generation. So I love to teach people that we as a people have a responsibility to archive and to preserve our own stories. And so teaching the art of storytelling and now how to preserve them and create spaces now where we can preserve them, and you don't have to wait on an institution to do it. So that's one of the things that I've been really wanting to teach. And especially in Oklahoma, where House Bill 1775 was passed, where we it's illegal to teach black history, but it's not just black history. Our governor said we can't teach anything in a public school that's going to make white students uncomfortable. And that was his words. And so we have to really look at that. And then the banning of 100 books in Oklahoma and across the country today, over 10,000 books have been banned. And so. And a lot of those books are authors who look like me. And a lot of stories that are just are banned.
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Podcast Host
Emma, from your perspective, do you want to add anything there just from the partnership side around, you know, recommendations for folks who are partnering with descendants in this way and. Yeah, just Anything else you want to add there?
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Emma Willis
Yeah, I'll say anytime you are talking about the experiences of human beings first. I mean, a lot of times we say tell people stories, but they were lived experiences. And so I always want to level set there that these are human experiences. And I think the other part about that is those experiences are requiring that we find compassionate humanity inside of each one of those experiences or story shared. The erasure of African American history in America is really something I would just kind of convey to the public. You need to Pay more attention to that. If they can do it for one population, they can easily do it for somebody else. A lot of these practices happen with communities that have been historically oppressed or more vulnerable because they know they don't always have the advocacy and the resources to fight a lot of the issues that are coming down. And so, from that perspective, I say it's important for you to know what's happening in your legislature when it comes to literature and history, what's being published and shared in your schools, and find the voice and the ability to find either partners for advocacy and activism around those issues or choose yourself to be the person to archive and store a lot of those resources. And so, for this particular effort, I think what's been important is making the world aware of what's happening in Tulsa, how it aligns with things that have historically happened in this country and internationally, and just pop your head up and ask for help. Because the truth about this project, as you talk to us, you'll find that, like, this is probably one of the most organic clients and partnerships I've had in some time. Just so happened to be in the right market, doing work with Christie already. And as we were going through that effort, things just started to align in a really organic and natural way.
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Podcast Host
Yeah, I mean, I'm curious. This is bringing up so many different questions for me, but I'm curious, like, when you think about the role that the everyday person can play in this. Like, I want to talk about the philanthropy side, of course, as well, but, you know, I really appreciate what you said around. Like, these are human beings, and, yes, like, storytelling is important, but those stories are lived experiences. And that makes me think about just human connection in general. And what does that. Oh, when we think about, you know, not being somebody with a lot of money to invest in something like this, what can everyday people do to be allies and advocates and history preservers?
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Emma Willis
I think I'd start first with having the willingness to pick up a book and open it. I mean, Americans are fans of fiction, and very rarely do we want to go and pick up the biography or go and read through old newspapers or look for those historic ledgers and maybe your local church or your local library. But that is evidence of the people who came before you. That is ancestral history. That is ancestral documents. And it is all of our responsibility to know who used to exist in the places we now stand in. It's our job to know what the previous fight was in order to allow us the privileges and the benefits we have today. And the Easiest thing you can actually do is go and look at the nationally banned books and go and purchase them. Because the truth of the matter is, we watch what happened in Florida schools, they just rounded up books and then they just ended up in a dump. Right. That's all material that could literally be saved and repurposed for the future generations to have. Material to see what the life was like, what experiences led up to this very moment where these books were banned. And quite frankly, it's the ability to be able to uplift those voices because they took the time to write and document the things that were happening in their lives. And also journaling, I don't think we ever pay attention to how much journals matter in the future. Not to have to always cite this one, but Anne Frank's diaries are one of the biggest things that allowed us to have some insight into what happened in Nazi Germany. And so even you taking the time to journal and document what this present day experiences have been for you is a really poignant moment in the future's ability to grasp the what this country has grown through and what it's going to become.
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Christy Williams
And Diary for Anne Frank is also one of the books that's been banned.
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Podcast Host
Yeah, I mean, there's so many interconnected issues here right around the erasure of people, the like, erasure of voice, and who is extended the privilege of their comfort, being protected and who is not.
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Christy Williams
Right.
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Podcast Host
Like, I think that's really, as I am absorbing what you're saying, I think is so infuriating, honestly, is who gets to define comfort? Who is that comfort for? And ultimately it's. I do a lot of work around understanding stress in the body and the way that that impacts our fundraising and human connection. And so my book is actually about, like, this progression from discomfort to stress to chronic stress to burnout. And I'm looking at it within the context of fundraising. But one of the things that I talk about a lot is like, when discomfort shows up in your body, one of the very first things to investigate is like, is that discomfort showing up because you're out of alignment? Or is that discomfort showing up because you're growing, because you're on your growth edge, because you're actually leaning into alignment around who you want to be? But yeah, it's uncomfortable to get there because you have to face some truths and look in the mirror and dig deeper and growth is not comfortable, you know, and so it's just like, it's sort of to hear umbrella terms like that also being like, excavated from, like, we should Never feel discomfort. And the things that make us uncomfortable, I mean, the implications for that just run so far and wide.
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Emma Willis
No true words. I think when you bring up what it is to go out and ask for the resources you know are important for you to further your work becomes usually the first stumbling block for people who really want to get in the trenches and do the work is the discomfort of having to ask. It's a level of vulnerability most people are uncomfortable with. Because to state a need is to almost have to be like, you know, the tiny little vulnerable creature out in the wild because we aren't prepared for no's. And it's a muscle you build up to over time. I, for whatever reason, my career allowed me the comfort of being able to ask for money. And it's just because I was in the places that were doling the cash out historically. And I'd always have to put those people coming in asking for the resources, fears to rest, because it was just a conversation. I just need to know where you're trying to go. I need to know if there's institutional alignment with your efforts. And I'm going to do what I can to help. But the act of making yourself like that, vulnerable is also knowing that your work a lot of times is tied to that no or that yes that you get. And so I'd always encourage people, while it may feel uncomfortable, you know, it inevitably at the end of the day what you have to do to get there, whether it's a community led effort or campaign to raise those resources, or it's an institutional gift, you still have to start with the ask. And the more you do it, the more comfortable you'll get. And it becomes a really critical skill inside of a lot of communities to possess. And right now we're in this individualistic, like type of mindset where it's my comfort, my abilities, my thing. But when you live in community, you are your brother's keeper. And so me going out and making sure I make the appropriate ask for the work Christy and I are doing, it's me understanding what's at stake for that community every day. And so it's always the framing of the argument, it's the movement through the discomfort. But at the end of the day, it's the understanding that you do survive those moments and you will actually persevere. And those actually get to be these interesting little critiques that you get instead of it being the end of the world is what I'd say.
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Podcast Host
Yeah. Hey, I want to tell you about a podcast I Genuinely love the Small Nonprofit podcast. It's hosted by the incredible Maria Rio, and it speaks directly to the realities so many of us are living inside every day. Maria, tell us about your show.
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Maria Rio
Hi, I'm your host, Maria Rio. I moved to Canada as a refugee, used charitable services myself, and have been fundraising for over a decade. I love exploring ways our sector can grow, change and make the world more equitable. The small Nonprofit podcast is where we do just that. I believe small nonprofits are where the most transformative work happens. But we've been set up to fail by systems that expect us to do more with less. Every week I sit down with leaders, fundraisers and change makers who are doing things differently. They're building sustainable funding without compromising their values, creating power instead of dependence and pushing back on the broken systems we've all inherited. You'll walk away with actionable strategies you can use, not just inspiration. So if you're ready to stop scrambling and start building something that lasts, you're in the right place. Let's get into it.
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Podcast Host
If you're leading or fundraising at a small nonprofit and you're craving work that feels aligned, sustainable and human, go listen to the Small Nonprofit podcast.
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Mallory Erickson
Search the Small Nonprofit podcast on Spotify
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Podcast Host
or Apple Podcasts to listen. And I'm, I'm curious. Like, I can only imagine, like this isn't my lived experience, but I've certainly like had a lot of conversations on the podcast around. I want to talk about the role that philanthropy needs to play in preserving black history and work in, you know, community led spaces around that. And some of what you're sharing for fundraisers to be going to donors to ask donors that don't look like them look like the community that they're advocating for that funding for. What would you most want those philanthropists perhaps at first to understand or to how you might ask them to show up, recognizing that in addition to the importance of supporting the work, there's a whole other dynamic, even in just that relationship that I think is like, important to be mindful of.
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Christy Williams
Yeah. One of the things I think is important for philanthropists to understand, even those who may just donate, you know, just small dollars to, to any type of organization that's preserving black history, is that it's not just for the black community. The black community is not the only community that benefits from that giving. Right. This helps make societies better. It supports a stronger democracy. And we all are learning from each other. I always tell this story of when I, my 11th grade year at Memorial High School, I went to a predominantly white high school. And it was the first time I actually had a real black history class. And they didn't do a semester. It was a whole year. And it was Mr. Mountry who passed away, but he was my teacher. And it was only eight black kids in the classroom of among about 25 students, the rest were white. And when I had his class, he taught me that our history didn't begin at slavery and it didn't end at the civil rights movement. And after I had his class, it gave me a confidence that I didn't know that I needed. Like, I've heard black history, right? I've heard of Rosa Parks, Dr. King. We learned that in school. But in his class, I learned about African kingdoms. I learned about African kings and queens and people's roles that I've never heard of, of inventors and things in America and globally. And ever since then, it matters to me when I walk into a room, how I hold my head and how I walk in. And that was Mr. Roundtree. And I often wonder, the white students who was in that class with me, if what he taught did that to me, what did it do to them? Are they better citizens? Right. In this country because of what they learned from Mr. Roundtree? So I say all of that again just to say that I don't want philanthropists to just look at it like I'm just helping these poor black communities, trying to learn their history or for repair or however or healing. But it. You're a part of that, too. Just like at black history Saturdays, I don't have just black students. I have students from all nationalities, from pre K to adults. And that's important because it's. This is American history, Like it or not, it is. And so we all have a responsibility to preserve it.
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Emma Willis
And I think when I think of philanthropy actually get a little bit more technical, because I think we forget that while philanthropy is this charitable act and it's meant for community benefit, they also get some critical learnings about us in society, too, which is why the grant report is always this amazing creature that's associated with funding that you receive is, what am I going to report back? And so we think about that in terms of how our lived experiences add to future planning of society. Right? And so they are in a position, because they have all of this amassed wealth, to be able to learn faster than most people are. And we don't ever think about how many organizations they give to and how many insights are gained. Well, we're helping them learn, and we're Helping them create. And we're helping them craft these future plans and these visions that they have that are so big. And so it is not that we are just receiving the resource that is capital. We're also giving them something back that's really critical to how they see the world. Right? We're offering them compassion a lot of times on paper, a lot of times we're offering them, like, the gritty realities of lives that people live and what we do as the practitioners to be able to mitigate, slowdown, and improve a lot of those situations. Now it becomes something that you work at over time, because a lot of times we'll see people get these grants. But I'll tell anybody that gets. And this is my favorite thing to tell Christie. I'll say issue people like, I got a million dollars. I'm like, it's 25 bucks. It's literally $25. It does not spin as big as the number sounds. You actually need to 10x that before you can get to some level of comfort to be able to do your work. Because otherwise, what I like to tell philanthropists is like, you really are creating a situation where I'm having to learn how to go out and aggressively always raise. Like, there is no comfort in sitting in that position with that resource to just focus on that problem that you are intending to solve or whatever resource you are intending to offer. And so what I would say to philanthropy is learn how the resources you deploy actually can become a working relationship that you can improve and build upon over time versus thinking about it in this. That simple grant cycle. Like, the organizations that show up at their doorstep more often than not are there by invitation. And you got to think about that. In the world of philanthropy, that invitation is typically through a network you possess. It's not that you can just walk in and you knock on the door and you're like, I want some money. You already have to have some relationships in place. So you are kind of working at this already. It's not even kind of, I won't short sale my fellow fundraisers. But it's a process. It is you understanding the means and mode in which that philanthropist wants to operate. You understand their core pillars and objectives. There's so many things that we have to learn about you. What we are asking in return is that you take the time and learn a little bit about us and the people in the communities we serve. And so it's also making sure those insights you gain return to the community in a fashion in which we can digest it and act on them. Because a lot of times that becomes very proprietary information that stays inside of those institutions. And we all want to work smarter with the little bit of resources we have.
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Podcast Host
Yeah. Like their role in honoring the like connective tissue and learning that ultimately is revealed through these projects. And part of what I'm that is bringing up when I'm hearing you say this is, you know, we mentioned a little bit around kind of the importance of investing in community led preservation projects in particular. And that comes with it sounds like what you're saying is this responsibility that the learning that's going to also come from that work together is accessible and informative back into the local community. Yeah. Is there anything else you want to add to that?
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Emma Willis
Yeah, I mean, it makes me think of some of my most interesting growth points to this very moment. I was sitting on a stage at a major university and we were all coming together to report like the success we were having in the world of higher education savings. And I remember sitting on a panel with an economist, some leading researcher in higher education studies, and they were talking about this white paper and I was like, can I access this white paper? And they were like, you'll have to talk to the department chair about that. And you don't realize that research is so heavily monetized in America and it's not accessible. This is in our four year institutions. This is inside of philanthropy. And to be able to reach into that, knowing that people are making these critical discoveries would actually help us a lot on the ground. If we know that you've identified behaviors or trends that will help us move a lot faster. Because now I have a pool of knowledge that I can lean into without duplicating the effort. Right. There's a lot of redundancy and duplication in this world, but I like to be on the forefront of, of hearing about these things because if there's something I can do that would allow me to support my client, Kristy Williams, and move her past this area where people tend to spiral, which is gathering critical knowledge. We all go through the same level of discovery. Typically in these projects. We have to know where the community stands. We have to understand what headwinds are associated with the project. Because our job is to make sure our client can move through these processes without wasting critical resources. So for every question we ask, it's meant to make sure that their livelihood and their resources go unsquandered. And so there are ways that philanthropy could lean in and actually double down and just be a partner in the process too. We work a lot with the ever elusive program officer. And that's a big title for it, to just be a person that does a touch point with you. Instead, I have to give a shout out to Kaufman Foundation. They're really good at this. You can call and talk to your program officer and it'll be like, hey, I need to know a person that's doing a thing. And they'll be like, you know what, we went to a conference. We should absolutely like, put you together with the person and credit to them because they don't like Gatekeep in that regard. They don't make you have to do another thing to get gain access to the people who are doing the work. And for me, those levels of collaboration have been the most important ones. When you do work in these spaces is like, I get to tag team with a Christie who is already on the ground doing preservation and remembrance work. And in that, she has a demographic that's way different than anybody else. She has a large. A larger pool of younger learners than most people have, because that's the other thing. Typical people who do this work are going to have one demographic that they'll serve one or two. Very rarely do they get the span. And Christy is in there understanding what literacy rates are for her community. She's understanding what comprehension looks like for her community that she's serving. And she can tailor curriculum way faster based off of that. Now, if everybody had that same capability and a partnership like Christy and Black History Saturdays, you'd probably fly through a lot of these issues, be able to diagnose and address the problems way sooner. And quite frankly, the resources would actually go further. But the more time we have to spend defining the problem and making sure that our research is beyond approach, we lose a lot of working capital in that regard. And so that's what I say. I really think we need to get out of the business of philanthropy because it has become more transactional. And it could be much better if they understood what it was to lean into community and turn those resources loose in a way where they understand we're learning in real time. And we really do want to make major, substantial and sustainable impact in our communities.
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Podcast Host
Amazing. Christy, anything you want to add to that?
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Christy Williams
No, other than what we're doing at Historic Vernon AME Church is something that this community has been wanting to do for a long time, and they are super excited. The community is always talking about, I can't wait to see what's happening there. But for those who don't know historic Vernon AME Church. The basement survived the 1921 Tulsa Race Massacre and people hid there for three days in that basement. And a lot of the trauma that happened to the structure is still there. And I say the physical trauma that happened because not only was Greenwood set fire to, but it was also bombed. And so a lot of that damage still exists in the basement that we're actually going to show and not only tell the story of just the massacre, but what life was like before the massacre and what it was like afterwards because there was a rebuilding that happened and we often don't talk about that. And so that's some of the things we're going to preserve. But more importantly, the oral histories that has not been documented will be documented and preserved to complement the artifacts that we do have. And the structure because it is an actual structural artifact itself.
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Podcast Host
Incredible. I know we're out of time. Tell folks where they can go to learn more, to support, get additional resources perhaps for their own community at what where should we send folks?
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Christy Williams
I would go to Historic Vernon Ame first, a Facebook page. We do post information there. We also have the Vernon Witness Facebook page and we'll be sharing the pictures of artifacts, things that we have. We're going to be documenting the story as we go and stay tuned for a lot more. We have our website that we are still planning coming up. So everything is rolling.
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Podcast Host
Amazing.
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Mallory Erickson
Thank you.
- [28:37]
Podcast Host
Thank you so much for the work that you do and for sharing so much with us today.
- [28:42]
Emma Willis
Happy to be here. Thank you.
- [28:43]
Christy Williams
Thank you for having us.
- [28:50]
Mallory Erickson
I hope today's episode inspired or challenged
- [28:53]
Podcast Host
you to think differently.
- [28:54]
Mallory Erickson
For additional takeaways, tips, show notes and more about our amazing guests and sponsors, head on over to Mallorykson.com podcast and if you didn't know, hosting this podcast isn't the only thing I do every day. I coach, guide and help fundraisers and leaders just like you. Inside of my program, the Power Partners Formula Collective Inside the program, I share my methods, tools and experiences that have helped me fundraise millions of dollars and feel good about myself in the process. To learn more about how I can help you, visit MalloryErickson.com PowerPartners Last but not least, if you enjoyed this episode, I'd love to encourage you to share
- [29:33]
Podcast Host
it with a friend you know would
- [29:35]
Mallory Erickson
benefit or leave a review. I'm so grateful for all of you and the good, hard work you're doing to make our world a better place. I can't wait to see you in the next episode.
- [29:51]
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