Jake Johnson

Summary

Where Everybody Knows Your Name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson (Sometimes)

Guest: Jake Johnson

Release Date: July 22, 2026
Host: Ted Danson
Summary by Segment with Timestamps, Quotes, and Key Insights

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Episode Overview

In this vibrant, heartfelt episode, Ted Danson welcomes actor, writer, and director Jake Johnson. They dive deep into acting philosophy, creative collaboration, ensemble work, personal vulnerabilities, and the joys and complexities of family and art. The conversation orbits the upcoming movie "The Dink"—starring Jake alongside Ted's wife, Mary Steenburgen—and also touches on Jake’s Apple TV series "Maximum Pleasure Guaranteed." Throughout, Ted and Jake compare notes on craft, career, and character, both onscreen and in life.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Impact of "Cheers" and Acting Influences

[03:06 – 06:11]

• Jake expresses how "Cheers" was foundational for him:

  "You are a North Star for me, so Cheers for me was everything... That show connected us all."
  — Jake Johnson (03:06)

• Ted and Jake agree on the importance of tonal consistency in comedy and the power of ensemble casts.

  "My whole family watched. Thursday night meant something. That was the first time I ever watched something where… I just want to be at that bar."
  — Jake Johnson (03:15)

• The way "Cheers" created a world so immersive that Jake didn’t distinguish between actors and characters.

2. Tonal Honesty and Ensemble Acting

[04:17 – 11:50]

• Both dislike projects where jokes feel external to character and situation. Ted:

  "That just irritates the shit out of me." (04:17)

• Jake underscores the difference between actors who push for laughs and those who ground comedy in reality, citing Ted as an example of the latter.

  "You don't sway... wherever you come in, it becomes a real person."
  — Jake Johnson (04:55)

• Jake’s approach to his "New Girl" character, Nick Miller, was inspired by Ted’s Sam Malone:

  "When I say the North Star, that's the kind of acting I love—where I get to go, I’m kind of watching a weird documentary about a bar, I think."
  — Jake Johnson (06:11)

• Ted admits he tries not to watch things he’s told are great, out of a fear of comparison (06:45).

3. Chemistry, Collaboration, and the Secret Sauce

[08:14 – 10:34]

• Discussion of on-screen chemistry:

  "Everybody thinks chemistry is just almost like luck... but certain people, whatever team they go to, wins."
  — Jake Johnson (08:39)

• Referencing John Belushi and Dan Aykroyd's idea of "the glue that connects two people."
• Jake says, "The chemistry game is a game I think you’re a master of. And that's my favorite game." (10:02)
• Ted's philosophy: a good joke can be distilled until it's not even a joke—and if it's still funny then, it's good writing (10:34).

4. Making Jokes Real and Acting Philosophy

[10:55 – 11:39]

• Ted and Jake agree: good acting means not delivering jokes, but living through moments.

  "I don't think people think in life that they're delivering jokes."
  — Jake Johnson (11:30)

• Ted:

  "If they are, they're real boring to be around." (11:36)

5. Sports, Ensemble, and the Right Level of Fame

[11:50 – 14:37]

• Both see acting ensembles as team sports, where the goal is collective success, not individual showboating.

  "Being on a team, when the team is gelling... when you start going and everybody’s cooking... the love, when it becomes really joyful."
  — Jake Johnson (13:16)

• Ted reflects he’s happy with his “level of fame”—any more would be too much, and less would be sad (12:47).

6. On-Set Games and Vulnerability

[14:37 – 18:43]

• Jake recounts playing a crew game assigning "Who's the Boss?" characters as production roles; it helped diffuse performance anxiety and built camaraderie.
• A memorable moment: Crew member gives Jake a "Danny" card (the least impactful character), making him laugh and break out of his slump.

  "He goes, 'I've just watched you for a while, and you're doing really bad stuff, man... Just a real Danny performance so far. You're here, but you're not even here.'"
  — Jake Johnson (17:37)

7. Authenticity, Kindness, and Competition

[19:01 – 25:47]

• Both value kindness and authenticity, but Jake points out:

  “Kindness is fine, but it doesn’t win championships. The talent wins championships.” (25:05)

• Jake praises Mary Steenburgen’s blend of kindness and fierce competitiveness.

  "What I like about Mary... is how talented she is. I want to push and press that she's a gnarly, nasty, mean person. So you can just watch her work and go like, naughty." (25:40)

8. Learning to Accept Flaws and Insincerity

[25:50 – 29:37]

• Ted shares being raised to be sensitive and kind, but admits he can be “mean as a junkyard dog.”
• Jake dislikes insincere compliments:

  "I tune off in a way that's too extreme... you hate insincerity." (26:55, 27:08)

9. Writing, Directing, and Learning Let Go

[31:39 – 42:09]

• Jake’s journey from writing plays as a struggling high schooler to college writer at University of Iowa, then NYU.

• Early lesson: seeing his play transformed by others, and being told by his mentor, "Learn to say thank you and leave." (37:20)

• Jake learned after writing/directing/self-starring in "Self Reliance" how much he missed the give-and-take of collaborating:

  "I missed collaborators so much. And it was one of those, like, oh, man, I'm so glad I got this lesson now."
  — Jake Johnson (41:12)

• Importance of a director’s vision: different directors shape the tone—and even the actors' outlook—across versions of a project (MULTIPLE, 42:09+).

10. About "The Dink" & Pickleball vs. Tennis

[42:09 – 50:03]

• The origin: co-writer Sean’s story about being bested in pickleball by older women (43:19).
• Film explores the real-life rivalry and culture clash between tennis and pickleball enthusiasts.

  "Tennis players fucking hate pickleball. There are city ordinances against pickleball. And it's a raging success all over the world."
  — Ted Danson (44:37)

• Mary’s love for pickleball carries into her character (46:12). Jake admits:

  "I haven't played pickleball since... I think it's great. I'm happy people enjoy it." (47:00)

• Movie’s sweetness comes from the real on-screen connection and underlying heart:

  "It really is sweet and has heart. And that, I think, is so important. If you're gonna make a funny movie, you better have heart."
  — Ted Danson (50:03)

11. Jake’s Other Projects

[52:34 – 54:11]

• Discuss "Maximum Pleasure Guaranteed" (Apple TV) and “The Sun Never Sets” (shot in Alaska with Joe Swanberg).
• Jake values working with director David Gordon Green and actor Tatiana Maslany.

12. Family Life and Artistic Balance

[54:00 – 58:11]

• Jake describes his wife Erin’s artist life and their family dynamic:

  "Who I am with her... If I'm on location within, like, 30 hours, I'm like, I like the other guy better. She's just, like, rooted."

• Both men reflect on how their relationships ground and improve them.

13. Ted’s Career Arc and Cheers Backstory

[56:15 – 64:11]

• Ted recounts his path: from understudy in New York to landing "Cheers," often feeling reactive not proactive in career moves.

  "I was the guy who went through life in the back of the pickup, facing backward... I never turned around and went, 'I’m going there. I want this.'"
  — Ted Danson (56:38)

• On auditioning for "Cheers":

  "A big reason why I got Cheers was 'cause I was paired with Shelly [Long] 100%." (60:44)

14. The Power of On-Screen Contrast, Not Just Compatibility

[61:11 – 63:09]

• Chemistry isn’t always social; sometimes magic happens with different or even clashing personalities.

  "It was almost sometimes hard for me to be in the same room with her... But when we were on stage, fucking magic."
  — Ted Danson on Shelley Long (61:26)

15. Dynamics of Family Loss and Change

[80:45 – 83:06]

• Jake shares about his two separate "losses" of his father—first in childhood, later after reconnecting as an adult:

  "When he died, everything released. And I was like, oh. I was like, I’m crying a little bit too hard for a man in his 40s. And I was like... now I’ve officially [grieved both losses]." (82:14)

• Jake learned people really can change late in life, citing his father’s sobriety and their relationship transformation.

16. Finale Reflections and the Art-Life Balance

[67:29 – 77:21]

• Emotional story of Coach’s passing on "Cheers"; the cast would tap the wall where actor Nicholas Colasanto wrote his lines:

  "We came down and it was like we all burst into tears. For the rest of the show, we would tap that as we entered."
  — Ted Danson (66:53)

• Both reflect on how show finales mirror life's impermanence and the passing connection of communities (69:21).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Acting Philosophy:

  "If they are [delivering jokes in life], they're real boring to be around."
  —Ted Danson (11:36)

• On Collaboration:

  "The real joy is when somebody wants you to score in a scene, and you can feel it, and you're like, oh, we have so much trust...that’s when the love becomes real joy."
  —Jake Johnson (13:16)

• On Individual Success vs. Team:

  "I couldn't be anywhere else...My level of fame is just the right amount for me. I could not handle more, could I? I’d be sad with less."
  —Ted Danson (12:47)

• On Grief and Growth:

  "I do fully believe people can change. You know, that thing of, like, you can't teach an old dog new tricks. Yeah, but we're not dogs. We can change."
  —Jake Johnson (83:19)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 03:06 — Jake’s early love of "Cheers" & acting inspiration
• 06:11 — Ted on not watching hyped shows; struggles with comparison
• 08:39 — The “glue” of on-screen chemistry
• 14:37 — The “Who’s the Boss?” crew card game, easing on-set nerves
• 26:55 — Jake’s aversion to insincerity in the industry
• 37:19 — Learning to thank collaborators, even when you hate the result
• 43:19 — The real-life pickleball inspiration for "The Dink"
• 54:11 — How Jake’s wife Erin, an artist, grounds his life
• 67:17 — Coach’s legacy and emotional rituals after his death on “Cheers”
• 80:45 — Processing the loss of his father, lessons from their relationship

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Tone and Style

The conversation is warm, candid, wandering, and often playfully self-deprecating. Both Ted and Jake celebrate creative partnerships, artistic authenticity, emotional vulnerability, and the lived-in messiness of real life. It’s a lively blend of reminiscing, mutual appreciation, inside baseball on acting, and gentle ribbing—as much about the whys of art and family as the hows.

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Summary

This episode is a masterclass in acting and humanity. Ted and Jake explore the undercurrents of ensemble work, the importance of being both kind and talented, and the challenges and joys of balancing art, ambition, family, and self-development. They reflect extensively on what makes creative and interpersonal chemistry work—from sitcoms to sports to marriage—and share stories tinged with vulnerability, humor, and generosity.

If you want to understand how actors think, how creative teams gel, and what actually matters in both work and life, this episode is a must-listen.

Transcript

[A]

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[A]

I'm not jealous of your relationship with my wife. Let me make that perfectly clear. Welcome back to where everybody knows your name. I love today's guest, actor and writer Jake Johnson. He is funny in a way that seems effortless. You know him from the new girl, Drunk History, the Mummy, and so much more. Right now you can watch Jake in the Apple TV series Maximum Pleasure guaranteed. He also stars alongside my wife Mary in the movie the Dink, which comes out this week on Apple tv. So let's get to it. Jake Johnson, who I respect so much, let me say, tell you how my morning started as I go out there. Well, not started, but as I'm leaving for work. This Mary, I say, do you have anything I should ask Jake? Because, you know, you guys did the Dink together and all of that. And she said, ted, he's very special. He's the most special person I've ever met. No one up. He said, one of. She said, one of the most special people I've ever met. And she meant it. So live up to that.

[B]

I love Mary.

[A]

Okay, Miss this special.

[B]

I'm gonna let you down now.

[A]

No, you're not.

[B]

I love Mary.

[A]

We met at a party. I think we met at the Dink.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Rap party.

[B]

I think that was us meeting you at first. I'd first seen you, we were at like a tennis court, whatever. You came to see me at the

[A]

end of the film shot. It was like, very chaotic.

[B]

Yes, well, the first one was a. Oh, I say this to you because I told you this in person, but you are a North Star for me, so cheers. For me, was everything. It was. It's.

[A]

You were. Yeah, it was kid, like, at that point. Right. I mean, you were.

[B]

I was born in 78, so that was kind of wheelhouse for me.

[A]

Yeah, it was.

[B]

My whole family watched Thursday night meant something. That show connected us all. That was the first time I ever watched something where before I understood what actors were, I was like, I just want to be at that bar. Before I knew, like, I wanted to be one of the characters. I wanted to be in Cheers. I wanted to know you. I wanted to know the group. And I was like, I loved hanging out. And I realized what television is, where it's a fantasy where you get to be like. You get to leave your world and be in another.

[A]

Yeah, it is. It really is. It is.

[B]

And you get. You're like, oh, I. I got to go to Cheers with you guys. And I was like, once a week, whatever was happening in my world faded, and I could just be like, oh, you guys. And I knew how you would all act. You guys were all so pitch perfect. So nobody ever took me out. There was never a joke that. I'm like, it's a good joke, but it doesn't exist here. Yeah, it was like, no, everybody was right.

[A]

We'll play back on that. That joke doesn't. Later on when we talk about acting and stuff, but. Because that is. That just irritates the shit out of me.

[B]

It kills me.

[A]

And I think I heard you talking to somebody, probably Dax, where if you come across a bad joke in a script that you're reading to see whether you want to do it, it's almost

[B]

like, I have to pass.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because you're going to now want me to do something that I fundamentally disagree with, and I don't want to fight with you, but this isn't right. Because the whole thing that I think the game is and what you do so well, and I'm not a guy who kisses a lot of ass, but I am going to kiss your ass a lot, Ted, because you mean a lot to me.

[A]

It's a good ass to kiss. I love it.

[B]

But tonally, you don't sway. So some comedic actors are really pushing, and you could feel them. You could feel the sweatiness of them, and I love them for it. Like a Chris Farley.

[A]

I'm like, I know you're working so

[B]

hard for me, and I love it so much. You. All of a sudden, wherever you come in, it becomes a real person. So I don't see you as Sam Malone. I see you as Ted Danson. But I also love Sam Malone, and I don't have that with a lot of actors where you're like the character you. And what I wanted to do with Nick Miller was when the character on New Girl is. I wanted people to view him the way I viewed Ted Dan. Sam Malone. And that is. Sam Malone was a relief pitcher from the Boston Red. So he's a real guy. And when a beautiful woman walks in, I know how Sam's going to react and I know how it's going to annoy everybody. And then I know he's going to, like, do a beer thing and push it there and it's gonna work and then he's gonna blow it. But I'm like, I just knew him as a real person. And that's the. When I say the North Star, that's the kind of acting that I love, where I get to go, I'm kind of watching a weird documentary about a bar, I think.

[A]

Okay, my turn.

[B]

Okay, sorry.

[A]

No, no, my turn. Then we'll get more real or something. But my entree to you as an actor. Forgive me. Cause I know you had a lot of stuff before this, but. Yeah. And it came about this way. Everyone was telling me, you should watch New Girl. It's amazing. And I don't remember what I was doing, but I was either struggling or I didn't want to watch anything that everyone was saying. So. Good. I did this to my friend John Krasinski in the office, too. I didn't watch it.

[B]

Oh, interesting.

[A]

Until much later. I didn't want to watch you. And it was you I didn't want to watch.

[B]

Is this true?

[A]

Yes, it's. Promise you. Promise you. And it was like, no, I can't. Because then I'll compare myself or fear of comparing. Whatever.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, that thing.

[A]

You're so. I hear how good you are, you know? Then I watched later. Let's play Cops.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

You fucking knocked me out of the. You know, you were so good. And I went back and watched New Girls, so I binged you about five years ago after watching let's Be Cops. Let's play Cops.

[B]

Let's be Cops. Yeah.

[A]

Be Cops.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You're my favorite kind of actor. Cause you are funny. Yes, Funny, absolutely. Make me laugh. You're dangerous because you could also rip my fucking head off, is what I feel from you when you act. And I told you this when we met, that you're my favorite kind of leading man. You really are. You're dangerous. And you're dangerous when you're not in a character being funny, because I know you could be funny at any second. So there's this tension.

[B]

He's holding it in.

[A]

Yeah. Anyway.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Compliment back. Yeah.

[B]

Amazing. Well, you know, in New Girl, and we talked. So Liz Meriwether, the creator that also loves Cheers and Zoe. Liz and I would talk all the time about the Sam and Diane and then the Sam and Rebecca.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And how the big magic trick of that show for me was how you did it twice.

[A]

Because the writers. I know. Unbelievable.

[B]

Well, yes, But I also. I mean, I know how the sausage is made, too, so I do know. Yes. You need great writers. And one thing I learned from directing a movie when I did my own writing and directing is I realized how much I love writing writers and directors.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Cause you're like.

[A]

Cause it's hard.

[B]

It's hard. And you guys are so good, and the good ones are so good that the magic trick that I give you credit for and that I honestly watch you for is that everybody thinks chemistry is just almost like luck. It's like a sports team where you're like, well, they just got the right group. And then you realize certain people, whatever team they go to, wins and has that chemistry. And you go, right. So there's something. So you could say you and Shelley Long just were magic. But then it was also the case with you and Christianity, because that was magic. And you go like, oh, there was something about the writing, the vibe, the set you that. It said, like, we can plug and play here. In a way that's fascinating. And that, to me, is the secret sauce where I go like, whatever. I heard this thing about John Belushi and Dan Aykroyd about. They would always say, like, what's the glue that connects two people? Like, what is that? When there's a great team? And I think there was something about what you do that I've always loved of, like, oh, he's half the glue. And I was like, whatever that magic trick is, I want in on that. You know, Gosling just did it. Cause Gosling has that in spades. But he just did it in the new movie project, Hail Mary, with a literal.

[A]

I haven't seen it yet, but I hear it's like, yeah, but he did

[B]

it with a literal rock where you're like, fucking guy's got chemistry with a rock, and it's genuine. He's talking to nothing. He's talking to a rock. And midway through the movie, I'm like, I believe they're very dear friends. And I'm in. And that, to me, is not the goal of some actors. Some actors, I'm like, their goal is just like, to really pop or to do this thing. The chemistry game is a game that I think you're a master of. And that's my favorite game.

[A]

Thanks. Me, too. I used to think that a really good joke is something that I written joke is something that I can approach and not water it down, but distill it like a homeopathic medicine so that it's almost not a joke anymore. And if you can do that to a joke and it's still funny, then it's good writing. It's good writing.

[B]

So Max Greenfield, a new girl, used to say to me in terms of that. Because whenever there's a perfectly written joke, for some reason I'm adding words to it, and they're the wrong words. And he would go like, you really can't deliver a joke. He's like, you just. He's like, you'll have a written, great joke. You'll find laughs around it. But he'll be like, just say the joke. And I'm like, I don't know why I'm butchering it. Other actors can go, I can't. I can't do that.

[A]

You're not butchering it. You're making it your own. And you're saying, this ain't a joke.

[B]

Right. Because I don't think people think in life that they're delivering jokes.

[A]

Yeah. And if they are, they're real boring

[B]

to be around or unthinkably funny, because there are certain people where you go, like, that's a joke. But that's the best joke I've ever heard. And you said that at a restaurant.

[A]

You know, ensemble, for me, is where it's at.

[B]

Same.

[A]

Because of basketball, I thought I could play and I couldn't. When I got to college, it was not even. I was so sad. And then I did a teeny part in a play by mistake kind of thing. And I heard laughter, and it's like, oh, same. Oh, wow. It's not basketball, but there's something here. Yeah, but basketball trained me to go. The team is the thing, which is the play is the thing. You know, it's not about you. It's about you supporting the team. Play the play. So I love that. I have often wondered that, you know, these are all the wrong words. It'll sound very lame. But I wonder why wasn't Tom Cruise, by choice or no, by the world, saying no? So that I'm very happy where I Am. Because I couldn't be anywhere else, you know, kind of feeling. But I really do feel like my level of fame is just the right amount for me. I could not handle more, could I? I'd be sad with less, but.

[B]

And I'm glad you said that, because that's the other part. I. I feel exactly the same. But one thing I want to say about sports, because that's exactly the same. So I grew up playing sports. I. It was. Everything was about the team. Nothing was ever about the individual numbers, and it didn't matter. Winning feels like something.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And being on a team, when the team is gelling, when you're on an ensemble and it's working, and all of a sudden the fifth lead, who's new, is crushing. It's like, oh, now we have a chance, because you're only as good as your weakest player on the bench. But when you start going and everybody's cooking, I don't have the thing of, this is my showcase. I've got to go. I view it more like a. When I read Salinger for the first time, and you're like, oh, all these characters keep coming back. So I don't view a career as like, this is my one movie. This is my showcase. And the whole end, this is a novel. I'm just on chapter 17. So all these different people who come in and on different ensembles, we're all building this whole novel together. And if you don't score and we're doing a thing together, then we lose. And when you're scoring, I'm scoring. And then the real joy is when somebody wants you to score in a scene, and you can feel it, and you're like, oh, we have so much trust that you are now setting me up, and you're putting me in my wheelhouse, and I'm kind of tired, and you're passing to me on a fast break, and you're like, thanks, man. And that's when, like, the love. And when it becomes really joyful.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Of. We're playing the same game, the crew's in it. Like, my favorite is, you know, and we had it on the dink. We made up this game with the crew where we were naming people from who they were. If the cast of who's the Boss? Represented a type of worker, it was ridiculous. But, you know, we laminated cards, and we would hand people what they were doing. And there was a day. So if you were Angela, you're the real boss. If you're Tony, you think you're the boss. But you're not the boss. You know, you're the nanny. You're not the boss. If you're Mona, you're sexy, you're adding heat to the day, but you're not really doing much. If you're Danny, who's the actor's name? You're doing so little on set, we don't even know your character's name. And if you're Eliza Milano, you know, you're great, you're gonna have a nice career, but you know, you're not ready yet. And everybody would get a card, right? And Soul Autumns would be for, like the ad. If there was a dance sequence where Mary and I dance in the dink and they're running everything, you go like, real Angela moment. You know, real Angela stuff. And those who are playing the game with us in the crew would go like, that means the world to me, right? Or you'd go like, pretty good stuff, man. A little bit mona right now, but let's get to Angela. Or if the AD goes like, everybody, let's go line up. But no one's listening. You go like, thanks, Tony. And the reason I say all that is we did that endlessly. And it was this one AC and I, this guy Andrew. We were having so many laughs privately. And then there was a day where I had a big monologue and I just imagined it in my head and I had done my homework. But when we got there, because of Light, the director, Josh Greenbaum, who's the greatest, the best, wanted to start really close.

[A]

Oh, and as opposed to you being able to work and do it from a master.

[B]

Yeah. And it's real baby stuff. I've been doing this long enough, I should be fine. But I like, you know, Aaron Chen was in the scene with me also.

[A]

Very funny man.

[B]

One of the funniest. I mean, it makes me laugh so hard. And I was like, well, we'll probably loosen up a little. And we were here and I totally got in my head and as I was saying the words, it was just an out of body experience. And if you practice them enough, the words come, but there's nothing to it. And I finished and I did a take or two. And Josh is being great. He's like, awesome and really good. We're getting there. Let's just go again. Yeah, we're getting it.

[A]

It's not a good.

[B]

No, he's giving me all the words saying, you're at a B minus. And this is the coverage I want, so really good. Let's just go Again? Yeah. Do you need anything? And I'm like, I don't think so, but I know I'm dying, you know, and it's a nightmare. And I'm like, I'm not feeling. I'm just not feeling it. And I'm thinking, worst case scenario, we go. We do this. Then we go to the wide, and then I ask him to come back. And the guy, Andrew, who I had created, walked up to me and gave me a Danny card.

[A]

Oh, nice.

[B]

And he. And Danny was you so bad, we don't even remember your character. And he goes like, I've just watched you for a while, and you're doing really bad stuff, man. And I started laughing in a way, and I was like. And he was like, look. He's like, it's fine. He's like, but, you know, just a real Danny performance so far. He's like, you're here, but you're not even here.

[A]

Mary never told me this stuff. She was brilliant.

[B]

And I started laughing in a way that it loosened me up. And then in the next take, as I was going, I was thinking of, as soon as this takes over, I'm gonna say. And I was like, it's a dandy. But midway through, I'm like, I'm becoming out. I'm becoming Alyssa Milano. And then all of a sudden, I'm like, I'm getting a little Mona. This is second half of this is sexy. And then I was like, I'm not an Angela. But at the end, I'm like, that was a Tony take. And you would hear like, that was a Tony, man. That was a Tony. I'm like, I'm pretending to be the boss, but I'm not. Before I knew it, I'm just in the groove of the day. All of that anxiety is gone. The fun of SED is back. And that is why the ensemble means so much. Cause you're like, right, we're all in this together. And when it's working, it becomes such joy.

[A]

And you can't do that kind of stuff unless everyone there is really good. And it gets the joke of life 100% right. And then you're free to do it

[B]

and not sensitive to each other. You have to be able to get the Danny card. And in that moment, go like, it hurts because it's true.

[A]

This is why Mary and I have been married happily, joyfully, for so long. When Mary mocks me, for good reason, it's funny. And if you can laugh at yourself, it's like, ah. Especially as you age.

[B]

Yes, you Know what Mary says about you? That I just told my wife, and she said she's gonna start doing. Cause we're currently looking for a new house and we're switching. It's a whole thing.

[A]

Looking for basement, I hear.

[B]

Yeah, I would love a basement. I mean, I'm from the Midwest, but we were talking about a house you guys had or something you were doing. And she goes, well, Zera excited. And then, you know, we spent Ted Danson's money. And she said, first and last name.

[A]

My wife goes, she did that? Yes. I've never heard it do that.

[B]

And I said, well, you know, we were spending Ted Danson's money on that one, and I died. I go, you refer to him first and last name? She goes, in this case, yes, I do.

[A]

I've never heard her do that. Or, yes, I love that. I love hearing new stuff. Yeah, I'm not jealous of your relationship with my wife. Let me make that perfectly clear.

[B]

Hey, what's going on over there? It's me, Trevor. Noah. You know me. You don't know me. Oh, you do. I was worried there for a second. Well, if you know anything about me, you'll know. I love having interesting conversations, conversations where we scratch beneath the surface, like what's really going on in the news? Or what is that celebrity really thinking about that scandal that they had? Or what's the worst way to be a parent? I mean, you want to find that out so you can be the best parent, right? Well, regardless of what it is, this podcast is all about figuring that out, talking to interesting people who have interesting ideas that give us an interesting perspective on the world that we're living in. So make sure you tune in. Check out what now with Trevor Noah, available now on the SiriusXM app. Some flavors can only be crafted by nature. One sunny day, a honeybee discovered a mysterious apple blossom and carried its pollen to a honeycrisp tree. Months later, something extraordinary was born. The Sugar Bee apple. With notes of honey, caramel and molasses, balanced by bright sweetness and an extra crisp crunch, Sugar Bee apples elevate everything from charcuterie boards and salads to baked treats and everyday snacking. Ready for some inspiration? Download our free recipe book and discover delicious ways to enjoy Sugar bee [e-mail]

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[A]

I like you hugely. Don't know you as well as I know my wife. Love her to bits. So it's suspect that I'm, you know, pushing the movie out as this, but it is wonderful. The movie's wonderful. And what's. One of the great things about it is you both have each other's back as actors. I watched you. It's like. And it's. How do we describe. It's a relationship movie, which could be an inappropriate relationship. And because of the writing of the story, it is brilliant. The way I went off on a tangent here, but it's like, you guys are really, really, really good together.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

And you can see people liking each other on film.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

You can see people acting like they like people on filming.

[B]

Yeah, totally.

[A]

But you guys really liked each other on film. Actively.

[B]

It was just cool. It was the thing you said when we just met out there about acting opposite somebody. When you're an attractive person, you can just look at them.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But what was the beauty of working with Mary is I've been a fan of her for so long, so it's like I've known Mary's work from stepbrothers to Parenthood. I'm like, I've just seen enough that were, like, those, like, big movies for me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then her reputation goes in front of her. But what I found about Mary when we were doing the Apple press, what I'm doing with the press with her is talking about how mean she is. Because my issue is with somebody like her who's truly a kind person. Like, she. Her tone ran that set. Sean, Josh and I all talked about it, but she just comes in, and even though she's got her own anxiety, she doesn't throw it on others. And everybody just gets when she was there and, like, the Mary vibe. Like, everybody's nice.

[A]

It's true.

[B]

Even, like, a grumpy grip. And I. When we walk by each other, he'd be like, hi. And I'd be like, hey. And I'm like, why are we doing this? Mary's not here. You have a neck tattoo, brother. All you and I have to do is do the head nod. But there is, like, a sweetness that comes. But what I realized in working with her is she's very good and she's very competitive and she cares a lot.

[A]

Very competitive.

[B]

Very competitive. Yeah. And competitive about the work in a way that going back to sports, I care. I'm very competitive.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I want our team to win.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I want the scene to be great. I want to finish a take, and I like to do scenes from beginning to end. I don't like pickups. I want the crew to feel like they watch the play. I want everybody there to experience what we're trying to do. Then in post, you can do what you want, but it's our job to do the thing so that the director's watching and goes like, yeah, pretty good. And what I liked about Mary is she's fierce with that and she's really good. But her niceness and her kindness is let out with. And I think niceness and kindness is

[A]

fine, but goes a long way.

[B]

But. Yeah, but it is. But it doesn't win championships. The talent wins championships. And I think something has gotten reversed where it's like everybody talks about now the no assholes on set thing, which I think that's great. I'm like, nobody wants an asshole on set. But we need talented, nice people. So it's not just nice people. And what I like about Mary, which was the great realization, is how talented she is. So I want to push and press that. She's a gnarly, nasty, mean person. So you can just watch her work and go like, naughty.

[A]

She's a naughty, filthy mouth,

[B]

all attitude. Mean.

[A]

Yeah, mean.

[B]

A bully.

[A]

You know, you have to be one to know one. I remember because my thing is, I was raised to be basically Christlike.

[B]

You were.

[A]

And that sounds like I'm making. Yes. Me really religious family. My mother went to church a lot. Yes. But it wasn't like a religious family. But I was raised to be sensitive and kind by my mother. There was no below the line. I didn't learn how to be a. And petty that I was. You know, but I could never be that. So even today, a knee jerk reaction is, you know, she'll say, you know, Jake's really an asshole. And I will say, well, you know, he's not really an asshole. You know, I always, always spin it and she gets so pissed at me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And. And one time she. I was being mean to her and she said, you are as mean as a junkyard dog. And at first I started to argue, and then it was like, I am. Oh, I am. It was such. It was such a relief to realize no, Ted You're a dick. You're like everybody else. Yes.

[B]

You know what my wife was just saying Yesterday we were talking and I realized. And I'm trying to figure out why I hate it so much, but empty words of gratitude or empty words of validation or, you know, anything like, you know, we went to a screening of this pilot and when people are all complimenting the thing, but it doesn't feel 100% sincere, I tune off in a way that's too extreme. And my wife goes, you hate insincerity. And she's like. To a point where it's like it's too much. But I think there's something because I was raised differently in that I was raised by a single mom and it was. There's no above line, below line. And if there was one, we're below line. So if you're going to think you're better than anybody, look at who you are. But it was also. But now get out there and do what you gotta do to win. And so there is the both things. And there was no time to kind of bullshit along the way. Cause it always felt like there was this big pressure and there wasn't a lot of time and it was nearly impossible to win. And so as I get older and I realize like that pace isn't reality.

[A]

I see. I admire that. Everything you just said, I know to be so. It's not my go to. I almost have to exhaust myself or be angry or full of hopelessness or I've had a big, huge cry over something to get so grounded that, yeah, I'm okay with everything. I am.

[B]

Yeah, totally.

[A]

And I want more of that. And I want more of that in my acting. I'm about to. Let's. Can we make this about me more than it already is? I'm about to go start acting for the first time in nine months.

[B]

Scary.

[A]

Scary. And it's not the same part that I was doing with Mike Shore, a man on the inside, which will come back. But I'm doing something brand new with new people, new people, terrifying new everything. And I don't know that I know how to be a good actor. And you know, I want my character to have said in the description, he has a massive scar down his forehead and an eye patch and he talks with a slur. Got it. I can act that. So I'm just terrified about this. But. But then I read something that you working on you today. You said something about. I realized that I want my character. I have to like enough of my character. You can do bad things and this and that. But I have to like my character enough that people would be. And if I don't, how can people want to spend an hour and a half with me if I'm totally unlikable

[B]

kind of thing, or at least, like. So one thing about me that is somewhat different than this era is I can like people that I totally disagree with, and I can like people that do bad things.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it is a product of my childhood. It is the product of being around people who I knew had done bad things, but they were really kind to me, and it was really fun doing jokes with them. And then I would hear a story and be like, that's a bad dude. That's a scary guy. But I do love them. And so when I'm playing a character, I don't think they need to be necessarily on the good team of life, and they don't have to be above board and always winning, But I need to know how. If me and that person were having a meal, where I would go, like, you're not a total monster. You're definitely in the gray. But, like, there are certain things that people could do that I could never forgive you for.

[A]

It also has to do that. You need to understand how they got there, how they there without judgment.

[B]

Exactly right. And there are certain offenses and certain crimes that, for me, I could never play because I can't get there. You know, I understand hurt people hurt people, but you're hurting too many people. So now I don't want to. I get it. Some actors want. I can't spiritually go there. I don't want it. But if I can go, you did steal that, and that is true. And you did do that. And this is. I don't know. And then I go. But if I listen to your whole arc and your childhood and you're this and you're that, I get you. And if it's between you and me and we're having a drink in my own heart, I go, like, I have love for you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And if I can do that, then I can find my way into something.

[A]

That's what's so up about today.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, it's just so divided, but it's an artificial division that comes here, not here.

[B]

Agreed.

[A]

I know where I want to go next with you is playwright. I don't even know all the movies that you've written and then directed or produced and created and all of that, but I saw the origins of that was you wrote a play at the University of Iowa that got you into Tisch.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

School for the Arts in New York.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How the fuck did you know you could write a play? What made you say, oh, I. This is something. Was there a lead up to that, or is this out of nowhere?

[B]

So when I was 15, I dropped out of high school for a year, right? I was getting really. I mean, it's dyslexia, but back then, we didn't have a name for it. We didn't know what it was, but it was. I was just doing really badly. And during that time, it was October of my sophomore year, I was just home, and my Uncle Eddie was having legal troubles. He was living with us. So there was a lot going on. And my mom having fear that I was going to, you know, not fulfill a destiny that I probably at least go back to high school. Pal.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Started saying, like, you need to do certain things. And one of the things she had said I had to do was I had to write. And so we had an old computer, and I could write anything I wanted. So I basically just wrote bridge.

[A]

While you're not in school and working with your uncles, you had to do this.

[B]

I had to do homework. So I wrote. Basically copied the book Bridge to Terabithia, but with, like, me and my brother. And I'd be, like, hysterically crying. And then I'd be like, that, my brother Danny has cancer. And it was terrible, right? But I, like, wrote a book that was probably 40 pages, had a beginning,

[A]

middle, and an end.

[B]

Beginning, middle, and end. Couldn't believe I wrote that much. And then realized what I really liked was the dialogue. Cause it was easier. And then for the next thing she said, you got to write something again. I then wrote a play, and I

[A]

was like, do you remember?

[B]

It was about. I was obsessed. I've always been obsessed with my brother. So it was about, like, two brothers.

[A]

Older brother.

[B]

Older brother. Talked to him the whole ride here,

[A]

just for my brain. Is he alive and well?

[B]

Alive and well, yeah, the best. But wrote a play, really liked it. And then my friends and I were all, who I'm still close with, we were all entering the world of the arts, but at 15 and what that meant. And my buddy Bill had read, like, the Beatniks, and he was into that. And I was always into tv. And I would always talk about, you know, Cheers or Roseanne or the Wonder Years, right? And my buddy Oliver was into music. And then I brought the plays in, and they felt like little teleplays. And then we started doing more acting together. Then that became my first, like, comedy troupe. And I've been essentially doing comedy troupes since then. And now I view each ensemble as a new comedy troupe. So, like Mary and Aaron and I, when we were just doing that movie and doing press, I was like, oh, yeah, this comedy troupe. Yeah, we're like the dink team. And then when we all do press, that's the end of that troupe.

[A]

Was it that play that you wrote that you sent to Neil?

[B]

No. So then I went to the University of Iowa, and at Iowa, I went to be a writer.

[A]

Oh.

[B]

And I wanted to write fiction. And University of Iowa has a great writing program for the graduates. And a bunch of novelists and short story writers were there, and they have all these, like, cool little literary bars. And Iowa City is a pretty cool scene. And I went there and I really wanted to do that. And then there was essentially, like, a sketch night. And so we would write little sketches that were, you know, five minute plays.

[A]

You and your buddy.

[B]

Buddy Bill.

[A]

Yeah, okay.

[B]

The beatnik Bill. And we would do them there, and we were getting a lot of attention. And then one of my plays.

[A]

So you wrote, produced and acted?

[B]

Yes, I started acting in them, too.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then one of those plays got into. I can't remember what it's called now, the Kennedy Center. There was some arena or. No, they gave some award where they published a bunch of plays. And my thing got published in, like, a book.

[A]

Whoa.

[B]

Yeah. And I was like, whoa, man. And then I wrote another one and submitted that to nyu, got in, and then I had a play put on by the ensemble. Ensemble? Studio theater.

[A]

Yeah. Yes.

[B]

And it was about my sister and my cousin and kids putting on masks. And when they put the masks on, they become who they're going to be as older people, but they're just kids. And my cousin became a junkie, and we had a really hard road, but my sister didn't. So when they put the masks on, my sister's like, it's fun. My cousin's character's like, these are not fun masks. And I put it on. I viewed it as a pretty serious little play, took myself very seriously. I was probably wearing a scarf. And the director cast it and I wasn't part of it. And when I went and saw the show with my then girlfriend, who's now Annie Baker, the famous director, playwright, we were dating back in the day. We were watching it together. When it started, I leaned over to her because it was a series of one acts. And I go like, this one sucks. And she gave me A look that I won't forget. Whereas that kind of sad look. And I was like, I know I'm not being nice, but this one sucks. And when she gave me that look, I stopped. And then I listened. And it was my play, but they had changed it so much in performance and music. And it was these adult women talking in baby voices. And I got like, emotional. And I did like, the little Max. Yeah. And sad. And he said I wanted them to pull my play. And the head of NYU's dramatic writing, Mark Dickerman, was like, I need you to grow up right now and say thank you and leave and just say thank you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I was like, yeah, you did. But it was hard, man.

[A]

It's hard.

[B]

And I hated it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I was like, I can't say thank you. They killed it. And he's like, these are professionals, and they're doing something that's really special. And you might not like it, but the audience did. So learn to say thank you and leave and you don't have to come back. And I was like. And I was like, I'll never not be. Have more control. And that became, if I'm gonna write something, I'm writing it for my friends and we're gonna act in it. And then that took us to like UCB in those places. Cause they would put our own stuff on. So we're like, then call it sketch comedy.

[A]

I did an Annie Baker one act. Oh, you did not one act. It was the 24 Hour Plays.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

For the Atlantic Theater.

[B]

Oh, no way.

[A]

Anyway.

[B]

And was she there?

[A]

Yeah, she had to be. Because they. The bit, you know, the bit, you know, you show up actors and writers and directors show up fun.

[B]

And do it all in 25.

[A]

The night before the actors show.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

A prop that they, you know, that they brought and maybe a talent. And then the actors go home and the writers stay and write all night. And then the directors come in short diversion. Mary's daughter was there too. And she. For her costume prop thing. She and my daughter, their stepsisters, had the Halloween before taken a bodysuit, a really good bodysuit. And then my daughter's a really good artist and made an anatomically correct vivid bodysuit. And then they were flashers. Right. For Halloween. But she brought that. And she said after she. She said this just by the way, as she's leaving to the writers and directors. This happens to be my mother's nightmare. And winked at the writers. And one writer just put her in this. And she had to enter buck naked. And it was such wonderful dialogue anyway. Wow. So that's how you. Because I heard you talk to somebody about yourself, about the fact of relinquishing that energy, of having it to having to be in control and everything. And then you went off and just acted recently. Just been acting or something, and how wonderful that was just to show up and mind your own business. Business, as it were.

[B]

That's a new lesson for me. So I was always somebody who.

[A]

But don't you have to be sorry. Yeah, please, you go, don't you have to be the way you're about to describe when you're writing and directing it?

[B]

You do. You have to be. When you're writing and directing, you've gotta be in control. But most of my career has just been hired as an actor in control. Being a little bit too much like, how we shooting this. Yeah. And then another actor's doing something in me think, like, they're not helping them be like, you know what we could do. And you're like, I'm trying to build that team. But at times you're like, it's overstepping.

[A]

Kristen Bell. I'm not saying she oversteps, but her brain is that way.

[B]

Yes. I know Kristen Bell, where it's non stop, non stop.

[A]

And she's right.

[B]

Yeah. But it's non. It's a lot. And I'm not saying that about her. I'm saying that about me. Where you're like, you just can't stop. And so I always said in my fantasy, the dream will be if I can have my own TV show where I'm co showrunning, I'm directing every other. It's my group and we're just doing it. And then when I did Self Reliance, which was the movie that I wrote, I directed and I starred in, I missed collaborators so much. And it was one of those like, oh, man, I'm so glad I got this lesson now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I would be there and I would do a take and the other actors would look at me and I'd be like, you guys are great. Like, it's. The offense is working.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I'd be like, but shouldn't there not be a coach in the timeout?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That goes like, here's what I'm seeing for you. And then shouldn't there be a writer who goes, I think this is working. What do you guys think of this? And go like, oh, you're so talented. That's so smart. So like Dink as an example, Josh would just come up after takes where I'd be like, oh, it's feeling really good. And he'd go, really fun. Let's try something tonally, totally different. Go a little bit more aggressive. Marry. Go a little bit. And you'd be like, oh, this isn't how I would see it. And then when you do it, it would open up something new. Or Sean would come in and go, like, what do you think of that joke? To start it? And I'd be like, oh, you're a professional joke writer. That's so funny, man. And then in doing that, if you don't tell the other actor and you're in a two shot, their response is so funny.

[A]

Tell me the origin of the dink.

[B]

I had lunch with Sean. I always pronounce his last name wrong, and he gets mad at me, but it's like Roger Clemens with a T. So Clemens.

[A]

Clemens.

[B]

But I guess I call him Clemence, but it's Clemens. And he's my real friend. I did Daxes and he got mad at me. Sean, yes. He and I got lunch and it was right before the presidential elections, and we were just talking, and he goes like, what are you doing next? What are you working on? We were doing that part of our lunch talk. And I said, I'm looking. I think our country's gonna get really wild, and I don't wanna be part of it. I wanna make something that's really fun with big, like, set pieces. That's nice and it's fun and it's funny. And I go, but really good jokes. And I was like, a really funny story, but I just want a good hour and a half. And I was like, I miss a set piece and I missed it about television where the situation's funny, where you're like, you can't lose in this situation because you're putting two characters just in a funny spot. And he goes, what do you think about pickleball? And I said, nothing. I never played. Couldn't care less about it. Didn't find it to be that interesting of a game. And he goes, what about tennis? And I go, nothing. And he goes, then I got the movie for you. And he pitched it to me because he's the real dusty character. He's an old tennis player. He's very good. His back hurts. Sean. Oh, he went to a pickleball court in Beverly Hills where there was three older women, and they asked if he wanted to play. And he thought, like, I don't want to hurt anybody. He's like, I'm probably looking for more people My age males where I could really. And they were like, oh, you don't won't play with us. And he was like, okay. And they smoked him and talked trash the whole time. And he got so competitive that he would say, we started playing all the time. And he's like, they were mean about it. And then we would go out for coffee after and we would, like, talk about our lives. And he's like, I can't believe I'm becoming friends with them. And so when he told me that that's the story. Yeah. I was like, that is so funny. But then he and I were talking about the Dusty Candace story that Mary and I do. And, you know, without giving stuff away, it's building towards something other than. And he pitched me the post honky tonk scene. And when he pitched me that. And I don't want to give anything away, but when he pitched me that, I was like, I want to do this movie.

[A]

Yeah. This movie is incredibly funny. It has huge set pieces. It has a truth out there in the world. Tennis players fucking hate pickleball. There are city ordinances against pickleball, and it's a raging success all over the world.

[B]

Yeah. It's crazy.

[A]

All over the world. Pickleball is huge.

[B]

But when you get into both. Because I took, you know, Brad Gilbert, the tennis pro, talker. Tennis. So you were there, too? Yes. So I got to play a lot of tennis and pickleball and learn from these greats. And what I also learned, I mean,

[A]

Brad coached some of the biggest names.

[B]

Andy Roddick, Andre Agassi. And what I learned from learning to play tennis from him and then also learning to play pickleball is. I get why tennis players are annoyed.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

Like, tennis is a really hard entry point in.

[A]

Yes. It's like learning to really enjoy the game. You have to become pretty darn good.

[B]

It's like horse riding. Like, if you want to gallop on a horse, which is a unthinkably fun thing to do.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You don't get there. Day three.

[A]

No.

[B]

You've got to, like, spend three days walking around horses.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Pickleball. Day three, you can be galloping.

[A]

Yes. Day four, you're in the emergency room.

[B]

Yeah. By the way, it hurts.

[A]

You're 70 and you thought you.

[B]

My back was killing me. For pickleball. It's all this, like, dinking. I don't have the body part, but I did understand the argument. And then what's so great is Mary in real life loves pickleball.

[A]

She found pickleball before the movie.

[B]

I know.

[A]

This is. My wife, by the way, manifests. She can manifest things. She thinks about something and boom, shows up in the world. It's amazing.

[B]

So good.

[A]

She was a fanatic. And she still is.

[B]

Yes. But she also. What made it so nice is, as I said, like, I have to. I try to always be sincere. So it's just. And unfortunately, it comes across as negative sometimes. And I wear people out a little bit too much, but I can't even on this press tour when they'll be like, tell us what you love about pickleball.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'm like, well, I love the movie. I haven't played pickleball since, you know, I was like, it's a fun game. But, like, yeah, I don't have a lot. I think it's great. I'm happy people enjoy it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Mary gets so mad at me.

[A]

Yeah. Which is perfect.

[B]

Which is also. And it's so real and so funny. But she truthfully gets. And she thinks I'm doing it because I'm trying to be so cool.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'm like, I'm not trying to be so cool. She'll go, like, just. Just say you like it, and it's joyful. And I'm like, that would be lying. Like, hey, don't dislike it.

[A]

Which is so perfect for the show.

[B]

I know, but. And on set. Set. If anybody, a crew member would go, like, you working on that backhand? I'd be like, no, I'm not playing. She'll be like, oh, Jake is to be so cool for the crew. He loves the game. It's full of joy. Like, she will not deal with anybody talking trash about pickleball. She loves it. And her sales pitch is, what's good about pickleball, where you're like. And that's also the character thing. So we kind of had that magic thing that you're like, this seat in the car when she's telling Dusty why she should do it. It's not false. So whenever movies can, parts can become real.

[A]

That's what I love.

[B]

I love that stuff.

[A]

There's the truth of the competition between tennis and pickleball. That's real, by the way. Pickleball players because of Mary and Mary's son, Charlie. Do you know Charlie?

[B]

I know he's great.

[A]

Supposedly, he's like a notch or two below going pro. He's winning tournaments in Europe.

[B]

Incredible. And you guys are hosting pickleballers at your place. Yes. The whole thing.

[A]

The whole thing. No, it's insane. But they're excited the pickleball community is very excited.

[B]

Well, it honors pickleball in a really nice way. But what it also does, which. So what I didn't want to be in is in a movie that I didn't want to be in. Something that's just like, this is the new world. And so, like. And we're just saying it's great. Like, there's a few moments that are very Sean. And that is like when they're doing pickleball at the end, there's a moment, and when I first learned the game, I would be like, okay, so that's really cool. And then there's a moment where the two characters, me and Roddick, are dinking. And Ed Harris goes, okay, what happens now? And then somebody goes, this is it. They just do this a while until somebody screws up. And he goes, like, what? And you're like, there are elements to

[A]

the game, tons to make, where you

[B]

go, like, yeah, I mean, I get it. It's really fun. That's goofy. And then Andy Roddick has a great line in the movie where we're playing, and he hits one and then he, you know, he gets a great point and he goes, oh, I get it now. It's like tennis, but easier because you can pick up pickleball pretty fast. If you play tennis and figure it out, you can't do the reverse. So it is an easier version, 100%. But pickleballers, they are right. Cause there's. There's definitely levels to the game. So people who say, like, it's so easy. I've played against a couple of pros. It's not easy. No, they are excellent. They can place the ball perfectly. They'll kill you. They hit it so fast.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So you're like, everything you guys are saying is true and everything they're saying is true.

[A]

I want to throw in one more thing because it is great sports. It's a great this, great that. Da, da, da. But the sweetness of your relationship and Mary's. I won't go into ruining it and all of that, but it really is sweet and has heart. And that, I think is so important. If you're gonna make a funny movie, you better have heart.

[B]

Yeah. I think it gets missed a lot that Josh Greenbaum, our director, is a king of. He just brings emotion to things in a way that we had. Jake Szymanski was originally attached to direct, and Sean, Jake and I had been developing it for a while, and that version was way further. More jokes, more one liners, and then he Fell off to do jury duty too. So then when we brought Josh in, you could almost. Which was a really interesting experiment because they're both dear friends of mine, and I respect the hell out of both of them. You'll be like, how a director changes so much by their actual being just naturally who Jake was. Sean and I, even in our pitching would be like. Sean would be like, you know, it'd be funny, and that'd be another joke we could do. And then as soon as Josh came in, Sean would be like, you know, it'd be sweet. And I'd be like, another nice moment we could do. But we still think we're in charge. But you're like, oh, we're just. Now the movie's changing. Hey, folks, it's Joel Kim Booster here. And as you may know, we have

[A]

been away for a few weeks now under construction. No longer are we just covering bad dates.

[B]

We are now Intimacy coordinates coordinator. You guys will not want to miss it. We cover such things as bi erasure, finding your perfect type, and has sex positivity gone too far? No matter what it is, you can expect the same amount of comedic chaos. This new iteration of the pod is going to be amazing. And I cannot wait to introduce Intimacy coordinator to all of you. Some flavors can only be crafted by nature. One sunny day, a honeybee discovered a mysterious apple blossom and carried its pollen to a honeycrisp tree. Months later, something extraordinary was born. The Sugar Bee apple. With notes of honey, caramel and molasses, balanced by bright sweetness and an extra crisp crunch, Sugar Bee apples elevate everything from charcuterie boards and salads to baked treats and everyday snacking. Ready for some inspiration? Download our free recipe book and discover delicious ways to enjoy Sugar Bee apples@hellosugar bee.com.

[A]

from bee to you. What is this other one? You went to Alaska? The other film, what's it called?

[B]

The Sun Never Sets.

[A]

No, sorry.

[B]

Maximum pledger. It's okay. Sun Never Sets was a movie I did in Alaska with Joe Swanberg, a collaborator who I've worked with on four movies now. Love him. Excellent. One of my favorite people I've ever worked with. I did that with Dakota Fanning.

[A]

Just as an actor.

[B]

Yes, well, he and I originally started writing it together. Cause we mostly write and produce them together. But it became so inherently his that I was like, this is just yours. And what I'm doing is actually just producing. And it was post self reliance, seeing the difference and being like, this really is your story. So I don't need to be at a festival with you and say, like, writers Jake and Joe, because it's. You love the movie, but the TV show is Maximum Pleasure Guaranteed. And that's coming out May 20th on Apple.

[A]

You are Mr. Apple all of a sudden.

[B]

I'm in a couple Apple projects.

[A]

It looked really good.

[B]

Yeah, it was. You know, David Gordon Green was directing the pilot, and I'd always wanted to work with him. You know, there's, like, certain directors that you're like, well, that'd be fun. And then the script of it, David Rosen is so good. And with Tatiana Maslany, who's so talented. Jesse Hodges, that's who. Those are the two I get to play with. And I was like, man, I.

[A]

That's cool.

[B]

It's cool. It's fun.

[A]

Okay. A family.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Aaron. Aaron is your wife who's a fine artist.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Not fine, good. But paint good.

[B]

Yeah. A good fine artist. A talented fine artist.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. What is that? What is none of our business. But. Or my business. But what is her day? Like? Can she go paint every day?

[B]

Yeah, we have a.

[A]

Your kids are how old?

[B]

My kids are 12, so they're in school from 8 until 3. And now with activities. So she can. She does the work. We've got a studio in the backyard. She's.

[A]

So. She's an artist.

[B]

She's an artist. Yeah.

[A]

She goes to work every day.

[B]

She goes to work. Yeah.

[A]

That is so cool. Much respect for that.

[B]

Yeah, it's. I feel we've been together now since 202003 or something like 2004. And I feel very lucky because I do know. I don't know if you have this, but I know who I am without her, and then who I am with her. I just assume that's who I am. But I also know, like, if I'm on location within, like, 30 hours, I'm like, I like the other guy better.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I was like, I don't know what happened, and it's happening so fast, but, like, I'm just getting too up and down. And I was like, she's just, like, rooted. And so I'm like, oh, I've had that so long that I think it's me. And then every once in a while, I remember, like, oh, right, that's you.

[A]

I barely knew myself.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I took a post grad grow up class fast. Took about a year.

[B]

At what point was this.

[A]

This was when I was. This is the tale. Last year of Cheers. I started.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And I wanted to stop being a liar. I wanted to be emotionally Mature. I wanted to change massively, and I went for it.

[B]

How'd you do that?

[A]

I drove down to Long beach to my mentor, who was a therapist, but Iranian fellow who was just absolutely fucking amazing. So I got a whole different kind of therapy, spirituality kind of thing.

[B]

Do you mind if. Let me. Could you mind if I ask this? So you went to college for basketball or wanted to play, and then got into a play and then started acting.

[A]

Transferred to Carnegie Mellon. When they said, ooh, you're serious, Go there. Loved it. Yes, loved it. Got married at 21 or 2.

[B]

You were a kid.

[A]

I was a kid. The emotional truth would have been, if I had been. I was the guy who went through life in the back of the pickup, facing backwards, going, oh, right, I'll be down. Look at that. I never turned around and went, I'm going there. I want this. I'm going to.

[B]

Things were just happening.

[A]

Things happened and I had some good angels and I. Okay, you know, that's working. Yeah.

[B]

And then. So what was the journey into? How do you get to that? To Cheers and how quickly did you know Cheers was cheers. So you're 21, you're married, you're a Carnegie. Then you start doing the New York stuff.

[A]

Go to New York and you're doing plays. I do a play. I do off off Broadway play called the Real Inspector Hound. And after Magrit. Tom Stoppard, playwright. Very, very, very funny material. And I was understudied, but went in because it had been on for years. Everyone wanted. All the main actors wanted time off, so I was on every night.

[B]

Okay, so you're getting great. And how were you feeling? You were doing.

[A]

Thrilled.

[B]

You're like, I'm kind of.

[A]

No, no, no. I was also taking an acting class.

[B]

Okay, so you were still in your, like, growing stage while getting great experience until.

[A]

Until shortly. Around Cheers years. So, you know, seven or eight years. I didn't care if I was in acting class or being paid to act. I did not care. I was walked away by the whole thing. I just wanted to act.

[B]

That's cool.

[A]

It was the light bulb. It was the reason.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know, thank God, because I couldn't have done anything else. Terrible student. Anyway, then I came to la. I got into a couple of movies and did you know every guest star, everything you were doing? Everything, Everything. Commercials. And I would be in the background of a commercial and be thrilled.

[B]

Same with me.

[A]

I just wanted to be on camera

[B]

seeing how it all worked.

[A]

Yes, yes. I didn't then take that to mean, oh, I could become a director sometimes.

[B]

But also just being there, like for me, watching the boom guy, I was like, cool.

[A]

I drive through studio gates today and

[B]

I'm like, yeah, same.

[A]

I turn right on Jimmy Stewart Avenue crossover. Great Tax Street.

[B]

That's exciting. Yeah, but so then you're doing the grind.

[A]

Cheer. Doing the grind. Then I get called in to do a taxi.

[B]

Oh, fright.

[A]

Somebody fell out. Somebody fell out. And I called.

[B]

That was a dream show.

[A]

It was Cheers like, too. It was very. Except they'd been around for a while. So there were personalities, but they were all brilliant. And I knew Danny DeVito a little bit from a play in New York, and he took me under his wing. And Danny was so irreverent. He'd take me to lunch to Lucy's. This is at Paramount across the street, you know, and there'd be Michael Eisner or whoever was the head of it. Hey, fuck you. He was just so irreverent. He was that taxi car.

[B]

That is so cool.

[A]

And then I got a call. While I was shooting that or doing that or rehearsing that, the Charles brothers and Jimmy Burrows were putting together Cheers. And they had an office on the lot. And I came down and met them twice in that week. Second time they said, don't take anything. And without checking with us, is that meeting.

[B]

Are you reading things or just talking?

[A]

Both.

[B]

Reading. So they're like, read this out.

[A]

Yeah, but kind of in the room, you know, read very casual. Don't take anything. And I went, does that mean I have this? And he went, no, no, no, no, you don't have it. You know. And I went out to sit back. There are two doors. One went that way and the other one. I saw this line of actors coming up the stairway. It was like. And I just didn't give up. And I just. And part of the audition was you got paired. Towards the end, you got paired.

[B]

Of course, the chemistry reads.

[A]

Yeah. And Shelly and I kept being paired over and over again. And I do think a big reason why I got Cheers was cause I was paired with Shelly 100%. Cause she was like a. She was a full blown character out of the. Oh, she was.

[B]

So what was that first? Cause I had that with Zoe too. We got paired and Max and I got paired in Chemistry Reads where it was all the difference. When you first read where Shelley.

[A]

I thought she would be the worst choice for this part.

[B]

How come?

[A]

Because I'm an idiot. Seriously. I almost always.

[B]

She's not it.

[A]

No, she's not it. And we're so different.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Our styles of acting, our styles of being were so different that it was almost sometimes hard for me to be in the same room with her.

[B]

Because you guys, it just wasn't a natural social.

[A]

We cared for each other a lot, but when we were on stage.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Fucking magic.

[B]

So this goes.

[A]

She'd hit you. Yeah. I mean. Sorry. You notice how it's a contact sport.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Right. You smack the actor and the other actor smacks you. And if they don't, you're like, oh, fuck.

[B]

Agreed.

[A]

You know, so. Man, she would knock your block off.

[B]

So this goes back to the thing I was saying before about the no assholes on set and the niceness in that. I think there's. Sometimes it's really, really nice. Sometimes I've been building where I'm like, I only want to be with people I like. Really enjoyable.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Sometimes it's really magic when you have a lot of respect for somebody.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But you're like, we see life differently.

[A]

Yeah. She was not an asshole.

[B]

No.

[A]

But she was not a bad. I'm just saying. No, I know. But she was so different from me and that.

[B]

You just. You don't even know. I had that in Minx with Ophelia, who I loved. She's an English actress we played. She plays, like, a really, like, type a woman who is. And my character's a pornographer. And everything for me was about, like, extra stuff. I had, like, a cigar and jewelry and wardrobe. Beth. And she hates. She would literally, at one point, she goes, jesus, Jake, do you have to have so much stuff? And it was right before, and I loved her. Like, we would hang out after, but I had this moment right before. I was like, I do. And they're like, quiet on set. And I could feel in life her being like, just say the words. And I was like, oh, this scene is so heavy. And the eye contact as us was so like. And I'm thinking, like, yeah, I'm doing extra. You're right. I'm moving my head a lot and I can't stop. You know, there's a lot going.

[A]

You were so good in that. I watched the whole thing and then I forgot about it. And I watched a clip today. You are so good in it. Thanks, man. That's a great part.

[B]

It's a great show.

[A]

But she was there, and no joke. There were no jokes there, but she

[B]

was that where I'm like, oh, everything is different.

[A]

Was that True Story? I can't remember.

[B]

No, but it's based off Playgirl. Yeah, but so then you read with

[A]

Shelly, and then we got it.

[B]

You got it. And then that pilot was. So did you know when you were doing that pilot, you were.

[A]

Once again, I got to act. That was all that was in our brain, in success. Like, the second or third year, we were loved by critics. So that was clear.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

We were dead last in the ratings. One week. We were dead last.

[B]

Insane.

[A]

But we kept going. And that's. As soon as you have success with money attached to it, then you all of a sudden. The word career.

[B]

Yes, agreed. Well, meetings happen.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Strategy.

[A]

Talk strategy.

[B]

You go, like, don't have one, and

[A]

this could be lost.

[B]

Yes, agreed. And I don't want to lose this now. I like it.

[A]

No.

[B]

Can I ask a question? If it gets too sad, blow it off. But I thought Coach was so special

[A]

in that he was. He was the heart.

[B]

Oh, he was. That's what I thought. And I didn't know who Sam was without him because Sam is an alcoholic. Coach Needham, even though Coach was always so goofy and, you know, saying the wrong things, you were like, sam's lost without him. And the only reason this bar works is because he brought his coach with him.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

So what I do with actors, like, when I act like I don't know who I'm playing until I play opposite somebody else, I can have, like, stupid little journals of, like, Jerry, you know, came from. I'm not talented enough on my little, like, actors notebook to figure out anything until I'm in a scene with a scene partner.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And you go like, oh, that's who you are. Oh, so then I'm automatically this.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so how does that happen, that the show continues with that after his passing? Then Woody Harrelson comes in, creates a whole different thing that turns out to be great. But that loss, yeah, it was huge.

[A]

Huge.

[B]

Do you mind?

[A]

We all wondered. I mean, he came in with a heart disease and didn't tell anybody. And he, bless his heart, was not getting enough oxygen to his brain. To the point towards the end where there wasn't a surface that didn't have his lines written on him, you know, everywhere. And he wrote, you know. You know how you come through a stage to say hi to the audience or something? And so the backside of the set is just wood boards, two by fours. You know, it's the opposite of a set. It's just the carpentry. And he wrote his entry lines a lot of the time as he'd come through the door so he could check it and I'll cut to the story part and then go back a little bit. But when he passed away, it was just like, oh, wow. And it was the end of the season, and we celebrated and all of that, his life and all that, but it was still pretty raw. And we came back the first episode back. We are at the top of the stairs on the outside of the set, and you can see through the window. And we come down to say, one by one, we're introduced, and we say hello to the audience. And the first person who was about to go through the door went, oh, my God. There was a line that he had written for himself towards the end, and the story was, he had just lost his friend. His friend had died. The coach's friend had died. And he wrote, it's almost like he's still with us now. And we came down and it was like we all burst into tears. And we. For the rest of the show, we would tap that as we entered, we tapped this thing. And then some poor carpenter decided to paint the sets and painted it out.

[B]

I did. What?

[A]

Why is everyone mad at me?

[B]

I painted it right, like I was told to do.

[A]

We're both very lucky that we got to be in ensembles that were special and meant, that were special and fun, funny and well done.

[B]

The other thing I want to say about Cheers, because I'd be remiss if I didn't, is I think it's the best finale I've ever seen.

[A]

Yeah, it was.

[B]

It was. I thought the way I loved the sequence when Sam gets mad at everybody.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And he says the thing that you've been thinking the entire series, that you're like, I didn't want to think of these people this way. But he's right. Like, go home. Yeah, you have a wife, man. Like, get out of here. Like, Carla. Go be with your kids. What are you doing?

[A]

I thought I forgot that, to be honest.

[B]

He kills everybody and gives, like, such harsh truths. And then he's like, and I'm going, too.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you kind of feel like, yeah, this is just a stupid old bar. This isn't your home. And then he leaves. And I remember watching it being like. And then it fails, you know, as it has to in a TV show. And he comes back and he's trying to get champagne, and everybody gives them the line of, like, I would. And he's like, normie, how about a free beer? And he's like, yeah, I gotta go see Vera, or whatever. And you're like, all right. And everybody leaves. And then they come back and they Go like, you think that's gonna hurt our feelings? And the reason I love it is if that doesn't hurt your feelings, nothing will. He eviscerated you. He told you your exact human flaw. And everyone's like, we're fine. Let's have a drink. And then at the end, the I'm sorry, we're closed. And that kind of sad music starts. You just go like, oh, right. These TV shows don't last forever. They're just things. And it's like you can watch them on reruns and people can find them, but you're like, oh, it just had that. Perfect for me. It's. It's why I think TV is my. It's my favorite art form of it.

[A]

The one loss of stream with streaming is that you're not a community that has to watch it when it comes out totally Thursday night.

[B]

And that there's a lifespan of the show. And I remember at the finale, you guys were all like, I watched the whole night of it. You guys were like, drinking beers.

[A]

Oh, we were hammered.

[B]

You were.

[A]

That's what. Hammered.

[B]

But I remember it was. For me, it was so huge. Where I'm like, oh, actors are people, and they're having fun with each other and they're drinking beer. And I would love that life.

[A]

Yeah, because you were probably.

[B]

Maybe old, probably 14 at that time. I don't remember. But I was old enough to go, like, I can't believe that. And I remember you were smoking cigars.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You had, like, a cool hat on. And I was like, wait, that's work.

[A]

This is right before I went to Ted's school.

[B]

My goal has been pretends to go.

[A]

People say, what was it like? What did you do when Cheers was over? I said, I had up my life so much I didn't even share was over.

[B]

Is that true?

[A]

Basically, we're just living wild. Yeah, funny. All right, before we go, I flip back to Aaron, your artist wife and your two kids and your success in your work and your fame. That's a juggle sometimes. How do you do? How do you do as far as your family is concerned? Let me. I mean, how did they. How would they mark you down as the juggler?

[B]

I would say there was enough people I had looked up to in this business, like the David Lettermans, the Jeff Bridges, different people I'd heard interviewed who would say things like, if I could do it again, I would have passed on that movie because I was gone for nine months. Everything is family. And growing up without a dad, I know what that feels like. And so it's not a juggle to me. It's the kids are first. I love my career, but I'm not famous at the level that like, if I. It's like if I retired, nothing would happen. You know, like if you're on a sports team, and I don't mean this self deprecating, but like if Michael Jordan retires, the NBA is like, hold on. You know, like if a guy on a team retires who's a good player, they're going to be like, oh, no way. If I left my family, they would be shattered.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I love my career. I'm real. It's my greatest passion. I never want it to end, but it's not a juggle to me. If it goes away because of family stuff, then I'll always be sad. And then I'll create something else and I'll get like really into something else. But it doesn't feel. I think having kids for me has been. I wanted kids more. To my wife, I'm the one that convinced her I wouldn't be with somebody if I didn't think somebody would be like a great partner and a great mom. There was like a certain feeling I needed at home to do. I didn't think kids, no matter what. I was like, I don't want kids if home is chaotic. And then when I met Aaron, I was like, oh, she's so different. She's so cool. She's so not like me. I was like, oh, if they could have, if somebody could have that as a mom, that'd be cool. And then. Yeah. So I just feel like once they came, everything got better. My Ted school was kids.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I was literally at New girl and I had had a vodka or two. And our camera brie operator goes, Guy Paul goes, how pregnant's your wife? And I go, I think she's four and a half months, man. He's like, crazy. And then he goes, you know, with twins, they could be born at any moment. And I go like, right, Crazy idea. And he goes, can you imagine their first smells of their dad if they were born today, dude. And we made eye contact and I went like, I hear you. And he goes, yeah, it's wild. With kids you never know. It could happen fast. And I didn't drink for, you know, nine, ten, nine, ten months after that of like, whoa. But my big school was when they were born. I took like a year first started therapy after they were born where I was like, oh, there's a lot cooking in Here you're like, a lot changes.

[A]

Yeah. I kind of had to make up my version of man.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Same you did too.

[B]

That was the plays I wrote with my brother. It was all two young men creating things called Men Rules because it was like I was raised by women. So I relate way more to women.

[A]

Me too.

[B]

I connect with. I like being around women, but I also don't have that thing that a lot of guys. I do believe men and women can be friends 100%. I have a lot of female friends.

[A]

Here's my thing. My thing is I love hanging out with men. They're very relaxing and fun, but they're beside the point.

[B]

Either way, kind of same. Now men. What I love about men is when the bits are great. Like my brother I'm so close with, I'm like. But a lot of times with men, there's just a lot more energy. And when you're around certain females, you're like, oh, it's just very comfortable. It feels like home. The way that I know home.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But yeah.

[A]

So let me do last image.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I not met you, but got to talk to you a little bit more at that wrap party for the dink. And wrap parties are lovely, wonderful, you know, rambunctious, social, celebratory. And then we all go down to our, to cars. We'd all had cars to take us there. And I remember Mary and I couldn't quite figure out where our car was. And you guys sweetly said, we'll walk with you. We're going that way. But on the walk, which is maybe a 10 minute walk to find a car, you and Aaron were way more interested in each other and talking as you walked. And I remember looking at you, this guy. Oh, they're in this amazing relationship.

[B]

That's cool.

[A]

You know, and I have, I feel that with my wife, Matt. Both very lucky. Yes.

[B]

Well, I, I agree. And I feel the same about you guys is that we are big processors together. So it'll be really nice to be like if we haven't sat at the kitchen table and talked in a while, I will feel like something's missing. It's like her opinion is different than mine, but I like hearing it. Her take on kind of world politics, the life, art, everything. She's all process. So even when you asked early about her art, these days she's not even really about finishing the products. She doesn't care. She's not overly interested in going to a gallery. She's not interested in selling. She's interested in a life in the arts. And in our business, I get so caught up in product.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

And I get. I hate myself for it.

[A]

Let me just throw in this really talking about myself, not you, at this point. But there is a train you're pulling.

[B]

Yes, that's exactly right. But sometimes I get so into the train that I'm pulling that I forget what the art is. And the art is first.

[A]

I know I accuse myself all the time of going, ted, you're not really an artist. You're a businessman.

[B]

You're a business. And me too. And then there's times, because the more you do this, in between. Action. And cut. I can give you what you've told me you want without opening up any part of myself. And then if I have a day or scenes where I'm not giving anything, then I go, now I'm just here for the commerce. And now it's getting gross. And I have to remind myself to go like, I'm here for whatever that magic is. Or else it's just business.

[A]

One of the reasons why I like doing this podcast, and we haven't even talked about years, but some other time. Yes, very funny.

[B]

By the way, I would love you on it.

[A]

I'll come.

[B]

Yes. It's called we're here to Help, and I'm dying to have. Mary was on.

[A]

She busted your chops.

[B]

So ours is an advice podcast.

[A]

We.

[B]

Not real advice, but people call in,

[A]

but you try to give them good advice.

[B]

The premise of it is, and I had this growing up, if you went to a bar and told loved ones what your problems was, they're not giving you sound advice, but they're giving you advice to get you out of trouble. And you'd go like, that actually could work. But Mary heard an episode. And just who Mary is to me is we were at some work event. I don't remember what it was. Sal had to be with the dink. And she walks up to me and she goes, you know, I listened to your podcast, and she was so annoyed with me. And I was like, okay. And she goes, that was the worst advice. You're bullying a woman who wants to quilt. And I was like, stop yelling at me. First of all. We're just bullshitting. I'm trying my hardest. And she's like, you and that other guy. It was two men. You were being all macho, talking about fist fights you had been in, which was embarrassing. I didn't remember that. And then she goes. And I go, please stop. Come in the show and do this.

[A]

Yeah, do it.

[B]

She came and she had notes. She was like, hold on, another thing, you. I love her, man.

[A]

She's one of those people. Who is she? She taught me what sister a sister meant. You know, she really loves women.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But she really loves men.

[B]

Yeah. You know, her journey into this business is crazy. She told me her story.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

From like that first audition where we were at work one day and. And I feel like now every once in a while in life it just becomes a podcast where you're like working with somebody and you go like, I guess we'll just turn this into a podcast. So how did you start? There's no mics, but it's a great way to talk to people.

[A]

I've gotten much better socially because of my same. Because of being a podcaster. I'm willing to go just be curious about the other person. They'll be fine.

[B]

By the way, my dad, before he died, we had a thing where we. I started seeing em more when I was coming back into Chicago and podcasts had already started and I'd already been listening to some like Marins and these long form ones. And I was doing a Joe Swanberg and I was doing EZ and I went in my dad's and it was always sports based. It was always. We were talking cubs or bears and. And I thought like, I can see he's getting sicker. So I was like, I'm just gonna do a podcast now that's not recorded. And I would literally go like, so Dan, you're from Chicago. And he'd go, yeah. And I would go, then you went to the University of Illinois. And he'd go, I did. And I'd go, so how do you get from that? And then you were in the hippie thing for a while. Oh yeah, big time. How do you get into business? And he goes, the 80s, baby. And he goes, the 60s and 70s, it was a different thing. The 80s happened. And I go, can you walk me through it? He goes, okay. So there I am. And I'm like, this is a great podcast episode. But we would spend, you know, an hour here, an hour there.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I wish I'd recorded it just selfishly.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That I'm like, I'm really glad because of podcast. I did that. Hearing all these things about when he was like a shoe salesman and then clothes and then cards. You're like, neat stuff, man.

[A]

What was it like to lose your dad twice you lost.

[B]

It's a great question. Devastated.

[A]

The second time.

[B]

The second time was harder. So when I lost him at 2, I still had all the. And then when I was, like, a teenager, I could deal with all that, like, young man anger.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I didn't need him because I had a mom. My mom's both. No, thanks. Hated coaches. Didn't know why I always fought with men. But. Yeah, I'm not deep enough to figure that out. But who cares?

[A]

I'll beat the shit out of you.

[B]

I hate you. I just won't listen to you. And then when I became friends with him in my 30s, I was like. And going back to sports. My dad was the one that taught me. Cause I was 26 and broke, and all the playwright in New York stuff didn't work. I moved back to Chicago, was doing a really weird art project. And he said, you view Hollywood and your acting career like basketball. I think you need to see it, like, boxing a little bit more. And he was like, you can't take a whole team with you always. You're a boxer. So if there's an audition, it's just you. And that transition did make it a lot easier to break into the business.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

But so then we became friends. We got really close. We were, you know, a couple times a week, talking, always bits. Whenever I would have a scene with.

[A]

Like, this is early on in your new relationship.

[B]

In the new relationship. But this is during New Girl, during acting gigs. He was the one I could call and talk business. I could tell him the numbers that I couldn't tell anybody else.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Cause he'd go like, so your job is you get to kiss Zooey Deschanel and Megan Fox. Tell me once more what a little idiot like you gets paid per week. And I'll go. I'll tell you the name. He'll go, jesus fucking Christ. These numbers are disgusting. I'd be like, disgusting. And I go, the cast, we just did, like, a Honda commercial. And he goes, wonderful. And what did you do in it? I go, I stood in the background as Zoe sang. And what'd they give you? And I'd tell him. He'd go like this. I'm gonna have a fucking heart attack. And so it was so fun to have that. And then when he died, everything released. And I was like, oh. I was like, I'm crying a little bit too hard for a man in his 40s. And I was like, oh, I think this is all of it. I was like, now I've officially. But what I'm happy about is the scales at the end really evened out.

[A]

Yeah. How wonderful.

[B]

And you really did teach me that. I didn't used to think this, but I do fully believe people can change. You know that thing of, like, you can't teach an old dog new tricks. Yeah, but we're not dogs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

We can change.

[A]

I'm so happy that I didn't have any regrets about either of my parents. I didn't have anything left unsaid.

[B]

Yeah, totally.

[A]

I was still working within myself on the stuff that. That I kind of inherited.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

From them. But I. I was full on. Oh, this is on me now. It's not on them.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, totally.

[B]

Right.

[A]

What they did to me so over. You know, was. Which wasn't horrible. Just. But how they were.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Is. You know, there were two kids doing the best they could, and now it's your turn.

[B]

The big change is when you see your parents as their first. First and last names.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And for me, it would hit really hard when I was at my dad's funeral and you see all the photos and then you see people and you realize, oh, this buddy of his who knew him at 18, he knew him before he had kids. I only met him as him. As my dad. So all my judgments, like, my dad was an addict. He was a partier. I mean, even when he was sober, because he went into AA and NA when I was 17. This is not a joke. I'd be staying at his house, and it was the first person I'd ever experienced this with that. We'd be like, we're gonna watch the Cubs game. And he's like, you wanna get some food? And I'd be like, yeah. He's like, I'll order. Get two cheeseburgers, two fries. But he would get six Diet Cokes. And I'd be like, I've never heard of that. And he's like, there's no way we'll stop at one. And I'm like, you're right. But it's such an addict behavior. You're assuming where he's gonna have three Diet Cokes. And we would. If he got ice cream bars and there were 12. If you don't eat them right away, they're gone before he goes to bed. And you're like, that's just who he is.

[A]

I can't do it in the morning. Coffee in the morning. One cup. Oh, this really feels good. Two's gonna feel. I take it until I am wired and don't particularly feel good.

[B]

I take until I disconnect mentally. And then I go like, you did it again, buddy. But anyhow. So. Yeah. But it was. I can relate to what you're saying about, there was no regrets there. And I think that is so key that you're like, it ends really nicely. And you know this as being a parent, like Damon Waynes Jr. Told me when Aaron was pregnant, we were doing let's be cops together. And he said, I was like, all worried. I was like, well, the other thing I need to think about. And he goes, they're gonna hate you for something no matter what. Just try your best.

[A]

Just write it down so you give it to them so it'll help them. Oh, Lord. Yeah.

[B]

Well, I love you, Ted. I have looked up to you for so long, man. Real honor for me.

[A]

Yeah, me too. Thank you.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Yeah, I really appreciate it. Thank you. Jake Johnson. That was so much fun. Catch him and my wife Mary in the dink on Apple tv. He also hosts the comedy advice podcast we're here to help alongside comedian Gareth Reynolds. Please check it out. It is very funny. That's it for this week. Special thanks to Team Coco. If you've enjoyed this episode, send it to a loved one rate and review on Apple podcasts. If you're in a good mood once again, you can watch our full length video [e-mail] teamcoco see you next time. Where everybody knows your name.

[B]

You've been listening to where everybody knows your name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson Sometimes. The show is produced by me, Nick Liao. Our executive producers are Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross and myself. Sarah Fedorovitch is our supervising producer. Engineering and mixing by Joanna Samuel with support from Eduardo Perez. Research by Alyssa Grohl. Talent booking by Paula Davis and Gina Batista. Our theme music is by Woody Harrelson, Anthony Gend, Mary Steenbergen and John Osborne. Hey, what's going on over there? It's me, Trevor Noah. You know me. You don't know me. Oh, you do. I was worried there for a second. Well, if you know anything about me, you'll know. I love having interesting conversations. Conversations where we scratch beneath the surface, like what's really going on in the news? Or what is that celebrity really thinking about that scandal that they had? Or what's the worst way to be a parent? I mean, you want to find that out so you can be the best parent, right? Well, regardless of what it is, this podcast is all about figuring that out. Talking to interesting people who have interesting ideas that give us an interesting perspective on the world that we're living in. So make sure you tune in. Check out what now with Trevor Noah, available Now on the SiriusXM app.

[A]

Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of Angie, and one thing I've learned is that you buy a house, but you make it a home. Because with every fix, update and renovation, it becomes a little more your own. So you need all your jobs done well. For nearly 30 years, Angie has helped millions of homeowners hire skilled pros for the projects that matter, from plumbing to electrical, roof repair to deck upgrades. So leave it to the pros who will get your jobs done well. Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find a pro for your [e-mail].