Simu Liu

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Simu Liu" on Where Everybody Knows Your Name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson
Release Date: October 9, 2024
Guests: Simu Liu, Ted Danson, Woody Harrelson

Where Everybody Knows Your Name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson offers an intimate and engaging conversation with Simu Liu, exploring his journey from a challenging upbringing to becoming a celebrated actor and advocate. This episode delves deep into Simu’s personal and professional life, providing listeners with a comprehensive understanding of his experiences, struggles, and triumphs.

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1. Introduction and Early Career

Ted Danson introduces Simu Liu, highlighting his significant roles in Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings, Kim's Convenience, and Barbie. Ted mentions Simu's upcoming collaboration with Woody on the film Last Breath, setting the stage for an insightful discussion about his career trajectory.

Notable Quote:
Ted Danson [01:04]: "Today's guest is a true superhero... Let's get into it. Meet Simu Liu. Simu, thank you so much for being here."

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2. Filming Last Breath and On-Set Dynamics

Simu shares his experience working with Woody Harrelson on Last Breath, a film based on the true story of a deep-sea diver. He discusses the challenges of filming in Malta under tight conditions and the camaraderie developed on set.

Notable Quotes:
Woody Harrelson [02:30]: "We really had a fun time and some of it was in very tight quarters."
Simu Liu [03:20]: "There are no, you know, you just have to make a joke to get through... because you're cramped in."

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3. Early Life: From Harbin to Canada

Simu delves into his early life, born in Harbin, China, and raised by his grandparents after his parents immigrated to Canada. He recounts the trauma of being separated from his parents at a young age and the subsequent relocation to Canada at four and a half years old.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [08:32]: "I have visceral memories of that... It was very traumatic being separated from my grandparents."
Woody Harrelson [12:02]: "Can you imagine?"

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4. Transitioning from Accounting to Acting

Simu discusses his initial career path in accounting, the pressure of being an only child in an immigrant family, and the pivotal moment when he was fired from his accounting job. This dismissal became the catalyst for his shift towards acting, driven by his passion for film and the desire to find his place in the world.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [13:56]: "I got fired because I was a shit accountant. Thank God."
Simu Liu [14:24]: "I just got hooked. It was never meant to be a long-term thing, though."

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5. Breakthrough with Kim's Convenience and Shang-Chi

Simu recounts landing his role in Kim's Convenience, which provided him with stability and recognition. He elaborates on the challenges Canadian actors face when auditioning in the US, including the visa process. The conversation shifts to his audition for Shang-Chi, emphasizing the intense and transformative experience that led to his breakout role.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [22:53]: "I was already in credit card debt... After being fired, I just went for it."
Simu Liu [31:49]: "I cried into my pillow for a long time... my entire life was about to change."

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6. Dealing with Fame and Social Media

The discussion moves to the complexities of newfound fame, particularly the impact of social media. Simu shares his struggles with maintaining his personal narrative amidst public scrutiny and the importance of surrounding himself with supportive friends and family to navigate the challenges of celebrity life.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [34:23]: "People feel like they're out there, and they feel entitled to give opinions that aren't true."
Simu Liu [38:02]: "I think it's the best decision I'll make."

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7. Advocacy and Philanthropy

Simu highlights his commitment to advocacy, particularly in mental health and representation. He discusses his work with organizations like UNICEF Canada and Culture City, aiming to destigmatize mental health issues within the Asian community and promote overall well-being.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [45:27]: "For me, it's really about representation... there's something revolutionary about that."
Simu Liu [48:55]: "Everyone's dealing with their stuff... we're all trying to heal, and that's okay."

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8. Exploring Music and Barbie

Simu touches upon his foray into music, detailing his contributions to the Shang-Chi soundtrack and plans for future musical projects. The conversation also covers his role in the Barbie movie, praising director Greta Gerwig's collaborative approach and the enriching experience of working with a star-studded cast.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [51:33]: "Barbie is proof that AI could never write that. It's so weird and original."
Simu Liu [56:12]: "I'm going to keep making music as long as the label will let me."

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9. Reflections on Success and Personal Growth

Simu reflects on his unexpected rise to fame and the responsibilities that come with it. He discusses the balance between leveraging his platform for positive change and maintaining his authenticity amidst the pressures of Hollywood.

Notable Quotes:
Simu Liu [52:26]: "Art should make you feel."
Simu Liu [53:30]: "I feel like I have to step back and tune that out."

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10. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Ted and Woody wrap up the conversation by celebrating Simu's achievements and expressing admiration for his resilience and humility. They acknowledge his contributions to the industry and his ongoing efforts to make a meaningful impact beyond his acting roles.

Notable Quotes:
Ted Danson [56:12]: "What a pleasure."
Woody Harrelson [56:15]: "So much for coming back."

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Key Takeaways:

• Resilience and Adaptability: Simu Liu's journey underscores the importance of adaptability and resilience in overcoming career setbacks and personal challenges.

• Representation Matters: Simu's roles, particularly as Marvel's first Asian lead, highlight the significance of representation in media and its impact on diverse audiences.

• Balancing Fame and Personal Life: Navigating the complexities of fame requires a strong support system and conscious efforts to maintain personal well-being.

• Advocacy and Giving Back: Using his platform to advocate for mental health and cultural representation demonstrates Simu's commitment to making a positive societal impact.

• Continuous Growth: Simu's exploration into music and his collaborative experiences with esteemed directors reflect his dedication to continuous personal and professional growth.

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Conclusion

This episode of Where Everybody Knows Your Name offers a multifaceted look into Simu Liu's life, blending personal anecdotes with professional insights. Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson facilitate a conversation that not only celebrates Simu's achievements but also delves into the deeper aspects of his character and motivations. Listeners are left with a profound appreciation for Simu's contributions to the entertainment industry and his ongoing efforts to influence positive change.

Transcript

[Ted Danson]

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[Woody Harrelson]

When you got that call, you must have just been over the moon, huh?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, I. I cry. I cried into my pillow for a long time. It was like, you never get more. You're not going to get more high stakes than that, you know?

[Ted Danson]

Absolutely amazing. Welcome back to where everybody knows your name. Today's guest is a true superhero. Many of you know Simu Liu as the star of Shang Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings in which he led Marvel's first all Asian cast. Or maybe you know him from the fantastic sitcom Kim's Convenience or Barbie, in which he memorably played one of the Kens. I was excited to meet Simu for the first time through Woody. They worked together on a film called Last Breath that you'll be seeing in the future. It's based on a true story about a deep sea diver. And it was really cool to hear these guys talk about how much fun they had together on the set in Malta. I'm surprised, actually, they got any work done. Anyway, let's get into it. Meet Simu Liu. Simu, thank you so much for being here.

[Simu Liu]

You're so welcome. It's such an honor. Mostly for you, Ted.

[Ted Danson]

Woody, I understand less so I wear thin very quickly. So I'll catch up to Woody in a second. Can we make an agreement, though? I just heard before we started that you guys have a. A routine that when one of you says a joke that's really kind of lame, you go into this mock hysterical laughter. Can we agree to do this in this podcast?

[Woody Harrelson]

Definitely. And maybe going forward, you just gotta have your laugh in life. But Simu and myself and Finn Cole, who's also in the movie with us. Well, I don't know how you could have much more fun than we had. We really had a fun time and some of it was in very tight quarters.

[Simu Liu]

It was, it was, it was kind of, I mean, it was kind of one of those situations where the set itself was so constricting and those, you know, it's like, I feel like, those scenarios kind of breed the best humor because you just realize you got to make a joke to get through, you know, because you're cramped in and like a bajillion things are happening around you, and you're like, oh, my God.

[Ted Danson]

And that situation is because you were filming Last Breath, which is a movie about.

[Simu Liu]

It's about a team of commercial divers that work at the bottom of the North Sea. The North Sea. And it's based on a true story where basically the whole concept of. They're called saturation divers is that they work 100 meters with 300ft below sea level. And in order for you to operate at that pressure, you have to. You basically have to live in a saturation chamber that's no bigger, really wider than, like, I would say, half this room.

[Ted Danson]

Right?

[Simu Liu]

There's no, you know, you have very little space, very little privacy. You're like living on a space station, and you live aboard the ship in a little tiny saturation chamber. And then when you go down to work on the sea floor, you climb into this little tiny thing called a bell, and they lower that bell down, and it's all pressurized so that by the time you get down 300ft below sea level, you're already kind of pressurized.

[Ted Danson]

When you say that they live in.

[Simu Liu]

There, so four weeks they stay there. So our movie is. It's a true story of a diver that gets caught. What happened on this particular day ten years ago was that there was a diver, Chris Lemons, who was out, and his co diver, Dave Yuasa, were both underwater working, and the ship that they were tethered to starts to lose navigation because there's a storm. It starts drifting and it starts to pull the divers and their umbilicals. And so Chris umbilical actually gets caught on a manifold structure underwater, and it snaps, and he basically is lost on the bottom of the sea.

[Ted Danson]

Did you guys have to go through any training, even though you're actors and you didn't have to really?

[Woody Harrelson]

Well, he did. He had to go through extensive because he's. He's actually one of the divers. There's two go down, and then one stays in the bell. I was the guy who stayed in the bell. So he fin did quite a bit of underwater.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah, we did. We did three weeks.

[Woody Harrelson]

But after I left, you really, you were underwater a while?

[Simu Liu]

Oh, yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

For hours you'd be underwater.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah. You were long gone.

[Woody Harrelson]

I was living the good life, you know.

[Simu Liu]

But no, you had. You had a couple of rough days where it was Just you and the bell. Right. And it was like you without you guys. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

That was a bummer.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah. So the. So the bellman kind of stays inside this. This egg shaped structure, and you've got. Imagine just like this tiny, cramped space and like, hundreds of feet of umbilical. Cause basically, as the divers go out, someone's gotta be in the bell to, like, wrangle it. So there's Woody, like, poor Woody's, like, learning how to do the job for real on the day. Because they dress like. They really just dressed in everything of what it would look like. We had, like, real saturation that came in and consulted a lot.

[Woody Harrelson]

Yeah.

[Ted Danson]

What was your.

[Woody Harrelson]

Never. Never was Movie Star Blues a more appropriate song.

[Ted Danson]

That was a genuine laugh.

[Simu Liu]

That was. That was okay.

[Ted Danson]

That was good. That was good.

[Simu Liu]

He's a pretty funny guy. I got to give it to him.

[Ted Danson]

Did you shoot in that chamber where you have to be on the. On board the ship where you're. What is it called? The.

[Simu Liu]

The sat. Yeah, the sat chamber.

[Ted Danson]

Right. Did you work together in that? Cause what I'm bringing up is it.

[Woody Harrelson]

Wasn'T an actual set change. I mean, it was, but it wasn't.

[Ted Danson]

It was close quarters.

[Woody Harrelson]

You didn't have to breathe in helium and oxygen.

[Ted Danson]

Right. There's a reason why I bring this up is when I worked with Woody, it was a huge soundstage, but his vegetarian farts were so horrible that he would shut down production. I'm just wondering what happened with him.

[Woody Harrelson]

Yeah.

[Ted Danson]

Sorry.

[Woody Harrelson]

Vegan. Go ahead.

[Ted Danson]

Vegan. Sorry. Vegan. Which gives it an actual pecan.

[Simu Liu]

They were vegan farts, to be fair.

[Ted Danson]

Let's.

[Simu Liu]

You were really nice. I think you were really nice about it.

[Woody Harrelson]

Now, that was back when I didn't chew my food.

[Simu Liu]

There was this. There. There was this one thing. We had an eating scene. We had an eating scene where, like, for whatever reason, like, their characters were all. You know, it's like all of the. We know the tricks of the trade is, like, when you eat on camera, you take little tiny bites and you remember this. And we were doing this eating scene, and for whatever reason, like, Dave was like, wolfing down the food, and he was like, are you gonna finish that? And then he's taking Woody. And I just remember, like, before every take, this guy would just, like, keep stuff on his plate because I had to in the script. Like, I had to finish whatever was on his plate so he would, like, put.

[Ted Danson]

Stuff on it.

[Woody Harrelson]

He's getting more frustrated by the minute.

[Simu Liu]

This is take 12, because I'm not that good of an actor too. It's take 12. Oh, God, please don't make me do this.

[Woody Harrelson]

I disagree with that statement, by the way, you're a great actor.

[Simu Liu]

Oh, man, really?

[Ted Danson]

Cool. So do you want to back up? How'd you get there?

[Simu Liu]

How did I get there?

[Ted Danson]

From Harbin. How do you say where you were born?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, Harbin. Harbin, yeah, yeah. One of the coldest cities in China. Yeah. Well, my parents immigrated to Canada. They were able to get scholarships to study electrical engineering at Queens University, Kingston, Ontario. And then they were there for a number of years while I was being raised by my grandparents. And then I came over when I was four and a half, learned English, started school, became something of a gifted child. My parents were very hopeful that I would follow in their footsteps and become like an engineer or, you know, something that, you know.

[Woody Harrelson]

Worthwhile.

[Simu Liu]

Worthwhile. Worthwhile, yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

But before you. So. But you were raised by your grandparents for how long?

[Simu Liu]

Until I was. Yeah, until I was four and a half.

[Woody Harrelson]

So that must have been wild for suddenly your parents aren't there and you're being raised by your grandparents.

[Simu Liu]

Well, I didn't, I never knew my parents, so actually my grandparents, like my grandparents actually felt like they were my guardians. And I never, I never grew up with like a notion of like, I don't have a mom or a dad. I was just like, oh, this is my, my. Yeah, yeah, and my night. And they're the ones who take care of me. They feed me, they clothe me, they're.

[Woody Harrelson]

Oh, they do everything. Because your parents left.

[Ted Danson]

Your mom was in Beijing?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, She, I mean, she was kind of, yeah, she was with me early on. And then, and then, yeah, went to Beijing and then went to, and then immigrated with my father. And I really honestly just never felt like I, I mean, I would hear their voices on the phone, but I think trying to explain that to a four year old, like, trying to, oh, yeah, your parents aren't here and these are your grandparents. They aren't your actual parents, but like, you didn't care. You know, at the end of the day, it was like they're the ones who tucked you in at night and that's all that mattered. And then one day when I'm about, yeah, four and a half, my dad shows up and he knocks on the door and he's like, hey, I'm here to take you to Canada, to your new life. We're ready for you. And I was kind of like, who are you? It was, it was very Weird. Like, he was like. You know, that feeling of, like, being a kid and, like, a stranger is, like, hugging you and is, like, lifting you up, and you're just like. I feel like I'm. Everyone's expecting me to, like, embrace this man as if I've known him my whole life. But he, you know, at that point, he just felt like such a. Such a stranger.

[Ted Danson]

Four and a half. That's it. Four and a half.

[Simu Liu]

Four and a half.

[Ted Danson]

And you have visceral memories of that.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, very much so, because I remember it was very traumatic being separated from my grandparents. You know, it was like that was the only home that I knew. And I felt like if you had told me, like, if you had given me any sort of agency at that age of, like, do you want to go with this man into a completely different part of the world? I would have said no. I would have said, hell no. Let me stay here. I love it here. You know, there's nothing wrong with my situation, but that was always kind of the family plan was that I was gonna join my parents in Canada. I'm obviously very grateful for that now, but, yeah, it was hard at that time.

[Woody Harrelson]

It must have been very hard to see then.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

So let's say you got. So when you got to Canada and now you're living with these two people you barely know, who are your parents, did it take a while to adjust?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

Can you imagine?

[Simu Liu]

I mean, I feel like we're still adjusting in a lot of ways. I mean, you just. I think when you miss those years with each other, it was like getting adopted by my own biological parents. You know, that's amazing. And there was so much that we had to learn. But then also, I was, like, adapting to life in Canada and learning English at a faster rate than they were because by the time I was seven or eight, I was already speaking better English, and my parents English was pretty good. But, you know, it's just when you're in the school system and you're listening to it every day, all of a sudden it's like you're, you know, for all intents and purposes, you become Canadian. And then there becomes a culture clash of, like, okay, now we're having trouble communicating, and we don't have that kind of baseline intimacy of, like, being together from birth. And. Yeah, I mean, there were some. There were some really hard years there.

[Ted Danson]

And their imprint, your parents imprint early on in their lives, was pretty intense, I would imagine, in China, but they.

[Woody Harrelson]

Were kind of taskmasters and really expecting you to be the golden boy.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah. I mean, a lot of kids from my generation were only children because that was the policy at the time. And so it was just like these one child would like. And especially if, like, that family made the cross, you know, made the journey to, you know, immigrate to a different country. It was like that kid held the hopes and dreams and the expectations of, like, the entire family. And that was me. And I feel like I did a pretty decent job for a hot sec. And I went to college and I studied accounting and got a job as an accountant. And then, like. And then less than a year after graduating, I got fired because I was a shit accountant.

[Woody Harrelson]

Thank God.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, thank God.

[Woody Harrelson]

By the way, this is the irony of life. Like, you think the worst thing just happened to you, and it's the best thing. You have no clue that that was the best thing that happened.

[Simu Liu]

Oh, yeah, it was over. Yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

And. But why did you end up grab. Gravitating toward, you know, so you became like a stuntman, actor, extra, whatever.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, whatever I could kind of get my hands on. I think it was because.

[Ted Danson]

Wait, wait, sorry. Take me through that later.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah.

[Ted Danson]

All right. I got fired. I'm no longer an accountant. I know. I'll go be a stuntman. Was that that clear to you or no?

[Simu Liu]

No, I think what was clear to me was that what I had been doing up until that point was not working. And, I mean, I should say, I always had, like, a love of movies. And as an only child with immigrant parents, it was like you absorbed the world through TV and through movies. Like, you just. You know, it felt like being at home was a very isolating experience because it just did not reflect the world that was out there. Right. It was like you were stepping into a time capsule, and all of a sudden you got two roommates from 1970s China. So in order to learn about the world, I was just watching movies and watching TV and wanting to just escape into those worlds, you know? And then I think the other part of it, too is, like, my parents worked all the time. You know, I was kind of bullied at school, so I just kind of felt like I wanted to matter a little bit, and I wanted to have the spotlight on me for once. And so I had. You know, Toronto is a. I would say it's like a small ish. It's a bit of a satellite city when it comes to film production. But, you know, you shot there. Like, there's tons of stuff. You were in a movie called Man From Toronto that shot In Toronto?

[Ted Danson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Simu Liu]

You know, a lot of stuff shoots out and I would hear like these stories of like, friends of friends who wound up as an extra on movie sets. And those stories would kind of trickle through the, you know, the grapevine. And I remember just I would get so jealous and so interested. I was just like, oh, man, I wish I knew someone in the industry. I wish I knew. I wish I had an in, you know, And I was on Craig's. I would, like when I was a miserable accountant in the kind of the depths of my depression, I would, like go on Craigslist and type in acting. Like, find me an acting job on Craigslist. Just for fun, really, just to fantasize. And I came upon a listing for Guillermo del Toro's movie Pacific Rim, which was shooting in Toronto at the time at Pinewood Studios. And I actually, I skipped work to be an extra on that set. Cause I just was so interested in it. It was like the listing was specifically calling for Asian actors, which I thought was a sign from the universe telling me that I had to do it. Because, I mean, I was like, when are they going to ever ask for Asian anyway? You never asked for Asian actors. So, yeah, I skipped work, went on set, pretty much got found out right away, got fired, like, less than a month later. So, you know, very clearly.

[Woody Harrelson]

Oh, was that part of what caused you to get fired?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah, definitely, I would say. I mean, I don't know.

[Woody Harrelson]

So it wasn't about being a shit accountant?

[Simu Liu]

Well, there was all. Yeah, I mean, there was also that. I did also fail the first of my exams.

[Ted Danson]

From that moment on, though, you're hooked and you're in the business.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I had no job and I was like, I might as well give this a shot. It was never really meant to be a long term thing, though, I gotta say, as somebody who looked like me, you know, 12 years ago, God, I had no delusions that I would, like become all of a sudden I would have a TV show or like my own movie. I was like, oh, I would love to be the Asian guy that is working at the convenience store that gets robbed, you know, I would love to be that guy who. And that would be enough for me, you know? And of course, you know, you go in with that. With that kind of thinking and you're like, maybe I'll just do it for a little while. And then you just get hooked. And, you know, I was pretty successful early on. I booked my first couple of, like, speaking roles here and there relatively quickly. And then I just found myself on set. And I think the more that you're exposed to it, the more that you meet people that are working in the industry, the more you just start to feel like, oh, maybe I could just, maybe I could. If only I could just hang in there a little bit longer, maybe I could do it.

[Ted Danson]

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[Woody Harrelson]

So tell me about that transition to finally, you know, scrounging around to finally getting Kim's convenience. Yeah, and then that blowing up.

[Simu Liu]

I mean, it was like, I've said this before, but it's like I had been in credit card debt for years before. You know, I was. I just kind of had convinced myself that that was gonna be my life and I had made peace with it. I was okay with the life of a starving artist. As you know, we all have to make peace with at some point, like where we are, what we do. This is not the norm. You know, we're extremely, extremely lucky. But, yeah, I was. So when I got the call, I just cried because I knew it was like lifting me out of credit card debt. I knew that I would no longer be the black sheep of the family that I had become. Because as we were saying, when all of these immigrant dreams rest on this one kid and then he gets himself fired before he turns 23 and then decides to become an actor. You've got like, you imagine how my parents feel, and then you imagine how like the family in China feel where they're just like, well, he went fucking crazy.

[Woody Harrelson]

Wow.

[Simu Liu]

See, this is why you should never leave, you know?

[Ted Danson]

And you were aware of that in real time?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I basically, you know, I used to go back and visit quite often and basically what just happened is I stopped getting invited back. I just stopped getting invited back. My parents were like, you know, well, we'll see you. We're going. We're going back to China for a bit and we'll see you in a few weeks. And there was no, like, come with or like, it was just like, yeah, you stay, you stay here. We, you know, we would rather pretend you don't exist.

[Ted Danson]

This is pre Kim's Convenience.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah. And not to say that that was the only reason why my parents are speaking to me now. We.

[Ted Danson]

Doesn't hurt.

[Simu Liu]

It doesn't hurt. It definitely doesn't hurt things, but no. We kind of done a lot of work prior and they had, in their own way, made peace with it as well. But that was a huge step up for me. It was great for our relationship because they were able to really see me make a living doing what I loved and what I set out to do initially. And if that was the happy ending to my entire career, I would have been totally happy.

[Ted Danson]

Right.

[Simu Liu]

You know, but now I'm here with you guys.

[Woody Harrelson]

I don't think you would have been totally happy. I mean, you would have wanted to keep going. You know what I mean?

[Simu Liu]

You're right.

[Woody Harrelson]

Like, I sometimes think, oh, if I'd have just been Woody on Cheers, like, that's pretty fucking great. You know what I mean? That's hitting the lottery, you know. But on the other hand, you also think to yourself, well, I sure would have liked to done something else.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah, fair enough.

[Woody Harrelson]

So then the transition from doing Kim's Convenience to when you got Shang Chi. Tell me about that.

[Simu Liu]

So it's really hard for Canadian actors to actually start auditioning in the US you gotta get like, you gotta get a visa. In order to get a visa, you gotta get an attorney who you basically have to prove notability within your profession. You're an. You have to apply to be an alien of extraordinary ability. That's what the O1 visa is called. So getting on Kim's and all the press that that kind of came with, that was enough to get me my. My visa. And once I got that, it was in about 2016, I started coming down to the States to audition whenever I wasn't shooting Kim's Convenience and it was a, you know, it was a tough.

[Woody Harrelson]

You had a agent in la?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, I had a. I had a manager that I just. I'd emailed out of the I. It was like 3am sending out mass emails. And this one guy, Chris, you know, responded and he's still my manager today, very, very great. Yeah, Best email that he ever responded.

[Ted Danson]

To, interviewing him before you got that.

[Woody Harrelson]

I'm happy about responding to that.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, he's pretty happy. He's pretty happy. And there's about 400 other people who are kicking themselves in their inbox. They're like, ah, shit. He did email me. Um, so. But, but those few years were, yeah, it was hard. Cause coming down to the US with the exchange rate, we weren't making that much money off of Canadian television. It really wasn't a heavy. I was living, but I was by no means a lucrative venture at all. Um, right. I was just kind of middle, middle class, working actor still. But I was hemorrhaging money and just trying to be in LA as much as I could. Because again, yeah, I knew that, you know, I love my home country of Canada very much, but I knew that if I wanted to pursue, like, if I would attain any sort of long term sustainability for my career, I'd have to go to la, I'd have to make it in the States. And so I was just year after year coming out, auditioning. There were some close calls. You know, as you guys probably know, being on a show, it can be golden handcuffs sometimes, right? Cause you signed, you see a contract in front of you, you've never seen that amount of money before in your life and they're like, but we're gonna need you for six years and you're not gonna be able to do any other shows. And you sign on the dotted line and you're like, great, just pay me, I don't fucking care. But then, but then you go down to LA and there's all these new shows that come up and they're like, well, we can make it work with your schedule. We just need your show to sign off on it. And then there's, you know, business affairs from one end to the other and then all before you know it, that deal's evaporated. You don't have an, you know, you're a, you know, my manager's calling me and being like, ah, they pulled the offer, they pulled the test deal. And so it was a lot of years of that. It was a lot of years of honestly maybe just not being good enough. And me still kind of working through my skills as an actor because I was still very much learning as I was going. You know, I had no formal, I had a lot of formal accounting training but very little formal acting training. And then 2019 rolled around and it was like, I just feel like been Beating that door down and beating that door down for so long. And finally it was starting to crack. In February, I was on my first U.S. network TV show. I was on Fresh off the Boat on ABC. And then shortly after that, I shot a little indie movie in San Francisco. And then three months later, I was Shang Chi. So it was like once it. Once I started noticing that first crack, like, it all just kind of finally came down.

[Ted Danson]

Wow.

[Simu Liu]

And that was the.

[Woody Harrelson]

So what was the audition process like for Shang Chi?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, so I basically. We got a call to put these scenes on tape. Like, dummy scenes. They were scenes from Good Will Hunting, and nobody would tell me what it was for. And so I did my best Matt Damon impression. I was like, how do you like them? Apple? And I put it on tape and I sent it in. And then we heard nothing for like a month and a half by then.

[Ted Danson]

Knowing what it was for.

[Simu Liu]

Getting more and more of an idea. Yeah. And then. But at that point, I was like, there's no way. I'll throw my hat in the ring, but, like, there's no fucking way they would pick me. There's just. There's just too many talented people out there. They're gonna pick someone. Stuff like that doesn't happen to me, you know? But then. But then, you know. Yeah, about a month and a half later, and it was right around the time that we had a bit of a shooting break on Kim's convenience. They were like, hey, are you gonna be in LA anytime soon? We'd love for you to sit down with the director. And I was like, yeah, I booked my ticket out, met Destin, who you've worked with. It was just absolutely phenomenal. And then from there, did kind of like a callback. And honestly, I feel like that callback was where I won the part, because it was like Destin and I in a room together. We were working. At some point, I was kind of, like, still on book. And then he was like, hey, how about we just throw the scenes away and we just kind of vibe and improv? And I was like, okay, let's do it, you know? And I very clearly remember I came out of that room and I. I was just like. I was hyperventilating, I think, because I had done so well. I felt like I had done well enough, and I didn't want to. I couldn't admit it to anyone. I didn't want to say it out loud because I was afraid I'd jinx it, But I was like, I think I may have just won the Part. And yeah, few days after that I get a test deal and then I fly out to New York where they've like, you know, they. It's Marvel, It's a big company. You know, they set up this like full screen test with the wardrobe and the, you know, and the, and the, you know, you're on a soundstage with a full camera crew. And Awkwafina was there. It was my scene partner. She'd like, you know, generously given her time. Cause she was already cast at that point to do a chemistry read. And then, and then I blacked out. Some things happened. And then two days later, I got the call.

[Woody Harrelson]

Wow, that's great.

[Simu Liu]

Talk about stress.

[Woody Harrelson]

When you got that call, you must have just been over the moon, huh?

[Simu Liu]

I cried into my pillow for a long time. It was like, you never get more. You're not going to get more high stakes than that, you know.

[Ted Danson]

Absolutely amazing.

[Simu Liu]

I just knew my entire life was about to change. And I, you know, was in my like 500 square foot apartment in Toronto just like sobbing. And then, and then, yeah, four days later, they flew me to San Diego to Comic Con. And then I was like announced in front of the whole world. And I was like on stage with Angelina Jolie and I was wearing like these broken, you know, these like ripped jeans from Zara that were like $20. And just sharing the stage with all these like Marvel superheroes that I just, literally, I just saw because Endgame had just come out, you know, it was like the biggest movie ever and all. And all of a sudden I was just there with them. So it was a, it was what a fucking surreal.

[Ted Danson]

And because of that announcement at Comic Con, you just blew up, right? As far as people recognizing you or knowing you or.

[Simu Liu]

I mean, yeah, it was that, that was a, that what I would say was like a small blow up. And then when the movie came out and hit, you know, in the middle of the pandemic, for it to do as well as it did, it became such a, such a conversation because, you know, the, you know, the industry was struggling and, you know, we were struggling to figure out whether we would all survive the pandemic. And the movie ended up being like the highest grossing domestic movie at that point until Spider man came and kicked our ass.

[Woody Harrelson]

But, but so that was in 2020, the end, 2021.

[Simu Liu]

So we shot in 2020. And then 2021, September, it came out.

[Ted Danson]

So I have some. Can I. Now you're famous now you're pretty much current. You've gone off and made more movies since that. Did you lose something with fame? Did you lose. I mean I saw your interview with Kevin Hart, which was a great interview but you know, it is a double edged sword. Yeah, you know, it's, I mean it's great, it's wonderful. You know, it's your dream, but you.

[Simu Liu]

Do you pay for it?

[Ted Danson]

Yeah, you pay for it. You have to be willing to let some things go. A lot of people, I found, could put their fears of being abandoned by you on you and it's your fault. You're not going to be the same. Oh, he's changed. Did you get any of that?

[Simu Liu]

I have great. I have and continue to have great people around me. I believe to be the best friends and family in the world, you know, especially like my parents and I feel like have just been to hell and back and we're just, you know, we're stronger than ever. I just, I love them so much and have a really, I think thorough understanding of like their journey to immigrate and really all of that being so that I could have the ability to pursue life on my terms, which was an incredible gift that they gave me. And so I think in my personal life I've been very lucky in that I don't think that too much has changed there. You need the friends that'll give you shit at the end of the day, you know, and my friends give me a lot of shit.

[Woody Harrelson]

There's no limit to that. Seemed like, could we put a cap? No, but. So how did your parents respond? They must have. When Shang Chi came out and was such an over the top success, how were they, you know, how did they take it?

[Simu Liu]

My dad retired. My dad retired, which is great. It was a. Sure. I mean, I think before there was no. There would be no conversation of retiring at his. He retired at 60 and you know, I know that he would still be working today if I hadn't gotten that part.

[Woody Harrelson]

Oh, just to support you, you mean?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, I think he, you know, there was always a sense of like he would be putting. Squirreling money away just in case I needed it.

[Ted Danson]

His loser son quit another.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, it's loser. So. Exactly, exactly, exactly. So all of that just. Yeah, I've just been really lucky with my family and all that. But where I feel like I've lost something is maybe just the, you know, in just the bigness and the speed at which it's kind of happened for me in the sphere of like the social media of it all, I think is that I think I've lost The ability, you know, it's kind of like you lose control of your own narrative in a way because you're just kind of, you're out there. And I think people feel like you're out there. And so they feel like based on what they see or what they read, that they know you. And so it entitles them to give opinions and say things that are, that are completely not true and based in reality. And I think for a while I really struggled with that because I came from like a grassroots TV show where every night when the episodes would air, we would like tweet with our fans. And everyone was so kind and so great and it felt like a small community, you know, and everyone was supportive of each other. But there's something about the bigness of the last couple of things that I've been in, and that comes with a global awareness. But that awareness doesn't mean that every single person is going to take the time to know you and who you are before passing some sort of. So whereas before I would love to read everything that was said about me. And you know, it would. The Internet really was like a place of support. Now it's like a very different, different place. And so I feel like a lot of what I have to, what I feel like I have to do as someone coming into fame in this era is like learn to step back from that and tune that out.

[Ted Danson]

Which ain't a bad thing.

[Simu Liu]

No, no.

[Ted Danson]

Mental health wise.

[Simu Liu]

No, I think it's the best decision I'll make.

[Ted Danson]

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[Simu Liu]

Yeah. The chosen. Yeah, the chosen one.

[Ted Danson]

Yeah.

[Simu Liu]

Maybe. No, I mean, I feel like many things have happened in my life in such a. I mean, I don't. I don't think I'm a particularly religious person, but I do feel like at time, like, you know, just the way in which my life is unfolded, it's impossible to go through what I went through and not feel like in some. Like there's just some sort of. There's something weird about the timing of everything and how everything in my life has come full circle in a way. Like, I remember, you know, I was. I was on my college hip hop dance team, doing dance, competing with these other colleges, doing dance. And my parents were like, what the fuck are you doing? None of this will ever matter in your life, ever. This is so useless. Why are you wasting your time? And then I get cast in a Greta Gerwig movie where I'm out there doing choreography to an eight count. And, you know, it's just that there's just been such so many of those full circle moments that it's just impossible to, like, really wrap my head around. So I'll say I've been very lucky in going through what I've gone through. And, yeah, I mean, I feel like there is an element of, like, living with some sort of burden of expectation my whole life, which, which, for better or for worse, I guess prepared me for whatever this is I don't know.

[Ted Danson]

I mean, that's what a superhero is, right? I mean, carrying the burden of saving the world or the universe or whatever, it's kind of all very perfect.

[Simu Liu]

But now you're cornering me and forcing me to say I am a superhero, which I did.

[Ted Danson]

You heard.

[Simu Liu]

I mean, if you must. If you put the words in my mouth.

[Woody Harrelson]

I'm not the one.

[Simu Liu]

God, what a. Yeah, you're saying it. I'll take it.

[Ted Danson]

Let's have one of those laughs.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah.

[Ted Danson]

By the way, that's fucking great. That was my first real attempt.

[Simu Liu]

That's a fun one, right?

[Woody Harrelson]

That's good fun, right?

[Simu Liu]

Woody really perfected the jaw movement as well.

[Woody Harrelson]

Oh, yeah.

[Simu Liu]

Which is the.

[Ted Danson]

Okay. This may be premature, but I remember early on I was very lucky that early on in the Cheers fame, you know, like about third, fourth year or whatever, somehow I realized or someone wise told me or whatever that you can feel the energy coming your way. That because people know you all of.

[Simu Liu]

A sudden, everybody knows your name.

[Ted Danson]

Yeah. And damn, that was good.

[Simu Liu]

I deserved it. I deserved it.

[Ted Danson]

That's not a bad joke. That was good.

[Simu Liu]

I know you don't have to, but.

[Ted Danson]

Anyway, being an actor celebrity with a lot of attention is like being a four year old in a room full of adults who are all focusing on that child. You can spin a kid out like that if everybody's going, oh, look at that little boy, you know, and it's the same thing. I think being a celebrity, all that energy can really fuck you up if you just absorb it. Somebody told me, or I whatever, that you. That's. But it's power. That energy is energy. So if you use it and, you know, deflect it into something you care about. Yes, you can make use of. You know, for me it was oceans. So I used to, you know, actors are the ones usually who stand in front of the tent, you know, and say, hey, thank you for watching Cheers. Yes, let me sign an autograph. But will you please come in and meet this marine biologist who. She has something amazing to tell you. I survived much better dealing with fame, knowing I had something to do with it to make use of.

[Woody Harrelson]

Yes, he had something to do with it. He makes a freaking mountain of money.

[Simu Liu]

I told you, my dad retired. I mean, that's the next.

[Woody Harrelson]

You're going to have to support your.

[Ted Danson]

Parents ultimately, but I think it's premature. I don't mean to be saying, what are you doing? Or anything like that, but does that ring a bell or does that make sense or.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah. I think.

[Ted Danson]

How do you deal with it, is what I mean. Cause it is a crapload of energy coming your way.

[Simu Liu]

Yes, yes. I think it kind of turns. It can turn anybody into a narcissist, right? Like, because all of a sudden you are the center of the world, and then you're right at the moment that you start buying into it, it's like it's over for you. You really have to. I think, you know, in my very, very short time in the public eye, I think I've started. I've really realized that, you know, that will come and go, and the eye. The eye of the world will come and go. But, you know, what you. Yeah, exactly. What you can. What you can do to be a conduit in a moment towards whether it's an idea or a cause or something. You know, for me, early on, at least, like, this, there was pretty simple. For me, like, even just existing as an Asian. Asian. American person in the public eye and being, you know, even like somebody who could talk on press and not be like, you know. And I say this with the most amount of love because I feel like I idolize people like Jackie Chan and Jet Li, but they were a different type of Asian character that I think was a lot more palatable to Western sensibilities of like, oh, here's like, an Eastern mystic martial artist and who doesn't really speak English, you know. And I was, you know, I really just wanted to be the guy that could shoot shit on, you know, on Kimmel or whatever and sit down and tell a joke and that there was something even, like, revolutionary about that. So in the beginning, it was really about just the representation of it. And now I feel like, you know, as an extension of just being more globally known, I suppose is like, you know, focusing and really trying to. Trying to connect with organizations that have a global reach. Like, so I do a lot of work with unicef, UNICEF Canada, for example. I love talking about mental health because mental health is something that my community in particular, doesn't have a lot of familiarity with. Like, when you look at our parents, a lot of whom came from, like, extremely traumatic situations, didn't feel like they had any of the tools available to, like, really process what was happening to them. And so a lot of it became, you know, like, they took it out on their kids, on us. And so we carried a lot of that generational trauma, and we, in turn, became really fucked up. And so, you know, without really hitting on the head too much, it's like, you know, my journey into therapy has been really awesome. I want to share that as much as I can so that people, really, people like me feel like those conversations are normalized. And so, you know, I've been doing a lot of work with an organization called Culture City, for example, which is all about invisible illness. Right. All about the diseases that afflict us that you would not know walking down the street. And you know what I really. What I think is true is that everyone's dealing with their stuff. We all put on a brave face to step out into the world, but we're all, to some degree, broken in our own way and trying to heal, and that's okay. And wanting to share that message with the world, too, among other things.

[Ted Danson]

You are a rock with eloquent man. You really are. You're a rock.

[Woody Harrelson]

You really are. Should we talk about Barbie?

[Simu Liu]

Oh, man, what's that ride been like? I've never worked with a director like Greta, and I think, you know, in all the. Every director teaches you something different. I think Greta taught me so much. And not just Greta, but, like, being on set with Margot and Ryan, it was just like aces. It was an all star cast. And everyone, you know, Will Ferrell, Kate McKinnon, these like, SNL pros that are just so fucking funny. And every, you know, it's like the. Every take is completely different but so usable. And I mean, I think I take a lot of those memories with me, and I feel like it just made me so much of a better actor. Greta is so amazingly collaborative in how, you know, she, like, the script was. The movie was in the page right from day one. It was like, we read that script and we were like, holy shit, this is one of the. This movie is gonna be huge. Like, you could tell. But then, you know, just the fact that she could have that distinctive a vision and still be so wonderful and so collaborative on the day and so receptive to ideas, I think made me realize, like, you can. You don't have to be an asshole in Hollywood. Like, there's no, like, you know, just because you're an auteur or like, you know, just because you're. Yeah. Like a director's director of a certain caliber. Like, that somehow entitles you to be a terrible person.

[Woody Harrelson]

Yeah. Listen to this advice.

[Simu Liu]

You know, Great.

[Ted Danson]

I'm. Well, never mind.

[Woody Harrelson]

I can't. He's the nicest guy.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah. I mean, I know it. I know it. I mean, again, we knew it would be big. We didn't realize. I mean, I think what has been just so incredible is like seeing The Barbenheimer of it. These two movies could exist simultaneously and could just, like, energize the industry in such a way that, like, you know, we're coming off of a summer where, like, a lot of movies where I feel like on the page or in the room felt like, this is an ace. This is an ace in the hole. This is like going to get us our 500 million, whatever. We're failing. And so I feel like there's a lot of uncertainty in the industry about, okay, what works now, what will get people out. And as it turns out, it's just two really great original movies from, like, solid filmmakers, you know.

[Ted Danson]

And so when you say original, you mean not created by AI?

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like Barbie is the one movie. And Ryan Gosling said this at one point, he was like, barbie is proof that, like, AI could. AI could never write that. It's so. Because it's weird and original and original and like, you know, and Greta's storytelling is just so unique that, like, it just. A movie like, that could not exist unless it was a person, a. A weird, eccentric person behind it. Just, you know, writing the page.

[Ted Danson]

You can rip it off. AI can rip it off and then make a less good one.

[Simu Liu]

A less good one.

[Ted Danson]

You can make a lot of copy.

[Simu Liu]

Tonally emotionally empty version of it. Yeah.

[Woody Harrelson]

Which some people do value emotional emptiness, but, you know, it's okay to live that way.

[Simu Liu]

Just, you know, art should make you feel.

[Woody Harrelson]

You don't want to over emotion.

[Ted Danson]

I feel stupid, slightly embarrassed, you know, saying, so how are you paying back? How are you going to use all of this attention coming your way? Because the truth is, after sitting here for a while, it feels like you walk in the door. You just walk in the door and you're giving back because you are all, you know, you are shit. Now I'm going to get in over my head. But you are an example to so many people who have been cut out of this industry for so long. You're an example of grace as you walk in the door. You're all of these examples that are changing people's lives just by you being you walking in the door. So I felt like my question was an implication of, hey, you need to give back kind, and that's so full of shit. So please accept my apology and know that I do see you.

[Simu Liu]

First of all, Ted, you're welcome. And thank you. And you're welcome, everybody.

[Ted Danson]

I mean, could you do me a favor and walk in one more time? Because it wears off once you sit down.

[Woody Harrelson]

Strut in. No, I just want to ask you one question before we wrap this up about your debut single. Don't.

[Simu Liu]

Because I didn't.

[Woody Harrelson]

I didn't know about this.

[Simu Liu]

Oh, yeah?

[Woody Harrelson]

You never told me.

[Simu Liu]

I didn't know. I didn't want to. I didn't want you to make fun of me.

[Woody Harrelson]

No, I would never. But what about it?

[Simu Liu]

What about it? Yeah. I guess I fancy myself a singer sometimes. I know you do too. Okay. I know. You know, I don't know about that. This guy's a good Elvis impersonator. I'm sure he's regaled you with many Elvis impersonations over the. Over the years.

[Ted Danson]

And what was the music? What was the music like?

[Simu Liu]

It was. It. You know, I. I had an opportunity to be in the Shang Chi soundtrack. So I have a song on the Shang Chi soundtrack with a record label called 88rising, which is like a. An Asian American focused record label. And. And I don't know how I weaseled my way out of the soundtrack, but I was like, I kind of was just hanging around the studio being like, hey, what you guys doing? Do you mind if I. Mind if I step in there? And then somehow came out with a song called Hot Soup, which was, you know, it's like a cool little thing, but, you know, it had like a couple million streams on Spotify. And then again, weaseled my way more and was like, so we should probably keep doing this, right? Like, you want to make an album maybe? And, you know, the people at the label were kind enough to say, yeah, sure, you know, fuck around, learn your sound. And that's kind of what I've been doing for the last year, just on my spare time. And with the single that came out was just, you know, now that it's out in the world, I kind of feel like I want to make more. And it's that thing of, like, growing up, I would just, like, see people acting and performing and I just want to do it. You know, there was. Whenever I saw someone doing something interesting, I was like, I'd be like, I want to do it somehow. And just watching people perform live is just such a. There's such a magic around it, and I'm just. I'm dying to do it and I need songs in order to do it. So I'll just. I'm going to keep making music as long as the label will let me. And I haven't been booted off yet. And hopefully at some point I'll play something for you and everyone that'd be Cool.

[Woody Harrelson]

Great, man.

[Simu Liu]

That's so cool.

[Woody Harrelson]

I can't wait to listen to it. I didn't even know about it till I read this thing.

[Simu Liu]

Yeah, read the brief. Yeah.

[Ted Danson]

What a pleasure. What a pleasure.

[Woody Harrelson]

So much for coming back.

[Ted Danson]

Thank you, man. That was Simu Liu, everybody. I am so happy that I got to spend an hour and a half or whatever it was with him. He's an amazing man and kind of an effortless ambassador, even if he didn't want to become one. He is that and he's remarkable. And I really. Chuffed. Is a great word. Chuffed that I got to hang out with him. So, anyway, thank you, Simu. Special thanks to our friends at Team Coco and to you for listening. I truly love getting to share these episodes with you every week. So it means a lot that you're here once again. Tell a friend about us and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. If you're on Apple podcasts, maybe give us a, oh, I don't know, great rating and review. We would appreciate it if you prefer to watch me and Woody in high definition. Oh, see, just reading this, I think that's a bad idea. But, you know, go for it. You can watch full episodes of this podcast on Team Coco's YouTube channel. So check us out sometime. Maybe put a little Vaseline over the part of the TV that my face is on. It helps. It helps. I will see you next time. Where everybody knows your name. Thank you.

[Simu Liu]

You've been listening to where everybody knows your name with Ted Danson and Woody Harrelson.

[Ted Danson]

Sometimes the show is produced by me.

[Simu Liu]

Nick Liao, executive producer are Adam Sacks.

[Ted Danson]

Colin Anderson, Jeff Ross and myself.

[Simu Liu]

Sarah Fedorovich is our supervising producer. Our senior producer is Matt Apodaca. Engineering and mixing by Joanna Samuel with support from Eduardo Perez.

[Ted Danson]

Research by Alyssa Grahl.

[Simu Liu]

Talent booking by Paula Davis and Gina Bautista. Our theme music is by Woody Harrelson, Antony again, Mary Steenburgen and John Osborne.

[Ted Danson]

Special thanks to Willie Navarre.

[Simu Liu]

We'll have more for you next time for everybody knows your name At Amica Insurance, we know it's more than just a house. It's your home.

[Ted Danson]

The place that's filled with memories.

[Simu Liu]

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