Which came first, Marvel or DC?

Summary

Summary of "Who Smarted? - Episode: Which Came First, Marvel or DC?"

Episode Release Date: January 31, 2025

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Introduction

In this enlightening episode of "Who Smarted?," hosted by Martin Goodman and the Trusty Narrator, listeners embark on an adventure through the rich histories of two of the most iconic names in the comic book industry: Marvel and DC Comics. Blending humor with educational insights, the episode delves into the origins, evolution, and enduring rivalry between these two giants, making complex histories accessible and entertaining for kids, parents, and educators alike.

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Origins of DC and Marvel Comics

The episode kicks off with a whimsical tale from the Trusty Narrator, setting the stage for a deep dive into the backstories of Marvel and DC Comics.

• DC Comics: The Early Days

  • Founded: 1934
  • Original Name: National Allied Publications
  • Renamed to DC: 1977, inspired by the popular "Detective Comics" series featuring Batman.

  Notable Quote:
  Trusty Narrator (00:49): “...DC Comics began in 1934, five years before Marvel. But guess what? Neither DC or Marvel started out with those names.”

• Marvel Comics: The Beginning

  • Founded: 1939
  • Original Name: Timely Comics
  • Renamed to Marvel Comics: 1961

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (05:28): “Whoa. That's right. I started Timely comics in 1939.”

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First Superheroes: Pioneers of the Genre

Delving into the characters that set the foundation for each universe, the hosts highlight the inaugural superheroes of DC and Marvel.

• DC's First Superhero: Superman

  Notable Quote:
  Trusty Narrator (05:54): “Did you say Superman? You’re right.”

• Marvel's Early Heroes: Human Torch and Sub-Mariner

  • Human Torch (Jim Hammond): An android, not to be confused with Johnny Storm of the Fantastic Four.
  • Sub-Mariner: Often overshadowed by DC’s Aquaman, but recognized as Marvel’s first mutant character.

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (07:46): “He's actually number one. As in the very first Marvel Comics superhero.”

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Rise and Fall of Superhero Popularity

The conversation transitions to the fluctuating popularity of superheroes over the decades.

• Golden Age of Comics (1940s):

  • Superheroes like Captain America fought real-life adversaries such as Hitler and the Nazis.

• Decline and Transformation:

  • By the late 1940s, superhero popularity waned.
  • 1951: Timely Comics rebranded to Atlas Comics, shifting focus to genres like westerns, horror, and science fiction.

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (08:31): “Which was way before the Avengers.”

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Rebirth and the Marvel Universe

Marvel's resurgence in the 1960s is attributed to the creative genius of Stan Lee and Jack Kirby, who pioneered the concept of a shared universe where superheroes interact more organically.

• Creation of the Marvel Universe:

  • Introduced characters like Spider-Man, the Incredible Hulk, Iron Man, Thor, and the X-Men.
  • Emphasis on realistic personalities and interpersonal dynamics among heroes.

  Notable Quote:
  Trusty Narrator (13:03): “Any ideas? Was it Iron Man? Hulk? Thor? Falcon?”

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Distinctive Differences Between Marvel and DC

The hosts explore what sets Marvel apart from DC, focusing on storytelling techniques and character development.

• Setting:

  • Marvel: Stories often set in real-life locations such as New York City, Los Angeles, and Washington D.C., adding relatability.
  • DC: Utilizes fictional cities like Gotham and Metropolis, fostering a more mythic atmosphere.

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (14:21): “The answer is Marvel stories were set mostly in real life locations. Unlike Gotham or Metropolis, home to Batman and Superman.”

• Character Depth:

  • Marvel: Heroes are portrayed as human and flawed, with intricate and unexpected origin stories.
  • DC: While also rich in character development, often emphasizes archetypal heroism.

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (14:58): “Our superheroes are very human, imperfect characters with interesting and unexpected origin stories.”

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Rivalry and Similarities

Despite their differences, Marvel and DC have influenced each other, leading to similarities in characters and story arcs.

• Comparable Characters:

  • Avengers vs. Justice League
  • Hawkeye vs. Green Arrow
  • Deadpool vs. Deathstroke

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (15:06): “They create very similar characters and powers. For example, the Avengers and the Justice League...”

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Marvel's Financial Struggles and Cinematic Triumph

The episode addresses Marvel's bankruptcy in 1996 and its strategic comeback through the Marvel Cinematic Universe (MCU).

• Bankruptcy and Rebirth:

  • 1996: Marvel Comics declared bankruptcy.
  • MCU Initiation: Starting with "Iron Man" in 2008, Marvel began producing interconnected films leading to massive success.

  Notable Quote:
  Martin Goodman (16:47): “And that's when the Marvel Cinematic Universe began...”

• Impact of the MCU:

  • Grossed over $1.5 billion worldwide.
  • Pioneered a shared storytelling model in cinema.
  • Promoted diversity and inclusion, highlighted by "Black Panther" winning three Oscars in 2018.

  Notable Quote:
  Trusty Narrator (17:45): “Black Panther became the first Marvel movie to win an Academy Award when it took home three Oscars in 2018.”

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Conclusion

Wrapping up the episode, Martin Goodman and the Trusty Narrator celebrate the enduring legacies of Marvel and DC Comics. They emphasize the significance of understanding the historical contexts and creative innovations that have fueled the popularity of superheroes across generations. The episode not only educates but also inspires young minds to appreciate the depth and complexity behind their favorite characters.

Final Notable Quote:
Trusty Narrator (18:21): “Now that's what I call an origin story.”

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Credits and Acknowledgments

The episode concludes with acknowledgments to fans and contributors, highlighting the collaborative effort behind "Who Smarted?" and its mission to make learning fun and accessible.

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This comprehensive summary captures the essence of the episode, providing listeners with a clear and detailed understanding of the historical rivalry between Marvel and DC Comics. By incorporating notable quotes and timestamps, the summary offers valuable insights while maintaining an engaging and educational narrative.

Transcript

[Martin Goodman]

Hey, yo, let me get a large pie with onions.

[Trusty Narrator]

Coming right up. Psst. Hey, smarty pants. That was me working in a pizzeria in New York City in the early 2000s. In between making pies, I spent my time memorizing reference books like encyclopedias, almanacs, atlases, and thesauruses. I even read the dictionary twice. I read anything I could get my hands on as long as there was a whiff of science or history. And whenever someone came in for pizza, I'd tell him a fun fact. Here you go. Enjoy. Also, did you know that human teeth are the only body part that can't heal itself?

[Martin Goodman]

I did not know that. Thanks.

[Trusty Narrator]

One day, a strange man dressed all in black with an eyepatch came in. He enjoyed his pizza and his fun fact. But his real reason for coming wasn't to grab a slice. It was to recruit me to be part of a top secret organization, the Tactical Research Unit serving the youth, otherwise known as Trusty, which spells Trusty. I was put in charge of the narration department. From then on, I became known as the Trusty narrator, helping explain amazing science and history topics to the youth of the world. And that's what's known. An origin story. You know who else is known for their awesome origin stories? None other than the superheroes and supervillains of the Marvel Universe. But how was Marvel created? Who was Marvel Comics first superhero? And what exactly is the Marvel Universe? It's time for a super whiff of science and history on who smarted?

[Martin Goodman]

Who smarted? Who smart? Is it dumb?

[Trusty Narrator]

You?

[Martin Goodman]

Is it me? Is it science or history? Listen up, everyone.

[Trusty Narrator]

We make smarting lots of fun.

[Martin Goodman]

But who's smart?

[Trusty Narrator]

And Psst. Hey, smarty. Families, in particular, the parents and adults listening. If there's one thing we all have in common, it's navigating the world of money. I hate to say it, but money is the number one thing that people in relationships argue over. Yet money is also something most people have a hard time communicating about. Which is why I'm so happy to recommend the Money for Couples podcast, hosted by Ramit Sethi. In each episode, Ramit helps couples stop fighting over money, improve communication, simplify budgeting, manage debt, and start building a shared financial future. Money for Couples offers real, actionable advice with stories from real couples facing the same financial challenges you might be dealing with. Like a recent episode, I heard about a couple that was constantly in debt because one of them couldn't stop spending money and avoided talking about it. Ramit approaches each situation without judgment, but rather with Good, solid advice on how to educate yourself about money and build better financial habits. Oh, and ramit even offers amazing tips on how to educate your kids about healthy money habits. So search for money for couples, wherever you're listening to who smarted and start building your rich life today. Before the huge blockbuster movies starring your favorite superheroes, the only place you could find them were in the pages of comic books. Can you name the two major publishers of comic books? Why, there's Marvel, of course. Home of spider man, Iron man, Captain America, Thor, Black widow, doctor strange, Black panther, and many more. And the other is dc, home to Superman, Batman, Wonder woman, Aquaman, the flash, and others. And just like the greeks and Romans, each had their own gods. The original superheroes. These two titans, Marvel and dc, became known as the big two in the comic publishing world. So, smarty pants, which is older, Marvel or DC Comics? Did you say Marvel? Sorry, the answer is DC. DC Comics began in 1934, five years before Marvel. But guess what? Neither DC or Marvel started out with those names. Just like Carol Danvers started out as Ms. Marvel before becoming Captain Marvel. Both DC and Marvel comics were originally published under different names. DC was originally called Nationally Allied Publications. They didn't become DC until 1977, taking the name DC from the popular detective comics series featuring a superhero you may have heard of named Batman. As for Marvel comics, see if you can guess what name it originally published as. Was it A, super comics, B, Timely comics, C, Captain comics, or D, Marvelous comics? The answer, somewhat surprisingly, is B. Timely comics.

[Martin Goodman]

Whoa. That's right. I started timely comics in 1939.

[Trusty Narrator]

Oh, hey, who are you?

[Martin Goodman]

The name's Goodman. Martin Goodman. I started Timely comics because I saw how popular superhero comics were becoming the year before nationally allied publications put out their first costume superhero comic. And it was a huge hit.

[Trusty Narrator]

Smarty pants. Any idea who this first costumed hero for the company that later became DC was? Did you say superman? Your right.

[Martin Goodman]

Before superheroes, I used to publish something called pulp magazines. They were filled with pictures with fictional stories. And they were called pulp magazines because they were printed on this cheap wood pulp paper. But after Superman took off, I wanted in on the superhero action.

[Trusty Narrator]

In October of 1939, Timely Comics released its first comic book, Marvel Comics 1. And it featured the debut or introduction of several superhero characters. See if you can guess who they were. I'll say a superhero. And you call out yes or no if you think they were in the first comic book made by what became Marvel or not. Ready? Here we go. Spider man, Iron Man, Hulk Thor, The Human Torch, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Submariner. So how'd you do? There's a good chance you're saying, huh? The Submariner, an ocean based superhero, was once fairly popular, but he was eclipsed by his DC underwater rival, Aquaman. In fact, of all the Marvel and DC characters, Sub Mariner and Aquaman are most similar in powers and backstories. But while Aquaman now stars in his own movies, Sub Mariner is fairly forgotten. As for the Human Torch, you may have heard of him as a member of Marvel's the Fantastic Four. There's just one problem. It's a totally different Human Torch.

[Martin Goodman]

Yeah, the original Human Torch is not Johnny Storm of the Fantastic Four. He's actually an Android named Jim Hammond. But while he might not be part of the Fantastic Four, he's actually number one. As in the very first Marvel Comics superhero. And the Sub Mariner is officially the first Marvel mutant character.

[Trusty Narrator]

Wow. So before Captain America or the X Men, there was the Human Torch and Submariner.

[Martin Goodman]

Yep. But when Captain America was created during the golden age of comics in the 1940s, he teamed up with both of them to form a superhero team called the Invaders.

[Trusty Narrator]

Which was way before the Avengers.

[Martin Goodman]

Oh, yeah. And most of the Marvel superheroes fought against not just super villains, but also real life villains of the day, like Hitler and the Nazis.

[Trusty Narrator]

And from there, superheroes have just gotten more and more popular, right?

[Martin Goodman]

Uh, not quite Believe it or not, by the end of the 1940s, people were getting sick of superheroes. In 1951, Timely Comics changed its name to Atlas magazine and put out mostly westerns, horror, war, science fiction, and humor magazines.

[Trusty Narrator]

I'm not hearing superheroes.

[Martin Goodman]

Nope. By the mid-1950s, that was it for Marvel Comics.

[Trusty Narrator]

Oh, wow. So what happened?

[Martin Goodman]

Marvel was saved by a superhero.

[Trusty Narrator]

Smarty pants. Any ideas? Was it Iron Man? Hulk? Thor? Falcon?

[Martin Goodman]

Try Superman.

[Trusty Narrator]

What? But he's with your rival.

[Martin Goodman]

I know. But in 1956, what became DC Comics ushered in what's known as the Silver age of comics by introducing the Flash, Green Arrow, the Justice League, and better quality stories and illustrations of their core heroes. Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, and of course, Superman. When these DC titles found commercial success, it was time for Marvel to be reborn, literally. Atlas changed its name to Marvel Comics in 1961 and began crafting what became known as the Marvel Comics Universe, which eventually became the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Everyone knows today.

[Trusty Narrator]

Gotcha. But, smarty pants, do you know what is meant by the Marvel Universe? Stick around. We'll have the answer in a Flash or Quicksilver. Hey everyone. Trusty here. One of the things I love about hosting who Smarted Is getting to answer all those amazing questions from curious smartypants. And that's why I'm excited to tell you about another show that does exactly that, our Friends Podcast. But why a podcast for curious kids? Have you ever asked something like why does the wind blow? Or do skyscrapers actually scrape the sky? And you weren't quite sure of the answer? Well, but why has you covered. They've answered questions from over 16,000 kids across 90 countries and they're not afraid to tackle any topic, even the gross ones that make grown ups squirm. I mean, they have whole episodes about poop and making paint from spit and rocks. How cool is that? Their team gets real experts to answer real questions from real kids like you. So if your family loves learning interesting stuff on who Smarted, you'll definitely want to check out but why? You can find but why? Wherever you get your podcasts.

[Seth]

Hey there who Smarted Fans, if you love exciting adventures, magical worlds, and stories that spark your imagination, you are going to love the Storyland Podcast. I'm Seth, the creator of Storyland, a podcast where kids like you can dive into incredible stories filled with wonder, mystery, and a whole lot of fun. From rocket powered vans and enchanted forests to talking animals and time traveling adventures, there's always something amazing waiting for you in the Storyland Podcast. And the best part? These stories are made for kids and parents to enjoy together with immersive sound effects and music that brings every tale to life. Whether you're at home in the car or winding down for bedtime, Storyland is here to whisk you away to a world of pure adventure. So what are you waiting for? Grab your imagination and let's explore Storyland together. Just search for Storyland Podcast on your favorite podcast app and start listening today.

[Trusty Narrator]

Now back to who Smarted? Whether you're a fan of Marvel Comics movies or both, you'll notice Marvel superheroes pretty much all exist in the same universe.

[Martin Goodman]

The shared storytelling idea known as the Marvel Universe was first unveiled in 1961 and came to define Marvel Comics. But to fully create the idea, I brought in two Marvel Comics legends, writer Stan Lee and artist Jack Kirby. Lee and Kirby attempted to make their comic book characters more original by allowing them to interact with each other in a realistic way that meant arguing or even fighting with each other.

[Trusty Narrator]

This trend continued as the newly renamed Marvel Comics introduced new characters throughout the early 1960s that included fan favorites like Spider man, the Incredible Hulk, Hulk Smash Iron Man, Thor and the X Men. Stan Lee wrote the majority of Marvel's stories during this time. But besides the Marvel Universe, there was another distinction or difference between Marvel and DC Comics. Smarty pants, do you know what that was? I'll give you a hint. Location, location, location. Did you get it, smarty pants? Goodman.

[Martin Goodman]

The answer is Marvel stories were set mostly in real life locations. Unlike Gotham or Metropolis, home to Batman and Superman. Spider man and the Avengers Tower are set in New York City. Captain America, Deadpool, Tony Stark and Bruce Banner live in Los Angeles, Hawkeye lives in Iowa, and The agents of SHIELD's base is in Washington DC.

[Trusty Narrator]

Trust me, I'm familiar with it.

[Martin Goodman]

Right, your origin story. Speaking of, that's something else that sets Marvel apart.

[Trusty Narrator]

Huh?

[Martin Goodman]

Our superheroes are very human, imperfect characters with interesting and unexpected origin stories.

[Trusty Narrator]

Sure. Of course, some critics have noted that both Marvel and DC imitate each other a lot and create very similar characters and powers. For example, the Avengers and the Justice League, Hawkeye and Green Arrow, Wasp and Bumblebee, Deadpool and Deathstroke, Wonder Woman and she, Hulk, Submariner and Aquaman. Fantastic Four and Doom Patrol, Norman, the Green Goblin, Osborn and the Joker, Thanos and Darkseid, Quicksilver and Flash, Superman and Thor.

[Martin Goodman]

Alright, alright. There's only so much you can do. They've got a strong person, we got a strong person, but they don't have anyone like our number one selling superhero. Hey, smarty pants, can you guess who that is? Is it Iron Man, Hulk, Captain America, or Spider Man? Did you say Spider Man? Good job. There's nobody like Spidey.

[Trusty Narrator]

Well, DC did have a spider based superhero named Tarantula two decades before the first Spider man comic came out. He didn't possess spider powers, but he did walk on walls and shoot webs thanks to a special suit he made.

[Martin Goodman]

Moving on.

[Trusty Narrator]

For several decades, Marvel and DC were the top companies in the superhero business. But in the 1990s, sales slumped and Marvel Comics even declared bankruptcy in 1996. Once again, it looked like things were over for Marvel.

[Martin Goodman]

But just like any true superhero, when things look darkest, that's when they find the strength to battle back.

[Trusty Narrator]

And battle back. Marvel did slowly at first, with a few movies that did good, but not great, especially compared to the blockbusters they put out today. There was the Fantastic Four, Daredevil and Elektra and the Hulk. The only superhero to consistently perform well was, of course, Spider Man. But Marvel needed to make more than just Spider man movies.

[Martin Goodman]

And that's when the Marvel Cinematic Universe began. Instead of individual stories. Marvel began making movies featuring their most popular characters that differed from previous efforts by setting them all in a shared world, starting with Iron man, then the Hulk, then Thor and Captain America, and building towards the Avengers, which featured all of them together. Marvel grossed more than $1.5 billion worldwide.

[Trusty Narrator]

And from there, the Marvel Cinematic Universe, or MCU, grew into one of the biggest and most lucrative franchises in film history. With an eye on diversity and inclusion, Marvel is packing theaters, setting streaming records, and dominating television with both known and relatively unknown characters. Black Panther became the first Marvel movie to win an Academy Award when It took home three Oscars in 2018. Today, there have been 29 movies and 16 TV series in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, with many more on the way.

[Martin Goodman]

Wow.

[Trusty Narrator]

Now that's what I call an origin story.

[Martin Goodman]

Speaking of, I just have one question for you.

[Trusty Narrator]

What?

[Martin Goodman]

Can I get a mushroom pepperoni pizza to go?

[Trusty Narrator]

A super special shout out to whosmarted super fans Sydney, Nicholas and Matthew, part of a military family in Silverdale, Washington. We appreciate your family service and your smarting with us. This episode. Marvel Comics was written by Adam Tex Davis and voiced by Adam Daredevil Davis and Jerry Colbert. Technical direction and sound design by Josh Hawkeye Han who Smarted is recorded and mixed at the Relic Room Studios. Our associate producer is Max Cobra Kamasky. The theme song is by Brian Scarlet Witch Suarez with lyrics written and performed by Adam Tex Davis who Smarted was created and produced by Adam Tex Davis and Captain Jerry Colbert. This has been an Atomic Entertainment production.

[Martin Goodman]

Too.

[Seth]

Smart Eddie.