Wild Card with Rachel Martin – Ann Patchett
Date: December 25, 2025
Host: Rachel Martin (NPR)
Guest: Ann Patchett (Author)
Episode Overview
In this intimate and thought-provoking episode of Wild Card, acclaimed novelist Ann Patchett sits down with Rachel Martin to answer deep, unexpected questions chosen at random from a deck of cards. Eschewing small talk, the conversation dives into formative childhood memories, the intricacies of love and acceptance, wrestling with faith and identity, the courage to critique one’s own work, and the meaning—or irrelevance—of legacy. Patchett’s candor, warmth, and wry humor shape a conversation full of memorable moments and honest insights into the writer’s mind and heart.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
Growing Up on a Farm: Childhood, Solitude, and Selling Moss
[02:44–04:49]
- Patchett’s rural childhood: Ann describes living on a quirky, animal-filled non-working farm near Nashville. The unconventional menagerie included her own pig (a gift inspired by Charlotte’s Web) and chickens named after Nixon’s cabinet members.
- “It was just a very animal-laden, isolated life. And because I'm an introvert, that worked out fine for me.” — Ann [03:31]
- Entrepreneurial spirit: At age 10, Ann created a moss business, collecting and selling moss to local florists, making “a lot more money off of moss than you do lemonade.” [04:17]
- Memorable advice: Her mother’s warning—“Remember, the rattlesnakes are blind when they're molting...they can't see you, so they're more likely to strike”—epitomizes the offbeat wisdom of her upbringing. [04:10]
Parental Influence: The Love of Books
[05:13–06:24]
- Modeling reading: Patchett credits all four of her parents (mother, father, stepmother, stepfather) for instilling in her a love of books, not through reading aloud but by example.
- “I have later found out that that is actually more important than reading to children, that children see adults reading and engaged in relationships with books.” — Ann [05:24]
- First Book Love: Unsurprisingly, her favorite childhood book was Charlotte’s Web, leading not only to her beloved pig but also a lasting love of storytelling. [06:08–06:09]
Learning to Be Alone, Finding Contentment in Solitude
[07:00–11:29]
- Rachel shares how she learned to be alone while living in Japan after college, evolving from loneliness into a craving for solitude as a parent. [07:32–08:44]
- Ann’s perspective: She never wanted children, sensing early that she thrived in quiet. She recounts a formative Christmas spent alone house-sitting during graduate school, where knitting, books, and solitude brought genuine joy.
- “That was a very, very joyful alone.” — Ann [11:14]
Annotating Bel Canto: Honesty, Critique, and Vulnerability
[13:13–17:41]
- Why annotate? Revisiting her most acclaimed novel, Patchett published an annotated edition filled with candid marginalia—critiques and praise for her younger self’s writing:
- “Bel Canto is so far away that I could say, look at this hard thing that I did. I did this really well. Look at this easy thing that I did. I did this really poorly.” — Ann [13:52]
- Self-vulnerability: She muses on public versus private vulnerability and jokes about the absurdity of rewriting the book as “Bel Canto Taylor’s Version.”
- “What if I just open up a new file and rewrite it? What if I just do it right?... But then people would always say, oh, no, it was better before.” — Ann [17:09–17:19]
Comfort with Being Wrong
[17:46–18:59]
- Ann’s philosophy: She welcomes being wrong, especially about “big things” like climate change or the world’s problems:
- “There’s so many things you want to be wrong about. I want to be wrong about climate change. I want to be wrong about the state of our nation... I hope to be wrong.” — Ann [18:05]
- Practical wrongness: With a self-deprecating joke: “I have a terrible sense of direction. So at least five times a day, I am wrong.” [18:38]
Expressions of Love & the Influence of Greg Boyle
[19:23–22:43]
- Striving for acceptance: Ann wants to express love as her husband does, with “complete blanket acceptance.”
- “I work very hard to not fix and to just see the people in my life and accept them for who they are and love them for who they are.” — Ann [19:31]
- Greg Boyle’s philosophy: She’s inspired by the Jesuit priest’s radical acceptance:
- “Everyone is perfect the way they are, everyone is beloved, everyone is accepted, no matter what.” — Ann [20:43]
- Dedication anecdotes: She shares a publishing near-miss—rescinding a book dedication to an ex before it went to print, and later, dedicating Bel Canto to her now-husband even before they married, trusting the relationship implicitly. [21:37–22:58]
Faith, Catholicism, and the Mystery of God
[25:07–30:43]
- Rachel’s and Ann’s spiritual evolution: The women discuss their shifting relationships with faith, belief, and religious identity.
- Ann on God: Profound humility underscores Ann’s approach:
- “I still believe in God. And here's the thing. If I tried to tell you what that meant, I would be wrong. The only thing I know for sure is that whatever I know is wrong.” — Ann [25:12 & 28:02]
- “It seems very possible to me that being alive is God, and...the trick is whether or not we know it.” — Ann [26:15]
- Catholic identity despite dissonance: Ann sees herself as Catholic much like she remains Tennessean or American—claiming the label while acknowledging disagreement and discomfort:
- “I am still a Catholic, and there is an enormous amount about Catholicism that I don't believe and am appalled by. I am still an American, and there is an enormous amount about being an American that I don't believe in and that I am appalled by. I am a Tennessean…” — Ann [28:33]
- Advice on religion: She recalls a formative conversation with a teacher who told her:
- “Don’t waste your time picking out your luggage. Just go on the trip.” — Ann [29:10]
Legacy and Letting Go
[30:47–32:13]
- No concern for legacy: Ann is nonchalant about her posthumous impact:
- “No.” — Ann, on whether she worries about legacy [30:50]
- “Don’t humor yourself into thinking that you have control over things over which you have no control.” — Ann [31:14]
- Wry practicality about estate planning: A lawyer’s hypothetical about someone else inheriting her royalties is met with a laugh: “I'm dead. Why do I care?” [31:14]
Time Machine: A Moment to Linger In
[32:42–35:03]
- Lingering with the moss: After some gentle deliberation, Ann chooses her farm childhood, sitting in the woods with her moss and animals, as her moment to revisit and savor:
- “Those moments of nature and complete silence, those moments before anything called me away to do something else...that sense of time when no one’s going to call you until it’s dark.” [33:40]
- “It’s a real Charlotte’s Web kind of world. A girl and her pig out in the countryside.” [34:40]
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- On childhood entrepreneurship:
- “You make a lot more money off of moss than you do lemonade, Rachel.” — Ann [04:17]
- On the fallibility of human knowledge:
- “If I tried to tell you what that meant, I would be wrong. The only thing that I know for sure is that whatever I know is wrong.” — Ann [25:12]
- On legacy:
- “Don’t humor yourself into thinking that you have control over things over which you have no control.” — Ann [31:14]
- On loving acceptance:
- “All I need to do is not say to my husband, maybe you want to wear a coat? It’s a little cold.” — Ann [21:10]
- On faith and labels:
- “I am still a Catholic, and there is an enormous amount about Catholicism that I don't believe and am appalled by. I am still an American...I am a Tennessean...But I am those things.” — Ann [28:33]
- On what matters most:
- “What matters is that we do our best with the life that we have, that we show up, that we love each other, and that we try to be as aware as is humanly possible of the life and the gift that we're given.” — Ann [30:15]
- On the purpose of religion:
- “Don’t waste your time picking out your luggage. Just go on the trip.” — Ann’s teacher, relayed by Ann [29:10]
Timestamps for Key Segments
- [02:44] – Ann’s childhood farm and the moss business
- [05:13] – Parental modeling of loving books
- [07:00] – Discussion of solitude and how both women learned to be alone
- [13:13] – Why Ann annotated Bel Canto
- [17:46] – On comfort with being wrong
- [19:23] – Expressions of love and Greg Boyle’s philosophy
- [21:37] – The wild dedication stories
- [25:07] – How Ann’s feelings about God have evolved
- [28:33] – Catholic identity and the meaning of belonging
- [30:47] – The irrelevance of legacy
- [32:42] – “Time machine” closing: A moment to linger in childhood woods
Tone & Style
The conversation is marked by Ann’s thoughtful, wry, and vulnerable storytelling, with Rachel’s empathetic interviewing drawing out self-reflection and philosophical musings. The playful card structure ensures surprising, honest responses, while Ann’s humility, openness to being wrong, and love of solitude provide a rich portrait not just of an accomplished writer, but of a wise and deeply human person.
For listeners seeking more than a standard author interview, this episode offers refreshing candor, philosophical insight, and one of the more memorable discussions about faith, self-acceptance, and letting go of control. It’s a reminder, as the best Wild Card episodes are, that our humanity is shaped as much by our questions as our answers.