Podcast Summary: "Raphael Bob-Waksberg doesn’t forgive, but he forgets"

Wild Card with Rachel Martin (NPR)
Air Date: September 11, 2025
Guest: Raphael Bob-Waksberg, creator of BoJack Horseman and Long Story Short

Episode Overview

In this unique and candid episode of Wild Card, Rachel Martin sits down with acclaimed showrunner and writer Raphael Bob-Waksberg for a conversation driven by random prompts from the show’s signature deck of cards. The episode explores Bob-Waksberg’s approach to creativity, grief, faith, parenting, and the tension between remembering and forgiving. The discussion also dives into his latest animated series Long Story Short, examining themes of family, religion, and the complexity of memory—all while maintaining the playful, insightful tone that defines both his work and this podcast.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Growing Up, Imagination, and Comedy

• Boredom and Imagination
  [02:01]

  • Raphael describes being perpetually bored due to ADD, likening it to a superpower:

    "I'm always a little bit bored... like in the Avengers when Mark Ruffalo goes, 'That's my secret. I'm always angry.' I do feel like I have learned to have multiple apps going on in my brain at the same time in any context or conversation. And I have also learned to view it as a positive because it's happening whether I like it or not." (Raphael, 02:01)

  • As a child, Raphael dealt with boredom by turning inward—making comics, inventing songs, or daydreaming—but this occasionally led to trouble at school.

    "I never knew before I did something: is this gonna be funny enough that I'm going to get away with it, or is the teacher going to get real mad at me?" (Raphael, 03:59)

• Formative Memory of Parental Vulnerability
  [05:20]

  • Raphael recalls realizing his mother was "only human" after breaking her glasses and seeing her cry as a child:

    "That's my memory of it is realizing, oh, she is also a person." (Raphael, 06:35)

• Having Adults Who Don’t Talk Down
  [07:41]

  • Raphael credits a high school theater teacher, Mr. Shelby, for genuinely "getting him" and channeling his energy productively—something he strives to model as a parent.

    "He really understood how to... focus my passions and instincts in the right direction and create rather than destroy." (Raphael, 08:24)

  • Raphael shares a joke from his son, showcasing humor and kindness in his parenting:

    "[My son says,] 'No, because you’re my friend, but other people I would interrupt.' So I think he’s a funny guy." (Raphael, 09:42)

On "Long Story Short", Animation, and Grief

[11:42–17:10]

• Pitching the Show

  • Rachel confesses to "cheating" on her son by watching Long Story Short ahead of him, prompting a discussion about the show's multilayered family and narrative:

    "It's an animated family and they're Jewish and they're religious and it's philosophical and... Isn't that a good TV show?" (Rachel, 12:42) "A lot of what you just said is how I pitched it, except I didn't end with, is that a good TV show?... I probably landed a little more declaratively and with a period." (Raphael, 13:11)

• Narrative Structure

  • The show's unique timeline, with each episode in a different year and POV character:

    "The gag of the show is gonna be jumping around in time and there is no home base... you get to the end of 10 episodes and you feel like you've known them for a lifetime." (Raphael, 13:27)

• Exploring Grief

  • Grief operates as a thematic through-line. Rachel and Raphael discuss whether relationships can change after someone passes and how one continues to learn about lost loved ones:

    "Can your relationship with somebody change after they have died? Or how do you repair some of those relationships that maybe weren't quite what you wanted them to be in life? Is it too late to repair that within yourself, if not with the other person?" (Raphael, 14:49)

• Lightness in Heavy Themes

  • The balance between heavy themes and the lightness of animation, with credit to Raphael’s collaborator Lisa Hanawalt:

    "On that show [BoJack], I could go to these really dark, deep places... and somehow in animation, you're able to take it in a little easier... Actually, the opposite extremes really work together to create something new." (Raphael, 15:42–16:40)

Insights: Forgiveness, Conflict, and Endings

[18:54–23:23]

• On Forgiveness

  • The episode circles back to forgiveness multiple times. Raphael’s approach is unconventional:

    "People say, 'I forgive, but I don't forget.' I'm the opposite. I don't forgive, but I do forget. So that eventually turns around to forgiveness cause I've stopped fixating on it." (Raphael, 19:38)

• Handling Conflict

  • Raphael admits that his instinct is to "step back" in moments of conflict, often overthinking rather than confronting:

    "I kind of extrapolate all the different ways it could go wrong, and I think I step back in moments of conflict." (Raphael, 20:52)

  • As a boss, conflict is "not really a conflict" due to hierarchical decision-making, but personal conflicts prompt him to linger in indecision while others move on.

• Knowing When to End

  • When asked about endings:

    "I think I'm good at knowing when this line of conversation should end. And I think we've reached the end..." (Raphael, 23:04)

  • This meta humor punctuates the show's playfulness.

Beliefs: God, Religion, and Community

[25:15–30:13]

• Evolution of Belief

  • Raphael describes gradually moving from being a believer in childhood to agnostic or atheist in adulthood:

    "When I was a kid, I believed in God. I don't now." (Raphael, 25:44)

  • He distinguishes his Jewish upbringing from Christian-centric faith structures—emphasizing community, tradition, and culture over individual belief:

    "A lot of the ways we talk about religion in our society is kind of viewed through a Christian lens. And I think... faith is very much an important facet... that was never in my experience, a real tenet of Judaism." (Raphael, 26:02)

• Religion as Connection

  • Continuing rituals as a way to connect with lost loved ones:

    "I do these things... I remember them. Rituals, yes. I light the candles, I eat the challah... And it feels like I am part of a thread, and that continues through my children..." (Raphael, 29:51)

Grief, Memory, and Creative Process

[30:46–37:11]

• Portraying Grief in Storytelling

  • Citing a storyline from Long Story Short:

    "There's a line about grief on the show... 'it isn't a straight line.' And I think that has been so much of what I have had to grapple with through my experiences with grief..." (Raphael, 32:08)

• On “Living a Good Life”

  • The central, unanswerable question motivating his work:

    "If I knew the answer, I wouldn't have to write anymore... I think it boils down to being kind to people... to leave this place a little better than where you found it." (Raphael, 34:09-35:03)

  • His advice to his own child:

    "Be kind and curious and brave. And I think those are... a good first step." (Raphael, 35:12)

• Lingering in the Present

  • Asked about a moment he'd relive, Raphael resists nostalgia:

    "I feel like it's hard for me to want to be in any moment other than where I'm at right now... I'd rather have the memory. I'd rather live now in the present with the memories of all that I've experienced." (Raphael, 36:06-37:11)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On his creative “superpower”:

  "I'm always a little bit bored." (Raphael, 02:01)

• On forgiveness:

  "I don't forgive, but I do forget. So that eventually turns around to forgiveness because I've stopped fixating on it." (Raphael, 19:38)

• On religious identity:

  "I think what I hold dear in my own religious practice is the cultural aspect of it." (Raphael, 29:00)

• On grief not being linear:

  "It isn't a straight line. And I think that has been so much of what I have had to grapple with through my experiences with grief..." (Raphael, 32:08)

• On living a good life:

  "It boils down to being kind to people... holding the door open for the people who come after you." (Raphael, 35:03)

• On being present:

  "I'd rather live now in the present with the memories of all that I've experienced." (Raphael, 36:41)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 02:01 — Boredom, ADD, and creative imagination
• 06:35 — Childhood memory: realizing parents are human
• 07:41 — Theater teacher’s influence
• 11:42 — Discussion of Long Story Short
• 14:49 — Exploring grief in the show
• 19:38 — Approach to forgiveness
• 20:52 — Handling conflict
• 23:04 — Knowing when to end things
• 25:44 — Evolving beliefs about God and religion
• 29:51 — Rituals as connection to lost loved ones
• 32:08 — Grief as a nonlinear process
• 34:09 — "What does it mean to live a good life?"
• 36:41 — Reflections on choosing the present

Overall Tone & Style

The conversation is warm, self-deprecating, and humorously reflective—much like Raphael Bob-Waksberg’s body of work. The back-and-forth is playful, sometimes irreverent, but always grounded in authentic inquiry about what it means to live, remember, grieve, and create with meaning. The “Wild Card” format encourages spontaneous, often vulnerable, philosophical dialogue.

Recommendation:
Listeners interested in creativity, memory, family, and the intersection of humor and existential inquiry will find this episode both relatable and thought-provoking. Fans of BoJack Horseman or those curious about how animated storytelling can tackle profound human themes will particularly enjoy Bob-Waksberg’s candor and insights.