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- [00:00]
Cabot Phillips
Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile. Now, I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back.
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Mark Schneider
So I thought it would be fun
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Cabot Phillips
if we made $15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment
- [00:22]
Mary Margaret Olivhan
of $45 for three months, $90 for six months or $180 for a 12 month plan.
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Cabot Phillips
Required $15 per month equivalent taxes and
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Mary Margaret Olivhan
fees Extra initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes.
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Georgia Howe
Me slow when network is busy See
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Cabot Phillips
terms well, good evening everybody, and welcome to Wired In. I'm Cabot Phillips, coming to you live from Daily Wire hq. Thanks for spending your Thursday with us on today's show. We're going to get you the latest from a packed day at the White House and on Capitol Hill. We'll tell you what the renewed fighting in the Middle east is going to mean for gas prices here at home. A new program from OpenAI just went rogue, escaping a sealed testing environment and hacking its way onto the open Internet. We'll talk with the tech expert about the wild west of AI, what's being done to prevent a doomsday scenario, and AOC is hinting for the first time that she is eyeing a 2028 presidential run. We'll tell you what that might look like. And of course, stick around until the very end of the show for our live listener Q and A. If you're a Daily Wire member, get those questions in the chat right now. If you're on Apple or Spotify, go become a member now and join the live chat@dailywire.com subscribe. All right, let's close the week out strong. How about it? Roll that graphic. And just a reminder, Wired In Live is Now streaming at 4pm Eastern Monday through Thursday. Get daily coverage of the news happening right now here, why it all matters and talk with experts who are actually in the story. Become a member and join the live chat@dailywire.com subscribe. All right, let's start things off in D.C. with our wonderful Daily Wire White House correspondent, Mary Margaret Olihan. Mary Margaret, it's great to see you.
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Mary Margaret Olivhan
Great to see you too, Cavett.
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Cabot Phillips
So you were jumping all over the country yesterday on Air Force One. I must confess, every time I see an Instagram story of you flying on Air Force One, I do get a little jealous. Just a little bit. So tell us first what you were doing. There was A very somber event that you attended in Dover. What did you see there?
- [02:23]
Mary Margaret Olivhan
Yes, so yesterday morning, we went on Air Force One, the new Air Force One, actually, and I can get to that in a second to Dover in Delaware, on Dover Air Force Base, where the President attended the dignified transfer of four of our fallen soldiers. That was First Lieutenant Tyler Feehan, Sergeant Michael E. Swinton, Sergeant Angel Rampersad, and Private Isabella Gonzalez. All four of these fallen soldiers were honored in this dignified transfer event at Dover. All of their families were there. And. Oh, my gosh, Cabot. I knew this would be sad going into it, but I had no idea what it would be like to actually stand there in person. It's dead quiet except for the instructions and the directions of the service members who are officiating the event. The family got off the buses. They had some privacy and space between the media and the bus that was kind of protecting them from our view. And even still, as the casket would come down, you know, the Runway of this plane where they were being kept, and we would see the casket appear, the family members would be able to tell which service member it was. And you would just hear from behind this bus these wails and this sadness coming from some of these family members. And I'm told that, you know, part of the reason that the media is not actually allowed to film the family members or. Or all of that necessarily, that space, is because in the past, some family members are so overcome with grief at seeing the casket of their loved one that they might run out or they might do something that we shouldn't be filming or we shouldn't be capturing. So there were very strict rules around this dignified transfer. And I know that I myself was weeping as we watched it. And some of the other reporters who were with me were as well, so just very moving. And you can tell that the President, too, was incredibly moved by the ceremony. Really sad. And he talked about afterwards how it's the hardest thing that he has to do is to meet with these family members and talk to them about the loss of their loved ones. So really sad morning there. And then we all got back on the plane and we headed down to Georgia. Now, something very special about that is, as we were leaving, one of the reporters noticed that two of the family members were talking to the president and they weren't going back with the rest of the family to get on this bus at Dover and head back to their homes. Well, turns out that the President found out that these two mother and father of Tyler Feehan were from Georgia, which is where we were headed. And so President Trump said that he told them he would like to give them a ride. He brought them on Air Force One with us, took them to Georgia, brought them to this campaign event. Well, not a campaign event. That's not what they're calling. It was a Trump accounts event in Georgia. And he brought them, had them, gave them VIP seats in the crowd. And then during this event, he didn't call them up on the stage because I think that would have been a little too much for them as they're still grieving their son. But he did honor their son in front of this crowd of thousands of people. And he did say that he's so impressed by them and by their bravery and their love for their son. And the entire arena burst into cheers and clapped for this couple who you can see on video, they're very cheerful, very emotional, but oh, my gosh, just such a beautiful moment as all of these Americans honor the parents of one of our fallen soldiers. It gets me choked up just thinking about it.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, it was a very emotional video to see that family there. And a nice gesture from President Trump bringing the family with him on Air Force One. You got the chance, I believe, to ask President Trump a few questions. What did he have to say?
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Mary Margaret Olivhan
Yeah, so we really only got to talk to the president at the beginning of the day. We knew it would be sensitive given the very emotional nature of the day. And our. I, for one, did not want to politicize it. Unfortunately, one of the reporters who I was with right. When the president came up to join us and to take questions from us and share what he was going to do that day? One of the reporters with us immediately politicized the deaths of these fallen soldiers and said to the president, basically, what are you going to say to the families in light of the fact that polling shows that not a lot of people support your war? Now, the president didn't respond very well to that. He was angry at the question. So I followed up with and said merrily, Ms. President, what is your message to the families? Because I wanted to know, and I think many of us want to know what he would say to them as they mourn the loss of their children who fell, you know, were killed in the Middle East. And he told us he was going to tell the families, we love you, we love your children, and more to that effect. So that was really the only gaggle we had with the president yesterday, which we were a little disappointed by. We hoped to talk to him later in the day we did have a little jump scare on the plane. This is something about Air Force One that's fun when you're on the plane. We're all sitting in our seats. And by the way, the new Air Force One has massage chairs. I never thought that I would be saying such a thing. But there are buttons you can press on those chairs to relax a little more. You can put the seat rest all the way up. We each have our own tv and we can watch the news or other possible channels. It's crazy. It's so nice. But while we're sitting there, all of a sudden someone comes back and says, we think he's coming. We think he's coming. So immediately everyone scrambles. I'm kneeling on my chair. We all have our recording devices ready. We're looking at our notes, ready to question the president. And then unfortunately, in this situation, he did not come back. And so we all just were getting already looking like fools. But it has happened before and it will happen again. So it's just one of the exciting parts of being on Air Force One.
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Cabot Phillips
Before we go, you mentioned there are TVs now on the plane. Do they carry CNN?
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Mary Margaret Olivhan
I didn't try and change the channel. So next time I'm on there, I'm gonna check and see. But I wouldn't be surprised if they don't.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, that seems like a Trump move just to tell the press. We will give you TVs, but we're going to control what you're able to watch. No fake news on the plane. Absolutely. I could see him saying, mary Margaret, thank you so much. We're glad you got to do that important reporting. Everyone can go see your dispatch from the trail on Twitter and also on DailyWire.com, so Mary Margaret, again, we appreciate it.
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Mary Margaret Olivhan
Thank you.
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Cabot Phillips
Well, as the war in Iran ramps up once more, as we just discussed, and Houthi rebels in Yemen attack tankers in the Red Sea, the price of oil is again surging. On Thursday, for the first time since May, oil hit $100 a barrel, raising new concerns for millions of Americans here at home. Here. Here with the latest is Tala Gudarzi, former assistant Energy secretary. Tala, great to have you back. Thanks so much for being here.
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Tala Gudarzi
Great to see you. Thanks for having me.
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Cabot Phillips
So we'd seen some positive movement. Oil dropping internationally. Now we're back over $100. Domestically, we're looking, I believe, at $92 was the peak today. Just how significant is this surge in oil prices?
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Tala Gudarzi
It continues to be a repercussion of the choke points that we're seeing. We saw prices rise because of the bl of the Strait. And now we're seeing that because of the Houthis. One, the threat of the Houthis attacking the Red Sea and Saudi ships in the Red Sea. But also since they've done that, we've seen the repercussions of that. And the prices have, have clearly started to go up. And that's, as you know, because oil is priced globally. So everyone feels that risk. Everyone feels all, all of those things that happen in the Strait and now in the Red Sea as well.
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Cabot Phillips
Now, typically, oil prices have been going up because of disruptions, as you said, in the Strait of Hormuz. But this time the disruption is coming in the Bab Ahmedab Strait. That is where these Houthi rebels are attacking Saudi tankers. This is very different than the Strait of Hormuz, which by now we're all familiar with. But what should we know about this other strait?
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Tala Gudarzi
So up until now, actually, Saudi Aramco Saudis have been exporting their max capacity of production through the East West Pipeline. That pipeline actually empties into the Red Sea. And so they were using that to avoid going through this trade. And up until now, actually, even in their first quarter, they experienced great earnings. But now that is now a new choke point and a new impediment to where oil can flow. And so the markets are feeling that. And again, it just makes it a little bit more of a precarious situation as now oil can't go through the Strait of Hormuz. It now can't go through the East West Pipeline that leads into the Red Sea.
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Cabot Phillips
How are the Saudis responding to this latest bit of aggression that we're seeing from the Houthis?
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Tala Gudarzi
Well, I'm sure it causes a lot of anxiety. As mentioned, they've been using it quite a bit and it's been their way to circumnavigate the strait. What's important here and what we continue to see is the importance of infrastructure. And I think that's one lesson that we've learned throughout this conflict. UAE is building out a pipeline to circumnavigate the Strait. Saudi was leading that effort by using the east west pipeline that's now being blocked. And we saw Chevron's recent investment and recent pledge to start to export through Iraq to Syria and out actually into the Mediterranean above. They want to build out the infrastructure to circumnavigate another. Another choke point. And so we see the importance of infrastructure around the world and, you know, hopefully in the future, ways that we can avoid these choke points.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, it's almost reminiscent of COVID When Covid disrupted global supply chains, the United States was almost forced to beef up our own infrastructure and exposed a lot of this reliance on China for pharmaceuticals and all sorts of goods from around the world. It seems like that's almost happening with oil, where a lot of countries are realizing how dependent they are on that oil coming through the Strait of Hormuz. One of the other areas where we've seen increased oil production and access from the US Is Venezuela. Ever since the capture of Maduro, President Trump has been lauding US Efforts to get oil out of Venezuela and bring relief to Americans. What is happening there? Just how much access to Venezuelan oil is the US Seeing?
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Tala Gudarzi
They're seeing a great deal. And as you mentioned, it's a great opportunity for. And the President mentioned today as well, for US Oil and gas companies. You know, there's a fair amount of exploration there, especially in recent months. It's a bit different, though, because, as you know, the Venezuela. Venezuela's oil profile is a little bit different. It's a bit thicker crude, and so it takes a little bit more to extract that oil from the ground and get it to market. So we're kind of feeling that it'll take a little bit more work from our oil companies and other oil companies that are investing in Venezuela to get that product to market, which is why, again, to free up, we can't say it enough to free up the Strait of Hormuz to prevent this sort of blockage that the Houthis are offering. And the Red Sea, it still continues
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Cabot Phillips
to be very important, it seems like. I've talked to a number of GOP lawmakers this month, and the hope seems to be that President Trump can find an off ramp before the midterms. But obviously, even if a piece is reached, it'll still take time for the economy to return to normal. So when do you think is the point of no return where the higher gas prices and inflation will still be felt on election day, or have we already passed that?
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Tala Gudarzi
It's tough to say. You know, the issue is too, we don't have. We the United States, but also the world didn't properly plan, in my opinion, for something. Something like this to happen and that we haven't properly beefed up our reserves. We don't have enough oil in our Europe certainly doesn't. And that was based on the policies and the climate policies that they so heavily pushed over the last couple years. But also we've depleted some of the oil from our strategic Petroleum reserves. And so sort backup emergency reserves are no longer as full as they should be. That's okay. And not something that the American people should, should panic about, but it is felt in the price because the traders that see that see this as an emergency and they reflect that in the price that we see at the pump.
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Cabot Phillips
I'm interested, when you were working directly in the Energy Department, what sort of contingency plans were there in place for if the Strait of Hormuz was blocked the way it is now?
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Tala Gudarzi
Well, in my case, I oversaw the LNG export authorizations. And so we lifted the pause on LNG, the Biden era pause on LNG and got that product to market and approved about 13.7 BCF. And after that we're at 20 BCF I think, per day. And that's new capacity. And so that is really helpful, I think, in terms of our ability to export to the rest of the market. As you know, Qatari LNG is shut off just simply because it can't get through the strait. That's very unfortunate for the rest of the world. But also it's a huge opportunity for us LNG companies to be able to export our gas and our American production to the rest of our allies around the world. And so that's, that's been somewhat helpful, I think.
- [15:49]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. Let's get to the other big story in the Middle east this week. The United States struck a deal that will allow the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia to develop a civilian nuclear program. This got a lot of attention yesterday. President Trump very excited, but obviously there were some folks who were critics. What do you make of this agreement? Tell us more about it.
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Scott Walker
Yes.
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Tala Gudarzi
So this agreement the president announced today at the EPA under the right conditions, which means he would like for Saudi to join the Abraham Accords, which would mean it would normalize relations with Israel. That's important and something that he started in his first term. But also most importantly that they agree to the 123 agreement, which means that they can enrich uranium to develop a nuclear warhead in the future. If they agree to do that. It will certainly put pressure on Iran that Saudi now has the ability to enrich. But also to some extent it would reduce the prices and sort of conflict that I was talking about previously because Saudi will be able to get the production that they need. They won't use it internally, able to export it in terms of their oil. So that's more oil on the open market and that's more ability and cushion for the prices to eventually come down. Of course, that's a long term solution, but I think ultimately a good one.
- [17:09]
Cabot Phillips
Now, one final question. I mentioned critics of this plan. They say that the Saudis developing a nuclear program, even if it's just for civilian use, could set off an arms race in the Middle east where other countries in the region get antsy and say, well, we need our own nuclear program that might not be only for civilian use. Do you think that's a legitimate concern?
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Tala Gudarzi
I think that's a concern, but that's a concern always. I mean, it's a very precarious section of the world. But, you know, I think we'll just have to wait and see. I think anything that puts pressure on Iran and you know how I feel about Iran as someone that's half Iranian, I think anything and any action that the US can do to kind of prevent them from developing a nuclear warhead is important and we should certainly try it not just for ourselves, but the
- [17:56]
Mary Margaret Olivhan
rest of the world.
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Brylon Hollihan
Yeah.
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Cabot Phillips
All right, Tala, thank you very much for the conversation. Really appreciate your insight. Always great to have you on.
- [18:03]
Tala Gudarzi
Thank you.
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Cabot Phillips
All right. Our next guest is a man who I believe to be among the most consequential governors in modern American history. It is Scott Walker, president of Young America's foundation and former governor of the great state of Wisconsin. Governor, great to have you on. Good to be with you.
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Scott Walker
Good to see you. Last time we saw you was up at Ronald Reagan's ranch. We had a great time. Thanks for coming.
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John Bickley
We did.
- [18:26]
Cabot Phillips
I want to get to that. Let's start with that. Your work leading Young America's Foundation. We've been together at a number of events. You guys have been celebrating America 250 all year. We at the Daily Wire, we've been lucky enough to take part in that celebration and partner with you guys at yaf. So just tell folks what y' all have been up to throughout for the last year or so and then what you have coming up.
- [18:47]
Scott Walker
Yeah. Freedom@250.com, if folks are interested, of course, you can go to our website, yafy.org as well. But thanks. You've been a key part of it. We kicked things off right there in Nashville, Tennessee, Country Music hall of Fame. We had no idea how things were going to be. But we thought with the 250th, what better time to celebrate not just America's birthday, but freedom. What our founders risk for those freedoms and really challenge young people as to what they're willing to do, preserve it going forward. And so we had the biggest freedom conference we've ever had in Nashville, had our Spring and now our June conference at the Reagan Ranch was double the size we've had before. We just had the largest crowd we've ever had at Dixon, Illinois, at Ron Reagan's Boy at Home, where we have a massive block party with high schoolers, middle schoolers and others. And in just a few weeks, again, another partnership, the Daily Wire. Ben Shapiro is going to join us. We're going to be at Mount Vernon, George Washington's Mount Vernon. In fact, in addition to Ben, one of our guests is former British Prime Minister Boris Johnson. I'm wondering if we could convince him to wear a red coat, come on out and just rip it off like Hulk Hogan and say, no, no, we were once enemies, now we're on the same side to save Western civilization. But all those things, plus another great stop in Philadelphia are part of this year long focus on Freedom at 250.
- [19:59]
Cabot Phillips
It has been one of the highlights of my year getting to go to these events, mainly because there's so many young people who are there that just love America, but also because there's nothing I love more than a USA chant. And these rallies. Anywhere you go, you can just say usa and within seconds the entire crowd will be chanting usa. It is a lot of fun.
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Scott Walker
Kids body surf in red, white and blue with the American flag on. That's not something you expect all the time, but it happens there.
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Cabot Phillips
That is not an exaggeration. There were kids body surfing. As you mentioned. We were together last month at the home of former President Reagan. And I heard you make the case to the I don't even know a thousand high school students who were there. And you were saying, look, the GOP must embrace the principles of President Reagan. There's no doubt that the MAGA movement, especially on economics, is quite different from that of President Reagan. So do you think the GOP has permanently shifted on those economic issues or do you believe that they're gonna revert back after President Trump leaves office?
- [20:56]
Scott Walker
Well, I think there's a merging of the two. It's not by mistake that every time you look in the Oval Office where President Trump is sitting at the Resolute desk over his left shoulder, he could have put anyone, but he put a portrait of Ronald Reagan there. I think that's intentional. You think of peace through strength. Certainly he's adopted that policy. You think even economically massive tax cuts continue to cut Red tape, reining in the federal government through doge. Those were things that Ronald Reagan did and would only dream of doing more of now. Now, obviously on a few things, like trade. Ronald Reagan was very outspoken on free trade, although, remember, he did use tariffs against Japan when they were pushing back in terms of unfair trade. So there are similarities there. But long term, he was very much a free trader. I think Donald Trump is too. He's an international businessman. I think he just wants to have a fair, level playing field. And I think you're gonna see a merging of what many of us think of as Reagan Republicans, along with Donald Trump's movement with magna.
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Cabot Phillips
You've spent years fighting for conservative values on college campuses. And I've heard you say for years now, hey, this stuff is going to bleed out from college classrooms into the mainstream. What you're seeing from professors is going to be what you see in the boardroom. It's going to be what you see in Congress. And there's no doubt that has happened. We're now seeing socialism have this moment where it's becoming mainstream. In your experience, what has been the message that works with dissuading the thousands and tens of thousands of young people that you meet every year from falling for socialism?
- [22:30]
Scott Walker
Well, I think part of the key is not only the logic, but trying to get people on our side, like Daniel DiMartino, like Yami park, people who've come from socialist and communist nations where it's failed. Venezuela right now is probably the best example. When I grew up, it was the old Soviet Union. When it was communism, the failures there Eastern bloc countries again. Thankfully, Ronald Reagan led the charge to bring that down. Not only the tearing down of the wall, but of the principles of the things that oppress the people on the other side of the wall and all throughout the Eastern bloc countries. But today, Venezuela is a prime example. This is a country that elected Hugo Chavez a democratic socialist. Those were his words, not mine. A democratic socialist in a free and open election in 1999. And he systematically ruined the economy, imprisoned his political opponents, took over things and changed the constitution, the laws there to ensure he and then his successor Maduro, could stay in place. Just like you just saw in Nicaragua. Same sort of thing. A guy that Bernie Sanders went to go see and lift up as this shining example of democratic socialism in action now say, oh, we don't need elections anymore. I think we need to reinforce those stories, real life stories, with the logic that it never works and it won't work going forward here in America.
- [23:46]
Cabot Phillips
Governor Your group yaf, hosts more campus lectures than anyone in the country. Has there been any sort of noticeable difference since President Trump took office for a second time? I know there was all sorts of stifling of free speech happening on campuses over the last four years under President Biden. Have you noticed any sort of tangible changes since Trump took office again?
- [24:07]
Scott Walker
Yeah, there's no doubt about it. Money talks for a lot of these places. I saw that even when I was governor. You push back on funding. It's. Why not only with President Trump, I would encourage people to talk to their governors, their state lawmakers, even in red states. I'm amazed. University of Alabama, Southern Alabama. We've got plenty of examples in supposedly deep red states where the campus administrators don't align themselves with the politics of the people that live there. We've seen a change, in part not just because of the president's words, but the Department of Education, and particularly the Department of Justice. Harmeet is just knocking it out of the park as the Assistant U.S. attorney, or, excuse me, Assistant Attorney General for Civil Rights, Harmeet Dillon, who worked with us in the past at UC Berkeley. She is really pushing the edge of the envelope here. And that's really important, not for conservatives, but for students who need to hear all sides of the story.
- [24:58]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, it's funny how that works. When these institutions think they're operating in the dark, they act very differently. But when they know that there are people in Washington keeping an eye on what they're doing, they might change things up a bit. I wanna get to some other topics. You were the first governor in American history to win a recall election up in Wisconsin. You went toe to toe with teachers unions. I would encourage everyone to go back and look at some of those showdowns you had with the unions, teachers. Amazing stuff. When you look around today, which governor do you feel is the most effective legislator on the GOP side?
- [25:34]
Scott Walker
Oh, without a doubt. I think Ron DeSantis continues to be just outstanding. I think he's done a fabulous job in Florida. You know, Florida was moving. Rick Scott before him had done a good job as governor before he went to the Senate. But DeSantis has really done a fabulous job. I think Kim Reynolds, my neighbor over in Iowa, has done a solid job on taxes, on red tape, on really fighting back against the big government, union bosses, the teachers union and others. I think Governor Kemp in Georgia, by and large, has done a good job. So there's a bunch of good examples and I look forward to. There's people like Kelly, who's Coming online. She's in those weird state, New Hampshire, where they have an election every two years. So it's taken her a little bit of time to get up and going, but I think she's doing a good job. I'm looking forward to Joe Lombardo coming back in Nevada. I think he could really help turn things around there. So there's a lot of good governors and then steady forces I've known for years. I think Greg Abbott's done a lot of good work in Texas, but of course, that's a state that demands it. It's a solid red state, and they want solid conservative leadership.
- [26:35]
Cabot Phillips
All right, before we go, I have to get your take on a trend we've talked about a little bit on this show. Nixon maxing young conservatives celebrating Richard Nixon looking to rehab his image. We've heard from some folks who love it. I understand you're not a huge fan. Tell us about that.
- [26:51]
Scott Walker
I'm not. I mean, I get the argument that he got a raw deal. What he was pushed out over would be nothing compared to, say, Bill Clinton or others today that said he was not a conservative. I mean, I love Ronald Reagan. He's not perfect. There were things he did here and there that maybe I would disagree with today, but overwhelmingly, he was the conservative movement. In contrast, Nixon, remember Nixon in the early 70s, pushed price controls, the same sort of stuff we're complaining about in New York City with rent control, price controls, cost controls. Those things didn't work. It's actually a great example when you want to tell people you're not being partisan, whether it's Nixon or any of the socialists are talking about it today, they were wrong. It was so wrong in 74, they had to repeal it. He got rid of the gold standard. He used an executive order to create the epa. He didn't. Federal affirmative action. I mean, is that a conservative? Again, I get that he probably was pushed out for reasons that we just laugh at today, but that doesn't make him a conservative.
- [27:48]
Cabot Phillips
All right, Governor Walker, not Nixon maxing. You heard it here first. One more question. I know you're an Eagle Scout. If you were dropped in the woods of Wisconsin tonight, all you had was a pocket knife. How long are you surviving?
- [28:03]
Scott Walker
Oh, I could be out there endlessly. You create a little fire, create a little hut. I could have a whole TV show. It wouldn't be naked and afraid or anything crazy like that. But I think I could stay there for quite some time, and who wouldn't want to? Northern Wisconsin, this time of year is Beautiful. You just need a little help with the mosquitoes.
- [28:20]
Cabot Phillips
So your show would be fully clothed and unafraid. Governor Walker, like the book I wrote. Yeah, exactly. My co worker, the guy I sit next to, is an Eagle Scout and he said that he doesn't think he could survive. So you're just built of different stuff and I respect that. Governor, always great to see you. I'll be with you in about two weeks at Mount Vernon for the next YAF at 250 event. So I can't wait for that, but I look forward to it. Thank you so much for coming on.
- [28:47]
Scott Walker
Thank you.
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Cabot Phillips
That was Governor Scott Walker from YAF and former governor of Wisconsin. All right, we heard from the White House. Now let's hear what's going on over on Capitol Hill. For that, we turn, of course, to Daily Wire, D.C. bureau Chief Tim Rice. Tim, you were supposed to be on right at the top of the show, but you were running all around D.C. you were Ubering. You were. What were we doing? Meeting with sources. What were you doing?
- [29:12]
Tim Rice
I was, I was, I was on the Hill in the, in the Capitol proper at a little, an event with a press gaggle with House Speaker Mike Johnson. So it's a little, it's a, it's a tradition that the Speaker's office does right at the end of the summer term, before August recess. They bring the Capitol Hill press corps together for, unfortunately for the, the purposes of this show, an off the record conversation with the Speaker. So it was very nice. Good to see some of our fellow reporters. Good to see the speaker, as always, a great American. But without giving too much away, we talked about midterms, we talked about the vote coming up, the reconciliation package that's heading to the Senate. And Mike Johnson is always a great guy to speak with. So I blame my tardiness on the speaker of the House.
- [30:03]
Cabot Phillips
There is just nothing worse than talking to a reporter who just teases you by saying, I had a fascinating conversation with so and so, but it was off the record. It just makes me want to just torture it out of you. And maybe we'll do a waterboard session where you have to disclose everything you learned. Nevermind. The other big thing going on on Capitol Hill today was the confirmation process for Trump's pick for Attorney General, Todd Blanche. He's looking to score Senate confirmation first. He's got to make it out of the Judiciary Committee. That's where John Cornyn and Thom Tillis sit there in what's being called YOLO mode right now. They're looking to maybe get some revenge on President Trump. What's the latest on the Blanche front? Is he gonna make it out of the Judiciary Committee and will he be confirmed?
- [30:46]
Tim Rice
It's a phenomenal question. The vote was supposed to be 10:15 this morning or that's when they convened. That's when the vote was expected. So the delay does not necessarily mean that he's not going to make it out of committee. And in fact, I think he's going to make it out of committee. I am hard pressed to find a scenario in which he doesn't get voted out of committee, especially with Darlene Graham has now assumed her late brother's committee assignments. So Republicans do have a full freight on the Judiciary Committee. That said, this is a pretty big sign. This is a Republican, obviously, majority committee, as all the committees in the Senate are, when the majority of each committee is the majority in the body, as you said, Cornyn and Tillis, I don't know what they're trying to do. My suspicion is that they're gonna try to extract some concessions out of Blanche or out of Trump. Could be unrelated. Again, we saw with the confirmation hearing, certain members of the Senate, even Republicans like John Kennedy from Louisiana went in on Blanche a little bit about the Justice Department's handling of the Jeffrey Epstein case. Tillis and Cornyn haven't really been. They don't seem to have an issue with Blanche specifically. I think they just kind of want to needle the President a little bit or again, use their power to get something out of the President. So I think he will make it out of the committee. I think it's good. We should watch those two senators and see what sort of concessions they might get. But yeah, if I'm Todd Blanch, I'm definitely locked in. I don't think this is an easy road to confirmation.
- [32:19]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. And then if he does make it out of the committee, he's going to have to win over folks like Lisa Murkowski, which might be a tough task. We'll keep an eye on that. Let's get to the other big side. A big story on the Senate side. This one revolves around Mitch McConnell. He's been away from his office since, I believe, early June. There are all sorts of rumors swirling seemingly every day about his health, including questions, frankly, over whether he is even still alive. What are you hearing? This is a very serious story.
- [32:51]
Tim Rice
Yeah, I think you sort of hit it on the head there, Cabot. There are rumors every day and look, I usually would avoid sort of talking about rumors, cuz they're Usually just that. But this is an important story. Mitch McConnell is a towering figure in American politics. This also has extra resonance right now because we are in the middle of a very fierce iteration of the perennial conversation we have about the age and the generally on average advanced age of the people who represent us in government and specifically in the Senate. Lindsey Graham's death put this in the spotlight. The fact that Susan Collins was running against Graham Platner, who's much younger than her, put it in the spotlight. So Cornyn losing to Ken Paxton, all of these things, people are discussing the gerontocracy. So for good reasons, for genuine reasons, and then just for sort of, of salacious reasons, people wanna know what happened to Mitch McConnell. His office has kind of trickled out news about him. People are a little suspicious. He hasn't been seen publicly. Now, again, Occam's Razor. Mitch McConnell is what, 78 years old? Maybe older. Older. I think he had a fall, he got pneumonia. This is all. Yeah, 84. Yeah, yeah, sorry. This is all super believable. It's very believable that he fell in his home, contracted pneumonia in the hospital, and as such is not in a position to make public statements. That's a thing that happens to 84 year olds. That's why people want to have the conversation about why maybe 84 year olds shouldn't be in the Senate. That said, without a public appearance, these rumors are going to continue. They go up, they go down. Sometimes it's just a chattering. Sometimes like today, there was a bit of a swell. Certain rumors, people start talking. Who knows how these things go. But yeah, I think it's easy to make light of or to get distracted by the gossip, but I think it is, it's an important story. It's understandable that people want the answer.
- [34:43]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, obviously we all wish Senator McConnell the best and we don't want to see him in poor health. But I do think it's fair for the American people, especially the people of Kentucky, to want to know whether their elected officials are actually doing the job that they were sent for. And to this point, since he suffered this alleged fall, all we have seen is a photo from a hospital bed where he's sort of conspicuously holding up a newspaper to show that it's recent. But again, I think it's fair for people to question that. I know you're gonna stay on that beat and try and get us more information. Let's get over to the House side. We have Alexandria Ocasio, Cortez. Usually whenever she is asked if she's gonna be running for office in 2028. She bats it down and says, I'm focused on my job here. Today, though, she gave a little bit different of an answer. The direct quote was that she hasn't ruled out a 2028 run. Is that notable that she's taken the step from saying no? No, of course not, too. I haven't ruled it out.
- [35:41]
Tim Rice
Oh, of course it's notable. That's about as good as an FEC filing in Washington. Come on. Everyone's known that AOC was going to run. It's just been a matter of when 2028 was really shaping up to be your year. There's an open field. There's no incumbent. It's going to be a younger field. Right. Gavin Newsom is. Is looking like he's going to be one of the oldest of the presidential contenders, which, you know, there's not that much of an age difference, but AOC versus Joe Biden or. Versus Hillary Clinton. They could have. Or Bernie Sanders. Right. Those past the 2016, 20 and 24 primaries or not 24 primaries would have been easier to, you know, sort of. She would stand out. Right. She was younger than these established statesmen, but now she's a little bit older. The front runners were a little bit younger. Younger she's been getting out there. She obviously wants this. And yes, the summer before a midterm election, as 2028, speculation starts to grow on both the right and left. Saying that you're not ruling it out is basically tantamount to saying, I have an exploratory committee in the field.
- [36:42]
Cabot Phillips
Well, I also am not ruling out a 2028 presidential bid. Are you ruling one out?
- [36:48]
Tim Rice
I am absolutely ruling one out. There's nothing that I would want to do less you. You can have.
- [36:53]
Cabot Phillips
You.
- [36:54]
Tim Rice
You run Cabot. I'll host the show, and I'll come campaign for you. But there's you. I would like to just. I just like to walk by the White House. Okay. I will. No desire to get in.
- [37:03]
Cabot Phillips
I will refrain from running because I don't want you to host this show because I know that the audience would fall too quickly in love with you, and we can't have that. Tim Rice, always great to see you, man. Thanks for making time for us.
- [37:17]
Tim Rice
Good to see you, Cabot.
- [37:18]
Cabot Phillips
All right. That was Daily Wire D.C. bureau Chief Tim Rice. Well, if you're someone who is deathly afraid of AI doomsday scenarios, you might want to skip this next segment. So this week, tech giant OpenAI is running damage control after two of their AI models went rogue, escaping a sealed testing environment, hacking their way onto the open Internet, and breaking into another company's computer systems. Joining us now with more is Nate Soares, president of the Machine Intelligence Research Institute. Nate, thanks for being here.
- [37:50]
Nate Soares
Thanks for having me.
- [37:51]
Cabot Phillips
So I'm not the first to say this, but it does sound like the start of an apocalyptic sci fi movie. Can you just, in layman's terms, explain to us what actually happened? How did this AI break out of the sandbox?
- [38:05]
Nate Soares
You know, it broke out of the sandbox by inventing novel hacking techniques that humans didn't know about. So these are called zero day attacks, where it's a type of attack where humanity and the people affected have had zero days so far. To prepare, these AIs invented multiple zero days to break out of their testing environment, which was supposed to be sealed and have no Internet access. They then hacked laterally inside OpenAI to find a computer that did have Internet access. They then got out onto the Internet and only then were like, well, what should we do from here? At which point they were like, well, the answers to the test questions for the tests that we're facing are probably inside this other company's database. At which point they invented multiple new zero days to break into them.
- [38:47]
Cabot Phillips
I'm kind of speechless. It's terrifying. I'm not in the AI space, so I'm surprised by this. I'm guessing that you're not that surprised. Is this to be expected?
- [38:59]
Nate Soares
We've seen warning signs over the last year or so. This is the first time that the warning signs have sort of culminated in AIs breaking out and carrying out a cyber attack on their own initiative. This is the first time that we know of, at least this attack was actually detected by hugging face. The attacked company and reported to the authorities because they thought there were humans behind the attack. And everyone was somewhat surprised to realize that this was done on the AI's initiative. So, you know, if you've been paying attention, you've seen the warning times, the warning signs, but this is the first time it's been sort of a real felony.
- [39:33]
Cabot Phillips
So as the AI gets smarter, is it outlandish to think that someday soon we'll get to the point where just no amount of guardrails are going to be able to keep it confined?
- [39:43]
Nate Soares
It's not outlandish at all. They thought that they had a secure testing environment here. They thought these machines did not have Internet access. That turned out to be wrong. So a very interesting Point about this scenario, about this instance, is that the AIs broke out onto the Internet first, and then we're like, what should we do now that we have it right? Which is a sort of worrying sign of the AIs learning that it's useful to grab resources such as Internet access and a bit more freedom of action. They found it useful to grab those resources even when they didn't have a reason to use them yet, which is somewhat worrying. The other very worrying thing about the situation is that these AIs were, in some sense, acting contrary to instructions. If you had asked these AIs, you know, they were being faced with a test, and it was a hacking test, but it was a hacking test that had, like, pretty clear, you know, please use the following vulnerability to break into the following, you know, system in our sandbox. If you had asked those AIs, are you intended to break out onto the open Internet and break into another company to steal the answers? The AIs would have been able to correctly answer, no, obviously not. So they had the knowledge that this is not what they were supposed to be doing, and they just didn't care.
- [40:59]
Cabot Phillips
That is what makes this so alarming. I've seen your work, and you've written that quote. The most alarming AI behavior we've seen isn't in shipped products. It's in the models the public and the government can't see. What do you mean by that? Exactly.
- [41:16]
Nate Soares
So these particular AIs were unreleased models that are available only inside the AI companies. And one of the most dangerous things AI can do is AI research. Because if you get to the point where the AIs can make smarter AIs that can make smarter AIs, that is a feedback loop, and that could get out of hand very quickly. These companies say that's what they're trying to do. They say they're trying to build AIs that can make smarter AIs, that can make smarter AIs, and hopefully they're not that close. But when you're at the point where the AIs are breaking out of your sandbox by inventing new hacking techniques and then going onto the computer and, you know, committing cyber felonies, we are lucky that these AIs were not trying to hide their tracks, as far as we know. And we were lucky that they were not capable of hiding their tracks. We're lucky that they were not trying to escape. We're very lucky that they were only stealing the test answers.
- [42:06]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. Nate, you worked previously at Google and Microsoft. Do you think that they and other big tech leaders in this space are taking enough precautions when it comes to this development?
- [42:18]
Nate Soares
I mean, apparently not. You know, this is the first incident of this form that we know of. But like I said, this incident was reported, I think on July 16 to the authorities and to the public Hugging face reported they had been attacked by an unknown attacker. Only on July 21st did OpenAI realize this was us. At least that's what the public record shows. And they sort of couldn't hide this one. And also it seems like they were told by the company that was attacked, which was an AI company that had the resources to detect the attack. So probably this has been happening for a while. Probably those AIs were sort of free on the Internet and we didn't know about it for five days. Right. That is nowhere near the level of precaution that you need just to be training AIs with this level of capacity, never mind the level of precaution you need if you're going to keep making them smarter in this regime where we don't know how to make them care about what we asked them to do.
- [43:18]
Cabot Phillips
I recently interviewed Greg Brockman, of course, the co founder of OpenAI and I talked to him about those who were concerned there weren't enough guardrails in the industry. And he essentially said, look, regulation is good, but it can go too far and end up stifling innovation. And that could cause us to fall behind. China, what do you think of that sort of claim?
- [43:38]
Nate Soares
You know, I think people should separate the idea of AI as a whole from the idea of machines that are much smarter than humans. The self driving cars are not, you know, trying to break out of the garage. The AIs that are doing drug discovery for modern medical miracles are not sort of like breaking out and trying to synthesize a virus or whatever, even military applications. These are not the same thing as making autonomous systems that carry out cyber attacks on their own initiative. There is this relatively narrower research path of making smarter and smarter AIs when we don't know how to make them care about what we asked them to do, which is incredibly reckless. And we've already seen that they can't keep them in a box. We've already seen that these AIs know, but do not care about the user instructions. If we keep racing to make, if anyone keeps racing to make smarter versions of those AIs, we all die. That doesn't matter if it's China doing it or if it's the US doing it. If. If we sort of make radically smarter machines and can't keep control, we're sort of replacing humanity, and we're not ready to replace humanity as the smartest entity should the planet. So I think I'm very sympathetic to people who want to go light on the regulation for a lot of the types of AI we have today, where maybe it can revolutionize various industries and bring a lot of new wealth and surplus into the country. I think for this race towards superintelligence, we need a global agreement that we're not going to build our mechanical replacement species. And we should be opening those talks with China, and we should be working on the hardware that we could put into advanced computer chips so that it would be possible to monitor, verify, and enforce any international treaty about this.
- [45:38]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, that is another fascinating conversation that we don't have time for right now. I want to get you back on in the near future because that is an entirely different topic that I would just be very interested in hearing your thoughts on. But this is scary and very important stuff. So thank you so much, Nate, for joining us and helping to break it all down.
- [45:56]
Nate Soares
Thanks for having me.
- [45:58]
Cabot Phillips
That was Nate Soares, president of the Machine Intelligence Research Institute. Well, a number of recent studies have gone viral this year showing that the findings in a vast majority of education research papers have never been replicated, calling into question their legitimacy and opening the door for potential fraud. So how big of an issue is this here with more on that question. And the growing trend is Mark Schneider, senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. Mark, thanks for coming on. It's great to have you.
- [46:26]
Mark Schneider
Sure.
- [46:27]
Cabot Phillips
So just.
- [46:27]
Mark Schneider
So the answer to you.
- [46:29]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I want to.
- [46:29]
Mark Schneider
The answer to your question, it's big.
- [46:31]
Cabot Phillips
It is big. And that's why I'm happy you're here. Just at the start, for folks who aren't too familiar with academic research in general, can you just explain to us why it's so important to be able to replicate findings that are being published?
- [46:44]
Mark Schneider
Well, okay. I'm going to answer that question in two different ways. The first one is people make up findings. There's fraud. And fraud in education research is bad enough, but when we start talking about fraud in medical, biomedical research or health sciences, then fraud actually kills people. We don't have that kind of impact in education research, but education research does affect the way teachers teach, the way students learn, the way we organize schools. This is really important to make sure that the research that's being published is correct. Replication is one of the ways in which we make sure. That fraud is not taking place. It's also very important that the bad research practices, which are endemic to academic research, more than just academic research, but is endemic to research, people research cheat, they lie, I mean, quite frankly, or they make up data or they fudge data, or they make believe that they had an hypothesis that they really didn't have. And then, oh, look, the data show this. So that's my hypothesis. So they're bad habits. One of the ways in which we could control bad habits is by replicating research. So one of the problems is that the academic journals don't enforce the sharing of data and research protocols. So there are studies in Nature where researchers went and asked for the original data from published research. Most PIs, principal investigators would not share the data. And then when they did share the data, most of the stuff could not be replicated.
- [48:33]
Cabot Phillips
And I just wanna make sure our audience knows what we're talking about here. As Mark is explaining, one of the ways to essentially prove that a study is legitimate is by being able to replicate it in a separate environment and say, hey, okay, we're also finding what you're finding so we can trust these findings a little bit more. So walk us through the actual numbers. How common is it for a study in an education research setting to be published that is incapable of replication or simply where no replication was even tried?
- [49:01]
Mark Schneider
So there are a couple of studies in the Nature magazine symposium about this. I will actually have some of the numbers here. According to the Nature magazine, between 2011 and 2020, replication studies accounted for only 1/5 of 1%, 1/5 of 1% of studies that were published. Then in another study in that Nature symposium, they asked authors, they went to something like, let's see, 62 journals spanning social and behavioral science education work, and only 24% of the authors of those published studies provided the data. Only 24% did. And less than half of those were replicated. So we're talking about a serious problem, right, People. So in journals have published this. This is the part that I just don't understand. Journals are publishing these studies and not asking or demanding that the data be made available. And then so a PI, a principal investigator says, like, I'm not going to give you my data. Well, you publish that data, that data should be in the public domain. That data should be shared and listed in a repository, in a public repository.
- [50:27]
Cabot Phillips
What do you think is the incentive there? Is it that journals simply want to publish as many studies as possible or that they want to be the first to publish new findings? And new research. And so they're willing to turn a blind eye to best practices. What do you think it is?
- [50:42]
Mark Schneider
Well, I think that there's an incredible bias both among researchers and in journals to publish interesting new different findings. You don't get a lot of credit for doing the replication study and then publishing. We found this in fourth grade students in Detroit and now we replicated in fourth grade students in Chicago. And it worked. It didn't work. Nobody cares. It's the person that did the first research that ends up with the credit. It's the journal that published the first research that ends up with getting points on the. There are all kinds of metrics about impact of journals and that's what the competition is about.
- [51:25]
Cabot Phillips
On a separate topic, but one I imagine you're very familiar with, I have friends that I've spoken to in academia and they talk about the peer review system and they say, hey, once it was incredibly useful in vetting research and making sure that what we're finding was legitimate, but that now the peer review system has become more of a quid pro quo system or a pay for play in some cases. Do you share any of those same concerns?
- [51:50]
Mark Schneider
Oh, absolutely, absolutely. So part of the problem is the selection of the peer reviewers. So peer review is really important, except it's gotten out of control. Right. So I ran the Institute of Education Sciences. We reviewed hundreds of proposals every year. So what would happen is we would call up people reviewers and we say, could you come to D.C. for three days to do a panel? And by the way, here's a whole bunch of stuff that you have to prepare. So the only people that have the time to do this are usually junior academics who get some points on their vita. So they come. These are very conservative, very status quo oriented people. And there is also this, as you say, some quid pro quo going on. So when I was at ies, the Institute of Education Sciences, I tried to bring in people from states, I tried to bring in entrepreneurs, I tried to bring business people, I tried to expand the pool from which we were drawing peer reviewers. So what would happen is I would call up a friend from Texas and I would say, look, you're doing great work. Could you come to this peer review system, this peer review meeting? And she would say, I'm sorry, the legislature is in session, I can't leave Austin. Boom, done. And then, I mean, I brought in some really, really creative entrepreneurs and they all found the same thing. So all these academics would talk to each other in jargon, and the entrepreneur is Like I'm on a different plan.
- [53:29]
Tala Gudarzi
Right.
- [53:29]
Mark Schneider
So the peer review system is broken. We need to fix it. There are many experiments that we could imagine to test whether or not how to improve the peer review system. They have to be done. We need to figure out how to save peer review from the kind of stasis, status quo orientation that it now has fallen into.
- [53:51]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. And as you say, the reason this is so important is because the research that comes out of these institutions. Institutions. Is so influential in shaping things that do impact our everyday lives. They shape all sorts of health policy, they shape education policy, they shape public policy. And if these studies are not things that can be relied upon, if we do not have best practices being applied, then it calls into question the entire system and people will start to lose even more faith in our systems and in our institutions. We don't need any more of that. So, Mark, thank you so much for providing some context here. Just fascinating stuff that you're working on and we really appreciate your time.
- [54:25]
Mark Schneider
My pleasure. Thank you.
- [54:26]
Cabot Phillips
That was Mark Schneider from the American Enterprise Institute. Well, guys, if you're watching Wired in live on the Daily Wire plus app, thank you. If not, come on, you know by now that's where you should be. That's where you get push alerts when we go live. Breaking news as it happens. And of course, the latest from our investigative reporting team. The Daily Wire app is free and available now on the App Store, Google Play, Apple tv, Roku, Samsung lg. All right, let's get to our next guest. He is a student, he's a commentator, he's an author. He's a very busy man. It's Brylon Hollihan. Brylon, great to have you on, man.
- [55:01]
Brylon Hollihan
Cabot, congrats on the success of the show. Thanks for having me, my friend. I'm excited you're busier than me.
- [55:05]
Cabot Phillips
I don't know about that. I feel like every time I see you on social media, you're going to book launches, you're on a different Campus, you're in D.C. you're in New York. And a big part of that has been promoting your new book, Make America Talk. Again, congratulations. Tell us about the book.
- [55:19]
Brylon Hollihan
Thank you.
- [55:20]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah.
- [55:20]
Brylon Hollihan
We live in a culture that's tried to teach us how not to offend each other so much that we've forgotten how to talk to each other. So everywhere we go, we see the most extreme examples of outrage through social media, through Hollywood, through our news media. We see people screaming and arguing. And you've seen it when marriages you Know, start arguing, they go to a divorce. But when nations start arguing, they get to a civil war. I mean, it's been two years since they tried to kill Trump in a field in Butler, and it's been 10 months since Charlie Kirk's assassination. We are raising our kids one day in a world that's going to be normal to result to assassinations or ranting online instead of just talking. And I think if we have civil discourse, like, half of our problems will be fixed.
- [55:54]
Scott Walker
Gabbit.
- [55:55]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, you mentioned Charlie. You and I both knew him well. What sort of impact did his assassination have on you wanting to, you know, get more involved in campus activism or to write this book?
- [56:07]
Brylon Hollihan
I'll be honest with you. So I started my freshman year last fall and. And I went into college planning to take a step back from politics. I was going to be a kid. I was going to focus on homework, focus on tailgating with my buddies, and lay off the speaking and writing and just, you know, pick that back up after I got a diploma. And I saw the assassination and it completely shook me. And I remember kind of, you know, facing a moment where I could have stepped away. I could have easily, you know, withdrawn into the life of being a student and mourned with my friends and did the homework and let somebody else fight this political fight. But I realized that that coward wanted that, like, he would be successful if he shot my friend from the rooftop and he silenced our generation. And instead, I thought that there needs to be more people debating, there needs to be more arguments out there to try to get the truth, just like Charlie wanted to do. And so we did 10 debates last semester. It was really cool. We had security threats and crazy people and insane rhetoric at every single one. But that just kind of proved the point of why we need to do it.
- [56:56]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, exactly. And those people win when you aren't going to campus because of those threats. And very few people know how intimidating it is. I've done a bunch of campus events also. I'm with you. I know how intimidating it is going into a campus debate format where, you know, people are gonna, you know, harass you in many cases, sometimes physically threaten you. So kudos to you for doing that, especially as a college student. That is commendable. And some other stuff you've written. Again, very busy man. You just wrote a new op ed in the New York Post titled Nevermind Socialism. The rebellious kids are all conservative and love America. What do you mean by that, Brylon?
- [57:33]
Brylon Hollihan
So here's what everybody's missing. This Socialist movement right now is actually just a false flag. The choice before us is between Christian nationalism and secular globalism. So there's not really any gray area in between there. They are happy when we call them socialists. That's a lot lesser than the evil they're actually trying to bring upon us. They want to convince us that God, that patriotism, this nuclear family is dangerous.
- [57:54]
Scott Walker
Why?
- [57:54]
Brylon Hollihan
Because it takes the attention off of the government. They want us to put our hands out and replace God with government and expect everything in our life from the government. That's their end goal. So when we call them socialists, it's really like putting lipstick on a pig. It's a lot easier than what they're really trying to sell us. But that doesn't fit on the TikTok trends or on the bumper stickers cabinet. So we'll give it to them.
- [58:11]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I wanna get your take on what's going on with President Trump and his support of young people. We know he won the 2024 election in large part thanks to young voters, especially young men. But if you look at the polling data recently, it shows that Trump's approval, it has dipped significantly with that group, especially with young men. How does he get them back?
- [58:31]
Brylon Hollihan
It's really simple. We cannot do what the Biden administration did. So they looked at 2024 and they lost their generation because they walked in and acted like they were entitled to our vote. They said, we've got it, we're good, this is easy, it's a landslide because we've always won. The youth vote was given them empty promises and finally we took our rose colored glasses off and started actually demanding results, those promises and there were no results there. So we have to earn the youth vote instead of acting like we're entitled to it. This week we, the president spoke at a high school gym in Georgia. I think that's great. It's a first step, but let's do more. Let's go to where young people are. The president's on TikTok. He's been on podcast. The vice president was just in a podcast last week. Awesome. Let's get more of it though. Have the president do a campus tour, have him book some basketball arenas and fill them to the brim with a bunch of frat guys and get them energized where he can just lay out all of the promises that he's kept and then lay out a new list of promises for his final two years.
- [59:16]
Cabot Phillips
If he needs help getting connected with the frat guys, I know that you can help make those connections down in Alabama.
- [59:24]
Tim Rice
Yeah.
- [59:24]
Cabot Phillips
Brylon, great to have you on, man. Congratulations on the book. It's Make America Talk again. Really appreciate your time.
- [59:32]
Brylon Hollihan
Thank you. Cabot, have a goin'.
- [59:33]
Cabot Phillips
Absolutely. Let's bring it back in studio. Guys, before we go, we have two very, very special guests. Two faces and two voices you will recognize. Georgia Howe and John Bickley, hosts of Morning Wire. Guys, it's great to see you.
- [59:48]
John Bickley
Cabot, finally on this set. I don't have set envy. I'm saying that right now. I'm gonna make that a reality for myself. I actually love this set. I want some elements of this set on our set. I might be stealing some things. Great to be. You haven't invited us on. I mean, this is what this is.
- [60:03]
Cabot Phillips
I know there's been.
- [60:04]
John Bickley
What's really been happening here.
- [60:05]
Cabot Phillips
It's mainly out of jealousy because you guys have just been topping the charts for five years now. We are like a family at this point. And Georgia, can you just explain to people why you're on today? What are we celebrating today?
- [60:19]
Georgia Howe
Oh, well, today. Well, why are we on your show?
- [60:21]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, what's going on?
- [60:23]
Georgia Howe
We're celebrating five years of Morning Wire and debatably, our 3,000th episode.
- [60:29]
John Bickley
It is our 3,000th episode, guys. We're gonna say that emphatically.
- [60:33]
Cabot Phillips
3,000 for sure. There's internal debate up here.
- [60:35]
Georgia Howe
Our approximately 3,000th episode.
- [60:37]
John Bickley
There's different ways to measure it. We might have lost a few episodes in the back end of the site. And so we think it's 3,000.
- [60:42]
Georgia Howe
Yeah, we think there are some that kind of went into the ether that are not being counted publicly. But we.
- [60:47]
John Bickley
And Cabot was on like 2,000 of those.
- [60:49]
Cabot Phillips
I think I may have been.
- [60:51]
John Bickley
This is a real statistic. We looked at it. Cabot by far has been on the show the most of any of the talent and of the reporters by far.
- [61:01]
Georgia Howe
I mean, I would guess it.
- [61:02]
Cabot Phillips
That warms my heart to hear now for people who are like, what's going on right now? For people who have only been watching Wired in. I spent the last four and a half years at the Daily Wire. My main job was working with John and Georgia on Morning Wire. Georgia, can you just explain what Morning Wire is for anyone who's been living under a rock?
- [61:20]
Georgia Howe
Yeah. So Morningwire is like a 15 minute news wrap up show that goes on at 4:30 in the morning and it has the top three stories of the day. And John, anything else?
- [61:31]
John Bickley
It's the news you need to know in 15 minutes or less. Approximately. Approximately 15 minutes or less. It's gotta be.
- [61:36]
Georgia Howe
And we don't really give our opinion on things too much, although you can sometimes infer it a little bit. But we try to just give a really succinct news wrap up so you get everything you need on your commute.
- [61:46]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I think the fun in doing this show has been that I get to be more opinionated if I want. But the coolest compliment that we would get from doing Morning Wire was people saying, hey, I've been listening for six months and I'm not listening anymore. Because I didn't know that you guys were a conservative news outlet. And it's actually a. A weird compliment because it means that you guys are doing a great job.
- [62:07]
John Bickley
Yeah, that's complicated. But yes.
- [62:09]
Cabot Phillips
Of just informing them of the news,
- [62:11]
John Bickley
which you did so much. So the whole launching of this show. We're gonna talk about this in an hour or whatever it is, but we're gonna be talking about this. But the launching of this show, Cabot, was absolutely central to the launching of the show we.
- [62:27]
Cabot Phillips
Over five years ago. And I'll get into this a little bit. Cause you guys are gonna be hosting a live all access at 5pm 6pm Eastern Time. So people can go on dailywire.com and watch that. Of course, you gotta be a member. Dailywire.com subscribe. But in the early days of the show, we were recording in empty sound booths. We didn't have a studio, so we were just trying to find a space to record.
- [62:51]
Georgia Howe
We also didn't have a show for the first few weeks. We would record fake episodes that would never go anywhere. We were just practicing it for almost a month.
- [62:58]
John Bickley
Yeah, it was about 20 episodes. We actually fully produced 20 episodes that we never ran.
- [63:03]
Cabot Phillips
Yes. And I remember some of the early episodes also where I got in trouble because Michael Knowles had his actual studio and he'd be recording. We were in a little box right next door. And I remember coming out and just singing very loudly and then getting yelled at. And people said, Michael Knowles is recording right there. And then there were the days when we recorded Morning Wire once. It was a thing in an old electrical closet.
- [63:24]
Georgia Howe
Yep.
- [63:25]
John Bickley
Literally it was an actual electrical.
- [63:27]
Georgia Howe
Well, there was also the phase of the box. The black box in the electrical closet.
- [63:32]
Cabot Phillips
Yes.
- [63:33]
John Bickley
Isn't that a premise of like an Apple TV series right now the box. And it's like a time trial. Nevermind, guys, nevermind. Dark Matters. Dark Matters.
- [63:43]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah.
- [63:43]
Georgia Howe
But our first week, I think we recorded exclusively in Michael's studio. And we would Just like, shoo out when he needed us, when he needed to use it.
- [63:51]
John Bickley
And your voice modulation problem, Kevin, actually came up. Yeah, that's exactly right.
- [63:55]
Cabot Phillips
Yes. There actually was a time where we had. Remember when we had some voice lessons? Oh, my gosh, like a month after starting the show, none of us really knew how to talk on a podcast and we realized, how about we just talk normally and not do anything special? Maybe I wasn't supposed to tell that we did that, but we did do that.
- [64:13]
John Bickley
It was like I was back in, like, middle school or something. All of us were going, what are we doing? Anyway? Some of it worked.
- [64:20]
Scott Walker
I don't know.
- [64:21]
John Bickley
I.
- [64:21]
Cabot Phillips
As I sit here, I'm reminded of the fact that I need to request that I not have to wear this jacket because John Bickley every day gets to show off his biceps, and I never get to do that. John just is mogging me.
- [64:34]
John Bickley
I use injections. You know, it's a thing. We'll talk about it later.
- [64:38]
Cabot Phillips
Yes, they'll talk about it later.
- [64:39]
John Bickley
Actually, we can enter it into a show. Well, you're better than me. I'm in a T shirt, guys.
- [64:46]
Cabot Phillips
Anyways, I just wanted to help celebrate that you guys are gonna be doing this live stream tonight to talk with the audience and answer questions about the show. So I encourage everyone go to dailywire.com and take part in the morning wire all access five years. It is a really cool accomplishment. And just thank you to the audience who has been with us every step of the way, the people who say they've listened to every single episode since it came out. A lot of people say very cool stuff. So, guys, and thank you to you
- [65:15]
John Bickley
who's played such a central part. I'm not.
- [65:17]
Cabot Phillips
I'm serious.
- [65:18]
John Bickley
A little cheer.
- [65:19]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I got is nice not having to fake liking my coworkers because we all love.
- [65:25]
Georgia Howe
We have a lot of fun, we
- [65:26]
Cabot Phillips
legitimately love each other, and we are like a family at this point. So, guys, thank you for being here. Congratulations on five years. And thank all of you for watching Wired in. If you're on Apple or Spotify, I will see you on Monday. If you're a Daily Wire member, let's keep the chat going over on the live Q and A that we're going to do right now. If you want to join, go to dailywire.com subscribe. Thanks for watching.