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- [00:00]
Howard Mackler
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- [00:55]
Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Paid for by Super Sure Insurance Agency,
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Cabot Phillips
llc, a licensed insurance agency Colorado is trying to silence free speech again. A state law forces businesses to use customers preferred pronouns even if they're biologically inaccurate. With the help of Alliance Defending Freedom, a Christian bookstore and a sports apparel company are challenging the law, but a
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Matty Frei Schultz
court recently ruled against them.
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Cabot Phillips
They appealed the ruling and with ADF's help, they'll keep fighting another attempt by Colorado to skirt the First Amendment. Learn more about how you can support free speech by Texting Wire to 83848 or going to joinadf.com wire well, hello everybody and welcome to Wired In. I'm Cabot Phillips, coming to you live from Daily Wire hq. Thank you for spending your Wednesday with us. It was a wild night up in Michigan where far left Democrat Abdul El Sayed came out with the Senate nomination, but the race was far closer than anyone predicted. We'll talk about what the results tell us heading into November and and tell you about the craziest race of the year where a Trump endorsed candidate for Congress just lost to a man who had already dropped out of the race. We'll also hear from a GOP congressman who says far left super PACs are meddling in Republican primaries on behalf of billionaires. We'll chat with the therapist who says that his industry is ruining countless marriages. And we'll hear about the new debate raging over flock cameras that are popping up in communities nationwide. And of course, stick around until the end of the show for our live listener Q and A. If you're a Daily Wire member, get those questions in the LIVE chat right now. If you're on Apple or Spotify, come on, Join in on the action. Sign up@dailywire.com subscribe. Go Become a member. Let's do this thing right now. Roll that graphic. And just a reminder for you lovely folks at home, Wired In Live is now streaming, streaming live at 4pm Eastern Monday through Thursday. Get your daily coverage of the news happening right now. Hear from experts who are actually in the story as we talk about why all of this matters. Become a member and join the live chat@dailywire.com subscribe. Well, up in Michigan, the latest polling had showed a double digit lead for far left Democrat Abdul Al Said. And betting markets pegged him as a 21 favorite against Congresswoman Haley Stevens. But as the votes came in last night, the two were in a dead heat. And by this morning, when the race was finally called, he won ultimately by less than a percentage point. Here with more on what we learned from the most expensive Democratic primary in history is Daily Wire breaking news reporter Jacob Wheeler. Jacob, great to have you. Welcome.
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Jacob Wheeler
Thanks for having me. It's great to be here.
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Cabot Phillips
So how did El Sayed pull this thing off? What did we learn?
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Jacob Wheeler
So this is no doubt the biggest breakthrough for the DSA socialist left. I mean, since President Trump's reelection, this group has been barnstorming the country in deep blue precincts, starting in New York City with Mayor Mamdani, then upsetting three longtime incumbents there going through Denver and Washington, D.C. but those are all deep blue districts in those cities. So the big question was, can this fringe movement capitalize on the Democratic Party voters frustration and win in a purple state like Michigan? And El Sayed proved last night that he can even by the thinnest of margins. And he really ran a populist campaign in a populous state. Michigan has a lot of working class voters and he barnstormed the state since last year and he really out communicated Haley Stevens. You know, Haley Stevens did go viral in the last moments of the campaign with their stick it to them slogan. But he really tapped in on the party's frustrations with Israel, with Medicare for all, with not sufficiently in their minds combating President Trump. And he was able to capitalize on their frustration and do it.
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Cabot Phillips
You mentioned the dsa. It's interesting in a lot of these races the DSA has explicitly said, hey, these candidates are Democratic Socialist of America members. We saw that in New York, we saw that in Colorado. But in this race, El Sayed kind of kept a distance where he had a lot of the same Messaging. He didn't necessarily say, I am a card carrying DSA member. And the DSA seemed content to let him kind of be a fellow traveler, but not in name. Do you think that was intentional where they're saying, hey, we gotta be careful in a state like Michigan that is a lot more working class, that is not as deep blue as New York?
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Jacob Wheeler
It's totally intentional. But one thing I would add on that is that if you look into the results of last night's results, he did the worst among Democratic working class voters. He performed strongest among college educated voters, white, wealthy Democratic voters, young people. He ran up the score in college towns in Ann Arbor and Lansing, Michigan. And Haley Stevens, on the other hand, did very well with black voters, particularly older black voters. And it shows that these older black voters who are still, you know, the bedrock of the Democratic coalition, are, are much more hesitant to this socialist wave that's sweeping across the country, whereas these other voters are much more welcoming to embrace it.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, it is ironic that we've seen now in race after race, if you look at the cross tabs and the polling and the turnout, it is these younger, very educated, predominantly white voting blocs that are going for these socialist candidates, whereas the core Democratic base of the black voters and working class voters not necessarily on board with this. I'm interested if you think that those voters who did go for Stevens will end up turning out for El Sayed or if they're gonna be disillusioned by what he's bringing to the party.
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Jacob Wheeler
It's a great question. I mean, I've definitely seen some voters out there. I've talked to people who say that, nope, he's way too extreme, not gonna be able to pull the lever. But you could even argue, on the other hand, if Stevens would have won, you know, would those younger voters, would they sit on the sidelines over issues like Israel? There's a lot of young people on the, you know, the Gen Z leftists out there who, they have drawn a stake in the sand and saying, if you're not against aipac, if you're not against Israel, I'm not voting for you. And so I think it's going to be very interesting to see the turnout. Mike Rogers obviously is probably the happiest person today because as you mentioned, the polls were wildly off. They were spectacularly off. I mean, there was polls out there showing he was going to win it by 8, 10, 12, 15 points and he's going to win by less than a percentage point. And if you look at the Results. He didn't even get a majority of the vote. When you add up Steven's vote and the other female candidates vote share, that actually was the majority vote, but he still was able to get a plurality there.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I believe it was four points that went to. Was it Mallory McMurraw? I might be getting the name wrong. Who knows what would have happened if she was not on the ballot, if Stevens would have prevailed. El Sayed has given some quotes in the past where he's basically fancied himself as the future power broker of the Democratic Party. And he's kind of alluded to the fact. Not even alluded. He's outright said, you know, if candidates in the future want to win, if they want to win the 2028 presidential nomination, they've got to come work with me. They've got to work with my coalition. But if that's gonna happen, first he actually has to win the general election.
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Jacob Wheeler
Right.
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Cabot Phillips
What are you seeing when it comes to polling? You mentioned Mike Rogers, the Republican nominee is very happy with this outcome. He seems to think he'll have a better chance of beating El Sayed than he would have Stevens. What are the polls looking like right now?
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Jacob Wheeler
Yeah, so the polling before this primary showed that Mike Rogers was faring better against El Sayed than Stevens. And I think that's because of that white working class vote in Michigan. I mean, Michigan is a very populous state. I mean, President Trump was able to win it twice. And that's because he carried a populist message into a very working class, populous state before President Trump, a Democrat, and hadn't won that state on the national scene until like the 1980s. But I think the biggest loser of this entire thing is Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, who he is the highest ranking Democratic official in the country for this kind of leaderless party. And this is the second candidate this cycle that he recruited and has now lost, first with Janet Mills in Maine, who lost to Graham Platner. Now Graham Platner is out of that race. That's a mess up there. And Maine and Schumer got very involved, as you know, in this race for Stevens, and all the money was backing her, and it just kind of collapsed like a deck of cards for him. So I think Rodgers is feeling very good. I would suggest, I would caution, though, Syed does have the energy. So it's going to come down to turnout this November.
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Cabot Phillips
I want to get to another race. Last night there was former squad member Cori Bush out in Missouri who had been voted out of office two years ago. She was a very prominent member, aligned with AOC and Jamaal Bowman and others. She tried to attempt a political comeback last night. Was she successful?
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Jacob Wheeler
No, she wasn't.
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Cabot Phillips
I knew. I just wanted to say I was teeing you up. I already knew the results, but what happened?
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Jacob Wheeler
She failed big time. I mean, she lost by more than 20 points in the Missouri 1st Congressional District, which is for the viewers who don't know that's based in St. Louis. It's a very deep blue district of urban St. Louis and some of the suburbs there. It's mostly black. And so, and unlike Michigan, I mean, both of the candidates here were black. I mean, Cori Bush is a black woman. Wesley Bell's a black man doesn't have the same racial dynamics that we can see in other races, including in Michigan. But no, Cori Bush lost big time. And that's mostly because she didn't have really a message other than Israel. And obviously she was one of the most virulent anti Israel critics in Congress. Wesley Bell's message was basically, I'm getting stuff done in D.C. i'm bringing back money. When storms are hitting, I'm the one that's on the ground. Cori Bush here is just, you know, yelling through her bullhorn about stuff that's not really affecting you. And so voters send a clear message. And I think it shows that, again, black Democratic primary voters are the least group likely in this party right now to embrace the socialist surge. And that was evident in both Michigan and St. Louis last year.
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Cabot Phillips
It's a fascinating dynamic to watch play out. Jacob Wheeler, Daily Wire breaking news reporter. Appreciate you breaking it all down for us. It was a late night for you last night, but thanks for being here.
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Jacob Wheeler
It was. Thanks for having me.
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Cabot Phillips
All right, for more on the state of the Democratic Party and this internal power struggle, let's bring on one of our friends from across the aisle, a man who spent more than a decade working for Democrats on the Hill and served as chief counsel for the House Judiciary Committee, it's Julian Epstein. Julian, great to have you back.
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Julian Epstein
Great to be back with you. Thanks for having me on.
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Cabot Phillips
So a historic win for Abdul El Sayed last night. The dust is starting to settle. We'll start with just what are you feeling?
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Julian Epstein
It feels like it's the beginning of the end of the Democratic Party as we know it. The Democratic Party leadership has had a choice as to whether it wants to fight extremism or make room for extremism under this sort of empty cliche of big Tent philosophy, which is, I think, a euphemism for saying we are too scared to fight extremism. I think this entire socialist wave in New York, in New Jersey, possibly in Wisconsin next week, and in Michigan last night is not what I would call socialism. I think that the Scandinavian socialist countries wouldn't recognize any of this. This is Third Worldism. This is extremism. This is not just trying to sort of nationalize one or two aspects of the economy, like health care. This is about getting rid of borders, getting rid of police, getting rid of prisons, getting rid of the democratic free market. This is about aligning yourself ideologically with Islamist terrorist groups in the Mid east because they happen to share with you an anti Western ideology. This is something just a generation ago, Democrats would have recognized as a Trojan horse of the forces of our enemies, our adversaries that want to undermine the United States and the West. And now I think because the Democratic Party is shrinking, they are desperate to buy votes and they're getting into bed with anyone. Remember the dsa? As much as Sayed wants to distance himself from the dsa, he sort of falls into a lot of that ideology. The DSA on October 8th was one of the first groups out there championing the genocidal efforts of the genocidal killings by Hamas. This is extremism. This is anti Americanism. This is something the party should be standing up to, but it doesn't stand up to it because it's scared.
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Cabot Phillips
Do you think that's gonna change? Do you think that? Cause right now it doesn't seem like there are any real democratic standard bearers who are putting their foot down, at least publicly. I'm sure they're doing this behind the scenes. But who do you see emerging as a potential standard bearer to stand up and fight this? Who would you like to see stepping up right now?
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Julian Epstein
Well, if you ask me, in my dreams, who I would like to see as a Democratic nominee and in 2028, I would tell you. I would tell you, Mr. Dimon, I think he is. We need somebody from the business sector or somebody like Rich Torres, who is a very moderate, anti woke, pro Israeli, African American Democrat from New York. I don't see the party moving back to the center much as I would. The party has a choice to make. Whether it wants to be a party of builders. This country was founded and built by people that build, that believe in innovation for the next generation and innovation for the next phase of the industrial Revolution, or it can take from others and redistribute and promote the notion of victimization and grievance, and the party is choosing that. What modern liberalism, postmodern liberalism has become is essentially two ideas. One is to grow the welfare state, and secondly is to promote identity grievance. And none of the reason that we're seeing extremism is because none of these two pillars ever produces any results. If you look at what's happening with say, growing the welfare state, just take education, for example. We're spending $40,000 per student in New York, and virtually all of a sudden all of the students in New York public schools cannot read and cannot do basic math. I think proficiency is somewhere in the 20s. Same with health care. We're spending, you know, tens, hundreds trillions of dollars on our health care welfare system. And since, say, the passage of Obamacare, premiums have doubled. So liberalism is not, is not, is not producing results. And the answer of the left and the liberal, the modern day liberal, is, oh, we're just not doing enough of those things, so we have to do more of that in order to buy votes. So it becomes a pyramid scheme. And the same is true of identity politics. It used to be that the left believed in a colorblind society. Now it's saying, well, the colorblind laws that we have, the anti discrimination laws, are not good enough because we're not seeing equal results. And therefore we have to bring in a new form of what I call neo racism and to begin developing public policy targeted at different minority groups and favoring different minority groups in order to promote inequality, quality of results. And what identity grievance is doing is just blackpilling the public and making people more angry and believing, and particularly young people believing the system is unfair, where this is the most upwardly mobile, most equal opportunity civilization that human beings have ever developed. And so there's a black pilling that goes on in modern day liberalism and that is in turn ironically and paradoxically sowing the seeds of its own failure because it never delivers results. And it forces the left to become more extreme and to double down on things that don't work. And this is why I don't see the left coming back. That's why I don't see Democrats coming back. And I think what we are seeing is we will see is open civil war inside the Democratic Party. And I think the party is going to move further and further to the left of the median voter. And so, you know, I don't intend to support Sayed. I don't. I intend to raise money for Rogers because I think he's the normie candidate here.
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Cabot Phillips
One of the. Let's get back to Michigan then, because one of the questions is just how many Democrats will do what you just described or at least are gonna stay home. And the other big question is, now that he has emerged from this primary, is El Sayed going to moderate a bit? Is he going to try to distance himself from some of the folks that he aligned with? The Hasan Pikers of the world, the Ilhan Omars of the world. And to that point, Mike Rogers this morning, once it became clear that El Said was the nominee, posted this new ad online. And I want to play that and get your take.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
I'm not here to disavow people's views.
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Cabot Phillips
America deserved 9 11, dude, I'm saying it. When I was in college, I took a terrorism class.
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Matty Frei Schultz
You know, there needs to be unrest
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Cabot Phillips
in the streets for as long as
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Matty Frei Schultz
there is unrest in our lives.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
I'm not here to disavow people's views. You know, I am in support of
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Cabot Phillips
abolishing ISA because we're gonna go in there, we're gonna impeach the, kill those, murder those mothers in the street.
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Rafael Mangual
Let the streets soak in their red capitalist bloods.
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Cabot Phillips
Dude, the people who listen to Hasan are engaging in faith.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
They want a way forward into our politics.
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Cabot Phillips
So, Julian, do you think this is the El Said that we're going to see in the general election, or is he going to take the traditional route of candidates moderating a bit as they get to the general?
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Julian Epstein
I mean, there's only so much you can walk back statements. When, for example, he's out there saying he wants to get the support of voters who in turn support the Iranian ayatollahs. You can't walk that back. You can't walk back his affiliation and his fondness for Hassan Piker. There's certain things you just can't walk back. And I think that normie voters in the center, I think Jewish voters, but far beyond Jewish voters, anybody that believes that what's happening in the Mideast with the ethno supremacist, the Islamo supremacist ideology, that's a genocidal ideology that fuels Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran that many on the left seem to be sympathetic with because they are anti Western for no other reason, they're the most anti progressive forces in the world today. But the left affiliates with them because they share the anti Western ideology as well. There's what we call the Red Green coalition. I just don't think it's going to be believable to walk it back. So I think you will see voters in the center. I think you'll see Jewish voters. I think you'll see anyone that has any sense about national security and the sort of, again, the Islamic supremacist threat. This is not to say all Muslims shared, but there is undoubtedly an Islamist supremacist movement emanating from Iran that many on the left are sympathetic towards. You can't walk that back. And enough people in the political center that vote Democrat traditionally know of that. And I just don't think they'll countenance that. I think that Syed will lose big in November.
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Cabot Phillips
One final question, Julie. Julian Haley Stevens had the endorsement of the state's Democratic governor, Gretchen Whitmer. That did not seem to be something that El said was running away from. He was quick to point out to everyone, look, Gretchen Whitmer is supporting my opponent. Do you think we've reached a point in politics, especially on the left, where endorsements from powerful incumbents can actually hurt a candidate?
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Julian Epstein
Perhaps. But I think the bigger problem on the left is that they have not switched, they have not pivoted away from grievance. So long as you tell people that the system is unfair and they need to be wards of the state under a bigger welfare state, that their racial or ethnic identity is the most important thing about them, and they are most likely to be victimized by this sort of invisible system of oppression, so long as you countenance that which the Democratic Party mainstream does, then you are gonna drive everything towards extremism. Because, as I say, these ideas never produce results. They only prod more extremism. And that is a central problem of the party. Sure. The apparatus of the Democratic Party has broken down. It's a weak party. It's a party that's incompetent. It's a party that's fundamentally scared of the online flying monkeys of the left. But more importantly, it hasn't realized that its own ideology, postmodern liberalism, is sowing the seeds of its own failure.
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Cabot Phillips
Julian, a fascinating conversation. We're definitely going to have you back as this election season progresses. We really appreciate your insight in making time for us.
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Julian Epstein
I always enjoy it. Thanks for the invite.
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Cabot Phillips
Absolutely. Thank you, Julian. That was Julian Epstein. Let's jump over now to Capitol Hill, where we've got Daily Wire D.C. bureau Chief Tim Rice standing by. You know what that means? It means that we are switching cameras to the Rice and Beans camera. Tim, great to see you, man.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Great to see you, Kevin. I thought I'd take it Out. I'm out here pounding the pavement on Capitol Hill to really get right to the source for our beloved viewers.
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Cabot Phillips
So I appreciate that.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Now, this not just. It's not.
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Cabot Phillips
I'm going to be honest, Tim, this isn't as cool as when Mary Margaret says, hey, hey, guys, sorry, I'm on the White House front lawn right now because you're just out there with the tourists. Anyone could be standing where you're standing right now.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
I could, I could, I could move and show you the Capitol dome, but that would put me literally directly in the middle of a sidewalk. And I do not, I refuse to be a public nuisance. So just rest assured it's right that way.
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Cabot Phillips
Okay, we won't do that. So you've been on Capitol Hill, you've been talking to folks. What is the mood on the Hill following El Sayed? Just groundbreaking victory last night, I would say.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Well, you know, I would say cautiously optimistic, right? I mean, it was groundbreaking for a lot of reasons. Groundbreaking, as Julian, I think, was just saying pretty expertly, right? Because of this sort of represents the triumph of the Red Green alliance in mainstream Democratic politics. But not. Not groundbreaking in that it was a pretty close race until the end there with Haley Stevens, who for all of her faults and foibles, was the establishment candidate in this race. So I think that, you know, it sort of runs the gamut, right? I think that very progressive members of the House and Senate, less of the Senate than the House, are really excited about this. They're galvanized. Certainly the activist class is galvanized by this. I think the real establishmentarians, the Chuck Schumers, the Nancy Pelosi's, the groups that were, you know, the fundraisers, right on the opposite side, are a little bit wary because they find that this is going to be a difficult candidate to maybe win in the general. And it represents a little bit of a. A little bit of a difficult direction, right. For the party, one they don't, they don't necessarily favor. But I think for me, what I'm the most fascinated in and what I've started digging into a little bit is I want to see how the squad responds to this. Because, you know, it wasn't that long ago, Cabot, that the squad, aoc, Cori Bush, who just lost her comeback bid last night, Rashida Tlaib, has been voted out. Ilhan Omar, who, you know, is sort of like hanging at the margins. It wasn't that long ago that they represented the leftist vanguard of the Democratic Party. And now, partially because of choices that they made like aoc, who's clearly positioning herself for a Senate or presidential run and partially because the voters turned on them, as in the case of Cori Bush and Rashida Tlaib. They were sort of like the progressive movement that got left behind. Right? So I'm very interested to see where they come down on this. Are they going to join the Al Said bandwagon and hope that this brings more new fire, new life into their movement? Are they going to try to hitch themselves to him? Are they going to try to subtly undermine him and focus on perhaps some of his less progressive tendencies in ways that it sets them apart? Or are they just going to kind of stay silent and ride it out? It is a Again, Julian, I won't go on on this point because he just really explained it very well. But this is a watershed moment for the Democratic Party and I think what happens in the next year to 18 months is really going to set the future of the party for a decade at least.
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Cabot Phillips
Tim When I was in eighth grade, I switched schools when we moved and I was the new kid at Allr Mill or at at J. Lufton Simpson Middle School, I was the new kid and I loved being the new kid. I got all the attention. Four weeks later there was another new kid who showed up a little late during the school year and I hated Dave because Dave became the other cool new kid. I was no longer the new guy on the block. I think that's how some of the squad progressive members are feeling when they're like wait a second, we're supposed to be.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Absolutely. That's radical.
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Cabot Phillips
We're supposed to be the radical leftists. I want to move on from El Sayed. We've talked about him a lot but before we do I just have to play this clip of him that the I believe it was the Republican Senatorial Committee posted last night where he kind of told on himself let's roll that tape. I mean like you think about if you're on Instagram, my team has has access to my Instagram account and like the things that I actually look at on Instagram.
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Julian Epstein
Right.
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Cabot Phillips
Of course we get served that on your for you page. But then like every third video that scrolls on its own is going to be some onlyfans model and it's because it clocked me as being a 40 some year old man. I'm looking at my Instagram for you page. We got zero OnlyFans models in there. We got a lot of fishing, we've got a lot of sports videos and Jiu jitsu stuff. No. OnlyFans models. Is he kind of telling on himself? There's a reason that the algorithm puts those types of things in there.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Of course he's telling on himself, I think. And it's also especially bad that he said Instagram. Right. Because there have been, with all due respect to Elon and the good folks over at X, which is my personal favorite social media platform, there have been reports pretty well documented that since Elon took over what used to be called Twitter, a lot of bots with, you know, either pushing OnlyFans accounts or otherwise salacious content. Twitter is a place where, you know, the White House tweets and the first hundred replies are, you know, Russian bots pushing only fans. Instagram. Instagram is a different story entirely. To your point Cabin. I checked mine.
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Matty Frei Schultz
It's.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
It's a lot of like recipes, grill content. And then because I have kids, a lot of parenting content, which honestly infuriates me because Instagram dad content is all pretty lib, but, you know, nevertheless, that's what I get. I do think, yeah, perhaps Mr. Syed, you know, it's the green part of the red green alliance may be losing out in his mind over there.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I don't think that those posts are haram, but what do I know?
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Tim?
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Cabot Phillips
The Senate race sucked up all the attention last night, but there was what might be the craziest result of the year in Michigan's 8th congressional district involving a man who was not even technically in the race. What happened?
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
I genuinely don't know. I mean, the background is that this guy, and I'm forgetting his name right now, I apologize with due respect to this, to this fellow. But as the story becomes clear, you might see why he had dropped out of the race and Donald Trump had endorsed another Republican candidate. And yet the good citizens of Michigan's 8th congressional district cast their lot with the guy who didn't have Trump's endorsement and had functionally stepped out of the race. This is literally like something out of a television television show. There is. I'm going to live out a little bit here, but there is an arc of the West Wing where this exact thing happens like a dead guy wins a Democratic Senate prior House primary in California in the California 47th. So we're living that out in real time. Remains to be seen if he's going to jump back on the ballot or if the party is going to replace him with somebody else. I, like most of us in this business, have become very acquainted with the rules in Maine about what it goes in what goes into replacing Senate candidate in Maine. Thanks to Mr. Graham Platner, I am not yet sure how much the party or voters get to control what happens on a ballot in Michigan House races. But I can guarantee you that by this time tomorrow, me and a bunch of other folks with our jobs are going to be a lot more up to snuff on this.
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Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I must. So the guy's name is Thomas Smith. So he dropped out. He was on the still on the ballot, though. His opponent, who was endorsed by President Trump, was named Amir Hasan. And I do think that there are a lot of Republicans who probably got to the ballot and said, hmm, Amir Hasan. I don't know about some of the stuff going on in politics these days. I'm just gonna vote for the guy named Tom Smith. And so Tom Smith wins. Tom Smith sent a handwritten letter to the FEC inspector that was published online where he said, this is to notify you that Tom Smith for Congress was a late entry into the race for Michigan's congressional 8th congressional district. He's only raised $1,850. We therefore pair your email to us will not file a report until the next deadline. I could not file this form online because I had no success logging in and I've not been able to get a response from the help desk. So he sends this letter saying, hey, just take me off the ballot. We only raised eighteen hundred dollars. I can't figure out your website. It's very relatable, though. I can't figure out your website. I couldn't get anyone on the phone.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Tom Smith for president. I can't figure out the website. I'm honestly just pulling the ripcord. Sorry, gang. Handwritten. Probably use the forever stamp. You love to see it. That's a real American patriot right there. I think we need more Tom Smith on a national level.
- [29:57]
Cabot Phillips
I agree. Mr. Smith goes to Washington. Let's get him there. Tom Smith, the man who didn't even think he was going to be on the ballot, might become a congressman. A fascinating story there. Tim Rice, we always love chatting with you. Thank you for joining us from the sidewalk in that oppressive heat. And nice job. Not getting run over by a team takeover, not getting hit by a lime square scooter. Good job.
- [30:20]
Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
I do what I can. Thank you. Oh, thanks, Kevin.
- [30:23]
Cabot Phillips
There we go. Did someone just run into you?
- [30:26]
Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
No, it was a bug. A bug landed on me.
- [30:29]
Cabot Phillips
This is what you get.
- [30:30]
Jonathan Alpert
All right, Tim.
- [30:31]
Cabot Phillips
Appreciate it, man. Stay safe out there.
- [30:34]
Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
See you, buddy. All right.
- [30:35]
Cabot Phillips
If you're watching Wired in live on the Daily Wire plus app. Thank you. If not, that's where you should be. That's where you get push alerts when we go live. Breaking news as it happens and the latest smart investigative reporting team. Folks like Tim Rice who are braving the elements, fighting back against the cicadas that are descending on him. The Datawire plus app is free and available now on the App Store, Google Play, Apple tv, Roku, Samsung LG and more. Well, this year, cities across the country are installing tens of thousands of flock cameras to monitor roads, parks and other public areas. The cameras record license plates automatically and can track the movements of folks in their day to day lives. They are meant to find criminals and they've been successful in doing that. But many Americans have privacy concerns. Here with more on the topic is our good friend Rafael Mangual, fellow at the Manhattan Institute and contributing editor of City Journal. Rafael, great to have you back, man. Always great to be with you.
- [31:29]
Rafael Mangual
Always great to see Tim out in the wild.
- [31:31]
Cabot Phillips
Yes, in the wild. I can smell him. I could just see him getting sweatier as that hit went on. No offense to Tim. So before we get into this debate on these flock cameras, just so everyone's up to speed, can you just tell us more about the technology, what they're being used for, how law enforcement is relying on them?
- [31:48]
Rafael Mangual
Yeah. So flock cameras are. It's a brand, right? Flock is a brand of a kind of product. The kind of product that we're talking about here are ALPRs, or automated license plate readers. Basically, the technology can recognize license plates, record those movements in the areas where those license plates pass through a camera coverage space. Now, these things have been around for a really, really long time. So, you know, the debate that we're having now about privacy is actually really fascinating to me. And I wrote a piece recently for City Journal about this because I had seen all of these politicians coming out in support of bans and, you know, really onerous regulations on flocks and sort of, you know, nodding and winking to some of the folks who have been cutting these things down or vandalizing them. And it made me rethink Back to a 2012 Ars Technica piece that I remembered about the deployment of automated license plate readers in New York City. I mean, back then they were warning us that the NYPD was collecting millions of our travel records and could track us everywhere that we went. And our privacy was on a ticking time clock. And, you know, in that piece, if you read it carefully, what you learn is that the NYPD started deploying ALPRs in about 2006. They've been in existence in most American cities for many years, In New York City's case, for 20 years. And yet none of the greatest fears that we've been hearing about with respect to privacy have been realized in any of those jurisdictions. So I think that's a really good starting point for some of the folks who have been kind of put off by the alarmism surrounding this technology. But in essence, the technology is meant to spot vehicles that are wanted, right? I mean, I don't think that most governments have a ton of interest in just collecting endless amounts of information about every single license plate that's recorded by one of these things. I will say that the newer iterations of this technology make it so that they can track more than just license plates. So now these cameras are capable of not just reading license plates, but also noting the make, the model of the car, and then any other kind of features like a bumper sticker or, you know, some damage. So, you know, an officer can search for a car, let's say they have a partial plate, the last three digits, and a make model, and there's a, you know, a distinctive, you know, bumper sticker on the back, right bumper. They can put that information and then see if that car has been spotted by any of the cameras placed throughout the jurisdiction.
- [34:15]
Cabot Phillips
I'm gonna be honest, I'm torn on this topic. I understand these cameras are designed to track criminals, but my concern is that the definition of criminal can change, as we just saw during COVID lockdowns, where folks who were going to church or folks who were spending time with their family members became criminals. And so the idea of giving the government even more power to track people's whereabouts does concern me. Do you have those concerns?
- [34:41]
Rafael Mangual
I don't really. Not with respect to alprs anyway. I mean, look, for one thing, there are real constraints with respect to actually tracking individuals movements over a long period of time, right? I mean, we're talking about massive amounts of data storage, and you start running up against limits with respect to data storage pretty quickly if you're talking about tracking information for a really long time. The thing to know about flock cameras is that their default setting is 30 days of retention, right? So, you know, you're, you're only going to get picked up by the cameras if you drive past them. You know, most cities do not have anywhere near 100% coverage in terms of, you know, the, what the cameras can actually pick up on. Usually they're Placed pretty strategically at, you know, entry points, exit points, really main thoroughfares where cars are likely to go. So it's going to be really hard, I think, for the government to really track your movements for any significant period of time. I'm not particularly worried about that. That doesn't mean that I don't think that there's possibility for this to be abused. And as I say in my piece for City Journal, I think the thing that we ought to really worry about here is the use of this camp, this sort of camera to enforce and nickel and dime these kind of lower level infractions. Right? I mean, I drive almost every day. I live out in the suburbs, look, I roll through stop signs, I drive above the speed limit. I don't always signal if there's no one behind me when I'm changing lanes. Right. If it becomes this kind of tool that's used to send people a ticket every single time they violate even the smallest traffic law, I do that, that's going to invite a backlash that will end up with these cameras being banned, vandalized in even greater numbers than we're seeing now. And what that will mean is that we'll never be able to really realize the potential that these cameras can have for more serious kinds of law enforcement, which we've already started to see. I mean, there have been cases, for example, where, you know, recently a young mom had her car stolen with her child in the backseat. The individual drove off and she called 911, frantic, obviously. Right. I, you know, that's every parent's worst nightmare. But because of the flock cameras, you know, she was able to give that, that description, they were able to track that car down in relatively short order and find the child unharmed, thankfully. So, you know, there is a real trade off here. I think that there's potential harm with these things, but I'm not particularly worried about the privacy stuff. You know, we're talking about public space, right? I mean, at the end of the day, you don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy in public space. This is something that libertarian first amendment auditors really get a kick out of. Illustra on a pretty regular basis, there's a whole sub genre of YouTube now where individuals will just obnoxiously film in public in order to piss people off enough for them to call the police only so that they can record the police, you know, basically saying, well, we can't really do anything because they're filming public space. So I think this is just the world that we live in now. And we'll have to see how it plays out. I mean, I think sensible regulation should be on the table. We should be having, you know, sensible debates about, you know, how this technology can be used and what, you know, sort of structures we can build around it to make sure that we're minimizing the potential for abuse. But I think we would make a serious mistake if we throw the baby out with the bathwater here.
- [37:56]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. And I think the most compelling argument for these are some of the stories you just listed. And I saw a podcast clip recently where there were some young youths who were talking about some crimes that they were trying to commit in San Francisco, and they were saying, yeah, you can't even get away with carjacking anymore because they got flock cameras on every block. And they were lamenting the fact that it was harder to commit crime because of these flock cameras. I think that's very compelling. But I do think that there's something to be said for the slippery slope here. And even if something does make crime less likely, is that still a good thing for us to slowly allow our privacy to be chipped away? And I think of there are plenty of things that you could do that would make crime less likely. Why stop here? If we're gonna have 100 cameras in a town, why not have 200? Why not have 300? If we're going to have the, you know, if there are folks on the sidewalk or in alleyways that are engaged in drug deals, why not put listening devices and all of those things? I'm sure that that would allow us to crack down on crime. So where does it stop here?
- [38:58]
Rafael Mangual
Yeah, look, I mean, I do think that you make an interesting point, and we want to make sure that we're not, you know, completely invading everyone's privacy. But the thing about flak cameras is that they're only looking at cars and their features, Right? They're not looking at the individuals inside the cars. They're not using facial recognition. And the truth is that with respect to cameras, I mean, that cat's already out of the bag. I mean, most of our lives are now lived on camera. Whether we're talking about the Google Nest cameras in our homes, the ring cameras on our front doors, the security cameras outside and inside of almost every single business that we frequent, and the cameras that are in our own hands. Right? I mean, we often record everything from the exciting to the most mundane moments of our lives and then voluntarily upload that into the cloud and put it up on our social media sites. I mean, you know, For a populace that is really concerned about privacy, we do a really terrible job of keeping our private lives private. And you know, for, for the folks who are worried about, you know, what ALPRs are going to mean for their personal privacy, I would just point them to the examples of the cities that have deployed this technology for two decades now. None of those fears have been realized in places like New York, in places like Chicago and places like la. And I think part of the reason for that is that again, you would run up against real data storage constraints if you're talking about tracking people over a period of time. But also, I think we're talking about a little bit of main character syndrome here. I don't think most government agencies are all that interested in what we're doing day to day. You know, I know that you're going to be able to point to some instances of abuse. But as I say in my piece, I mean, you know, just as I don't think a handful of, you know, instances of excessive force justify writing off the entire institution of policing, I don't think a handful of instances in which some of this technology has been abused, you know, justifies, you know, leaving the proverbial money on the table when it comes to the potential crime fighting benefits. And, and I would put it in a separate category from things like listening devices and cameras with facial recognition that are covering sort of every aspect of our lives. I mean, do I think those things, you know, can, can possibly play a role too? Yes. But when it comes to ALPRs, I think the private, the privacy concerns are just largely overblown.
- [41:14]
Cabot Phillips
I have a flight in about three hours. I will be taking my two and a half year old, my six month old, my wife and I, we're gonna be flying. I proudly, every time I get to the tsa, opt out of the photo. And oftentimes the TSA agents will say, hey, you know, your face is already on every single security camera in this place. Why are you opting out of this one photo? I say, I understand that it's about the principle. It's my one minor act of pushing back against the government and I will still gleefully do that. It's a fascinating topic though. And one, and I think it's, I kind of lump it in similar with data centers where people are very riled up about it. And I think that there's a middle ground to be found on both of these topics. But it's definitely a conversation that's not going away anytime soon. And we are always glad to get to pick your brain on these things. Rafael, a pleasure to have you, man.
- [42:02]
Rafael Mangual
Much appreciated. Always great to be with you. Thanks.
- [42:05]
Cabot Phillips
Thank you, Rafael. Well, our next guest writes in a new piece on the Daily Wire that many of today's marriage counselors are actually doing more harm than good for their patients. It's Jonathan Alpert, a practicing psychotherapist and author of Therapy How America Got Hooked on Therapy and why It's Left Us More Anxious and Divided. Jonathan, great to have you back, sir. Thanks for being on Cabot.
- [42:28]
Jonathan Alpert
Thanks for having me on. I appreciate it.
- [42:30]
Cabot Phillips
You have a fantastic new piece up on the Daily Wires Upstream. I would encourage everyone to go read it. The title is why so Many Therapists Are Getting Marriage Wrong. What sort of errors are they making?
- [42:42]
Jonathan Alpert
Yeah, and I think you have to look at how politics has entered my profession. We have therapists that are quick to label someone as undateable or not a good partner simply because of the way that that person may have voted. And we also have a trend in my profession where it's very much focused on encouraging what I would say is selfishness. If you're not feeling entirely good, it's never anything you did. It might be entirely your partner's fault. So there's a lack of accountability and ownership I'm seeing when new people come to see me, they talk about their previous therapist. So I think therapists are just doing a lousy job with actually digging deep into couples work and really trying to look at what part one part of the couple might play in the relationship, and they're very quick to blame the other person.
- [43:37]
Cabot Phillips
You say in your piece that a lot of marriage counseling has turned into a performance review. What do you mean by that?
- [43:45]
Jonathan Alpert
It sure has. So not just in marriage, but also in the dating world, where people have an idea of what they think they need and want, which is fine, everyone should. But it almost seems like there's a constant evaluation or almost like a survey that's being done to monitor how satisfied they are with the partner instead of recognizing that marriage and relationships aren't perfect. And if you think that your partner should be perfect, you're likely setting yourself up for disappointment. Relationships are often strained, and they have their moments that aren't always great. But that's part of the work of being in a relationship and figuring out how to make it better.
- [44:28]
Cabot Phillips
Jonathan, in your work, I appreciate you speaking out against the mass adoption of what you call therapy speech, where folks have heard certain phrases on social media or maybe from their therapist language, like what's one of the phrases here that I love. Oh, protect your peace. This is one of the phrases that you talk about people using. What sort of impact does that have on people and how do you think it can be destructive?
- [44:55]
Jonathan Alpert
Yeah. And protect your peace, in my view, is just another way of saying do what you want, care only about yourself and forget that you actually have a partner and try to understand like what role he or she plays in the relationship. So it's become like a very selfish culture that we're in. And my book, Therapy Nation, the original title that I was playing around with was it's not all about you because it really speaks to how self involved and entitled people have become in our society. It's like the me generation and it's all about me and no one else. So I think we need to get back to consideration of our partners and the people around us and we might ultimately be a healthier society as a result.
- [45:44]
Cabot Phillips
Can you talk to us more about the impact of people maybe self diagnosing on social media? I've heard from friends who are in the therapy industry where they say, yeah, I have so many patients come in who may have seen a few tiktoks and they are convinced that they are on the autism spectrum or they are convinced that they have some sort of obscure mental illness because of something that they've seen on social media. Talk to us about the role that that has played.
- [46:09]
Jonathan Alpert
Sure. And social media in my view is a big problem. And of course, the influencers that earn their living on social media. So if you're a social media influencer and you have a million followers, they're going to believe what you say. And if you say, I think I have ADHD or this person's on the spectrum, they'll actually start to believe that. And what I'm seeing a lot of lately is these people will put out checklists. You know, here are five things to look for to know if your partner is ADHD or on the spectrum or a narcissist or if your relationship is toxic. And you know, these aren't professionals. These are just really popular people online and they do have influence over the many people that follow them. And it's destructive. But the problem isn't just with social media. I would argue it's coming from therapists. Therapists are very quick to throw labels out there. They're very quick to pathologize what I would call ordinary life experiences. So if you have a bad day or even a bad week, that doesn't mean that you're depressed. If you have a conflict with a colleague or a family member, that doesn't mean that that other person is a narcissist or, or it's a toxic situation. These are just everyday experiences that actually help us to build character and grow as a person. But therapists are very quick to label these as pathologic.
- [47:38]
Cabot Phillips
I've heard from some friends, Jonathan, who have talked about, you know, obviously I know people who have had very beneficial results from marriage counseling. So we're not throwing the baby out with the bathwater here. And that's certainly not what you're doing for anyone who reads your piece. But I've heard from some friends who said they almost felt like their marriage counselor was egging them on, kind of urging them to dig deep into these minor disagreements and maybe convincing them that something more serious must be at the root. Do you think that sort of thinking can create more serious divisions where they don't actually exist?
- [48:08]
Jonathan Alpert
Yeah, absolutely. And that's in line with what I just talked about, how therapists are quick to label or even create things that aren't there. But it does create division in relationships and also in our society where if we're labeling, for example, the way someone voted as wrong or negative or a problem, and I've certainly heard cases of other therapists looking negatively just because of the way someone voted, that's not a very healthy worldview or view of a patient or a couple that might be sitting in front of you.
- [48:44]
Cabot Phillips
One final question. What does good marriage counseling look like then, in light of all this?
- [48:49]
Jonathan Alpert
Well, and just to acknowledge your point, there are plenty of great therapists out there and certainly good marital counselors. I think for effective marital counseling, identifying what the issue is and not blaming necessarily the other person. Of course, if there's an act like cheating, that's one thing. But most of the cases I see with couples, it's poor communication, misaligned expectations and values and goals. And those things are fixable. Identifying what the issue is and then coming up with an actual plan and giving the couple exercises and things to think about and work on. So a very outcome oriented approach I find works best with couples.
- [49:32]
Cabot Phillips
I think next time you're on the show, I want to get some folks in the chat who have some questions. We can do some live therapy on air and we can get here.
- [49:40]
Jonathan Alpert
That sounds like a lot of fun. I think we should do that.
- [49:43]
Cabot Phillips
I agree. Jonathan, we really appreciate your time. Thanks watching for, for coming back and we'll get to you in the future. Always fascinating hearing your Insights.
- [49:51]
Jonathan Alpert
Sounds good, Kevin, thanks for your time.
- [49:52]
Cabot Phillips
Absolutely. That was Jonathan Alpert, author of Therapy Nation. We're joined now by a very special guest. It's Congressman Andy Ogles from the great state of Tennessee, our home state. Congressman, great to have you back with us. Thanks for being here.
- [50:08]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Absolutely, thanks for having me on.
- [50:09]
Cabot Phillips
We have to start, Congressman, with the big news. The election results. Last night in Michigan, Abdul El Sayed punching his ticket it to November. What do you think?
- [50:20]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Well, I mean I think it's a scary time and it's a wake up call for Americans to engage. There's an infection within the Democratic Party of socialism, of Islam, of these Marxists that really want to see the overthrow of the Constitution of our republic. I mean, El said his own words, he says it's racist if you're against Sharia law. Hey buddy, we have a constitution in a Bill of Rights and so Sharia law has no business in this country. And if you want Sharia law, go back to Greater Arabia and find a country there because we're not going to let it happen here.
- [50:53]
Cabot Phillips
Do you get the impression that your Democratic colleagues are scared by the rise of socialism within their base?
- [51:01]
Congressman Andy Ogles
I think they are absolutely scared. They're witnessing a takeover of their party. I mean look at Mamdani in New York. I mean this is the site of 9, 11 and now we have Mamdani. I mean this guy's a Marxist, he's a follower of Islam, he hates this country, he wants to undo the republic and that's who they elect as their mayor. You gotta be kidding me. You know the slogan back then was never forget. Well, I'm guessing by the election of Mamdani they forgot and unfortunately they're gonna have a harsh reminder when their economy is cratering. And look, you know, Texas is looking at opening their own stock market because. Because they're anticipating a failure of New York and their stock market. So look, this is quite frankly an opportunity for Republicans to take the lead. We have to do a better job of communicating and quite frankly giving solutions to the problems that Americans are facing. Which is quite frankly, right now it's all about gasoline and ground beef and affordability.
- [51:58]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, how do you make that case? Because I agree it is not simply enough to say socialism has failed. This isn't going to work. This is a failed ideology. It's been terrible. I don't think that's enough because I think voters, especially young voters, they're saying, hey, I don't care, nothing else has worked. I'm willing to try Anything. So what does that message look like of saying, hey, we're not just gonna point out the problem. We're going to have a solution. Here's the solution. What is that message?
- [52:23]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Well, fortunately, with Trump in the White House, a great communicator is to lay out that plan of fully articulating why we had to go into Iran. The fact we don't want boots on the ground, ground that we're going to make, you know, force the collapse of this regime. What that means is, is that on the horizon there are lower prices, that on the horizon, because you're going to have stability in the Middle east, greater stability in the Middle East. We're going to see fuel prices coming down, which, by the way, the President said just yesterday that he expects gasoline to start coming down, that he's spoken to the executives of these oil companies to make sure that they're passing, passing savings on to the consumer. So he's leading and he's communicating not only to the corporations but to the American people. But look, I think this is really going to be a pocketbook election. When you look to the midterms and the lefties are on the march. I mean, we've got this green super PAC, Kamala super PAC out of California, who's spending $2 million against me.
- [53:20]
Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
Why?
- [53:20]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Because I'm conservative. Because I'm the leader of the conservative movement, Because I'm endorsed by Trump and I'm close to the White House. House. And so they're targeting their own, but they're also targeting the conservatives that are leading for President Trump.
- [53:32]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah, I want to hear more about this, because your primary here in Tennessee, there's been an enormous cash infusion supporting your Republican opponent. And you would think that someone donating six, seven figures to a Republican primary candidate is a Republican. You say it's not. Tell us about who those donations are coming from.
- [53:52]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Yeah, so this gentleman, he's a green energy billionaire. So he's made money elsewhere, but, you know, he's gotten millions upon millions of dollars in subsidies from the federal government. He's made so much money off of subsidies that he's willing to spend $2 million against me because I was one of the ones who quite frankly, ended some of this fake green energy welfare. And that's all it is. It's welfare for billionaires in California. And you know what? We have veterans who are struggling. We have veterans killing themselves at a rate of 20 to 22 a day. So if I have to choose between these greenies and California or our veterans, I'M going to choose our veterans. We have third graders that can't read, write or do arithmetic. And you know what? If you go into the fourth grade and you can't read, write or do arithmetic, your chance of going to prison is off the charts. I'm going to choose the kids, not the Greenies in California. So I'm sorry that offends him, but I'm not gonna back down from this. The welfare is over for you, buddy. And we and other conservatives like myself, are not going away.
- [54:54]
Cabot Phillips
All right, I wanna get your take on a topic you've been outspoken about across the street in the Senate. Republicans have failed to pass the Save America Act. Still, this is one of the things I hear most commonly, as I'm sure you do, from your constituents. Why have we not passed this thing? And you've had some very strong words for Republican Majority Leader John Thune. Do you think he deserves the blame here?
- [55:14]
Congressman Andy Ogles
100%. No more excuses. No more hiding. Look, CNN poll, not the bastion of conservatism. They say 83% of Americans support the Save America Act. That's Republicans, that's Democrats, that's independents, that's black, white, brown, yellow. Across the board, people support the Save America Act. So even Democrats in the Senate can go home to their districts once they pass it. If they pass it and say, look, look, we did it. We did exactly what you asked us to do. So this idea that John Thune can't put this on the floor is nonsense. Put it on the floor. And look, if he's unwilling to do it, no hard feelings, step aside and let Mike Lee do it, because Mike Lee would let Rick Scott do it, because he would. Let Senator Blackburn do it, because I think she would. There's other senators who are willing to lead in the Senate, and it's time for him to either do his job, he signed up for it, he asked for it, or get out of the way because the American people have given you a mandate.
- [56:12]
Cabot Phillips
Folks in Senator Thune's office have responded to this criticism essentially by saying, look, I can't force Republicans to vote a certain way. I'm getting blamed for something that's not my fault. The votes just aren't there. What do you make of that defense?
- [56:26]
Congressman Andy Ogles
So put it on the Senate floor, let them vote, and then let them go home to their district and explain to their constituents why they didn't do what they were asked to do. It's that simple. There's accountability, and that accountability is your constituent. I work for the people in my district. For the people, state of Tennessee. Look, John Quincy Adams loved the House of Representatives because where you argued, you debated, you do the people's work. That's true in the Senate as well. They're supposed to be doing the people's work. And the people have said, pass the save America.
- [57:00]
Cabot Phillips
Yes, they have. Congressman, this week you introduced articles of impeachment against a federal judge who you say is circumventing the Supreme Court and in your words, quote, protecting Somalis over Americans. Tell us about that impeachment effort.
- [57:15]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Well, you know, so you have to understand, there's the Mullen vs Doe Supreme Court ruling. They just ruled that the president about two weeks ago or so has the authority to end TPS temporary protected status. And so, so you have the ruling of the Supreme Court, and yet you have this judge who's defying the law, who is defying the Supreme Court. So Judge Burroughs, again, needs to do her job or she needs to get out of the way. And look, at the end of the day, what she clearly is is an activist. She's not an impartial judge. And our founding fathers, they warned us of a judiciary that was too powerful, that a judiciary that was legislating instead of being that impartial judge. And that's what we're seeing here, where you have the judiciary undermining the President of the United States, quite frankly, defying the Supreme Court of the United States. And so the great thing about the articles of impeachment is when those are presented, you can lay out the case line by line while she how she has broken her oath to do her job. And you can look at it over and over again. When the president called for colleges to end de Harvard did not comply. She was the judge who stepped in and defended Harvard and wouldn't let the president, you know, not withhold some of their aid, some of their federal dollars. And so activism after activism after activism. And now she's siding with Somalis and with Haitians who are here illegally who are stealing from the American people versus siding with Americans and the law.
- [58:52]
Cabot Phillips
Congressman, I know you are a very busy man, so we appreciate your time. Thank you so much for joining, as always.
- [58:58]
Congressman Andy Ogles
Absolutely.
- [58:59]
Julian Epstein
Thank you.
- [58:59]
Cabot Phillips
That was Congressman Andy Ogles from the great state of Tennessee. Well, guys, as we have discussed plenty on this show, Ozempic is all the rage in Hollywood. We've got former champions of the body positivity movement dropping hundreds of pounds. As some have now said, Skinny is back. But is it going too far for some stars? Our next guest has a new piece up on the Daily Wire where she says Ariana Grande is wasting away and still blaming you for noticing. Joining us now is Daily Wire Upstream editor Matty Frei Schultz. Maddie, great to have you back.
- [59:34]
Matty Frei Schultz
Great to be here. Thanks for having me.
- [59:36]
Cabot Phillips
So tell us about this new piece. Ariana Grande wasting away, mad at us for noticing. What do you mean here?
- [59:44]
Matty Frei Schultz
So at the same time as we have a lot of people who used to weigh a lot who are now on Ozempic and are losing a few pounds, more than a few pounds. Ariana Grande is a singer who's always been very skinny and is now incredibly emaciated. This has been going on for a few years. If anyone watching has seen the films Wicked, the first and second films that came out in the past couple of years, she has gotten incredibly thin and she is now criticizing people for criticizing her for appearing basically, like she's very anorexic and has kind of become this hero to people who have eating disorders. These photos of her are getting spread around online forums of people who have very unhealthy relationships with their weight. And she just released a music video for her song Petals, where in the music video she applies for a job as an actor. She goes and she meets all these old guys behind a desk and they keep telling her she's not good enough, she's not right, she's too sexy, she's not sexy enough. And one of the comments they give her is she needs to lose a few pounds. And eventually she comes up, she's sick of it. All of these criticisms of her body, and she takes a chainsaw and she hacks off all of their heads. So it is an incredibly strange and violent music video. But basically what she is saying and what she has said in public statements before is she's tired of people talking about her body. And this is a question that people in the media are now debating. Is this something where we need to give her her privacy and we need to leave her alone, or do we need to say this level of. Of thinness is completely unhealthy and we don't want this to be a model for people who are struggling with their self image for young girls. This is something that we need to call out. And I definitely fall in the latter camp.
- [61:26]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. And if she's being honest in the video, she would not portray people saying, you need to lose a few pounds. I don't think anyone is saying that. If she were being honest, the men would be saying, hey, maybe put on a few pounds for your own health. She's responded in the past to people commenting on her body. The direct quote was, was I think we should be gentler and less comfortable commenting on people's bodies, no matter what. What do you think?
- [61:51]
Matty Frei Schultz
Yeah, I mean, I totally disagree. And I think that she's kind of trying to save herself by using this language of feminism that people are always commenting on women's bodies and we should let women live their lives as they want to. But there is a point where we have to draw a line and say, if you are appearing visibly unhealthy in a way that could affect people in, in a harmful way. And there are other celebrities in the past who have had these struggles with weight. Karen Carpenter, who died from heart failure related to anorexia. I think it's really important that we in the media or people who have platforms can call this out and say, this is not healthy. This is not a model for people who may see it and think, wow, she's lost a lot of weight. That's good. That seems healthy, because it's absolutely not.
- [62:34]
Cabot Phillips
Yeah. I've heard from many women who grew up in the 90s and early 2000s when they the heroin chic was in style. They talk about how hurtful it was for many girls in their body image to see that sort of just unhealthy thinness be emulated. And that's not to say that we should be celebrating obesity and lying to people about the health effects of that. But as you point out, I think there is a line that you can draw here. Matty, I want to get to another topic you've written about for the website. This was the new Spider man movie, which, I'm gonna be honest, I'm not a huge movie guy these days. I did not even know it was coming out. And then I look on the news and it's broken the all time box office record with a $360 million domestic opening. You write on the site about why it was so successful. What do you think?
- [63:23]
Matty Frei Schultz
Yeah. So this film made more money in its opening weekend than any movie ever, beating out even Endgame. And I have to say, I've become a Marvel skeptic. I used to to really look forward to each new Marvel movie that came out. But after Endgame, I kind of stopped watching. There were a lot of very formulaic stories. The stories weren't very interesting. It felt like Disney was just trying to make money off of fans without putting in the effort to tell good stories, make the movies really interesting. And they finally did it with this Spider Man. Movie which audiences clearly are resonating with. So many people have seen it. I went on a Monday night. It was a completely packed theater. Everyone around me seemed to really enjoy it, and it was just a really great story. And I think the lesson here is that people aren't sick of sequels as much as they are sick of badly told stories where studio executives think we'll just slap a familiar name on a story. We'll just kind of tell anything and people will like it and they'll enjoy it. And this is a really great film. It's very positive. It shows Peter Parker. For people who are familiar with the Spider man story, this is Tom Holland, who I think really does an excellent job. I grew up with Tobey Maguire, so I was a little hesitant to kind of move on to the. The Tom Holland movies. But he does an excellent job. He really has this innocence, but also this grit and the strength of character. And a big theme in this film is the feeling of isolation that I think a lot of people can relate to, especially Gen Z. It's not about phones, but I think it could be for people who are watching, the need to have other people in your life where, you know, spider man thinks, I need to protect the people that I love. I'm going to kind of stay away from them. And then the film shows that that is not what he should be doing. And it's not good for him. It's not good for the people around him. So really great messages, really well told story, great acting. Definitely recommend.
- [65:11]
Julian Epstein
All right.
- [65:12]
Cabot Phillips
We're planning on getting a babysitter soon so we can go see a movie. We were going to do the Odyssey. You may have convinced me. Maybe we should go see Spider man instead. It sounds pretty nice. Maddie Freischulz, A pleasure to see you. And I believe we'll be together in person tomorrow up in D.C. at this YAF rally at Mount Vernon. Have I heard correctly?
- [65:31]
Matty Frei Schultz
Yes. Yes. That's great. I didn't know you'd be there.
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Super Sure Insurance Agency Announcer
I'm looking forward to it.
- [65:34]
Julian Epstein
I'd be there.
- [65:35]
Cabot Phillips
I'm looking forward to it as well. Maddie, great to see you. Thanks so much for coming on.
- [65:40]
Matty Frei Schultz
Thanks for having me.
- [65:42]
Cabot Phillips
That was Daily Wire writer and editor Maddie Fries Schultz. And this was Wired In. If you guys are on Apple or Spotify, thank you for watching. And if you want the show to continue, head over to our live listener Q and A. I want to meet you guys. Guys, everyone who's on the Daily Wire member chat. I get to know all of these people. You guys are my friends now the people who are only on Apple or Spotify. I'll occasionally see your comments, I'll see your tweets, your messages. It's nice, but I haven't really gotten to know you yet. So go become a Daily Wire member so we can become familia dailywire.com subscribe join the live chat. I will see all of you tomorrow.
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Jonathan Alpert
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Cabot Phillips
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