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- [00:00]
A
That was quite the conversation we had about sex. It's pretty interesting.
- [00:04]
B
That's one way to start an episode.
- [00:05]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [00:07]
B
Get the people going, why don't you?
- [00:09]
A
What do you think about it?
- [00:10]
B
I think a lot of things about sex. I mean, it's a very interesting activity that has physical, social, emotional, and spiritual implications.
- [00:24]
A
Yeah. It's the closest physical bond that two human beings can have. And so it's a big deal. Yeah. It brings forth life, but it also can bring forth destruction if you misuse it.
- [00:36]
B
Yeah, I think. I think the church talks about sex a lot. I kind of do think that we're often appealing to the positive aspects of sex as a setup to just go in for 30, 40 minutes about the negative expressions of it. And so I think it would be helpful for us to talk about, like. Like, talk about the beauty of it. Yeah, More than we talk about, like, the negative misuses of.
- [01:00]
A
You think that, though? You think that we talk about the. The ugliness of sex more than we talk about the beauty?
- [01:04]
B
I think we always are starting with Romans 1 instead of Genesis 1 and 2. Like, we're starting with, like, the. Like, the deviations of God's original design and not giving as much energy to God's. Like, the. Like, what is Genesis? Like, he knew his wife. Like, what does that mean?
- [01:19]
A
Why do you think that is? You think that is? Because we've seen sex misused so much.
- [01:24]
B
It's everywhere. You turn on Netflix, you on Hulu, you turn on YouTube ads. Like, I think we see the negativity more. So it's just. It's just in us. You know what I'm saying? But I think there's beauty to be explored.
- [01:35]
A
It kind of reminds me of just how people just present the gospel holistically. Like, I think a lot of times we present the gospel with the fall of man and not God creating his creation and then calling it good. So I think even when we share the gospel, people need to know that, no, you were created by a good God. And then the bad news comes.
- [01:52]
B
Right?
- [01:53]
A
And so even when we think about sex, it's like, no. Sex was originally created for God's glory. Right. For us to be fruitful and to multiply. And so if we start there, people will know the purpose of sex. And I think that we can have a good start.
- [02:05]
B
Yes, I wish I knew that. It's the saints and the A. It's the saints and the A. You heard that vibrato. It's the saints and the A.
- [02:26]
A
If you keep opening our Podcast like that, people gonna think it's the Saints. And the podcast is called the Saints and the ain't. And not 30 minutes with the Paris.
- [02:34]
B
How are you?
- [02:35]
A
I'm doing good. How you doing?
- [02:36]
B
I didn't think I ever come back for that, because I disagree, but I didn't have any language to talk about why I disagree. How's your day going?
- [02:44]
A
It was going good. I woke up with you and came here to record podcasts.
- [02:49]
B
Did you ever think that when you got married, it would get, like, old to sleep with the same person in the same bed every day? Like, what did you think that would be like, to sleep in the same bed with the same person for the rest of your life?
- [03:04]
A
Well, the. The first. The first year we were married, I was. I was surprised that you slept with the window open in the wintertime. I was like, she's in her late 20s. Is she going through menopause now? I just didn't. Starting with the disrespect, I just didn't get it. I was. I thought she was trying to kill me. So I thought, you know.
- [03:23]
B
Well, I still don't understand, because it's April, right? I came in the house last week from Glory, and you had the fireplace on. That's what I don't understand is that it's springtime and you somehow still need fire. That doesn't. That doesn't compute to me.
- [03:39]
A
So what you're not telling the people is because what I think you need iron supplements. What you're not telling the people was it was cold last week and you left the window in our closet open. And I didn't know, but this is what. Room was freezing.
- [03:51]
B
This is where the tension is. Is that the way you define cold is differently than the way I define Coke? So you think 55, 56 deserves a fireplace.
- [04:03]
A
So. No, the way it just deserves. The way I find coal is if it's. If it's snowing outside, it's April. The windows, it shouldn't be open April. But in Chicago, you used to have the windows open when it was snowing outside.
- [04:16]
B
Notice you didn't even answer my question. Deflecting.
- [04:19]
A
That's what I know how to do.
- [04:20]
B
So while we're here today, we're going to talk about sex, but more specifically, some of the, I guess, messages around sex in marriage or. And the messages we don't or should be receiving before marriage. Is that. Is that a correct way to say it?
- [04:45]
A
Yeah, the. The unhealthy expectations. I think our society and our culture kind of Puts on people entering into marriage, making them think that, oh, my sex life is going to look like this, or it has to look like this, or if I've done xyz, I should expect XYZ in marriage. It just doesn't look like that.
- [05:06]
B
Is that your experience?
- [05:08]
A
I think it was my experience. I think nobody told me that me being a young Christian man who was fleeing lust, like every woman not named wife was made of flames.
- [05:22]
B
Right. Is that a poem?
- [05:24]
A
Yeah, yeah, got it. It was a poem.
- [05:27]
B
She just busted out with it. Like, it was just like a thing.
- [05:30]
A
Right. Like that. When I entered into marriage, I had this idea that man, like, my sex life should. And it was going to look like how I. How I wanted it to look like. And it just doesn't work like that.
- [05:47]
B
Yeah, I think. I think, if anything, I think I assume the same thing. Because one, I didn't hear, I heard about sex and sexuality typically in two contexts, which is sex is to be avoided so that you, you know, you don't go to hell or you can have sex in marriage and it's going to be awesome.
- [06:10]
A
Yeah.
- [06:10]
B
Like, which is two extremes. And so I think I avoided it, did all the things I could to be pure, quote, unquote. And then when I got married and sex came with a bunch of baggage and work that I did not expect, it was just deeply discouraging. Especially because if you don't hear people talking about the nuance that sex and marriage can be, then you think that you're the only one with the problem.
- [06:37]
A
Absolutely.
- [06:37]
B
You know what I'm saying? Like that. Like that what is uniquely happening between you as a married couple ain't happening to everybody else, but it is happening to everybody else. They just not talking about it.
- [06:47]
A
Yeah. And what I think we're not trying to do, we're not trying to paint the picture. Like everybody's gonna have the same, you know, testimony entering into marriage. But what I am saying is that I think that we should give people different perspectives and prepare people for what they might experience entering into a marriage so they won't be distraught or highly disappointed when your sex life doesn't look like how you think it should look like immediately.
- [07:17]
B
Okay. So for the male species, what is the. What are some of the most predominant assumptions about sex? Let's address.
- [07:29]
A
So here's the thing. I be really wanting to help my brothers. You know, I'm saying when I see them online, because I think. I think purity culture in a lot of ways has affected a lot of people. And what Is purity culture. Purity culture is. This is. Well, I don't want to. I don't want to try to define purity culture and put it in a box.
- [07:49]
B
So let me do it for you.
- [07:50]
A
Okay.
- [07:50]
B
Yeah, go. So purity culture was a moment in time primarily within evangelical Christianity, where there was all these messagings and messaging and books, like from Joshua Harris, I Kissed Dating Goodbye. But basically this messaging around staying pure for marriage. And so, like, they would have like, you know, purity balls where you go and dance with your dad and, and, and I guess commit to living a pure life. And then you get like, the purity ring, which was a sign of your situation and like, when this was happening. This is like 90s primarily. So that's why I think it was a moment in time, because we weren't necessarily Christian nor in evangelical culture during that. But I think the, the problem, one of the problems with purity culture is what it was kind of a version of a prosperity gospel which said, if you are pure, then your marriage is going to be good and your sex life is going to be good out because you obey God all these years, and that's just not a thing. So go ahead.
- [08:53]
A
And what I see now a lot of the times is I see these. I see these reels and I see these videos of dudes on social media talking about what they want in a marriage and talking about when they come home, what they. What they want to expect. And like, they. And I get it, like, we're not married. We. It's. It's not all the way wrong to fantasize or to dream about the ideal marriage that, that, that we want. I think the problem comes in. I've tried to tell a couple of brothers this in person. I think the problem comes in is when you speak about a woman that you haven't even met yet, a complicated being, right? A complex individual who probably God is going to connect you with or bring you together with, who has her own set of problems, have her own trauma, has. You know what I mean? And so, like, if you automatically think that your wife is just going, you know, out the gate, you know, not come in the marriage with her own set of problems or, you know, whatever, like, you might set yourself up for failure. And I think a lot of dudes, when they get into marriage, they'd be deeply disappointed because, yeah, we're complex beings.
- [10:08]
B
You know, what's crazy, though, is that I think sometimes when people, primarily guys, when they, you know, fantasize about the ideal woman, I want her to, you know, rub my feet. I want her to have sex with me every time I ask. I want, you know, lingerie on Thursday nights and Friday nights, like, just. Just all of this stuff. I don't think they also see that there's the potential that the way you imagine sex in marriage is also a function of trauma. Because what if these men have dealt with all kinds of rejection from their mother? And so you really want a woman that will never reject you? That's trauma. That's not Bible.
- [10:50]
A
That's why. That's why a lot of men watch porn.
- [10:51]
B
But that's my thing. You think that your ideals about sexuality are actually right and biblical when they're actually not.
- [10:59]
A
Yeah.
- [11:00]
B
So not only is she dealing with her own trauma, now she got to deal with yours.
- [11:03]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I agree. And I think. I think for me entering into marriage, I just thought, man, like, not only was I entering into marriage with my own set of traumas, I had this idea in my head that, man, God is going to honor me because I honored him with my body. And so he's going to let me, you know, just, you know, have this wild and crazy sex life off jump. You know what I'm saying? And it was like. No, like, what God showed me eventually is that. No, like, I've called you to enter into a marriage with a. With a person for you to grow and learn how to satisfy this person. And it's not just about what you want, you know what I'm saying? And what you need and what you desire. Yeah. It's about growing and learning this person. And I think that's. I think that's one of the things that I feel like the church can do a better job at. It's teaching us. No, this is a. A union, a marriage where you have your whole life to become comfortable with somebody. And that's another thing. It's like when we marry someone, we don't even know them like that. For real. For real.
- [12:18]
B
No.
- [12:19]
A
Right.
- [12:20]
B
We don't. I definitely didn't know you.
- [12:22]
A
Yeah. You know what I'm saying? And so for somebody to like you.
- [12:25]
B
Ain'T even know you. Hello.
- [12:26]
A
I didn't. Yeah. I didn't even know me. And so, like, you. You have to. Yeah. I just feel like sometimes people just. Just forget that it's a. It's a process of learning and growing with one another.
- [12:38]
B
Yeah. And I get it. I. I think it's taken time for me, and it's going to continue to take time for me to understand the purpose. Purpose of sex as it exists in a Marriage, you know, because I think, especially when growing up in this like, culture where pornography and pornographic images are so easily accessible, it makes sex and sexual sexuality a matter of comfort and convenience rather than a thing that exists between two people in a covenant relationship so as to bring them closer together and intimate. Right. And so it's not this convenient medicine, if you will, like this is to, to mimic the beauty and the intimacy and the long suffering and patience and eternality of the gospel and God's love for us. And so like, I think when you have that perspective, then you see, nah, like in the same way that I'm giving, getting to know your mind, getting to know your quirks, your personality, the same way I need to get to know your body and how your body functions and what it likes and what it doesn't like. And that, that takes time. And I even said on Instagram the other day on Twitter, I was like, even the fact that like, if we're together 40, 50, 60 years, you will always be changing and maturing. You will become a different Preston. Not different in the sense of another Preston, but 50 year old Preston is not going to be 36 year old Preston. Right?
- [14:01]
A
Yeah.
- [14:02]
B
And so I'm actually going to have to change in a way. Like I'm gonna have to like, know what you need and what you expect and what you want as a 50 year old. I can't keep giving you the same thing that you expect as a 36 year old. I don't think that made any sense.
- [14:14]
A
Yeah, but no, it did make sense.
- [14:16]
B
Because we always are growing.
- [14:18]
A
Because if I can think about myself and just be honest, the way I thought about sex was such a narrow minded, empty view of it entering into marriage. Because I didn't think about how. No logic will tell you that the sex life that you want in year one, you probably want to have in year eight or year nine.
- [14:44]
B
Right.
- [14:44]
A
Because I've had the opportunity to learn what this person wants to learn what this person desires to learn how to woo this person, to learn what triggers this person to learn, that this person needs to feel like they have the autonomy to choose at times.
- [15:03]
B
So what you're saying is, is that sex and marriage takes work.
- [15:07]
A
It does. And we don't like that. We don't like that because our culture does not teach us that work and sex should go hand in hand.
- [15:16]
B
So let me ask you this teaches.
- [15:17]
A
Us that we should get it at the drop of a dime or whatever. We feel the earth.
- [15:20]
B
So I know you talk to because you'll come Home and talk to me about it. There's a lot of men that you talk to who are married now, and one of their primary frustrations in their marriage is that they have to work. Yeah, right. Like, what is when you counsel them, what, what do you say?
- [15:35]
A
I, I tell them so. And one thing I think we should talk about in this podcast is women who have been traumatized and men who, because that's, you know, I think you kind of gave some, some statistics about women, you know, being traumatized.
- [15:52]
B
I think it's one in four women, I have to confirm that one in four have been sexually abused.
- [15:56]
A
Yeah. And so just a lot, you know, after, you know, we got married, I started to meet other men who had been with women who had been sexually abused. And it's kind of like this. Oh, I get it. But, you know, I love her.
- [16:14]
B
Give up the draws. Trust God.
- [16:17]
A
Yeah.
- [16:18]
B
Obey.
- [16:18]
A
Yes. And, and so I, I had to, by the grace of God. And I think God and his sovereignty sent me my way for me to, to help them and to, and to, and to, like, share my experience with him. You know what I'm saying? Because. What was your question again?
- [16:35]
B
I completely forgot. So when it comes to the dynamic work for your intimacy, that's frustrating for a lot of men.
- [16:41]
A
Got you. Yeah. Yeah, I, I, I do think it's frustrating because, because, let's just be honest, arousal is, is a thing. And so I think when someone is aroused, they want it right then and there. You know, a man, when he comes home and he sees his beautiful wife, it's like, man, like, I think a lot of times the urge is I want to, I want to engage her physically. Right. But I think one thing that God has taught me is that I have to really search for a lot of humility. I have to really search for a lot of patience. And I have to look to him to say, man, like, it's not always about what I want, when I want it. And the reason why is because you are complex, nuanced, individual. And so for me to have this expectation that you're going to want to have sex exactly when I want it, when you have your own set of trauma that you dealt with before you even met me, it's just not a realistic expectation. And so what I had to do is I had to. People know that you have experienced, you know, trauma and you've been abused, you know, sexually, through your testimony, whatever. And so one of the things that I had to do as a man is say, man, how can I humble myself right and not always think about my needs when I want them, but to make my wife feel like she has the autonomy to choose when we.
- [18:10]
B
Come together, which is major. It's huge. Because when. When someone is sexually abused, the fundamental thing that was taken from them is their rights.
- [18:19]
A
Absolutely.
- [18:20]
B
You know, like you. Someone took my body and did with it whatever they please.
- [18:26]
A
Right.
- [18:26]
B
And so when you get into a marriage where a man feels like he has dominion over your body and you don't have any autonomy or freedom to say yes or no, if it. It. I think it makes whatever trauma you have worse. And God forbid you start to see your spouse through the lens of your abuser. You know what I'm saying? And so I think it's huge for a man to be humble enough and for the conversations around the fact that, like, I need to have the freedom to say no without consequence. Yeah, right. Because there's some women who will say no, not right now. And the man, you know, you had seasons of this where he'll say, okay, but his whole body is dejected and he got an attitude.
- [19:09]
A
You talking about me because I was mean.
- [19:11]
B
He's not talking no more. And it's just like. Like to know that my no has a consequence. Doesn't feel like I actually have freedom in saying no. You know, I want to say no.
- [19:21]
A
And still be loved, but from the man's perspective. And I. I think for the men who are listening to this, I want to encourage them because I think what it can feel like, and this is just from my own experience and talking to other men. Right. It can feel like that no is going to be for the remainder of your marriage, but it's like no.
- [19:39]
B
Like, I think feels like an eternal no.
- [19:41]
A
I think what. I think what giving someone who has experienced trauma the autonomy to say no or to say, well, maybe Tuesday, right. Give makes in the past, even now, I realized that it made you feel more comfortable. Yeah, it felt safer. Where it didn't have to be like that all the time as we grew together and your trust grew for me and your love grew for me, and the more you was able to disassociate me with the people who did traumatize you in the past. And it gets better, you know what I'm saying? And so I think that, yeah, our society, it doesn't paint this picture that work and sex should go hand in hand. Like we. We have sex at the tip of our fingertips. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, porn is instant, you know what I'm saying? Even when we was in a world, sometimes being around promiscuous people, sex was instant. And it's like, no, like, God is probably calling you to somebody who is going to sanctify you in a way that you never thought.
- [20:48]
B
Got a question? I could hear somebody listening to this podcast, like, okay, that's doing too much. Like, if. If I got to do all that, then I'm actually. I need to be more picky about the kind of people I'm a date and I'm a Mary, you know, because I could see how that doesn't sound fun or beautiful or good. And so why is working for intimacy even a good thing?
- [21:12]
A
Because I don't think it's our job to pick and choose how God chooses to sanctify us.
- [21:17]
B
Okay.
- [21:18]
A
And what I mean is, I think we. We as Christians, we say we want to be sanctified. We say we want to. You know, we want to grow, and we want to. We want to grow as men of God. And we, you know, but. But a lot of times, God uses the things that we want the most to be hard to help sanctify us and to grow us. Like, as a man and as a husband, I have so much more patience dealing with the things that we've dealt with in our marriage. I have so much more knowledge and I have so much more wisdom to give to other men, you know, I'm saying, who experience the same type of thing. For some. Like, the thing. The thing that I realize now is that most of the beautiful things that we experience in this world comes with work.
- [22:06]
B
Yes.
- [22:06]
A
You know, I'm saying, like, if it's hard, if God is bringing you through something that's hard, we have to believe that on the other side, it's beauty, you know, I'm saying. And so, like, I love my marriage now in year three, I do.
- [22:23]
B
Wow.
- [22:24]
A
In year three, it was tough.
- [22:25]
B
That's a good thing.
- [22:25]
A
In year eight, it's. It's. It's way better. And so, yeah, like, you have a lifetime, you know, to. To. To learn and to grow with somebody. And so to. To. To experience. To want to experience. Now, I'm saying. I'm not saying that, you know, in year one, your sex life ain't gonna be bombed from. From jump because people have their testimony. But I just don't want people to have an expectation that it. That it's going to be that way.
- [22:53]
B
Yeah, I mean, I think there are some couples I know who, you know, starting off, they did not have a problem with their sex life. They had Problems with their, you know, money or communication. But I always knew it was coming. It's gonna come. One, because we got a real devil. Two, because everything else that happens in the marriage affects the bedroom. And so if there's problem with problems with communication, it's going to affect the bedroom. Yeah. If there's problems with trust is going to affect problems. So when the butterflies go away at the end of the day, something going to happen where now we have to work and pray and fight to get to know one another in a way that's trying.
- [23:36]
A
So one of the things that we talked about as men, how the unhealthy expectations that men have. What are some unhealthy expectations women have? You feel like in this. In this area or y' all just don't have them?
- [23:51]
B
I'm sure we do. I just don't know what they are. It might be the same, you know, with purity culture. No, that's what I'm saying. I'm saying I think it's the same in a unique way. I don't think the woman has this dominion ethic where, you know, I'll. I'll be able to have sex whenever I want. Whenever I pursue my wife, she's going to respond. If anything, it may be I will want to have sex all the time and that I will enjoy it when statistically only 65, I think percent of women climax. Right. And so there's a lot of men who. Yeah. When the woman says yes, they get. They rocks off while the woman is sitting there with her legs still. So I think, if anything. Yeah, there are. There are a lot of women who had the expectation that they would have consistency in being pleased, and they're not. And they're fearful of sharing it with their spouse because they don't want him to feel, you know, rejected and all of that type of stuff. So it's like, man, that's a bummer.
- [24:55]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [24:57]
B
Which is a part of the work. Like, to have a better sex life, you have to actually text you. You have to have a conversation about what's bad. So it could be better.
- [25:07]
A
Yeah.
- [25:07]
B
You know, and so stop faking all that noise and just tell this man, hey, bro, it ain't working for us.
- [25:14]
A
So. So let me.
- [25:15]
B
Not working out.
- [25:16]
A
So. Have you ever talked to women?
- [25:19]
B
I'd rather watch tv.
- [25:20]
A
Who said they fake?
- [25:22]
B
Yeah.
- [25:23]
A
Like, really?
- [25:25]
B
Yeah. Well, yeah. And some of it is I have to fake it so you can stop.
- [25:30]
A
Wow.
- [25:31]
B
So let me just, like, make this noise so you think you doing something which makes you Excited. So you can get up off me. Wow. And the sad. That's how you know it's bad because he doesn't even. He's not even able to read your body language to know the difference between when it's real and when it's fake.
- [25:48]
A
And that's a problem. And that's another thing I think. I think we need.
- [25:53]
B
You might as well do it to a man.
- [25:54]
A
I think we need to start having real conversations in churches.
- [25:58]
B
Yeah.
- [25:59]
A
You know, and saying, man, you probably think, bro, you. You better than what you. You think you are.
- [26:06]
B
Yeah.
- [26:06]
A
And. And God forbid, like, your wife don't want to have sex because it's. It's whack.
- [26:11]
B
You're bad.
- [26:12]
A
You're bad at it. And so, like, man, like, I. I don't. I don't think. I think that we need to start teaching men to learn how to pay attention to a woman's body.
- [26:21]
B
Yeah.
- [26:22]
A
Like, if you're doing something, don't try to get creative. Keep doing that.
- [26:27]
B
Why did you shimmy?
- [26:29]
A
I'm just saying, keep doing that. Same thing you was doing. Because she seemed like she was liking it. You know what I'm saying? I've had to have conversations with dudes. We know, people that, you know was like, yo, can Preston, can you help? And I'm like, yo, if she learned how to pay attention to what to.
- [26:51]
B
Hilarious. How we trying to keep this pg? I'm just saying, when you, like, it's a lot of read between the lines happening. Go ahead.
- [26:59]
A
I'm saying if.
- [27:00]
B
If.
- [27:00]
A
If. You know what I'm saying? Like, so I. I think a lot of men, pride and not ego, don't want to admit that. Like, no, like, we have to. We have to grow. Like, you can become good if you humble yourself and say, you know what? I'm not right now.
- [27:14]
B
Yeah. And that's, I think, the beauty of marriage, because in the tweet that I made, I said that I really dislike the idea of people trying it before they buy it. You know, feeling like you have to have sex before marriage so that you know what you're getting yourself into when that's literally the antithesis of what marriage is for. Marriage, again, is for us to learn one another. And so, like, even if you have experience with sex and sexuality outside of your spouse, that doesn't mean that that will actually please your spouse. Like, your spouse is their own person. So you have to learn this individual, and that takes humility, and it takes courage, but it actually ends up working out in the long run.
- [27:58]
A
But also, babe, so I'll say this. In our marriage, like, I didn't have a lot of room to be bad at things because you are an extremely honest person.
- [28:11]
B
Yeah.
- [28:11]
A
And so when you don't like something, you're gonna know. I'm gonna know. You know what I'm saying? Which I kind of feel like, you know. Yeah, whatever.
- [28:21]
B
But thank you for tempering your time.
- [28:25]
A
Yeah. You saw that.
- [28:26]
B
I did.
- [28:28]
A
But can you speak to the women who are afraid to communicate to their husband? I don't like this.
- [28:34]
B
I mean, I did just sit them down and share it respectfully and make it a we conversation. Because I always think it's. That kind of truth is harder to receive when all of the blame is placed on the individual instead of. Instead of it being you are bad. Do this, do that, say, how can we work together to make sure that we are both pleased? Right. So it becomes a team conversation.
- [29:02]
A
Yeah. You got.
- [29:03]
B
Not just like a blame conversation.
- [29:04]
A
You gotta rub his ego. You can't just slap his ego.
- [29:06]
B
Nah, you can't, because that's. That's just. You know, men are very fragile.
- [29:10]
A
We're all fragile.
- [29:12]
B
We are. But y' all are particularly fragile because you refuse to identify and own that you're fragile. So it makes your fragility that much worse. Actually, y' all don't even want to cry in front of people. That tells you how fragile you must be. But that's another conversation for another day.
- [29:28]
A
Oh, whatever. So we can't be attacking the dudes like this. You're saying.
- [29:32]
B
I'm not. I'm just trying to help. This. This sex conversation has to be more common because it's a part of humanity. And I hate that the world is always the one leading the way.
- [29:46]
A
Yeah.
- [29:47]
B
In this conversation. When they should not be. It really should be the church because we serve the God that created sex.
- [29:55]
A
Yeah. And sex is great. You know, I'm saying sex is something that God has given us to enjoy. You know, And I think I hear Christians all the time saying the world shouldn't enjoy sex, you know, as much as Christians. Or that world should be the only ones enjoying sex and not Christians. And I think it's some truth to that. But I think the problem comes in. And when we. When we don't teach Christians that it has some level of work into it, like, you have to put some work into it. You know what I'm saying? It's not going to be this instant gratification all of all.
- [30:30]
B
All the time, because that is straight up pornography. Culture. Yeah, that logic is pornographic.
- [30:36]
A
Absolutely. You know I'm saying, and pornography, it's fake. You know what I'm saying?
- [30:40]
B
Here we go.
- [30:41]
A
It's not. It's not real, you know, I mean, and even when you out in the world and you're being promiscuous, really, you're just having sex with a whole bunch of broken people who don't even know themselves, you know what I'm saying? And they ever became whole, they probably have issues with sex, too. And so, yeah, like when. When two whole people come together and they're. And they're aware of their emotional trauma and they're aware of their. Their. Their spiritual sinfulness. Yeah. You know, some issues are going to come up, but as time goes on, it gets better, I promise.
- [31:14]
B
Yeah, we gonna be 72. Barely making it, getting it in, but doing it anyway, right?
- [31:21]
A
Knocking each other hips out of place.
- [31:22]
B
Ow. All right, y'. All. Bye. That's the first 30 minutes with the Perrys is a production of Ivy Media podcast, edited by Angie Elkins, video recording and audio production by Kim Powell, artwork by Hop and music by Swoop. Join us on Patreon for early access to. With the Perry's episodes and other exclusives, you got two options. You can go to www.patreon.com forward/with the Perrys, or just go ahead, scroll. You'll find the link in our show notes. We are the Perrys. Thank y' all for listening. Now go with God.