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Inside their legacy these women there wait for you and me and her and she Breaking boundaries, building a better world Designers, you should know that you should know Women Designers, you should know. Hi friends. Welcome to Women Designers, you should know. I hope you're all having a happy holiday season and end of year season. I wanted to do a 2024 Rewind episode. Or as I like to call it, the episode where I remind myself why I signed up for all this work in the first place. Let me paint a little picture for you. So over the past seven or eight months, I've researched, written and produced episodes on 29 incredible women. And then as if that weren't enough, I've created 60 reels on Instagram because apparently I thought being a podcaster meant being a full time content creator too. And I'm so glad it is striking a chord with so many people getting over 200,000 views on some of the reels. Last year, or even at the beginning of the year was starting to hit a million with some of the reels too. So it's gained a lot of attraction. And I'm so glad that this whole project is resonating with so many of you. And I like to go way back to the beginning. Why did I even start all of this? It goes back to college for me, sitting in lecture after lecture wondering why every example of quote unquote influential design or amazing design was attached to the name of some man. And it wasn't a conspiracy. Or maybe it was, but it was clear women weren't getting their due. And they still aren't. In fact, did you know I looked the stat up that only 0.5% of history books feature women prominently? Yeah, kind of sucks. And that's why I use the phrase let's redesign history by celebrating women. Because that's what this whole podcast is all about, is rewriting history. And the fact that there's still so many books that need to be rewritten and new books that need to come out, and that this isn't just a women's problem. This is an all gender problem. This is something that will benefit all genders, learning from the layers of different cultures, different ethnicities, different genders, and those layers really add so much richness to design. So this podcast was born out of the sheer audacity to believe we could change that one episode at a time. I am a very hopeful person. It's already hit number four as high as number four on the design podcast charts, Apple podcast charts, and even 57 on the arts charts. And so I really hope that this continues to spread and get into the hands of even non designers too. Or maybe some of you are already non designer listeners and I so appreciate you being here because that is how the word is going to spread. Along the way, I've learned so much. Not just about the incredible women I've covered, but also about the shared themes and challenges that connect them all. From groundbreaking designs to quiet revolutions. There's been so much crossover, so many layers, and today's episode feels like an excavation of sorts. I'm going to dig deeper through all of these past episodes to connect the dots of this year's work and I think it'll be fun to take a moment to celebrate, reflect and get inspired all over again. So I have six different major themes that I thought was a really great way that connected a lot of these. I might not be able to touch on every episode today, but definitely the ones that have a lot of these connecting themes. The first one is this idea of not learning about women in school, which I just touched on, but is also one of the most frustrating themes that kept popping up this year and I wondered if it was just me and it isn't. And I was hearing from some of these other guests that they were also not learning about women in design while they were in school. Why does it feel like design history curriculums are stuck in a time warp where only men get credit? And this isn't just about fairness, it's about recognizing how this one sided narrative limits our understanding of creativity itself. The contributions of women have shaped entire disciplines, but so often their stories are erased or minimized. So my first clip is from episode seven where Roann Adams joined me. Here's a clip from that episode. Do you remember learning about any women designers and history in your classes there? It's funny because I actually cannot recall being taught about one female graphic designer while I was at Parsons. Perhaps we were, but it was definitely not the focus. But what was amazing was that my teachers were working professionals. So I was incredibly inspired by a few of my female teachers who had incredible companies and were doing amazing things. So that really formed my path in a way. Stella Bugby, who started a small design studio with two other men named Carrie Marnian and John Milott. It was called Honest. And the other teacher was Cecilia Dean. She was one of the founders of Visionaire. And Visionaire started out as like a fashion publication, but it's also like a multimedia art project and they also create these curated luxury experiences. She also founded the company alongside two men, Steven Again. And James Caliardos, she was one of my teachers. Again, like an experimental publication design class. Seeing both of those teachers and their careers really inspired me to do what I do today and eventually go out on my own. And then in episode 15 of Ellen Lupton, she also shared her perspective on the systemic sidelining of women in design history and how we need to rewrite the books to change that. Let's listen to this short little moment from her episode. While you were in school, do you remember learning about women designers or artists in your history classes? No. There's one artist, Eva Hess, who was a sculptor. Somebody told me to look at her work because I was doing these paintings that were like, all white and sort of cylinders and cups and stuff. And she did sculpture a little bit like that. That's the only woman I remember now on the street was Jenny Holzer, Barbara Kruger. These were the rising artists at the time, and we weren't learning about them in classes. Yeah, but they were the artists who were commanding the attention of young people, and they were using language and graphic design and photographic reproduction to make communication. So those women were very influential to me. Louise Lawler. There's a whole generation of artists from that period who were kind of doing graphic design and art together. And that was mind blowing. And it was happening right on the street outside of school. And like I said before, these gaps in education don't just affect women. They rob everyone of a fuller, richer understanding of what design can be. Now let's dive into something more uplifting. Humanism in design. What does it mean to create with empathy, warmth, and a genuine consideration for the people who will interact with your work? So this approach of designing not just for functionality or aesthetics, but for human connection was a recurring theme in so many of the women we covered this year. I would definitely describe this as a feminine trait, and I think it's a trait that both men and women can embody or house. But being able to think about the end user and to perfect it so that it really does benefit the end user is something that's so important to design. In fact, Ray Eames embodied this idea beautifully. Her designs were as much about comfort and joy as they were about innovation. Take her iconic lounge chair, for example. It's not just a chair, it's an experience. And here's a clip from that episode, episode 23, where we explored this with Amanda Jane Jones. One of her classmates said, you could tell that Ray saw things differently. She had this ability to take something as rigid as a chair and turn it into a living, breathing thing. We actually just talked about Charlotte Perry and on the last episode, and I see a lot of crossover with the two of them because they both have that philosophy of taking something as rigid as a chair and humanizing it as much as possible and helping it feel warm and inviting. The iconic plywood chair, which Time magazine called the chair of the century, was as much Ray's vision as Charles. One anecdote highlights how hands on Ray was during the process. Ray. Ray would spend hours making sure the curve of the chair's back was perfect, not just for aesthetic purposes, but for how it would feel to the person sitting in it. She always thought about how design interacted with human experience. And then the Eames lounge chair, of course, we've talked about this too. And her attention to color, texture, proportion balanced the chair's modern look with warmth and comfort. And she perfected the curves and angles to ensure the chair not only looked sleek, but also felt inviting. And then Lela Vignelli took a similar approach. Let's revisit that moment from her story in episode 18. Lela was a catalyst. Lela, in any case, played such a role in the creative process by all the time highlighting what worked and what didn't work. And that's like, super creative. And she really pushed the work forward. I like that she said once, good design is not about showing off. It's about solving problems elegantly. If I done my job right, people won't see me. They will see a solution that just feels right. And her design really combined beauty with practicality, like the bakewares that she created. And even her jewelry design for San Lorenzo had a dual purpose, offering flexibility in how pieces could be worn, really reflecting her belief that design should adapt to the user. And then lastly on this theme, Charlotte Perry and her philosophy of creating spaces for living made her work timeless. Her designs weren't just about form. They were about function. That feels good. And so here's a clip from episode 22 on Charlotte Perry. And with AD Goodrich, she actually used her own body to test its ergonomics. So when you sit in the LC4, you're actually feeling the way that Charlotte Perry Ann's body would be on that chair, which is amazing that a chair is designed by a female with a female's body, because, as we know, most objects in the world are designed with the male body informing the design, which is pretty cool. That's really interesting. That was a common theme with some of these women who are furniture designers and became iconic for their work. And it was those moments when they were actually using their own body as inspiration. Amazing. And not even in a feminist way. It's just like, well, I'm the designer here. Because Corbusier doesn't want to deal with these details. So here we go, I'll base it on my body. Perry Ann saw design as a tool for social change and became passionate about creating functional and affordable furniture for the working class, not just the elite. She believed that design should serve society at large, not just be an object that can be bought by rich people. And this approach was rooted in her philosophy that furniture should serve the space and the people inhabiting it, rather than being decorative. And so one of the things that she said was, quote, the most important thing for me has always been the human element. Design is not about the object itself. It is about how that object affects the people who use it. When you think about it, this emphasis on human connection might just be the most important design principle of all. And I love hearing about these women paving the way in this area. And then if there's one thread that ties together so many of the women we've covered, it's this. They didn't wait for permission. Whether they lacked formal training or had to defy societal expectations, these women proved that creativity thrives in the cracks of the rules. Eileen Gray is a perfect example of this. She went from designing furniture and interiors to being a self taught architect. She did this purely by looking at others work. Here's a moment from that episode with Emily Farnham. Here's the thing. She had no formal training in architecture. She was completely self taught, which is wild when you think about it. She learned architecture by reading architectural manuals and shadowing professionals and traveling to study buildings. Like, she basically set up her own apprenticeship of sorts and really figured it all out. And I think that says a lot about her intellect too, that she just soaked it up, understood it and ran with it. It's just all so inspiring. She, from the jump, she was just extremely determined to carve out her own path, dating back to her earliest education, convincing her family to let her pursue such an independent and academic life. And then she went on to squeeze her way into the male dominated field of interior design in France. I wasn't aware of this, but in the 20s and even earlier, interior design was a male field. It was not typical for a woman to practice interior design, much less own a shop and trailblaze and take on important clients. And then when she finally did enter architecture at midlife, she then had the Confidence to say, no, you're doing it wrong. You should design the interiors first and then the architecture. And then Elaine Lustig Cohen also took the leap, stepping into the design world with nothing but talent and determination. I mean, a lot of that also had to do with survival mode and her husband passing away. But I truly believe it was her passion and her calling in life. Let's hear a bit from her story. It wasn't too long before he passed away, and without formal training and design at all, Elaine dove into the deep end. Alvin was known for his avant garde book covers and typographic experimentation. But his tragic life cut short due to the complications of his disease. Elaine, when she took over the studio, it was thought that she would just finish Alvin's projects for her. And one of her early high profile projects was creating signage for the Seagram Building in New York, which had started with Alvin. But she really had to do the finished project. And it set the tone for her design ethos of combining clean modernist typography with innovative abstraction. It wasn't a small gig, it wasn't something that you gave to a neophyte. The fact that she was trusted with the visual identity of the monumental project speaks volumes about the confidence she earned from high profile clients like Philip Johnson. Over her career, Elaine created 150 designs for book covers and magazine catalogs, including a lot for the Guggenheim and the Jewish Museum. And she was a student of avant garde European modernism and that influenced her own approach. The work that she did didn't just follow trends, however, they shaped the direction of modern American design. She was a woman with no formal training taking over one of the most influential studios of its time. And then there's Barbara Krueger. Her work is a masterclass in breaking the rules. Bold graphics, sharp wit and zero apologies. And honestly, it amazes me to this day that she never went to college for it and is an icon. Here's a moment from that episode that stood out to me. And when she was younger, she was intimidated by the art scene. And I found this interview of her and I loved what she said about the art scene. She said when I was young, the art world, one version of it, the main version of it, was 12 white guys in lower Manhattan. So there was really no way I could see myself clear through that. And you see this push and pull, how she sees what the art world is, sees what is resonating with people and yet just flips it. It's just so interesting. You know what makes her a pioneer too is the fact that she didn't shape herself to fit a mold and to fit what was happening. She took something and made it her way or how she thought she would want to be able to see art or view and experience art too. And so I thought, that's so interesting, too. She really paved her own way and paved the way for so many with that idea of, I'm a woman who's going to make accessible art and make art that hasn't been done before. Lastly, there's Phyllis Madonna. She shows us that instinct and passion can create magic. She designed the iconic Madonna Inn rooms without formal training, and they have been a favorite for decades. I call that courage. So let's revisit her story from that episode with Emily Hayward. So, originally, Alex reached out to two interior designers to help design the themed rooms, but the results didn't feel unique or personal enough. And they were ideas anyone could have found in a catalog. And so, frustrated, Alex turned to Phyllis and said, you could design those rooms as well as anyone else. And encouraged by his faith in her vision, Phyllis took on the challenge, even though she had no formal design training. And so it was from that moment that the creativity flowed, and Phyllis's designs were anything but conventional. They were bold, whimsical, and playful. Breaking all the rules of traditional interior design, she focused on creating rooms that told a story and evoked emotion, whether it was a fairy tale, a rugged adventure, or pure fantasy. Yeah, I love that she had no formal training, and I also love that her husband was like, you could do this better than anybody. Yeah, like, what a great husband. And she, like, I read her a little bit of her book, too, that she wrote all about this, and she sounds, so, I guess, like, humble about it too, and doesn't really take a whole lot of pride in talking about what she really created. And I think it is because she doesn't have that formal background, and she really did make it something amazing. And so now, like, here's the moment to really celebrate her and to really call out the fact that she is a designer and she created something really iconic. These women remind us that formal credentials are optional. What matters is daring to start. Okay, next. Patience might not be the flashiest quality, but it's one of the most essential for great design. The women in this section understood the value of seeing a project through to the very last detail, even if it took years, going back to Charlotte Perry. And she spent her career refining her ideas, making sure every detail aligned with her vision. And so here's a moment from her episode that captures this during her work on Lays arcs, she was known for her hands on approach. She lived in the mountains for extended periods and personally supervised the construction process. Wow. Really seeing a project through to the very end and being there and helping through the process that takes so much time and attention and focus and design integrity. Like, she had to be there. Very hands on with all of it. And she said, quote, I like being alone when I visit a country or historic site. I like being bathed in its atmosphere, feeling in direct contact with the place without the intrusion of a third party. She focused on the use of sustainable materials and made sure that the interiors blended seamlessly with the natural landscape. So she faced pushback from developers who are more concerned with profit than with her vision for sustainability and functional design. But she fought to ensure that her principles of human centered design were maintained. So again, I see so much design integrity there and then. Norma Merrick's cleric brought precision and persistence to architecture, breaking barriers. As one of the first black female architects in the U.S. her dedication was inspiring and so was her patience with every material and every precise detail. Let's revisit her story. She was responsible for hiring and overseeing staff architects and coordinating technical aspects of major projects. These projects not only showcased her architectural prowess, but also her ability to manage large, complex projects. Her son, David Merrick Fairweather recalled how she considered the design of a building the easy part, but production was the real work. Figuring out what kind of concrete, nuts and bolts or glass was needed to make the building real, that's probably the tedious part too. Like, just goes on forever. It does. Especially once I started realizing, like, the bigger the building, the more material you need. So, like, you're not just ordering, like, you know, 25 square feet of tiles. You're ordering and then, yeah, it's like, can it withstand an earthquake? Can. It's the logistics. So when you go and submit drawings for permits, they mark it up and they look and say, okay, you need to update this, you need to update that. So they call like, redlining, even though redlining is also something else, but, like, redlining on your designs. And they would say that she would come back with like, maybe like one page of, like, notes. Other people come up like 50 pages of notes or even just early, showing the difference of her level of attention to detail versus her peers at the time. She wasn't doing it with computers. She was doing everything by hand. And then lastly, going back to Lela Vignelli, her work is definitely a testament to polish and care. Here's a clip that highlights her meticulous approach. So it was that meticulous planning, I feel like that really ensured that every detail, from the altar's placement to the way that the sun filtered through the windows, it really created harmonious atmosphere. And so she really paid attention to all of those details, which I feel like again went unnoticed. And how she was given credit at the time. Absolutely. And just to speak to some of her design philosophy, one of her most quoted philosophies is if you do it right, it will last forever. Which is so true for some of the work that she's created that is still in production today. She also famously remarked, design is not a product of creativity alone. It's a result of rigor and discipline. And so that was really the balance between her and Mossimo, is that she really was the pragmatic minded designer. She was the one who really finished projects to the end and saw them through production and all of that, while Massimo saw himself as the dreamer. Attention to detail isn't just about perfection. It's about respect for the work and for the people who will interact with it. Another thing that I saw as a through line with all of these women's stories is that trailblazers don't just follow trends, they set them. And so this next section celebrates the women who redefined what design could be and actually open doors for others to follow. These are actual design innovators who were paving new paths and reinventing what the design that they were working on really could be. So going back to Roanne Adams episode, we talked all about sustainable fashion and how women fashion designers are really leading the charge with sustainability, pushing the industry toward more ethical practices. Here's a clip from that episode. Like, it should be the bigger companies and especially the fast fashion companies that should be held accountable. So I really see that if this bill gets passed, the industry will shift. So I feel very optimistic about this. I have friends who are really on the front lines of this who are ambassadors for this act and have inspired me to really pay attention to it. It feels very topical that women are at the forefront of this movement too. It's interesting how they're each bringing their own unique vision to it too. They're doing their own take on sustainability and there's just so many versions of it too. And so there's four women that you wanted to spotlight that are really doing the work. Yeah, I think that this subject is really important for me right now because I feel like we're at a pivotal moment where the climate crisis is just looming and there are people, you know, like Stella McCartney and like Eileen Fisher and Mara Hoffman, Christy John, that are making changes. And I feel like we really need to be talking more and more about these people and promoting them because they're struggling. It's very hard for them to stay ahead of the curve. And then Barbara Stoffacher Solomon took Swiss style and gave it a California twist, creating something entirely new. Swiss style was just barely starting to become popular at this time. She even learned it from the source in Basel, Switzerland. And she was one of the earliest to actually start using Helvetica in the US let's revisit that moment. I don't know if it's safe to say this, but she basically brought Helvetica to California. I think so. I mean, I think, again, what I've read is that when she opened up her own studio, which was in San Francisco's north beach neighborhood, I think, up up until 1972, so it was open for about a decade or so, I think she had to put in a request to have them send over specific, like, letter forms, because at the time, like, you know, you could. You'd only have, like, certain sheets, and then she'd have to use it for her, whether it was her business cards or something else. But, yeah, she couldn't find it anywhere here. Meanwhile, what I. What I love about what she talks about is that she. Only once you learn the rules can you break them. And she earned that right. I mean, she's most known for her super graphics, which are well beyond, like, the constraints of a grid or a page. I think she. If anything, she was. She had Armin over one shoulder, kind of pushing her to think about, you know, how things should be? And then meanwhile, was like, how can I break the rules? How can I make things as. As big and as loud as possible, but still very intentional about how and when those should exist? And then I'm putting these next two women together, Gunther and Anni Albers, both coming from the Bauhaus and transforming the world of textiles. Textile design was so different before they came into play and has been so different ever since. Their influence, they blended tradition with innovation. Here's a clip from their stories. So now that she was master, she continued to improve the weaving workshop even more. She insisted that the women were taught math and geometry to be even better at weaving. They tested materials for qualities such as color, texture, structure, resistance to wear, flexibility, light refraction, and sound absorption. In fact, she changed the perception of weaving under her direction. The fabrics and prototypes made by the Workshop became one of the school's largest sources of income. I did not know that. Incredible. Here they're thinking, okay, women, go to your little corner. And then turns out they're the ones that are supporting the Bauhaus financially. Gunther Stolzel was known for her pioneering spirit and relentless experimentation. She introduced modernist principles to textile design. And so Annie absorbed these principles and began to push the boundaries of what could be done with loom. A couple of things to point out is that Annie very much experimented with material. She'd use horse hair and cellophane and material metallic threads in addition to traditional fibers. And people just weren't doing that before. And so that was definitely revolutionary. And then lastly, Muriel Cooper foresaw the digital design revolution, which is so ahead of her time. She paved the way for interfaces we use to this day and did this way back in the 70s and 80s. Let's hear her story. Like, I can't remember who said this originally, but she's oftentimes referred to as the humanist among scientists. She was thinking about things like play and what she needed as a graphic designer and, like, different ways, like, a reading experience could be on screen. And this is something that she was always grappling with as a graphic designer and we're always grappling with, too. It's like, okay, you want a human to read this text on the screen? How much space do you need in between the lines of text? How big is the text need to be? All of these things that really require paying attention to, like, the human response to technology. And that was largely missing even today, but was definitely missing at the invention of a lot of this technology we're dealing with. So much of the work that they were doing in the Visible Language Workshop was about the fact that human beings don't think like computers. And how do you build a bridge between the embodied cognition we have as human beings and these machines that can just essentially, like, push around numbers? And so, you know, it really, a lot of the human computer interaction, things that we still are struggling with today or playing around with today, are things that they were really talking about then. So just to emphasize, these women weren't just designers, they were visionaries. They were forging new paths for actual design that everyone partakes in to this day. And then my last theme, I wanted to end with this. The most inspiring moments that stayed with me long after these episodes aired. These were the moments where I got chills in the episode and that these philosophies and ideas are ones that I hope to continue to Put in my own career and remember these women. For Iris Apfel's philosophy of never too old is as empowering as it gets. Here's a clip from that episode. She famously said, retiring at an early age is a fate worse than death. And so it's funny because she did retire. But maybe she retired knowing that there was going to be a second story to her life. Who knows? She knew. She knew. And she had stories of her tireless work ethic and enthusiasm for projects. Even at the age of 102, her involvement in collaborations and public appearances demonstrated her enduring influence. I guess the only other one that I would emphasize is the you're never too old to start something new, as she just like, led by example. There's definitely times where I've felt like, ugh, it's too late to start trying to play drums, or it's too late to do whatever or try this new thing. And the answer is no. Like, that is a limiting belief. And if you use anybody as an example of being open minded, Iris, I think, is a great example of just that. And then Pum Lefabir's process was so incredible, so profound, I had to share a clip from her episode. I never understand the process of brainstorming that ad agency is doing because it doesn't work for us as a designer. Because when you sit down, you know, and really think quietly on a piece of paper, looking at the brief, read the research and strategy, being quiet and solitary and really think deeply is really important. I want to give everyone equal opportunity to dream equally. And then when it's the time to come and have like a meeting, they all presenting their dream. And then lastly, Jerry Kavanaugh's fearless multidisciplinary approach is a reminder to stay curious and never box yourself in. Here's a standout moment from her episode. She is endlessly and enthusiastically curious. She felt empowered to tackle anything. And thus, in the span of her career that's lasted over 60 years, she's seemingly done it all. Over the years, she worked with an impressive span of materials and projects for a range of local and international clients. She designed ceramics, light fixtures, homes, store interiors, textiles, clocks, furniture, toys, malls, sculpture, wrapping paper, holiday decor. She designed birthday cakes, park benches, vast corporate headquarters, and she imbued each commission with her trademark acuity for color and pattern and whimsy. You asked me to think about what my favorite piece of hers is. And it's so hard because, I mean, there's little ceramic dishes that she made probably in her spare time for fun. That I'm obsessed with. And she did graphic design, she did textile design. I mean, just. It's like endless. She commented once that quote, I never wanted to be a niche designer. It's like asking someone to eat hamburgers all their life. I can relate to that. So that's a wrap on 2024. Thank you to every guest, listener, and Instagram scroller who made this year what it was. If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to leave a review and share it with a friend. Here's to 2025 and many more reels, stories, and incredible women designers to discover. Let's redesign history by celebrating women. See you next year.