Sophia (3:26)

Welcome to Work in Progress. Welcome back to Work in Progress, friends. We certainly have a smartie joining us today. On days when I just don't understand what's happening anymore, when it seems like there's rules for some of us and no rules for the people who need them, I want to be able to phone a friend. But phone a friend in government, you know. And today we are joined by a good friend to progress to women, to everyone who's not a cheating elite, I suppose. Today we're joined by New Jersey Senator Cory Booker. He is sitting at the center of so many fights, when military action is bypassing Congress, when media power is rapidly consolidating and monopolies are being formed, when the guardrails of democracy feeling increasingly fragile, it gets hard to feel like we know which threats matter most. And yet we know we need to show up to the fight and we need leaders to fight for us. And that's what Cory Booker does through his work on the Senate Judiciary Committee and its Antitrust Subcommittee. He is directly involved in questions about all of these things. War powers, corporate consolidation, overseeing unfair immigration enforcement, the limits of executive authority. Issues that aren't theoretical but are unfolding in real time. And while he is pushing back on the abuse of power, he is also trying to create a better path forward. Perhaps because his career itself was shaped by the belief that leadership should be grounded in moral conviction. Perhaps because he grew up a kid experiencing both the lack of civil rights and the way that civil rights can change the course of a family's life. Perhaps because he's unafraid to ask questions and by the way, unafraid to push back against the levers of power and propose an all new tax code that's meant to help working Americans. Cory Booker really shows up and works for what's happening now in front of him and in front of all of us. And today, I hope that we can ruminate on what leadership actually requires in a moment like this and get some tips in terms of how the rest of us, rather than getting exhausted and apathetic, can feel reinvigorated and inspired to show up. So let's dive in with Senator Booker. Thank you so much for being here, Senator Booker. Obviously, there's just a few things going on in the world and in our country. Before we dive into pressing issues of the moment, I do want to ask you one of my favorite questions because everybody knows you. They know your career, they know what you do. But I think people forget that a career is not just who you are. And I'd like to know if we could go back to the New Jersey playground and run into Corey at 10 years old.

Ad Readers / Sponsors (e.g., Xolair, Mint Mobile, Ryan Reynolds) (6:48)

Wow.

Sophia (6:49)

Do you think you would recognize that little boy and do you think he would recognize himself in you?

Senator Cory Booker (6:54)

You're bringing me back to fifth grade, Harrington park elementary in the playground, where I had adventures that still stick with me today. And a lot of the friends I had back then are still some of my closest friends today. I grew up in a really small town. I was this idealistic kid that used to tick my friends off when I would be the guy that would always break up fights on the playground or try to do everything I could to make our class just more harmonious. I think that idealistic kid would be really proud of who I am today. He'd probably be frightened that I have no hair. You know, I remember running for president for the first time ever in seventh grade. And I guess that's two years later. And it was my life's most embarrassing moment because I stood up in front of this class and all my closest friends and tried to give a speech. And I froze. I was completely terrified of speaking in. In public and. And I had worked so hard on my speech. I really felt like I had something to say. I wanted to call to the harmony of the class, to the connection in the community and talk about what we could be together. And I froze. And I shook my hands. Was so nervous they were shaking. And I remember the paper making this loud sound and the teachers tried to help me get things out. And then eventually they're just like, you can sit down. And I remember going home that night devastated. But something inside of me made me swear that I was going to conquer that fear. And the strangest things happened. First, I won the election without even giving my speech. And. But more importantly, I had teachers, public school teachers, who saw this fear and pushed me to do school plays and theater and do a lot to try to get more confidence so that I never had a moment like that. So I think that scared boy would look at me now, still trying to do the same thing, perhaps remind our country that decides despite the many lines that divide us, we have more ties that bind us. Trying to. Trying to bring folk together. I think he'd be pretty proud. And I think I would love that kid because I think in the fifth grade I was cute. And then I went through a long, awkward stage that lasted to my 50s.

Sophia (9:20)

I was going to say seventh grade was particularly bad for me, but I feel your pain there. It strikes me that you had a very early bent for justice and for advocacy. And, you know, if we had all the time in the world, I would be asking you about the housing discrimination your parents faced and. And your incredibly impressive resume at Stanford, Oxford, Neale Law, and then choosing to go and, you know, live in a low income neighborhood in Newark and organize tenants and get in a fight with the housing authority. Like, this is the point of leadership, is to lead in your community and to defend your neighbors and to organize for good.

Senator Cory Booker (10:04)

The one thing I will say is, like, I think a lot of people, when they talk about my narrative, you know, my dad. My favorite thing my dad said to me when I was graduating, he says, boy, you got more degrees in the month of July, but she ain't hot.

Sophia (10:21)

Dad's just keeping you humble. I love it.

Senator Cory Booker (10:24)

Yes. Yeah. Life isn't about the degrees you get. It's about the service you give, sort of. My parents and they really wanted my brother and I to be service and move into a community like the one I still live in in Newark. And you. And you think, oh, I'm here to help, you know, And I think the powerful thing that happened to me on that journey in my 20s was that I realized in Newark, in a community, I arrived to try to be of help, that I needed a lot of help, that I needed a lot of growth. And I think when you're in when. And we all should be about creating and repairing community. I think one of the first lessons to understand is that it is not, it's not something where you're doing all the service. It's actually something that heals you as, as you yourself are a healer. In fact, I don't think you could be a healer unless you recognize that you yourself need, need to be more whole and more connected. And I think if anything that Newark did and gifted me it is that a lot of, a lot of humility. It broke me down and helped me realize that perhaps the reason why I still live in that neighborhood today, which, which at the time was jarring in terms of the challenges that our community was facing, is because it has gifted me so much of so much growth, so much strength and sourced my spirit. This low income community I eventually moved into these high rise projects, became one of the most special homes I've ever had. I miss living in those high rise projects where I lived until weeks before they were condemned. I think again, it gets back to that same spirit of this kid in a grade school class in a very different part of New. Even though it's only 20 plus miles, this was an all white area, affluent, relatively affluent neighborhood and we were the first black family to move in. And now I live in a predominantly black and brown neighborhood. But for me to see the common humanity and the common urgencies and this delusion of separateness that what happens to others doesn't affect me, that I'm not less. Because we live in a nation still where people can't afford healthcare or childcare or kids, kids are being taught to hide in their schools because of gun violence. All of this is corrupting and cancerous to community. And all of us are affected by these things, whether we live amidst the immediacy of the urgencies or not.

Sophia (13:01)

Absolutely. And I think it's a beautiful perspective. It's something that I as a civilian, I'm not an elected official, but I am 10 toes down activist for my neighbors. And I think of everyone in this country as my neighbor and I and I think of a lot of people around the world as my neighbors. And the illusion of other, I think is not only detrimental to the people we other, but it's detrimental to us. As you said, you know, watching what's happening in our country, you know, with these ice raids at the moment is devastating because to your point, not only are people that are accused of being other who are in fact our neighbors, who are in fact so additive to our communities and also additive to our economy, frankly, they are being brutalized and harmed, but they're doing so with resources that are meant for us. Like I think of our tax dollars as an roi. Okay? We invest in the country and we are supposed to get a return on that investment. And when our tax dollars to the tun to the tune of 175 billion extra dollars are being given to ICE and Border Patrol, they're not arresting the worst of the worst. They're like dragging somebody's granddad out of his house in his boxer shorts in January winter in Minnesota. That's $175 billion that could pay for childcare or for kids to get to eat in school so they can pay attention and learn and become leaders in their community. That's, that's money that could go to cover healthcare costs which are easily paid by every other peer nation in world. So I really appreciate. By the way, I watched the video of you taking Kristy Noam to task on this just this morning on the day we're recording anyway for our friends at home. How are you keeping this idea that you've talked about for so many years of radical love for our communities central in, in a moment where the administration that you have to work with feels so rooted in hate. How do you do this and how do you want us to do this with you, the non elected constituency that does care about their neighbors?

Senator Cory Booker (15:25)

Well, I think that you're answering that question and just your preamble in there. I mean I'm gut today's a hard day. I sat there and questioned Noam who swore to uphold this constitution that she's trashing, violating people's civil rights and violating court orders and overseeing an agency that is literally physically brutalizing people and even as we know has killed Americans. And then I go to this classified briefing about a war in the context that people don't understand. We've not only lost American soldiers already, but we are spending billions of dollars every week, billions of dollars that this goes on. At the same time we're cutting health care for millions of Americans. At the same time we cutting veterans benefits. At the same time they were cutting school lunch programs. And so it is one of those days tonight that I think I'm probably going to go home and lift the weights, exercise tonight because my wife is away and I'm just feeling so hurt and angry. But what sources me is what you just said is that in the midst of all of this, I am seeing heroism in my state that is extraordinary. People collecting food, food and resources for people who are afraid to go out and can't go shopping because they're afraid of ice. I have people that are organizing to walk American children to school because an immigrant parent is afraid to show up at that school and confront ice. I just see so many points of light out there that are illuminating even this wretched darkness. And it is a testimony to the truth. I think Mr. Rogers once said it, whenever there's a crisis, look for the helpers. There's always helpers. And so, if anything, as I watch this president's poll numbers plummet, not just his approval rating, but remember, he came in with a significant amount of Americans endorsing the things he was saying about immigration and saying, I'm gonna go after the bad people and I'm gonna secure the borders. And now he's way underwater with today, looking at data that about a quarter of the people voted for him, regret it. And that just shows me the American people are rejecting this and that, that people are rising up and speaking up. And I let that source me and challenge me that if I see people who are willing to stand out in the bitter cold and with their whistles and blow as hard as they can with all the breath in their body to warn their neighbors, then I could stand on the Senate floor in a comfortable, heated chamber and fight like hell for the very same people and the very same ideals you're talking about.

Sophia (18:15)

I mean, it can't have been comfortable to stand for 25 straight hours. But, you know, whether, whether it's 25 hours or the afternoon, you're, you're up there trying to remind people what's at stake. Why do you think the reality of Trump and his cronies and their cruelty doesn't sink in for people, perhaps until they're confronted with it as we are now, all those people that regret their votes, we know that the number two searches after the 20 election night where what is a tariff? And can I change my vote? And I thought, oh, dear God, we're failing our people. Why do you think their cruelty is so deniable until it's smacking people in the face versus the reality of what our party has said, which is true. Everything Vice President Harris said on the campaign trail is true, has come true. There is an absolutism for the left, and there seems to be a complete annihilation of the rules and an accept an accepting of lawlessness on the right. And I, I wonder if you from within the halls of government understand why that double standard seems to exist out in the voting block.

Senator Cory Booker (19:31)

So I, I, I don't know, and I don't, I try not to wrap myself in the around an axle. I, I, oh that that there is a larger discontent growing in our country that is not him. That actually made him possible. He not necessarily even the problem. He's the accelerant to I think what's burning at America right now. And I caution people not to make him the main character in this story, not to center him in your narrative and to try to pull back and take a more courageous empathy for even those people that may have supported him and are regretting it. This is not a time to shame people. This is a time to understand, to see the larger picture. And the larger picture that I see is two forces that are really threatening our nation. One is the fact that the bargain doesn't work anymore. It did for my dad's generation. In fact, we were the best country when my dad was coming up. To be born poor because your chances of climbing, climbing out of the bottom quintile to like the middle class or even better was extraordinary. 90% of American children in my dad's generation did better than their parents. The bargain worked. You had this explosion of the middle class. You had a closing to black white racial wealth gap. I mean everybody was getting better and riding this point where we as a nation were investing in public schools and public higher education, where a Pell Grant or the GI Bill got people investments in. We were the number one investors in and research on the planet. We had this wave of immigration where we were making it easier for people. It was this amazing period. Now for people born in the 80s it was down to 50% doing better. It's even worse now for people born in the 90s and 2000. And so they're right. The first thing that's bothering people is that there is a generation of Americans who just don't think that the deal is working for them.

Sophia (21:38)

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Sophia (22:51)

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Sophia (26:41)

Can I ask a question? I'm literally raising my hand. Isn't part of the reason the deal isn't working because you know I am an 80s kid. I'm very aware of what the tax rates were yes, when I was born for wealthy and successful people. Part of the reason the expansion of the American middle class is being stifled. Part of the reason people can't afford their rent and their groceries. Part of the reason people can't afford child care is because the most successful people in this country are no longer paying their fair share.

Senator Cory Booker (27:12)

Okay, so God, why are we doing this? Virtually because I would want to hug you right now. But. But that is it. The effective rate for the richest 1% of the country in terms of percent of their income is way lower than the effective tax Rate of the teacher in high school who's married to a nurse. And that's. That is fundamentally wrong. That everybody at the highest ends has all of these things that were put into the tax code to help them avoid paying the same percentages as the overwhelming majority. And when I'm talking majority, I'm talking about 70, 75% of Americans who are carrying that full freight of a tax rate, while the wealthiest who might get their money from capital gains or other kind of sources, they are not paying the same. So, and then the corporate tax rate. I was digging into numbers late at night instead of sleeping. The corporate tax rate used to be about 4% of GDP. It's now down to just 2%. Our corporations are paying far less than they did during the golden era of American growth and expansion.

Sophia (28:18)

And not only are they paying less taxes into the nation, which is the reason they are successful in the first place, but they're not paying less. I part of my friendship. I'm not elected, so I get to say what I want because it's my friend, please fuck a living wage. People should be paid a thriving wage. And the fact that my tax dollars, that I pay more money in taxes than the President of the United States and that my tax dollars are subsidizing Walmart employees having to be on food stamps and health benefits because they can't afford to live well working for the richest corporation in America is psych to me. Like the fact that billionaire families are writing off not even their first yacht. By the way, you invent something. I want you to have a yacht. Good for you. I wish I had a yacht. The fact that you get to have a fleet of yachts and not pay taxes on them and your employees are on food stamps is ridiculous because you don't make a billion dollars that way. You're taking a billion dollars. You're taking it from the people that work for you. You're taking it from the American economy. You are taking it from American school children. You are putting a burden on the people who teach your kids and not on yourself because you want a third boat. Like, at some point, we have to reign the crazy in.

Senator Cory Booker (29:39)

And so this is a couple things I want to say. First of all, writing off private jets and all these things 100% right?

Sophia (29:46)

And teachers can't write off construction paper.

Senator Cory Booker (29:49)

Literally. They have limited. I have a bill to change this. When they reach in their own pocket to pay for food for their kids or tampons for their kids, or you name it, they have a huge cap on the amount of money that they

Sophia (30:01)

can reclaim, it makes me crazy.

Senator Cory Booker (30:03)

But listen to what we do. Listen to what we're doing right now. We're shifting the narrative away from Donald Trump. This is the problem of the Democratic Party. They want to be about what we're against. What you and I are now talking about is what we're for. And so the solution to this is to have the courage to stand up and say enough. I don't care who is control of Congress or the House. Even though most of these policies was the attack so called welfare. And then they just created massive corporate welfare because as you said, we're paying for the healthcare, we're paying for the food stamps, we're paying for all of these workers because they pay their people. What my father did, he worked for a big corporation, IBM. Even IBM's janitors got a pension. Even IBM's janitors had their health care.

Sophia (30:51)

And they should. Yes, it's all dignified work.

Senator Cory Booker (30:55)

So let me just tell you it is not that hard to fix that. That's the thing that frustrates me is so we're going to introduce a big piece of legislation that's very simple idea that if you are an American, you should not pay any taxes on your first $75,000 of earning for earning for your household. No taxes. That would take a family making $150,000 a year. If you add that to a with an expanded child tax credit earning, you would actually take a family making $150,000 a year battling to stay in Los Angeles or New Jersey. They're getting squeezed and that would give them more than $10,000 more in earnings. It would just suddenly take a tax code and say for working Americans, we're giving you utter tax relief. If you are working in this country, we're raising the. You will not get under this floor again. When you're living with constant cortisol pumping in your head because you're afraid that your family can't pay for their prescription drugs and pay for their rent or their mortgage. And so that's the thing. It's like stop this tax code which gives all of the benefits to the wealthiest of the wealthy. Shift it back to making work pay. Create a new deal for the American worker. So that's just one simple idea that addresses that first issue we're talking about. There's a few other simple things around childcare and paid family leave and these things that make it easier to child. But I want to shift to the next pillar cuz you and I, I'm feeling you agree on this bullshit. And I'll say the French of having Americans working harder than their parents did, but actually getting losing ground that their parents had gained, that is. That is so un American to everything we believe about America. And that's why a generation of Americans is growing up and saying the promise is a lie. And so, yeah, I'm gonna pick the radical candidate from either wing that's promised me to blow the whole stuff up or burn it down. No, what we really need to do is undo the overwhelming corrupt influence of big, big corporations. Which brings me to the second point. If the first one is making the economic bargain simple and reward work, the second thing has got to be ending the colossal corruption that is perverting our

Sophia (33:11)

political system, including Citizens United.

Senator Cory Booker (33:15)

Yes. God, yes. So let me give you an example of all the money spent to elect Trump. The dark money, the PACs, everything. Because the candidates themselves in our modern elections, they raise money constantly. They're constantly trying to raise money and taking it from people they shouldn't. Both sides of the aisle. Corporate PACs should not exist. Corruption. This is why I think it was a fourth senator. It might be only one of six or seven that doesn't take corporate pac that is corrupting money. But that's not even the worst part of this situation. If you take Donald Trump, all the money he raised in his hard dollars, they call it the people directly his campaign, and then add that to all the dark money paid. 10 people, 10 human beings. Multi billionaires gave. Spent 44% of all the money Donald Trump spent accounted for 44% of that money. 44% of all the money spent was by 10 individuals.

Sophia (34:11)

And by the way, for the people listening at home, I'm not allowed to contribute. It's either more than like 1200 or $2500 to A. To a candidate. I am not allowed. You are not allowed. But for some reason, these billionaires have. They've bought and paid for their own political system, and they write their own rules. And so they're. They're spending hundreds of millions of dollars, and it's literally illegal for the rest of us to do that.

Senator Cory Booker (34:37)

And so this is why the game. Because they can spend for what you and I might be $1,000 on a campaign, but for them, it's $100 million. Because that's the relative wealth. Because we are having more billionaires than ever before on the planet Earth. We're approaching our first trillionaire. They now can influence our systems in ways that no one could have imagined. And they don't even have to spend the money. When you get that rich, that's a great thing. You don't have to spend the money. You can just call up Senator X and this has happened and say, if you don't take this stand, I'm gonna spend $20 million against you in a primary. And Senator X knows that's true because it's happening to their colleagues and they're getting primaried.

Sophia (35:14)

Yep.

Senator Cory Booker (35:14)

And so the people don't understand that in order for us to get the first thing, we've got to end the corruption because this is how it affects you. And I know all these mergers going on, all this consolidation going on, including in the entertainment industry. Follow the money. Why did you see all of these tech billionaires sitting on stage with Donald Trump? It's the most corruption we've ever. Donald Trump himself has made billions of dollars since he's been in office.

Sophia (35:43)

And to be clear, before he ran for president, that man was in a lot of debt.

Senator Cory Booker (35:46)

Yes.

Sophia (35:47)

So he has used the, the privilege of the office to enrich himself at a rate literally never seen in American history and to avoid going to jail.

Senator Cory Booker (35:59)

Yes.

Sophia (35:59)

And in front of our eyes we see him doing side deals with the Saudis for hundreds of millions of dollars and plenty of other countries as well, selling cryptocurrency to who knows who. Completely untraceable, bought and paid for campaigns. We know the man's loyal to Vladimir Put Putin and, and he's out here essentially playing in our faces. The DOJ is redacting files that he is in. We know he was part of this Epstein ring when Jamie Raskin got out of closed door committee with all of you guys and said, oh, in the files we can look at unredacted. Out of the three and a half million Donald Trump is in. A million. That's nearly one in three files. That's not an oopsie, that's a business partnership. And when the entire country is enraged that children are being bought and sold on a black market and the President goes, oh well, it's like I feel, I've never been a conspiracy theorist who's like, oh, it's a simulation. Like, you know, all the tech guys that are doing too much ketamine for their own good. But at this moment I'm like, it really does feel like a 12 year old. Like Smash, Smash, the video game controller. What's happening? And so I wonder. I know I feel crazy. I know so many people feel crazy. I know it's got to be insane to have to work in the halls of government right now. From the Epstein files to illegal strikes on Iran. And to be clear, I have so many Iranian friends. I am thrilled for them that the tormentor of their home country is gone. And I'm also enraged that the President of the United States is taking military action illegally. Two things can be true at the same time. And then as you said, in my own industry, like this merger with Paramount and Warner Brothers, we know David Ellison's a Trump guy. We know that they bought TikTok, they bought CNN, they bought CBS. They're killing stories on the news. Like everything seems very bad.

Senator Cory Booker (38:02)

The corruption in Washington is. This is what happens now. I'm that rich person that owns, let's say, a major media company. And I compound my wealth and so I go out to buy another major media company. That's illegal under any conception of the ability to control so much news information, major news platforms, major antitrust law would say, nope, you can't do that. But you know what I can do? I can give a billion dollars to the presidents to build a new East Wing. I could give stuff to his inauguration. I could go into business with his children. Children. That very corruption then corrupts the people who've already shown us that they'll weaponize the Justice Department to protect them, to suppress the Epstein files, that. This is actually my lawyer. So I'm not gonna use the Justice Department and the approval that I have in controlling these so called independent agencies that now I'm gonna give you even more perks. I'm gonna let you concentrate wealth. I'm gonna let your companies merge. I'm gonna let you control a dominant share in the media. And then what does that do to this first pillar of just people fighting to try to. To pay the rent? Well, it makes their costs go up.

Sophia (39:10)

Yep.

Senator Cory Booker (39:11)

It actually. And then for you, who you and I both are patrons of the arts. Art in a democracy is not nice to have. It's vital here because of the artists during the civil rights movement, their songs and their cinema poetry. It was the power that sustained and fueled the movement. And so what does that happen? Well, I'm sorry, when Disney and 20th Century Fox merged. 20th Century Fox was producing a lot of movies from their studios. 11 to 14. Last year they produced six less movies being made.

Sophia (39:47)

Yeah, but also what are they going to be about?

Senator Cory Booker (39:50)

Right. And who's going to control the content?

Sophia (39:53)

Yeah. What stories are going to wind up on the cutting room floor?

Senator Cory Booker (39:57)

Yes. And the jobs when Paramount and Skydance merged again, then they got rid of jobs. Over a thousand jobs were lost in America because there's not healthy competition. So it's an issue of jobs, it's an issue of what art is being created, issue of how much costs I'm paying for my streaming services. We've had more corporate consolidation since Reagan. It is this acceleration in every industry. Why are our meat prices so high? Well less meat packers today than there were the time when Upton Sinclair wrote the Jungle and they were trust busting. We are living in a perversion of the free market that's being controlled by the wealthiest who when they get wealthy they change the rules so they can compound more wealth and they're making more people pay higher taxes and get less in benefits.

Sophia (40:47)

Yeah, well they're quite literally stepping on everybody's necks. We'll be back in just a minute after a few words from our favorite sponsors.

Ad Readers / Sponsors (e.g., Xolair, Mint Mobile, Ryan Reynolds) (40:57)

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Sophia (42:07)

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Sophia (44:24)

Switch upfront payment of 45 for 3 month plan equivalent to 15 per month required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees, extra fee full terms@mintmobile.com. It was surprising to me looking at the judgment that came down about tariffs and the Supreme Court saying, you know this is illegal, you can't do this and the fact that Justice Kavanaugh's dissent mentioned, well this is it would be such A mess to have to refund all these people. So, you know, you've stolen money from the American people, on average, $1,000 per person in this country, and you think it would be too hard to pay them back the money that you stole from them. Illegal taxation. And so you just don't think we should do it.

Senator Cory Booker (45:14)

Yeah, because that happens to guys in South Central or Newark all the time when they steal, you know. Yeah. So. So I, it. It's different rules and Donald Trump with a. Cons, with a, with a Supreme Court, frankly, that the spirit of the Constitution was violated to, to stack the court the way it is right now.

Sophia (45:33)

Yeah.

Senator Cory Booker (45:33)

And if you see the kind of gifts that, that many supreme, that some Supreme Court members are getting and the kind of influence that was being played to get them on the court, everything smacks of corruption. So now you've got that cynical kid. If I work hard, the economic system is rigged against me. If I try to fight the political system, my voice is being drowned out by billionaires and big international multinational corporations that are spending ungodly amount of money on our American politics. And then those platforms, platforms like X or Twitter, are now being controlled by people who are silencing the voices of people that might not agree with the owner of the platforms. And they're consolidating more of that media power, controlling more of what I see. You begin to check out of the system, you begin to get radicalized or worse. Because the only thing necessary for evil to be triumphant is for good people to do nothing. You think, hey, I have no agency, I have no power to affect this. That's what I'm fighting against. Again, I'm a child of civil rights parents. So the same forces were. The same kind of backlash, the same kind of violence, corruption, criminality. They were dealing with outrageous government allied against them. If you saw how the Department of Agriculture, what they did to black farmers, I can go through all of these things that were paralleled in the past. Nothing we're seeing right now is unprecedented. It's all very precedented. So what did they do? King said it clear, you still have power. Remember what we will have to repent for in this day and age. King's quote, to paraphrase him, is not the vitriolic words and violent actions of the bad people. It's the appalling silence and inaction of the good people are still powerful. And the two election cycles that are coming up could be defined by people reclaiming their power and insisting that both parties stop this in most cases, left Right. Fight. It's not left. Right. You talk to a conservative family in rural Iowa like I have, they have the same concerns about a family in Los Angeles or Newark, New Jersey. We have so much more in common and people are trying to convince us that we should hate each other and not get together to change the tax system to end this time of corporate ill gotten dominance, to make our politics be rid of corruption.

Sophia (47:59)

Yeah, but the thing is, it's, they're essentially trying to create a dog fight that the, the economic elite want us fighting over scraps against each other so we're not paying attention to the feast they're having in the ivory tower. And I, and I think it's incredibly detrimental when, when you know you've got blue collar workers that are citizens fighting against blue collar workers that are immigrants. It's like, no, we, we should, we should be fighting the people who aren't paying anybody fairly. But we have a lot of information, Senator. We know what works, we know what doesn't. We have all the historical backing on our side. We know that Democrats get us out of the recession, recessions that Republicans cause and that this has been a definable pattern for almost 100 years, since 1941. We know that the tax code isn't working and it's being cheated. We know that people are buying elections. We know the mergers are bad for the First Amendment. And we know people are waking up to the fact that we do have power and we do have the ability to do something. We saw 10.2 million people protesting just through last year in the streets. And it's, they say it takes three and a half percent of a country to overturn authoritarianism, which in our country, country is, you know, between 11 and a half and 12 million people. So we're close, but we know the authoritarians know we're close. They know people are really running out of patience. So the ICE raids are increasing in blue cities and states like, like ours here. We're not so far apart where I am in New Jersey and where you are Newark. We know that they're already threatening to intimidate people at the polls. We know they're trying to change voting laws, laws to stop people from voting against them. So it's currently March, midterms are in November. What do you see from inside government as the ways you all will be able to protect us? Getting out the vote, hopefully righting the ship. What do we as citizens need to know that you know about what's going to happen during the elections and about how to keep each other safe. Like it is so important for us to be educated and know how bad the problem is. And it's also important for us to remember that we don't give up hope and we keep hitting the streets and we keep showing up to vote. So. So how do we keep people hopeful? How do we encourage people to continue to participate in the political process?

Senator Cory Booker (50:30)

So I, I think that elected leaders need to fight harder and fight better. One of the reasons why I did the 25 hour stand or sit in I did all day on the Capitol steps is I'm constantly pushing my team to find things that are just getting into the system. And I gave a speech in my caucus today imploring my colleagues on an issue. We need to fight harder and fight better. Second, we have, have all of us have an obligation to understand that the power of the people is greater than the people in power. But the most common way people give up their power is not realizing they have it. So many of us have to be. And you are incredible at this. Remind people that they want you to be cynical. They want you to disengage, they want you to shut down. That the best thing you can do. Even if it's just one day going out to a protest or taking content every day that educates people on the issues and sharing it to your community. Take action. That is your power. And don't underestimate the small things I tell people all the time. I am literally here because a guy on a couch, a white guy on a couch in New Jersey after watching the Edmund Pettus Bridge march and being so shaken by that and realizing he couldn't go to Alabama, he couldn't go join the civil rights marchers because he had a business and a new family and didn't have money for a plane ticket and did the meager calculation. All I can do is give one more hour a week. And got involved with the Fair Housing Council in New Jersey. And years passed and he got really good at exposing housing discrimination. Got the case filed. My parents and my parents were denied housing and then set up so that they had a white couple that followed them. The white couple was able to make a bid on the house and it was accepted that my parents wanted and they did it for them.

Ad Readers / Sponsors (e.g., Xolair, Mint Mobile, Ryan Reynolds) (52:19)

Them.

Senator Cory Booker (52:19)

And on the day of the closing, lawyer fought, my dad shows up, they're attacked by the real estate agent. They had to fight their way out, literally because my dad had a Doberman Pinterest signal on him. This guy then wrote more letters and next thing you know the owners of the home found out about it, sold the house to my family. We moved in in 1969 and 44 years later, I'm a United States Senator. I am here because of this set of dominoes that got me to be that fifth grade kid that those teachers all surrounded and said one day you're to going, going to be a great public speaker. I'm here because at high school, where we won the national championship, launched me on a football scholarship to Stanford. You just don't know. Every act of decency, kindness, of love, of right, indignation and resistance echoes into the universe in ways that you don't imagine. I know so many children of immigrants who have hellacious stories of how they got here, who would be deported by this president. President, we're now inventing things, starting companies, curing diseases in the emergency room. What you do today in this fight matters. But I'm going to make a prediction to you that I hope gives you hope. Because to me, hope is not an external thing, it's an internal decision. Hope is the act of conviction that despair won't have the last word. And so here's a reason to choose hope today is because, because we're just a handful of months from November where we could regain the House. And now the Senate is here to have the power, actually the gears of government to stop this president from doing the bad stuff he's doing. But it doesn't stop there, because then you have another election in 2028 where all of us should say to any candidate running for president, Senate, House or anywhere, I don't care if you're a Democrat or Republican, what are you gonna do to deal with the, the bargain not working? And once for all, will you pledge as you said, end Citizens united, stop corporate PACs from getting, stop Senators and congresspeople from dealing stocks, those two pillars, what are you gonna do to make the bargain work today? Literally, we could, on the first day in office, put in a reconciliation bill that could change the tax code. If we had the White House, the House and the Senate. Show me, tell me what are you gonna do to make. Raise the floor and then tell me what you're gonna do first month or two in office to end once and for all the corruption that allows corporations to game the system that allows people that you and I celebrate and want them to be wealthy, but to change the tax rule so they could avoid paying the same taxes as a teacher or a firefighter. This is the most excited I've been because I think it's the first time that your generation, millennials and my generation X's, could do something that could prove worthy like the generations before. For us, this is our chance to redeem the dream of America, to renew the hope of America, to make the deal real for Americans.

Sophia (55:06)

I love that. Redeem the dream. Is that our slogan? What are we doing?

Senator Cory Booker (55:10)

I love redeem the dream. My wife got a hat with it on it.

Sophia (55:15)

Oh, I love that. It's. You know what? Thank you. I needed. I needed that. People will ask me sometimes. They'll be like, you're so passionate about this stuff, and you love politics, and why don't you run? And I'm like. Because I just be. I feel like I'd be doling out slaps. Like, I can't. I'm too. Like, I come from a long line of, like, very feisty Italians in New Jersey, Senator. Like, I. I don't know that I could keep my cool in the way that might be necessary. But you, you know, you remind me that. That we can channel that frustration into hope and hopeful action. Also, we do have to. You do have to give me a quick bite about your book, because I'm incredibly excited. That Stand is coming out later this month. I know it's available March 24th. And clearly for folks who need a. A joyful moment of. Of political hope that you've got it for us.

Senator Cory Booker (56:08)

Well, that's the thing. It's actually, you know, the. The. The. The people that agreed to write for the back of the book are Doris Kearns Goodwin, John Meacham, these. This eminent historian, historians, Henry Louis Gates. Because I said, let me write a book that is instructive about our past and inspirational for what we can do now. And so it's really a whole bunch of stories to show you that in the worst, most awful times, there are 10 virtues that this country clung to or supported or elevated that helped them win the fight. And this is a book that if you are feeling down or discouraged or need inspiration or instruction, Stand is this book that you can order it. You can pre order it now, that I wanted to write as an ode to this dark, difficult moment, about how they're going to overcome and. And. And redeem the dream.

Sophia (56:53)

And I think the. The real crux of that, that feels important, especially for our friends at home, is to remember that none of this is happening for the first time. Yes, it's happening in this way for the first time. It's technically technologically enabled in this way for the first time. But people like our ancestors have beaten back these most horrid human instincts before they've given us the blueprints for this. And it makes me excited for your book because essentially, you're giving us, like, I don't want to say a CliffsNotes version. It's a full book, to be clear, but it's like you're summarizing historical wins and movements for us in a time when people need to be reminded that the blueprints do exist. So preemptively. Thank you for writing it.

Senator Cory Booker (57:45)

No, thank you. Figures from today, like Kanji Brown Jackson, who in this moment are showing profiles and courage.

Sophia (57:54)

Absolutely. But I think to relate the two is something we do need to be reminded.

Senator Cory Booker (57:59)

Yeah. To connect that line. We are descendants of people that made a way out of no way. American history is the screaming, screaming celebration of people who achieved impossible things against impossible odds. And we can't forget that.

Sophia (58:13)

That's right. Well, Senator, I have a million more questions for you. I know you have to go. The last one I will ask you is my favorite question to ask everyone on the podcast. Might be hard to answer in 2026, but what feels like your work in progress right now?

Senator Cory Booker (58:29)

What feels like my work in progress? I guess it sounds boring as heck, but I actually see that we can create a tax code that overnight, whether you're the waiter or waitress at a diner, whether you're a third year at a law firm, whether you're a teacher, overnight, I see people lining up suddenly having this. Aha. Moment. Wait a minute, minute. We do not have to create a tax system that lets the wealthiest pay lower tax rates than working people. If we just shift that, all we got to do is reverse it. It can be done in one bill. Suddenly, Americans are seeing 10, 20% more in. In their income and have the money now to do the things that feel out of reach or to save or to go on a vacation. So that's my work in progress where we're unveiling it. And I think what we need is simple ideas that people. People can get in their heart and their head. Like, nobody pays taxes. No households paying taxes on their first 75, 000.

Sophia (59:36)

I love that. That's a big deal. That's a very big deal. Well, thank you for joining us today. Hopefully we can do this again soon. I have, like I said, many more questions for you.

Senator Cory Booker (59:47)

I would love that.

Sophia (59:48)

I would, too.

Senator Cory Booker (59:48)

Grew up with a lot of Italian Jersey girls. Yeah.

Sophia (59:51)

Right.

Senator Cory Booker (59:52)

Very happy.

Ad Readers / Sponsors (e.g., Xolair, Mint Mobile, Ryan Reynolds) (59:53)

Yeah.

Sophia (59:54)

It's like I get. I get my belief in universal healthcare and my pacifism from my Canadian dad and I get my my mouth off to my friends and I'll pop you in the face for my Italian mother and it's a nice balance for me.

Senator Cory Booker (60:07)

I'm going to share you some stories when next time we're together about just such spirit.

Sophia (60:12)

Thank you for joining and thank you team. I know he has to go. You're great.

Ad Readers / Sponsors (e.g., Xolair, Mint Mobile, Ryan Reynolds) (60:15)

Thank you everybody.

Sophia (60:17)

They're like, shut up Sophia. Okay, bye.

Ad Readers / Sponsors (e.g., Xolair, Mint Mobile, Ryan Reynolds) (60:36)

Xolair Omalizumab is proven to significantly reduce allergic reactions if a food allergy accident happens. Xolair 150mg is a prescription medication used to treat food allergy in people 1 year of age and older to reduce allergic reactions due to accidental exposure to one or more food foods. While taking Xolair, you should continue to avoid all foods to which you are allergic. Don't use if you are allergic to Xolair. Xolair may cause a severe life threatening allergic reaction called anaphylaxis. Tell your doctor if you have ever had anaphylaxis. Get help right away if you have trouble breathing or if you have swelling of your throat or tongue. Xolair should not be used for the emergency treatment of allergic reactions including anaphylaxis. Xolair is for maintenance use to reduce allergic reactions including anaphylaxis while avoiding food allergies, allergens Serious side effects such as cancer, fever, muscle aches and rash, parasitic infection or heart and circulation problems have been reported. Please see xolair.com for full prescribing information. Ask an allergist about Xolair this is an advertisement for Xolair, paid for by Genentech and Novartis.

Sophia (61:45)

This is Chelsea Handler from Dear Chelsea after the Big Game. Like most people, I kept thinking about the commercials, and there was one that stayed with me. It was from the Blue Square Alliance Against Hate. And it wasn't loud or flashy. It showed a Jewish kid being targeted at school and another student who chose not to ignore it. As someone who is Jewish, that moment felt very real to me. Not dramatic, just familiar. And what struck me was how clearly it showed that hate doesn't always announce itself, but the impact is still huge. If you saw the Blue Square spot during the Big Game, it's worth thinking about. And if you want to show support, sharing the Blue Square is one small way to do that.

Senator Cory Booker (62:23)

I'm U.S. transportation Secretary Sean Duffy. We all seem to be in a rush these days, from work to driving our kids around. But when you're behind the wheel, please do not speed. A few minutes saved by going faster is never worth the risk. So follow the speed limit, enjoy the drive, maybe bring some snacks for the kids. And know that along the way, you're getting quality time with your family, paid for by nhtsa.

Sophia (62:52)

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