Work in Progress with Sophia Bush – Abby Phillip
iHeartPodcasts | November 22, 2025
Guest: Abby Phillip

Episode Overview

In this episode, Sophia Bush sits down with acclaimed journalist and CNN NewsNight anchor Abby Phillip. They discuss Abby's journey from childhood in Trinidad and Tobago to becoming a trusted voice in American journalism, her insights on identity and empathy, the significance of her new book (“A Dream: Jesse Jackson and the Fight for Political Power”), and the challenges of telling complex, multidimensional stories—especially in a deeply divided political era. Together, they explore what it means to be both a “masterpiece and a work in progress”.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Abby’s Early Life and Formation (03:25–09:21)

• Immigrant Roots and Identity:
  Abby shares memories of moving from Trinidad and Tobago to the U.S. at age eight, the “lore” of the American Dream, and early experiences that shaped her drive and self-understanding.
• Balancing Uniqueness and Assimilation:
  • “My parents…always kind of instilled in us this sense that we were not…just like everybody else, for good or for bad.” (09:21, Abby)
  • Her Christian upbringing taught her to “be in the world but not of the world”, cultivating comfort with difference.

Empathy, Diversity, and Belonging (13:06–15:20)

• Growing up among different cultures and races in Trinidad and Tobago taught Abby to easily interact across differences.
• “The idea of differences was not something that ever really bothered me…finding what we had in common was always more important than finding what we didn’t.” (13:18, Abby)
• Sophia and Abby relate over their family histories of immigration, assimilation, and navigating American identity.

The Power of Storytelling and Journalism (20:12–28:35)

• Roots of Curiosity:
  Abby reflects on her entry into journalism and how she finds meaning in chronicling both history and the present.
  • “History, politics, culture—it’s the story of us. How we came to be, and also where we’re going.” (20:12, Abby)
• Explains her attraction to political journalism:
  • “I’ve always loved the sort of outsider role…the place that journalism sits, that is somewhere between the two party system.” (23:34, Abby)
• Responsibility & Agency:
  • Notes that journalists have a special role to “elevate voices” and work for the public.

On Impartiality and Institutional Trust (29:18–35:22)

• Abby addresses the difficulty and necessity of maintaining openness and empathy rather than strict “objectivity.”
  • “Are you approaching every story with openness and empathy?” (30:43, Abby)
• Acknowledges institutional upheaval in both media and politics; emphasizes that democracy requires voices outside the partisan fray and checks and balances.
• Sophia and Abby reflect on the importance of traveling, meeting people, and seeking lived experiences to inform their work and perspectives.

The Complexity of Voters & Telling the Full Story (40:52–44:19)

• Abby describes the often contradictory and multidimensional beliefs of American voters, and the need to reflect real complexity in public discourse.
  • “People are complex…and being open to that is really important because politics…flattens us into two-dimensional R and D.” (40:52, Abby)
• She recounts working on stories with diverse communities whose personal and political views don’t always align—insisting these nuanced voters are often the “deciders.”

The Legacy of Jesse Jackson & Lessons for Today (46:55–59:33)

• Why Write This Book Now?
  • Abby explains that, like today, the 1980s were a time both of “backlash against diversity” and fights over who speaks for the working class.
  • Jesse Jackson’s approach—acknowledging difference but emphasizing coalition—offers lessons for politics today.
  • “One of the key lessons…is the way that he argued in favor of seeing people with those multiple dimensions.” (47:21, Abby)
• The “quilt” metaphor from Jackson’s campaign:
  • “All the different parts of this country [are] part of a quilt…that is still something worth aspiring toward.” (50:43, Abby)
• The danger of siloing people by identity versus embracing both individuality and shared purpose.
• The necessity of not giving up on persuading others, even across lines of antagonism or difference:
  • “I think the act of persuasion is the practice of democracy, and you cannot write people off if you say you want to practice democracy.” (58:48, Abby)

Women, Leadership, and Double Standards (68:09–76:22)

• Discuss the contrasting standards for men and women in politics—men are often allowed to be “fabulous and flawed”, women are held to perfection.
  • “We hold ourselves, women, to a higher standard…But also, I think [women’s] allies sometimes create a cocoon…and I don’t know that the cocoon is helpful.” (73:25, Abby)
• The road ahead:
  • “At some point a woman candidate is gonna sort of blow through some of that, and that’s what’s gonna be necessary to get women into that final tier of American politics.” (75:45, Abby)

Abby on Anchoring, Leadership, and Evolving Media (80:18–86:44)

• She describes consciously facilitating conversations across divides on “NewsNight.”
  • “I don’t want to be the center of that conversation. I want to be the facilitator of it.” (83:08, Abby)
• Normalizes resilience in the face of identity-based attacks and rapid media change.
• Abby sees her work as “seasons,” constantly balancing professional and personal life, and is looking forward to new chapters of both rest and creativity.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the eternal balancing act:
  • “You are allowed to be both a masterpiece and a work in progress, simultaneously.” (Show theme, Sophia)
• On building bridges:
  • “Can candidates figure out how to…bring people together not by ignoring who they are, but by saying, I see who you are, and I acknowledge it—but also, let me show you what we all have in common.” (49:32, Abby)
• On the role of journalists:
  • “The First Amendment is the First Amendment for a reason…you cannot have a democracy without a free press.” (26:30, Abby)
• On women in politics:
  • “We can be whole people. We don’t have to be perfect people.” (75:45, Abby)

Important Segment Timestamps

• Abby’s childhood, moving to the U.S., and identity: 06:01–13:18
• Entering journalism & why she chose it: 20:12–26:30
• Objectivity/impartiality discussion: 29:18–35:22
• On voters’ complexity and misconceptions: 40:52–44:19
• Jesse Jackson’s candidacies—lessons for the present: 46:55–59:33
• Portraying complex leaders & double standards for women: 68:09–76:22
• Anchoring, leadership style, and balancing life: 80:18–88:23

Tone & Language

The tone is intimate, thoughtful, and candid—marked by warmth between Sophia and Abby, frequent laughter, and mutual admiration. Both lean into complexity, reject easy answers, and embrace the messiness of progress, both personal and political.

For Listeners New & Old

Even if you haven’t listened to the episode, this conversation will leave you with:

• A deeper appreciation of the importance of multidimensional storytelling in democracy.
• Insights on how empathy, curiosity, and open-mindedness improve journalism and civic life.
• A renewed sense of how history—specifically Black political organizing—shapes the present.
• Reflection on the persistent double standards women face in leadership, and the ongoing work to change them.

If you enjoy intelligent and nuanced conversations about identity, politics, and change—this episode is for you.