A (1:58)

I used to manage a team in Tokyo and I always felt I was young. I was like in my 20s, early 30s, maybe late 20s. And there is this, what I felt a perception in Japanese culture that western women are whores, like white women. And I managed this guy in Tokyo, oh my God, he gave me a fucking run for my money. But I always felt very uncomfortable in Tokyo. It's so funny, really. I liked it. I thought the drinking culture was like a little bit scary. Like the sake shop.

B (2:28)

I didn't go out at all.

A (2:29)

Really big drinking culture that was just strange. It was a. It was an interesting time. But anyways, I'm so glad you went. Let's go through this week.

B (2:39)

Okay, so.

A (2:40)

Oh, boy. Okay. Okay, what are we doing?

B (2:42)

So Monday you have a doctor's appointment.

A (2:48)

Okay.

B (2:48)

So I think that's like the. There's like a few scattered meetings here and there, but the following day you have another appointment followed by the bi weekly executive meeting for two hours.

A (2:59)

Yep.

B (3:01)

Something with your child.

A (3:02)

Yes. Those pesky children.

B (3:06)

And then you're meeting with Lauren Root. Lauren from Root. And then there's a event here that night as well.

A (3:18)

Okay.

B (3:19)

Which I don't think you need to be a part of.

A (3:20)

Oh, what's the event?

B (3:21)

It's our event with produce parties. So it's like in line with our tomato thon.

A (3:27)

Okay, great.

B (3:28)

They're doing like a potluck situation.

A (3:30)

Okay.

B (3:31)

That's what I was talking to Chelsea about earlier.

A (3:32)

Oh, that's fun.

B (3:33)

Yeah. And then the next day, I'm going to Boston. You're going to Boston. And you have the Work Like a Girl AI event. AI Like a girl, yes.

A (3:43)

I'm very excited. So we're doing an event at axon on the 26th. Right. It's on the 27th. Till on the 27th. So on the 27th, I'll be in Boston. We have a big event at Axon. Any woman or any person really who wants to come and learn about AI from a bunch of really interesting people is welcome to join. You can sign up via the Work Like a Girl slack. So if you go into my Instagram or into my socials and you go into my all my link source, my link tree, I guess you can sign up, but it's going to be awesome. We're excited. Thank you to the Axon people for hosting us. And then I have an Axon board meeting, which is going to be great.

B (4:22)

Two days is like just Axon nonstop.

A (4:25)

All Axon, all the time.

B (4:26)

All right.

A (4:26)

I love it.

B (4:27)

And so that's like pretty much your week.

A (4:28)

That's the week. Yeah. Boston and Axon. That's not a bad way to end the summer.

B (4:32)

Not a bad way to end the summer.

A (4:34)

All right, thank you so much. Jessica Rose, welcome back. Okay. All right, so let's. That was a good trial run. Let's just start it from the top. All right, so welcome back to work. We just saw Jessica Rose. We had our wellness week last week. So I would say about half the company was out. Half the company wasn't out, but the company part of the company that wasn't out was doing light work. It has been a while since we recorded this podcast and in that time there was a salacious little article in the cut about a former Food52 employee named Shannon Muldoon. So I just wanted to talk about it here. If you look on Instagram, the headline of the story is, I mean, we work in media. What the fuck? Food52 exec Shannon Muldoon used her company credit card for everything, including hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of personal expenses. So the cut goes on to say, oops, go back to the top summer. So the cut goes on to say, Shannon Muldoon, a bright and vibrant media executive. I feel like this is not a nice thing about media executive lived a life of unquiet luxury. She bought the best clothes, ate at the restaurants, vacationed in beautiful places, and she put it all on Instagram. She worked out at the same private training gym as influencers and reality television stars. That's like my nightmare. And she flaunted her lifestyle to colleagues at the recipe and lifestyle website Food52, where she ran studio Food52, which is the content studio that handed production for brand partnerships. Long story short, between 2021 and 2023, she stole over $270,000 from the company. And this is what is captured in the court documents. She's just pled guilty to, I believe, second degree larceny, grand larceny, in addition to basically expensing whatever she wanted. Clothes, wise Gucci, Chanel, all sorts of designer brands. I don't know exactly what ones she booked. I think almost $20,000 worth of flights on Delta that she expensed to the company. And it really makes, I think anybo who reads this say what the fuck was happening. So the headline is right. I mean, we work in media, what the fuck? But it's funny, I went to an event last night and people are like, hey, what about Food52? What about the article? It's an annoying thing to have to address. I actually have, I read the comments section on the article and I had frankly fairly similar reaction, which is this happens at a lot of companies. Fraud happens all the time. I think fraud happens in big companies and little companies and successful companies and unsuccessful companies. But it does make you scratch your head on what were people thinking when her expense report came in? Like, how was she able to expense so many personal items with nobody noticing and no justification? And look, I think it's a good like, ooh, splash of cold water on the face, like wake up call for the company Obviously it, you know, had a big impact. Food52 is an investor backed company. It is a startup that is trying and struggled to be successful for a long time. Having great moments of brilliance and some moments of despair like this. But I think it's an interesting, it's an interesting story. It is a good cautionary tale that if you are running a business or managing a team or working in a controller or finance operation, you gotta check the ones and twos all the time. What are people expensing? Why are people expensing it? Do they have the business justification for it? Are people's expense reports monitored by other people? Do you have checks and balances in your financial systems? I'm spending an inordinate amount of time on this now, not because of the article but just because of where we are as a company. And I think it is always a good wake up call on look, that administrative stuff that is uncomfortable or you know, you want to gloss over, you want to get to a better part of your job. Making sure you have a good handle on the singles and doubles and the, you know, where the money goes and who the money goes to is really, really, really important. And I think, you know businesses, I think in hindsight or inside view, it's really easy to be like, oh, those people are idiots. What were they thinking? How could they have done that? Which is a natural and very obvious reaction. But I also think businesses are like complicated organisms. There's a bunch of humans, there's other priorities, there's other catastrophes, there's other stuff happening which make it so that there are room for people who want to commit fraud that they are able to do so. So good cautionary tale. I think my tips and tricks section today would be like don't steal hundreds of thousands of dollars from your company if you don't want to end up in jail. And if you do lead a company or you work in finance, make sure you're checking where all the expenses go.

B (9:50)

Now work.

A (9:55)

All right, so that's that. What are we doing in today's episode? We have a whole bunch of stuff. You're gonna hear me rant for a while. We're gonna jump into current events next. So the first thing we're covering in current events thanks to summer is the pacifier trend. So I saw KFC doing a one minute man on this the other day. So I guess the newest thing with Gen Z and I actually I'm feeling bad for Gen Z. I think Gen Z just gets mal by everyone everywhere at all time. I think it's partly because there's some Gen Zers, like some Gen Xers and some millennials who are doing ridiculous things, including this, which is Gen zers are now taking to having pacifiers to soothe them from workplace stress. So there's now this trend, and I don't actually even know if it's real or if it's just a meme, but people are wearing pacifiers. I think it's mostly happening in Asia. It's probably the people who are taking to their bed to rebel against workplace stress. But now not only are they taking to their beds, but they are having pacifiers. On this topic, I do want to reframe some of this conversation, which is. I think there's a different thing happening, which is about people in their 20s. And I think instead of blaming Gen Z and maligning Gen Z, talking about what it's like to make it through your twenties and being understanding of the challenges and the opportunities that are present for you in your 20s. In your 20s, you don't know where you're going. You don't have a whole bunch of financial certainty. You don't necessarily right now have a great ton of job prospects. You might have to live at home. You grew up, you had a formative part of your life in Covid, so you're naturally socially awkward or you're socially limited, or you're socially inhibited. The Internet is everywhere. You're on your phone all the time, so you're being assaulted with messages. You become very passive just by virtue of how you consume content and media. And I wish that people would spend more time thinking about how do we coach up, love up, teach up, push up these, the 20 somethings, so that they can be happy 30 somethings and hopefully fulfilled and successful 40 somethings, whatever that definition is. But I think that's a big thing I want to start talking about here, which is not just making fun of Gen Z for taking to their beds and having pacifiers and just being generally needy. I think all generations are needy in their own right. But really thinking about how would we change that narrative to give folks in their 20s who are coming into the workplace the tools and the encouragement and the confidence they need to be successful. Let's talk about quiet cracking. So quiet cracking is the new quiet quitting. Jessica Rose. So quiet quack. Quiet quiet quacking. Quiet cracking is the next big thing at work or the new big thing at work, which is instead of basically being like, fuck my job, fuck the man. I'm just going to mail it in and screw my company. What's happening now is something called quiet cracking. So employees are struggling. They're cracking under the pressure of work, the discomfort of work, the demands of work, the division at work, whatever that may be. And they're cracking because they want to leave, but they can't leave. And so they're stuck where they are. I think this is happening. I don't think this is a Gen Z thing. I think this is happening to everybody at work right now. And it's really. I think there's two things which is when you think about the attitudinal change or the cultural change of quiet quitting was I think last summer or the summer before. I think it was the summer before because it was in my book. So quiet quitting was two summers ago. The economy was roaring, employees were very emboldened. It was a different political climate in the country. It was still an era of a little bit of wokeness and kind of there was a lot of prevailing attitudes which were very emboldening and empowering to employees. To two and a half years later where now it's quiet cracking and the economy's possibly slowing down. Depending on, you know, who you read or what you listen to, the job prospects aren't there the way they used to be. There's. I read something last night like there's basically this stagnation of mobility which is people aren't changing jobs and people aren't buying houses. So Americans are becoming less, quote unquote mobile. And as a result, what you're seeing is people are stuck in a job, they don't love it, they might not be good at it, or maybe it doesn't, it isn't good for them. But there's no viable prospect. And so this amount of like self hate and depression and just disadvantage disenfranchisement is happening. But because there aren't any prospects, you can't be like, fuck you, you're like shit. And so that's how I would describe quiet cracking versus quiet quitting. All right, so our next story comes from Instagram. I'm getting assaulted in Instagram by all sorts of like business startupy things. Actually cute summer story. So it's like Friday night, a week ago, Friday night. And like at Friday night sometimes I like have a glass of wine and I take to my bed and then I scroll through Instagram, which I think is a very normal behavior. And on my Instagram like I used to get like celebrity and Jennifer Garner and food and now I just get like business Quotes and like motivational speeches. And so I put them in slack to our group that makes this show. And I'm like, ooh, look at this, look at this, look at this. And poor Summer. And I batch it. I'll do like 10 and then I go away. And then I'll do 10 and then I go away. And so Summer, to Summer's credit, you are a great person. Summer, like, was like, okay, great, like responding. And I was like, oh God, summer, it's like 11 o' clock on a Friday night. Like, go have a life. Like, ignore me. I'm gonna do this all weekend long. Just ignore me and then we'll come back and talk about it Monday. But to Summer's credit, I was on the call with someone yesterday and the only two people in the office early yesterday morning were you two, which I thought was like super cool like, that you guys were like getting ready, wanting to make the show great, which is awesome. So. So long story short, last Friday night I got this post which is from Founders Tribune and it's talking about Zach Parrott. So Zach Parrott is the co founder of Plaid and he wrote this as a blog in 2025. So you can read the full essay@founderstribune.org but the quote I loved was no startup ever wins because their team is the best at attending internal meetings or approving expense reports. That's a hot topic for this episode. And he gave the idea of the shit umbrella and that essentially a manager's job is to be the shit umbrella for your people. So every person should be the shit umbrella for the person who comes next. And I think this is a good way of thinking about management and thinking about work, which is, you know, I was reading something else the other day that the most important thing at work is how you show up in a stressful situation. And I have to have a lot of self talk with. With. We're in obviously a lot of stressful situations at Food52 and I find that I have to have this self talk where I'm like irritated or mad or stressed going into something and if I go in that way, it's just gonna be like that for everyone else I touch. And so I think being able to emotionally regulate your stress and to show up positive despite stress is a really, really great management skill. But the shit umbrella means, according to this post, protecting your teams from all the unnecessary things that SAP differ by function and team. For some teams, it might mean just giving them permission to ignore unnecessary emails and calendar invites. For others, you Might need to work with the individual to convey the importance of focus, give them a better shit proof jacket. And in the most extreme cases it means auditing someone's calendar and discussing their personal time allocation. So I think that I think of the shit umbrella a little bit differently, which is, yes, as a manager you should make sure your team is not wasting their time and spending their time on stuff that doesn't matter. Auditing the calendar, talking about time spent, talking about priorities, making people motivated to address and handle and get them great. I also think it's more important than that where you have to try to protect your teams from getting too whipsawed by everyone else in the company. I know I can be a problem like this because I always like to go to the source. So I find sometimes that I create problems because I'm like, no, I just want to ask the person the question and the manager will be like, oh, I want to like manage how you ask the person the question. And I think that's good tension. But I also think it's really good that you know, if you're a manager to try to, you know, try to keep the stress at bay, try to keep the noise at a, at a decent volume and try to keep the focus and effort and energy positive and motivated to good things. I think that's really, really, really essential at a startup. And so I think that's good skills. I think that's why working at a startup is actually great because if you can handle that, then you can go work in bigger companies and be successful. It was interesting. I had lunch with someone last week. God, last week feels like a year ago, but I had lunch with someone I didn't know very well who was introduced through someone who I'm on a board with. And we were talking about just like big companies and I was kind of, of sharing my observation on the company we, I sit on the board of and one of the things we're talking about is like when you get in a big company, there's a lack of like precision, focus and execution. It just, things become a little blobby. And I think the blobbiness as a manager, if you can protect your people from being impacted and sucked up into the blob, it makes a really, really big difference. And I also think it's why people who, who, who like to work in small companies or like to work in startups tend to be sharper because they are most focused and most urgently prioritized and out of necessity focusing on things that can transact and Matter. So. Ooh, strategery. All right, strategery is back. We had a whole big thing in Work Like a Girl, so small shout out for Work Like a Girl slot. We had a daily topic the other day on strategic words that we hate. And pushing the envelope was one that came very, very, very high to the top. So what does pushing the envelope mean? Pushing the envelope means going beyond the usual limits or boundaries of something, often in a bold or innovative way. It implies a desire to explore the edges of what's possible, potentially taking risks to achieve something new or improve upon existing methods. I like all those things. I think it's great to push the boundaries at work. I think it's great to endeavor to take on big, gnarly tasks. I think when people say push the envelope, it's kind of just. It's a little cheese. I think I just have to say. I also think that people who use the phrase push the envelope probably are the least likely to push the envelope. So I think like most strategery words, it's all in who and how you use it. So that's pushing the envelope. So we're going to close our episode out. We're going to talk about traits of highly successful employees. I think one thing that's important to keep in mind as you think about the sensational cases of like a Shannon Muldoon, or you think about quiet cracking, like, I think there's this thing, or you think about being a 20 something at work. Like, there is something right now where people are feeling overwhelmed, like demonstrably overwhelmed, stressed, kind of maxed out, and are unsure of what to do, where to do, how to do next. And I think that's one of the biggest ailments in the modern workplace is this feeling of being overwhelmed, this feeling of being disenfranchised, this feeling of not having your company have your back, but you don't really have your company's back either. I think that is a prevailing attitude right now, which is creating a really complex relationship between people and work. And I think it's especially happening for new and younger people coming into the workplace because they didn't, you know, they don't come into it with the same value set as the people who are exiting the workplace. They don't have the experience. In some cases, the experience they have is very different than what the workplace requires. So I think work is becoming, which is why I'm interested in work. It's like becoming this whole jumble of, in a microcosm of kind of what's happening at large. So one of the things I spend a lot of time looking at, I get like all these color coded wheels on Instagram of like the 10 habits for this and the 12 habits for that. But one of the things that I do think is worth, worth talking about is what are the habits of highly fulfilled and highly successful people at work? The biggest, the best, like the only one that really matters is I think people who show up at work wanting to make other people successful are the most successful people at work, period. So you don't need to be the smartest, you don't need to be the brightest, you don't have to have the best pedigree. But if you show up ready, willing, engaged and, and able to put a lot of effort in, to care and to focus with intention on making other people successful, you have the best chance of really two things happening. One, you are fulfilled personally and two, you are fulfilled because you are fulfilling other people. So I think that's the biggest thing and the greatest trait of people who are successful at work. Other things are. Oops, sorry. Other things are. One is being proactive. I think being proactive is a highly, highly underrated skill. I think a lot of times, and I see this especially in 20 and 30 somethings at work, is like you're a little bit afraid, so you don't know to ask for more or do more. And I think people sometimes can be afraid of looking stupid or not knowing what to do. And being proactive will always get you more at bats. It gives you more chances to win, it gives you more exposure, it gives you more experience. Yes, it will cause you to fuck up more, but it's a great opportunity to do and try and be more. And so the at bats really matter. And I also think people value proactivity in other people. Like when I interview people here or I talk to people at work about people we want to hire. Proactivity is always a top five skill that hiring managers want people to have. And what that means I think is being proactive is really just the result of being observant. You understand what's happening, you see the dynamics, you see what needs to be done and taking action and being motivated and willing to do something. So that's one, Two is being solution minded. I think I had a phase here like a month or a month and a half ago where everyone at schoolhouse was just asking for headcount. Literally I'd go into every meeting I went into, it was just asking for headcount and I was like, fuck. Like, I don't have any headcount to give you. But headcount isn't the solution. So not just focused on the complaint, which is in this case, hey, we don't have enough people, which may or may not be true. And going to a conclusion of, hey, we need more people. Sometimes more people isn't always the answer. Like, I'm in a vortex of like, hey, build a billion dollar company with AI. Hey, build a billion dollar company with four people. I just met with someone this morning who has like a two and a half million dollar business on eight people and is profitable. I'm like, that's pretty amazing. So being about the solution, not being about the complaint, being resourceful to solve something is a second great skill of being successful at work. Third is not complaining. Yes, you need that safe space. You need somebody to complain to. You need somebody to vent with. You need someone to be like, oh my God, my boss is a fucking crazy person. I hate this job. Like, have that person try to not have that person be someone you work with. And that's like my greatest advice, which is, everybody needs to vent. It's very normal to vent. Find a place to vent that's outside of work, but inside of work. Don't be the complainer. Be a person. Be a fixer. Like, be the fixer. Don't be the complainer. Next up, admit what you don't know. Like, don't pretend to know something you don't. Don't say yes when the answer is no. Don't say sure when the answer is, I don't think we should do that. Don't present something to be true when it's not. Don't say you know when you don't be okay being vulnerable and not having the answer. Like, I went through something this weekend and I'm trying to figure out a. Figure out a way to resolve a dispute the company has. And so I put my five ideas in an email and I sent it to two people I respect and value the opinion of. And I'm like, you know what? You probably have better ideas than I do. How would you handle this situation? So being vulnerable and not being disingenuous, and I don't mean it in like an evil way, but don't say yes when the answer is no. Don't pretend you agree with something when you don't. And don't puff up when you don't have the stuff or the goods to back up the puffing up. Don't just talk the talk. So speaking of a strategery word like, don't just toss out the strategery words. Being successful at work is actually trying and doing something. We talked about this other week, which is being able to sit in discomfort and doing things is the greatest key possible to getting experience, building a bigger gut, having a better knowledge base to work off of. And then the last one is like, try to lift other people up. Like, try to make somebody else successful. I think the people who focus on making other people successful at work actually become the most successful people themselves. So. So that's my parting thought to you. Things that it takes to be great at work, ways that you can make your work fulfilling for you and use it to build your knowledge base. I always have said this. I really believe it. That work is the tuition you get paid for. So no matter what that job is, if it's in a gift shop, if it's at Google, if it's something fabulous, if it's not fabulous at all, there is always something to be learned from everything. And part of what you can learn is, is a direct result of how you show up and what you decide to do and who you decide to be in that. In that moment. So that's it. Thank you for listening. You can follow us everywhere. We will see you back here next week and have a great day.