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One of the most common ways workers can find support and camaraderie is through a union. But what if your role doesn’t allow you to be a part of a union?

That’s the case for middle managers.

According to the National Labor Relations Act, managers are prevented from joining unions because it creates a conflict of interest. So where does that leave managers when it comes to support? Like in so many other instances, they are falling through the cracks.

Without formal support groups, middle managers, like today’s guest, have to go out of their way to create their own. Erin Mantz is currently a middle manager at communications agency Zeno Group, who has also been a middle manager at big tech companies throughout her career. She says her informal support group is necessary to stay above water.

In this episode, she tells us how her support group operates, the benefits of having a support network, and where other managers might find their own support to get one of the hardest corporate jobs done.