WSJ What’s News – Sunday, Nov 9, 2025

Episode: Amazon and Netflix Are Winning: Can Old-School Media Compete?

Overview: Main Theme & Purpose

This episode dives deep into the rapidly evolving media landscape, focusing on the latest wave of media mergers and consolidation – especially the potential acquisition of Warner Brothers Discovery by Paramount Skydance. The conversation explores whether these traditional media giants, amid declining cable subscriptions and the rise of streaming, have any chance of surviving or thriving against tech behemoths like Amazon and Netflix. Guest media analysts Michael Nathanson and Robert Fishman from MoffettNathanson provide context, history, and prognosis for legacy companies entangled in the so-called “last stage” of media consolidation.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Week’s Hot Topics: Brief Market and Political Rundown

• Tariffs & The Supreme Court

  • The Supreme Court questions whether the president overreached using the International Emergency Economic Powers Act (IEEPA) to enact tariffs.
  • Even if Trump loses, other avenues exist to impose tariffs, leaving corporate America uncertain.
    • Miriam Gottfried [03:57]: "What this all boils down to is more uncertainty for corporate America... Uncertainty is the enemy here if you are a publicly traded company."

• Elections & Market Impact

  • Focus on affordability (inflation, cost of living) drove recent political victories for Democrats and Mayor Mamdani in NY.
  • Financial markets reacted in unexpected ways (e.g., rent freeze proposals didn’t sink relevant stocks).

• Private Credit & Alternative Assets

  • Despite recent bankruptcies, the narrative has become more positive for big asset managers like Blackstone and Apollo.
  • Investors eye private credit as a potential alternative given high market valuations and Shiller PE ratio.
    • Telis Dimos [09:23]: "At some point does, does the greed factor kick in for the market and overcome the fear factor..."

2. Media Consolidation: Paramount, Skydance, and Warner Discovery

Setting the Stage

• Who Owns What?
  • CBS: Owned by Paramount Skydance.
  • CNN: Owned by Warner Discovery.
  • Merger could place these under one roof – showing how convoluted media ownership has become.

The Paramount Skydance-Warner Discovery Bid

• The bid marks another major shakeup after decades of similar tie-ups and breakups.

• Why Merge? Scale is the goal – especially in streaming.

  • Robert Fishman [12:44]: "They need to reach scale, and scale in streaming specifically. Most media companies are trying to compete with Netflix... who's already won in terms of the scale war and in terms of profitability."

• The Threat from Big Tech

  • Michael Nathanson [14:44]: "The biggest change the past decade has been the advance of these really large tech companies... Amazon, YouTube, Google, Netflix... If you're a traditional media company, you have to get scale, scale of balance sheet, scale of cash flow, scale of cost cutting."

What Scale Enables

• Global subscriber base dilutes content investment costs.
• Strength in ad monetization as advertisers move from cable to streaming and digital.
• Library & IP (Intellectual Property), especially for franchises, is a crucial asset.

Sports Rights: Media’s Last Stronghold

• Sports broadcasting has long anchored media companies, but tech firms like Amazon are marching in.
  • Robert Fishman [16:39]: "If they lose control exclusively over the sports rights... that's going to have another leg down in terms of the disruption..."

Financial Realities & Shareholder Value

• Track Record of Mega-mergers

  • Big mergers often disappoint shareholders due to overpaying and difficult integration.
    • Michael Nathanson [20:45]: "They just don't work... Trying to find scale through M&A, you end up paying a big premium for businesses that really, you know, at the end of the day don’t live up to the valuations."
  • Smaller “tuck-in” deals (e.g., Disney buying Pixar) tend to create more value.

• Is THIS Time Different?

  • Streaming’s economics may force consolidation that is more necessity than opportunity.
    • Robert Fishman [22:00]: "Streaming is this X factor... These standalone streaming services can't compete on their own. So I would argue it's almost a necessity that they have to come together."

3. The Tech Giant Threat: Amazon, Netflix—And Apple?

• Netflix: Focused Powerhouse

• Amazon: Mixing Commerce With Content

  • Michael Nathanson [23:43]: "Amazon, it's clear what they're doing. Their ad platform is growing like gangbusters ... focused on more and more sports... Add premium content and drive ads through our platform."

• Apple: The Enigma

  • Michael Nathanson [23:43]: "I'm not sure what the answer to that question is. ... Apple is an enigma. I don't understand why they haven't gotten more aggressive in sports rights..."

• Why Buy Warner Discovery?

  • Valued assets: DC Comics content (Batman, Superman), CNN, HBO, Warner Bros. film library.
    • Robert Fishman [25:34]: "It comes down to that very valuable IP... HBO and Warner Brothers content both on the TV side and on the theatrical side."

• Comcast NBCU's Interest

  • Consolidation offers global reach, content synergy (Universal + Warner), and pooling of sports rights.
    • Michael Nathanson [26:23]: "You would build the most dynamic studio in the world by combining Universal and Warners. That’d be pretty interesting."

4. Industry Implications: Is This the Endgame?

• Will Disney or other legacy companies be threatened?

  • Michael Nathanson [27:50]: "I don’t think you’re quaking in your boots... You lose a competitor, you won’t be able to make as many films... It’s really healthy for the incumbents to have this deal happen."

• Is this the Last Big Consolidation?

  • After so many cycles of mergers and breakups, the industry may be at a structural endpoint.
    • Michael Nathanson [29:20]: "That was the original sin... I think we're at the end... This is probably the last mega deal we will see."

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Surviving in Today’s Media World:

  • Michael Nathanson [14:44]: “Traditional media companies... need scale, scale of balance sheet, scale of cash flow, scale of cost cutting. It's a different playing field than... 20 years ago.”

• On the Appeal of Warner Discovery’s Assets:

  • Michael Nathanson [25:15]: “You have all the DC content. You have... HBO, one of the crown jewels there. Warner Brothers content both on the TV and theatrical side.”

• On the Nature of Consolidation:

  • Robert Fishman [22:00]: “Standalone streaming services can't compete on their own. So I would argue it's almost a necessity that they have to come together.”

• On Whether This Is the Final Act:

  • Michael Nathanson [29:20]: “We're at the end. This is probably the last mega deal we will see... studios streaming, broadcast in some combination of that, and that's kind of the end of it.”

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

• 01:10–05:03: Weekly political & market hot topics, tariffs and uncertainty.

• 07:18–10:12: Private credit, alternative assets, and dealmaking environment.

• 10:12–11:25: Who owns what in media; setting the stage for main discussion.

• 12:06–27:12: In-depth interview with Michael Nathanson & Robert Fishman:

  • 12:44: Why Paramount Skydance wants Warner Discovery.
  • 13:47: Streaming economics and the need for global scale.
  • 14:44: Tech titans upending legacy business models.
  • 15:45–17:35: Sports rights as the last stronghold.
  • 20:45: Historical context of mergers, shareholder value.
  • 22:00: Whether this time is different because of streaming necessity.
  • 23:43: Amazon, Apple, Comcast's strategic interests.
  • 25:15–27:12: Detailed analysis of Warner Discovery’s most valuable assets.

• 27:30–30:08: Future of media: Is this the end of an era?

Concluding Thought

As old-school media giants face existential choices, the guest analysts are united: bigger might be better, but history is filled with failed mega-mergers. With tech superpowers like Amazon and Netflix already at scale, this merger race may be legacy media’s final act—for better or for worse.

For those following the future of streaming, sports broadcasting, and content ownership, this episode offers both a grounded sense of history and a candid, even bittersweet, look at the media industry's likely endgame.