Episode 1610 - Bill Burr

Summary

WTF with Marc Maron Podcast: Episode 1610 - Bill Burr

Host: Marc Maron
Guest: Bill Burr
Release Date: January 20, 2025
Description: In this emotionally charged episode, Marc Maron engages in a deep and revealing conversation with comedian Bill Burr. They explore personal struggles, societal concerns, and the intricacies of their careers in comedy. The discussion is candid, introspective, and laced with humor, offering listeners an unfiltered glimpse into the minds of two of comedy's most influential figures.

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1. Societal Concerns and Personal Fears

Bill Burr opens the discussion with a somber reflection on the state of America, expressing fears about the nation's trajectory towards authoritarianism and the suppression of marginalized groups.

• Disillusionment with Democracy:
  "Squarespace has been a sponsor of WTF for more than a decade. But this isn't the same Squarespace that we used way back when we made wtfpod.com it's a Squarespace for today's needs..." (00:39)

• Fear of Authoritarian Shift:
  "We're at the precipice of an authoritarian America where people will be nominated and put in positions of power where they have no capability of doing it correctly or don't know the job primarily." (02:15)

• Impact of Policy Changes:
  "Equal rights are going to be on the back burner if ever coming back. I don't know. The living wage also on the back burner..." (01:50)

2. Personal Struggles and Coping Mechanisms

Bill delves into his personal experiences with fear, dread, and isolation, discussing how these emotions have been exacerbated by recent societal changes and natural disasters.

• Dealing with Natural Disasters:
  "Driving on ice in a car that isn't an all-wheel drive... that was priming me for what's going to happen today." (05:10)

• Coping Strategies:
  "Try to hold on to yourselves. Try to hold on to who you are. Try to get involved on a community level..." (04:20)

3. Comedy Careers and Personal Growth

The conversation shifts to their journeys in comedy, highlighting the challenges and triumphs they've faced while building their careers.

• Bill Burr's Upcoming Projects:
  "His new comedy special called Drop Dead Years comes out in March on Hulu. He's also going to be in the Broadway production of Glengarry Glen Ross..." (07:00)

• Marc Maron's Tour Updates:
  "I'll be in Santa Barbara, California at the Librero Theater on Thursday, January 30..." (05:50)

4. Relationships and Family Dynamics

Bill shares intimate details about his family life, emphasizing the importance of empathy and understanding within relationships.

• Parenting and Empathy:
  "I have to hold on to my kids. They treat me like a bouncing house... my daughter reads me Captain Underpants..." (09:00)

• Balancing Personal Struggles with Family:
  "I come home, I sit down and I listen to them... she reads to me, and we just hold hands." (10:30)

5. Dealing with Mental Health

The episode delves into discussions about mental health, therapy, and personal development.

• Therapy Experiences:
  "I went to therapy to crack it open, but it's like doing standup where you can rehearse as much as you want in your room." (11:00)

• Addiction and Sobriety:
  "I took mushrooms once... it was like walking on a cloud. But then I realized the reality still existed." (12:00)

6. The Evolution of Comedy

Bill and Marc discuss the changing landscape of comedy, touching on alternative comedy and the impact of digital media.

• Transition to Alternative Comedy:
  "Alternative comedy might take over... everything is just different." (14:00)

• Impact of Social Media:
  "People take our jokes out of context and start shit. It's a nightmare." (15:30)

7. Reflections on Past Experiences

The duo reminisces about past performances, interactions with fellow comedians, and pivotal moments in their careers.

• Memorable Gigs:
  "One of my favorite nights of comedy was handling the hecklers and bringing the audience back with airplane material." (17:00)

• Friendships in Comedy:
  "I have a good group of people that make this easier. Hanging out with guys like Dean Del Rey keeps it level." (16:00)

8. Concluding Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, both Bill and Marc offer words of encouragement to listeners facing their own struggles, emphasizing resilience and community support.

• Encouragement to Listeners:
  "What you should do is respect each other and help each other out. We're all on the same team here." (19:00)

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Bill Burr on Authoritarian America:
  "We're at the precipice of an authoritarian America where people will be nominated and put in positions of power where they have no capability of doing it correctly." (02:15)

• Bill Burr on Empathy:
  "Empathy is for suckers and everyone's on their own. You just gotta make do." (03:00)

• Bill Burr on Therapy:
  "Therapy is like standup where you can rehearse as much as you want in your room." (11:00)

• Bill Burr on Parenting:
  "I sit down and I listen to them, even if I don't agree... sometimes, just hold hands and move forward." (10:30)

• Marc Maron on Tour Life:
  "The set is coming along pretty well. Trying to think that has any relevance or importance to anybody." (07:50)

---

Conclusion

Episode 1610 of WTF with Marc Maron offers a profound and introspective dialogue between Marc Maron and Bill Burr. They navigate through personal adversities, societal concerns, and the evolving nature of comedy with honesty and vulnerability. This episode serves as a testament to the resilience of individuals facing overwhelming challenges, all while maintaining a sense of humor and camaraderie.

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Note: The timestamps provided correspond to the transcript segments and serve as reference points for notable quotes and discussions within the episode.

Transcript

[Marc Maron]

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[Bill Burr]

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[Pete Davidson]

How are you?

[Bill Burr]

What the fuckers. What the buddies? What the nicks? What's happening? I'm Mark Mayer and this is my podcast. Welcome to it. I am recording this on Sunday. I am in Denver, Colorado, so it's not Monday morning, but I know it is for most of you. And I know for at least 75,017,626 of you, this is going to be a horrible day. And it's going to be a horrible day for America. And it will go down in history as one of the worst days of this country. Because after today, we're not really going to know the nature of our country. I don't know what happens now, and I'm as scared as you are. And just know that they, they love it. They love our fear. They want us to be subjugated by all of their actions, policies, points of view to push back on the marginalized populations of our of our country with no social reprisal. Look, I'm all about free speech. But just know that it's now conditional to abide by their rules, which I think mostly will be. Shut the fuck up. Equal rights are going to be on the back burner if ever coming back. I don't know. The living wage also on the back burner. Will it ever happen? I don't know. Health care for all, Will that ever happen? I don't know. The idea of sustainability being an important project for the human species, I don't know where that is either. They finally won the war against tolerance and now we got to live with it. But again, I don't think that number is unsubstantial. I mean, when you think about the electoral map, which is oddly a lot like the Duty Watch app that I've been tracking to watch fires, you know, red is a problem, all shades of it. It's a problem because despite what anybody thinks, it was always sort of the loophole of democracy that it was possible that you could freely elect a fascist that will end it. And you know, I don't know, the nature of democracy as a government body seems to be very codependent. Suffers the same problem as any co dependent situation. You know, you've got this idea, this body, this entity that wants everyone to be treated equally, that wants, you know, everybody to be on the same level. That's a real people pleasing idea. And people pleasers are vulnerable to major assholes and profound gaslighting. So here we sit at the precipice of an authoritarian America where people will be nominated and put in positions of power where they have no capability of doing it correctly or don't know the job primarily. So the autocrat at the top of the pyramid has all the say and all the power. He's terrorized his stooges in the Senate and Congress and in business to fear for their own lives, if not their own careers in politics if they do not do what he does. And that fundamentally, I don't know, it doesn't sound like democracy. I'm not trying to bum you out, but this is where we are today. And I don't. Look, my fears are the same as many of yours, you know, I mean, I know some people in their denial or in their need to adapt or like, well, we'll see what happens. Yeah, we will. But I don't, I don't. It's not going to be good. And the dread and isolation and feelings of despair are real. And again, they love it. This is a, a trolling population of autodidactic meatheads with heads full of Garbage and bits and pieces that enable them to bully and just gloat and find a real joy in that somehow or another. Their disposition, which is basically built on the idea that empathy is for suckers and everyone's on their own and you just gotta make do. And a lot of people that I thought were once relatively decent people have locked into this political movement as a way to, to make their personal fortunes and continue their grift. And I don't know, I. It's not that I assumed that humans were all innately good, but it's sort of interesting to watch the ones that you thought were somewhat well balanced, you know, buckle for their own intentions. You know, I flew out of a fire zone into a blizzard and the dread of waiting for fire day to day, that, that feeling of a lack of control, a powerlessness in the face of natural disaster is, is a lot to live with. And then I came out here to Denver and did a couple of amazing shows. Great people out here in Boulder and in Fort Collins. We really had a good time. Me and Mykovsky did some great sets and, you know, did what we could to ease the stress, but there was a blizzard in that feeling of driving on ice. Driving on ice in a. Just a, you know, a car that isn't an all wheel drive and that weird tension where you just don't know when the car is just going to start sliding without you. That fear of powerlessness. I guess it was a primer. Is that the word I want? It was priming me for what's going to happen today and what it's going to feel like for God knows how long. But again, the desire to isolate and lose yourself in your phone and losing to yourself in and bask in, you know, frightening information or information that's, I'm not suggesting, you know, denial, but I am suggesting that, you know, somehow or another we try to keep our heads together. I mean, on, you know, on some level a little bit of denial is necessary just so you don't lose your mind, you know, maybe, you know, don't look at your phone right when you wake up in the morning, give it a few hours, take a breath, have a nice breakfast and then, you know, blow your brains out with the phone. Because it's going to be a shit show. It's going to be just like checking for fires. It's going to be every day of that, every day this week is going to be horrifying for tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of families who will be ripped out of their homes and thrown into transport vehicles and taken wherever, possibly to camps, possibly to countries that they haven't lived in as families for decades, maybe ever. And, you know, that'll probably be on tv. But this is what making America great looks like to, you know, about 77,301,917 people in this country taking the rights away from women. This is what makes America great. This is what does it. It's a small price to pay, right, for people who just want their eggs to be cheaper on the backs of this kind of bullshit. But look, again, don't want to be negative, just want to say, hey, try to hold on to yourselves. Try to hold on to who you are. Try to get involved on a, you know, community level, on a state level, see if we can, you know, regroup something or hold the line in terms of just treating people with some decency because the war on tolerance has been won. And, you know, tolerance was the necessary lubricant for democracy to function. And I don't really even know to do, you know, what to do with 110 million people that didn't vote at all. But, you know, who knows? They're the wild card, I guess. But I do know again that 75 million plus people do not want this. And that's almost half. It's a difference of a couple million people. So we're out there, they're out there to try to, you know, do the right thing in their day to day life and probably, you know, try to do the right thing and in the civic world of your community, of your state and yeah, I don't really know what happens. But look, you can still enjoy a nice, you know, a nice meal. You can still entertain yourself. You can still run your errands, you can still have your friends. Just try to hold on to your minds, will you? Could you try to take care of the people that are vulnerable in the way that you can? I'll be in Santa Barbara, California at the Librero Theater on Thursday, January 30. San Luis Obispo, California at the Fremont center on January 31. That's a Friday. Monterey, California at the Golden State Theater on February 1. Saturday, Iowa City at the Engler Theater on Thursday, February 13 Des Moines, Iowa at Hoyt Sherman Place on Friday, February 14. Kansas City, Missouri at the Midland Theater on Saturday, February 15. Asheville, North Carolina at the Orange Peel on Thursday, February 20. Nashville, Tennessee at the James K. Polk Theater on Friday, February 21. Louisville, Kentucky at the Bombhardt Theater on Saturday, February 21 in Lexington, Kentucky at the Lexington Opera House on Sunday, February 22. I'll be in Oklahoma, Texas, South Carolina, Illinois, Michigan in March and April. You can go to wtfpod.com tour for all my dates and links to tickets. The set is coming along pretty well. I'm trying to think that that has any relevance or importance to anybody. That's the other thing about this thing, is to think that whatever you're doing is futile. Can't think that way. And, you know, and also try not to let your mind swift and, you know, kind of drift into thinking that maybe this isn't so bad. I guess that, again, falls under the denial umbrella, which might be necessary, but it's going to be challenging. It's gonna be challenging just to. To maintain yourselves. Today I talked to Bill Burr. You know, he's been on several times over the years. I see him at the Comedy Store all the time. He's got a couple of things coming up. His new comedy special called Drop Dead Years comes out in March on Hulu. He's also going to be in the Broadway production of Glengery Glen Ross with Bob Odenkirk, Kieran culkin and Michael McKean. That's going to be. I think that's starting. Well, they're going to start rehearsals in March. Look, you know, I wanted to talk, and in some ways I had to talk to people who were around during the fire because everything stopped. And these fires are. Are being managed miraculously by amazing teams of firefighters. Thank God somebody, many people there is a type of person that wants to fight fire fires because, you know, with civil servant jobs and jobs that, you know, seem, I don't know, like, there's a lot of jobs that are sort of thankless, but this isn't one of them. And it is driven by people that want to fight fires. That is what they want to do. That is their purpose in life. And thank God they exist. Because if there were people that were like, well, I don't know, this firefighting racket, you know, there's not a lot into it.

[Pete Davidson]

There's no future in it.

[Bill Burr]

I don't like my health care. It's very dangerous. I'm not into it. I'm going to do something easier. Thank God there are people that want to fight fires with all their heart and. And save lives. It's amazing. And, you know, I guess on some level, we're all going to have to become firefighters metaphorically, in our own way, in the ways that we can. Again, I'm not trying to be negative, but I'M just trying to be realistic. But Bill is here because he was around and he had to evacuate. And a lot of the talks we've had lately are pretty present, they're not backlogged.

[Pete Davidson]

And it's good catching up with them.

[Bill Burr]

You know, we have our own issues, me and Bill, but, you know, he's sort of leveling off and he's, you know, really kind of fighting the good fight to be a decent fella. It takes time. So, yeah, the blizzards, I've been in a blizzard. It was kind of a blizzard. It just, it got very cold. And you know, I know it's, it's hip for the, the grifting entertainers to kind of poo poo climate change. And maybe we've passed the point of no return. And this is just the new reality. 23 degree below zero, wind chills in Denver to the point where the hotel couldn't even heat itself. And you know, the ice and a lot of it's just regular stuff. But we're on the precipice of a lot of dark stuff. And for those of us who are still alive and not excited about it, it's going to take everything we got, you know, just to do our part to push back on it or to just adapt to it, to find some quality of life in the middle of it. Oh my God, it's so dark. It's so negative. But I'm going to go have some coffee. Look, I can tell you this, I'll keep doing this. I'll keep talking to people. I'll keep figuring out a way with my heavy heart to find humor in things or just to be self righteous.

[Pete Davidson]

Occasionally, you know, what are you going to do?

[Bill Burr]

So look, Bill Burr came by the other day and we hadn't talked in a while and Phil Burr, you know, struggles, you know, he's, he, he is struggling with himself. And that's where a lot of the, the good stuff starts. So his new comedy special Drop Dead Years will premiere on Hulu on March 14th. Glengarry Glen Ross opens on Broadway in previews on March 10th. Opening night is March 31st. Tickets are on sale now. This is me and Bill the other day, people with Robinhood Gold. You can now enjoy the VIP treatment. Receiving a 3% IRA match on retirement contributions. The privileges of the very privileged are no longer exclusive. With Robinhood gold, your annual IRA contributions are boosted by 3% plus. You also get 4% APY on your cash in non retirement accounts. That's over eight times the national savings average. The Perks of the high net worth are now available for any net worth. The new gold standard is here with Robinhood Gold. To receive your 3% boost on annual IRA contributions, sign [e-mail] Gold investing involves risk. 3% match requires Robinhood Gold at $5 per month for for one year from first match. Must keep funds in IRA for five years. Go to robinhoodgold.com Boost over eight times the national average savings account interest rate Claim is based on data from the FDIC as of November 18, 2024. Robin Hood Financial LLC Member SIPC Gold membership is offered by Robin Hood Gold LLC.

[Marc Maron]

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[Pete Davidson]

It's kind of ironic in some way that you were coming over and then I. That coffee grinder up and I went through this with that coffee grinder before.

[Bill Burr]

Like I couldn't.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, I couldn't get it to do the right grind.

[Bill Burr]

Grind.

[Pete Davidson]

It was all the same, you know, it was like dirt. So now I gotta. I bought two of them. Now I gotta find that part. So I was in the middle of that project, but that's a day, you know it's gonna be okay.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bill Burr]

And.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah. And you were like, you're probably mad about something else. Yeah, I think so. But I mean, I am mad about that as well.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Right. But do you find the level that it goes to to be a little excessive? Like ripping out a drawer?

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, I broke things, you know, trying to, you know, if I just slowed down? Well, no, I think I got a little dramatic, but I was Thinking about your. I watched a special, I think, because I deal with a lot of the same stuff you do. How old are you now, 51?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I'm 56.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, so you're not that far from me. Yeah, Like, a lot of this stuff's coming up for me, too. The sadness. And I've talked about that before, but, like, I think. And I. And this observation that's kind of like something you would observe. Like, if I'm driving alone and I get lost or I get frustrated, you know, I. I just sit in it. But if there's someone there, then I'm gonna be like, Jesus Christ. Like, oh, really? Yeah, like, you know, like when. If you. If you're driving alone, you know where you're going, you'll figure it out. But if there's someone sitting there, be like, where the.

[Bill Burr]

Where the Are we?

[Kieran Culkin]

Right.

[Pete Davidson]

Like, you know, you need the audience.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. I wouldn't go that way. I kind of flip out whether there's somebody there or not. Yeah. I flipped out on the way here.

[Kieran Culkin]

You did?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I was. Because I was. I'd put in your address.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But then on the way, I was like, oh, there's this coffee shop I want to go to. So once I kept shutting it off.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And then it would go back into the map, and it would automatically put your thing there.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I screamed as loud as you could scream. I don't fucking want to do that. And I was just like, what is wrong with me? Like, what the is wrong with me?

[Pete Davidson]

So how'd you. Like, with this. The fire thing? Like, how. How'd you fucking handle it? And I think you were on Kimmel last night, but you talked about, you know, I. For real, though, did you freak out?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I don't freak out on these things, but I am freaking out somewhere. I'm just not in touch with it, so.

[Pete Davidson]

But you weren't directly threatened.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I didn't freak out during 9 11. I didn't freak out during the pandemic. I didn't freak out during this thing, but I freak out about the fucking Google map thing not working. So what I kind of was figuring out last night when I was on Kimmel, Is that because I don't flip out about the big shit.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

The little shit is where it comes out. So I'll flip out about a cell phone because I'm upset about what I saw, you know, when I was in New York when that stuff happened or whatever, so.

[Pete Davidson]

But you worried that your house wasn't in danger?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No. Yeah, no, it got a little scary there.

[Pete Davidson]

That's what I mean.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. So we, you know, definitely.

[Pete Davidson]

You load up.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yep, load up. Had to get out of there.

[Pete Davidson]

You had a mandatory evacuation?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. But it was like, you know, I saw this. The flames never got close enough. But like you knew they were coming and it was just kind of like this. Yeah. And it was like, you know, it's just. Yeah. I feel very like fortunate that. Survivor's guilt.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, I got a little of that. I freaked out.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Where does the benefit start? Yeah, with this many friggin people.

[Pete Davidson]

What you mean insurance?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I mean just as far as like for helping people out. Yeah. Insurance company. And that's the thing I was talking about on Kimmel is how they always keep it on the. All the homeless people, the immigrants. What about the insurance companies aren't going to pay anybody a dime and still give themselves a bonus. What about those guys?

[Pete Davidson]

It's going to be.

[Bob Odenkirk]

What about all these landlords that are now a two bedroom in Pasadena is nine grand a month. What about these hotels? That was 89 bucks. And it went up to like 700 bucks. Yeah, these fucking. And I met this guy at the In N Out was saying like, yeah, my landlord's trying to evict me.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, really?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well. Cause there's all that Palisades money and they don't have any. So now these areas that were working class, they're trying to get that. I think that they're trying to do that too.

[Pete Davidson]

But that becomes that sort of like that shock doctrine capitalism business. Like I don't know who's gonna rebuild in the Palisades. But you know, if a developer comes in there and offers enough money to buy out all that property, they'll probably take it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh yeah? Well how about the fact that banks won't even freeze it for two months? Like you have to keep paying your mortgage even though your fucking house burned down. They won't even give you like a hey, you know, you're going through a difficult time. You're a fellow American, you're fucked. You have to keep paying that thing. Plus getting gouged by these landlords and in hotels. It's ridiculous. And I get that. This is why I don't fucking watch politics. Politicians are grossly underpaid. Their job is to give you and me somebody to blame and get mad at. And then their job is they stand there and they get yelled at. And then all the fucking people that they're really working for yeah, they fucking. Like, you can't make 200 grand a year and your portfolio is worth 60 million bucks. That just doesn't work that way.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, you just become a money laundering operation. Big business. And also, like. Well, the idea was that, you know, you try to make government work for people or protect people, and then there's one side that just wants none of that. They just privatize everything. Fuck everyone.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Can I tell you something? One of the dumbest theories out there is this form of government works better than that form of government. They're all corrupt. They're all corrupt. It will be communism, capitalism.

[Pete Davidson]

They never seem to make room for. They never seem to acknowledge the potential for greed. You know what I mean? Like, it's a great idea.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You know what's funny?

[Pete Davidson]

But if somebody gets in there, they're like, I got an angle. Yeah, we can run money through this.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, Yeah, I did it. I did a gig in Finland one time. And they had like, socialism where they had over there.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And they go, yeah, we don't have any rich people in their country. And I said, really? I go, do you have banks? And they said, yeah. And I just laughed.

[Pete Davidson]

Somebody.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Somebody's making money. Do you have sociopaths here? Yeah. Then somebody's fucking with the deal.

[Pete Davidson]

Plenty of sociopaths. But I.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You could call it whatever you want.

[Pete Davidson]

But when you were in that moment, though, like. Cause like, when I decided I was gonna freak out and leave, like, I did it voluntarily. Cause I couldn't read my app, right? Like, I saw the red section, and it was right over there on the two. And I'm down seven in the morning, I got a guy coming to paint. Cause my kitchen had a leak in it. And we're standing out there, my neighbor comes out, and I'm like, what are you guys gonna do? It feels like it's close. And it's like, yeah, but I don't think it's that close. And then we just saw this black cloud come over the whole fucking neighborhood. And the painter goes, you better get out of here. So I gotta load up these three cats. I got one crate. I'm putting one in a hamper. I taped one in a box. And I go to Hollywood, to the Hampton Inn. And I figure I'm good. I get them all in. I buy other crates. And then that catches on fire. I watched it catch on fire. I could see it. The one by the Comedy Store.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah. Oh, my God.

[Pete Davidson]

I could see it blow up. And I'm like, you gotta. Now I gotta move Again. But nonetheless, I found that in that moment, like, I can focus. Like, you talk about calm. It's not that I don't respond to big things, but I'm always happy that, you know, no matter how panicky or fucking nuts I am, that when the shit hits the fan, I can show up and do it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, well, burning to death is pretty good motivation to get the fuck out of there.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm glad I didn't panic and be like, I don't know what to do.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Which way do I go? Yeah, you don't want to be the guy shitting himself.

[Pete Davidson]

How'd you decide what to load up?

[Bob Odenkirk]

It was very quick. I don't care about stuff.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, me neither.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You know what I did? I took my pilot's license and my logbook, and then I. My passport and my passport and my. And my laptop. And then cash. No, I just grabbed. I'm not gangster. I don't have, like, cash in the fucking walls or anything.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And we just. You know, we spent some time with some friends in the Valley, and then we went out to the desert. And I just thought after a couple, two, three days, it was going to be over. And it's just like. But this is not the one thing I do is I don't watch the news at all.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Because I'm already crazy enough. I don't need these people, you know, like the job, you know, cnn, Fox News. All they do is just stir people up and get.

[Pete Davidson]

That's right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Then they get their own countrymen fighting. Like, I think they should all be in jail for treason.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Cause if you make money by dividing Americans, these fucking nerds who own these apps, who just have bots on there, just making everything political to get people to argue. But no one fucks with those guys. So what I'm trying to do is to get the message out there, guys, we're all on the same team here.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

People, let's. Yeah, let's. We need to, like, respect each other and we gotta stop. We gotta help each other.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, I know. I noticed that message. Like, you know, I've watched a lot of your standup, and I know you fairly well. We've had our moments.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Mark. I think we've both had our moments with everyone goes without saying.

[Pete Davidson]

I know, but, like, you have. But people just assume that I don't wanna talk to him. Do you know what I mean? They're like, he's intense. You know what I mean? So they stay away from me for that way. I think that you it's like, yeah, it's gonna come.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You know what I mean?

[Pete Davidson]

I mean, you might get a little defensive pretty quickly and get angry about something.

[Bob Odenkirk]

As opposed to you. Did you just put me higher up on the hill of psycho? A little, yeah. All right, well, I'll let you. I understand how you're wired. You're on the narcissist spectrum, I'll give you that.

[Pete Davidson]

Are you?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I am on the low self esteem.

[Pete Davidson]

I got that. I don't know if I'm narcissistic. I'm just selfish.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Crushing need to be liked.

[Kieran Culkin]

Oh.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So I don't have that thing where I like just, you know, I mean, the farthest I'll go is if somebody cuts me off in traffic. You know, I'll get in a. You. You fight with somebody. But I, I would never, like, whatever, you know, you're, You're. You have an acting gig and treat a PA like I would never, never do. Like, I'm not like that.

[Pete Davidson]

So, like, I've had to tell people in my life where, like, maybe you've had this too. Where it's like, I'm not yelling at you, I'm just yelling. Like, I'll yell.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I used to be that guy. I don't do that. I know I'm yelling now. I do.

[Pete Davidson]

I do know I'm yelling, but not at somebody.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. But I also. No, I also know. And I've also gotten like, you know, the people in my life now. I have, like, you know, I think I gravitated to some of the same kind of wired people. And it was just like, you know, it was like junkyard dogs in a fucking pit fighting over a pork chop. But like, yeah, you can't. But hanging out with guys like Dean Del Rey. Dean's like a total chill guy.

[Pete Davidson]

Totally chill.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So he's like one of the great people that I've met in this business.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Great friend of mine. And like, I've. I've.

[Pete Davidson]

It's good to hang around Dean when you're like us. Because he'll just level it off. Just keeps it level.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, I mean, I don't. I've never had an argument with him.

[Pete Davidson]

Exactly.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, but I have. I have, like, you know, I got a good group of people that, like, I've, like, it's like, oh, this can be easy.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

This doesn't have to be like, hey, bro, sorry about the other day, like once a month or whatever. So, you know, and a lot of that shit, obviously I was bringing to the table.

[Pete Davidson]

So I was I was pretty impressed during the last fight we got into over whatever the fuck it was in the green room.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Dude, I've had so many fights and I don't remember what any of them are about.

[Pete Davidson]

No, I kind of knew what that was about. But there was a couple things I remember about it, though.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, the last one. I do remember the last one. You were trying to get a freebie in and. And then you tried to act like you weren't. You came walking in and you go. I could hear your voice from down the hall. And I go, I could smell your bitterness. And you go, hey, man. Hey, man. I'm just fucking around. I'm like, no, you weren't. You're in a bad mood. And I was the first guy you heard. And now you're being a cunt.

[Pete Davidson]

No, this was a different thing. It was over a topic. It was over due process. And we were in the.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, well, the cancel culture shit was going on, right?

[Pete Davidson]

We were in the green room and Jeslyn, there's a couple other people there, and you go off on me. And all I remember is like, I'm gonna have to just fucking take this. I'm gonna have to stand. I'm not. I can't walk away from it. Gonna have to hold my ground and wait till this shit passes. And you go. And then I go. But the thing I noticed was, you know, within three minutes, you were like, you know, maybe I should be on the women's side once in a while. Like, the distance between outburst and apology was tight.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I was proud of both of us. We thought we did one over quickly.

[Pete Davidson]

Pretty good.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, we're in a good place. And I know another one because of the way we're wired is coming, but I don't take it seriously. Like, you could literally say the most fucked up thing you could possibly say to me, and I'm gonna be like. The next time I see him, he's gonna be like, hey, man.

[Bill Burr]

Right?

[Pete Davidson]

Well, yeah, I get that too. Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. I don't get.

[Pete Davidson]

But I don't rage anymore. And I get. And I guess. Cause I remember, like, I don't remember.

[Bob Odenkirk]

If you just ripped a flip drawer out of you give it to. You know what it is about.

[Pete Davidson]

No one was around. No one witnessed it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No. Does it.

[Pete Davidson]

If.

[Bob Odenkirk]

If it's what it is, is probably if you're like me.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

What you saw growing up, you're not anywhere near. So you think you're not crazy, but it's like your definition of crazy is so beyond regular. People. So that. That tends to happen.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, that's. Well, I think it's. That what. It's all. You can't get away from what you grew up in. But I remember, like. Well, I don't remember. Was that last. When did you have that revelation? I haven't talked to you in a long time in a. In a long form conversation. When was it? When. I remember you did mushrooms once.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

And you had, like, in a week or so after you, like. Oh, you had it all figured out for a minute.

[Bill Burr]

You saw.

[Pete Davidson]

You saw something.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That's the honeymoon phase. But then what happens is after that, then, like, you. This shit that happened to you still happened to you.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So it becomes. Yeah. Then. Then it's just weird that you can.

[Pete Davidson]

See it, but you can't necessarily unfuck it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yes. So.

[Pete Davidson]

Right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

The anger comes back more so. Oh, but then you. Then that's like the work. You kind of got to work your way through it. As a buddy of mine, you know, who got sober was talking about that, how he gets sober, and like the first day he goes, dude, I felt like I was walking on a cloud. Waking up.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah. And then all of a sudden, they were out and about, and there was some guy looking. I said, what the fuck are you looking at? The data and this. And his sponsor was. Oh. And then his sponsor goes, all right, the honeymoon part is over. Here is now. Here comes the work.

[Pete Davidson]

That's right. Well, there's a.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That's where I am. That's where. Where he was with his sobriety. And after the 10 days, what.

[Pete Davidson]

Was there a. Was there an event that tipped it?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Tipped what?

[Pete Davidson]

You into, like, saying, I got to do the work.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. It was the. Because post, like, the first mushrooms I took, I figured out so much about myself or figured out the main, I guess, issue.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I felt. I felt for 10 days.

[Pete Davidson]

Was that the sadness thing?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah.

[Kieran Culkin]

What?

[Bob Odenkirk]

What. What that was.

[Pete Davidson]

What was it?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, it was. It was how I felt growing up.

[Pete Davidson]

Just constantly terrified.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. Not loved. Not. Not feeling like you. That you mattered.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And. But I always thought when I was a kid, I was like, oh, I didn't need that. Oh, tough. And I laugh at families that were like, yeah, the other way. But, like, I mean, because it wasn't like, necessarily my family. It was the whole fucking thing. Everybody's family was kind of like that.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And so anyway, so after, like, the 10 days. For 10 days, I felt like, oh, this is who I would have been if all of this shit didn't happen to me. And then after 10 days it's like, oh, but it did. And it was like, oh, I could have been like this.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But now I'm like this. And then it's just like. And then you just start thinking, like, you know, at different events, like, how the could you do that to a kid?

[Kieran Culkin]

Right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Why would you? You know, whatever. I don't want to get into it.

[Pete Davidson]

But like, but you saw the parallel universe where you're having a healthy life.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. Not in show business. Not needing to get on a stage, being, hey, look at me. And I don't know. Yeah, but I don't know where the that that goes. But then. Yeah, so then I, I, you know, I will say every time I feel like, you know, okay, I've dug it all out and now we can start building a new house. I find this another level or area or what? I mean, it's a lot of shit. I mean, it was. I know, 50, 50, 50 years, dude. Look, as bad enough as it is for me, it's worse for the people around me. So that was really the motivation because I love my wife to death. I obviously love my kids to death. And like, the one thing I am proud of is my kids are not afraid of me. I've probably overcorrected. But yeah, they. I come home, they treat me like a fucking bouncy house. So they're just jumping all over me and everything. And we have all these games that I play. Most of them just involve me chasing them around the house. How old are they about to be? 8 and 4 and a half. Wow. So, you know, my daughter's to the point now where she reads to me. She reads me Captain Underpants a chapter. And what I love is she loves jokes.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And how they write that book. The chapter ends, you know, with a setup. And then the name in the next chapter is the punchline.

[Kieran Culkin]

Right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So like, the guy would be like going, no, we covered our tracks. There's no way we're gonna get busted. Chapter eight, Busted. And she just thinks, you know, in her seven, eight year old brain, that's so she. And then she, she read it like five times and be like, busted. And she'd make like this face when she did it. And she was totally getting into it. And, you know, my son's like, really into music. Like, loves AC DC and stuff.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, yeah, you show me that video.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah.

[Kieran Culkin]

The best.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Him doing the, the. The Chuck Berry.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Via Angus dance. Yeah, he can do the duck walk. It's amazing.

[Pete Davidson]

The one Thing, though, when I was watching the special, you know, I realized, like, I mean, you and I are. Are similar, but, like, in a lot of ways. But you, like, you went and had a regular life in the way that, you know, you got a wife, you got kids, you know, and now, like, you know, I didn't even pull it together to be able to handle that. And when you talk about that sadness at being at the core of the anger for how you grew up, I mean, I relate to that. But one thing that you seem to have gotten over or at least have some range in your life is that, like, for me and, like, you say you want to be loved, and, you know, we do this thing in a room full of strangers, but, like, I don't fucking trust love. I don't trust it. You know, if somebody. If somebody loves me, I'm like, you're fucking with me. You know, I can't let go and it's a fucking nightmare.

[Bill Burr]

So that's.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, I know where that comes from.

[Pete Davidson]

What's that? Because my parents were like, needy, fucking exploitive people. Why? What do you think?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No. Jesus Christ. I'm on your side. Jesus Christ, Mark.

[Pete Davidson]

See, that's where we get touchy. We're like, what's your.

[Bob Odenkirk]

How are you going to hurt me?

[Pete Davidson]

Exactly? But you know that one.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, you. You showed me a picture of your mom one time.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I was like, wow, she's beautiful. And you just made some sort of comment like, oh, yeah. She made sure she got all dolled up. It's all about her. And Black said, oh, my God. Child of a narcissist.

[Bill Burr]

Yes.

[Pete Davidson]

Two.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah, Two. Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

How does that relationship work? There's usually one person just getting abused.

[Pete Davidson]

Well, they waiting for the storm to.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Be over and it never does until they die.

[Pete Davidson]

No, no. They're both selfish enough to kind of float in their own zones and then just react to each other and then go back into their own little world. But now, like, my old man's got dementia. And there's a point, like, I remember when we did that comics come home thing, you know, and there's always that moment where your folks were there and you're like, this is my dad. I'm like, that's the guy. Like, I'm thinking, that's the guy. And then you realize, like, God, they're just old fucks now, you know?

[Bob Odenkirk]

But, like, how I look at them, I'm like, whatever happened to them was worse than what? The same way you don't feel like you're yelling but you are to somebody else. They felt like, you know, the, what they were doing was the right thing to do because they improved it from what happened to them. So then I improve it from them.

[Pete Davidson]

And, you know, was this empathy always within you though, or is this part of the new you?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, no, it's like I, it's trying to put shit to bed. Because what I have realized is that when you go back to your childhood, there's your version and your parents version and the truth is in the middle.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Because you know what parents don't understand? A lot of them seem to forget, I think, is that how small a kid's universe is?

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So if they're literally going, I don't like this shirt before they go to school, I go change your shirt.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Because I don't want you going to school feeling bad about yourself because these other kids will smell that on you and next thing you know you're getting bullied.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And like fucking. When you're, you're five, six years old, liking the shirt you're wearing to school is your universe as an adult.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Seeing these fires and insurance and fucking, you know, never ending wars, that's nothing to you. But you have to remember the value that it is. But you know that information. I know that because it's out there now. So like, my parents didn't have that information. Their generation didn't have that information. So that's why when you, when you go back, hey, man, you did this, you did that thing. Oh, that was no big deal. It's like to you, to you it wasn't. So one of the hardest, I think human emotions probably is, is empathy.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So that's, that's a difficult thing to do. And I think a lot of people, you know, I've been guilty of it, like, just don't get there. So you got to be like, you know, that's a big thing with like a relationship is getting out of your ego and not trying to win the thing.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Trying to actually hear, you know, what the person you're with is saying and how you ended up getting there. And like, and just acknowledge how whatever you're doing makes them feel rather than being like, oh, that's nothing.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, I got a friend of mine.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Well you like when you rage and then like 10 minutes later everyone's crying, but you're like, I'm okay, everybody. What's the matter? We got through it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. That wasn't that bad then. And then you do the worst thing you say, that wasn't that bad.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And that really comes from the fact that you love them. You don't want to feel like you heard them, so you're like, you're fine. Come on. Come on. Yeah, yeah. It wasn't that bad. Come on, let's get an ice cream.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Shake it off. Yeah, you start doing that great. Stan Santini. So. Yeah. So, like, a lot of. A lot of this. So there's a lot of this new special, and everything is just, you know, it's. If you really watch my specials along. I was. You know, it's not like, this isn't like a sitcom I didn't get here. And like, you know, one mushroom trip into this has been something that is, you know, I've been working on since I first started doing specials. I never wanted to be a lot of the stuff that I was. I didn't want to be that guy. I just didn't. I, like, that was the guy I became and how I had to be so shit, you know, wouldn't keep happening to me.

[Pete Davidson]

Well, I think it's funny because, like, you're a guy. The thing that. Well, don't. Don't take this wrong. I mean, you're. Your saving grace is your struggle with yourself.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Right.

[Pete Davidson]

Do you know what I mean? Like, you were always. You knew, and I knew and everyone else knew. It's like, well, Bill's. You know, he's a good guy in there, and he knows that, but there's fighting himself.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. 100%.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

And it's like that. That's the whole thing. Like, who's gonna win the match.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. And the thing is, I think when people watch, that's if there's something relatable about what I do, you know, like, one of my favorite, like, head coaches right now in the NFL is this guy, Nick. Is it Soriano? Siriano, the guy for the Eagles.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Because I see that guy.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Where I'm just like, this guy is really good at what he does.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But. And he knows he is, but there's a part of him in that brain is saying, no, you're not. And it's just like. And fighting that fucking thing and having to do that.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

As an NFL fucking coach, with all these other CS who don't know anything about football, questioning everything. You're doing a very, like, standup comedy experience where, like, getting heckled from the crowd or, you know, people, like, online. I like when they take your jokes and they put them on and they rename them and make you say what they Want you to be saying, like, there's a lot of that.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, yeah. Some people started all kinds of shit with me and Kreischer by, you know, taking something I said out of context and saying it was about him, it wasn't even about him. And we had to fucking work that out. It's a fucking nightmare. Like, out of all the people in the world, how does anyone start shit with Bert Kreischer?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Listen, what do you mean fucking. He's a comedian. It happens. Everything happens.

[Pete Davidson]

I wasn't even talking. It doesn't.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Dude. We're all. Followed our dream and it came true and we're still fucking working shit out. It's funny as hell. How do any of us. We tell jokes for a living. How are any of us upset? Yeah, because it's not a fix.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, but I never got. But did you like. You talk about the arc of your specials. All I ever did with comedy, all I ever wanted to do, I don't. And I've said this before, I don't know that I got into it thinking, like, I want to entertain people. I just knew that I could have my own space to say what I wanted to fucking say. And that was. And it was mine. All right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I got into it because I thought it was a way, an easy way to make a bunch of people I didn't know like me so they wouldn't get mad at me and no one would try to hurt me.

[Pete Davidson]

Really.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That's. Well, it was a combination of that and then being so walled off that I needed, like a place somewhere to. Like a moat, kind of.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, well, yeah, that's. That. But that's. But that's taking a risk. That's not necessarily get everyone to like you, because when I do it, I guess I want them to like me. But, you know, there's part of me that's sort of like how I don't like me. So go fuck yourself. How can you like me?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, I don't have that.

[Pete Davidson]

No, you don't push back, but you like to fuck with them a little bit. You like to test them.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I'd like to do that. But I don't get upset if they like me. I want them to like me. I want them to like me. And then I also want them to feel like they got their money's worth. I don't want to be just going up there and dumping my day on them or whatever.

[Pete Davidson]

So, yeah, like, sometimes if I don't have a show that I think is good, I'll just go really long. And then at least they can't leave saying, you didn't try.

[Bob Odenkirk]

They're not enjoying me. I go, I know the solution. More. More of me.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, more of me. Because then they get. They're not going to walk out, say, like, why the. Didn't he finish?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, I don't know. Like, I.

[Pete Davidson]

That doesn't happen that much. That's behind me. Yeah, I don't. You know what I mean? I. I don't. I did. Here, let me tell you this. I was in.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I'm just going to let you go, man. Come on, work this up.

[Pete Davidson]

Go. I was in. Well, like.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, I don't know what hasn't happened in a long time, you know, last night.

[Pete Davidson]

Well, what happened was I was in. I was in Napa, and I do this show. I get one woman who's sitting in the middle of the front section at the theater, and she really wants to give me a present. She brought something for me. She didn't know she was gonna get it to me after. So in the middle of the show, she's like, I love you. I have a gift for you. It's taken time. And I'm like, all right, can we. And she's like, can I just. And like, it was good natured, you know, she had knitted me a cat thing and she bought me a little thing or whatever, Right?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, boy.

[Pete Davidson]

But then the rest of the audience is like, hey, come on. I'm like, this is not a. This is not a bad situation, you know, this is not a bad person.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, good. I thought you were gonna.

[Pete Davidson]

No, no, I'm like, you know, we just have. Just hang out, you know, I'll get back to the show, let her do the thing, and I'll take the present. Thank you. And then some other woman was up in the balcony. It's like, yeah, like, yelling like this. And I'm like, what the fuck is this now? So that's a whole different thing. So I go from like, you know, managing the nice lady, just being like, why don't you? Are you gonna shut the fuck up or what? Like, because I can have you taken out. I don't have to deal with this. People want to show and it keeps happening. And eventually I'm like, what are you, a fucking moron? You know, and then it's being handled and I'm.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Which person? The upper deck person.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that, that, that all happens and then you gotta get back to you, you know, because you just showed the audience what a fucking monster you are by, by dealing with the heckler.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I think you're being too hard on yourself.

[Pete Davidson]

No shit. So, so today I get a fucking DM from. From somebody was sitting near the woman up top who was drunk, I thought, and yelling. And she says, look, I don't know really what happened, but I was sitting next to these person, these people, and it seemed like she was a neurodivergent person who couldn't control it. Like, so now I'm like, this is all sitting on me. I call this neurodivergent, you know, spectrum person who, you know, who was with somebody, who was taking care of her, wanted to see this show but couldn't control her emotions. And, But I don't know what to do with that. I handled it the way I'm supposed to handle it, but now I think I shit on some person that has major emotional problems.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, that's on the person that brought them, I think. So if they have like that issue, you shouldn't bring them to a comedy show. Yeah, I'm saying put them in the attic like the Kennedys.

[Pete Davidson]

No, I know, but I, I came to the same conclusion. But you just, you can't win and anybody can communicate with you if they.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You didn't know the person who brought the person. Person didn't know the person doing it. Didn't know. It was just a big, it was a big misunderstanding.

[Pete Davidson]

So when you talk about like that thing you said on Kimmel last night about how like what you're mad about is something much bigger that you think is going to like consume you if you, you know, take it on the. Do you feel that? Do you know, you know what that is though, right? Mostly what that thing is. Is it just your family?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, you know, it's, it's, it's. And it's also the powerlessness, powerless feeling of being a kid if you're not being listened to.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And that's what ends up happening if you're not being listened to and bad shit's happening to you and stuff. You just eventually you. That's kind of how you, you stop emoting because no one's listening. And then you also shut down stuff because, you know, stuff. Stuff is hurting you.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So then you just sort of become like, you get the 600 yard stare, the kid version of it. And that was. A lot of my friends, A lot of my friends are like that. And it's, it's kind of funny.

[Pete Davidson]

It's a neighborhood thing almost.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, I mean, I go around and I do shows and you know, my whole graduation class, like, everybody has really interesting jobs and really cool to see him again. And I run into a lot of them, and there's a couple people where, like, you know, you start having, like, family envy when you feel yours is a little weird. And then I ended up finding, like, wow, it was very similar, or it was like, oh, it was a little different, or it was worse or whatever. So. But that's one of those things where. So that's not, like, fair to my parents where. Or anybody else who was bringing me up or something. It's not like I'm shitting on my parents, but it's just like, they were my universe, so, like, the importance of things, like, when your kid comes up to me, like, going, you know, hey, dad, you said you were gonna play with me, and you're staring at your phone, it's like, that's a big deal, and you gotta go put it down. Like, fuck, man. This is making this person feel like you're not worth my time. That's good.

[Pete Davidson]

Good. You're catching all this now because, like, I took a different approach in jokes with my parents. Like, I used to do that bit about, like, you know. You know when your parents say, we did the best. We did the best we could, and they didn't. They didn't know what they were doing. And you don't have to take that shit. You didn't do the best you could. I can accept that. But you didn't even try. Really?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. I mean, well, look, each situation is unique, so. But I've interacted with you enough to know that they didn't try.

[Pete Davidson]

They left me untethered.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I think that that's why you're a cat person.

[Pete Davidson]

I grew up with dogs.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I got dogs. I think a dog would be too fucking needy and consuming. And, like, you probably grew up isolated. And you vibe with cats where it's kind of like, hey, man, sometimes I want to be on top of you. Other times I just want to get the fuck out of here.

[Pete Davidson]

That's right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Go kill something.

[Pete Davidson]

We had a lot of dogs. I grew up with a lot of dogs. And it's just the same reason I don't have kids. I don't trust my emotional construct not to be selfish and you know, and.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Feel that, like, hey, more people should do that.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Like, because a lot of people just have a kid because they think they should be doing it.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And you really have to want to do it, and you have to love the job.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And you have to want to Help try to form a empathetic adult on the other side is what you're. You're hoping to come out with. But, like, you know. You know, I got. I have. You know, I listen to my kids, though. Like, when they're upset, like, everything stops. And I sit down and I listen to them, even if I don't agree with them being like, well, you can't do that. You can't have every toy or whatever they're doing. And then there's other times it's like, all right, you're right. I shouldn't have done that. Like, I remember, like, when I knew I was changing it, my daughter was only three. She was so cute. Maybe even less than that.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And she came up to me. There was something that was bothering her, and I sat down on the stairs. I said, what's bothering you? And she walked up to me, and us spontaneously, not even thinking. We both held hands while she talked to me.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I was like, that never happened when I was growing up. That never happened to anybody in my fucking generation. Maybe Italians. Italians are really good with, like, emotion. Like, I always got along with Italians because I was just like, these people, like, as much as they're fucking yelling at each other, I hear love in there.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Where, like, you know, my Aryan, Northern European is just.

[Pete Davidson]

What do you think? It's just Irish Catholic, dude.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I'm German.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I. I mean, I. I am a. A. A gumbo of shutdown nationalities. Irish, Scottish, English, German. Mostly German.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

French and Dutch. And, like, as much as I love French culture and everything there is, I can't tell because maybe it's just Paris or whatever.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

It sort of has that Manhattan coldness to it. Like career, then kids.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And no. God.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You know, the Manhattan vibe. Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

But it's good that you can identify in that moment when she. You're holding hands and that you can, you know, be present for the love from her and you. And, you know, it's good. As opposed to, like.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I say that. I said, you know, Absolutely. You know what I mean? Like, you know, and then you start having more than one. They have, like, disagreements. You become like Judge Walkner.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You got to make sure that you're not favoring either one of them or anything. Like, I make sure, you know, I do that. Let my son learn. Does something. Oh, that's great. And I'll ask my daughter. Did you teach him how to do that? That's amazing. Like, I just. I make sure.

[Pete Davidson]

Balance it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. I make sure I balance it. Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Now, did you start. Did you go to therapy?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, I did.

[Pete Davidson]

Was it helpful?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. I mean, to kind of crack it open or whatever, but, like, I kind of feel like it's almost like doing standup where you can rehearse as much as you want in your room. You have to go out and do it in front of people.

[Pete Davidson]

That's right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I feel like therapy, you know, you can go there and talk about your fucking problems forever.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

It's like.

[Pete Davidson]

And just spin them. Like it just becomes a habit. Oh.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I got sick of telling the fucking stories. And I was just like, I just need to go live my life. I've learned enough here.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Definitely served a purpose. But then I needed to go out and I think mushrooms was a huge thing that was like. That was like how many times you do it? Fast forward button. Like, only like four times. Oh. It's the only drug I've ever done that didn't. Never makes me feel the next day like I want to do that again.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You know what I mean? And then it becomes like a habit.

[Pete Davidson]

Was it like a prescribed thing or you just did it?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I just did it.

[Pete Davidson]

By yourself?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Nope. I was with my wife and my brother and my sister in law and we were out in the desert. Ah. Yeah. And then another time, I took them. I was with my wife in the.

[Pete Davidson]

Middle of Utah during the day.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I took him during the day and I. I took them. And right after I ate, my wife's going, like, because she took him with. And then she's. She's not into him.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

She goes, I don't want to. I don't want to do it. I said, well, I'm doing it.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

She goes, don't do it. I go, I'm doing it. And I just ate a whole bunch of them. And then, dude, I ate them. And 20 minutes later I got a text. You got to call me. I know you're on vacation. You got to call me. And my. Oh, God, dude. My. My butt. Yeah. Told me Bob Saget died.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, my God.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And then the mushrooms were coming on. Oh, my. It was. I was wild.

[Pete Davidson]

Where'd you end up going in your head?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I still had a good one. But there was a. The weirdest thing was when I would think about Bob. Like, the room went like, gray. Like black and white. Like a funeral or something. It was wild. It. Because I took a lot, dude.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I mean, the ground was going. Going in and out and. And I was talking to trees. I mean, I was tripping.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And yeah, dude. I thought I saw this guy way up on the hill, and he said hello to me. Yeah, he was way up on this cliff. And. And I realized, like, the next day it was my. The neighbor. It was like this vacation thing. He wasn't way up in the hill. He's like, right where you were. But my depth perception. So I was just like, staring at him. Wow. It was so. It was so weird, a lot of the. But like, what did I say?

[Pete Davidson]

Oh.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And then that was the thing. And then I asked my wife, I said, can you go outside? I go, is there a little guy on the cliff walking, saying hello to people? She's just laughing. She walked out. She goes, there's nobody out there. But the guy had left.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So then I fucking went back outside or whatever. And then I started thinking about it, like, towards the end of my trip, I came walking and I said, hey, can I get asked you a question? I go, you know, was. This was the sad part of the trip? I said, was that little guy real? And she said, no. I said, okay, good. And I go, well, what about that text message about Bob? Was that real? And she was like, yeah, it was. And I was like, ah, fuck. Cause I was kind of hoping for half a second.

[Kieran Culkin]

Right.

[Pete Davidson]

That is.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That maybe I dreamt it.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I don't know why you would dream that, but I was. I was hoping that it was. Wasn't the case, but that was.

[Pete Davidson]

That. That one. That one really got me, man. You know, like, brutal. Because then you talk about that in the special too. About we're at that weird zone of age. It's a very good observation, that one. It's funny.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I'll never be over Bob. I. I don't. I. I've made that piece that I won't be.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, I don't think I. I will too, because. And it's not like I was totally close to him, but we're all weirdly close just by nature of who we are and what we do. But, like, he was always the best guy in the world, and it was such a shocking fucking.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You know, I loved about him. He just loved jokes.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So if you started texting with him, I swear to God, if you wanted to go eight hours, he would just.

[Pete Davidson]

Keep going, like, doing jokes.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, he never got sick of it. And then he would always go crazier and darker.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I always just thought it was so fascinating that he was such a nice guy, but he could go just so twisted.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And dark.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But it kind of worked because he was, like, just such, like, a nice guy. And, you know, and whenever I would do something on tv, if he saw it or whatever, he always took the time to say, you know, great job, and. And. And, like. And it was, like, sincere. It wasn't like, oh, hey, you're. You're moving along in the business. This is a guy I need to know, wasn't it? It was.

[Pete Davidson]

It was a sweet guy.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

So it's so weird, because. Did anyone ever figure out what happened?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I believe. I. You know, I don't want to speculate or anything, but this. The stuff that I heard was. I. I think that he hit his head. He hit his head and. And had a bleed, and he went to bed. He didn't realize how bad it was.

[Pete Davidson]

Well, you want to know something? I don't think it's bad, but, like, I'll tell you, man. You know, we go into all of these different hotels, but after Saget died, I turned on light on in the bathroom because, you know, you get up and you don't know where you are for a second.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah. What's. Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

You know, some of these places got those marble floors and, like. And I'm old, so, like, now, like, anywhere I go, I just got to make sure.

[Bob Odenkirk]

The big thing, too, is you're alone.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And then you hit your head, and you have. You have to make a decision.

[Pete Davidson]

Right. You know, how the hell is he gonna know he hit his head? I'm gonna lie down for a minute. Was he. He doesn't know that how bad you hit it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But that one was like, that Patrice, like some of the. Greg. Geraldo. I mean, I've lost a lot of people.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah. I lost those same people.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Fucking awful.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

But you knew what happened with those guys.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I know. It didn't make it any easier. No. Geraldo was the one that made me believe in addiction.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, dude.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I just. To see it take a guy that smart.

[Pete Davidson]

That smart and that good, and that, you know, sweet guy and that alive. Yeah. Like, he couldn't fucking stop it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That was literally like. I. Because I remember, like, the first time hearing him about him having an issue.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I thought, like, oh, come on, man. What's he having, a midlife crisis? Like? I just. I just didn't believe that addiction was strong enough to take a guy like. That is. Yeah.

[Kieran Culkin]

That sharp.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And, like, who the hell. I think Vinnie Brand called me. When.

[Pete Davidson]

Oh, he died out there, right? In Princeton or. Where New. What is it? New Brunswick.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. That was a brutal one.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I mean, I mean, it's bad enough he died, but to have you last set at the stress factor in that hotel with you. Vinnie, if you're listening.

[Pete Davidson]

No, but I remember. Why'd you have to say that?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I. You know, people. People are gonna take that seriously.

[Pete Davidson]

He still got the phone on stage.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Patrice's life work was fucking trying to get him to get that fucking payphone. He would say, vinnie. First he trashed him, and then he had to try to logically go like, you are, encouraging people to yell up at the stage.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

What it was was Vinnie's a comedian and a club owner, and he. You can't write material fast enough every weekend.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So he needed a gimmick.

[Kieran Culkin]

Right?

[Bob Odenkirk]

So he would do that, and it was just. It just. It turned every crowd into, like, a bachelorette party there for a while, but then he stopped doing. When he stopped doing it, it became this. This great club, and he used to.

[Pete Davidson]

Run those, like, car crash videos. Like, do you remember, like, before the show, the videos, it was just like. I don't even remember, but I just remember it was, like, crazy. Oh. But the thing I was gonna say is I had talked to Geraldo because I told him, I said, you know, when I got divorced from Mishnah, she'd gotten me sober. And I was sort of, you know, I. I told him. I was framing it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Like, she was just like, what did I do?

[Pete Davidson]

Well, no, I told her, like, the divorce cost me a fuck of a lot of money, you know, and she earned it. Yeah, that's true.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That's true.

[Pete Davidson]

I. I have peace with that. You know, I was.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You should. She's a sweetheart.

[Pete Davidson]

I was able to. I was able to see my side of that because you get stubborn, you get competitive. You're like, it's this and that. But I realized, like, years later, like, you know, it's okay, the money and whatever, but I told Geraldo how much it cost, you know, versus the fact that, you know, she got me sober. I said, I have to look at it like, this is the price of my sobriety, because you got off easy. I've been through six fucking. Really? Like, that guy tried hundreds of thousands of dollars in rehabs and, you know, whatever, and he just couldn't get a handle on it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I, you know, I, I. I don't know if part of it was, like, he was a social guy, too. Like, he really liked, you know, hanging.

[Pete Davidson]

Out with losers, doing drugs.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, not that you're talking about the end. That's where that's where it ends. And if you get lucky, you know. No, I just feel like, you know, I toured with him a few. Couple of those, you know, just for laughs thing, me and him, Tom Papa and just the hangs were.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, it's great.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Amazing. And, you know, he was clean when. When I was torn with them. But he was saying, he goes, don't you just want to go up to that bar, you know?

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Have drinks and talk to some chicks? And. Yeah, it's like he just was a fun. Yeah, fun guy. And we were kind of going through this business the same way where it was like, you know, we. Like. It was a period of time. Any place I went on the road, he is either just there or was on his way to being there.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And we would always get the same feedback, like, you know, one of the Quad Cities or something, whatever the hell we were getting booked back then, and, you know, Duluth or some shit. And they would just be like, dude, you're like one of the funniest comics that's come through here in years. And, like, we would laugh about that, going like, you know, if somehow these regular people were the industry, we would have something going on in our careers. So we used to joke that, you know, we used called killing in obscurity.

[Bill Burr]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So you'd be going out there and it was, you know, and you keep coming back to these clubs and the same fucking 30, 40 people were showing up. And then also the whole alt scene exploded in the 2000s. And I was sitting there as a club comic. Like, there was a part of me going like, am I playing disco? Like, what the fuck is. Music changed? And I'm out here like, Bob bop bop. You know what I mean?

[Pete Davidson]

And they're at some coffee shop.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. So I was going like, like, yeah, I still remember where I was, where I had that one time I ever had that. That thought which was the scariest thought ever. I'm like, wait, am I the guy who doesn't make it?

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, we're out. My. What I do is old timey.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Where was it?

[Bob Odenkirk]

It was at the funny bone in St. Louis. Westport or whatever they called it. Funny Bone in Westport or whatever. And it was like one of my favorite gigs because the staff at the Funny Bone was fun.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I was still drinking. It wasn't out of control then. So I would go out and have some pops or whatever and. But I used to just mainly talk about sports and shit. So I would be asking them, you know, you know, Ozzie Smith did You see him at the old Bush Stadium and, and shit like that. Actually, one time with the staff, I went to the old, the old, the first one they had that the, the St. Louis Cardinals football team played in. And to me, like, when I went on the road, like, those places were like cathedrals. I used to see it every week. Mel Allen on this week in Baseball, pun. Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun. And like Ozzie Smith would come out doing the backflip.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And, or, you know, the Kingdome with Ken Griffey Jr. Later. All of that stuff. Like, I, I was iconic to me. So I got to go to a lot of those old stadiums and old ballparks. They're all gone now. County Stadium, Busch Stadium, gone. The Kingdom. Yeah, they all these owners fucking, you know, some reason the cities had to, like, they're all billionaires, but for some reason. And we're buying all their merch and, and rooting for the teams and buying the booze and all of that. But we also have to pay for the stadiums. It's kind of a great gig. Yeah, that's why I like Bob Kraft. Like, he, he paid for the, the Patriots stadium.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

So you had the realization that alternative comedy might take over when you were in St. Louis?

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I, I, I felt like what I was doing was old, was still vibrant in St. Louis, but where it air quote mattered in New York and la. Like, oh, dude, like, do you remember, like the height of that alt shit, like all of a sudden? Well, all of a sudden, no. You were the guys who kind of started the first comics that started. That's what always killed me.

[Pete Davidson]

We were club guys.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You were club guys that created the alt thing because it got, it got stale, which it did. And then, but then it created this scene where you could start in the alt room.

[Pete Davidson]

Right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Rather than doing all those hell gigs that we did to, to season yourself to, you know, to understand that you could literally start your career doing a 20 minute bit about the fucking, you know, Transformers.

[Pete Davidson]

And now you just have to post a reel. That whole sort of like, come up open, middle, close thing done. It's over.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, but I mean, it's just, it's just everything is just different. But, and what they were saying when we were coming up, like, I used to have to go on in between a stripper and a guy playing a ukulele. We had clubs. So shit is always changing, you know what I mean? Like, I love, I love how old people are. Oh, man, you missed it. You missed it. It's like they're not missing anything. They're gonna look back in the 2000s and say. And tell people in the 2000s that they missed it. Because you're young.

[Pete Davidson]

Don't you remember? That's what it is in Boston after the Happy hours closed down and all those guitar acts came in and you'd have to feature for a guitar act that. And they were the big headliner. And it was sort of like, what am I doing? But how bad your drink can get.

[Bob Odenkirk]

It definitely got to the point where I wanted to not be doing it, and I was still doing it. What it was for me was the tipping point for me was I brought it into the house. And then once I had it in the house and I could have it every night.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Then you saw it then.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, then it was a lot. That. That's. That's how my cigar smoking, you know, as long as I don't have cigars in the house, like, I don't have.

[Pete Davidson]

They always end up at the store with me grabbing them out of the box.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. Well, I don't. I don't have that now. Where I don't have that one. Like, I'm somewhere on the spectrum of addiction. But I don't have that thing of, like, if it's not in the house, I'm so jonesing. Like, I'll go out in my fucking boxers and just go get it. I never had that. My shit is like, if it's not in the house, I won't. If it's in the house, I consume it. So I just have to be aware of what I have in, like, my day to day.

[Pete Davidson]

Because the cigars turned on me. I don't like them anymore.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

I don't know what happened. While I'm doing these zins, I'm getting nicotine. But I. At some point I smoked a cigar and I'm like, it's not. It just didn't taste good anymore. And it was kind of good.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

For that to happen. But you know, probably also, like, what?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Smoking a lot of them and then. Yeah, it's. You sort of get. You get numb to it.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah. And you expecting that same thing, that great thing, and then by the third one, it's not so good.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, my God. Dude, Chain smoking cigars is not. No, I never did that. Like, I would have, like, two a day.

[Pete Davidson]

Come on.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No. I was always a one a day guy. But then. But there were times, like, if I was hanging with friends, like, if I'm, you know, out on the golf course, I Don't golf. There's nothing for me to do out there. I'm a redhead. It's sunny. You don't golf. I fucking hate golf.

[Pete Davidson]

But you go hang out, I go play.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, it's funny. I bring my little bows thing.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And the one that I. The album I always play is Paul Anka's one where he did this fucking incredible album of covers.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, like Nirvana and stuff.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yes.

[Kieran Culkin]

Great.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, it's fucking incredible.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, it is.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And the arrangements, like, he could have so just gone like Captain Kirk and just been, like, all cheeky, whatever. He didn't.

[Pete Davidson]

He honored him.

[Bob Odenkirk]

He respected the music, and the arrangements are incredible. So it's like everybody, you know, you want to see play, like Sinatra. This is like the. The. The happy medium where it's just like, all right, it's our generation's music, but it's that. That old, you know, Paul Anka, Sinatra, Tony Bennett, class.

[Pete Davidson]

It's kind of a great record.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, I know that record. It's so funny that you're using. Like, I used to do this. I was working on this bit about that every male is on the spectrum of male. Toxic. Everyone. There's a toxic spectrum of men. And it kind of goes from, like, insensitive to murder.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Right. I actually, I. There's guys I see that aren't on it. There's definitely like. Like one of my buddies that I hang out with, I always say that to him, I'm like, dude, like, you're like what I'm trying to work towards. You're like. Like, dude, he's just like this chill, fucking cool guy, you know? Like anybody. He has his problems or anything, but, like, I just noticed, like, when people meet him, like, they're really drawn to him.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Like, he's just this open guy where, like, you know, for the longest time in my life, people would meet me and they were just like, oh, yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Hey, what do you attribute it to? Have you talked to him about it?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I haven't analyzed it too much.

[Pete Davidson]

I just like his growing up thing.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I mean, however, like. Well, there's probably your DNA or whatever, or how you came. Whatever you came from. But, like, it's how maybe he processed his pain in a different way.

[Pete Davidson]

Or maybe his parents were just loving people that gave him the space to grow up with love.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, it could be that. I don't know.

[Pete Davidson]

Crazy.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I don't know. But, like, I don't want to know if that's true or not, because if I find out that it isn't, True that that's actually a myth, then all my work is just out the window for not. Yeah, it's all this. Just. Just a theory.

[Pete Davidson]

I was telling a story that you're in on stage about that night at.

[Kieran Culkin]

That.

[Pete Davidson]

That comics come home thing that we did. You know, I was so, like, you know. You know, he put me on that thing and I was like, great. You know, it's full circle. You know, I'm going to come back. I'm a pro, you know, I remember, like, doing one of my first guest spots at Nick after Leary and just dying. I'm like, now I've got it all together, you know, I'm seeing everyone who's on there. And he's reading the list of the.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Order and he's going through everybody.

[Pete Davidson]

And I'm like, what the fuck is happening? And he goes, all right, Then Robert Kelly, then Marin, then Burn. I'm like, God damn it, how the fuck. Now I gotta go fight. I gotta go fucking. You know, I'm drowning upon the intro.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But you know what's funny?

[Pete Davidson]

I did fine.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Every. Exactly everybody who gets that spot.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

But here's what I.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Everybody. Dude, I saw Bobby did it this year. Bobby Kelly had to go on last. And he's like, dude, what the fuck? And he's just going, I gotta follow all you fucking guys. And I'm looking at him like, dude, you think it's fun following you? It's not. Yeah, it's not. So. And then what happens? What happens?

[Bill Burr]

He kills.

[Bob Odenkirk]

He went on after me, like. And it was within two seconds, it was like, I didn't even go on stage. He fucking murdered Bobby Lee's like that. It's like, bobby, nobody wants to go on after you. You fucking kill. You kill.

[Pete Davidson]

Well, that was. The funny thing is I'm back, you know, once I figured out these, I was told the order. I was like, God damn it. And I'm between you and him. And I walked up to you, I said, why don't you go after Kelly? And you go, I don't want to.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Go after fucking Kelly. Oh, dude, I loved watching you twist in the wind. And then that was funny, is you got off stage. I go, you opened with the proctology bit. And you're like, I had to. I was going after Bobby. I go, yeah, but you had the bit. You had the bit. You weren't winging it, dude.

[Pete Davidson]

So the colonoscopy bit. Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what. Yeah, look, dude, we all have our.

[Pete Davidson]

No, I did.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I Went up one year. I went up one year. One comment. It was the first time Trump got elected. And this person went up on stage and so trash Trump. Half the crowd was booing and then the next guy, oh, is that Wanda? Wanda's Wanda, Nick Topolo and then me. Oh, wow, dude, it was fucking amazing. Yeah, it was one of my favorite nights of comedy. Wanda went up there like fucking fight. She went off on everybody like they all voted for Trump. It was fantastic. This is a comedian to watch somebody do that in an arena and not give a fuck. So half the crowd's and she's like, eh, fuck you, you motherfuckers.

[Pete Davidson]

Right?

[Bob Odenkirk]

I was just like, you know, I already loved Wanda. I think I love her more. And then Nick goes up there and just goes the other way. Oh my God, dude. Oh my God. Took it to another level of fuck this crowd. And I remember Cam Neely comes down and he's going, going. He's going, what the fuck is going on?

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I go up there and I gotta save the day. And what did I do? I went up there with a chunk of airplane material that I already had.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

The most hackiest ever. Yeah, that's what I did. I opened, I said, hey, how you guys doing? You guys want to talk politics? And they all laughed. And then I just did this airplane material. It was so funny. I get off stage after doing like the hackiest shit ever to bring everybody back and they're all looking at me like, oh my God, that was amazing. I go, that was amazing. That was like my evening at the improv set from fucking 88 before I even did comedy.

[Pete Davidson]

I will say though, I don't. I did. I went up there and I, I started pretty strong.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I knew you were going to be fine because this is the thing. Cuz he's only going to do 10. Whoever you're worried about is only going to do 10. 12.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, Bob did like, he did like 15, 20. But, but, but you remember that, you know Pete, Pete David.

[Bob Odenkirk]

But it was funny this year to watch Bob freaking out. He was going like, dude, what the fuck? I got to go on after all you heavy hitters. And I'm just sitting there. I wish I said to him, it's like, bob, do you understand every year someone's freaking out, they have to follow you. Yeah, you do understand.

[Pete Davidson]

He doesn't that you level.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, but place I remember understand that, right?

[Pete Davidson]

The opening joke I did though is because Pete Davidson went up and it was weird. He did it Was a little weird. It was all about trying to get his mother. Remember, he said just trying to. His mom had had sex since his dad died on 9 11. So he's been trying to have, you know, get his mother to date and have sex. And then, you know.

[Bob Odenkirk]

It sounds like a good premise to me.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah, it was good. And then he does the joke. He ends sort of like, I might have to do it. It was funny. It was a little weird and dark, but he did fine. But he talked about it for the. The entire time. And I went. I went on and I said, you know, it's. I like doing these things, hanging out with the comics. And it's not definite or yet or anything, but I think I'm gonna be Davidson's mom.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, that's fantastic.

[Pete Davidson]

It worked. It got me in.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, but then also. But the crowd loves that because then they can see the, you know, camaraderie. Yes. Yeah, exactly. But I do find there. There are some guys, the guys who kill the hardest sometimes are because Bobby fucking levels.

[Pete Davidson]

He's just hard on himself because he doesn't think he writes enough. Like, he knows he can kill, but he knows he's going to do that same 15 minutes. And I think that's what drives him nuts, is like, I think maybe in his.

[Bob Odenkirk]

He's got all kinds of material, but.

[Pete Davidson]

He'S pretty hard on himself about it, about generating material. And I think his. His mindset is like, you know, like, he knows he can kill, but he knows he's just killing with, you know, these certain bits. Like, I don't think he really thinks that he's gonna bomb.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, I think everybody has. I'm in an arena set.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

I don't have. Not one. I don't have one in the chamber. I don't do them enough. But. Yeah, you got soil things down.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Listen, I saw the freak out.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Where was that? Oh, at the. At the thing.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Dude, I enjoyed doing my set and watching you freak out that night. And the harder Bobby was killing, the harder I was laughing.

[Pete Davidson]

Cause of me.

[Bob Odenkirk]

You just kept walking out, just like, dude, the look on your face, it was like, what was that? When the first time the stock market crashed. Was it Black Friday?

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. You look like the guy that was gonna jump off the fucking out his window. And I was secretly rooting for Bobby to kill even harder.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

Well, thanks, buddy.

[Bill Burr]

That's nice.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, what else would we be doing? Do you know? One of my favorite childish comedic moments, comedy moments. We were doing the improv when it Was at Harris.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And we were sitting in there, and the guy that was opening had some sort of prop, and we were teasing him about it, and he came running in.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And they were doing, like, his intro.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Remember that? Stupid. Y'all ready for this?

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

So he is. He comes running back with this panic look, looking for his. Because it was like, his opening joke. And he's like, where is it? Where is it? Where is it? Neither one of us moved. We just sat there. And then he found it. And as he found it, I reached over with two fingers and I closed the door. And me and the other guy just. He goes, you. He rips open the door. He comes. He came running out. We, We. We're actually listening to him out of breath, doing his first joke.

[Pete Davidson]

Hey, thanks.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Thanks for coming down to the improv, dude. It was the hardest. We laughed at his jokes all that week. But, like, that's the. That I like. So I love. Know you go up. I'm going to fuck Pete's mom.

[Pete Davidson]

Or save it.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever.

[Pete Davidson]

So what's going on with this one of the question about the, about the, the psychological stuff and that is that, like, when you. And I'm just asking because I'm trying to.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I guess you're fucked up too. Yeah.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

You know, when you make the decision to not react or not fight or take the hit, don't you just feel it in your chest? Like, you know, just, you know, there's a, There's a decision, and then there. You got to ride out that kind of.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Oh, I'll tell you the one that I, I, I, I am not able. I don't even know how to attack the problem. I have no clue how to do it is like that Google Map thing that happened to me on the way over.

[Kieran Culkin]

Oh.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Where it's like, I try it, I try it, and I. Dude, I go from, like, com seas to tsunami.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I. And always. And, But. But now I just immediately say after, like, dude, you didn't have to do that. What the is wrong with you? Stop being crazy. You know, thank God nobody else was in the car.

[Pete Davidson]

Right?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Like, what is wrong with you? So that's. And that's as far as the solution has gone to now. I still do it. And then I just say I beat myself up. What the is wrong?

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Stop doing that. I don't need to react to these things. I say that out loud and then. And then the next thing happens, and it's literally like that moment and that realization Never happened, so. But I also know through, you know, trying to figure myself out that, like, this is. This is why most people don't figure themselves out, because you got to push through this part. That's difficult.

[Pete Davidson]

Yes, because it's easy.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Because, you know, once those grooves get worn in your brain, it's just. Just automatic pilot. Something's bad. I'm gonna rip a drawer out. I'm gonna scream or throw my phone against the wall.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And then apologize afterward. That. That's how this. This is the mood. It's a play, but it's good. Rewrite it.

[Pete Davidson]

You've got it down to just mostly, like, freaking out when you're alone.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, I still freak out. Like, this is. I'm. I got an acting gig coming up. I'm trying to memorize the lines in this one section.

[Pete Davidson]

How's that going?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Well, we haven't started yet, so I. I'm trying to get off book before I get there, and I keep up this same part. So I'm with my wife last night, and she's reading me the lines. All the kids are in bed. And then I up this. And I. I was like, it's coming. It's coming. But then I tripped up on a word. So she goes, oh, you got to do with this? I'm like, all right. So now I go. Go back. And then I forgot. And then she said the line that I forgot like, 50 times in a row. And I just went, like, seven times on the arm of the chair.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. And then my daughter came into the room, said, what happened? I said, oh, sorry. I go, I was banging on the chair. It was so funny. Is she just looks at me because she's always going like, dad, it's not that big a deal.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I go, sorry, I lost my temper.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And she goes, all right. I go, I still love you. You know, Daddy has issues. And then she just looks at my wife and kind of laughs and then leaves. But, like, so as much as, you know, I up in that moment, I. I. The. The saving thing that I'm trying to do is I. I address that, you know?

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

What I just did had nothing to do with you.

[Pete Davidson]

Right.

[Bob Odenkirk]

I'm up. I'm sorry. That was wrong or whatever. So.

[Pete Davidson]

Yeah. I didn't mean to scare you.

[Kieran Culkin]

That kind of stuff.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. So my daughter, actually, she kind of, like, looks at me in, like, a funny way. Like, she kind of knows that I. I have, like, issues. But she. She does say funny things. She said the other day, like, she was with her One of her friends and she, the, her friend had brought her little sister along who's only like, you know, five, six years old. And they saw an ambulance go by with the lights on and go through a red light.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And the little girl was like, can they do that? Can they go to the light? And she goes, yeah, she goes, they're allowed to do that when they have the lights on. They can go through the red light. And then she goes. And sometimes my dad does too.

[Pete Davidson]

And so that's a big deal to memorize the whole play because like, you know, when you shoot movies or tv, you can go scene for scene. It's a big deal. Right. Getting that all in your head.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah. But I also find like it's, it's. I just think it's going to be fun.

[Kieran Culkin]

Yeah.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And I met with some of the actors and we were already.

[Pete Davidson]

You and Bob and Kieran and, and, and who else? Is it kind of Olli or.

[Bob Odenkirk]

No, no. Michael McKeon.

[Bill Burr]

Oh.

[Bob Odenkirk]

And so it's those four people. I think Bobby Cavalli did it. He's. He's done it before. Yeah, I definitely talked to him. He's been helping me through it and. But like, you know, we were hanging out and we just, just the, the bust and chops that was already happening. It was really good natured and funny. Like, like Michael, I'm so happy to be working with you. I mean, Bob I don't want to work with, but just like that level of, you know, just around and it just seems like it's, it's gonna be. I just think it's gonna be a lot of fun.

[Pete Davidson]

So when does it. So you haven't even started rehearsals yet?

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah, we start rehearsals beginning of February. And then mid March it starts going.

[Pete Davidson]

And so you locked into New York for like what, a month of rehearsals and then you go, yeah, something like that.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Six weeks or whatever. So I just figured like, you know, everybody's getting off. It's kind of cool, dude, like the, the better Call Saul, Breaking Bad sort of connection that we all. Yeah, we all have. And like someone was saying that they had talked to Brian, get asked for advice and he said, you know, be off book, be off book. So all of your rehearsal time is working on the character. So yeah, if Brian says something, you do it right. Cuz that guy's unbelievable.

[Kieran Culkin]

He is.

[Bob Odenkirk]

He's great.

[Pete Davidson]

I just watched the whole series again. So funny when you were on the plane the other day and I didn't even know you were sitting behind me.

[Bob Odenkirk]

That was so funny. And then you stood up and like, yeah, looks like Mark Marin. Oh, Mark.

[Pete Davidson]

And I was just. I. I was just rewatched Breaking Bad. So literally, I'm watching you on tv, and then I get up and like, oh, there he is.

[Bob Odenkirk]

Yeah.

[Pete Davidson]

So now I gotta go back in the house and find that thing.

[Bob Odenkirk]

All right, well, you have beautiful woodwork in this house. Thank you. A little easier on your drawers.

[Pete Davidson]

All right, Bill. Good seeing you, man.

[Bob Odenkirk]

All right, buddy. I'll see you.

[Bill Burr]

There you go again. Tickets are on sale now for Glengarry Glen Ross on Broadway, and also Bill's special Drop Dead Years premieres on Hulu on March 14th. Hang out for a second, folks. It's time to take the stress out of renting and home buying, thanks to the Redfin app. Redfin makes it fun to search all the homes for sale and apartments for rent in your neighborhood. And if you find a place you love, Redfin makes it easy to go see it in person. Just schedule a tour right from the app. Plus, if you're looking to sell, Redfin agents know how to get you the best price possible for your home. That's because they close twice as many deals as other agents, and with a listing fee as low as 1%, Redfin's fees are half of what others often charge, which means you'll have more money to put towards your next home. So if you're looking to buy, rent, or sell, Redfin's got you covered. Download the Redfin app to get started. Hey, folks, Longtime listeners probably know Dan Pashman. He used to work with me at Air America Radio, and we've had him on over the years when he became the host of his own podcast, the Sporkful. Last week, the sporkful turned 15 years old, and Dan was on the Friday show with Brendan and Chris, which is available now for full Marin listeners.

[Dan Pashman]

You know, back in 2010, it was the stone ages of podcasting, and Mark was our first celebrity guest. And so I emailed the people at Apple podcast that back then it was itunes to have see if they would feature Mark's appearance on the Sporkful in their big promotional carousel. Now, Today here in 2025, there are whole teams of marketing and PR people who are lobbying Apple to get features in this carousel. It is prime real estate. You cannot buy it. It's only up to the editorial discretion of the this what is actually a group of people at Apple. But back in 2010, you literally just emailed a guy named Steve.

[Pete Davidson]

Steve Jobs.

[Dan Pashman]

Not that Steve. Steve Wilson, and you were like, hey, Steve, I'm this guy Dan. I have a podcast called the Sporkful. Marc Maron, famous podcaster, is gonna be on my show in a couple weeks, and he'll be like, oh, cool, yeah, sure. Just here's the specs. Send me the art. And that was it. And that was how we got featured in Apple in 2010 was that I literally just emailed Steve and he said, okay, yeah.

[Bill Burr]

To hear the full episode with Dan Pashman and get bonus episodes twice a week, sign up for the full Marin. Go to the link in the episode description or go to wtfpod.com and click on WTF Plus. And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by acast. Here's a bit of guitar work from the Vault.

[Pete Davidson]

Boomer Lives Monkey and La Fonda Cat Angels Everywhere.