Episode 1650 - Seth Meyers

Summary

WTF with Marc Maron Podcast Episode 1650 – Seth Meyers Release Date: June 9, 2025

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Introduction and Reflections

In this episode, Marc Maron delves deep into personal introspection and broader societal issues before welcoming his guest, Seth Meyers. Marc begins by contemplating the nuances of gratitude, especially in the face of past struggles and current achievements.

Notable Quote:

"I think it takes a certain amount of humility to just accept [success] and be grateful for it..."
[02:30] - Marc Maron

Gratitude and Personal Growth

Marc reflects on his journey toward gratitude, acknowledging past resentments and the importance of humility in achieving personal success. He discusses how overcoming chaos and fury has led him to a more relaxed and appreciative state of being.

Notable Quote:

"I might not have been as good as I thought or as ready as I thought... but over time, I've definitely accepted that..."
[04:15] - Marc Maron

Current Events and Societal Concerns

Transitioning to broader topics, Marc expresses his concerns about the state of America, feeling a sense of personal connection to the nation’s upheavals. He introduces the documentary "Are We Good?" slated for screening at the Tribeca Film Festival and shares his upcoming engagements, including a Q&A with Tracy Letts.

Notable Quote:

"It's hard not to take that personally."
[07:50] - Marc Maron

Reimagined Niemöller Poem

Marc shares his adaptation of Pastor Martin Niemöller's famous poem, highlighting the dangers of apathy and distraction ("being on my phone") amid societal injustices. This creative take underscores his apprehension about losing personal protection when he becomes the target of oppression.

Notable Quote:

"First they came for the Communists, and I did not speak out because I was not a communist and I was on my phone... And then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me..."
[11:00] - Marc Maron

Podcast Promotions

Skipped non-content sections including advertisements and promotions for BetterHelp and Squarespace.

Interview with Seth Meyers

a. Life in Albuquerque and Family Connections

Seth Meyers joins Marc from Albuquerque, discussing his family's ties to the area and his sporadic visits, primarily during the holidays. Both share anecdotes about visiting family and the beauty of Albuquerque in May.

Notable Quote:

"We were there for the weekend, so it was nice. We only go in December for the holidays..."
[17:46] - Seth Meyers

b. Life as a Late Night Host

The conversation shifts to the challenges and rewards of hosting late-night shows. Marc and Seth discuss the pressures of maintaining a daily show, the transition from live audiences during the pandemic, and the emotional toll of addressing serious political issues through comedy.

Notable Quote:

"We give ourselves a lot of permission to take tangents, to do dumb bits..."
[38:34] - Seth Meyers

c. Political Climate and Comedy's Role

Both hosts express frustration with the current political landscape, emphasizing the rise of authoritarianism beyond the traditional two-party system. They discuss how comedy can serve as a cathartic outlet and a form of resistance, providing community and representation for like-minded individuals.

Notable Quote:

"There's an authoritarian coup going on and we're up against something that is not relative specifically to two parties."
[21:22] - Marc Maron

d. Comedy Writing and Physical Comedy

Marc and Seth explore the intricacies of comedy writing, the balance between humor and serious commentary, and the challenges of physical comedy. They share personal experiences about developing comedic bits, the importance of timing, and the evolution of their comedic styles over time.

Notable Quote:

"I have a grandiose brain that I have to fight against all the time."
[35:05] - Seth Meyers

e. Thoughts on Fellow Comedians

The discussion moves to their admiration for fellow comedians like Nathan Fielder and Tim Robinson. They highlight the unique comedic styles and the impact these comedians have on the current comedy landscape, praising their ability to innovate and resonate with audiences.

Notable Quote:

"He is a genius... he's so very funny."
[73:19] - Marc Maron

f. Podcasting and Ending the Show

A significant portion of the conversation centers around Marc's contemplation of ending his podcast, reflecting on the community they've built over 16 years. Both Marc and Seth discuss the emotional difficulty of stepping away from a long-term project, the fear of leaving their audience, and the uncertainty of life post-podcast.

Notable Quote:

"It's so hard to do... I'm a poor cook because I have no patience."
[40:43] - Marc Maron

Personal Anecdotes and Stories

Throughout the episode, Marc and Seth share personal stories that range from Seth dropping his phone in the Rio Grande to Marc losing money due to a careless moment. These anecdotes add a relatable and humorous layer to their introspective discussions.

Notable Quote:

"I was kayaking on the Rio Grande. Dropped my phone in the water and it was then I literally, maybe had the most peaceful two hours of the entire year."
[33:15] - Seth Meyers

Closing Reflections

As the episode wraps up, Marc and Seth reflect on their careers, the future of late-night comedy, and the importance of authenticity in their work. They express mutual respect and excitement for each other's upcoming projects, leaving listeners with a sense of camaraderie and anticipation for what's to come.

Notable Quote:

"It's great talking to you, man."
[80:32] - Marc Maron

Conclusion

Episode 1650 of "WTF with Marc Maron" offers a profound and engaging conversation between Marc Maron and Seth Meyers. They navigate personal growth, the evolving role of comedy in society, and the emotional complexities of long-term projects. Through their candid dialogue and shared experiences, listeners gain insight into the challenges and triumphs of two influential figures in the world of comedy and late-night television.

Transcript

[Marc Maron]

Lock the gate. All right, let's do this. How are you? What the fuckers? What the fuck, Buddies? What the fuck? Assotins. Yeah, I threw a new one in there. Got a request. I got a request. As we're heading into the home stretch. How are you? This is Marc Maron. I am Marc Maron. This is my podcast. Wtf. Welcome to it. You know, I used to get lists of those things. Just full lists of ideas for the opening names. And then, like, you know, I could get preoccupied with, you know, which ones I should use. There'd be dozens of them, and then you just land on a few. How's it going? What's happening in there? Out there? In there? What's happening out there? What's up with you people? Are you okay? Is your head all right? Is everything checking out fine? Are you holding up? It's been very overwhelming, the outpouring of kind of appreciation for the show, and I'm moved and grateful. Edgy, though. A bit edgy. I was talking to my buddy Jerry last night, and I was trying to understand my feelings, and I don't know if there's such a thing as angry gratitude or aggravated gratitude. I'm still wrestling with a certain amount of my feelings that I think it takes a big person to achieve a certain amount of things in their life that are, you know, pretty great or get to a place where they finally kind of made it through the fire into their own sort of level of success or at least having a place in their world. And I think it takes a certain amount of humility to just accept that and be grateful for it and look at the work you've done and think you've done a good job at whatever you do. But there's sort of a level of. Of humility that has to occur so you don't get to that place and look back at all the people that stood in your way on purpose and just inform that gratitude with you. You can go fuck yourself. See. See what I did? Because quite honestly, I think the mature way to look at that is that at those different junctures in my life, whatever my life has been and whatever my rejections were or whatever my struggles were or however many people stood in the way of me getting to where I thought I deserved or what I wanted to believe that I was capable of, I might not have been at that time. I might not have been, you know, as good as I thought or as ready as I thought. And, you know, over time, I've definitely accepted that, and a lot of My resentments or petty aggravations about the struggle or the course of my life. The one it took, you know, was somehow unjust. Yeah. Was out of my mind. I was a being of chaos and fury that eventually had to be beaten down and humbled by the great wheel of life until I. I kind of like, relaxed into me. So I am grateful. That's what I. And I'm going to keep saying that because I should, and I should appreciate that. So I don't just kind of keep, you know, just steamrolling and plowing through life without appreciating what is happening. It's. It's kind of upsetting that I get to this point in my life where, you know, I can level off a little bit and kind of, you know, look at what I've achieved and feel pretty good about it. Just, you know, coinciding with the end of America. It's hard not to take that personally. So look, folks, Seth Meyers is on the show. He was actually on the show back in 2016. That's episode 731. He's not in Los Angeles much. So it was good. It was good to have him back. Catch up. He's still hosting Late Night with Seth Meyers. He's also got two podcasts out now, one with his brother Josh, and one with the guys from the Lonely Island. You're welcome, fellas. So. I'm kidding. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not in that zone. I don't think I invented anything. But there has been. Has been something that's been something that came up the other night that was kind of surprising. A little bit of a retreat, you know, back into mystical thinking. That was kind of. It kind of. I don't really like to go there, you know. Cause I was there. But something triggered it. But I'll talk about it in a minute. The documentary Are We Good? Is screening at the Tribeca Film Festival in New York City. You can come see it this Saturday, June 14th at 5pm that's at the Ocean KX Theater on Chambers Street. I'll be doing a Q and A with Tracy Letts after the screening. That's funny, Tracy. You know, some people wonder over the course of this podcast, you know, because of the nature of my conversations, it seems like, hey, those guys should be friends. You know, how many people have I become friends with after really talking to them? Well, I have a lot more acquaintances and people that I know and know me. But Tracy actually became a friend and I was very focused on that, on becoming friends with Tracy. And he is a friend. Okay. So there's another screening as well on June 15th at 5:30. It's screening at the Village east on 2nd Avenue and 12th Street. And also stick is on TV. I'm on TV in a show with Owen Wilson, and people seem to be enjoying it. Why wouldn't they? A new episode of Stick premieres this Wednesday. I haven't seen it yet. I've only seen as many as you've seen if you've been watching. But it seems to be a fairly emotionally uplifting and satisfying show and I'm happy to be a part of it. So, yeah, a couple of things are going on in terms of the life. I'm kind of adjusting to, realizing that big changes are on the horizon in my life. But in the world, things are certainly not looking good. It's been pretty fucking awful out here in Los Angeles with this display of might and power with the new secret police, that is Ice. And it's been kind of awful, I would say horrible and disconcerting. And it's hard to know exactly what to do. So I found myself kind of trying to sort of integrate the ideas of the poem by. I'm not sure how to pronounce his name. Pastor Martin Niemoller. The poem many of you probably sort of come in contact with. First they came. And, you know, in terms of the message of that. Of that poem and what it means to be a real citizen in the fight for democracy, a couple of things are coming into my mind around this and I'll like, well, I don't know if you know the poem, but I'm going to. I've been rewriting it a little bit and I'll try to give you the sense of it. So here's the poem with my additions. First they came for the Communists, and I did not speak out because I was not a communist and I was on my phone. Then they came for the socialists and I did not speak out because I was not a socialist and I was on my phone. Then they came for the trade unionists and. And I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist and I was again on my phone. Then they came for the Jews and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew and I was still on my phone. And then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me and they took my phone. See, I'm just kind of working with it a little bit, and I think you can Change communists to immigrants. Yeah, that's a little side project that I'm working on. Look, folks, this is an ad by BetterHelp. And if you've heard me talk about BetterHelp, you know that having regular therapy sessions is a normal part of life. But there's still a stigma around mental health issues in this country, and 6 million men in the US suffer from depression every year. A lot of times it goes undiagnosed. A lot of guys feel like there's something wrong with asking for help. I think that if you're a listener to this show, you. You already know that it's okay to struggle. Real strength comes from opening up and getting the supports you need to be your best self. I see a therapist when I need the help, and you should, too. BetterHelp can be a great way to get started. With over 35,000 therapists, you can join a session with a therapist at the click of a button, helping you fit therapy into your busy life, plus switch therapists at any time. As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Talk it out with better help, Our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com WTF? That's better. H E L p.com WTF I did Andy Richter's podcast. I don't know when he's gonna put it up, but, you know, he got me talking about the Comedy Store and about cocaine and about Sam Kenison, and I guess that popped open that portal and I did sort of kind of like retreat. Not retreat, but I found myself engaged in a bit of old Marc Maron style mystical thinking. Because many of you have heard the story of that period in my life where I was a doorman at the Comedy Store and hanging out with Kennison in that entourage and living at the house that Mitzi Shore owned up behind the Comedy Store and just living a life of. I don't even know what you would call it. It was certainly off the grid. It was certainly Comedy Store specific. It was certainly a very jacked up, dark period in a lot of ways, but mostly because of my brain, because I had coked myself into psychosis that took me quite a long time to fully shake in the late 80s. And that was the sort of beginning of my relationship with sobriety. The. That was on and off for years after that. But in my book, the Jerusalem Syndrome, I kind of spent a lot of time on that chapter, the Hollywood chapter, and what was happening in my Mind in terms of psychosis and then also my own sort of paranoid fantasies and my own sort of. It was all informed by whatever intelligence I had at that time. But, but here, but here's the thing is that during the psychotic time at the Comedy Store I started to sort of realize or believe that it was a fairly dark castle of a strange type of mystical, dark energy. And it's not something that people didn't notice back in the day. It's kind of been exercised to some degree just by proficiency. But there was just this concept I had about the role that Mitzi played in the big picture and that, you know, I had become obsessed with the building across the street, which is the Sunset Towers, which is now a pretty sweet hotel. It's an old deco structure. At the time I was at the store it was being gutted and renovated and there's this sort of altar structure on the top. And I'd become sort of obsessed and believed in these. Some sort of apocalyptic fantasies about, you know, the end of the world beginning with some sort of sacrifice that was going to take place on that altar. By who? I didn't know, but I knew there were dark forces coming and I knew that Sam was a representation Kennison of, Of those dark forces. And I believe he was. I re. Listened to some of his bits, two of which are some of my favorite comedy bits in the world. But, but many of them wrong minded. And, and he was really, he was a megalomaniacal person, not unlike Trump or other megalomaniacal people. And you know, he was a powerful force being an ex preacher and he had kind of broken my brain and the Comedy Store just un. Into this castle of. Of. Of. Of dark wizardry. And I felt that, you know, comics at that time were somehow, you know, I didn't quite understand how. But there was a good and evil thing working in that. Somehow comics played a part in the, in the oncoming apocalypse. Because I was there at the Comedy Store and this was going on in 1987 and I had this whole apocalyptic sort of mythos that was being generated by my brain and it wasn't, you know, clear all of it, but I knew that there were certain parts that the Comedy Store was going to be involved in it and that Hollywood was involved in it and that there was something about the shifting of reality and that was. I kind of documented in that book, you know, and it was a real kind of paranoid psychotic vision that I had. And you know, it eventually forced me to run away from Hollywood fairly quickly. You know, give away everything that didn't fit in my car and just get out, get out. 23 Skidoo, baby. And I was running from dark forces that I couldn't see. And I went home and I renewed my passport because I was pretty sure I was going to have to go. And, you know, and I tried to get sober the first time, which I did, and I went back to Boston. But the other day, I was thinking, well, look, you know, and I guess this is in light of the podcast ending and just kind of putting things together for myself and then, you know, realizing at some moment that there was a whole system at the store and at the Comedy Store, and we've discussed it many times on this show, that if you were in the system and you believed in the system, that's all you believed in, really, was Mitzi's system of becoming a comic and what you had to do in that building to get to that place to be a comic. All that being said, it's just interesting to me in the big picture of what's happening and what this medium has. Has unleashed is that, you know, me and Joe Rogan were both in the system. We are both products of the Comedy Store. We are both the spawn of. Of Mitzi's system. Now, however you want to frame Mitzi Shore in the big picture, you know, I have personal sort of opinions about her, but it was her decision. She was the queen. She was the decider. And at my. At my. At the time in the late 80s, when I was out of my mind on drugs, she took on a very kind of almost universal and powerful significance as a kind of a mystical presence. Now, I'm not saying any of this is true, but all I know is that in this medium, which I helped popularize, and Joe, also in that system, certainly has his place in the world, but just there's the spectrum of approach and what we have both unleashed on the world through this medium, but both of us being adepts of the Mitzi Shore system and. And lifelong members of the Comedy Store community. So there you go. Two ends of the spectrum of podcasting coming from the same source underneath the brain of the same woman in a now truly apocalyptic landscape. Hey, look, do with it what you will. I'm just kind of thinking out loud, you know what I'm saying? This episode is sponsored by Squarespace. When you run your own website like we do, life is easier thanks to Squarespace. We never have to worry about updating the site or dealing with bugs. Squarespace handles all of that, plus Squarespace gives you everything you need to offer services and get paid all in one place. From consultations to events and experiences, showcase your offerings with a customizable website designed to attract clients and grow your business. You'll get paid on time with professional invoices and online payments. Plus streamline your workflow with built in appointment scheduling and email marketing tools. And with blueprint AI, Squarespace helps you design a fully custom website in just a few steps. Check out wtfpod.com to see a site powered by Squarespace. Then head to squarespace.com wtf for a free trial. And then when you're all set to launch your new site, use offer code WTF to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. That's squarespace.com WTF offer code WTF all right, so be it. Okay, so look, Seth Meyers, obviously the host of Late Night with Seth Meyers on NBC and Peacock, his podcasts are family trips with the Myers brothers and the Lonely island and Seth Meyers podcast, you can get those everywhere. And now you can get me and him, me and Seth talking right here, right now. Here we go. You were in Albuquerque?

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You have family, right?

[Seth Meyers]

My wife's from.

[Marc Maron]

Grew up there. That's right, she grew up there. Yeah. How. How long did you hang out there?

[Seth Meyers]

We were there for the weekend, so it was nice. We only go in December for the holidays and I've never been in May. It's beautiful. Might be the best time to be. It was gorgeous.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, my God. I gotta get back. How you feeling, buddy?

[Seth Meyers]

I'm feeling all right. Thanks for asking.

[Marc Maron]

What are you doing out here?

[Seth Meyers]

I'm just out, you know, I come out like twice a year and try to do some LA press for the show. Yeah, I'm gonna go in Kimmel for the Emmys. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

It's a little shameful, isn't it?

[Marc Maron]

No, it's show business.

[Seth Meyers]

It's show business.

[Marc Maron]

But, you know, it's.

[Seth Meyers]

I also love. I should say I. I love being out here for short pops of time.

[Marc Maron]

We must have a lot of friends out here that you don't see all the time.

[Seth Meyers]

So many.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, one, I came up in Chicago and everybody came here and very few of us went to New York. And then, you know, post SNL, I mean, for basically for 15 years, those are the only friends I made.

[Marc Maron]

And they're all out here and they're still here.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, everybody came.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that gives me hope because I was under the impression everybody was leaving.

[Seth Meyers]

Oh, yeah, Well, I Feel like I haven't paid that close attention, but certainly in the last six months, I would.

[Marc Maron]

Imagine people coming back to New York.

[Seth Meyers]

I feel like we've gotten a few people. Not my closest friends, but definitely some imports from la.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I think people realize, like, what do I gotta be out there for?

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

You know COVID ruined everybody with Zoom.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. Well, I was gonna. We were talking. I have something I want to pitch recently.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And I was looking at my schedule, trying to figure out when you could get out here, and then I realized nobody pitches. Nobody. I don't. I don't even think people in L. A. Want to have to come into the.

[Marc Maron]

Office to hear a drive out to Culver City.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

To HBO to pitch them.

[Seth Meyers]

Does feel foolish that we did it all in person for as long as we did.

[Marc Maron]

I still like it, ma' am.

[Seth Meyers]

This is nice. I mean, we could be doing a podcast via Zoom, and this is so much fun.

[Marc Maron]

I don't do them.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, I know.

[Marc Maron]

Like that. But the. I had a. I went to see a psychiatrist because I figured it was time.

[Seth Meyers]

Was their first line to you. What took you so long?

[Marc Maron]

Well, no, I've been to them, but, like. But at this stage of my life, there's. There was something, you know, nagging me, and I wanted to get a psychiatric evaluation by a real psychiatrist.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And. And they were like, do you want to do Zoom? I'm like, no, I want to sit on a couch, and I want to look at a guy that I can judge for an hour as to whether or not he's, you know, on the level.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And not just shuffling me off with some medication ideas.

[Seth Meyers]

Did you feel like you got what you wanted out of the hour?

[Marc Maron]

Yes, but he shuffled me off with some medication, so you guys. But. But I believed him.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So the last time we talked was like, what, 2016.

[Seth Meyers]

Long time.

[Marc Maron]

And you just started, I think, hosting your show.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. A couple of years in.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. And it was not as defined as it was. I think that, you know, you're the. I think. Who. Who was in the band. It was this rotating crew. Wasn't Armisen.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. Fred was in the band, and it was the He Band. We no longer have a band.

[Marc Maron]

Eleanor Friedlander.

[Seth Meyers]

Yep. She was there. She would come in and wonder how she's doing. I hope good.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

She's a fantastic musician.

[Marc Maron]

Totally.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. Sid Butler and Eli Janney.

[Marc Maron]

No band now.

[Seth Meyers]

No band. That was. They. The cost of doing business in the modern era of showbiz.

[Marc Maron]

And, like, how are you feeling about. I'VE had this issue lately and I think that you're starting to realize it where for too long everyone's been talking about the political environment as a two party problem.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And really the problem is, is that, you know, there's an authoritarian coup going on and we're up against something that is not relative specifically to two parties.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I think that we all feel powerless in the face of it because we are. But there is this idea that, like, these Democrats have got it. Like what? You know, so, like, I've actually gotten to the point where, like, you can make, you know, cute jokes about Trump and whatever, but really the problem is almost impenetrable by clever jokes.

[Seth Meyers]

Oh. I mean, yes. I feel like maybe it has always been. I mean, did we ever really penetrate, as you look back.

[Marc Maron]

Well, when the media landscape was different.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

And that everybody was relatively on the same page. I think that there was an ability to raise some awareness and actually have to provoke some sort of reaction that could facilitate either cosmetic change or actual small changes.

[Seth Meyers]

I think that I, looking back, I hope that might have been true. We were always very careful to approach this not as we were changing anybody's mind, mostly because we never had the.

[Marc Maron]

Sense with this show.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

With ours. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

That, you know, early on, if you disagreed with us, I don't understand why you would continue to engage with us.

[Marc Maron]

Watch the show. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

So the only mind we were trying to change was to get the people who were watching our show to vote. Right. Like ultimately, that's all you can hope.

[Marc Maron]

And also feel represented.

[Seth Meyers]

Feel represented.

[Marc Maron]

Because now it's almost like, you know, people are afraid to talk.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

And, you know, I did a whole tour for a year and a half, you know, and a year that or however long since January with Trump in office. And it really started to feel like I was, you know, providing some sort of community service, getting these like minded people out from under their phones and their computers into a room full of people that thought like them. And just to sort of bear witness to the fact that we're. You're not alone here.

[Seth Meyers]

I think it's catharsis and I do think that, you know, ultimately that it is both. It's certainly cathartic to do our show every day and hopefully it's cathartic to watch our show. But I'm talking to you during a hiatus week.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And this is so much harder for me than when I have the show. Right. Like what I read today on any given day when I don't have the show to sort of process it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Like, I feel so much worse and so.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, because the reality sets in or just.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, it's just. It's just this horrifying.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Seth Meyers]

Like, for example, you know, we're. We're talking after Memorial Day. Yeah. And you just sort of read what, you know, the President chooses to say and, you know, it's just impossible to, you know, not just feel sunk by the reality of it.

[Marc Maron]

Well, yeah, exactly. And I guess that's not a good show.

[Seth Meyers]

No. But, you know, I think we had this moment where, you know, as it dawned on us pretty early on election night. Okay. I mean, the first thing I felt was just this overwhelming sadness about having to do it again. I just didn't think I could generate the energy to do it again. And pretty quickly, I think we all came up with this tone shift that is open to comedians, that's not open to people who say, work at CNN or msnbc. Like, sure, I don't know how they go to work every day.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Because we realized, all right. In 2016, I think our approach was, you know, that this was, you know, we. A mistake has been made, you know, like, that everybody will realize over the course of the next four years, this isn't us.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And now you firmly have been told, nope, this is us, you know, more us than it was even in 2016. Because everybody know exactly, you know, what the deal was. And so we've sort of given ourselves permission to just. And I know this will sound possibly hollow as I say it, but just to make sure we are still joyful. Because, like, once your joy is taken away, like, they win. And so we're not trying to pretend like anything is good. We're trying to still talk about things that are really difficult and scary.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

But with a collective, like, all right, you know, at the very least, you know, we agree with one another.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that's interesting. So. Because that, that actually becomes, as time goes on, I think, as time will show, sadly, a revolutionary act.

[Seth Meyers]

I mean, it would be nice if it ended up having the result of some sort of revolution, you know?

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Seth Meyers]

But.

[Marc Maron]

But just the idea of having voice.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

Like, what isn't really talked about as much is that, you know, Trump being the selfish self serving grifter that he is, and this sociopathic narcissistic personality who has a knack for cranky autocracy is being handled.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I think that when you talk to people about, you know, even smart people, they're sort of like, yeah, I don't know what we're going to do and you know, in 28 or whatever. And I'm like, dude, you know, what are we gonna do next month? And. But they don't talk about like, Russ Vaught. They don't talk about, you know, you know, the fact that like, you know, Trump's not coming up with those executive orders, 30 a day and that they don't talk about. I mean, everybody paid lip service to Project 2025, but I don't know that anybody really knows what that was, the architecture of an authoritarian America. And that, you know, really what's happening on all fronts is, you know, and quickly is that, you know, he's fucking all these major institutions, right? Defunding, you know, breaking the government. And like, most regular people are like, that doesn't sound good. You know, and then they're like, I gotta go to work. And I'm like, shouldn't there be more urgency?

[Seth Meyers]

I, you know, I feel like you've talked about this before, but like, I don't, you know, I don't think any of us have any sense as to what to do.

[Marc Maron]

I know. God damn it.

[Seth Meyers]

God damn it.

[Marc Maron]

I thought you would be the guy.

[Seth Meyers]

No, I'm not. I mean, again, look, I, I'm so lucky that I have the show to.

[Marc Maron]

Do, but do you fear on any regular basis that, you know, the, the corporate ownership of the network will come under fire and you, you haven't been spoken to about, you know, toning anything down or anything?

[Seth Meyers]

I haven't. And I do want to give credit where credit's due and I've never had any corporate interference on our show from the very beginning. Now, I also am aware that, you know, like you were saying, yeah, 20, 28 versus next week. Yeah, this stuff is happening fast.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, and yeah, you know, we do a Q and A every night and you know, after the show during, like during the last commercial break.

[Marc Maron]

Okay.

[Seth Meyers]

And I'll go into the audience and, you know, with regularity, people will say some version of Are you worried?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And I will say I went from hahaha, no to basically the answer now, which is it wouldn't matter if I was, you know, like, I don't. It's no, you know, it's not, it's.

[Marc Maron]

Not like I know I can correct.

[Seth Meyers]

The record in the next few shows.

[Marc Maron]

Right. I talk to Brendan about it all the time and you know, he's my producer and we've been sort of like, well, this is what they said they were going to do.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And this is what's Happening.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So, you know, once you take that in fully and then you realize, you know, like, I did a bit in the special about, like, what, do you even protest? There's so much going on every day. Do you make a sign that just says, please just stop?

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

This is fucking crazy.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, also, you just. Your brain, I feel like almost it just retreats to this false sense of security where you get through a day and you say, well, that hopefully that's the end of it for the near future. Hopefully they've done everything that was they set out to do.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

But, you know, they, you know, it turns out when you have sort of unchecked power like they do, there's no real reason to take your foot off the gas.

[Marc Maron]

Right. And, you know, and what are the repercussions of it? It's like, it's so weird to be living in this situation. What I notice is that, you know, people are afraid to talk and because, like you said that you're preaching to a choir to a certain degree. So there's no real way to have across the board, impact. You know, everyone's insulated in their bubbles of information. So there's a futility in that.

[Seth Meyers]

You also just realize how bad, you know, the messaging always has been about so many things. And even the very idea that when you hear, like, federal funding is being pulled away from Harvard and the speed in which, you know, certain bad actors can frame that as, you know, good, These rich kids shouldn't get a free ride to college. And of course, that's. The money was never for that. The money was always for scientific research. It was for cancer research. And it was one of the things that always drove, you know, the sort of scientific breakthroughs that this country had a lot of reason to be proud of.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Do you? Well, I guess. But that agenda has been going on forever. They just want to, you know, break these institutions of progressive thought so they can make the general populace more malleable if it doesn't exist anywhere in the world.

[Seth Meyers]

That's the part that's the scariest to me is I feel like every now and then people are like, well, they're going to regret this. Cause I don't think. And I'm like, they're incapable of regret. They're incapable of shame. And so, you know, even when, oh, well, you know, homes get more expensive, they're gonna really wish they hadn't messed around with the bond market. I'm kind of like, no, they'll just blame it on something else.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, and so it's terrifying to live. You know, basically, we're dealing with an administration that I do think is, like, incapable of shame. And it's a hard thing.

[Marc Maron]

And they're fucking, you know, cruel.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And they like it.

[Seth Meyers]

They like being cruel. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And there's a lot of people in this country that are like. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

It's also. I keep going back. I mean, again, like, look, it was obviously a stumble when, you know, Hillary Clinton called them, you know, a basket of deplorables. But, you know, I was just being specific about the way certain people were behaving online. That was, you know, deplorable by any sense.

[Marc Maron]

I wish she would have tightened up the metaphor. Yeah, Just like a bunch of fucking idiots.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, right. But there's. Yeah, I know, but it was too fancy. But again, we should probably pay the price for being too fancy with their language. But, you know, it's that crazy thing of just never in our lifetime. Right. We never, you know, saw an inauguration or, you know, a victory speech or, you know, a statement where, you know, people relished the cruelty of it.

[Marc Maron]

Dude, it's. And their brains. The phones are just breaking brains. Yeah. You know that. Like, I watched some weird old Michael Mann movie I didn't know about last night, the Keep. Oh, do you know that?

[Seth Meyers]

No, but I. The fact that there's a. Oh, wait, I do know this movie. I do know this movie.

[Marc Maron]

It's kind of a practical effect horror movie where Nazis are, you know, encamped in this Romanian mountain village.

[Seth Meyers]

I was very excited when I read this movie existed. How did it hold up?

[Marc Maron]

Well, I mean, the effects are horrendous, but. But if you're a heart, I think it's got kind of a culty following, but it is about evil and it's about Nazis. And there's a monologue in there by the Nazi commander who has heart somehow to the Gestapo guy who said, you've convinced millions of people to honor their worst possible self. Like, the power of propaganda, of breaking brains to engage people's worst fucking animal, horrible selves is like, you know, we all update ours every day.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. I was kayaking on the Rio Grande. Dropped my phone in the water.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, wow.

[Seth Meyers]

And it was then I literally, maybe had the most peaceful two hours of the entire year.

[Marc Maron]

But how long was it panic?

[Seth Meyers]

You know, it was so immediately gone.

[Marc Maron]

And that's a muddy river, man.

[Seth Meyers]

And it was moving pretty fast. It was that thing of, we're not gonna.

[Marc Maron]

It's gone.

[Seth Meyers]

It's gone.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And by the way, like, then I woke up at like 3:30 in the morning in a cold sweat. But I did really. I had like. I had like a few hours where I'm like, you know what? This, this path. Okay, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Learn this. Yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, I also think it helped to just also be in nature's current.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, I didn't have to do anything.

[Marc Maron]

It's a very weird thing to accept, but, you know, like. But the process you go through with a phone is sort of like, well, it's all up on the cloud. I'll just get another phone, then jack back in and, you know, everything will come back.

[Seth Meyers]

Right. And it came back pretty fast.

[Marc Maron]

Sure. I mean, I lost a wad of money because I'm an idiot and I want to be my grandfather. So I like to carry a wad of money in my pocket with a money clip. And I was wearing a jacket. And it wouldn't have happened if I hadn't had to walk to get my car, but I dropped it and it's gone. It's just. It's in Glendale. I was walking down Brand Avenue and there must have been 600 bucks in that thing because I'm an idiot.

[Seth Meyers]

You know what my grandfather used to do, as we're talking about Grandmother. My grandfather. This is before I was around, but my dad told me he thought Scotch tape was the greatest invention of all time. And so he would lay his money out and he would tape it end to end and he would keep it in a roll. And when he paid for things, he would carry scissors around and he would cut out like. He would pull out like $14 and then cut it with scissors and then pay with like, just a strip of.

[Marc Maron]

That's the best. Nice ritual.

[Seth Meyers]

It's good.

[Marc Maron]

But letting go of something like that, it's just sort of like, I hope someone who needs it. You found it.

[Seth Meyers]

You know what? Yeah. It's amazing how, like, you find. You always find Buddhism after you've done the dumbest shit ever.

[Marc Maron]

Sure.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, that's when you're like, you know what the river. What the river takes, May the river have. And it's always just because you were dumb as.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I'm a fucking idiot. But I gotta let it go. Yeah. And then. Let me see if I can make that poetry. Well, I mean, that's what you're doing every day with the news. Yeah, but like, do you get. Do you get. Well, I have a grandiose brain that I have to fight against all the time.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. And.

[Marc Maron]

But I think people in your position who are actually have a major platform. Do you get scared for your life ever?

[Seth Meyers]

I try not to think about it, but I would say no. If I'm really being honest. I think. And I don't quite know why, but I would say no.

[Marc Maron]

Do you get threats?

[Seth Meyers]

Some threats, yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Any ones that are like, I gotta bring the authorities in a few times.

[Seth Meyers]

There was a, like, name on a list. You know, they catch a guy who's got a name on a list. But I should say long lists. Like, I've never, you know, I think if you're on like a two name or a three name list, you may just spin out. But if you find out, it's like a couple hundred names.

[Marc Maron]

I remember years ago when I was on the radio, there was a guy that had like this site that just listed all the Jews, you know, that, you know, were the evil. And I really. And I fought to have the guy on the show because I wanted to try to convince him that if you just look at this list a little differently, and it's amazing the contributions these people make. This is a list of geniuses.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, this is a good list.

[Marc Maron]

It's a good list of why the world is a good place.

[Seth Meyers]

My son did say, there's a. We were walking and he said, I sometimes worry, you know, because sometimes bad things happen to famous people. And I said, yeah. You know, also though, like, you know, no one's really, you know, no one's really safer than anybody else. And he goes, yeah. And actually, you know, when I think about it, there's a lot of people more famous than you. And I said, yep. And again, now at this point, I just want him to feel better. I'm like, yeah, I would say that's true. And he said. He goes, you're kind of a medium. And now I'm like, now I'm having. Now I'm like, all right, we can talk about something else.

[Marc Maron]

A medium.

[Seth Meyers]

Medium.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, that's good.

[Seth Meyers]

Medium. Then I'm going home. Now I'm back on the couch.

[Marc Maron]

But when you decided to, like, you know, there's only two people that really do what you're doing. Specifically, it's you and Oliver that really kind of push back. Fleshings out fairly thoroughly.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, I mean, I would say the Daily show does it. I think Colbert does it a fair amount. But we built this thing called A Closer look, which is three days a week. And we have this fantastic writer on our show, Sal Gentile, who sort of generates it, and he has.

[Marc Maron]

He Used to be at msnbc.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. And he has this sort of cable background where he writes a thesis statement and then he lays out a lot of arguments and then he comes to a conclusion. And I think it's what makes it such a watchable piece of comedy is there's also this sort of through line of content.

[Marc Maron]

So that's the framework for the comedy. So that's something new for you as a guy who was a writer. Totally is that, you know, you now have this outline of information that is news.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And it's a point of view piece. Right. And you've got to figure out how to punch it up.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, Sal brings it in and then.

[Marc Maron]

And it's not funny when Sal brings in.

[Seth Meyers]

No, no, it's very. Sal puts in a ton of jokes.

[Marc Maron]

Okay.

[Seth Meyers]

And then. But then he's definitely writing comedy as well, really good comedy. And then Alex Bayes, our head writer and I, we take a pass and. And then we sort of read it together. But we've also, you know, especially post the pandemic when we were doing the show, you know, in an attic with no audience.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

We have a lot. We give ourselves a lot of permission to take tangents, to do dumb bits, do, you know, half baked impressions. Like we try to, while we're, you know, kind of giving this pretty, pretty, you know, a well thought out take on what's happening in the world. We also really want to embrace the freedom to be silly.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. To balance it. Yeah, that seems to be the way to do it.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Oliver does that too.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, very much. And, you know, I think, you know, Oliver, who, you know, I'm a friend of, and we talk all the time like, you know, he's always trying to balance like, what's the dumbest thing we can do to counter this? Just to counter the weight of our. And I should say, you know, John, at least, you know, we have the. I think it's a little easier for us because we're talking about stuff people know about. John's often like, hey, here's this thing you didn't know about that's also terrible.

[Marc Maron]

That'S more horrible than you can ever imagine.

[Seth Meyers]

Right. Like, at least they, you know, they tune into me to, you know, with an expectation of what I'm going to talk about, whereas John's like, hey, bad news.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, it's not. And it's not the whole show.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I've noticed that in terms of comedy writing that, you know, you can. That the silliness is almost this necessary pause.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

You Know, in presenting this stuff.

[Seth Meyers]

Right. Well, I mean, you know, I think.

[Marc Maron]

My comedy chops are not designed that way. Like, if I get an audience into a bad place, you know, my way out is like, I know. Right?

[Seth Meyers]

But you. For a long time, I feel like, you know, you know, very trailblazing in being a comedian who talks about stuff.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

That ultimately we're all talking about on our shows now.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Well, good. Thank God. Thank God I'm there to start something.

[Seth Meyers]

That I don't get credit for Podcasting, too, just FYI. That's another one.

[Marc Maron]

And I guess you should know that we're going to be stopping it.

[Seth Meyers]

No.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Get out of town.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. In fall. In the fall.

[Seth Meyers]

Why?

[Marc Maron]

Because we're tired.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And it's just being me and Brendan for, you know, these 16 years, and we do a new show twice a week, and it's very, you know, we did all right. We've been in a deal with a. A platform for a few years, and. And, you know, we've always said about the show, like, you know, when are you going to stop? And it's like, well, I don't know. It's up to him.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And then, you know, it just becomes this thing, like, you know, we don't have to keep doing it, dude.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. You know, I mean, that's. But I'm mostly happy for you coming to that decision.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

I will miss it. I should say. I'm incredibly honored to be back.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

I hope. The inner judge of myself that we all have. My first reaction was, they're running out of people. They're running. If you're coming back, they're running out of people. And now you're like, yeah, we're ending the show. And I was so worried you were gonna say, yeah, we're running out of people.

[Marc Maron]

People.

[Seth Meyers]

Once we knew we had Seth coming back for a second time, we're like, this is it.

[Marc Maron]

No, no, we. We don't really run out of people. But there is this sort of question about. I mean, yeah, I. I'm older than you, but, you know, nobody seems to really stop. And I. I don't know. I'm not sure what my life will be after it. But, you know, it. It is a rare thing that we've done to where we've built our lives around this thing. And we have done a new show, you know, every Monday and Thursday for 16 years, without fail, whether vacation or no vacation. And, you know, it doesn't sound like a lot, but it's a lot.

[Seth Meyers]

Did you start from the very beginning. Doing two a week.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Wow. That was, like, the only thing we knew we were gonna do. It's like we weren't sure what the show would end up being, but it's like Monday and Thursday. That's the right amount of time in between shows so people can have them to go. The drive time or whatever. And the more I talk about it, and I've only talked to a couple of people about it publicly, I had Mulaney on the other day, and he's gonna be on the show where we're gonna announce it. And then there's this whole feeling of I've got this community of people, but I'm not grandiose about them. Like, are they gonna be okay without me complaining about my cats?

[Seth Meyers]

You know, I get that part, though. Right. Because I think for us, in our show, it was really during the pandemic where I understood it because I had never read the YouTube comments on my show. But when I was doing a show and there was no audience, I sort of turned to it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Just that ego needed to have some feedback to not think I was just yelling into a void. And I found it to be really lovely.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, good.

[Seth Meyers]

And so you sort of. And I kind of underestimated how you build a community. And, like, look, I think they'd be fine without me, but it is. That's a hard thing to do. Break away from.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. And also, this is, like, the majority of my social life.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Like, is like having you guys. Like, that's why we have recurring guests. Not because we're running out. It's sort of like. Well, he was. I liked him the last time we had a. We had a good time.

[Seth Meyers]

It is. I. You know, Lorne Michaels told me that when he was. You know. Cause everybody was up to. You know, there was that long run, and I think everybody finally accepts now that Lauren's going to stay. But he said he was talking to Steve Martin, and Steve said, lauren, if you retire, who do you think you're gonna hang out with? You know, like. And that's that community thing. Like, Lauren gets to be. You know, not few guys Lauren's age get to hang out with that many young people. I have a famous person who's, like, right next to culture, come by once a week and hang out with them. And it's a great gig. Socially. It's a great gig.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I had a very interesting, weird realization. Whether it's real or not, despite his power and despite his impact, that he's a guy who's a television producer that goes to work. And he's been going to work in that building for however long it's been 50 years. And that's sort of who he is, despite the fact that he's built this, you know, fortune and had this power. He's a star maker, everything else. But when you see him walk down the hall, you're like, he's just been.

[Seth Meyers]

Doing that same office.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

I mean, it's so funny. I said to him, you know, during the 50th stuff, I said, you know, it's so funny. When I first met you, I thought, oh, my God, I hope. I hope I get the keys to Lorne Michaels in New York City.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And now all these years later, I know it's an office, Yankee Stadium and two restaurants. Like. Right. You know, he is not. He is such a creature of habit.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Seth Meyers]

And so there's actually. If you hang out with Lauren, like, within, like, three months, you're like, oh, we're going back to this place.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Because you, like, you know, you're.

[Marc Maron]

But that's what anybody does. I know that's what anybody does. But it really was. It was sort of like a strangely empathetic moment I had.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

You know, like, after mythologizing this guy my whole life, and even, you know, people were on the show, you guys humanize him, but we all know that he's this bigger than life presence. But then I just saw kind of him kind of waddle off into the building while I'm putting my gear away. I'm like, oh, my God, he just works here.

[Seth Meyers]

I had one of my best Lauren moments, which was during the 50th, I did. I was at Update and was doing that thing with Fred and Vanessa where, you know, they used to do that bit where they were, you know, the friends of dictators.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And for the 50th, they were friends of Lorne Michaels. And, you know, I've only ever watched. And again, Lorne laughs at Sketches, but I'd only ever watched with him under the bleachers whilst I've got to watch him watch. So I'm at the Update desk, and he was just sitting in, like, the second row with his family. And he was really laughing, especially because Fred and Vanessa were, like, talking about him, obviously a fictional version of him. And it was really kind of. That was a real humanizing moment to realize, oh, God, like, he's also, you know, he's a comedy audience. You know, he always. And I think that's a part of the job that he wouldn't want to give away either.

[Marc Maron]

Did you learn anything from him in relation to that? Because he seemed to be kind of very nuanced in your way of assessing what's funny and what isn't.

[Seth Meyers]

Sure. But I think the thing. I mean, that freedom to just enjoy people such. I mean, you know, he really.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I'm glad that the man who has everything, is still able to enjoy.

[Seth Meyers]

Life, can still find a way to laugh.

[Marc Maron]

What a relief. You know, I was really worried that.

[Seth Meyers]

I do. I mean, I will say I do think he was really worried about the 50th. I mean, I know he has everything, but I. You know, IF. If the 50th had been a dud, I think Lauren would have carried it to the grave.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know if I'm the first to say it, but when I saw the audience of the 50th, I'm like, this is the resistance. Yeah, that's them in that room. How are we going to win this? They're all in that room right now.

[Seth Meyers]

It was something.

[Marc Maron]

It was. I couldn't like. And then people kept showing up and then, like, some people didn't look particularly comfortable, but I was happy to see Keith Richards, always.

[Seth Meyers]

I had my Keith Richards moment.

[Marc Maron]

You did?

[Seth Meyers]

I don't have many, but I. You know, it's right down the hall from my office. So it was weird. Like, the SNL 50th was both, like, this trippy thing that I couldn't believe I was part of, and it was also like 100ft from where I go.

[Marc Maron]

To work every day. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And so I sort of, more than other people, felt fine at commercial breaks, getting up and going, and it was so hot. And it was. People like Keith Richards. When was the last time Keith Richards had to stay in his seat for three hours? Three plus hours? And so at one point, I just. It was very hot in the studio and I just grabbed like 12 waters and walked. I was just handing them out to people and I said, keith, would you like. Oh, you know, I've never talked to Keith. Keith, do you want to water? And he's like, oh, thanks, mate. And I was like, that's all I need. Like, also, it was so funny. Like, of all the things Keith Richards has craved in his life, I found him the day, the moment he needed water more than anything.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, well, what was the vibe? I mean, what were when. You know, heading into that thing. What did you do on. Did you. Did you write?

[Seth Meyers]

I was. Yeah, I was. They hired me to be A writer. But I really didn't have much to do. Like, a couple weeks out, it was pretty clear what the sketches were, and, you know, the people who originated the sketches worked on them and did a, you know, great job. But I was. I mean, all my anxieties came back. I thought, you know, I had a lot of times over the course of the week where I think I was not alone of, like, what role am I gonna play? Am I gonna. Are they gonna need me?

[Marc Maron]

This.

[Seth Meyers]

Cause the Last one, the 40th, was right after I'd left, and I felt very. I still felt very close and essential to the show. And then you just realized, like, it's doing fine without me. And. But, yeah, I mean, it was, you know, being at the table, reading one more time when, again, it was mostly writers, but also, you know, you know, Steve and Tina and Amy and. And Mulaney. Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was amazing. It was that thing of knowing it. It felt like being aware was the last time and not knowing. As a human, you're incapable of absorbing it all.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Because, you know, the seconds go just as fast, even if it's the last time.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. But it's so interesting that, like, for somebody watching it and for somebody who's inside of it, like, I only know, like, you know, for whatever reason, I don't get asked to go to things. I don't seem to know how to maintain relationships with people.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

I'm becoming like this old character, I think, like, you know, were you good.

[Seth Meyers]

At it in your, like, early standup days? Were you good at maintaining relationships?

[Marc Maron]

No, I resented the other side of the business to the point where none of them wanted to give me opportunities. I was the guy that, you know, like, if they never realized that assistants were on a career trajectory, that eventually, when you were a dick to that assistant, that he was going to be running everything. Like, I was very.

[Seth Meyers]

What a funny thing to realize. Way too late.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, they all move up. Yeah. And they don't like me from when they were younger. I remember I'm very nice to everybody now.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. For years. Yeah. It's a. You know, I was an angry man. Yes.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

I remember once being rude to. And I had very few of these, but being rude to somebody who's one of Lauren's assistants, and someone's like, do you think there's any Lauren assistant who's not showbiz connected? Do you think there's anybody got that job from a resume?

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Seth Meyers]

And I was like, oh, right, right, right, right.

[Marc Maron]

Wasn't there a bit on the 50th with that. Wasn't there a line in Sandler's Song about the assistants and, oh, whose kid is it?

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, Sandler. Man, what a needle to thread. Because there were. He had so many inside jokes that even if you were outside, you appreciated why. Why they were funny.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And that's a really.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I think that was the trick of that whole thing, wasn't it? Is. Is to make it not so insulated that, you know, other people could enjoy.

[Seth Meyers]

It, but also not. It wasn't a show for people who'd never seen snl.

[Marc Maron]

That's right.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But, like, I watched it and there. There's, like. There are two specific characters and moments that I was like, oh, my God, that's the best thing ever. There was something about the. There was something about Eddie Murphy relishing doing Tracy Morgan that I thought was spectacular.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

Like, it seems like, you know, I don't know who pitched him on it, but he was like, I'll definitely do that.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, Che told me that Che pitched it to him and that the minute he pitched it, Eddie, the first time he heard it, started saying things as Tracy that made the final script. Like, he immediately improvised lines that made the final. I mean, that I think you could tell, right? I mean, the joy. I mean, again, there's nothing quite like watching Eddie in the pocket.

[Marc Maron]

Sure. Yeah. But the fact that, like, you know, that he was so in tune with Tracy. What makes Tracy Tracy? And then the fact that Tracy's right next to him and I don't even know what Tracy must have been feeling.

[Seth Meyers]

I know.

[Marc Maron]

To have Eddie Murphy doing, like, a perfect impression of you. It's that whole lasagna thing.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. The best Three cheese lasagna. I think that was maybe the first thing. Four cheese lasagna. I don't know if I'm gonna get it wrong, but.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, my God. And then Will's fucking jailbird character.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

What the fuck was that?

[Seth Meyers]

Amazing. And that, you know, that's Colin Jo's sketch. And I will say, man, shout out to Jost and Che, who one, I think are just fantastic on Update. And they both wrote so many great things for that SNL 50th. And so many other writers did, too. But a real shout out to them. My. Our friend Neil Brennan.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Said something really funny afterwards. He goes, you know, everybody who ever worked on that show has so much charisma. And then you see Will and Eddie and you all look like just people on a bus. Like they're Just a different thing. Yeah. And even amongst the best sketch performers of all time, they come out and you're like, oh, I should retire. You know, like, what? I mean, they're just. It's nuts.

[Marc Maron]

But that character, like, I don't even like, it was so disturbing and funny that I was sort of like, we need, like, a show with that guy.

[Seth Meyers]

It's also that thing that, again, for guys like you and I, who are at our very best, have gotten better at being us.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Right.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, like.

[Marc Maron]

No, that was the whole goal.

[Seth Meyers]

No range. Rangeless.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

To watch Will Ferrell on, what, his 500th sketch character, have a new move.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. And just. It was so disturbing and funny and confident. Yeah. Well, that's a weird thing. That's an interesting thing you bring up is like, you know, I've just been working on being me, and I think I'm kind of nailing it, but to the point where if I do movies and people and this is a liability of doing something that, you know, shows all of me, which is the podcast or whatever, is that anything I do like, well, it's just Marin being Marin. I'm like, no, it's not. I was acting, but it was. I was listening. I was doing the acting thing. And then I have to rationalize it, like, well, you know, Clooney's always Clooney.

[Seth Meyers]

Really? Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I'm not saying I'm Clooney.

[Seth Meyers]

No. But certainly you. I mean, no one. Right. No one's saying Tom Cruise. I saw the new Mission Impossible. Same moves from old Tom Cruise.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, of course. Get him running.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Get him hanging.

[Seth Meyers]

I'm excited. Look, I will tell you, like, I'm.

[Marc Maron]

Did you talk to him? Who, Tom?

[Seth Meyers]

No, he wasn't there.

[Marc Maron]

Nobody on the. Have you had him on the show for.

[Seth Meyers]

I've never had him on my show.

[Marc Maron]

Huh. Yeah. Why is that?

[Seth Meyers]

I don't know.

[Marc Maron]

Aren't there a few guys like that? I have a few guys like that. Like, what's the holdup?

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. I feel like, you know, I. You know, I think he has a pretty good relationship with Fallon, and I think he had a pretty good relationship with James Corden. They did some really funny stuff together.

[Marc Maron]

It's sort of interesting, the kind of point of view on. Because I'm doing your show in a few weeks or in July.

[Seth Meyers]

For the Apple show.

[Marc Maron]

For the. No, it's gonna be for the special.

[Seth Meyers]

Oh, for the special. Gotcha. When's the Apple show coming out?

[Marc Maron]

June 4th.

[Seth Meyers]

Okay. Gotcha. So you're Coming for the special?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I wanted to come. I want to do all of them. But you guys are also weird about that.

[Seth Meyers]

We're not weird at all. I will say the 12:30 shows.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

If you're, let's say, doing well, I'm.

[Marc Maron]

Only doing you and Jimmy.

[Seth Meyers]

Okay, great.

[Marc Maron]

But I had to break that up by a month or two, but that's fine.

[Seth Meyers]

But, like, that wasn't that. It wasn't. I'm sure that didn't come from us.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know where it comes from.

[Seth Meyers]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

But in my mind, I'm like, dude, I'm a great guest.

[Seth Meyers]

You're a great guest.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm like, I don't have to do the same stories.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, you can talk about anything.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I mean, it's like. Can you take that into consideration? Jesus. Yeah, no, whatever.

[Seth Meyers]

I also think that that seems like a. An unwritten rule from a bygone era.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Like, you know, it used to be that maybe, like. Right.

[Marc Maron]

Me too.

[Seth Meyers]

If somebody was on Leno and then the next night they were on Conan, you'd think, oh, gosh, Conan's got to get. You know.

[Marc Maron]

No, I think that. I think that's exactly true. It's like, why do you, like. How many. How many people are there that go. Can go around?

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, but.

[Marc Maron]

But I'm like, come on. God damn it.

[Seth Meyers]

God damn it. No, but, like, you're coming.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, thank you. But in terms of, like, hosts, it's just interesting because you do a thing where you're clearly listening, you're engaged, and you. You move, you know, your curiosity kind of, you know, drives you into places with the guests that, you know, and you're. You're funny. And then there's like. But you. But you're very grounded, but you're engaged. And then, like, with Fallon, you just realize, like, when you look at him, you're like, I gotta make him laugh.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, I think. But that's a good audience, too. He's a great audience.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, but that's the whole thing.

[Seth Meyers]

But it's funny, you know, I love doing Jimmy's show because I think that as well. Like, you.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You realize, like, oh, different muscle. Here we go.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like. Cause he's kind of waiting.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, but it's great.

[Marc Maron]

I know. It's great. Like, what's gonna happen?

[Seth Meyers]

But he was also, like. I mean, he was. He was that at SNL as well. Like, a really good audience. And so I. Oh, really? You know, I do feel this way, which is that once the guest Shows up. I feel like the hard part of my show is over.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, especially most of the time, you know. Yeah, most of the time. There's obviously exceptions, but in general, I think if you approach it as, now I'm just gonna have fun with interesting people.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, no. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And don't put too much on it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. But, like, as from doing this kind of thing, there are those moments where you're that guy. And then, you know, after about a minute, you're like, okay.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, I mean, with a long road ahead. Because that's the other thing.

[Marc Maron]

You have to lift this one up a bit.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, that's because, again, it's like. It's like running wind. My Show's Wind Sprints vs. A Marathon. You know, at any given point, I can always say to myself, it's only eight minutes.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, that's. Oh, that's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Or 10, whatever.

[Marc Maron]

But, yeah, if someone shut me out eight minutes in, I'm like. Because I have this, like, therapist brain about it. I'm like, we're here for an hour. That's what the time is, at least.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And we're going to do that.

[Seth Meyers]

We're going to do the hour.

[Marc Maron]

And that helps me. You know what I mean? I don't. I don't think I'm a therapist, but I do have this idea, like, all right, well, you know, figure out a way. And then, like, But. And then, like. But I'm just talking about the other late show host, like, Kimmel. When you sit with him, like, you know, he's. He's almost like. It's different because he's sort of dug in. He's almost like Letterman was, you know, later on, where he's so dug in and he's there and he'll save you, you know, but, you know, he's not going to come get you.

[Seth Meyers]

No, but he also. I've only done it once.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And I'm going to do it again this week. And so with a very small sample size, I think he gives this impression to you of whatever's fine.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, don't. This is.

[Marc Maron]

Don't freak out.

[Seth Meyers]

It's all going to be fine.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

So.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And, you know, I won't name names, but, like, early on, like, you know, it's amazing how, whatever. When I started doing this, you would talk to segment producers, and they might. They'd be like, got anything else?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, dude.

[Seth Meyers]

And you're just like, this is. This is the only life I'm living.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I mean, when I used to get on the phone, Frank Smiley for Conan, like, I. Because they'd call me on, you know, when they'd have fallouts because they knew that I just, I would sit on panel and have something. Yeah. But I would get on the phone with Smiley and I'd be pacing around my apartment, New York, sweating, and I'd be like, okay, I'm telling a story. And then I'd finish it. And then I just hear Smiley go, what else you got?

[Seth Meyers]

God damn it.

[Marc Maron]

And like, oh, my God. And then Ferguson used to have Bart call you and be like, so where were you born? I'm like, what are we doing? How far back do you want to go? But people have gotten looser.

[Seth Meyers]

They've gotten looser. And I think mostly because they realized, what are we doing?

[Marc Maron]

Really? I think, what do you got? What do your guys do?

[Seth Meyers]

You know, the part of the process that I do want to give a shout out to is our researchers. I said that weird. But our researchers do. I was like, that's not how you say. But researchers. So they, I wanted to say it again so people knew. I didn't think that's how you said it. They make sure that we're not asking people things they've been asked before. Recently as well. Usually, you know, we are getting people, if they're on a tour, we're getting them after they've done one, if not two of the 11:30 shows. So we're. And then, you know, our segment producers talk on the phone. But we try to bring a lot of. To it as opposed to, what do you got? We're like, hey, we heard, you know, we read this really funny story in print.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Or you do the. Are you. Have you talked about the this?

[Seth Meyers]

Yes. And, and so we try to, you know, we try to, like, you know, but again, it's. There's a, you know, as you've learned doing this, there's all these different kinds of guests. There's people who, like, they need very little help.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And there's some people who want to pretend like it's not going out in the world and just want to talk to you.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And then there's other people who need.

[Marc Maron]

You know, oh, yeah, they need, like, I want to tell a funny story. Help me tell a funny story. But oh, and then we didn't talk about Colbert. Now, Colbert, when I do his show, which I've done a couple times, they're like, because I have a, I have the ability to be pretty Serious.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And sometimes when I'm with him, I'm like, let's not do it. Like, just let me just do the funny thing.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Because I know you're gonna be like, but Mark, you know, I'm like, oh, no, no. It's just.

[Seth Meyers]

But I think that, that one of the truly special and unique things about Steven is his ability to, like, live in that serious place.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I, I think that he, like, I think initially, you know, I think he might have been made to feel uncomfortable with it, but then he just sort of owned it.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

And he's running sort of an old school, kind of intelligent, sort of like curious, creatively curious show there where, like, he owns his Catholicism, he owns his. His disposition.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And he doesn't even, you know, when you, when he's talking, you don't get the feeling, like, I gotta make this funny.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

That's not a priority.

[Seth Meyers]

But he's also, you know, really, you know, quick on his feet, improvising. Totally. So he's, you know, again. But that thing of owning it, you know, it sounds cliche, but ultimately anybody who does one of these things, like, if you can't find your way to your most natural self, it's never gonna work.

[Marc Maron]

Is that true?

[Seth Meyers]

I think so, yeah. I mean, I don't. I don't think. I know the show I'm doing now is like the closest to my skill set that.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I think it's great because, you know, when I first, like when you were doing Update, and then like, you know, and I knew you were a writer and then I knew you were a head writer, that I think that it enables you to be funny in a lot of different ways that you. Like all of the ways that you're capable of being funny.

[Seth Meyers]

It's nice to have a show like ours where there's a lot of real estate to fill and there's a lot of different ways to. And also just, you know, it's so fun to, you know, when I was at snl, when I was a struggling cast member, the amount that I thought, oh, what if I'm an impression guy and try to be like, super precise? And they all stunk. And now, you know, I'm doing. Just tossed off, you know, half baked impression. And because there's joy behind it. Yeah, they actually are working.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, they work. It's just about the sort of. And impressions are weird because, like, I'm a guy that I can do them for like four or five seconds.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, right.

[Marc Maron]

And I'll nail it. But. But beyond that then I'm, I'm second guessing it.

[Seth Meyers]

Like a power lifter. You can't do a lot of reps. That's right.

[Marc Maron]

I just, I can do the one phrase and then, then that's good.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And people like, oh, you should do a whole thing like that. No, I can only do.

[Seth Meyers]

Right. Just little bits.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, little bits. And, and. But I never, I never tried. But that's another part. And do you, do you have that where I'm like, if I get. Just try harder.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, that was the problem of my SNL years when things were going badly. I really thought that, you know, again, funny no one's ever tried, like, funny no one's ever gotten funnier by trying harder.

[Marc Maron]

You know, I guess that's true.

[Seth Meyers]

I mean, you can may, look, you can be more successful, but like, nobody got funnier.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I wonder because, like, there was a point where so much of my comedy was coming out of a frantic, panicky place.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And there was an intensity to it that, that, you know, that wasn't able to sort of detach and just put on a show.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Because I was so.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, driving. But I found that, like, with bleak to dark, you know, for me, like, because I know I'm naturally funny, but like, I'm always envious of people who are physically funny.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Because they're those guys that are just like Will. Or even like an example I always use that people don't. I think it doesn't land with people is Kevin James is oddly, you know, like, if he's just standing there.

[Seth Meyers]

Yep.

[Marc Maron]

It's like, how does that happen? Like, I don't have that. I don't think so. When I had to do that last bit about the bat, killing myself with a bat, I was like, you're doing physical comedy. You have to figure out the beats. And, you know, you gotta, you gotta fucking put it together, man. Whereas, like, a physical comic would just be a no brainer.

[Seth Meyers]

By the time you did it, was it second nature or were you still like, by the time you filmed it, were you still thinking about the beats?

[Marc Maron]

Well, it's like, how many times am I gonna hit myself? That's the funny part. And what am I gonna say after that? I think it's probably basic comedy writing. Like there were points where like, I was like, well, I think two's the limit because three, it's diminishing returns. So I had to make those calculations. But yeah, by the time I did it, I was okay with it.

[Seth Meyers]

That's good. Cause it didn't seem like you were overthinking it.

[Marc Maron]

No, no. But. But I had to deliberately say, like, this is physical. You can't be self conscious about it. And there is something funny about hitting yourself with a bat.

[Seth Meyers]

There's two things I want to say. One, I think that when I picture the physicality of comedians.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

You are one of the easiest to picture. Like, when I think of you on a stool, that is a physical choice.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And that is sort of a trademark choice. And so even though it's not wildly physical, I do think a lot of how you look.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Is assisting your comedy.

[Marc Maron]

And because, like, with this new special, I made choices around the stool.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

I was like. Because I've been the pacer. I've been the guy on the edge. And as I get older, I'm like, do a little everything, man. You know, like, pay. If you have an homage in your mind to something that you were before or somebody that influenced you, you know, be aware of it and know that you're doing that you.

[Seth Meyers]

Not to blow what the joke is because it's such a memorable part of your special. But like the turning back and asking about the selfie moment, was that overthought or was that natural in your. While you were playing it out as a. Cause again, you're retelling a story.

[Marc Maron]

Yes, I'm retelling a story that. But I had to frame. That was a framing issue.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Because, you know, it's. It's an.

[Seth Meyers]

It's.

[Marc Maron]

It's not. It turns out it's not an unusual thing, people taking selfies with their. Their newly passed people. And oddly, in the 1800s, it was a very popular form of portrait photography because, you know, dead people were some of the only people that would come out clear in pictures.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Because you had to leave the aperture open so long. So there's this. A tremendous trend in memorial photographs. And. But that. That aside, I had to frame that as like, this is. This is not what I really thought. But this was the first funny thought I had.

[Seth Meyers]

But there is a nice, you know. Cause then the delivery.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, yeah, no, no, I. Punchline. But that's the thing is I did know the natural timing of it because, like, even if you're gonna physicalize something, you know, you've gotta have a sense of timing to know when to drop that beat and that. You can't learn that. But there was. You definitely, you know, through working it out, which I guess you don't really get the opportunity to do on a sketch show. Like, you know, I could, you know, kind of figure out what's the distance before I'm gonna drop that thing. And knowing that it was gonna be like, what the fuck? So, you know, you can get greedy with that.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

But it definitely was worked out.

[Seth Meyers]

I had. I'm very proud of something, which is I had a physical bit that worked in my special that I came up with the night of.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, good.

[Seth Meyers]

The floor night before. Cause we did do it two nights before we taped it, but just because of. Not here in shoes. We put carpet down at the vic. And I have a bit about how I hate how my kids roll dice because they can't keep two dice on the table to save their lives. And just. And so. And then I was like, in the moment, I realized, oh, you know, I would never want to lie down on a floor because I feel like I get covered in dust. There's carpet here. And so I basically, in the fly was like, this is my impression of me playing dice with my kids. And I just lied down and tried, like, reaching my fingers. Yeah. And again, if I had thought about it ahead of time, I think because of the same aversion to trying to be physical, I would say, ah, that, you know, nobody wants to see me do that. But because it was so natural.

[Marc Maron]

You were in it.

[Seth Meyers]

It was really fun.

[Marc Maron]

It's. That's the best.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. And then the other best, I said to my wife, yeah, I did it because, you know, I was like, oh, a carpet.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And then she's like, that a carpet is so much dirtier than a floor. And I'm like, I think you're. That's not what this is.

[Marc Maron]

Not when they just put it down.

[Seth Meyers]

That's new.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

This is hbo.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I did a thing where. And I seem to always do it working towards a special where everything's pretty fluid. You know, I was very confident about all the bits, but there was a couple of things that tagged themselves, like, days before, like, after I'd been doing this shit for a year and a half and I was. It was that. Because that's. I'm not. I don't write like you. Like, I have to wait for things to be delivered. I have a thing that's funny enough to do, but I know it's going to get funnier when it's delivered to me.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And I don't know when that's gonna happen or where it comes from.

[Seth Meyers]

If you had to pick, like. Cause obviously the problem with a special is you have to pick one moment to catch Every joke at the same time. And ultimately some jokes are in their ascendancy and some jokes have maybe already peaked and you feel like they're just whatever. You don't have the same. When do you think is the perfect time if you could film one of your jokes? Like the 20th time you do it, the 10th time you do it? Or are your jokes different? And you sort of always.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I always. Because they're long form. Like there's. I don't know, man. Like if I have a long piece, like I did one on John Oliver's when he hosted that Stand Up Special thing. It took me months to put it together. It was a long piece about being on a plane and there was a lot of physicality and a lot of different voices. It took me forever to make that thing work. And then I do it on his show and you have this mindset where I'm like, well, that's done. Like that's out there. But I think for me, if I don't get tired of them, I get tired of short form jokes.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So because like it's like, oh, that works. It's like a math problem. Like A plus B equals haha. And you're like, how many times is that going to be satisfying?

[Seth Meyers]

Right. Whereas the story, you can always hang new stuff on it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah. And so. But I came up with a punchline for something like two days before the special. And I've been doing the joke for a while.

[Seth Meyers]

But then. That's so exciting. Right?

[Marc Maron]

It's the best because it was. I had a line there before and it was okay, but this was like, that's the button. But there's part of me that always thinks like, why can't I just write like regular people and sit and you know, make choices on paper and be.

[Seth Meyers]

I mean, the one thing I'm confident of is you at this point know the process that works best for you.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. But it's like, it would be so much easier.

[Seth Meyers]

Sure. But if you, if you. I think like we all find our. If we're capable of an easier way, we go to it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Well, I did this whole. I came up with this line that was like such a beautiful kind of moment, was like, I do talk about the, the problem with progressives in general.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

You know, like, you know, single issue, single issue obsessed progressives that, you know, are not really. We're all disconnected from any unifying left because it doesn't exist. Yeah. So they get very passionate about one thing and then they fight about it with each Other, you know, and.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah, it's sad and true.

[Marc Maron]

And, you know, and I. I kind of explore that because I know my audience and I made a. A very clear decision in this special to play to them because no one's doing it. And the people that are playing to the right claim they're not because either they don't know it or they just think that this whole anti woke thing is really a censorship thing and they're duped. But nonetheless, after I kind of explored the progressive sort of nitpicky stuff I said, we actually annoyed the average American into fascism.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, that is so funny, because as much as people talk about, like, everybody's too sensitive now, like, literally they were so sensitive to certain progressive issues that they were like.

[Marc Maron]

Well, they. Because they were. They. They were platformed.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And. And. And just like the disconnect was so extreme that, you know, and it gave them something to be mad at.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. It's a. It's a shame how happy people are when they're angry. It's a real problem.

[Marc Maron]

It's very satisfying, I think.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Let's talk about Nathan Fielder.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Have you watched the rehearsal?

[Seth Meyers]

I haven't started this season. I apologize.

[Marc Maron]

Okay.

[Seth Meyers]

You know what? Can I just say, I'm very excited and I've had a hard time finding the time.

[Marc Maron]

I'm so mad that I have to say this, but I think he's a genius.

[Seth Meyers]

He is. I mean, I think. I really think he is. And I just. My YouTube algorithm will point me back to Nathan for use. He did the funniest thing. He came on my show.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And he said he had just done Kimmel and he had used his one anecdote, but he thinks it's good enough that he can just do it again. And I mean that. Again, that's just a very small idea. And by saying it, you know exactly how he delivered it. And it worked so well. He's so very funny.

[Marc Maron]

The thing. Okay, so you haven't seen that, but. Okay, then let's talk about Tim Robinson.

[Seth Meyers]

I mean, Tim Robinson's. It's the best.

[Marc Maron]

But it's so crazy that, like. Because I went and watched a movie.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

And I liked it because, you know, I. I'm a late adapter to him. So, like. Like I was able to watch all of everything he's done at once. Like the Detroiters and the. I think you should leave.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And just take this guy in. But there is something about the particular buffoon he's invented.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

And that he inhabits that somehow speaks to something so human but so specific and not explored that it's just mind blowing.

[Seth Meyers]

Well, I mean, again, we're living in an era where buffoons won't back down.

[Marc Maron]

That's right.

[Seth Meyers]

And so he is, I think, you know, not. I actually wouldn't know the answer to this, but, like, I don't think it's by design. But there is a reason this show is the most perfect show for this era, even though it seems like. And by the way, I believe it would work in any era, but it is so perfect for this time right now. Yeah, it is for me, too. It's so. Is edifying the word. You know, he was. I was at SNL when he was hired as a cast member, and it did not, you know, work the way anybody who is a fan of his thought it should. And I, having been the head writer at the time, felt like I was, you know, mishandling this asset. Like, everybody knew how funny he was, and every table read, he would, you know, crush. In a lot of sketches he tried at snl, not that many, I should say, but, you know, found their way into. I think he should leave. And so for everybody who worked at SNL to see him have this moment, along with Zach Cannon, who's his co writer, it's so lovely, because he's also the best dude in the world. They both are. And for them to find the. I don't know, the moment they weirdly have found their way into the zeitgeist. That's almost beyond what SNL is, because it's so singular.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. And I watched a movie, and everyone's saying how funny it was, and I knew he was gonna be funny. But what was interesting to me is that I wanted more of it in some way. What was interesting is that the risk that you take with that character is that in the sketches, there's something heightened about the dupes around him. You know what I mean? Cause they've all gotta be like, what? But in the movie, there were scenes being played as if they were real life. You know, when there's that scene where it's, like, where she's like, I can't be with a narcissist, and he just is confused. But. But it was almost like taking this. This. This alien and putting him into a real situation where he was, like, being challenged to act like a normal person. And I. You know, there were moments where I'm like, oh, I don't think they're using him as good as they can. But, you know, that's just Me.

[Seth Meyers]

I have excellent news for you.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

He. I've seen the pilot of his HBO show, which is.

[Marc Maron]

This is new.

[Seth Meyers]

This is new.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

And they're. They're filming it now, and I can tell you from watching the pilot, it's everything you just said you wanted more of.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, good.

[Seth Meyers]

I think Friendship's a great movie.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. It's fun.

[Seth Meyers]

But this show is. I've always said those sketches are so hard to predict because I feel like a classic sketch structure is like A beat, then B beat, then C beat. And I feel like his sketch is like, A beat, then J beat, then, like, double Q beat.

[Marc Maron]

Like, you might not get to see.

[Seth Meyers]

Right. But the leaps are so long. But if you could see all the beats, they didn't show you. They do connect. Like, it all makes logical sense, but they just get so bored with the premise that they're like, we're gonna jump way ahead. And so I just feel as though they're just like.

[Marc Maron]

But him and Fielder, I think, are just mining something.

[Seth Meyers]

It's really cool.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Even just, like, him eating a hot dog out of his sleep. Have you watched the Flower?

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

It's crazy.

[Seth Meyers]

And it's so.

[Marc Maron]

It's so funny as a. And I'm a guy that, like, had to expand my mind when it comes to comedy because, like, Fielder, initially, I just found him annoying. And then, like, you know, all of a sudden with this season, the rehearsal, having watched a lot of his other stuff and all the other ones, I was like, oh, my God, this thing is working on so many levels, I can't even wrap my brain around it. And then to be able to enjoy that is a. Is sort of a big leap for me that I. You know, for me to get out from under the sort of, like. Well, if I just focus, I could probably do something like, you know, like, the resentment over. Based on what? Insecurity, and just enjoy things. Is a big, big deal.

[Seth Meyers]

It's great.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. And with Tim, it's just sort of like, what the fuck?

[Seth Meyers]

I. The one. For me, I'm gonna get my seasons wrong. Maybe it was season two, Coffin Flop, you know, that it was the TV show about bodies falling out of coffin. And I remember watching it, and my first instinct was, I cannot wait to show this to my dad, who had, you know, introduced me to early SNL and Monty Python. And there was something about Coffin Flop that I just knew. Oh, this is forever funny.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

This is an. First of all. I know it's never existed before, and yet whenever somebody came up with this idea, it would have been funny. And it was so fun to show it to my dad and have him laugh so hard at Coffin Flux.

[Marc Maron]

There's so, it's, it's so rare that that happens. You ever seen that one with Eric Andre trying to get his phone out of the gorilla cage?

[Seth Meyers]

Uh huh.

[Marc Maron]

Oh my God.

[Seth Meyers]

It is. I mean, I think one of the things about Nathan, certainly Eric, certainly Tim. One of the things that makes it so easy to enjoy is knowing that you're not, you weren't adjacent to having the same idea.

[Marc Maron]

Never, you know, never.

[Seth Meyers]

And so part of, I mean, part of it I think is, you know, getting older.

[Marc Maron]

And that's a good way to frame resentment. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

This is completely out of my wheelhouse.

[Seth Meyers]

If you'd had a million tries.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Seth Meyers]

Even if somebody had said, here's the, the title is Coffin Flop. Write a Million Sketches, you're not going.

[Marc Maron]

To come up with it. Yeah. That's a good way to look at it. Yeah, I appreciate that. That'll probably help me in my life.

[Seth Meyers]

I hope so.

[Marc Maron]

It's good talking to you, man.

[Seth Meyers]

It's great talking to you too. What a delight.

[Marc Maron]

And I hope you win.

[Seth Meyers]

You know what? Even if I don't, the genuine way you said that is victory enough.

[Marc Maron]

I know we're all sort of competitive and we want to win. And I say that from a long history of not winning anything.

[Seth Meyers]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

But I do, I hope, if it's.

[Seth Meyers]

Important to you, I would be lovely to be nominated. I would have no expectation of our show winning.

[Marc Maron]

Okay. But nominating be good.

[Seth Meyers]

I'm excited to see your Apple show too.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, well, that was, you know, I play. It wasn't a stretch for me, but I hope it all come together. Okay. You know, it's sort of acting's weird with me. Cause I really have a hard time sitting around.

[Seth Meyers]

Can I venture that Owen's an easy person to act with?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Well, he's one of those guys where when you're with him, you know, of course I know Owen from the movies. And when you're with him, you know, he's kind of that guy. But then when you watch, even watching these trailers of the show, I haven't seen, really seen a whole episode, I'm like, oh my God. Like he, you know, there's some people that just fit on screen.

[Seth Meyers]

Yeah. They just know.

[Marc Maron]

And it's just like, it just is what it is. And you know, and I'm being, you.

[Seth Meyers]

Know, he's like, hey, man, just like that thing of. Yeah, they understand how cameras work. Whereas I think the best you and I have ever done is we understand how audiences work.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, exactly. And I'm. I'm always like, you know, for me to, like, get ready to shoot a scene and just, you know, remember to be like, all right, which camera is it? Like, I don't even know. Yeah, A lot of times I'm not even thinking about that.

[Seth Meyers]

You know, you're a bad actor when you're worried. Like, I gotta be loud enough.

[Marc Maron]

You're not even supposed to be loud.

[Seth Meyers]

All the act.

[Marc Maron]

All the actors I work with, they're like, hey, man. And I'm like, what's going on? Well, I haven't. I haven't got a handle on that part, but I'll work.

[Seth Meyers]

We'll get it. Once this show stops, you'll recommit it.

[Marc Maron]

Exactly. I'm really lean in. Thanks, man.

[Seth Meyers]

Bye, buddy.

[Marc Maron]

That was fun. I think I'm gonna be on Seth on Seth. Seth's. That's a tough one for a guy with a lisp. And Seth. I think I'm gonna be on Seth's show in July. And again, you can find family trips with the Myers brothers and the Loneliness. Lee island and Seth Meyers podcasts are both available wherever you get your pods. Late Night with Seth Meyers is on NBC. And Peacock. Hang out for a minute, folks. Guys, close your eyes and imagine what you'll look like six months from now. Even if you've got thinning hair, maybe you think it looks the same or maybe you picture even less on top. Well, if you start using HIMS right now, you should be picturing yourself with thicker, fuller hair in anywhere from 3 to 6 months. HIMS provides you with convenient access to a range of hair loss treatments at work, all from the comfort of your couch. These are hair loss solutions that use clinically proven ingredients like finasteride and minoxidil. You just answer a few questions and a medical provider will determine if treatment is right for you. If prescribed, your treatment is sent directly to you for free. Start your free online Visit [e-mail] WTF that's hims.com WTF for your personalized hair loss treatment options. Hisss.com WTF results vary based on studies of topical and oral minoxidil and finasteride. Prescription products require an online consultation with a healthcare provider who will determine if a prescription is appropriate. Restrictions apply. See website for full details and important safety information. Hey, folks, on Thursday, I talked to Mike Birbiglia once again, if you have a WTF plus subscription, you can go listen to episode 200 where Mike interviewed me. All right, let's do this.

[Seth Meyers]

What the fuckers?

[Marc Maron]

What the fuck, buddies? What the fuck? Nuts.

[Seth Meyers]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

What the fuck? Are not. Yeah, right. I'm Mike Birbiglia, and I'm filling in this week for Mark Maron, who is not available to host, but he is available for an exclusive interview. He's going to. I'm going to interview him this week. I think that went pretty well.

[Seth Meyers]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

I'm not gonna chime in like that. You know, it's your show from here on out, okay? I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna sabotage it. That's from episode 200. You can listen to every WTF episode ad free by signing up for WTF Plus. Just go to the link in the episode description or go to wtfpod.com and click on WTF Plus. And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by acast. Here's a little interpretation of Jigsaw Puzzle, Boomer Lives Monkey and La Fonda Cat Angels Everywhere.