Episode 1656 - Mariska Hargitay - WTF with Marc Maron Podcast

Summary3 min read

WTF with Marc Maron Podcast
Episode 1656: Mariska Hargitay
Release Date: June 30, 2025

In this deeply personal and emotionally charged episode, comedian and podcaster Marc Maron engages in a profound conversation with Mariska Hargitay, best known for her role as Olivia Benson on "Law & Order: Special Victims Unit" (SVU). The discussion delves into Mariska's latest endeavor—a heartfelt HBO documentary titled "My Mom Jane", which explores her relationship with her late mother, Jane Mansfield, and the complex family dynamics that ensued following a tragic car accident.

Introduction to My Mom Jane

Marc Maron sets the stage by introducing Mariska Hargitay and her groundbreaking documentary. He highlights Mariska's exploration of personal identity and familial revelations, which stem from both surprising discoveries and introspective experiences.

Notable Quote:
"My Mom Jane is about learning who you are through revelations that are either surprising, informational, or through your own aging and experience with your parents."
— Marc Maron [12:00]

The Impact of Personal Trauma

Mariska opens up about her journey dealing with the aftermath of her mother's death in a car accident when she was just a child. She shares how this event led to her father, Mickey Hargitay, compartmentalizing the trauma, which significantly affected the family dynamics.

Notable Quote:
"I feel like I have two fathers, that I have two men that loved me in a paternal way."
— Mariska Hargitay [73:47]

Exploring Therapy and Self-Discovery

The conversation shifts to Mariska's experiences with therapy, including techniques like EMDR and internal family systems. She discusses how these methods helped her integrate different parts of herself, leading to profound personal growth and healing.

Notable Quote:
"Self-parenting is essential. When you honor what the different parts of yourself are saying, they calm down."
— Mariska Hargitay [24:53]

Uncovering Family Secrets

Mariska recounts the discovery of letters and fan mail that revealed her existence to her biological father, Nelson Sardelli. This revelation sparked a five-year journey of identity crisis, culminating in meeting him and understanding his reasons for staying distant.

Notable Quote:
"Everything has been reframed for me. I understand him, and I'm grateful for that."
— Mariska Hargitay [70:43]

The Dichotomy of Her Upbringing

Mariska reflects on the contrasting influences of her father and stepmother. While her father embodied stability and determination, her stepmother represented strict social mores and presentational etiquette, creating a complex emotional landscape for Mariska.

Notable Quote:
"The messaging from my father and from my grandmother were diametrically opposed."
— Mariska Hargitay [42:13]

Legacy and Reclamation

Through "My Mom Jane", Mariska seeks to reclaim her mother's legacy, understanding the cultural and personal struggles Jane faced as an icon. She emphasizes the importance of not confining individuals to societal boxes and honoring their true selves.

Notable Quote:
"This is what I mean about integrating all these pieces… I really excise this [her mother's story]. So to reintegrate her and understand her and love her."
— Mariska Hargitay [38:33]

The Healing Power of Truth

Mariska discusses how uncovering and confronting family truths have been instrumental in her healing process. She highlights the mutual respect and newfound love between her and Nelson Sardelli, underscoring the documentary's role as a love letter to her father.

Notable Quote:
"When Nelson tells you why he made the choice he did, it heals my heart."
— Mariska Hargitay [65:38]

Reflections on Identity and Family

The episode concludes with Mariska sharing her feelings of dual motherhood and fatherhood, appreciating the love and support from both her biological and stepfather. She underscores the universality of her story, hoping it resonates with listeners facing their own familial complexities.

Notable Quote:
"This is a movie about my mom and my family, but I hope that it resonates with everyone because you leave there just thinking about your own family."
— Mariska Hargitay [64:36]

Conclusion

Marc Maron and Mariska Hargitay wrap up their conversation by acknowledging the cathartic journey of creating "My Mom Jane". Mariska expresses gratitude for the understanding and revelations that came from making the documentary, while Marc reflects on the profound human drama that unfolded.

Notable Quote:
"It's so profound that you could find this true, kind of tragic, but elevating human story."
— Marc Maron [74:40]

This episode offers listeners an intimate glimpse into Mariska Hargitay's personal life, her quest for identity, and the healing power of uncovering and embracing the truth. It underscores the complexities of family relationships and the enduring impact of parental love and sacrifice.

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Transcript533 lines

[00:01]
Marc Maron
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That's Q U I N C E.com wtf to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quint.com wtf all right, let's do this. How are you? What the what the Buddies? What the Nicks? What's happening? I'm Mark Marin. This is my podcast, folks. Hope you're doing okay. Seriously. Today on the show is very exciting, actually. I talked to Mariska Hargitay. Now, a lot of you know her as Olivia Benson on Law and Order. She's played that role since 1999. And it is Olivia is the longest running character on the longest running American primetime drama in history. She's won an Emmy and a Golden Globe for that. But she's here to talk about this amazing documentary that I found very impactful and also just, you know, about learning who you are through revelations that are either surprising, either they're informational or they're just, you know, through your own aging and experience with your parents. And it's so great. It's called My Mom Jane and it's about her mother, Jane Mansfield. Before I get into it, I'll be at Largo for a comedy and music show with the band. Some new people this time I'm playing with some new people. Try that out. They say that's good to do. That's Wednesday, July 23rd. Tickets are at largo-la.com Also, the date of my HBO special, Marc Maron Panicked was announced. It premieres August 1st at 8pm on HBO and on Max. Okay, now I'll throw To her. I'm kind of sweating out here in my studio right now. I just got back from New Mexico where I was with my dad for a day or two, few days, hanging out in the hometown with some old pals. Saw the old man Revelations, folks. Revelations. Not biblical, but those seem to be abound. Those abound. You know, that book of the New Testament there being one of the older conspiracy theories, it is sort of disconcerting when those events seem to be unfolding before our eyes, huh? Hard not to go mystical. I mean, I imagine, though, because of those kind of stories, the Bible is probably one of the foundational forces in the untethering of the human mind from engaging in the mundane truths of the human condition and current politics. Huh? How's this for some quality yammering? So look, outside of processing the, the terrifying excitement of the new wild American authoritarianism, I. I try to keep grounded, folks. I try to keep grounded in the human component of my current life that is continually unfolding, friends. You know, I don't know. And obviously as the unfolding, you know, plows along, it becomes a bit more finite, you know, I mean, there is the infinite unfolding of the post life mystery, but I think we can rest assured it is a forever kind of thing. Probably an unconscious vacuum of nothingness, but who knows? Maybe a. Maybe a little more exciting than that. I don't know. I doubt it, but I don't know. All right, so here on the ground, my trip to Albuquerque the last few days, you know, spending time with the old man and friends I've known most of my life. I guess I talk about this every time I make this trip. I'm not sure that each time my observations are that much different. But, you know, I was there with the dad with the dementia, and surprisingly, he's remained somewhat stable in terms of, you know, like, knowing me and being able to engage, you know, pretty well. Pretty well. It does seem like the. It does seem like his past is blurring or melding into like one big event. Things are not in context. There's not much of a timeline, and many memories seem to be kind of mashed together, which makes it kind of poetic. I swear it's still all the way you look at this, but there is a baseline, you know, to who he is. You know, that's very. That's very intact. And because there's not a lot of noise around it in the form of kind of cogent, consistent thinking, it's kind of easier for me to kind of look at it plainly. And it's a bit disturbing, but it is revelatory. Every time I see him, it kind of reveals something about who he is and was innately. It could be a cautionary tale, though. I'm getting a little old, so it's less a cautionary tale than enlightening because, you know, I mean, a lot of the stuff that I have found in myself that were his or of him that were negative, I've tried to. To kind of get a handle on it. You know, I'm trying to. I'm trying to kind of put a stop to those if I can. I actually talk at length about this somewhat in my. My upcoming special, but it's just. I don't know, it's kind of, you know, just getting to know him on this level where it's kind of pure, you know, out of nowhere, he. This was not this time I saw him at the last time. I don't know if I told you this. Out of nowhere, he just says, well, look, you got to take the consequences or make up your own. To me, that was some sort of amazing key, some sort of amazing puzzle piece. But, you know, the fact that he's got no one to talk to or wants to talk to, he's got nothing he really wants to do or enjoys doing. You know, he just. He just sits there, and he was always pretty heady, but he just sits there. And I don't know what's floating around his head, but, you know, you ask him, what are you doing? He's like, nothing. You want to do anything? Nope. And again, this isn't just the dementia. This is some sort of core part of his being. And I feel that. I mean, I don't know. But as a creative person or an impulsive person or somebody who has to put their voice out there, you know, I mean, a lot of times I've got to force myself to do it because there is a sort of like, yeah, what's the point? What is the point? That's the selfish part of it. The point is engaging with others. And I wish he was talking more to people. I mean, it was kind of good this time because, you know, he. When I'm around, he, you know, he'll. You know, he's impressed with me. He appreciates my mind, he appreciates my life. You know, he's kind of surrendered to that, you know, probably because of age and dimension. Just the fact that, like, I guess I'm kind of impressive. So a lot of the bullshit that used to give us trouble is kind of, you know, passed us by, and he can listen. And he was responding. And he has ideas, you know, and if he does, he'll repeat them again and again. Like, I showed him the documentary about me. And then for three days, he's like, oh, my God, what a terrible thing to happen to you. Why'd that lady have to die? Just terrible. Jesus, Mark. So many terrible things have happened to you that got repeated a lot, which isn't great, but, you know, he was remembering at least. And sometimes there's something about some parents, and my dad in particular, that no matter how proud he is of me or what I've done with my life, there's some part of him that thinks he's got suggestions, and they're not really career suggestions. You know, just out of nowhere he said, you know, you should start a company. I don't even know. I don't know if there was more to it than that. I don't know what kind of company that would be. He feels like I should build my own theater. And he still hangs on to that. That's an old idea. His. You should have your own place for this stuff. And then he got very preoccupied with getting the documentary out there. You're doing everything you can to make this thing get out there. You're doing everything you can. It's like. It's too much. But he's. He's. He's gotten pretty soft, and he's all, you know, pretty fragile, pretty vulnerable. And even with all the other stuff that I'm noticing, I'm glad that I have this time with him and that I. And I take advantage of that. So I'm very excited that Mariska Hargitay is here. This HBO documentary she directed, My Mom Jane, is streaming on Max. And it's really great. It really is great. It's quite a life here. And she found something out and kind of moved through it with her family. It's just great. And this is me and Mariska talking. Hey, folks, if you're running a business, you know that every time you miss a call, you're leaving money on the table. Every conversation with a customer matters. So you need a phone system that keeps up and helps you stay connected. That's why you need Open openphone. Openphone is the number one business phone system that streamlines and scales your customer communications. With OpenPhone, your team can share one number and collaborate on customer calls and texts, like a shared inbox. So whether you're a one person operation drowning in calls and texts, or if you have a large team that needs better collaboration tools. OpenPhone is a no brainer. See why more than 60,000 businesses trust OpenPhone. OpenPhone is offering WTF listeners 20% off your first six months at openphone.com WTF? That's O P E N P-H-O-N-E.com WTF and if you have existing numbers with another service, OpenPhone will move them over at no extra charge. Open Phone no missed calls, no missed customers. Guys, close your eyes and imagine what you'll look like six months from now. Even if you've got thinning hair, maybe you think it looks the same or maybe you picture even less on top. Well, if you start using HIMS right now, you should be picturing yourself with thicker, fuller hair in anywhere from 3 to 6 months. HIMS provides you with convenient access to a range of hair loss treatments at work, all from the comfort of your couch. These are hair loss solutions that use clinically proven ingredients like finasteride and minoxidil. You just answer a few questions and a medical provider will determine if treatment is right for you. If prescribed, your treatment is sent directly to you for free. Start your free online Visit today@hisss.com WTF that's H I M S.com WTF for your personalized hair loss treatment options. Hiss.com WTF results vary based on studies of topical and oral minoxidil and finasteride. Prescription products require an online consultation with a health care provider who will determine if a prescription is appropriate. Restrictions apply. See website for full details and important safety information. So you read the article about my show?
[12:43]
Mariska Hargitay
I did, Yeah, I did. I read it with such understanding and perspective because there's been so many times when I thought that exact same thing.
[12:56]
Marc Maron
Well, yeah, I think it's just a matter of wondering. And I'm sure you've dealt with this on many levels that, you know, who are you without it? Yeah. And I mean, it's not so much an identity thing, but it is sort of like too much time to think. Like, you know, are you ever gonna, like, I don't really know what's gonna happen without this thing because it's a big part of my social life in the sense that I talk to, you know, people twice a week and they're, you know, they're pretty thorough and deep conversations, some of them. So there's that.
[13:27]
Mariska Hargitay
That's what resonated with me the most.
[13:29]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[13:29]
Mariska Hargitay
Is the deep conversations. Because I thought. Sorry to interrupt. But when I read. When I listened to your podcast with your ex girlfriend, Moon.
[13:42]
Marc Maron
Oh, wow.
[13:43]
Mariska Hargitay
I know. It was. It was a crazy moment.
[13:45]
Marc Maron
You know her.
[13:45]
Mariska Hargitay
I don't, but I was on a plane and I was listening to it and I thought, I love that we're going there. I love that we're just going in, because it's so human. And I thought, when you go through that sort of cycle with somebody, it's so fulfilling.
[14:01]
Marc Maron
Right.
[14:02]
Mariska Hargitay
To have a real connection with somebody.
[14:03]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[14:04]
Mariska Hargitay
And then I thought, wow, that's gonna be the change for you.
[14:08]
Marc Maron
Where's that? Well, yeah, it's interesting. Well, with her, there was nowhere else to go. I mean, it was all very surprising because we had been through some stuff and we never really talked about it. So that was. Yeah. I mean, she's an astronaut of that stuff. She'll go there.
[14:24]
Mariska Hargitay
She lives there.
[14:26]
Marc Maron
But I think that was a unique one. But all of them seem to be connected. It's a very odd thing because I talk to people and then after I talk to people here, I'm always like, are we gonna be friends? Is that.
[14:36]
Mariska Hargitay
I get that I'm like that.
[14:38]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Really?
[14:38]
Mariska Hargitay
Very much so. So much so that I thought maybe that's what I need to do next, is the podcast. Yeah. Well, just. Cause I like going in and getting in there.
[14:46]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Jump on board.
[14:47]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. Maybe I should take over for you.
[14:48]
Marc Maron
Yeah. You want to just come here and do it? Yeah. I watched a doc, you know. Yeah, of course I did. It was like, great.
[14:57]
Mariska Hargitay
Thank you.
[14:57]
Marc Maron
It's crazy.
[14:58]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[14:59]
Marc Maron
The whole thing is crazy and how you put it and like, it's taken you this long to put it all together.
[15:05]
Mariska Hargitay
I feel. Truly feel like I've been preparing for this moment for my entire life to.
[15:11]
Marc Maron
Put the doc together. Yeah. Well, I mean. I mean, you're real show bizarre.
[15:17]
Mariska Hargitay
No. Look at the real deal, like, pedigree and everything.
[15:20]
Marc Maron
But it's true. It's kind of amazing how much about your mother that I didn't know. It's not my time. It wasn't your time. And you really don't realize her position in culture and in show business and kind of what she went through and then being the legacy of that, but not having any relationship with her, it's just. What was it like to, like, get in there and really research her? How did you even do that?
[15:51]
Mariska Hargitay
I just jumped in. I've been. My best friend always says about me, I'm the kind of person that's ready, shoot, aim. Like, I just. If I'm gonna do it, I just do it. I go.
[16:00]
Marc Maron
That's how. From early on though, you knew she was your mom, Right?
[16:04]
Mariska Hargitay
Of course.
[16:05]
Marc Maron
And, you know, it seemed like when you discussed it, that you had mixed feelings about it as. As you got old enough to understand.
[16:13]
Mariska Hargitay
Well, not only mixed feelings. I. As I said, I separated myself. That's why it's funny, you hear the. You know, you said your pedigree. Yeah, I grew up, you said. Did I say it?
[16:26]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[16:26]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. All right.
[16:26]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[16:27]
Mariska Hargitay
Okay. Well, you know, I'm getting older. I can't remember who said what, but I grew up in such a non showbiz environment, really. My stepmother was a flight attendant. My dad was a builder. And Mickey. Mickey, Mickey. He built houses.
[16:45]
Marc Maron
I just talked to somebody who used to go to his plant store.
[16:47]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, that's my brother.
[16:47]
Marc Maron
Oh, that's your brother. Okay, so he's still got that.
[16:49]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, yeah. But the point is that we had such a normal existence and very much away from Hollywood, even though we lived, you know, we lived up in the Bird Streets and up Doheny and stuff, but we never. We just didn't have showbiz friends. My parents weren't really friends with actors or producers or writers in the business, really. And so I just had a very normal existence.
[17:17]
Marc Maron
But wasn't it kind of hanging over you?
[17:19]
Mariska Hargitay
It was very much so hanging over me. I mean, this icon hanging over me that I really wanted no part of.
[17:27]
Marc Maron
Why do you think that I was.
[17:30]
Mariska Hargitay
I just think it was too much.
[17:32]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[17:34]
Mariska Hargitay
It was embarrassing.
[17:35]
Marc Maron
Really?
[17:36]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. I mean, like the sex symbol part of it. You have to understand. I went to St. Paul the Apostle grade school, and then I went to Marymount High School and Catholic schools my whole life.
[17:48]
Marc Maron
Very much Catholic.
[17:49]
Mariska Hargitay
Very much.
[17:50]
Marc Maron
Okay.
[17:51]
Mariska Hargitay
And so it was just too much. And I wanted. It's a very interesting dichotomy because I grew up with this, like, longing.
[18:01]
Marc Maron
Yeah, right.
[18:02]
Mariska Hargitay
To look like my mother, have a normal mother or have somebody. You know, in my school, we had, like, mother, daughter things, and my. Even high school, we had, you know, father daughter things.
[18:14]
Marc Maron
And so it was just sort of like an absence.
[18:16]
Mariska Hargitay
Always.
[18:17]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[18:17]
Mariska Hargitay
This. This absence, this longing.
[18:20]
Marc Maron
And so. And then when it was defined in photographs and films and in culture, you know, the absence of that represented your mother was something you didn't want to have anything to do with that. What was absent was offensive to you somehow?
[18:33]
Mariska Hargitay
A little bit. Yeah. Yeah. So I very much identified with my father.
[18:39]
Marc Maron
Sure.
[18:39]
Mariska Hargitay
And I wanted to be like him in every way. Mickey, very much so. He was solid guy, solid as a rock. Committed, human, focused, determined. Anything in his life, he set out to do. He did it. Athlete, champion mentality.
[18:58]
Marc Maron
Well, he was like a very. I mean, he was sort of in show business.
[19:02]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, he was. Started out, you know, he did a lot of, like, B Westerns in, you know, Rome and stuff like that.
[19:09]
Marc Maron
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[19:10]
Mariska Hargitay
Little things, you know, here and there.
[19:12]
Marc Maron
Spaghetti Western.
[19:13]
Mariska Hargitay
The spaghetti Western.
[19:13]
Marc Maron
And wasn't he a big bodybuilder before bodybuilding was happening?
[19:17]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, I don't know if it was before bodybuilding, but when he came over to America, he went to Indiana and found he was so enamored with weightlifting and bodybuilding. And then he said, I want to try it. And they said, you're too old. And he said, you're too old. And then he went on to become, you know, Mr. America. Mr. America, Mr. World, and then Mr. Universe in 1955.
[19:41]
Marc Maron
It's crazy.
[19:42]
Mariska Hargitay
It's crazy.
[19:43]
Marc Maron
And then, like, okay, so when do you start to, like. At what point did you know that you were in the car with Jayne Mansfield and your mom when she died? I mean, when did you. When did that make sense to you?
[20:03]
Mariska Hargitay
I don't know that there was a time. I think I always knew it because of my scar, and it was just part of the lore.
[20:12]
Marc Maron
Right.
[20:12]
Mariska Hargitay
I think that we always talked about that, you know, that we were in the car with her and we survived.
[20:18]
Marc Maron
Right. But you. But you didn't. There was no. You were three.
[20:22]
Mariska Hargitay
I don't remember it. Yeah, no, of course I don't remember it. I don't remember any of it. Not here.
[20:28]
Marc Maron
Yeah. But in your body.
[20:30]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. I've had a whole journey with that.
[20:33]
Marc Maron
Really? Specifically, like, did you do EMDR and stuff?
[20:38]
Mariska Hargitay
I did emdr. I've done a lot of things. I've done a lot of trauma work, and I've done something called somatic reprocessing.
[20:48]
Marc Maron
Yeah. How does that work?
[20:49]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, it's amazing, actually. It's a thing called internal family systems, and there's a guy named Richard Schwartz, but there's several amazing therapists that do this work. And basically, it is a process where you learn to listen to your body and you let it speak to you and you understand the parts of yourself. Like, I remember being in therapy, you know, one time and going on and on about how great things are. And I said, like, at the end of the session, I was, like, talking about all this great stuff, and I just went from that to, like, then why do I feel like such a loser?
[21:32]
Marc Maron
Loser. Yeah.
[21:33]
Mariska Hargitay
And then she said, well, that sounds like it's another part talking. And I sort of went, what? Or there was times when I'd be in therapy and all of a sudden I would almost fall asleep.
[21:48]
Marc Maron
Right.
[21:49]
Mariska Hargitay
I would say, I'm sorry. I'm so tired. I'm not a great sleeper. And I said, I didn't sleep well last night. And I just, you know, I don't sleep well and I'm really tired. And I was. And then she'd go, no, I think that's your sleepy part. And at first you're like, excuse me, my sleepy part?
[22:04]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Yeah.
[22:04]
Mariska Hargitay
But then every time we would talk or get close to something, it was almost like a narcoleptic where I would. And I have a lot of energy, as you can see. I would all of a sudden be just zero to 60. Like, I'm sorry.
[22:17]
Marc Maron
I was like.
[22:18]
Mariska Hargitay
And I would feel like I was gonna fall asleep.
[22:21]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[22:22]
Mariska Hargitay
And, you know, it was. She explained to me that it was a part of myself that was protect. So when I started having all these physical things happening, it was very clear that we are so complicated. And when you say to somebody, like, part of me totally understands what he did, but the other part of me wants to kill him. Those are real parts. So I started honoring that and understanding myself and understanding how important integration is. And it was life changing to integrate the different parts of yourself and also.
[22:56]
Marc Maron
To bring the trauma into the present. So it's not retriggered in an unidentifiable way.
[23:02]
Mariska Hargitay
Exactly. But also not live in these extremes, but we have to live in the gray. You can't. Like, I'm the greatest person in the world. I'm total loser. Here's the thing.
[23:13]
Marc Maron
I can do it.
[23:15]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. No, no. And you should. Thank you and you should.
[23:17]
Marc Maron
It's part of my job.
[23:18]
Mariska Hargitay
But for me, not so much. No. But when you just learn, like, I'm this person and I've had this trauma, and sometimes I good at my job and I do great things, and I'm a great friend and a great mom and a great wife. And then other times, like, not so much. And I'm just a regular person. And so once you sort of go, oh, comfortable there, like, right in the middle, right in the gray, life starts to get more peaceful and we have more internal space.
[23:48]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[23:49]
Mariska Hargitay
And so that's what this Integration. Integration in the somatic. In the somatic field. And that really just changed my life in such a big way, as did the making of this film.
[24:00]
Marc Maron
Right. But, like. So, like, it would kind of manifest itself as exhaustion or a blank spot or.
[24:09]
Mariska Hargitay
For example. I don't like being in tight places or being trapped. I don't do well being trapped. And you know, those are things that now I can reason with myself or talk to those parts of myself or just have the space. I like to liken these parts like little children that need a little attention. And that's all it is. You just go, I hear you. I'm with you. I have room for you. And you know what? I'm okay now. You're good. You don't have to like panic.
[24:45]
Marc Maron
Yeah. You gotta self parent.
[24:47]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. And if as soon as you give like a kid, as soon as you honor what they're saying, they calm down.
[24:54]
Marc Maron
Huh.
[24:56]
Mariska Hargitay
That is, if I could give one thing to the world, people that have experienced trauma, that's what I would offer.
[25:05]
Marc Maron
And I guess that on some level, because it kind of comes full circle in the documentary that the fact that Mickey, you know, just showed up like you had a family.
[25:19]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, yes.
[25:20]
Marc Maron
And. And it was, it was grounded and you know, this, this thing was going to be in your pre memory, you know, so you didn't have, you know, because it seems like in another situation, psychologically you could have been really hobbled.
[25:35]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[25:35]
Marc Maron
You know, for a long time if you didn't have the family and the support. Do you know after that loss.
[25:41]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, I had the family and the support and.
[25:44]
Marc Maron
And these siblings. You had all these older siblings.
[25:46]
Mariska Hargitay
How great are they?
[25:47]
Marc Maron
They're great.
[25:48]
Mariska Hargitay
No, but aren't you in love with every single one of them? Because I am.
[25:51]
Marc Maron
Well, there's.
[25:51]
Mariska Hargitay
On both sides.
[25:53]
Marc Maron
I'm trying to identify them all. There's.
[25:55]
Mariska Hargitay
There's my older sister Jane, who's from.
[25:57]
Marc Maron
From Jane's first marriage.
[26:00]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes, yes. Then there's Mickey, my older brother who owns the plant shop.
[26:05]
Marc Maron
Right.
[26:05]
Mariska Hargitay
Then there's Zolie. Then my next brother who was sort of the heart who carried the trauma and sort of walked us through what happened.
[26:13]
Marc Maron
And Mickey's his dad too.
[26:15]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes.
[26:16]
Marc Maron
Right. And then there's another one.
[26:17]
Mariska Hargitay
Then there's my little brother Tony, the one who said he's the one with the blue eyes and the blonde hair who said, I don't want to carry it.
[26:24]
Marc Maron
Yeah, yeah. Remember, he's not that much. He's only in it for a few beats.
[26:28]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. Because he and I did not grow up together. He, after my mom died, went to live with his father.
[26:34]
Marc Maron
What's that guy's name?
[26:35]
Mariska Hargitay
Matt Simber.
[26:36]
Marc Maron
Yeah, I think I played him in a show, kind of the show Glow, the Gorgeous Ladies of Wrestling.
[26:42]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, that's funny.
[26:43]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Like I could.
[26:44]
Mariska Hargitay
Six degrees, baby.
[26:45]
Marc Maron
I know. Yeah, I know.
[26:46]
Mariska Hargitay
That's crazy.
[26:47]
Marc Maron
Yeah, it was kind of a bunch of different characters, but he was at the beginning of that. He was the guy that made Glow. The original Glow.
[26:55]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I never. I never saw that.
[26:58]
Marc Maron
It was on Netflix. It's pretty cool. It was kind of a sweet show.
[27:02]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, good.
[27:02]
Marc Maron
It was on for a few seasons, but I realized that it was because I played a kind of a down and out filmmaker who was brought in to manage and direct this gorgeous Ladies of Wrestling.
[27:13]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah, well, they live. He lives in Las Vegas.
[27:18]
Marc Maron
Okay. So are you close with him, though?
[27:20]
Mariska Hargitay
You know, it's interesting. He's my brother and I love him so much. And we both love each other and we.
[27:28]
Marc Maron
Right, right, right.
[27:29]
Mariska Hargitay
And we're, you know, we see some things differently, but, I mean, we're not close like Mickey and Zoli. Cause I wasn't raised with him. We don't have shared perspective at all. And like he said in the movie, you know, he didn't feel very connected to my mom and stuff, so. But yeah, I love him. He loves me, and he's the sweetest.
[27:53]
Marc Maron
And so how old was he when it happened? He was like.
[27:56]
Mariska Hargitay
He was one and not in the car with us.
[28:00]
Marc Maron
Right. They were done. Yeah. So all three of you were in the back?
[28:04]
Mariska Hargitay
Mickey, Zoli, and me?
[28:05]
Marc Maron
Yeah, yeah. Oh, my God.
[28:08]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[28:09]
Marc Maron
So in moving through this story, when you started acting, you were very young?
[28:15]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, when I started acting, I was in high school, and I went to, as I said, all girls, private Catholic high school. And it's such a beautiful story. And this is. So I was more of like an athlete. I was on the swim team, cross country. And then my English teacher, who was a nun, Sister Margaret, suggested to me that she thought that I should try out for a play because I was chatty and I was extroverted. And she was like, how can I channel this? And so she said, mariska, I think you should Maria. Rather I was Maria in high school. I think you should try out for the play. And so I did. It was a French farce called Salad Days, and I had a blast. And then my senior year, I tried out for the play again. And it was a serious, straight play called Women's Work. And that's when I fell in love with it. And that's when I decided to apply to. I applied to SC and ucla. I ended up going to UCLA and became a theater major.
[29:27]
Marc Maron
It's so crazy.
[29:28]
Mariska Hargitay
It's so crazy because before that, zero Interest in being an actor. And I mean, zero, if you would have asked me, I wanted to be a French diplomat because we traveled so much as a family and I loved languages and I loved. I wanted to connect people and I wanted to. I also thought about being an interpreter and again, connecting people. And then I found acting and fell in love with telling stories.
[29:56]
Marc Maron
But it's like. It's genetic.
[29:59]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. Crazy.
[30:01]
Marc Maron
It really is. I mean, because, you know, there are certain families of actors, you know, like the Baldwins and Skarsgrd and like the Fondas. Yeah, the Fondas and the Barrymores. But there is something like. I can't really put my finger on it, but there is something about someone's ability to hold the screen.
[30:19]
Mariska Hargitay
To hold the screen, but also to need to do it. Right.
[30:23]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[30:23]
Mariska Hargitay
I remember my acting teachers were like, if you don't need to act, if you don't need to do it, don't.
[30:30]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[30:31]
Mariska Hargitay
And I remember that really resonated with me.
[30:33]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[30:34]
Mariska Hargitay
Because it is so hard and it's so hard to begin and it's. There's so much rejection and so much that if you don't need it, and.
[30:41]
Marc Maron
Sometimes it's boring and horrible.
[30:43]
Mariska Hargitay
Beyond. Beyond.
[30:46]
Marc Maron
All that trailer time.
[30:47]
Mariska Hargitay
I mean, who can handle that? I mean, come on, I got shit to do.
[30:51]
Marc Maron
Totally.
[30:52]
Mariska Hargitay
But you know, the thing is about the trailer time. You can be.
[30:56]
Marc Maron
Yeah. If you can.
[30:58]
Mariska Hargitay
I'm very like, I multitask. Oh, no, I can do a get at work.
[31:01]
Marc Maron
I choose to, like, go look at food and then be like, what the fuck is happening out there? How long could this take?
[31:09]
Mariska Hargitay
I was called in here at 6. It's 3:30 and I haven't worked yet.
[31:12]
Marc Maron
What are they doing?
[31:13]
Mariska Hargitay
But I'll tell you something, after beginning, you know, being on a show for this long, you know, since the early.
[31:18]
Marc Maron
You know, you like, you're like the longest running character on any show ever.
[31:22]
Mariska Hargitay
Isn't it crazy?
[31:23]
Marc Maron
It's crazy.
[31:24]
Mariska Hargitay
No, it's so nuts. And, you know, you were saying that at the beginning because your big decision to take a break or step away. And I was thinking, I can't remember what year it was. Yeah, I think it was year 23 or 24. I was at a party and I was talking to my friend Juliana Margulies.
[31:40]
Marc Maron
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[31:41]
Mariska Hargitay
And she said, so what are you doing? And I said, I think I'm done. This was season 23, going into 24. She goes, I said, I think I'm done. And she goes, why? And I said, well, I just don't want to be a one trick pony. And she looked at me and she goes, well, Mariska, I think that ship sailed. And we had such a laugh. She goes, you might as well go till 25.
[32:02]
Marc Maron
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[32:02]
Mariska Hargitay
And we had such a laugh about that because. But now I'm so. I mean, I have been. I'm just so in love with this show and what it does and how it affects people. And for me.
[32:16]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[32:17]
Mariska Hargitay
Like, I get to go deeper every year.
[32:19]
Marc Maron
Sure.
[32:20]
Mariska Hargitay
And also find new stuff and work with new actors.
[32:22]
Marc Maron
As you find it in yourself.
[32:24]
Mariska Hargitay
As well as you find it in yourself. I mean, everything changes after this film.
[32:29]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[32:32]
Mariska Hargitay
I feel so different or new. And I have all this new space. I kind of can't wait to see what I do on SVU next year. Does that make sense?
[32:44]
Marc Maron
Of course. I mean, you know, look, as we grow. And also, I think you keep growing as an actor, and I think that, you know, part of the maintaining engagement with it is that, you know, you can make different choices and that you have. That's the only thing you really have control over as an actor.
[33:04]
Mariska Hargitay
That's right.
[33:05]
Marc Maron
Is that, like, if you have more depth, then you have more tools, and then there's a challenge to see if you can go there, which is so exciting.
[33:14]
Mariska Hargitay
I remember one of my favorite directions I've ever gotten in my career. I mean, and there's been several. Cause I've obviously had the pleasure of working with so many amazing directors, but one time I was doing a scene and Tom DiCillo was the director, and he asked me to do something that felt so foreign to me. I said, tom, that's not really my character. I just feel like it's the opposite. And he says to me, mariska, but what if she did that today? And it was like, boom, Because I'm Mariska. But I do a lot of uncharacteristic stuff all the time. And in the character of Olivia Benson, I was like, this is how it is. And then I'm like, we all have bad days. We all have days where we're like, I'm out. I'm done. I don't care. And it was so expansive. The direction was such a gift. And so now I really entertain anything. And then you just figure out why that's happening today. But I love that because it gives you permission to go into different. Not get locked in arenas.
[34:30]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[34:31]
Mariska Hargitay
So anyway, that's very exciting.
[34:32]
Marc Maron
And not be predictable, which is, you.
[34:35]
Mariska Hargitay
Know, the enemy of all creativity.
[34:37]
Marc Maron
Well, yeah, but that's also why anyone wants to stop anything.
[34:40]
Mariska Hargitay
That's right. And when I say. Exactly. And when I say, like, people go, what do you. What's your goal today? I said to surprise myself. Yeah, please, surprise myself. Please.
[34:48]
Marc Maron
Please, God.
[34:49]
Mariska Hargitay
Please, God, help me surprise myself.
[34:52]
Marc Maron
So when you start doing this in high school, that has to be where you take into consideration your mother. Yeah, right. I mean, like, when you start acting, when you realize, like, I wanna do this, I have to assume that whatever sort of resentments or wherever you had her in your mind, it must have shifted a little.
[35:11]
Mariska Hargitay
No, it wasn't that linear. No, no, no.
[35:14]
Marc Maron
Because you just thought, I'm just gonna be an actor. You didn't connect it with.
[35:17]
Mariska Hargitay
No, no, of course. No. I'm sorry. Maybe I didn't understand the question. No, I wanted to do it, and I loved acting, and I felt a connection there of what she loved, what I loved. What is this thing? But then I think that's when I decided that I wanted to do it differently.
[35:34]
Marc Maron
Sure.
[35:34]
Mariska Hargitay
That's when I sort of went, I'm gonna be serious, and not, you know, a sex symbol, and sort of. Sort of steered away from that kind of thing.
[35:46]
Marc Maron
Well, you know, and it was like.
[35:48]
Mariska Hargitay
Comedy, I want to do comedy, I'm funny, blah, blah, blah.
[35:50]
Marc Maron
Sure. But I mean, the whole idea of a sex symbol changed a lot, too, since she was around. I mean, you know, I mean, that was. It seemed that when Jay Mansfield was around, that, you know, sex symbol was, you know, part of most of the job for a certain type of actor who was stunning, you know, is that you're going to be maneuvered that way. And I have to assume that when you were doing the doc that, you know, to find your mother's, you know, struggle, you know, towards the end, you know, must have been kind of devastating.
[36:23]
Mariska Hargitay
Utterly devastating. I mean, it's like how women were treated, Right? How women were put into a box, how women were, how she was dismissed. I mean, you see in the film, and that is what. That has been the gift of this movie, to understand what she went through and how much. It was like, God, just sprinkled archival on me that I couldn't believe the gems that I found that I had no idea.
[37:00]
Marc Maron
How'd you find all that stuff? Because, like, she was an innately talented person with a fairly broad potential that was packaged as sort of a Marilyn esque, but obviously had her own thing that was, you know, even bigger than Marilyn in a way.
[37:19]
Mariska Hargitay
In a way, yes.
[37:21]
Marc Maron
Very much so, in terms of her impact, you know. Cause Marilyn, you know, she like, the struggle of both of them, like, of Marilyn being sort of, you know, taken seriously in the face of her glamour and her beauty. And I don't think, you know, it seemed like Marilyn had a little more opportunity to do that than Jane.
[37:42]
Mariska Hargitay
But being put in a box.
[37:43]
Marc Maron
Yeah, totally.
[37:44]
Mariska Hargitay
When you're in your early 20s and not knowing that there are options. And I think about my own career, and I think about when I started out, when I would walk into a room in a casting office and they'd go, oh, I was expecting a blonde. And I'd be like, well, I guess you were wrong. Or, you know, walking in and having people go, you need to change your name. And I'd say, you change your name.
[38:07]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[38:08]
Mariska Hargitay
Or they'd say, you need to get a nose job. And I'd go, you get a nose job.
[38:11]
Marc Maron
That all happened.
[38:12]
Mariska Hargitay
All of it. And it was so great because my dad and because everything he told me about what happened to her, I wasn't having it. And I had learned young, don't put me in a box. Don't even try to put me in a box.
[38:27]
Marc Maron
Right.
[38:28]
Mariska Hargitay
And so that was my sort of superpower is when they did, I was like, yeah, no, that's not happening.
[38:33]
Marc Maron
Right. But also because of that, you know, you had reasonable expectations in terms of, you know. Cause somebody like Jay Mansfield, it's like so many people are trying to run money through her.
[38:44]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[38:45]
Marc Maron
And, you know, they were not going to embrace anything that she wanted to do to expand her potential. It's like, this is how you make money, period. It's almost. It's bordering on prostitution.
[38:59]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. And originally, they were sort of building her up and creating a star to keep Marilyn in line. But they were like, this is the box. This is where you fit. Do this or you're done. Yeah, that's what they did to her. So now I understand that that's what the gift of this film has been, is to really. Reclamation of reclaiming her understanding so many parts of her and understanding what she was dealing with culturally and the times and her family. And also for me, because I spent so much time with my grandmother.
[39:37]
Marc Maron
Yes.
[39:37]
Mariska Hargitay
Understanding the sort of, you know, Southern social mores.
[39:42]
Marc Maron
Her mother.
[39:43]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, yes.
[39:43]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[39:44]
Mariska Hargitay
Very strict and very presentational.
[39:49]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[39:50]
Mariska Hargitay
Which I grew up the opposite, like my parents. My grandmother used to tell me how to answer the phone, and she would give me line readings, and I'm not kidding, she would say, this is what I was supposed to do. Hello. Who may I ask is calling? One moment, please. And I would go, why? Are you talking like that? People don't talk like that. But. So if that's what she did to me, imagine how my mother was raised to be so deferential and kind and whatever anyone wanted, that sort of presentational thing as opposed to going the way I was raised. It's like I would argue with my dad and go, dad, I gotta tell you, I couldn't disagree more.
[40:29]
Marc Maron
Right.
[40:29]
Mariska Hargitay
And my dad would say, tell me if I'm wrong, Marish. Tell me. And I go, but here's the thing. You are why. And let's have a discussion.
[40:36]
Marc Maron
Right. That's a generational thing, too.
[40:38]
Mariska Hargitay
Totally.
[40:38]
Marc Maron
And it's also lucky you were in California.
[40:41]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. Yes. Yeah.
[40:44]
Marc Maron
And I. I mean. But also, your grandmother seemed to, you know, support your mom's violin playing. Oh. And everything.
[40:50]
Mariska Hargitay
My grandmother was a. I was a school teacher. And she played the organ and the piano. No, she was amazing.
[40:56]
Marc Maron
Did she get to see you act?
[41:00]
Mariska Hargitay
Well, how about this story? So my grandmother, when she moved to California, I used to go visit her every weekend. She lived up in Ventura, and I.
[41:10]
Marc Maron
Were you guys taking care of her?
[41:11]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[41:11]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[41:12]
Mariska Hargitay
And I had gotten er.
[41:18]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[41:19]
Mariska Hargitay
I was so proud of myself. This was hands down the biggest thing that I ever did and was, like, launched my career. And I said to her, dan, Mama. I called her. I said, I got this role on er. It's the number one show. It's the best show and the best actors. And she said, when are you gonna get married and make something of yourself? And I remember going, wow.
[41:44]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[41:45]
Mariska Hargitay
When are you gonna get married and make something of yourself? And then it's sort of all. I understood it all in the moment. Cause my dad used to say the opposite. Mirshka. You need to find out who you are and where you're going and then decide who's coming with you.
[42:01]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Yeah.
[42:02]
Mariska Hargitay
And also, you're not going on somebody else's ride.
[42:04]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Get the right people around you. That kind of stuff.
[42:07]
Mariska Hargitay
So the messaging from my father and from my grandmother were diametrically opposed.
[42:13]
Marc Maron
Yeah. So. Well, I mean, some of that is probably generational and old thinking and also, like, you know, they never understand acting, but.
[42:24]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, no.
[42:25]
Marc Maron
But the fact that it's frivolous. Right. But the fact that her daughter was Jay Mansfield's. Crazy that she still thought that way.
[42:32]
Mariska Hargitay
I know, but I think she really struggled with it. She wanted her to be a musician.
[42:37]
Marc Maron
Right. Well, getting married didn't necessarily help her all the time. I mean, she did it enough.
[42:41]
Mariska Hargitay
Right, Exactly. Right.
[42:42]
Marc Maron
But maybe that's why she kept doing it. Yeah, It's. Cause that was in her head.
[42:46]
Mariska Hargitay
Right. All these pieces that I got to figure out that I got, what I learned were. It's been the greatest gift of my life. This is what I mean about integrating all these pieces, you know, because I had sort of exiled her and her story. I wanted no part of it. I was like, dad, you're my guy. I'm following your path. And this is what I'm doing. And so I really excise this. So to reintegrate her and understand her and love her and go, I get it.
[43:26]
Marc Maron
And also the fact that it's tragic, obviously, a lot of it, you know, not just, you know, the car accident, but that, you know, when you really. And you spend a lot of time, you know, putting her career into, you know, into context, you know, for yourself. But, you know, as somebody who's an entertainer, you know, the point that she hit where, you know, just to maintain a livelihood, you know, she had to do this nightclub act, which could not have been further from something that she wanted to do. And five kids and she was a cultural icon. And then she was on the other side of it and couldn't get a shot to do something different because the business wouldn't let her. So she's relegated to being part of a nightclub act. It's so tragic.
[44:27]
Mariska Hargitay
It's so tragic.
[44:28]
Marc Maron
But I imagine on some level that the live show and that people were happy to see her and she was living up to their expectations in sort of a clown like way. Right.
[44:42]
Mariska Hargitay
But, I mean, that's painful for me. But I'll tell you something. People were happy to see her. And out of all my research that I've done and all the. The gifts that I've gotten from, whether they be letters that people wrote me that had an interaction or even the books, everyone said, and I mean, everyone said she was so kind and so fun and loved people and children and babies and animals. And so she had this, like. She was such a lover.
[45:18]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Yeah.
[45:19]
Mariska Hargitay
And again, the kindness is what really resonates for me. So now after this film, like before, as I excised her away and said, here's how we're different. We're different. We're different, we're different. Now I get to see this is how we're the same. This is what I got from you. And I'm so grateful and so proud.
[45:42]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Oh, that's so good.
[45:44]
Mariska Hargitay
I'm proud of her work ethic. I'm proud of her determination and proud of so many Aspects of her. How about the fact she just got up from Texas and moved to la.
[45:55]
Marc Maron
It's all crazy.
[45:56]
Mariska Hargitay
What?
[45:57]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[45:57]
Mariska Hargitay
Back then.
[45:59]
Marc Maron
Yeah. To have that drive.
[46:00]
Mariska Hargitay
To have that drive and go, I'm doing it.
[46:02]
Marc Maron
And those two things that she was living with, like. And how you were talking about these different parts of ourselves was the, you know, the ethic of your grandmother, you know, to, you know, pursue, you know, and discipline. And discipline. But also this sort of like, you gotta find a man or you're nothing.
[46:18]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[46:18]
Marc Maron
Yeah. But she was able to leave that first man, but I guess that just stuck in her head. The man thing.
[46:24]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. And needing a man, but also not just needing a man for my grandmother, but don't forget, losing her father at three.
[46:34]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[46:34]
Mariska Hargitay
That leaves such a hole in your heart. Losing her father at three and how to we replace that? I will say to you, that kind of trauma, soul injury, you never get over that. No, you never get over that. And, you know, I know that a lot of my trauma, it was very difficult for me to express because it was pre. Verbal.
[46:59]
Marc Maron
Right, Right.
[47:00]
Mariska Hargitay
So I remember. So hers then, feeling trapped, and so was hers then.
[47:04]
Marc Maron
Right.
[47:05]
Mariska Hargitay
So I think about that so much and that longing and wanting a dad, especially for me, who I can't express to you the love, security and confidence that I got from my father. Like, feeling loved and knowing that's my guy and he has got me.
[47:29]
Marc Maron
Solid guy.
[47:30]
Mariska Hargitay
Solid as a rock.
[47:32]
Marc Maron
It's like, it's so fortunate.
[47:35]
Mariska Hargitay
I know. I'm very aware, believe me. I used to say, I was reading some old interviews and I said, everything good about me is for my dad.
[47:41]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[47:41]
Mariska Hargitay
I used to say it all the time because I just remember him being at my swim meets and, like, the investment or doing gymnastics every night in the living room, TV room before dinner, teaching me how to do a back bend and a backflip and splits because he was, you know, physical champion and he understood that there was no. No, you just do it.
[48:06]
Marc Maron
Yeah. And also the fact that he was, you know, really in love with your.
[48:10]
Mariska Hargitay
Mother, like, nobody's business.
[48:12]
Marc Maron
I know.
[48:13]
Mariska Hargitay
Like, nobody's.
[48:14]
Marc Maron
Brutal.
[48:14]
Mariska Hargitay
It's just so brutal, that kind of love. I also feel like I found my soulmate and the most amazing husband because of that love. Because I knew what love was. I recognized love, how much he loved.
[48:32]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[48:33]
Mariska Hargitay
And I. I feel so grateful for.
[48:36]
Marc Maron
That and the heartache of it. And also, like, in, you know, in relation to, you know, what is revealed ultimately, you know, about your life, your beginnings, that, you know, that that love was Big enough to include you to the point where, you know, he wouldn't.
[48:57]
Mariska Hargitay
Hear otherwise because it wasn't true to him. Didn't matter.
[49:02]
Marc Maron
Didn't matter.
[49:03]
Mariska Hargitay
It didn't matter that he. But this is what I mean about his focus. Like, there was no telling him that he was too old to become a weightlifter.
[49:11]
Marc Maron
Yeah, sure.
[49:12]
Mariska Hargitay
In terms of that. And by the way, that's what it takes, I believe.
[49:16]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[49:18]
Mariska Hargitay
To get anything done. But I understand him now because he just proceeded as if. And now I look at it and I go, how lucky am I?
[49:31]
Marc Maron
Well, I mean, what's.
[49:32]
Mariska Hargitay
I mean. But really.
[49:33]
Marc Maron
Yeah, I know.
[49:34]
Mariska Hargitay
It's insane.
[49:35]
Marc Maron
Yeah, totally.
[49:36]
Mariska Hargitay
And that's why I have this love to give. That's why I wanted to share it. That's why I want to invite people. That's why I wanted, you know, look at it like an invitation. That's why I was. I was. You know, people are like, oh, the movie's so brave. I was like, yeah, sure. And the only way out is through. So if we're not doing that, what are we doing?
[49:58]
Marc Maron
Yeah. And it just. The combination of the love for your mother and then, you know, the unconditional love for you, you know, it was just so big, you know, it was like, you know, it was real and unusual.
[50:12]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[50:13]
Marc Maron
But what's fascinating is that you really didn't know. Like, in the movie, you explore your sort of feeling of a slight alienation from your other siblings or that you were.
[50:28]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah, I was going to say that's an understatement, but, yes, that's right. And that, you know, I always felt different. I always knew there was something different, but I didn't know what.
[50:37]
Marc Maron
And you didn't really think to pursue it until you were in your late 20s or, like. Because the whole. The one thing about the fucking movie that kills me is that the head of the Jayne Mansfield fan club is the person.
[50:52]
Mariska Hargitay
How great is that?
[50:53]
Marc Maron
It's the best.
[50:54]
Mariska Hargitay
It's so perfect, you can't write it.
[50:56]
Marc Maron
No, I know, but, like, the information was out there.
[51:00]
Mariska Hargitay
That's. You know, what I say? This is the miracle of this, I feel, because they. As I felt in my life, this is my story to tell. I feel so grateful to, like, God and the universe that it somehow miraculously protected me and that when, again, the information was out there.
[51:24]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[51:25]
Mariska Hargitay
How did it not come out? After every interview I've ever done, all I do is talk about my dad. That some journalists are reported. Well, actually, I did a little research. There's this Other piece. And I sit there and I go, this is the gift that was given to me. There's been so many gifts from this movie.
[51:44]
Marc Maron
So the gift is that you didn't have to know about it until you were ready to know.
[51:48]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. But also that I got to tell the story, that I wasn't embarrassed or humiliated and that I needed. When I did find out, that I needed to keep it private, that I needed to honor my father. I was so worried that it would embarrass him or dishonor him because of what he had said to me.
[52:07]
Marc Maron
So when did you like. Not to interrupt you, but in terms of hiding it. So the course of events. Well, I think that oddly, and it's not the same culture we live in today, that enough time had passed between Jayne Mansfield's passing and her. Her cultural relevance, that, you know, that information that was so important to you was sort of insulated in kind of a film nerd community. It wasn't, you know, but you were rising as a star, too. But, you know, yet it didn't come out because I don't know that people were as fascinated with Jane anymore.
[52:46]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[52:46]
Marc Maron
So it kind of worked in your favor completely.
[52:50]
Mariska Hargitay
And then all of a sudden, I went, what? What? This isn't my. I didn't do anything wrong.
[52:56]
Marc Maron
No, but how did. How did. How did you. What was the moment of mind blowing realization?
[53:02]
Mariska Hargitay
You know, it's an issue about being ready. It was during the pandemic, after I made my first documentary. I am evidence about the backlog of untested rape kits.
[53:11]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[53:12]
Mariska Hargitay
And I felt. I just love the medium of documentary storytelling. It's my personal hobby. It's what I do when I have extra time. And after I did that, of course, everyone said, are you gonna do a doc on your mom? Are you gonna do a doc on your mom? And I sort of went, nope. And then during the pandemic that was in 2017, it came out. And then during the pandemic, here I was at my house, and as everyone did, I cleaned the basement and cleaned out everything, and I found these boxes of letters that were written to me, fan letters that were written to me about my mom, about people sharing a story about her, about saying, I knew.
[53:56]
Marc Maron
Your mom and you hadn't read them.
[53:58]
Mariska Hargitay
No, I used to get these letters and put them in a box.
[54:00]
Marc Maron
Well, you kept them?
[54:01]
Mariska Hargitay
I certainly did.
[54:02]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[54:03]
Mariska Hargitay
So once I read them and I started getting these pieces of information, it was one of these things where I, like, went, I'm ready. I'm ready.
[54:13]
Marc Maron
But you had known since you were.
[54:14]
Mariska Hargitay
Like, oh, I. I knew at 25. At 25 is when you. Ben, the fan club guy who said, who's Nelson? Do you want to see a picture of Nelson? And then at 30 is when my friend who I went to UCLA with, my good friend, said, I got two tickets to Atlantic City where Nelson.
[54:38]
Marc Maron
What's his last name again?
[54:39]
Mariska Hargitay
Sardelli.
[54:40]
Marc Maron
He was playing. Now, this is the assumption at that time, when you were 25, was. I think you should look into this, because I think this is your d. Your biological debt. Well, I knew it was at 25.
[54:51]
Mariska Hargitay
But before that, the second I saw his picture, I knew. On a cellular level, I knew.
[55:00]
Marc Maron
And that's at 25.
[55:01]
Mariska Hargitay
At 25. And then I sat with it. I didn't know anything about him. And then I just sat with it for five years and had my own, like, breakdown and identity crisis.
[55:11]
Marc Maron
Yeah. What'd that look like?
[55:12]
Mariska Hargitay
Not good. Yeah, I mean, I felt like I was tethered. I was lied to. I was angry. I was. It would bring too much pain on the rest of my family. And when I. As I do in the movie, I went and told my dad and confronted him, and he denied it. And then I saw that he was more upset than I was and more so I just, out of my love for him, said, okay. And I never spoke of it again, but it lived in me.
[55:44]
Marc Maron
And then when you went to go.
[55:46]
Mariska Hargitay
See him, my boyfriend at the time hired a private investigator and found him for me, because what I was really interested in.
[55:54]
Marc Maron
Sardelli.
[55:55]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. But what I was really interested in was whether or not I had sisters. That's all I cared about.
[56:00]
Marc Maron
Well, this is after. So you went to go see him in Atlantic City.
[56:03]
Mariska Hargitay
But I had heard from the private investigator.
[56:05]
Marc Maron
Oh, that was then.
[56:06]
Mariska Hargitay
That he was a entertainer in Vegas and also worked in Atlantic City. That I had two sisters. So I was like, wow. And then I went to Atlantic City, and I met him, and I. You know, it was my favorite moment where I said. He came out, and I said, hi, Nelson. My name is Mariska Hargitay. I understand you knew my mother. And he. He just looked at me with, like, awe, shock and awe and disbelief, and like a miracle had just transpired. And something that I didn't say in the film that I remembered after, which is so beautiful, is the first thing he said is, how's your father, Mickey Hargitay? Is he okay? The first thing he asked was about my father. And I wish I'd put that in the film. But I didn't remember it until later.
[57:00]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:01]
Mariska Hargitay
And then he, you know, as I say, he grabbed my ear and he just started crying. And then we went to a diner and we stayed up till five in the morning and talked and he told me everything. And that's when I said to him, let me explain something to you.
[57:16]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:17]
Mariska Hargitay
I have a father.
[57:18]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:18]
Mariska Hargitay
I don't want anything from you.
[57:20]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:20]
Mariska Hargitay
And I don't want a father.
[57:22]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:22]
Mariska Hargitay
I have one. So just be clear. This was just about. And you made your choice and it was the right one. And we're good. I just want to meet my sisters.
[57:32]
Marc Maron
Right.
[57:33]
Mariska Hargitay
I want my sisters.
[57:34]
Marc Maron
Did you know at that time the depth of this choice?
[57:37]
Mariska Hargitay
No.
[57:38]
Marc Maron
You know, because I don't know. When you did that interview with him.
[57:41]
Mariska Hargitay
That was the first interview that I did for the film. How about that?
[57:45]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:45]
Mariska Hargitay
It was either May or June.
[57:47]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[57:48]
Mariska Hargitay
Of 2023.
[57:49]
Marc Maron
So recently, Guy, you're so lucky. He was.
[57:52]
Mariska Hargitay
No, yeah, I did that interview and that was my first one. And it was like. And so I got to ask him all those questions.
[58:00]
Marc Maron
Well, I mean, just the weight, like the weight of the two heartbreaks, you know, the never ending heartbreaks of Mickey and Nelson.
[58:10]
Mariska Hargitay
Right, so you're never ending heartbreaks of Nikki and Nelson. That's exactly right.
[58:15]
Marc Maron
That, you know, Mickey, you know, stepped up and compartmentalized it to the point where it didn't matter.
[58:23]
Mariska Hargitay
No, it was like denial. Compartmentalized to the place of denial. And Nelson's guilt and self. Oh, my God, can you imagine that? And he has two, three beautiful daughters. And so he.
[58:38]
Marc Maron
But that choice, the weight, the choice of like, you know, look, she'd just been through this thing. She was in a car, her mother was killed. And, you know, what am I gonna do now? She has a family. Why, like, to live with that and not step up to confuse your life.
[58:56]
Mariska Hargitay
I can't even comprehend that decision.
[58:59]
Marc Maron
It's crazy, but it's beautiful. It was the right thing.
[59:04]
Mariska Hargitay
That's the beauty of this film. And I lived my whole life thinking he didn't claim me. He didn't know about me. He didn't care. How does he not care? I couldn't comprehend why he didn't care. So I felt unloved, unclaimed, unimportant, and like a mistake that he was ashamed of. That's what I felt. And it was a hard way to live, I'll tell you. It was just a hard, sad way.
[59:35]
Marc Maron
To live from 25 on. And then it's like fortuitous that that was the first interview. Cause it reframed the whole project for.
[59:43]
Mariska Hargitay
You, the whole thing. And the project has been gift after gift after gift after gift with all my siblings, everyone that I interviewed. And one of the most beautiful things about this film, this experience, I mean, listen, I'm not gonna lie, it was a bumpy ride. Obviously this is anything. Two things can be true at once. And it was painful. But one of the things that was so beautiful was when I flew to LA and I asked, you know, I went to my family, each one of them, and I met with them and I asked them for their blessing to make this film. And then I asked, you know, my stepmother Ellen, who, you know, raised me, and obviously she had reservations and concerns. But what's so beautiful is that she and I have gotten so close.
[60:32]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[60:34]
Mariska Hargitay
In this process. She was so generous, so kind, didn't hang on to anything. Just said, gave me carte blanche in the house, said, I'll answer anything, photos, files, everything. I mean, it was such a bonding thing that here you go to your stepmother, you say, I wanna make a movie about this person that even she couldn't get away from. This icon, this legend, that it's hard when you're married to somebody and then their love was. She knew, she knew and she had room for it.
[61:16]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[61:17]
Mariska Hargitay
And it's pretty magnificent. So I just give her so much credit and I'm so grateful to her for so much. But also the gift that she gave me while I made this film, it's beautiful, it's stunning.
[61:31]
Marc Maron
And also it's crazy that your grandmother knew all along.
[61:35]
Mariska Hargitay
How about I'm all you have?
[61:37]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[61:38]
Mariska Hargitay
Who says that to a 12 year old?
[61:40]
Marc Maron
Yeah, but you didn't know the meaning of that.
[61:41]
Mariska Hargitay
No, but I knew it wasn't good. Very perceptive kid. I was like, what the Sam Hill?
[61:48]
Marc Maron
She meant family.
[61:49]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes. But she looked at me, like I said, and she goes, I was talking about my dad. My dad is my life. My dad, my dad, my dad. And she goes, I'm all you have. And maybe a couple of Rob Roy's in, if you know what I mean.
[62:01]
Marc Maron
Sure. But you know, ultimately you did have your brothers. You did have your father. I mean, you did.
[62:05]
Mariska Hargitay
I think she meant as a parent.
[62:07]
Marc Maron
Yeah, I think so.
[62:08]
Mariska Hargitay
Because in the summers, as I say in the movie, we would go to Europe every summer. And then there was always like two weeks or three weeks when I'd have to go to Colorado or Texas. And when my brothers didn't come and I went, what? And I just felt so isolated. Like, do my parents not like me? Like, they want to be alone with the. Why would they?
[62:28]
Marc Maron
But that's weird, because they were still her grandkids.
[62:31]
Mariska Hargitay
I know that. She liked me the best, right? She really did. The boys were too hyper for her.
[62:37]
Marc Maron
You know, it's also weird in thinking about the film, is that, like, I believe. And you found that footage of Nelson Sardelli on Ed Sullivan. Like, you know, how great is that? It's great because, like, you know, he.
[62:48]
Mariska Hargitay
Was, you know, was it Ed Sullivan or Mike Douglas?
[62:50]
Marc Maron
Oh, maybe it was Mike Douglas.
[62:51]
Mariska Hargitay
Mike Douglas on there.
[62:51]
Marc Maron
Yeah. But either way, you know, he was, you know, in the world of that second tier of entertainers that were everywhere, that were working, that were, you know, they may not have gotten the life they wanted, but they were, you know, entertainers and they.
[63:05]
Mariska Hargitay
And how gorgeous is his voice?
[63:06]
Marc Maron
Yeah, it's great.
[63:07]
Mariska Hargitay
He's major. Yeah, that man can sing.
[63:10]
Marc Maron
Yeah. But, like, the one other thing about the movie in you capturing that relationship through archival moments is I think your mom had a great time.
[63:21]
Mariska Hargitay
Without a doubt. Without a doubt. How about Nelson and I? How about that? I look more like him than his other daughters. That's the joke. I look exactly like him.
[63:32]
Marc Maron
But also here, you look like your mom. Oh, wow.
[63:34]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes, I know. I look like your mom. I'm a perfect mixture.
[63:37]
Marc Maron
Yeah, it was like. It was so profound, you know, that you could find this true, kind of like, tragic, but elevating human story. Because when he is able to release to you the reason why he made the choice he did, and all he could do is wait for you to find him, really, that's all he could.
[64:08]
Mariska Hargitay
Do, which was the most loving act. And that's why this movie is like, I understand every single person's point of view. And that's what I wanted to sort of show. The three dimensionality of each person, their feelings, the complexity of the decisions that they made, and then knowing that makes me. It just healed my heart. Yeah, it just healed my heart.
[64:36]
Marc Maron
I think it healed mine.
[64:38]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, thank you, Mark. I hope that, by the way, I hope that. I hope. I so hope that is my wish for the movie. Because I believe that there's such universality comes from the specific. Right. So this is a movie about my mom and my family, but I hope that it resonates with everyone. And I think that it will, because you leave there just thinking about your.
[65:03]
Marc Maron
Own family, but also you leave there, like, realizing, like, okay, if you think about this story happening in the culture we live in today that, you know, the possibility of that being framed as something sordid and something, you know, clickbait worthy. Well, tabloids were around then. But, I mean, you got so lucky, you know, because that could have polluted your whole perception of the thing and made your own sense of self even more damaged. And it didn't.
[65:28]
Mariska Hargitay
Exactly. But I also thought that I was from, like, a, you know, going to Catholic school. I thought I was from, like, a dirty affair.
[65:34]
Marc Maron
I know.
[65:35]
Mariska Hargitay
And now I've learned they loved each other.
[65:38]
Marc Maron
It seems that way.
[65:38]
Mariska Hargitay
Like, I came from love. I came from love.
[65:42]
Marc Maron
And you brought up in love, too.
[65:45]
Mariska Hargitay
I was brought up in love.
[65:45]
Marc Maron
You were just so lucky. But, like, you know, I think my point is, is that it's so easy to minimize something like, oh, she's the, you know, out of wedlock child of the. To make it sorted is so easy and so lazy and so destructive that the nuances of this situation, which you sought to find were insanely human and incredibly difficult. But it's so fortunate it wasn't.
[66:14]
Mariska Hargitay
And you saying that is so right on. Because I spoke to a few people, some business people, some older people, and I told them about it, and they go, oh, no, don't do that. Don't tell that story. And this one guy who loves me and is a very smart guy, but he goes, yeah, I don't want people to see you like that. That's what he said. And I went, a child out of wedlock, whatever. And that's when I said, oh, you don't get it. You don't get it. And it was. So I left. We had dinner, and he said that to me, and he's very protective of me. He thought. I mean, he was, but he just didn't get it. And I went, guess what? You're who I'm making the film for. Yeah, you are who I'm making the film for. So you go.
[67:00]
Marc Maron
Did he.
[67:01]
Mariska Hargitay
He hasn't seen it yet. He's Kobe there, though, and I know that's what he'll do. Actually, he doesn't have feelings, so he might not.
[67:07]
Marc Maron
But anyway, yeah, I'm telling you, man. Like, you know, when. When Nelson Sardelli tells you why? Yeah, it's fucking crazy.
[67:19]
Mariska Hargitay
And how about Nelson Sardelli waiting for 30 years out of respect for me? And by the way, I know that people called him. I know that there were people, little people trying to call, and. And he said, no comment. And he honored me and my dad. And that's why in that movie, when he has that, like, total Sicilian Mafia moment. And he goes, I will never embarrass you. Never. And I went, oh, I'm gonna cast him as, like, a Mafia king on svu. But it was so. I love that. I'm Sicilian. I think that helps me play Olivia Benson.
[67:55]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[67:56]
Mariska Hargitay
I'm serious.
[67:56]
Marc Maron
I'm sure.
[67:57]
Mariska Hargitay
Because when I go there and I'm like, where did that come from? I got it. But the fact that he honored me and my dad in that way is such an act of loving and generosity.
[68:10]
Marc Maron
It's crazy.
[68:11]
Mariska Hargitay
And that my sisters. My sisters lived with the secret. My sisters. That's not fun being a secret. His daughters. But can you imagine? They were like, okay, these are the rules. I get it.
[68:23]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Yeah. It is kind of profound that it went on, that he waited until you eventually found out or was ready. Yeah. Cause you both knew early on.
[68:34]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, yeah, we knew.
[68:36]
Marc Maron
And certainly it didn't make your life any easier. But, geez, the relief of resolution and the burden lifted to get that piece of information. Is he still around still?
[68:47]
Mariska Hargitay
Oh, yes.
[68:48]
Marc Maron
Oh, good.
[68:49]
Mariska Hargitay
He's around. And we were texting yesterday. Cause he checked in with me. He goes, how do you feel? How do you feel now that it's at. I had asked him how he feels now that it's out, because everyone's calling him and texting him, and news journalists, everybody wants to interview him. And he said, I feel great. How do you feel? He said. And I said, well, I wrote back to him. Some things are worth the wait. The wait. And also the weight.
[69:22]
Marc Maron
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[69:23]
Mariska Hargitay
And it sort of was like the whole thing.
[69:26]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[69:27]
Mariska Hargitay
Both weights. They were worth it. And now he and I have this such beautiful love that he's proven to me through the truth, through telling his story. And now we obviously have this biological connection. But it's so profound to me what he did and what he sacrificed as a parent. I can't imagine. I can't imagine making that choice for someone, you know, it's so hard. And he did the right thing.
[70:03]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Such a specific and heightened circumstance, you know, so heightened.
[70:10]
Mariska Hargitay
So it was quite a noble act of love. And I. Everything has been reframed. Everything has been reframed for me.
[70:20]
Marc Maron
And after all this work, you know, through the movie and through, you know, your personal experience, I mean, do you. You know, what. What is the most difficult. It would seem to me that the most difficult thing to really kind of wrap your brain around is Mickey's position till the death.
[70:43]
Mariska Hargitay
No. Because I understand him, and I'm grateful for that.
[70:47]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[70:49]
Mariska Hargitay
And that was his. What's the word? Like, he solemnly swore. He made an oath to me and to himself. To himself and to me. I get it.
[71:00]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Yeah.
[71:01]
Mariska Hargitay
That's who he was.
[71:02]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[71:04]
Mariska Hargitay
And I know that he's looking down at me going. And that's why I wanted to make a love letter to him with this movie. And that's what I think it is.
[71:21]
Marc Maron
I think that is true. I. I guess, like, for me, I'm just. I'm wondering about, you know, because, you know, the commitment that both these maiden. These men made to themselves. It was a lifelong commitment, you know, in honor of you.
[71:44]
Mariska Hargitay
It's staggering.
[71:45]
Marc Maron
It's crazy. And, you know. You know, Mickey's decision to take it to the grave is kind of, you know. I know. You know, you understand it, and I understand it. And I guess that for a guy like that, there was no other way.
[72:08]
Mariska Hargitay
And you know what the irony is, is I get that now. But I grew up. My mother died. I had serious abandonment issues. And then when this happened, I felt so unloved.
[72:21]
Marc Maron
When you found out about Nelson. Yeah.
[72:24]
Mariska Hargitay
I was lied to, betrayed. I felt unclaimed. So unloved because I didn't understand the whole story. And when you have those feelings inside, you know, all those feelings of imposter syndrome, abandonment is a rough one. I'm not gonna lie. Abandonment is just a rough one to get over.
[72:45]
Marc Maron
But that's all attached to the original trauma of the car accident.
[72:48]
Mariska Hargitay
Yes, but then how things can switch with the truth.
[72:54]
Marc Maron
Yeah. What a relief.
[72:55]
Mariska Hargitay
What a relief. But it's for me, like it's a miracle. It's like I was. My assessment was so far off.
[73:03]
Marc Maron
Well, how could you know any different?
[73:04]
Mariska Hargitay
Right. Because you're a kid and you think your mother dies, it's your fault.
[73:06]
Marc Maron
But on some level, those feelings are valid. Of course they're all valid. They're all valid and they're all real.
[73:12]
Mariska Hargitay
And two things can be true at once.
[73:13]
Marc Maron
That's right.
[73:14]
Mariska Hargitay
Several things can be true at once. But the fact that I have this devotion of these two men, true devotion that. I mean, you're lucky if you have the devotion of one person. So that I had these two fathers, and so that's how I look at it now, is that I have two fathers, that I have two men that loved me in a paternal way. And the same thing with the mothers, that I have two mothers. That was the other thing, is that I didn't feel that she loved me.
[73:48]
Marc Maron
Who, Jane?
[73:48]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah.
[73:49]
Marc Maron
Well, I mean, how could you know?
[73:51]
Mariska Hargitay
But also, I just. I thought she was too busy for me. I thought I was. You know, when I say that in the movie, if you see me holding my bottle, I clearly was like, I got this, people. I'll do it myself. And.
[74:01]
Marc Maron
Right. But all that is in ret. All that is through. You know, in terms of feeling loved, the memory of it actually being the time that you have with her is gone. I mean, you can't access that, so you can only project this stuff.
[74:18]
Mariska Hargitay
Yeah. You know, that's why it's also a commentary on memory and what we remember and what is real and what is not real. You know, this is. You know, people say, why did you make this movie now?
[74:31]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[74:32]
Mariska Hargitay
Because I was ready.
[74:33]
Marc Maron
Yeah. Because it's time.
[74:35]
Mariska Hargitay
Because it's time.
[74:36]
Marc Maron
Well, it's a beautiful thing, this movie.
[74:40]
Mariska Hargitay
Thank you.
[74:41]
Marc Maron
And it's a real human drama that ends in a way that you could never imagine. And it's freeing for so many people, you know?
[74:53]
Mariska Hargitay
Thank you. What a beautiful thing to say. Yeah, I hope so.
[74:56]
Marc Maron
Well, it was great talking to you.
[74:57]
Mariska Hargitay
You too. Okay, thank you.
[75:04]
Marc Maron
Unbelievable. Great story. Great person. The HBO documentary she directed, my mom, Jane, is now streaming on Max. Hang out for a minute, folks. People. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game, shifting a little money here, a little there, and hoping it all works out? Well, with the name your price tool from Progressive, you can be a better budgeter and potentially lower your insurance bill, too. You tell Progressive what you want to pay for car insurance, and they'll help find you options within your budget. Try it today@progressive.com. and now some legal info. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law. Not available in all states. So five years ago, during COVID lockdown, I got a chance to talk to another law and order SVU cast member, Ice TV. That was episode 1145. I was in Barcelona, Spain, on a honeymoon, and at some point, must have been earlier that year, and we went to the aquarium, me and this woman. And you were at the aquarium in Barcelona, Spain, with one of the kids and a wife, and you were just looking at the fish. Does this make sense? Do you remember doing that?
[76:27]
Ice-T
It makes absolute sense.
[76:29]
Marc Maron
So I'm walking behind you because you're reading off the. You know, the information cards, and you're reacting to what's in the tank. And I was like, we gotta follow this guy, because this is the best tour I've ever been on.
[76:42]
Ice-T
And you know what, though? When you travel, I Was probably on tour.
[76:48]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[76:48]
Ice-T
I've never gone to any foreign country.
[76:50]
Marc Maron
Just to hang out.
[76:52]
Ice-T
Yeah, I've always gone because I was on tour or something. And if you don't take advantage of that trip and go see some sights, you know what I'm saying, you lose your mind. So I was in. I'll tell you another funny story. I was in Ireland.
[77:09]
Marc Maron
I love Ireland.
[77:10]
Ice-T
Ireland.
[77:10]
Marc Maron
Love it. You like? Was cool.
[77:13]
Ice-T
See, I like every place I go because every place I go, I got a fan base, right? So I go from the hotel to people that love me. So it doesn't really. I don't think I go right for the hotel to a group of people that can't wait to see me. Yeah, I'm always gonna love play. People like, oh, well, it's fucked up there. I'm like, I'm not even there long enough to know I'm.
[77:33]
Marc Maron
I'm just there for the love. And then I'm out.
[77:35]
Ice-T
I'm out. So we went to a zoo.
[77:39]
Marc Maron
Yeah.
[77:40]
Ice-T
And a fucking gorilla almost tried to kill me, right? Like, we were. We were. Me and Ernie C. Were looking at this gorilla, and it was a big plexiglass thing. The gorilla was maybe say, 40ft away. And the gorilla took one look at me. I might have been the first black person it saw. And it beat its chest and it came and it rushed and it tried to hit the glass.
[78:01]
Marc Maron
Bam.
[78:02]
Ice-T
I'm like, oh, my God, that glass wasn't there. That gorilla would just killed me. Almost died by gorilla in Ireland.
[78:12]
Marc Maron
Go check that out right now. And whatever podcast player you're using. Ice t on episode 1145. And if you want every episode of WTF ad free, sign up for WTF. Go to the link in the episode description or go to wtfpod.com and click on WTF Plus. And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by acast. Now, I'm going to try to. I've been doing actual songs lately because I'm. I want to get in the habit of trying to learn things. So now I'm going to clunk my way through this one. Boomer Lives Monkey and La Fonda Cat Angels everywhere.