Episode 1681 - Jimmy Pardo

Summary

WTF with Marc Maron – Episode 1681: Jimmy Pardo

Release Date: September 25, 2025
Guest: Jimmy Pardo

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Episode Overview

In this reflective, intimate episode, Marc Maron sits down with comedy veteran and podcasting pioneer Jimmy Pardo for a deep discussion about their parallel journeys in comedy and podcasting. As Marc approaches the "home stretch" of WTF, he honors Jimmy as one of the original comedians to embrace podcasting, noting Pardo’s influence on the medium as host of Never Not Funny since 2006. Together, they reminisce about early days, debate the evolution of podcasting, address sustaining creativity, and open up about aging, family, and the bittersweet nature of recognition and legacy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Podcasting Origins & Community

• Mutual Recognition: Marc credits Jimmy for helping lay the groundwork for comedy-driven podcasts.

  “You were already dug in and doing it and an inspiration, and you kind of had a ... you set a precedent” — Marc (20:34)

• The early podcast landscape included a small core: Jimmy Pardo, Marc, Jimmy Dore, Todd Glass, Doug Benson, Kevin Smith, and others.
• Early podcasting was full of trial and error: monetization models, backstage traditions, and building a DIY audience.

Timestamps

• [16:46] Marc introduces Jimmy, reflecting on their long history together.
• [20:34-24:00] Discussion of the early podcasting landscape and mutual influence.

2. The Paywall Dilemma & Audience Growth

• Jimmy’s paywall gamble:

  "One could argue it was the greatest thing we ever did. And one could argue it was the worst thing we ever did." — Jimmy (24:07)

• Initially, charging for Never Not Funny meant immediate income but also contributed to being excluded from the "comedy podcast boom" press and left him feeling isolated from the mainstream audience growth.
• Marc recounts feeling left behind and experiencing professional jealousy, despite financial success.

Timestamps

• [24:00-27:57] The pros and cons of the paywall decision, feelings of isolation, and professional jealousy.

3. Recognition, Validation & Resilience in Comedy

• Both Maron and Pardo reflect on needing validation—even amid success.

  "I want the pat on the head. That's the truth." — Jimmy (28:41)
  "I'm flattered that you always mention me as an inspiration." — Jimmy (28:46)

• They share bittersweet stories about never feeling quite 'big enough', comparing themselves to podcasting celebrities, and coping with award shows and public credit (or lack thereof).

Timestamps

• [28:41-31:00] On seeking validation and the psychological toll of comedy careers.

4. Aging, Family, and Comedy Legacies

• Jimmy brings up his son Oliver’s entry into stand-up, highlighting the challenges and emotional vulnerability of comedy as a family occupation.
• Both discuss the strangeness and loneliness of becoming "empty nesters," the passing of time, and the deeper emotional resonances of old friendships in the comedy world.

Timestamps

• [29:10-33:26] Talking about Jimmy’s son, empty nesting, and the passage of time.

5. Classic Rock, Music Obsessions, and Tastes

• A lengthy, affectionate digression into their favorite rock bands (Styx, Chicago, Foreigner, etc.), the joy and danger of seeing legacy bands age, and the impact of classic rock on their psyches.

  "I believe I was gaslit by classic rock. A little bit." — Jimmy (39:35)

• They joke about the perils of seeing beloved bands perform past their prime and reminisce about their youthful music fandom.

Timestamps

• [33:26-41:00] Music fandom, aging with bands, and pop culture references.

6. Comedy Styles, Crowd Work, and Industry Trends

• Both express nuanced frustration with the current dominance of algorithm-driven, crowd work clips in comedy.

  "I am currently furious at everybody putting clips of, 'here's my crowd work from this set.' ... This is what made me and Todd Barry special." — Jimmy (49:29)

• Analyze how new technology changes the art form and what is lost or gained as stand-up adapts to TikTok and social media.

Timestamps

• [47:01-51:11] The “crowd work boom,” artistic integrity, and the erosion of uniqueness in the digital age.

7. Podcast Evolution: From Underground to Mainstream

• Memories of the "patent troll" crisis, the sense of camaraderie in fighting off legal threats to podcasting’s viability (“like a meeting of the five families”).

  “It really felt like a community… we had to have each other's backs. …It was like an amazing time.” — Marc (65:10)

• Debate whether podcasting should ever become a corporate enterprise, lamenting the loss of its ‘outlaw’ spirit.

Timestamps

• [63:14-68:15] Community in crisis: patent trolls, advertising, and the business shift.

8. Dealing with Audience Decline and Speaking Political Truths

• Maron openly discusses losing a large chunk of his audience in 2016 after taking a strong anti-Trump, pro-Hillary political stance—and having no regrets:

  “Good. You know, take the others with you.” — Marc (58:53)

• Emphasis that, for both, podcasting has become about speaking honestly, regardless of fallout.

Timestamps

• [58:01-59:45] The cost of authenticity and politics in podcasts.

9. Sustaining Creativity Through Podcasting

• Despite the fatigue after years of podcasting, both men see it as their creative refuge and lifeline.

  “It's my outlet to be funny. It's my outlet to be creative.” — Jimmy (62:38)

Timestamps

• [60:05-62:38] Podcasting as ongoing creative sustenance.

10. Legacy, Gratitude, and Letting Go of Resentment

• Reflecting on legacies, their influence, and resisting bitterness towards newer, bigger shows (“SmartLess” and the Hollywood Bowl set).

  “I'm not competing with them… I like to think that I'm interesting and funny, and I would like more people to hear it.” — Jimmy (71:50)

Timestamps

• [71:28-73:40] Letting go of bitterness and cultivating gratitude.

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Memorable Quotes

• On the origins of comedy podcasting:

  “I always have to qualify that by saying there were other podcasters years before us. ...I'm talking about the community I came up with.” — Marc (00:09)

• On legacy and recognition:

  "Where's my big award? Where’s my statue?” — Jimmy (74:04)

• On aging in the creative world:

  “It's very sweet to get to a certain age with your life committed to one thing and realize there are people who knew you at the beginning.” — Marc (00:09)

• On early podcasting innovation:

  “Jimmy Pardo was the first person with a name that you knew who was doing a podcast.” — Marc, citing Todd Glass (22:55)

• On changing industry dynamics:

  “Once you’re starting to get notes and stuff, like you’re doing a TV show for NBC, that’s not podcasting to me.” — Jimmy (68:22)

• On artistic frustration:

  “If we're not getting the validation… I want the pat on the head. That's the truth.” — Jimmy (28:41)

• On outlook despite competition:

  “Am I a little jealous that SmartLess could do the Hollywood Bowl? Of course. But I also am not competing with them.” — Jimmy (71:44)

• On their camaraderie:

  “I do feel we are kindred spirits at the beginning of something that got away from us.” — Jimmy (77:18)

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Notable Lighter Moments

• Classic Rock Trivia (30:31): Friendly one-upmanship about concerts, band trivia, and the number of times Jimmy has seen Chicago (112 times!).
• Aging Comic Problems (41:49): Jimmy recounts napping backstage at Largo and worrying about being upstaged by younger comedians.
• Ad-Read Antics (66:56): Both laugh about ads for squatty potties, Tushy bidets, and Sherry’s Berries.

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Final Reflections

The episode closes with heartfelt mutual appreciation. Both hosts acknowledge the blessing and the burden of longevity in their field, sharing affection and gratitude for each other's impact on podcasting and comedy. In the end, they accept that—while their influence will never touch everyone—they have meaningfully shaped a medium and inspired the comedians who followed.

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Listen to Never Not Funny with Jimmy Pardo

See Marc’s tour dates, archival episodes, and more at wtfpod.com

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Summary by Podcast GPT – For those who want the essence, depth, and spirit of every episode.

Transcript

[Marc Maron]

Lock the gate.

[Jimmy Pardo]

All right, let's do this. How are you? What the. What the Buddies? What the Nicks? What's happening? I'm Mark Marin. This is my podcast. Welcome to it in the home stretch here. How's everybody doing? You okay? Today on the show, Jimmy Pardo is here. Now, look, Jimmy has been podcasting since 2006, and he was one of the guys at the beginning when we started WTF that I knew was out there. I knew him. I knew his comedy. I known him a long time, and, you know, he was doing Never Not Funny, which was a show that had a lot of influence on us in terms of, you know, how to do a podcast, how to, you know, perhaps monetize it or what the options were at the time. But he was there with a small group of us that were part of the podcasting community. He was on WTF back on episode 102, as well as a couple of live episodes. But he. But it made sense to have him back on here in the home stretch because he was one of the guys, one of the gang of the original podcasters. And again, I always have to qualify that by saying there were other podcasters. There were podcasters years before us. I'm talking about the community I came up with. It's weird when so much time goes by that all of a sudden the people you came up with, that. That's a long time ago. I mean, I was at the Comedy Store the other night, night before last, and Dave Attell came by, and I've known Dave Attell. We started roughly at the same time in New York. I've known him going Back to, what, 89? Is that possible? 35, 36 years I've known Dave Attell. I spent a lot of time with Dave Attell. We were both, you know, hammering away at the same dream. Me and him and Ross and Silverman and CK And Todd Berry. Others, many others. But I don't see Dave that much anymore. And I saw him last night. You know, we see each other in passing, and he's not a huge talker, but it really becomes kind of moving as you get older in this life, as people have passed, as people have fallen away, as, you know, people have had their own troubles in their own lives, and. And, you know, seeing Dave, it was great. It's always great to see Dave. I never know if he's gonna, you know, talk to me for very long, but that's been the way it's been for our whole life. But, you know, we were out back, and we're out in front of the club and there's a few people gathered around chit chat and he says, come on, take a walk. And we had a little catch up and it was, it's very sweet. It's very sweet to get to a certain age with your life committed to one thing and, and, and realize there are people who knew you at the beginning, who were there with you at the beginning. Even if you've lived totally different lives, you don't see each other very often. Just that moment of like, hey, still alive, huh? Still at it. Here we are, look at us. How's your mom? How's your health? What have you been doing? Yeah, I saw that thing you did. That was great. It just, it becomes deeper and more touching as time goes on. It's not competitive. It's not, you know, in any way detached aside from the time spent apart, but it really becomes sort of like we are still here, brother, and we're still doing the thing. And you're holding up well. I'm holding up well. I'm glad you're okay. The final batch of WTF Cat mugs go on sale tomorrow. These are the mugs I give to my guests and they're handmade pieces of art by Brian Jones. You can get one tomorrow starting at noon Eastern. Go to wtfmugs.co. also, the documentary Are We Good? Opens next week, October 3, in New York and Los Angeles. I'll be at some of the screenings here in la, as well as the Vancouver Film Festival. There are special screenings around the country on October 5th and October 8th. Go to are we good? Marin.com to see where it's playing and get tickets. The Kickstarter for the graphic novel WTF is a Podcast is still going on and we're still pushing to get everyone who orders a book a special box brown design WTF trading card. And if we can get over 250 grand, everyone gets a frame set of our four trading cards, me, Boomer Monkey and La Fonda, the original crew. Go to Z2Comics.com WTF and if I could, at this moment, I'm not going to make this screening, but I just want to draw attention to the fact that the movie Springsteen Deliver Me From Nowhere is showing at the New York Film Festival this weekend. And if you didn't get a chance to hear it over the summer, you can check out the episode I did with Jeremy Allen White, who plays Bruce in the movie. So the Bruce movie, how'd you feel.

[Jeremy Allen White]

About was very hard?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, yeah, especially because he's sitting there the whole time. But in terms of playing Bruce and doing your own singing, I, I, from what I remember on set that there were times where Bruce couldn't tell the difference.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jeremy Allen White]

I mean, you know, I had not had a lot of experience or any experience singing, playing guitar, any of it. And so that was daunting to say the least in the beginning. And I didn't have, I mean, I had a lot of time, but I didn't have as much time as I would have liked. You never do, you know, But I had about six months to kind of.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What's fortunate with those songs? The guitar playing is not like, exactly.

[Jeremy Allen White]

It's not a lot of. Yeah, the chords are pretty simple. There's not many of them. And a lot of the songs are in the same. Yeah, but, but the singing was a, you know, a gamble and, but so what'd you do?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Just kind of like figure out at first just to mimic it? Like, do you listen to it and then kind of record yourself?

[Jeremy Allen White]

Yeah, I mean, I worked with this guy, Eric Vitro, who's kind of like the guy, you know, he helped Austin with the Elvis movie, He helped Timothee Chalamet with the Dylan movie. He's kind of the go to. And he works with a lot of amazing vocalists and real singers and performers. But I got together with him and then I really have to give Eric credit because he was there to kind of. Or I thought he was there to be like, you know, this is how you sing a song. This is how you make it sound. Good.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jeremy Allen White]

But he would catch me not feeling connected to it and doing what as an actor, I should have just been doing naturally, which is like, what are you talking about?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, right.

[Jeremy Allen White]

What's going on?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right, right.

[Jeremy Allen White]

Have you written this down? A whole bunch?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jeremy Allen White]

Just think about is this the work of who's Bruce playing or, you know, which moment in Bruce's life is this, you know, all this stuff. It should have been simple, but I was so worked up with how does it sound? Being self conscious and sounding like Bruce.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jeremy Allen White]

So that was like a break, a breakthrough. And then, you know, we pre recorded and, and so that gave me the ability to like a lot of vocalists. You know, you sing the song for an afternoon.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jeremy Allen White]

And they go ahead and they put together your, your greatest hits, you know what I mean?

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's episode 1672 with Jeremy Allen White. And the movie opens nationwide on October 24th. So many. We've done all the talks. We've done all the talking. Oh my God. So I know the big news, outside of horrible news about another shooting and outside of the farce of our president speaking at the un, the big news is that Jimmy Kimmel returned to work. And this was no small feat, to be honest with you. I mean, look, I spoke out early and then many people spoke out when I did. And then actors came together and then comedians came together over time. Even the comics that do not identify with the politics that, that Jimmy Kimmel is or with the side of politics that Jimmy Kimmel has been linked to and represents, they eventually came out in fairly full throated ways, but everyone kind of got on the same page and an amazing thing happened that, and of course the boycott was, I think, in a large part an amazing thing. And he returned to the airwaves and made a tremendous monologue out of what happened and what he feels is right and wrong and, and his wrong phrasing or misunderstanding or being misunderstood. I just thought, all in all it was an incredible showing for a guy with humility, with a big heart, and with a sort of very precise and righteous attack on the threat to free speech by an authoritarian administration. And I thought it was tremendous. But I do think we have to take note that this was a five alarm fire. This was no little thing. This was nothing that could be dismissed. And all roads lead back to FCC chair Brendan Carr, who outwardly and very directly deliberately made an ominous threat. He couched it in language where he wouldn't be legally liable, but it was strong arming, plain and simple by the administration. And then Trump, a day after Jimmy gets his job back, confirms that this was a autocrat's desire of his authoritarian government to silence a voice that he didn't like, didn't agree with, took personally. I mean, the difference between Trump being annoyed by people who make fun of him and the structure of the policies that the new authoritarian administration has coincide a bit. I think Trump, thankfully, because of his big mouth and his inability to take a joke and his incredibly thin skin and frail ego, because he takes everything personally and does not know how to shut up, you know, really kind of fucks it up for the authoritarian system that he is the frontman for. I don't know how conscious that is as long as it serves his petty needs. But it does make it plainly obvious what the intentions are and what they were and how they're not gonna stop. But I'm not necessarily helpful, but I am encouraged by the outpouring of not just support for Jimmy, but action taken and voices heard that this is Not America. This is not how America was supposed to be. How America is. On another note, I'm waffling back and forth between rehousing my cat Charlie, because it's just too violent here. I don't know how. I really don't know how people have kids. Yesterday I was like, I'm so sad I have to get rid of them, but it's probably gonna be better for everybody. And today I bought a fucking cat tree for my bedroom, which is where he'll probably end up living almost exclusively. That's my life. Rotating and going back and forth between rehousing a cat that I adore, but that in, in, in times of rational thinking, I think maybe everybody'd be better off if he had a. A single cat home. And he could be the king of the. The place that's. That's my life. I. That's how I spend my time. I go through all the emotions and I waffle back and forth between making big decisions it that I'm tethered to this cat and that I can't travel comfortably. I can't spend a day away from my house without wondering, is that little okay? And some people be like, yeah, well, that's cute. Is it? I'm getting old, you know, I should be able to have the freedom to do what I want to do. And, and if I can't do it, it shouldn't be, because I wonder if that crazy cat will be okay. You know what I mean? So listen, something people keep saying to me about the podcast ending is that I should take a vacation. Look, I used to take vacations. I used to love to go to Kauai. I enjoyed Kauai. I would go there, you know, once a year. Usually. I haven't been on a vacation. I can't remember the last vacation I've been on. I was just talking to somebody about traveling to Tuscany and Umbria. I do need to take one. But if you're planning to take a vacation, there's always the question of what to do with your empty house while you're away. Of course, there's the option to host your place on Airbnb to make some extra cash. And now it's easier than ever. With Airbnb's co host network, you get a high quality local host to take care of your home and your guests. They manage all the hosting details, send messages and updates, and are available to be on hand when your guests are there, just to help out with anything that might come up. So your co host handles the details and you still make some cash while you're enjoying your vacation. Find a co [e-mail]/host. So look, Jimmy Pardo is here. And this is another thing about going back with somebody. Look, I've known Jimmy a long time. I knew him as a comic. I probably knew him a bit before the podcast. But you have to realize that at the time we started wtf, there was only a few podcasts out there that I knew of that were driven by comics, by guys I knew. Jimmy Pardo, Jimmy Dore, Todd Glass, Doug Benson, Kevin Smith was around. Carolla was basically doing a radio show. And I know you guys have heard a lot of this stuff already, but Jimmy and I go way back and his partner Matt Belknap, you know, they were putting together a network or a platform. And I think the point I'm trying to make is that I want people to realize that now that podcasting is a pervasive and popular medium, that at the beginning there was a core group of us that were trying to make podcasting work. We don't know what the future held. You know, Jimmy at that time was doing, and I think he still does. We talk about it, you know, you gotta. He had a paywall set up and there was conversations with Brendan and I about a paywall, and we were all just trying to figure it out. But there was a community. Jesse Thorne, Chris Hardwick, later Rogan a few months later, after me. But there was a community of us that were, you know, really had each other's backs, were doing each other's shows, were operating as like minded creatives that were, were doing a similar thing with a, a common medium. And we were all kind of in touch for years in terms of, of moving the medium forward, having a bit of group think about what should happen with the medium, certainly with the patent troll crisis. But we were always sort of in conversation one way or the other, either on each other's shows or off the mics. And it was kind of an amazing time considering where the medium has come and where we're all at now. And I just thought it would be fitting to honor Jimmy's part in it, to honor Jimmy's part in sort of getting us going or at least showing us a template or a model of how this thing could work. And he's still at it. He's still funny, he's still one of the great podcasters, and he's here with us today. You can listen to his podcast, Never Not Funny, wherever you get podcasts and go to jimmypardo.com for his upcoming tour dates. Very funny comedian. And this is me and Jimmy having a chat here in the final days of wtf. Funny. I had Tracy Letts in here yesterday.

[Marc Maron]

The actor?

[Jimmy Pardo]

He's an actor and a playwright. You know who he is.

[Marc Maron]

But I look up his photograph so I could enjoy your story.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure. It wasn't really a story, but he had problems with his yesterday. Oh. On the air. He's readjusting his a lot. I don't know if it had something to do with me, but it could be Tracy Letts. L E T S. That guy's a good actor. Great.

[Marc Maron]

He was in that. That Lakers miniseries.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, he's in a lot of things.

[Marc Maron]

Really good.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I'm gonna turn my phone off for this.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay. Well, that's respectful.

[Marc Maron]

I don't think people turn it off on my show. I don't.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You don't mind the ringing?

[Marc Maron]

Any interruption is welcome.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, because you can just go with it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, why not? You know, we're. We're all fighting for content after 20 years. 20 years, Jim.

[Marc Maron]

19.

[Jimmy Pardo]

19.

[Marc Maron]

We're coming up on 20.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What am I coming up on?

[Marc Maron]

Less than that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, I mean, you don't have to be. What's with the tone?

[Marc Maron]

No, there was no tone.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

No. I don't know.

[Marc Maron]

Is there a right? Wait, left is always the cord. Right?

[Jimmy Pardo]

They're headphones. You want. You put them on your head.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

These.

[Marc Maron]

You mentioned the cock earlier, so I assumed that it had something to do with. Now, those are too high. That's too high for me.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You can adjust it.

[Marc Maron]

I see. There we go.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Do you have a custom set at your studio that is only yours?

[Marc Maron]

I use the inside ear, like the monitor type.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really? When did you make the jump?

[Marc Maron]

10 years ago.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

I don't. You know what? It started because when I worked at Conan.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I would do the podcast and then have to go to Conan, I didn't like having headphone hair.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So I started using the in Iterators.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right, Right.

[Marc Maron]

For that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wait, what? I'm trying to remember which. Which phase of Conan were you involved.

[Marc Maron]

With from day one of the Tonight Show? All through.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Are we. Are we recording?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know how this works?

[Marc Maron]

I don't know. Well, usually you do some sort of.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What? I do that later. Yeah, but you want to ease into it.

[Marc Maron]

I want you to make me feel comfortable.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, that's not all. That's not what this is about.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I know. I.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, if you remember, I think you're pretty comfortable. You're comfortable from when you walked up to the house.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, 100%.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Here's the thing.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I did your show. This is a true story. I did the live Marc Maron at the UCB the day. The final day of the Tonight show with Conan o'. Brien. I left the studio, raced over to.

[Jimmy Pardo]

The UCB for a live WTF to.

[Marc Maron]

Do a live wtf and then went back to the wrap party afterwards.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, thank you for doing that.

[Marc Maron]

Well, you know what? I. I did not know we were going to be losing our job at the Tonight Show. I did have Marc Maron WTF live at the UCB on my calendar.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, so you. And it wasn't like, we're not coming back. It's just the end of the season.

[Marc Maron]

No, we got fired.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

Don't you remember that? We all got fired because Jay Leno wanted his job back.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, I get it. But I didn't. I didn't realize you got fired. Then you came to my house or to ucb.

[Marc Maron]

I got. Yeah. It was the final show.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then I raced over.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I did a little thing with you, and I don't know who else was on the panel.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Did you, did you let on that you were sad and shattered?

[Marc Maron]

You. You did a whole thing about you couldn't believe that I would leave the wrap party to come and do your show, and you can't believe that on a day that we all lost our job that I would, I would still show up.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Did I? Thank you.

[Marc Maron]

It sounds like you got a lot of good memories about this day.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, it's not going to have the same impact on me as it is on you.

[Marc Maron]

It was.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I've done 1600 of these things, and that, that was like Pearl harbor for you that day.

[Marc Maron]

I'm going to tell you something.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

To your point, somebody will say to me, hey, on the show, you said, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I go, I don't remember anything that happened. I've been doing this thing 19 years. They go, it happened Monday.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Like, okay, well, again, I've done a lot of shows.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I'm the same way. I. Because I, you know, once I talk, it's out, you're in it. And then my producer takes the rest of the. So if you're just asking me to remember a conversation.

[Marc Maron]

No.

[Jimmy Pardo]

From 20, you know, 15 years ago, it's not going to happen.

[Marc Maron]

Me neither.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So let's, let's talk about the evolution. I do have to give you a lot of credit because when we Started this, which we're now kind of wrapping up. You were already dug in and doing it and an inspiration, and you kind of had a. You set a precedent, and you helped us in kind of figuring out how we were gonna approach ours. You're really the one of the OGs of this wave of podcasting.

[Marc Maron]

I am. I am doing my best not to get emotional, because that's very kind of you to say. Thank you.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It's true.

[Marc Maron]

And I will say this publicly, and I do say it publicly on my show. There are some folks that forget that I was in early on podcasting, and you never do. You give me credit everywhere you go, and it means the world to me and people, you know. You know, just, like, we have fans that are out in the world, and they all like to report back. Hey, Marin was just on Smartless. He mentioned you. Yeah, hey, Marin was here. Mary was there. And then. And then so. And so was just on this show. They. They gave credit to Chris Hardwick. They give credit to so and so.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And like.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Nope, nope.

[Marc Maron]

So you always do. And in fairness, Chris Hardwick always gives me credit, as does Scott Aukerman. There are some others that don't, and they're wrong, and that's okay.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, well, I mean, where are those guys? Where's Hardwick? Do you. Are you in touch or.

[Marc Maron]

I. No, No. I. I don't know. I hope. I hope he's well.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I. I'm sure he's fine.

[Marc Maron]

Does he host the Wall still? I don't know.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Maybe.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I think he might be up in. Wherever it is up, you know, up north. Swimming in the Hearst Castle.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. He's got a castle.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

He splashes around while some night watches over him.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But let's talk like. Because when you talk about podcasting, sometimes people would go, you know, they'll say, like, well, Adam Curry.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I mean. I mean, yeah, but Marconi did something too. You know, it's what you do with the. With the units.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But do you have any idea. Like, I have no sense of. Because even when people call me og, I know that I was there after you. But at the time where the medium was starting to get a little bit of attention, but hardly any.

[Marc Maron]

Barely.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, barely. But a lot of people cite these other podcasts that were around before. I think it was even that accessible. Well, I mean, you had to listen on the computer.

[Marc Maron]

You did have to listen to your computer. And there were, you know, if we're talking strictly comedy, Keith and the girl were doing something on the east coast.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Well, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I give them credit sometimes, but not for us. Not as often as I should.

[Marc Maron]

I give them credit because they were before us. But Todd Glass, the brilliantly funny Todd Glass, in my opinion, said it best that, yes, there were other podcasts, but Jimmy Pardo was the first person with a name that you knew who was doing a podcast.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And I think that's a good way to say it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm very grateful that my producer and co host to this day, Matt Belknap, came to me with the idea, and you know what? We didn't know what we were doing.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And to me, I was between television jobs, and let's give this thing a go. And it was a way, just like you to express my point of view without a network telling me what to say or do.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

And, you know, it was. We had an audience right away, and then people kind of then started thinking, well, what's a podcast? And then other people started getting into podcasting, but still not knowing what it was.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then it took off.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, how do you, like. Are you still all audio?

[Marc Maron]

No, no, we've been video for. We were. I think we were the first to do video.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

We were one of the first to do video. No question about that.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And are you still a paywall situation? Has that evolved?

[Marc Maron]

We have a. You get a. There's a free show every week, and then there's shows behind a paywall every week as well.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Because I remember at the beginning that was sort of like you were the guy that. That always had the paywall. That was your model.

[Marc Maron]

Well, here's the. Here's the thing. One could argue it was the greatest thing that we ever did.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And one could argue it was the worst thing we ever did. We had been doing it for two years.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And to your point from earlier, podcasting was still kind of like you'd invite somebody, hey, you want to do my podcast? What are we doing?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

They wouldn't know.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

And then they'd come, and they would have a great time. But it still wasn't catching on. It still was questionable. You're on an ipod. You're on a computer. How are you listening to it?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Old people had no idea.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, my dad still says, what's going on with the cast.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah. Where do I get that? How do you watch it?

[Marc Maron]

And so he. We then were like, well, you know what? And also, is this thing even going anywhere? Is podcasting a thing?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

So we made a decision back in 2008 to, let's go Behind a paywall. Let's decide to charge money for this, and if that fails, then we'll just quit.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then luckily enough, a big enough audience followed with the paywall.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, we.

[Marc Maron]

But then we're behind the paywall.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then in 2009, the Comedy Podcast boom exploded.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And Jimmy Pardo, who started it all, is behind a paywall and is not being included in any press or anything.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Locked in a prison of his own making.

[Marc Maron]

It really was so one. Again, one could argue it was the greatest thing because I was able to buy a house because of it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But I also then was left behind as kind of the beta tape while you guys with VHS move forward. And, you know, you and Aukerman and. And. And. And, you know, Hardwick again and others that were very popular at that time.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Who was it? Let's think about it. Like Rogan.

[Marc Maron]

Well, he started before he went nuts.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right. Jay Moore. Jay Kevin Smith.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Doug Benson.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, Doug was there. Doug was in it right after we were. So Doug. Doug's kind of one of the OGs as well.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Because I'm trying to sort of remember, like, you know, when we all had to communicate with each other and do.

[Marc Maron]

Each other's shows, it was very incestuous for a while.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't know if it was incestuous. I feel like it was a community thing, you know, I like that positive spin on it. Well, yeah, I mean, we didn't really know how to get other guests, but we knew that the comedy community was big enough. I always reflect on that because when I started, it was primarily comics who I needed to apologize to or sort things out with. But I do remember, and I don't think people realize it, that you guys were there. So you stayed with the paid wall.

[Marc Maron]

We stay with the people for, I think, four to five years. And then Earwolf, who had been courting us. Airwolf, the network. Airwolf.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Once Scott and Jeff created that.

[Marc Maron]

Yes.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And they. They had been courting us for years. And then we finally were like, we. We have to grow. We are. We're doing very well.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Again, I bought a house. Yeah, we're doing very well, but we're also plateauing.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

We need to do something. So let's take a risk and go to a free episode a week, plus the paywall. And luckily that has worked out as well.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And that. Well, that then mid roll evolved. So you were able to get advertised.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, we got advertising for the free. For the free show. Yeah. And then, yeah, subscribers for the other.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But like. So let's go back to when. So you've got your thing going. You're the. You know, you're one of the. The only guys. You got an income. You got a payroll. And you say 2009 comedy podcast blew up, but still nobody was making money. Nobody was really making.

[Marc Maron]

Well, we. Luckily we were.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's right. So that's why you held your ground.

[Marc Maron]

But that's why we held our ground. Exactly.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So. But your feeling was, you know, Fuck.

[Marc Maron]

Well, my feeling was. Fuck. My feeling was, oh, my God, I'm getting left behind. I was like, this leader of this.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm getting left behind.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And admittedly I was. I mean, your show welcomes this kind of talk. I got a little jealous.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I got a little bitter.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Welcome to this guy. That's all I talk about.

[Marc Maron]

I mean, that's. I mean, that's. The truth is, like, you got bitter. I did get a little bitter. I got a little bitter that, like, here's all these. All these, you know, online, you know, they're doing the best podcast of the year. The. Here's the hot comedy podcast. Here's the. Here's the ones that open up the door.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No one. No one knows you're out.

[Marc Maron]

And nobody knows we're out there except you and Aukerman and others. Giving me credit to the people writing the article, but the person writing the article doesn't then do the legwork of then like, well, hey, three people have mentioned you be part of. Did you be part of.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And they never would.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So did this.

[Marc Maron]

Didn't fit their narrative?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Did this strain your life was there? Did it cause trouble? Were you running around the house, going fuck out in the yard, you know, hitting things?

[Marc Maron]

That seems extreme, but in my brain, I was doing all that. I was. I did. And. But again, at the same time, how do you bitch that it's not going well when it's going well?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, because there's something about us that, you know, because I think we're infantile, that if we're.

[Marc Maron]

If we're.

[Jimmy Pardo]

If we're not getting the validation.

[Marc Maron]

I want the pat on the head. That's the truth. I want the pat on the head.

[Jimmy Pardo]

This is your pat on the head, Jimmy.

[Marc Maron]

Thank you. And I mean this sincerely. I. I've said it before. I am flattered that you always mention me as an inspiration. And I'm honored that while you're wrapping up your show, you took you. I'm gonna get emotional that you contacted me to be one of your final guests. It means the world to me. I want you to know that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, thank you. I, I, I, I did. I thought it was. I wanted to do it.

[Marc Maron]

Well, thank you. And I said to my. I said to my son Oliver, who's a. Who's.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How old's that kid now?

[Marc Maron]

He is a freshman in high. I'm sorry, freshman in college.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Isn't that crazy?

[Marc Maron]

He's brilliantly funny.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

He, he's telling the state of show business.

[Marc Maron]

It's inevitable. He's, he's got it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

And you know, it's a comedian.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I'm not just saying this as his dad. I'm saying it as a comedian.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

When you see a guy do stand up or do any comedy, he's doing stand up. He's got to get out of this. He's got no business. He, he needs to be in the business.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But you know who I said that about?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Who's that?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Jeff Ross.

[Marc Maron]

I said that about, you've made some mistakes. You made some errors at your time, but, yes, he's very talented. But I said, I thought. I was just on the phone with him seconds ago. We were talking about a movie, but he said, what are you doing? I go, I'm going over to do Mark Merritt's podcast. And he goes, who's that? I go, I go, the guy from Sticks.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Huh?

[Marc Maron]

And then he said, the band? I go, no, the, the golf, television.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wow.

[Marc Maron]

He's very hurtful. My son does not care for you or your comedy.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Very hurtful.

[Marc Maron]

Very hurtful. He said, is that the guy that had Obama on his podcast? I said, yes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

The fact that he can know Sticks to band and not know me, and why would he. How did. Why would he know Sticks to Band?

[Marc Maron]

You. His dad's a classic rock idiot.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

He there.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Like what? Stick songs.

[Marc Maron]

What do you mean? He knows them all.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Like, lady.

[Marc Maron]

He knows.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And, and what. What are some of the other stick songs?

[Marc Maron]

Grand Illusion's a big hit.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Oh, yeah?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Fooling Yourself. Which one? You're fooling yourself and you don't believe it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

They've got.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What are we, the same age? How old are you?

[Marc Maron]

I'm younger than you. By about 15 years.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wow, you just stopped aging. Is that same as paywall? You decided at some point, you know.

[Marc Maron]

I'm working, I might as well stay here. They get bitter about other people looking great.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I haven't thought about sticks in a while.

[Marc Maron]

I. He is.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I saw him in concert.

[Marc Maron]

You know, I've seen them probably 55 times.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Come on.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, they're one of my favorite bands.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You're a praggy guy.

[Marc Maron]

I do. Marillion is one of my favorite bands.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I. I remember saw him once and the seats weren't good. No sticks. Yeah, I saw sticks. And it was far away. And it was on the Grand Illusion tour.

[Marc Maron]

1977.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right. So I was still in high school.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yep.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, that makes sense. Like maybe a freshman or sophomore.

[Marc Maron]

So you are a little older than me.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I'm 61.

[Marc Maron]

Happy birthday.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Next month or this month, I'll be. I'm going to be 62. And 10 days.

[Marc Maron]

Here comes the cake.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, Happy birthday. How old are you?

[Marc Maron]

I am 59.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay. So, yeah, we're in the same zone, same ballpark. So your kid, is he getting on stage?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, he's done some. He's done stand up at. At Flappers a Bunch in Burbank.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

And then he's done some gigs with me down, like, in San Diego.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

And.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, he opens for you.

[Marc Maron]

He goes up and does 10 minutes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Did he change his name?

[Marc Maron]

I told him, go up and use your first and middle name so that they don't know you're the headliner's kid.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then he's like, I don't care.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I'm like, okay, if you don't care.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wait till he gets big. Because, you know, you start dropping the word name Pardo around.

[Marc Maron]

Shake this thing loose fast.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's right.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

This thing.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You might can have a Nepo baby situation.

[Marc Maron]

Don't have this albatross on your neck, son. You don't want that. Start fresh.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But he's. What, do you give him notes?

[Marc Maron]

I do give him notes.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And he listens.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. He's a better joke writer than I am. You know, so. But I still. I. He's a better joke writer, but I've always been able to help people tighten the screws on jokes.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And.

[Marc Maron]

And so, like, he'll have the. He'll do it on stage, and I'll go, hey, you know what? Work. Let's move this here. Let's move this here. And what do you think about this as a callback?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, and then he tries it. It works or it doesn't.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, sure.

[Marc Maron]

And it's pretty cool.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And it's okay if he's bombing in front of his dad?

[Marc Maron]

Oh, no, no. That's stress, man. As his dad, I'm in the back of the room. Like, if you see another guy bomb a comic friend, that's the other Side.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Of using your name, it's like distant cousin.

[Marc Maron]

Just a coincidence. Carlo's very common show business name, but he's doing great. And I. He just started freshman year down at Chapman University.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You got another one too, right?

[Marc Maron]

No, no, just him.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Just him.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. So we're Danielle and I, huh? We're empty nesters.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How's that going?

[Marc Maron]

Oh, sad and depressing.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Is it?

[Marc Maron]

Oh, it's horrible. Yeah.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Why?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Because you get. You getting to know her a little bit?

[Marc Maron]

Well, she's getting to know me. She doesn't care for me. You know, when you're. When you only have a. When you have an only child. And he is so aligned comedically with. With the two of us.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And we go to the movie. We like the same movies. We like this. And so we would move together as this unit. And then he leaves. And it's only been a month. Yeah, it's. The house is lonely. It's empty.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I bet. I feel like the last time we ever had a conversation was you needed a handyman.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, you thought Ernie. Ernie, yeah. Ernie was in the wind the last time we talked.

[Jimmy Pardo]

In the wind.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Because we couldn't.

[Marc Maron]

We couldn't locate Ernie. And so I like saying that Ernie's in the wind.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Did he do some. He did some work.

[Marc Maron]

Ernie. He's done great work over the years for me.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And that was a long time ago.

[Marc Maron]

I have not seen him. He and I went to. Coincidentally went to see the Cars in concerts.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You and Ernie.

[Marc Maron]

And nobody was more angry at how bad that show was than Ernie.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, really?

[Marc Maron]

Ernie's favorite band of all time was the Cars.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

He had never seen them live.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Couldn't believe that they reunited so he could see them.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, how much was left? Was it just Elliot Easton?

[Marc Maron]

It was everybody but Benjamin Orr. It was everybody.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okasich was still alive.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

And the show was absolutely atrocious. It was really boring.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Was it outside?

[Marc Maron]

It was at the Palladium.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

And Ernie, the next day was like, you know, back to work on my house. And he's like, that thing was. That was. That was a waste of my money. I ruined. I ruined my memories of that band. And he wasn't wrong.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wow, that's something to ruin your memories of a band.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, that's how bad they were.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, I've never really thought of that approach to my criticism of boomer rock in the sense that, like, I don't go see a lot of it because I think that that that's a possibility. Like, I see footage of ACDC right now. And I'm like, yeah, it's a hard pass on that.

[Marc Maron]

I saw him on their Black Train tour, acdc, and I think I saw them at their last great tour.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I don't need to see them again because of that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That'll actually alter your good feelings.

[Marc Maron]

It will.

[Jimmy Pardo]

About the band.

[Marc Maron]

Yes. I don't want to leave there going, yeah, too.

[Jimmy Pardo]

They went on too long.

[Marc Maron]

I'm in a fight with that right now with the band Chicago. You know, that's my favorite band.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How many are left of them?

[Marc Maron]

One.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What? You can't. Like, for me, it's sort of like I. There would never be a time I could see Chicago where they would have been as good as they were with Terry Cash.

[Marc Maron]

Well, they were great. They were great in the 80s and 90s. I'm not going to dismiss that.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Okay. All right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Because of the horns.

[Marc Maron]

I've seen them this nor lie 112 times. I just saw them last Friday for the 112th time.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And.

[Marc Maron]

And it's the first time that I left going, I don't think I can keep doing this because I don't want to remember them this way. Yeah, they're great. They're a bunch of session musicians doing those great songs that you love.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

But the magic of me going there, like I did in 1981, when I saw them for the first time and got chills.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And then I had chills for 30 years seeing them.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And to your point, I walked out going, those songs still bring me joy. I'm glad I went. But that might be it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No chills.

[Marc Maron]

No chills.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No chills.

[Marc Maron]

No chills.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So you really go see a lot of music?

[Marc Maron]

I go to. I love it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, I don't do that.

[Marc Maron]

It's my. It's my hobby.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I went to, like. I saw the Flaming Lips. For me, it's like, it's got to be. I got to be set up. I have a good seat.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I got to leave. You know, when they go off stage the first time.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't want to battle traffic. And, you know, I'm good for having a good time for about 45 minutes.

[Marc Maron]

Then you're out.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, then I'm sort of like, all.

[Marc Maron]

Right, you got it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, I got it.

[Marc Maron]

You're a little hipper than me, though.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, that's not true. It's not hipness. It's really just anxiety.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that part of it is anxiety, and I don't disagree with that anxiety. As far as the bands, I. I See, really nothing but bands that will stop in the next five years and that I will have no shows to go to.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

With the exception of Dawes, who I adore.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You're like a Dawes guy. Oh, wow. I got to get into that.

[Marc Maron]

They are the. Taylor Goldsmith is maybe one of the greatest songwriters of all time.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Their amp guy have helped me fix that amp down there.

[Marc Maron]

Is that right?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah. It had nothing to do with Dawes, but the guy who fixed my amp fixes theirs. Well, yeah, that's something. Is that the only new band you like?

[Marc Maron]

I'm not. I try. I do love Taylor Swift. I, you can't deny that she's a great singer, songwriter.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure, sure.

[Marc Maron]

So I, I, I enjoy her and Dawes, and then otherwise not, not in the loop. I'm a classic rock guy.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I, I find that I, when I.

[Marc Maron]

80S, 80s. You know that 80s sound.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure. Yeah, I, I guess so. Were you a Toto guy?

[Marc Maron]

You know what? Here's the thing. I like them on record, but live, they're just okay to me. So I don't need to see Toto live. I've seen them a bunch.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

In my life, but they were just here at the Forum and I did not go because I've seen them.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It's so weird. Super.

[Marc Maron]

I like them the same as ELO where like, yeah, you know what? These 10 songs are great, but okay.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right, but you give other, like, you know, eight song bands a pass if you like them.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I mean, 10 songs is a lot of songs.

[Marc Maron]

It's a lot of songs.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Foreigner, I.

[Marc Maron]

Foreigner, I joke with my son. That's his favorite band. It is not.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Stop it.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, but we've seen them a bunch.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I've dragged him to see Foreigner a bunch. I love them.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And what are you getting out of that? Hot Blooded, you get Hot Blooded, you.

[Marc Maron]

Get cold as ice. Feels like the first time.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, it feels like the first time.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Those are great songs, dude. Head Games. Head Games. They're great. Yeah. I mean, I, I, I have no shame in liking Classroom. For years I hid it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I'm not laughing at you.

[Marc Maron]

I know you're not.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I know because when I was during that era in high school. So you graduated in what, 83?

[Marc Maron]

84.

[Jimmy Pardo]

84. I graduated in 81. So you were in junior high, which is a better time for all this shit to be happening. But when I was in high school, you know, Foreigner was huge. Van Halen one happened.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, there was, there was still a lot of Bob Seeger around for some Reason?

[Marc Maron]

Bob's a good singer. Songwriter.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Great. No, I got no problem.

[Marc Maron]

You were on the east coast, right?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Nope. New Mexico.

[Marc Maron]

Oh. I thought you were East Coast. So sick. Because Sammy is huge.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I saw Sammy Hagar in concert.

[Marc Maron]

You loved him.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I saw him do that first tour Red for the album. Red.

[Marc Maron]

That's a good song. Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And then he does that Montrose song, the Bad Motor Scooter. Dude sits on that block with the. With the lap steel, remember?

[Marc Maron]

Great song.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

And Rock Candy is a great song.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Look, I. I witnessed it all.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But I sometimes feel like it was. You know, I was attacked by it every day and that, you know. You know, I know all the songs. I don't know that I bought the records. But certainly you couldn't avoid the songs.

[Marc Maron]

Right?

[Jimmy Pardo]

So I feel like I was. I. It was almost like I was. What do you call it? What do you.

[Marc Maron]

Inundated.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Inundated, but assaulted. Assaulted, but what's the one where you.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

You.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You convince someone they're crazy or you brainwash. No, no. When it does, it happens in relationships.

[Marc Maron]

Gaslight.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I believe I was gaslight.

[Marc Maron]

You were gaslit by classic rock.

[Jimmy Pardo]

A little bit.

[Marc Maron]

You think you were classic rock? Glass.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You sure? A little bit.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know how that's possible, but I hear what you're saying. By the way, can we turn my headphones up just a tad?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, sure.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How's that?

[Marc Maron]

Can I tell you something about old man?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah. Is that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Is that good?

[Marc Maron]

Yes, Perfect. Okay. Two years ago, I'm sitting on the couch. My wife and son and I were watching television. And I get. For years, because I. You know, I've listened to rock music. I would get tinnitus every now and then with that little whistle.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And it would whistle and go away.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And so when people say they suffer from night is. I'd be like, so who cares about that?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, Everyone gets.

[Marc Maron]

It comes and goes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

So I'm on the couch, and the whistle comes and the whistle doesn't leave.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Oh.

[Marc Maron]

And then I say, hey, did you guys just turn the sound of the TV off? And they went, no, I went deaf for about five minutes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

And then I. The next day, I was rushed, and they gave me an injection into my ear, and they saved my hearing. So, yes, my hearing is not as good as it was two years ago.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What the. Was it? What do you mean? They gave you an injection in your ear?

[Marc Maron]

4 Injections of steroids into my ear.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, closed up on you.

[Marc Maron]

No. Old Manny losing hearing.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I. I never had tinnitus But I had some. Like, there was a period there. My. Where my left ear sounded like a busted speaker.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It would go, you know, like, it would.

[Marc Maron]

It would rattle. And so what do they do to solve that?

[Jimmy Pardo]

There was nothing to do. I went to the ear doctor and he's like, I don't see anything wrong with it. And then it. Eventually, you know, if you're lucky, almost, I would say 50% of the stuff that this. That happens, if you give it a little time, it'll go away.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. But I was so afraid that you live with it. I thought I was deaf.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So I think these earphones have a vacuum to them. I think there's something about.

[Marc Maron]

They suck it in a little bit.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Is that possible?

[Marc Maron]

I don't know. You know, I would talk to about your ear and hear me out.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

The amp guy from Dawes, this guy's all about the sound systems.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But the old man thing, I had a little bout with it last night.

[Marc Maron]

What happened, brother?

[Jimmy Pardo]

I was. I was at Largo. Joe Mandy one had him. You know, Fanny had me come down to Joe Mandy show.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And I get there at 8 and they're like, you're closing. And it's Joe and three other acts. So I'm waiting around and. Well, a couple old man things happened is that I napped.

[Marc Maron]

You napped? While the other comments were.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, yeah. Right, right. Backstage. Like not even in the dressing room on that couch backstage at Largo so.

[Marc Maron]

They could look over to the left and see international podcaster, star of sticks.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Napping, Napping. And I think James Austin Johnson, he apparently told me planning that, you know, should we check on him? Should we poke him? But I took a nap. But then I. When I was in and out of consciousness, I just heard these younger comics killing.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And I got nothing right now because I just did a special and now I'm closing and all that insecurity came on me. Well, yeah, you remember, you remember when you. You were doing open mics and you'd get to like the. The last slot on an open mic and you know, you've already watched most of the audience go, yes. And then the host comes out, goes, you guys okay for one more guy. We got one more guy. Yeah, I have one more guy that I had that.

[Marc Maron]

You had that energy or you had that your head.

[Jimmy Pardo]

In my hair. In my head. It's like, you guys, don't leave yet. We got one more guy.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That energy.

[Marc Maron]

You felt that they had already seen enough show. And now here's the guy from Glo.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's the stand up comic who just did an HBO special. Yeah, same guy. So I let two of them in. I mean, I took two of your shots.

[Marc Maron]

They're not. You must know this. And we talk about it on my award winning podcast, Never Enough Money. You're terrific.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You've been doing that how long?

[Marc Maron]

It's 19 years. You are on both Glow. You are phenomenal on Glow. You brought me to tears on Glow.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, thanks.

[Marc Maron]

That's the truth. I'm not saying that because you're in front of me. I said it on the program.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Thank you.

[Marc Maron]

And then sticks. That's an unwatchable show. But you're fantastic.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, thank you. A lot of people like it.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, they're not watching it properly.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Are you a golf guy?

[Marc Maron]

I am. I went to. I had a golf lesson today. Really? Yeah. I used to be on a golf team in high school. That's how good I was. And I, I've lost my, I've lost it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How, how much have you lost? All of it.

[Marc Maron]

All of it. To where this guy is like, you're not doing bad for a guy who's starting. I'm like, not starting. I've been playing for four years.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Where do you golf?

[Marc Maron]

I, I, Whoever. Anybody invites me.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I'm not good anymore.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I, well, back to what I was saying. Well, I realized that all of my jokes, if you look at your jokes, I haven't checked in with you in a long time. But over the course of my last few specials, which I think got better and better, I think I did the best one I could do, but I realized that I'm talking about the same things. So it's all from my point of view, and I'm talking about the same themes. And there comes to a point where it's like, dude, I think the well is dry. You better start looking outside yourself, you know? But like, I'm like you. I mean, I'm not classic rock guy specifically, but I feel a little out of the loop.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, I can comment broadly on things, but most of the stuff that I do, I. Comes from inside of me. Because I thought that was the only way I could do it where no one could take it and I wouldn't be competing with anybody.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I, listen, I'm gonna, I'm gonna say this as a, as a, as your friend. You don't see each other often enough, but I would consider you a friend. I say this as your friend and a fan of your comedy.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Get out of Your head, because you're doing great work.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But that's where it all comes from.

[Marc Maron]

Of course. Of course. But you're worried about that you're repeating yourself, that you're doing the same things and stuff. No, you're doing great work. The specials are terrific.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Thank you.

[Marc Maron]

I did not expect to come here and kiss your ass like this. I don't care for it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, it's. It's uncomfortable for me, too.

[Marc Maron]

What was the clip that was going.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Around recently with the Ovon Hitler and.

[Marc Maron]

Theo von dude in 45 seconds? Just perfection. Just perfection. Thank you.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, that makes me feel better. I guess I'll keep doing it.

[Marc Maron]

No, you're supposed to be quitting. Get out of my way.

[Jimmy Pardo]

This is your time, Jimmy.

[Marc Maron]

It's Jason Bateman's time.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Is it?

[Marc Maron]

It's a good thing the movie stars are doing it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But you know what's weird is that, like, the one benefit of. Of algorithm driven entertainment is none of us really know how anyone's doing. I mean, you know, they may get a lot of attention.

[Marc Maron]

They're filling the Hollywood Bowl. I think they're doing okay, but that's because they're celebrities.

[Jimmy Pardo]

They filled the Hollywood Bowl.

[Marc Maron]

Well, they. Yeah, they're coming up at the Hollywood Bowl. I don't know if they filled it. It hasn't happened yet. There could be six people who goes to those shows. Could you imagine sitting at the very last row of the Hollywood Bowl?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Watch. I can't imagine sitting for any podcast. I mean, I used to do live podcasts, and I. I didn't know why they were there.

[Marc Maron]

They're there, they're excited because you're in their ears twice a week or once, and they.

[Jimmy Pardo]

They want to see it happen in real time.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Although, can we agree on this? The live shows are never the same as what they enjoy that we do in the studio.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But I think, to speak to your point, they.

[Marc Maron]

They.

[Jimmy Pardo]

They like seeing us?

[Marc Maron]

I think so, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I mean, I shouldn't begrudge the audience, but I used to think that too. It's like, who would go to comedy?

[Marc Maron]

So how does your set go at Largo? It probably went fine.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It was fine. But, like, I. And I realize this is part of the process for me is that, like, when I dump the. The hour, which I do once, it. What's it? Errors. Once it's out there, everyone can see it. I start pretty much new, and I think I forget what that feels like. It's a very vulnerable kind of frightening, draining feeling to just go up for 15 minutes and go, like, I got to do all new.

[Marc Maron]

But can I ask you a question? Why do you think you have to do all new? Because, like, for instance, let's use your Theo von Hitler as an example. If I'm coming to see. Oh, good, Marc Maron's here.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Maybe he'll do the Theo Vaughn.

[Marc Maron]

Maybe he'll do the Theo Vaughn bit. And I would be excited to hear it. So why do you think you've got to discard that material? I mean, been, do you and I have been doing this a long time.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And, and I, I, I, I hear you. I like to keep my show fresh. And I do that by not writing any jokes and just doing, just improvising my hour every night.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Crowd work.

[Marc Maron]

It's all crowd work, but not in the Matt R. Shitty kind of way. I'm doing it in the way that it's supposed to be done.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Which is how cleverly.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, you know, not I want to your aunt. You know what I mean?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So I don't know that kid, he seems like a nice kid.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't know, he's mad at me constantly because I, I, I, I, I kind of, I guess I poke at him.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Because he's got a chiseled jaw. Get out of comedy.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's why I remember one time I was walking years ago, before I had any TV, I was in New York, it's probably the late 80s, and, you know, I'm wandering around the East Village with ck, you know, and he was, you know, he was, hadn't, I don't think he had done his first letterman yet. And he was all worked up about Jay Moore, because Jay Moore came in from Jersey. He was like 17 years old and he was a cute kid, you know, and he's real charming, you know, Jay back in, I don't know if you knew him back then, but Louis was like, it's not for him. It's not for the attractive guys.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It's not there. It's for us. And part of me was like, what do you mean, us?

[Marc Maron]

What do you mean us? I'm kind of a good looking guy.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, I look all right.

[Marc Maron]

Trying to get by like everybody else. That's hysterical. You know, I used to say that about back in the day. I used to, it used to infuriate me was like, Gary Goldman would get on stage and he would talk about how he had a tough time in high school. Like, tough time. You're tall and gorgeous.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then he's become one of the best Stand up comics of all time, in my opinion. And watching that transition of going, oh, I misjudged him. I did judge a book by its cover.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

By this tall, good looking guy with a gorgeous head of hair. Well, he can't possibly. It's not for him. Go be your model and let me 5 foot 4 nerd get the laughs.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, well, you were wrong about that guy.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, my God. Yeah, so I'm wrong about a lot of people. I think that's good. I mean, like, I'm right about a lot too.

[Jimmy Pardo]

In all honesty, I don't. When I criticize. And I think we can talk about this with podcasting too. You know, when I criticize other comics for there, it's. It's not coming out of some personal resentment at this time. It's coming out of, you know, what does it do to our field, dude, Can.

[Marc Maron]

Can I jump in right here?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

That is how I feel. So when you ask me about am I doing an hour of crowd work?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

What does it do to our field?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I am currently furious.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

At everybody putting clips of here's my crowd work from this set. Here's my crowd work from this set. Hey, I've got to work on my crowd work. No, do what you do. Yeah, this is what I do. This is what made me and Todd Berry special.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

We would go out and Todd Barry, by the way, who is one of the best jokers of all time, but also is a great crowd. There's guys that are great at crowd work.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And Rick Ingram.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know Rick, but I'll take your word for it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

He's a Comedy store crowd work guy. Old school.

[Marc Maron]

It's what we do. Well, I mean, I'm 59.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, I'm talking about Rick. He's younger, but he does it in a way where it's kind of smart.

[Marc Maron]

And I see.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So the part away. Yeah, I guess that's my point. What. What is it doing to our craft? And so I get. Very fair. I was just at the. At the Mic Drop and Chandler is on over the weekend on Sunday night and the management.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Braggart.

[Marc Maron]

Come on Sunday, 6, 6pm show. I'm doing a matinee. How much? Don't know how much I'm bragging, but they were a great crowd. I'm. I was grateful that they showed up and. But the management was very kind afterwards to. And, and to your point from earlier, we still need to hear this. They were like, you know, so many guys are doing crowd work. Not like what I just saw.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And it means the world to me that they. That at least they can see the difference of, oh, this guy's doing it. Interestingly.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Everybody else is doing it. Because that seems to be the easy way to get laughs nowadays.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I just find it lazy, and I don't find it funny. And so I don't like what it's doing to our craft right now. So when people go, oh, part of the crowd work guy. Not like those other people.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And also just the, you know, chasing the likes and the job of getting clips up and everything else. You know, look, I work improvisationally. I don't. I don't do a lot of crowd work unless I feel embarrassed in a moment.

[Marc Maron]

Is that true?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I know how to do it, but I'm usually, you know, it can get pretty spiteful pretty quickly.

[Marc Maron]

Okay.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And I'll, you know, I'll talk to the people and sometimes. But usually it's when, you know, an audience member has gotten the best of me or I. Something up. Like last night, I was on stage at Largo, and, you know, I wasn't paying attention because I was, like, locked into the bit and I was moving around and the stool. I knocked into the stool and it fell over. And somehow or another, the mic cord had gotten tangled in one of the rungs on the stool, and I couldn't figure out why. How does it get in there?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And then I picked up the stool, and I was like, how did this happen? Then I said, I'm closing with magic.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But very happy about that.

[Marc Maron]

Of course you were. You kidding me? I would. Then, if that were me, I would figure out a way to go. Like, how do I wrap the cord around the stool every night? Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

That's my new closer.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It's a big closer.

[Marc Maron]

How do I. I. While they're not. While I'm over here talking, how do I wrap it around the. The leg?

[Jimmy Pardo]

What happened to all the guys, man?

[Marc Maron]

What do you mean?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Do you.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Are you starting to feel like, you know, there have guys in our generation where it's like, I don't know what happened to that guy. I mean, we're talking about Jimmy Dore, but he's still at it.

[Marc Maron]

You mean that they've gone nuts?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, no, there's that, but. But just sort of disappeared. Do you know anybody?

[Marc Maron]

You know, We. We. You and I talked about this a little bit before we got on the air.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I'm so locked into never not funny.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And booking that show and Doing that show. That. And I don't do a lot of stand up around town.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So I don't know the young people.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

And I also don't have a chance to run. Thousands of people.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Thousands of young people.

[Marc Maron]

But weren't we. Weren't we one of the thousands?

[Jimmy Pardo]

I'm not grudging them. Yeah, totally. I just. I felt old because of these young guns.

[Marc Maron]

I do, too. When I. When I go on a show like that and it's like I feel like what I have nothing to offer. But then I realize, like you probably realized. But I'm also really good at this.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And so I'm going to bring them. I'm going to do something they didn't. They. Yes. They just saw four great comedians.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But now they're going to see me.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's nice.

[Marc Maron]

And then I get in my car and go. That was just. I think I let them down.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I drive over the Danielle's, like, how'd it go? I don't know.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sometimes I just can't. And I think I must do it to myself on purpose sometimes. I just cannot detach from the bad set. Like, you know, it won't last a long time.

[Marc Maron]

When's the last time you had a bad sex?

[Jimmy Pardo]

A bad one?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. That's bad.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Really? A tanker.

[Marc Maron]

It's got to be 20 years.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, no. I had one. There's only one that I really remember. But how recent was probably three or four years ago at the. You know, I was in New York and you hadn't been in New York in a long time. And I got. I did a spot at the Comedy Cellar, but the.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Not that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Not the. The old room, but around the corner. And I didn't have my New York dukes up and I went on after Soder and it was just real flat. It wasn't silence, but it was flat enough for me to feel that sweat on the back of my neck.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Because like, I, you know, I have the. The. The kind of physical ability to pretend like I'm not bombing, but the inside doesn't lie.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Oh, I know.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Felt that sweat. Says that's a bad feeling.

[Marc Maron]

That is a horrible feeling.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And last night I was sort of like setting myself up to fail, but I couldn't do it.

[Marc Maron]

I don't see you failing.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I appreciate.

[Marc Maron]

See them getting excited to see you. And even your story about being at the Cellar, it confuses me.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, it was.

[Marc Maron]

I think you're a guy. I don't know why I'm doing this today. Yeah, there's all this boosting your ego.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Business, but I'm a little fragile. This was just last night.

[Marc Maron]

Well, you, you seem to me like a guy who is, is, is a fail safe. Yeah, like, oh, we got, you know, Marin's coming up no matter what. Even if the guy kills. Oh, good, Marin's next. He's going to kill too. Or if the guy. Before you go, oh, yeah, he struggled, sure. Good. Here's Marin. Bring it back.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, right now I'll tell you, there's some Marin within me that's saying, don't listen to this guy. Oh, you gotta fucking work harder. You stink.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that guy's not wrong either. Yeah, I'm kidding.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So let's talk about the, the. The what, what, what's happened with podcasting? Like how many. Okay, so if we, we can identify comics that have disappeared, how many sort of dead, abandoned podcasts are there out there?

[Marc Maron]

There are a gazillion of them, but there's also tens of thousands of podcasts happening. But think about when we, when you and I first exploded. And then every comic. It was almost like when Dane Cook, Remember when Dane Cook Did MySpace?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And every comic went, I gotta go to MySpace, Daddy.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

That's the secret to being successful.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And then you had to figure out how to get followers on MySpace and then you had to call a certain guy to like, you know, can you give me those? Can you remember I.

[Marc Maron]

Do you know who I'm talking about? About getting followers for you? Yeah, yeah. Did I do that for a while? I did it for one month and I felt so badly because they were.

[Jimmy Pardo]

All like, you know, these weird. Most of them were from Thailand, I think.

[Marc Maron]

And who.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't know what it.

[Marc Maron]

Good. You've got all those. But, you know, in your brain, you know it's phony.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, I knew it was phony, but I knew that other people were doing it and I didn't know how it really worked. And now you have, you know, bots and everything and I didn't know what it meant. But you just want that number to be a little. They weren't going to help you fan wise.

[Marc Maron]

No, no. But you wanted that number in case somebody from the quote unquote industry would go, Mark Mirren, I don't know, he's.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Only got this many space. Didn't even work like that. It was just an ego thing.

[Marc Maron]

Yes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Like, how do you. I didn't even really commit to MySpace, but there was a time there where we had to do it.

[Marc Maron]

Oh yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And it Wasn't easy to get shit up there, but, you know, Dane kind of fucked us all up. He was the guy that started this cancer of interacting with technology in a compulsive way to where, like, I don't do it anymore. Like, I have somebody post my clips. But these younger comics, you know, God bless them, I guess, but the game is so different that they spend all their time, you know, editing clips and trying to get that up there. I know, you know, for these, like, one minute long things. So I.

[Marc Maron]

But again, they're. They're working a different landscape than you and I did when we started. We used to have to send VHS tapes out to get bookings. They now can go, here's my one minute clip of, you know, that has 1 million views. Please book me. And then they have 12 minutes and they suck.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, but Kravitz, you know, Steve Kravitz, I know that.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Older comic now. A little older than me. But I remember just a couple years ago he came out of the fog at the Comedy Store. I'm like, what's going on, Kravitz? How's it going? This is like, I would say maybe four or five years ago. He goes, I don't know what's going on. I don't even know where to send my tape. I'm like, back to 1992.

[Marc Maron]

That a boy. Yeah, set it back there. See if they can figure it out, how to plug in the machine. But your point of podcasting is what I was going to say about MySpace. Comparing it to. That was, here's Pardo and Aukerman and Marin and, you know, Paul F. Tompkins had one at the time, and other folks. And then people are like, oh, that I got to get a podcast.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

That's the next step. And then it's like, then it didn't happen. So to your point, then there's all these abandoned podcasts because they didn't explode like we did well there, because, well.

[Jimmy Pardo]

There was no way to make money.

[Marc Maron]

Or to get an audience if nobody knows who you are.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Just because you have one doesn't mean people are going to listen to it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I know, and that still happens.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

People ask me now, it's like, I'm going to start a podcast, but I don't do. I don't even do video. So, like, I'm analog. But. But I. They said, do you have any pointers? I'm like, don't. Don't expect much.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I mean, my advice is always have. Have a niche topic.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, because we. We've covered the white guys sitting around riffing. Have a niche topic. That's what people want now.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I guess so.

[Marc Maron]

Because there's already enough of us riffing.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah. Just like yammering white guys.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm one of them.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm very grateful that people care.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So do you. Have you held your audience?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, we lost a lot in 2016. We lost a lot in 2016 when I decided to stop worrying about offending people politically.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I just went, this. This is. This guy's an asshole. We're fucked. With this guy in charge, how you morons did not vote for Hillary is beyond me. And you think that you're being clever, but let's blow it all up. No.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I just. And then people were like, you're losing half your audience. See you later. Really? I don't care.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, take the others with you.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, go. And you still feel good about that now?

[Marc Maron]

I do.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I feel good about it. And we still get. I still get hate letters every now and then because of it. Like, hey, hey, you know what? You're pissing people off with what you said about this or what you said.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Good.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Someone's got. We're doing a lot of talking. We have to talk about something sometimes.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm also about my life.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You've come to it. You've come to the Jimmy Pardo show, and I'm talking about my life. And this is what my life is right now.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm supposed to ignore it and just be frightened and angry 100%, aren't you? How can we not be frightened and angry right now?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

It's a. We're living in weird times. And, yes. You come to a podcast like my stupid show, which is, you know, does have a lot of silliness, a lot of classic rock, a lot of 80s references, and we. We have fun.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But at the same time, if something happens in the news, I'm not going to ignore it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

And then, hey, I come to your show to get away from it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Well, then don't.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Then find another show to get away from.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I'm not a vacation.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So we did lose a lot. I mean, and a lot.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Wow.

[Marc Maron]

But I don't feel badly about it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And look, as a guy who's, you know, stopping his podcast, I mean, like, now, like, how do you. How do you feel about, you know, do you ever feel like. I think it's worn out, I.

[Marc Maron]

You know, What? There are, obviously, there's days where I think, like, what are we doing? But then an hour later, I'll go, you know what? I go there. I never. I never don't. I never feel like, oh, I gotta go. Do I gotta go to work? Yeah, I. I enjoy. I. I hate to drive. I. I have to drive an hour to my studio, and it's infuriating.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, you don't.

[Marc Maron]

I do.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Why'd you let that happen? Well, where the. Is your studio?

[Marc Maron]

It's in Sherman Oaks. And we.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Where are you?

[Marc Maron]

I'm down in Baldwin Hills, near Culver City.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Wow.

[Marc Maron]

And so we. We opened. We did our studio there because I. Again, at the time, I was working for Conan.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And so I would. And that was in the Valley.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So I would go do this. The podcast, and then go to Conan. It was like, oh, this is very convenient. And also the other cast members all live down in that area. The. You know, my co host and my video guy and.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Our intern of 14 years.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You're paying them, though?

[Marc Maron]

Is it a living wage? No, we do pay them. Yes, of course. Yeah. The. So that's why. That's why the studio's there. But I. I don't like the drive. But I don't. I'd never say, oh, I gotta go to work. I look forward to going. Because it's.

[Jimmy Pardo]

It's this.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And you lock in and you're like.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You get into the. The manic zone.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I never joined the guestless shows more often.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How have you been doing with guests?

[Marc Maron]

We don't find.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I mean, we don't book famous people as much as we used to because.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, everyone's got podcasts.

[Marc Maron]

You know, you can't compete with Conan o' Brien to Smart List. They're going to get the famous people.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And. But I don't. I want. I just want funny people.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I want interesting people.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And then if we can't get that, we'll do a show with just the cast. And people seem to enjoy those, too.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure. And a lot of people, like, don't.

[Marc Maron]

Like Todd Glass, Paul F. Tompkins. You know, Scott. You know, the people that have been doing the show literally, since it was at my dining room table.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How's Aukerman?

[Marc Maron]

You know Scott? Scott.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, he's great.

[Marc Maron]

I enjoy. I love him to death when he shows up.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

The dining room table. I remember in my old garage, I had this table and just my MacBook and one of these mics, you know, In a. Like, on a stump, A little stand.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Just sitting there. And it wasn't even put together. It was just a real garage. Just garbage.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Just stuff that didn't fit in the house.

[Marc Maron]

And that's what you brought the president into.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, by that time, it was a thing. It was a place that I had the mic booms. You set it up and there was, you know, everything was. You know, it was a very unique.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You were in that garage.

[Marc Maron]

I was in that garage.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But, like, why. Why are you not exhausted by it all and I am.

[Marc Maron]

I. I don't have sitcoms like you.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, right.

[Marc Maron]

That might. That might play into it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, I. I still a. I still enjoy doing it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And it's my outlet to be funny. It's my outlet to be creative.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, yeah. I feel that, too.

[Marc Maron]

So it's that.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I just. I feel like, you know, there's. When I do these interviews and I talk about, you know, what podcast has become, it's so weird to me that. And I didn't get into it specifically for money. I didn't believe that there was money to be made. I needed to keep working Right. And doing something creative. And then, like you said, there was a period there where it got popular, but it still was not any guarantee of making a living. But it was on the radar. But it took, like, a decade before people were like, I know what a podcast is.

[Marc Maron]

Do you remember when you and me and Aisha Tyler, we were on the COVID of Billboard magazine.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And the podcast. Boom. And people still didn't know what a podcast was, but we were on the COVID of Billboard magazine.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

They were pushing it.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But it still didn't quite take.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And then, like, I don't. I don't know how involved you were with that patent troll.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. We were part of that. Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, I know because I was at Belknap because he had started. He was starting a thing. What was it? It had a number in it. The platform.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, my God. Art 19.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah. Art 19.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And, like, in, like, I don't. I wish somebody. To me, that. That. That movie about the patent troll thing is equally as exciting as Apollo 13. That if we could just get people to play that core group of podcasters that were, you know, written this letter that we were using a patent in our technology that none of us had any knowledge of.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And it was a shakedown. We need you to cough up some money or we're going to shut you down. That. That it was like, it was crazy. But there was, there, there. Thank God the guy was just a patent troll and was looking for a quick payout because. And thank God for the iff they, they took on the case pro bono and were able to, to sort of kill the troll. But if he decided he wanted to go a more legit route and have his and license the technology, everybody would be paying up. Yeah, everyone who fucking did anything on these mics.

[Marc Maron]

Well, luckily he, I mean, his mistake was he didn't wait 10 more years. Could you imagine if he would have sat on that thing and then done it?

[Jimmy Pardo]

But like, we were in a panic about it.

[Marc Maron]

Yes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And you know, Belknap, I was like, when he was starting that new thing, I was like, can you guarantee us protection? And you know, he was in the sights too. But I don't think that people really know that story and that if that was what made me feel like we were talking about earlier, that at the beginning of the comedy podcast, more so than incestuous, and the fact that we were doing each other's shows, it really felt like a community.

[Marc Maron]

A hundred percent. I agree with that. And you know, we were all certainly in that. We were all in that together.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Totally.

[Marc Maron]

And we, and we had to be, we all had, we had to have each other's backs.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's right. And it was like kind of an amazing time.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, because I remember like when that patent show thing came down, we all ended up over at Corolla's compound.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

To have a sit down.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Like the five families.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, it was like me and Jay and, and you know, someone from Nerdist and you know, Corolla, Kevin Smith's people were there, like, what are we going to do about this? And we had a higher, we had thought, thought we thought about hiring a guy because the lawsuit would have cost a fortune to defend it to, to break the patent.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And I think Corolla just paid up. And the, the, the, the thing that was so shallow about it is this patent troll who had decided that this technology technological patent that he owned applied to podcasts, just saw a list of the top five podcasts at that time and assumed they're making millions of dollars. None of us were making any fucking money.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Except for Corolla.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And I don't know what the other ones did, but to me it was a heroic kind of coming together of the community. And I don't know at what point because I remember there were times where, you know, we'd be like oh, fuck. You know, Nerdist got that guest first. First. And there was competition there. Like, it was really an exciting time and we were at the cusp of new media and now, like, who gives a.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that is certainly out there. What do you mean, who gives a.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, I know. I'm just saying because everyone has one. That there's no, there was. Once it becomes a business, once, you know, becomes networks, once people are selling their networks, you know, once it goes, you know, video that, you know, it's sort of just part of show business now. But at that time, it was the fucking wild west. I was doing advertising for sex toys. So were we. And coffee.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And audible. And that was all you could get.

[Marc Maron]

And you were grateful to get it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure. And the occasional like, you know, old school terrestrial ads, like, you know, Sherry's berries and 1-800-flowers, you know, and now it's Squarespace and simply say, fine. But it did feel like, I remember there was a time where I'm like, I don't want to do ads because that would ruin the integrity of the show.

[Marc Maron]

Show. Okay. And that, how long did that last?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, we, we did need to make money, but our, our to it. What we chose to do in relation to you, because the conversation was, you know, if you do create a paywall, like you said, you're cutting off new audience. Is that we created a pay site for the live shows. That's why we did live shows, is people would buy those and then we had a donation sort of thing going.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Where, you know, you'd give different tiers of donations for a monthly thing, you know, five bucks, ten bucks. If someone gave a big chunk of money, they get T shirts and whatever. And my whole house was filled with boxes of T shirts.

[Marc Maron]

Right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But that's how we made our nut at the beginning. Enough to get by. And then like, look at us now, just corporate horse, a lot of us.

[Marc Maron]

Well, obviously you're not a part of a network.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No. Never was.

[Marc Maron]

Nor am I. We were with their world for five years and otherwise we were never part of a network.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And we didn't want to be. And again, for good or bad, one could argue for the bad, you know, that we, maybe we should have been part of something.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Gotten that corporate push. But I, I, I don't think podcasting is ever supposed to be a corporate thing.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And so once you're starting to get notes and stuff, like you're doing a TV show for NBC, that's not podcasting to me.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah. Or else you're dropping in pre record ads.

[Marc Maron]

No, I think we do do that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You do?

[Marc Maron]

I think we do the. Yeah, I think there's pre record sometimes.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, I never do that.

[Marc Maron]

We do the. The host read and then. Yeah, yeah, there's. Yeah, there's pre records recording.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And we're pretty picky about our ads. We're not complete corporate stooges, you know, we. We definitely. And I don't think that's the right word, you know, you got to do advertising to make your money.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But, you know, we're pretty picky about it. We only do live reads.

[Marc Maron]

We are picky in the sense that we won't do anything that we won't actually use.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, I don't want to be selling something where it's clear, like, you know. You know, I don't drink, so it'd be very disingenuous for me to talk about, you know.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Budweiser. So we don't do it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I remember there was a point there where, man, great. You remember? Man, great.

[Marc Maron]

Sure. Cook your steak on the ground on your engine.

[Jimmy Pardo]

They kept pushing at us, you know, because Corolla was, you know, selling a lot of man grates, and they kept pushing at us. Well, you got to do it. And we're like, it's not our audience. And they're like, you got to do it. And we did it. And they sold nothing.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, because it's not your audience.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's right. And they were like, we made a mistake. And, you know, can you. And we just said, don't worry about it. You know, off.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't think I ever sold squatty potties.

[Marc Maron]

You did. We do the squatty parties. That little thing where you put your feet up on.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

No, no. We never got the squatty.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I was kind of upset that we didn't get squatty.

[Marc Maron]

I want a squatty potty.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I mean, I got a squatty potty, but I think I paid for it like everyone else.

[Marc Maron]

Out of pocket.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, out of pocket. For the squatty potty.

[Marc Maron]

I did get a free one from. What was the. The tushy. Remember tushy? The. The adapter for the bidet that you put.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, no.

[Marc Maron]

Make your toil into a bidet.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't know about Tushy.

[Marc Maron]

It was tushy.com. make your toilet just put this thing in there, and then you've got a bidet. Then they had their own squatty potty. Squatty pot.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You had a knockoff. You had a tushy. Not a squatty potty.

[Marc Maron]

I had that. But the problem was our toilet was already low to the ground.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So it was.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Your knees are up around your ears.

[Marc Maron]

My knees were too high. Well, too high.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And I remember, like, you know, getting those, you know, the sample boxes of Sherry's berries and just wondering, like, are these good? I mean, they look nice.

[Marc Maron]

I, I. Who doesn't like berries?

[Jimmy Pardo]

I know you still do them. Cherry's berries.

[Marc Maron]

Listen, use promo code Pardo. Get 20% off. No, we do not do cherry berries. No, there's some. There are some over the years where it's like, okay, it's good, but is it as great as I'm saying? I was grateful they stopped advertising.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure, sure.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

1-800-Flowers. That worked out okay until you start getting complaints to the show about flowers that show up dead or whatever.

[Marc Maron]

Is that true?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So my fault.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, yeah. Get. Go to the bear. Go to the flowers, Guys.

[Marc Maron]

I'm also a fan of that. When people complain about, hey, there's something going on with your. Hey, we're trying to buy tickets for your show at the, at the club.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't know.

[Marc Maron]

I'm the idiot that shows up and talks.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

That's literally, that's where it starts.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And every once in a while, if they hit me on a particularly vulnerable day, I'm like, I'll see what I can do.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You know, we've been trying to see you for three years. Let me see what I can do.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But, you know, you got to be careful with that. Are you. Has the bitterness gone away towards you? No, no. Towards the, the. Where podcasting has happened.

[Marc Maron]

You know what? Not. I'm. I'm. I'm going to circle back. Not unlike accepting, hey, dude, you're a classic rock guy. Just be who you are. Quit trying to like the newer bands. They're not for you. It's the same with letting go, with the bitterness, with podcasting of, you have your audience right. You're doing great.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

What? Could it be bigger? Of course it could be bigger. Am I a little jealous that Smart List could do the Hollywood Bowl? Of course.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But I also am not competing with them. Yeah, they're not. I'm not in the same circles as Sean Hayes, so. So I don't have that bitterness. I just, I, I like to think that I'm interesting and funny, and I would like more people to hear it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

That's all.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's. I, I feel the exact same way.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

But then it Comes to why aren't more people.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I guess that's why. And I mean this sincerely again, Mark. I guess that's why I get a little emotional when I'm so grateful, when people like you do spread the Pardo word.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

It's like, you know what? My peers and people that I respect and that I personally find funny, that would sit down and watch.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

Are out there saying, you got to see Pardo.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

That means the world to me.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And so. And then maybe five people will hear that and say, I'm going to check this guy out. Those five will say, you know that stupid shampoo commercial.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Isn't that funny, though, when you get these. An email that says, like, I just started listening. I'm like, what?

[Marc Maron]

Where you been? Really?

[Jimmy Pardo]

We're getting that now as we're closing the show. No, just got on board. Because you realize that, too, in the big picture of the media landscape that, you know, despite however long you've been doing it or even I've been doing it, most people don't know who we are. It's just a fucking reality. Most people don't know where. And I guess that's. That's always been the case, you know, like, if you were on a TV show when there were three networks, everybody in the fucking world knew who you were.

[Marc Maron]

Everybody knew who Tim Allen was. Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Was there a person in the world that did not know who Tim Allen was?

[Jimmy Pardo]

But now it's like you. You're kind of like, you know, you get your little bubble and you get your little audience, and you kind of go through life like that. But the bigger realization is like, I'm just not getting through to most people.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

And there's nothing I can do about that.

[Marc Maron]

But you also have billboards around town. You're. You're.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You're for the specials.

[Marc Maron]

You're doing great.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, I know. I appreciate.

[Marc Maron]

There's also the. You and Owen Wilson are up on billboards. You're doing all right.

[Jimmy Pardo]

So you're saying maybe be grateful. You fuck.

[Marc Maron]

Am I using those words?

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, I'm just projecting.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I mean, you nailed it. But I wouldn't have said it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Look, I know I've done fine, but it's just so. It's just so weird because, you know, even the way you feel, and I do get plenty of credit for. For. For doing what I did. But, you know, there. There is part of you that. And I don't know where it comes from, where it's sort of like, where's my big award? Where's, where's my statue?

[Marc Maron]

Well, the first time they gave out a podcast award, it went to Conan o'. Brien.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Okay, see now, now why did you, you know, where does that come from that you said that?

[Marc Maron]

Well, because it, it, it's. By the time they finally started acknowledging podcasts, Conan was the number one podcast. So of course he got the trophy and Conan's great.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Which trophy?

[Marc Maron]

I don't know, it was the, the Billboard Music Awards or whatever. Right. Wasn't. Wasn't that it? I don't know if it was.

[Jimmy Pardo]

I don't know what it was.

[Marc Maron]

The American Music Award, whatever it was. He, you know, he got the podcast and there's no bitterness there. Again, Conan o' Brien changed my life when he hired me to work for. On his program.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So thank God he's.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, he's probably.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, I could probably find a little.

[Marc Maron]

Bit and you about it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure. I don't know that we need to poke around at it. I'm finding that as I'm coming to a close with the podcast that my desire to spout off is returning.

[Marc Maron]

I will say about. In regards to that and again, I don't know how this has turned into a suck ass session, but your ability to spout out has kind of freed me in a way as well where it's like, you know, I'm 59 and this is who I am and I've got my audience and I'm gonna say it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, go fuck yourself.

[Marc Maron]

Right?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And if NBC doesn't want to hire me, they're gonna hire me anyway.

[Jimmy Pardo]

What is NBC anymore? Do you ever go back to Chicago?

[Marc Maron]

Sure.

[Jimmy Pardo]

You got family?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, my dad's there.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Oh, really?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, my dad's still. My brother's there and my dad.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How old's your dad?

[Marc Maron]

82.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wow. Isn't it amazing? I'm going to be 62 and my dad's still alive. Is your dad's got all his marbles?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Wow.

[Marc Maron]

Still sharp. He golf three times a week. Golfs and yeah. I mean, he's not. I will say this. When I call my dad on the telephone, I. In my head, I'm picturing the 50 year old man I used to call.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

And so when he says something where it's like, well, how do you not know that?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Because you used to know stuff like that.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And so that's. I'm kind of coming to terms with that a little bit.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But for the most part he's still Pretty. He's still pretty with it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Well, that's great.

[Marc Maron]

He can't find a podcast.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sure.

[Marc Maron]

But otherwise, he's still pretty with it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

My dad's wife. My dad has dementia. My dad's wife, they play the podcast. She plays the. But they listen to the podcast. It's like his way of keeping up with me.

[Marc Maron]

Really.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And he's back. Is he in New Mexico or back?

[Jimmy Pardo]

He's still. He's still in New Mexico and, you know, and. But he's still. That. He knows me and everything. But she keeps it. She keeps it fresh.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that's actually.

[Jimmy Pardo]

That's a smart move by playing the podcast for him.

[Marc Maron]

So he. He gets to hear how you're angry at Chappelle.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Doesn't know who you're talking about, but he hears it.

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Now, a lot of people don't know this. You're from New Mexico. That your father was the inspiration for Walter White on Breaking Bad.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Totally.

[Marc Maron]

Okay. Because again, that hasn't been out there as much as it should be.

[Jimmy Pardo]

No, he. He's not that interesting. But, yeah, I'm from New Mexico. Jersey roots. Jersey roots. All right, all right. Well, I think we did it, dude.

[Marc Maron]

All right. But don't you have your famous catchphrase?

[Unidentified Guest/Producer]

We good?

[Marc Maron]

We good?

[Jimmy Pardo]

Yeah, well, I. I thought we were good going in. And. And despite the fact of, you know, thinking that this was a blowing smoke up my ass session, I. I had you here because I appreciate you and thank you and what you've done and the inspiration and. And I do feel we are kindred spirits at the beginning of something that got away from us.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I agree with that. I agree. And yeah, I. I appreciate your friendship, your show, everything. So thank you for having me.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Thanks for talking. Jimmy Pardo, always fun. Again, his show Never Not Funny, is available on all podcasting platforms. Hang out for a minute, folks. Hey, if you have a subscription to Supercast and the full WTF archives, you can go check out our two part episode with Judd Apatow from 2010, episodes 103 and 104.

[Judd Apatow]

I was very lucky that part of my dysfunction as a person is a terror of bankruptcy. Financial bankruptcy, not emotional bankruptcy and spiritual bankruptcy. So as a young person, I thought 10 years ahead. So I had a show like this in high school where I interviewed comedians like Leno and Seinfeld and John Candy.

[Jimmy Pardo]

How did you manage to get hold of them?

[Judd Apatow]

I used to call other publicists and say I was from a radio station in New York and all the Publicists were too lazy to look it up and figure out that it was a high school radio station. But I was afraid that I was gonna not be able to take care of myself in my life. So in my head, I always thought, well, what do I need to do? Okay, I'll interview these comedians, and they'll tell me how to be a comedian. They'll tell me how to write. They'll tell me what it's like. And to be 16 years old and sit down with Jerry Seinfeld, and for half an hour here, he literally tells you how he writes a joke, how he first got on stage, how long it took him to get good. It just changed everything for me because I thought, okay, it takes seven years to find your character. When did this all start being funny as a kid?

[Unidentified Speaker]

Yeah, I guess so. Although it was not like a real. I wasn't a class clown, per se. I mean, I wrote some funny things for the newspaper, and I wrote always trying to be funny around my friends. And watching comedy was the thing I enjoyed more than anything else. I was obsessed with. I knew every comedian. I knew all their routines, you know, and I loved it so much. That's how I got into it. I wanted to be around it, you know, And I never thought I'd be any good at it, but that turned out to be an advantage because it made me work harder than most other people work at it.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Sign up for a Supercast subscription by going to wtfpod.com and clicking on WTF so you can hear those episodes with Jud. And then Judd will be back on Monday with a special episode. That was his idea, and it's a good one. And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by Acast. Here's some sludge from a P90SA.

[Marc Maron]

Sam.

[Jimmy Pardo]

Boomer lives Monkey and La Fonda Cat Angels Everywhere.