Episode Overview

Title: War Under The Waves
Podcast: WW2 Pod: We Have Ways of Making You Talk
Date: November 21, 2025
Hosts/Guests: Comedian Al Murray, historian James Holland, with featured historians Roger Morehouse and James M. Scott

This episode, “War Under The Waves,” dives into the realities of submarine warfare during World War II, focusing on the harrowing living conditions faced by crews on German U-boats and American submarines. Using both historical research and vivid anecdotes, guests Roger Morehouse and James M. Scott strip away the veneer of romanticized naval heroism and reveal the brutal, claustrophobic, and often grim experience beneath the waves. The discussion also touches on morale, propaganda, and enduring psychological trauma that defined service under the sea.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Invisible Enemies: Shifting Perspectives (01:19–02:40)

• Roger Morehouse explains his motivation for writing about the U-boat crews, noting that most literature on the Battle of the Atlantic highlights the experiences of surface ships and their crews.
• He emphasizes the importance of shifting to "the German perspective" to understand what it was like for the U-boat men, who remain "literally and metaphorically invisible" in the wider wartime narrative.

“As soon as you shift the perspective, it forces you to ask different questions, you get different answers, all of that.”
— Roger Morehouse (01:56)

2. Life in a Type VII U-Boat (02:41–05:12)

• The Type VII U-boat is described as extremely cramped—the size of “two tube train carriages” (approx. 67 meters long).
• Massive engines, electric motors, and torpedoes leave very little living space; crew members slept among torpedoes in hammocks.
• The infamous “U-boat stink” is discussed: a pervasive odor due to diesel, unwashed clothes, mold, seasickness, and only one spare change of underwear permitted for multi-month patrols.
• Hygiene and comfort were nearly nonexistent; skin diseases and cockroach infestations were the norm.

“They wore beards because they didn’t wash, so they didn’t shave. So U-boat stink is absolutely a thing. ... They had cockroaches on board, of course, because cockroaches are everywhere.”
— Roger Morehouse (05:12)

3. Psychological Toll & Lasting Trauma (05:13–06:51)

• Roger shares a personal story: his German mother-in-law’s uncle served in the U-boats, survived, but “spent the rest of his short life ... in a succession of psychiatric institutions, damaged by what he'd experienced.”

“That sort of made me think that’s an angle that I’ve got to really look into.”
— Roger Morehouse (06:39)

4. U-Boat Propaganda vs. Reality (07:02–08:10)

• Propaganda portrayed submarine crews as heroic and glamorous, the reality being utterly different.
• Morehouse cites a Nazi-era newspaper following U-boat recruits: “And then he says, what could possibly go wrong? ... You have no idea what you’re going to experience.”

5. The American Submarine Experience (08:11–12:08)

• James M. Scott contrasts U.S. and German experiences:
  • U.S. service was volunteer-based and offered incentives like extra pay and unlimited food—a real draw for Depression-era recruits.
  • Living conditions remained cramped; bunks only 18 inches apart, and showers often used for storage.
  • Anecdote: A submarine veteran, unable to board his old vessel, is given a rag soaked in the “Drum” submarine smell—eliciting a joyful, nostalgic reaction.
• Food deteriorated from fresh to canned; constipation and parasite issues were rife, and rodent infestations led to odd stories (e.g., the “Romeo and Juliet” ship mice, where one mouse was accidentally fired out with a torpedo).

“I initially would spend all this time just sort of sifting these things out, these little bugs out. He said, but, you know, then I realized it was just easier to bake bread.”
— James M. Scott on baking with weevil-infested flour (11:27)

6. Morale, Food, and “Tin Can Rage” (12:09–14:34)

• German U-boat provisions were relatively generous (to help maintain morale), but after a couple of weeks, crews subsisted mostly on tinned food.
• “Tin Can Rage” referred to massive brawls that occasionally broke out on the boats; management of morale was crucial, and genuinely disruptive crew were quickly removed.
• Scurvy was prevalent; captured U-boat crews were frequently found by British intelligence to have advanced oral disease.

“Half of the sample they had ... half of them were suffering from scurvy, and half of those that were suffering already had oral sepsis.”
— Roger Morehouse (13:45)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You go through the thing and you go out the other side and it says, this is a type 7U boat. This had a crew of 50. And you go, where do they stand? Like, never mind work and small. How do they even fit?”
  — Roger Morehouse, describing the tour of a restored U-boat (03:46)
• “You would be a great naval recruiter. I mean the way you capture life on board, like, come join the German undertaking sea service. We got cockroaches, body odor, scabies.”
  — James M. Scott’s tongue-in-cheek remark (06:51)
• “One of the things that was an all volunteer experience in the US ... you did get the promise of extra pay, which was a huge incentive.”
  — James M. Scott (08:29)
• “After all those years, he could remember it. And so, yeah, that's very much that smell.”
  — James M. Scott, on a veteran’s emotional reaction to the scent of his old submarine (09:52)
• “They called it Tin Can Rage, where there’d just be a massive brawl and then everyone would calm down. ... Anyone that is genuinely kind of disruptive, they get them out, they get them transferred to another boat.”
  — Roger Morehouse (12:46)

Timestamps — Segment Guide

• 01:17–02:40 | Shifting historical perspective to the U-boat crew experience
• 02:41–05:12 | Physical conditions onboard German U-boats: layout, odors, infestations
• 05:13–06:51 | Personal and psychological impacts; trauma after the war
• 07:02–08:10 | U-boat propaganda and public perception vs. grim reality
• 08:11–12:08 | American submarines: life, food, quirky stories, and morale; museum submarines in the US
• 12:09–14:34 | Food and morale in German subs, “Tin Can Rage,” outbreaks of scurvy and oral disease

Tone & Style

The episode maintains the show’s signature mix of historical expertise and dry humor, with candid details about the more unglamorous aspects of war at sea. There’s a clear intent to demystify the romanticized notions of submarine service, laying bare the psychological and physical extremes faced by those who fought "under the waves."

For Listeners

This episode is a must for anyone curious about the realities of submarine warfare, especially those interested in the personal experiences behind the myth and legend. The mix of brutal honesty, quirky anecdotes, and historical depth makes it both sobering and compelling.