← You Can! Inspiring Women In Business
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- [00:01]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Hello and welcome to the UCAN Podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Jolly Jarvis, and today I am joined by Liz Stanford. Now, Liz and I have got a bit of history, really, which we will come on to in a little bit. But to start off with, I'm going to get Liz to introduce herself because today we're going to be talking around starting a business and your motivations behind having a business and how we can kind of how things can evolve over time. And that's what's happened with Liz. So over to you, Liz. Tell us a little bit about yourself.
- [00:28]
Liz Stanford
Hi. Thank you, Sarah, for having me on your podcast. I'm really excited to be here. So my name is Liz Stanford and I have two businesses. One is called the calmberth School, which is a hypnobirthing training business, and one is called baba, the Birth and Baby Business Academy, which is a membership for birth and baby business owners to help them with their businesses. And that's me.
- [00:54]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Brilliant. Okay, so Liz and I met with the conversal when you were an instructor. Yeah, so back when I was pregnant with my first Clara. And. Yeah, Liz. And then actually. And then I had a, like a little session with you as well, for number two as well.
- [01:11]
Liz Stanford
So.
- [01:12]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
So, yes, yes. So.
- [01:15]
Liz Stanford
So I, I knew Martin, your husband, before I met you didn't. Wasn't I working with Martin? I think I was. And then that's how we kind of connected. So.
- [01:25]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Yeah.
- [01:25]
Liz Stanford
So, yeah, that my, my journey feels like, oh, God, it feels so long and I'm rubbish at timelines. So forgive me when I'm thinking, like, what happened first and when did this happen? But I've been running my own business now for full time, probably for about eight years, but I decided full time for eight years, part time, probably for about three or four years. Yeah, part time when it was a side hustle. Yeah.
- [01:59]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
How did it all come about?
- [02:01]
Liz Stanford
So after I. So I've got three children and after I gave birth to my first child, who just turned 17 a couple of weeks ago, so that seems like a lifetime ago. Shortly after I gave birth to her, like literally within weeks, I started thinking, I don't want to go back to work. Like, everything felt so totally, totally different to me. My job at the time, I was a PA office manager for a security company. And I loved my job, I loved the people that I worked with. I got a lot of satisfaction, a lot of fulfillment from it. I was paid very well, there was lots of bonuses, there was nothing wrong with the job. And I thought I could go Back and be as committed and as, like, involved. Like, I used to work crazy hours and not think anything of it. Like, it was totally normal. But after having a baby, I just remember thinking, how can I. Like, I can't do that. I can't. I cannot do that anymore. I'm gonna miss so much. Or, like, I'm not gonna have any kind of life whatsoever. So I started thinking, like, what can I do? What can I do? How can I. How can I generate money to support my family? Because at that time, there was no way that I could have not contributed. And I remember saying to my husband, I don't really want to go back to work. And he just looked at me and he goes, no, no, no, you have to go back to work. Like, what are you talking about? You have to go back to work.
- [03:35]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Yeah, but maybe.
- [03:37]
Liz Stanford
And I think I was just really naive. Like, I was looking at things like MLMs, thinking, could I make money, like, as an Avon lady or something like that? And I know people who make so much money and do so well from those kind of things. It's not for me, though. It's definitely not the thing for me, but, like, absolute hats off to people who can manage that. And I looked at other things. I started thinking, could I set up a cleaning company with my. I hate cleaning my own house. But I was like, I could maybe do. Run a cleaning company, all of these things. Anyway, I had to put it to bed for. For a little while. And then I had my second child. And I felt the same again after I had him. I don't want to go back. I don't want to go back. And I found. I just found it really, really challenging. And my husband said to me, why don't you train in hypnobirthing? Because hypnobirthing was what I used to prepare for both of my children. And I was like, me, me. You talking to me? Because I had no, like, teaching experience, no business experience, like, nothing. And he was like, yeah, you would be really, really good at it. So between him and my mom, they kind of bullied me into it, pushed me into it. I went and did the training. And it was a difficult time, actually, because I. It was two years after my son was born, and shortly after I did the training, I there that I eventually did the training. Two years after he told me to do it, my husband told me to do it. I then. I then found myself in the pits of depression. So I had what they called postnatal depression, but I would just call it depression. Now and that was incredibly challenging to navigate whilst learning something new and trying to set up a business. But I did it and thankfully, thankfully I did it. So that's where I started as a hypnobirthing instructor with absolutely no, zero, zero business knowledge, no clue what on earth I was supposed to do, how to get clients or how to promote myself. Social media was not what it is now. And yeah, it's just been such a journey since then that I've ended up now owning my own hypnobirthing training company, writing a training program, training people all over the world to become hypnobirthing instructors and to create their own business and then setting up another business at the same time. So it's been a journey and a half, Sarah. I have to say it has.
- [06:16]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
So what was motivating you in that? Was it just I don't want to go back. What was it about going back to work that it was like the lack.
- [06:26]
Liz Stanford
Of flexibility, the lack of control that you have over your own time. And I remember the first day that my daughter went to, luckily I had my parents and my in laws did like all the childcare so I was very lucky in that respect. Didn't have to pay for any of that. And I remember the first day my daughter went to my mom's house and I went to see her at lunchtime. I was just in floods of tears at the thought of like going back to the office and just like leaving her. And also like a little bit of resentment, like why did they get to see all of this? That's horrible. I wasn't even paying for childcare, getting free child care and I was like, why do you get to see all the good bits? And I'm stuck at work four days a week because I'd managed to like just go down to four days a week and that, you know, that felt very. Because it's very different in my mom's day she didn't work until I was at secondary school and then she started working part time. So she was literally there for me, for my, my siblings all the time. So I was like, she got, she got to watch me do all this and now she's watching my daughter do all this, you know, and my, my mother in law as well. It was very like so mixed emotions and so difficult because you've got so much gratitude that they're doing this for you but at the same time you're like, but I really want to.
- [07:50]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Which kind of makes it worth it, doesn't it? Because you're Kind of, you're like, I'm supposed to be grateful here, but actually, this is not the emotion that I'm currently feeling.
- [07:57]
Liz Stanford
Yeah, this is what I want. It's not what I want at all. So I found it very challenging. So I think that that was always my. My motivation was that I wanted to be able to spend more time with my children. I wanted to drop them off, pick them up, go to, like, you know, whatever plays they have, help out at school if I needed to, like, be part of their, you know, their school lives and have, you know, have time for me as well. Because I know you go to work, you come back. There's so much that comes with being a mother and a. And a wife and a parent in general, like you. There's just so much emotional load, but then there's just so much physical load that you've got to do as well. And I just wanted more balance. Like, I wanted to live, not like, work, live a little bit. Work, live a little bit. So that was definitely my motivation.
- [08:52]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
I get that. Because I. So I had Clara and everyone was telling me, oh, you'll be different. You'll be different when you. When you, you know, you're going to go back. And I was like, yeah, yeah, I'll go back. I'll. I'll go back full time. And they're like, you're going to go back full time after having a baby? And I'm like, yep, yep, nothing's going to change. And. And then I went around a nursery in actually happen and they were showing us around and they said, oh, we put them into little tables so that they're all sat like, they're around the, like a. A family table. Because that for some of them, that's the only time they're here five days a week. That's the only family meal time that they get is with the other kids pretending to have a family, basically. And I was like. And she was strapped on my front and I was like, in one of my little carriers. And I was like, that that's not happening. I remember kissing her on the head and being like, there is no way that these children are going to be your pretend family. And that was when I thought, you know what? Yeah, I need to do something. I need to do something different. And it was just. It's so weird because until that was kind of pointed out to me, I was quite adamant that this was the route forwards. And then I was like, this is absolutely, definitely not going to be the route forwards. And so I set up my business on maternity leave and that was kind of how I went about it. And I've worked a kind of mixture of different days per week ever since. I am up to four days a week now. So I do feel a little bit like, oh, you know, like it's almost like I'm back at a job. But that Friday I've got, like, that is my Friday with him. And it's like my work hours, I send them off in the morning, Martin drops them now at school and I pick them up and it's like, you know, you finish at three. And that's the thing is I've not missed sports day, you know, open book day, what they are. But you know, you've got, where you go in and look at their books once a term and you now multiply that by three and they put them on different days and you're able to do it. And that's the thing is there's no asking somebody. And I think that's what I found was that thought that I don't want somebody standing in the way of me. Like me having to ask, can I do this with my child? Just seems so. It felt so wrong. Yeah, that is not going to happen. And I remember I had a colleague who I worked with when I was a medical rep and she wasn't, she was at conference. So we have conferences just before Christmas. She was at conference at the same time as her daughter's reception nativity play. And they, she said, can I, can I come later? Can I go back and come back, can I do something so that I can go to watch the nativity play play? And they said no. And so she, the school let her see the rehearsal, but she wasn't there for her daughter's first nativity play. And I remember thinking, why would you. She was so upset. She's basically spent the evening in tears, bless her. And I remember being like, if I was you, I would have quit. Because it wasn't the fact that I could relate to my child scenario, it was just that feeling of being restricted.
- [12:05]
Liz Stanford
Yeah.
- [12:06]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
And I was just like, yeah, no, that's, that's not happening.
- [12:09]
Liz Stanford
No, definitely. I know somebody listening to this might be thinking, well, but I don't, I don't have an option, you know, I don't have an option. Like, I really want to be self employed full time and you know, run my own life, but I don't have an option. And I think, you know, you're, you're. We've got different mindsets. Definitely. I think you Make a decision, strike while the iron's hot, and, like, go for it. Whereas I'm like, I'm going to take four years to decide. Like, to decide I'm actually going to do this. So you can do it on your own timeline. I think I was very lucky with my bosses. So the boss at the security company was really, really flexible. And then I did have another job. I left there and I got another job where I met Martin. And I worked for them for quite a few years as well. And they were very flexible again, you know, great, great people, great atmosphere. It's like, you don't want. It's always like, you don't want to leave, but you really do want to leave. So I was glad I got to a point where I made a decision that, no, I need to leave now. And I left because my business was earning me more than what I was earning working part time. So at that point, I was working. I think I was working three days or maybe two. Two day, two and a half days or something like that. So I was thinking, well, this business is earning me more than what I'm earning working for somebody. Imagine if I put all my time into the business, I could probably make up the rest of that salary that I was earning and maybe more. And it is a real leap of faith, I wouldn't say to anybody, you know, to just, like, pack in the job, especially, like, I was, you know, very reliant on that monthly income. But I did it when it felt safe and when it felt right to me. And I did it with my husband's, you know, 100% support, which I know not everybody has. Like, we have. We have both got very supportive husbands. So it's. I do think that that makes a big difference to women making decisions. It's sad, but if the man is the breadwinner, let's say, and they're the one who kind of directs all the finances, and they tell you, like, this is the amount of money that you need. Which my husband did, you know, initially, and it was true. Like, no, we can't do that. Then, you know, you do feel a little bit stuck. But I would always say, keep that conversation going with your partner. Like, keep telling them how passionate you are about wanting to create, like, a better lifestyle for all of you so that you can all. You can have that more kind of like family unit and family. Family time feels easier. And it's easier on your partner as well if they're corporate. If you're working from home, not saying that you're doing the dishes or running around like, putting a washing on all the time. But there are things that you can do that just makes the house kind of flow more easily as well.
- [15:15]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Yeah, no, definitely. I think that's the thing is I come across a lot of people who, you know, I think it's a natural progression that if you don't have support for your business, that you end up looking for that support. And so I work with a lot. A lot of my clients don't have that support necessarily at home. You have people who are waiting for you to kind of get it out of your system and go and get a proper job and all that kind of stuff. And. And I can imagine that is, you know, having supported people in that scenario, it is a very frustrating place to be. It's a very upsetting place to be. And it does make you doubt yourself at a time when you do doubt yourself anyway. I mean, gosh, putting yourself in that position of having your own business, you really are putting all your personality under a microscope. Definitely does make you realize your pros and cons and your strengths and your weaknesses and Aries development. But it does really, you know, it. It's understanding, you know, this is what I want, and getting clear on that motivation. And I think when you're clear on that motivation, what I always get people to do, what you were saying before, Liz, about, you know, when it feels right, when it feels safe, is, you know, I always get people when they are in that position where they're setting something up on the side to have that number. So to have a number of amount of money in the account or amount of revenue per month you're bringing in or. Or both so that you have. You are really, really clear when you are going to resign. And it's like, when I get to this number, I will resign because for a lot of people I meet, they're wanting to leave something that they don't enjoy. But when it comes to the point of actually handing you your notice, you're like, oh, maybe I could just go another month. And then it's almost addictive because you know that you could. And it's like, it never seems like a good time. And it's like, you know, have you resigned? No, it wasn't a good time this week because this happened. And it's such. It is such a big deal and it's such a safety blanket. And I think, you know, that's the thing is I use the safety blanket because I am quite. Make a decision, go for it. But Even with that, I had my maternity leave and my thought process was, if this isn't, if this hasn't got enough potential, if I've not got enough going on by the time I look to go back. As it happened, I was pregnant with my second one, which was the explanation that I gave to work was I am actually already pregnant again. And so you don't, it's not really fair. You don't really want me back. But you know, I remember them being like, well, if things change, if you want to come back, you know, we'll find something within. There will always be something for you. And I remember having that as a bit of a safety blanket. And then I remember one day working out my numbers before I went to a networking meeting and I realized that I was now earning more than I was taking home in my old business, in my old corporate job. And I thought that would be a moment of feeling really liberated and being like, yeah, I've done it, I've. And actually I just felt really weird that my safety blanket was no longer a safety blanket because it was there. Yeah, I would have to take a pay cut, do you know what I mean? Like, in order to take the safety route. And I remember thinking, so that really isn't a viable option anymore. And I really felt really. Yeah, like out on a limb and quite vulnerable with it. It was really, really strange feeling.
- [18:42]
Liz Stanford
That is, that's really interesting and like, not, not the same, but similar. I now feel unemployable. Yes. So I did actually do, because I'm a coach as well, a mindset coach and a business coach. And I did actually go and do a contract, a short term contract coaching for another company back in 2021. And that was like, it's just so weird. So weird. So I was back in this kind of. I didn't have my second business. I didn't have the Birth and Baby Business Academy, but I had this kind of business, the Carnival, which is quite significant in terms of the amount of work that it takes and the people involved. And I decided because I wanted to try it, I was like, I would really like to coach people outside of my industry to see what it's like. Like, is it, is it different? What, you know, what could I learn, what could I do? But it was trying to fit in to somebody else's timetable and somebody else's goals and vision and priorities really affected how I ran my business. And I ended up the busiest I have ever, ever been. And I think I lasted, I lasted four months and then I was like, I literally. I cannot. I cannot do this. So now my safety net is completely gone as well, because I'm. I'm now on this trajectory where it's like, I cannot go back to employed work. Not. Not that I've ever thought that I would, but it's just. Yeah, it's not there. It's not an option. What does that do to you then, Sarah? Does that make you feel, like, more motivated? Or does it. Does it now, does it make you feel. Are you over that completely? Or.
- [20:30]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Oh, now I'm. Now I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I don't think you could stay in that state of, like, for that long. But, yeah, I remember because it was between. It was between Clara and Ethan, so it was. But, yeah, and. And I was like. It was a really weird feeling because I always thought that it would be. It's a bit like, you know when you've. You've exchanged on a house and you've completed and you're like, I've sold it. And it's like you thought you'd be, like, jumping for joy, cracking open the champagne, but actually, you're just relieved. It was quite anticlimaxy in that way, in that I was a bit like, oh. And then I thought, actually, I feel a bit vulnerable. It makes me feel a bit weird. And I think, yeah, now I think having that time and of building up the confidence, it's like doing anything you then build the confidence of. Actually, yeah, okay, I did it that month and I've done it again, and I've gone off and had a baby and come back and done it again. And. And so you've got that feeling of, you know, what if I need to get clients, if I want to get clients, if I want to launch something, I can. And like, you know, it tends to. Yes, we've all had things that we've tested and haven't gone so well, but it tends to. It tends to respond the way you expect it to. You know, there's always, you know, because obviously you have got the fact that you work for yourself. My husband works for himself as well. So you don't have that setup of. Of corporate scenarios for people being ill and things like that. And obviously we've had to navigate that as well. And when Martin was poorly. Yeah, of course, I think I'm always a plan A, plan B, plan C kind of person. And so you've always got the sort of backup thoughts of, well, if everything went wrong, this is What I do and if everything went or if that went didn't work, then this is what I do. And I still have thought processes around that, but they are no longer tied to ringing up old bosses and being like, yeah, you know, you said, you know, seven years ago, are you still there? Yeah. So you know, that wouldn't be my, my kind of route. But I think it, you know, it's always good to have a thought process of this is what I would do. But I think that kind of safety blanket in my head had kind of gone from under me and then I was like, now what do I do?
- [22:50]
Liz Stanford
Completely, yeah, I had to create a.
- [22:52]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
New plan B and a new plan C. But I think it's, it's good to have those kind of thought processes and plans in place. I've got clients who, they've gone through quite a lot of personal stuff and it is very difficult running your own business and navigating parents, being ill, partners being ill, all that, all those kind of scenarios without even looking into your own, you know, your own health side of stuff. So there's always a kind of future proofing and thought process and there's always.
- [23:21]
Liz Stanford
Pros and cons to everything, isn't there? So you know, if you like, if you are looking after somebody who's poorly or know, caring for elderly parents, et cetera, if you were employed it would be even more difficult to do that. Although I know it still affects like your ability to earn money as a, as a self employed business. But yeah, it's, it's, it's working out what, just what suits you best, what makes you feel most comfortable and what suits you best. But that's such a good idea. I think anyone who's thinking, you know, oh, what would I do if I did like leave my part time job and go full in on the side hustle, then exactly what you said. I think you've got to sit down. I did do this with my husband initially. We sat down and we were like, right, so if in one month you don't earn X amount, like the amount that I needed to contribute, here's what we'll do. So we've got money from here, we've got money from there and so maybe we could cover like maybe you know, a couple of months, three months maybe. Um, but after that, that's it, like literally that's it, that is your, that is your buffer. And I remember feeling like, ah, but that was good motivation as well. That was like, well I can't, I can't drop any Any balls here. I have got to keep going and keep finding new ways of getting clients and getting the word out there. And I did find that quite motivating and in a positive way for me. I know sometimes some people might find that really anxiety inducing, but for me, it was just more like driving me forward and. And I just took seriously. I took my business seriously. And I know a lot of women, when they start out in business, there's that level of embarrassment when somebody says, like, oh, how's. How's things going? How's your business? Oh, yeah, oh, it's fine. Oh, it's just a hobby, really. Or, you know, if someone says, like, oh, how's your little business? And you got to put your boundary in straight away and say, my business is. It's going well. Thank you. Yeah, I'm really loving it. I'm enjoying it. Do you want to hear about what I do? Every. Every day is a networking opportunity as far as I'm concerned.
- [25:32]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
I think that's the thing there, isn't. It is. It's very easy to make assumptions, particularly with. For women in business that, you know, oh, it's just a little bit of a hobby for them, really. You know, like, it doesn't really matter. They don't really have to bring in the money. And, you know, that's a massive assumption over the setup in their household and everything else. And I think the thing is, it's understanding, as you say, your buffers and what the plan is if something doesn't work out. And having those conversations is really, really key so that you know the plan. I speak to people who are regularly like, oh, if this doesn't work, then I'm going to have to go and get a job. And it's like, you can get to the point where you've already mentally given up. And I think that's the thing, is you're really fortunate that that kind of pressure drives you. Whereas some people, that pressure just makes them freeze. And they. This is where this whole understanding of your own mentality and mindset comes in again, because it's actually like, oh, when this happens, I thought I'd be like this, but actually I'm more like this. And so if anxiety takes over, then you end up doing nothing. You'll go into kind of the freeze mode of doing nothing about it, and then you're just kind of waiting for it to happen to you, whereas it's that feeling of, you know, what backs up against the wall. I've got to do this. I've got to put this effort in and that's the kind of spirit you want. But even with somebody, even when you feel yourself, that's how I'll be. It's very interesting actually, what happens when that scenario hits and how you respond to it. And that self reflection can really help you to kind of move forwards and understand yourself better for next time and kind of work to your strengths.
- [27:16]
Liz Stanford
Yeah, because it doesn't, it doesn't go away like the, you always need to be able to earn money and as you get more comfortable, as you earn more money and you adapt to that lifestyle, you need more money. So you need. The bar just keeps getting higher and higher. And you know, even now, like sometimes I'll be like, oh, my numbers are a bit low for, you know, whatever course I've got in the future. And I'll get a bit of a, hmm, right, we've got to do something about that. And it's again, it's a drive and it's a motivation. It's like, well, what could I do? What did. Have I. Have I followed up on all the inquiries that I had? Have I checked in with those people? Have I? You know, what about a masterclass? Should I do that? Should I? What about my socials? Are they up to date? Relevant newsletter and things like that, you know, making sure that, that people are actually hearing about what I'm doing, that I'm getting the word out there and that I'm actually giving myself the opportunity to sell to people as well. So it doesn't go away, but you get better at it and it continues to drive me anyway, thankfully.
- [28:21]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Excellent. So Liz, in kind of conclusion, where can people find out more about you?
- [28:27]
Liz Stanford
So if anybody's interested in training to teach hypnobirthing, they can find me over at the Calm Birth School on Instagram or you can take a look at the website, which is thecalmbirthschool.com if anyone is a birth or baby business owner. So that could be anyone. Like, could be somebody who's a baby sleep consultant, could be ibclc, hypnobirthing instructor, breastfeeding supporter, any area, maybe like a children's activity business or anything like that, you can find me over on Baba, Baba business or which is b, a b B a business on Instagram. And actually anyone who's even thinking about what would it be like to get into the birth or baby world to like, you know, do some training and set up a business within that world, then Baba would probably be a good place for you to start as well.
- [29:23]
Sarah Jolly Jarvis
Excellent. Well, thank you so much, Liz, for your time. It's been lovely to speak to you. Next week, guys, I will be doing a solo episode. So I'm talking more about business growth and those realities of day in, day out, what to do to get your business moving in the right direction. That's it for me, guys, this week. Look forward to speaking to you again next week. Bye for now.
- [29:43]
Liz Stanford
Bye.